 12 o'clock rock. Whoa! It's Halloween! It's Halloween! Look at that person who's supposed to be Mary and Sasaki next to me. What a face. You know, this is a face that really couldn't sink a thousand ships. Thank you. Thank you so much. It's hard to look at her, actually. It took me all day. I can't ready for the show. Happy Halloween. And we have a show we're calling Things You Didn't Know About Halloween that are scary. And one of them is about Halloween. And right after the break, we're going to talk about another scary thing, James Comey. Current events. Scariest than Halloween. Scariest than Halloween. But first, let's talk about Halloween, Mary. Okay. So where did it come from? What is it? Is it a serious holiday or just fun and games? It's a serious holiday. The origins are disputed, but it looks like some combination of an ancient Roman festival called Pomona. That relates to the apples. That's why we dunk for apples. And a Celtic festival called So How. And it is thought that these were pre-Christian religions, and when Christianity began taking over from in the ancient world, these gods and these traditions were just melded into Christianity. So it's the end of the harvest season, the end of the summer, and the beginning of night. That's why we light bonfires. And the reason we go trick-or-treating is so that we can store food for the winter, gather food, the poor, you know, the peasants and so on, could get cakes and foods from the richer people, store them for the winter, and have food for the winter. Yeah. And we play gags on people and little tricks. Right. Because we want to emulate the dead, or the tricks the dead could play. Right, exactly, exactly. The costume is, they think that it's derived from medieval, like, religious plays, and so where people used to dress up like, you know, dead saints or religious figures. And in fact, tomorrow is all Saints' Day, and the day after is all Souls' Day. So it's really intertwined with saints and sainthood and the afterlife. Well, it has become intertwined, but for a long time it was really all about the harvest, and, well, the equinox, although it's a few weeks after the equinox. Right, right. A pre-Christian, and it was, at least we know in Ireland, it was very popular there. Definitely, Celtic culture. But what's interesting to me is that, I mean, I think it's clear that the holiday began probably in the British Isles, and it was appealing because it was happy, it was a party, a celebration of the end of the harvest, and it spread, and then you find that all these countries in Europe, they all had some affinity for it, and they brought, and Christianity adopted it. Right. And, you know, probably the Pope. As it did many things. The Pope. The Pope. There was a Pope involved. Yeah, I... Gregory, I want to say Gregory, but I... I don't think it was... I felt Clementine, but I'm not sure. I'm not sure. But I know... The Pope said, gee, I like this holiday. Yeah, we're going to make this one of the four... You know, hijack, excuse me, this holiday. Right. And so we're going to layer it up with all these Christian ideas, and then from that point on, it was all easy. And every country that was Christian in Europe, you know, adopted Halloween. Right. And people go to church in Christian countries. And that was in the 16th century. It was late. It was late in the 16th century. Right. It's part of four holidays. Christmas Eve, because it's all Hallows Eve, right? Christmas Eve, there's Shrove Tuesday, there's all Hallows Eve, and one more... Oh, and the 12th of January, those are like four big days of obligation in the Christian calendar. So they're all at points where things are turning, whether we're over the holiday season or over the summer harvest or coming into spring. It's really interesting. It's interesting how the early Christians allowed the adoption of these other cults because they wanted to grow. It was a pagan holiday. Right. That's the interesting thing. So Christianity adopted a pagan holiday, embraced it, and they knew it was pagan. They knew it was not a religious holiday. They really wanted numbers. They wanted to reach a lot of people. So they used the hijack, didn't they? Right. They wanted a lot of people to read the gospel and believe in Jesus. They were willing to let people still have their other gods, their other local gods and goddesses. When you find something popular, write its coattails. No kidding. They took advantage of what was already popular. Definitely. Good PR, yeah. And it's supposed to be the day that there's the thinnest membrane between the living and the dead, and the dead can come over. Right, that's where we put food out. Yeah, we put food out. And that's part of the trick-or-treat. But in Mexico, they put oranges out and kinds of food for their dead ancestors. And it's so scary. I love it. It's so fun. Well, what's happened in this country, though? I like turn-of-movie classics. Okay. It seems to me that if you were trying to get a beat on Halloween, you'd find that in this country, we've been making horror movies and Halloween movies for a long time. Well, since the 30s. Since the 30s? Since movies. But that's when Halloween really became popular in this country. It really was adopted in the 1930s. And that's right. Since the beginning of movies, even silent movies, we've been making like Nosferatu. We've been making movies that... Well, they're emblematic of our anxieties, right? Like Dracula or these creatures of the night. They're emblematic of our anxieties about life and death and living and why are we here. I mean, they all asked that question, whether it's Frankenstein, Dracula, the mummy. Existing somewhere between life and death, right? Yeah. Now that you said that, I mean, even going back into the 19th century in France, there's Phantom of the Opera. And that opera house there in Paris is defined by Phantom of the Opera. And so, you know, art has covered this for a long time. And we in the movies here in the U.S., we've covered it for a long time. Well, yes. Because, you know, I think since the beginning of humanity, the big question of humanity is what's going to happen to us? Where do we go? What happens after we die? Is it it or are there... And so it's the big question that everybody must grapple with. Everybody, no matter how high a station or lowest station. But there are places in the world that don't celebrate Halloween. And, you know, for example, Islam says don't celebrate Halloween. No, because it's iconographic. They don't believe in any imagery. And so they don't believe in the cross either. There's no imagery. And if you look at Muslim art, there's no imagery. There are no saints. There's no Jesus. There's no crosses. They think that's idolatry so that they don't celebrate it. But some New Pagans, Neo-Pagans celebrate it. Well, I can see the infinity there because it's originally a pagan holiday. If I were a pagan, maybe I am a pagan in some ways. If I were a pagan, I'd go for Halloween big time. I think it was my holiday. It is. Well, it's a holiday of letting loose and exploring the extremes of humanity, of living and dying. There are Jewish holidays, by the way, that fall in the same period of time. The Jews are prohibited from celebrating Halloween, although Jews in the United States do. Because they're not able to participate in Christian rituals. But if it was a pagan ritual, then it would be easier? I don't think the ancient Jews would approve of that either. I think you pretty much had to be Jewish in a conservative way. The Jewish holiday calendar includes a bunch of holidays around this time of year. But none of them is like Halloween. Oh, oh! There's Purim in the springtime. Purim is where we dress up. And then when you dress up, there's Simka Hattora, which is when you make fun. And you make fun of the rabbis, as a matter of fact. It's really a fun holiday. I think what happened here is a conglomeration of a lot of holidays and it became popularized. And when the church adopted it, it took on all kinds of new means. Institutionalized. Institutionalized. But in recent years, and say go back to the 30s and the new movies, the new movie industry, the new movie art form in the U.S., we had a lot of stuff that was driven off Halloween or that fed back into Halloween about, you know, vampires and terror and fear and all that stuff. Right. And you should see those movies. If you haven't seen those movies from the 30s and 40s, and even before the 30s and 40s, you should see them because they're terrific. Like, I'm just as the bride of Frankenstein and the bride of Frankenstein is such a terrific movie with Elta Lancaster. And she sees Frankenstein and she freaks out just like that. They make this woman specifically for him. It doesn't work out the way they thought it would work out. And there, that was only the beginning of the genre because if you look at TV now or for that matter, movies and movie theater, you see an awful lot of these, you know, horror movies. Oh, yeah. Zombies are everywhere. Zombies are everywhere, everywhere. Zombies and all kinds of supernatural creatures because it's, like I said, it speaks to our anxiety of not being able to know the unknowable. We don't know. So we form a story and we try to make it into something we can understand. And make it fun. If we make it fun, it becomes less scary, less threatening. Right. We're in charge then. But the other hijack, there's another hijack, okay? And it probably happened, it's not a post-war. And that is, it became, Halloween became part of the ramp up to You Know What. Oh, well, yeah, that's true. I'm sure that big, big business did that. Yeah. It's sort of now between this and Thanksgiving and Christmas. It used to be, if I looked during the war, you know, in the 30s or 40s, I would have thought that Thanksgiving was the ramp up. Mm-hmm. But now it's not the, now we've got Halloween. Is there any holiday in the storm? I have got my Christmas sweaters out. I'm ready. Oh, jeez. I'm so... And I heard them playing Christmas carols already. Really? You know, we're not even really finished with October. No, I know. And we're ramping up so the stores, the merchants, you know, it's a big part of the American economy. Yes, it is. And people, you know, adults, I remember when I was a kid, adults didn't celebrate Halloween. But so over the last 20 or 30 years, adults started, there were so many parties this week and grown-ups. I'm dressed up. I'm a lawyer. I went to my office dressed this way. And, you know, so it... You could probably go to court like this. I would like to, actually. Maybe you would win because, you know, sort of best contest and best costume. The right judge might, you know, find this very appealing. Some judges. Other judges, not. But you know what, I think when I came to Hawaii, I was surprised to find people at work in Bishop Street. This is 50 years ago. In Bishop Street, everybody dressing up. Everybody in the company would be dressed up with some Halloween. I never saw that when I was a kid. You're right. Back, you know, in the East Coast before, well, in the earlier days, it was only the kids. And it was a lot of fun. And they really did do... They really did do trick or treat. Yeah, right. They did hijinks. They did little mischievous things. Little mischievous things. But then, do you remember? Do you remember? It was coming back to me. There was a guy, I don't think we ever found out who it was, who put razor blades in the candy. All right. That was a big scare in the 60s and early 70s. Made it really scary. So you couldn't have candied apples anymore. You'd have to have packaged candy. And now you can't even really give candy because parents don't like kids getting the sugars, which they're right because I ate so much candy today. And candy's not good for you. It's not good to make an entire meal of candy. But candy's not good for you. In fact, it makes you feel faint. And that's why we take a break here. And we're going to come back and take another look at this whole thing about scary. Oh, we have scary. And we're going to see what's scary now in the election with James Comi. Oh, yes. We'll be right back to talk about some really scary things here on He Said, She Said. Oh, ha! Michael, University of Hawaii football team under Rolovitch is going to kick butt this season. In case you didn't understand me, University of Hawaii football team is going to kick butt under Rolovitch this season. So be sure to follow us on Think Tech Hawaii and Yobachi Top. I'll be at every game. And remember, hello, ha! This is Steve Katz. I'm a marriage and family therapist. And I do shrink wrap, which is now going to every other week, all during the summer and maybe forever after. Take care of your mental health this summer. Have a good time. Do what's fun and take good care of yourself. Bye-bye. Okay, he said, She Said, we like a little controversy here. We talked about Halloween, but the natural, you know, trans, trans, trans, trans, transition. Transition. What's really scary, James? What's really scary? It really scares me. I mean, you know, it's like, we all ought to walk around until this election is done and you're kind of out there. Exactly, because this is how I feel about the election. I'm not scared to go. So we've seen drama. We've seen surprises and really ugly things happening for a long time in a too long election. But it's not over. It's like every day there has to be something else. So last week, surprise of surprises, after a few days of quiet, I was, I appreciated that. Yeah, I did too. James Comey Surfaces. He's the FBI director. And he did something really scary. You want to describe it? Yeah, he released a whole bunch of e-mails that he found in the Anthony Wiener, during the course of the Anthony Wiener investigation. So they think that there is a number of whom Ahmed did, who is Hillary Clinton's chief of staff, her e-mails on Anthony Wiener's computer, and they think that... She related to him. Yeah, yeah. And they think that that might show some of the ones that Hillary Clinton purportedly destroyed or things that should have been confidential that were used on this, like public computers. So it's just fascinating because as we said earlier, the Justice Department was opposed to this and they advised Comey not to do it. So he asked for advice on this or they knew about it and they advised him. I think they must have known about it. I don't know the process of how, but I know they were opposed to it. Why would you think that they opposed it? Why would you think they'd... Because I think they thought that doing something without any certain proof, just a phishing expedition, which is what it is, it's a phishing expedition, so close to an American election, undermines the authority of the process. Can you remember a time when the FBI was making press releases about an investigation that was not complete? An ongoing investigation, yeah. In fact, investigation early in the course of the investigation, making national pronouncements about it, I can't get my hands around that. This is what Andrew says, my husband says. He thinks that James Comey did this to be assured of a career after he's no longer at the FBI to be a political, like a talking head or have a place in cable news or to go to a conservative think tank that he did it to, you know... Andrew may be giving him too much credit. I think there's dark reasons here for what he did. You're familiar with the Hatch Act. Right. What's the Hatch Act? Okay. The Hatch Act is tampering, tampering with an election, trying to influence an election before it happens. And, you know, in case you reacted, as I did when I heard about this, you know, that it's unfair to keep on massaging this issue and to make statements about ongoing investigations when you really haven't even gotten the investigation going, knowing there's an election a few days later, that seems unfair. Well, it goes beyond unfair. It's a federal crime under the Hatch Act. Right. It could influence the outcome of the election. But, you know, I've never lived in an era where anyone doubted the honorability of the democratic system of the... I mean, our system was the most well-regarded in the world. We were the models for so many systems. And the FBI walked out of order. You know, Eliot and S. Although I'd say we knew it. We didn't know it at the time. We found out later that Edgar G. Hoover... Yeah, J. Edgar Hoover. J. Edgar Hoover was a bad guy. He was a... Edgar G. Robinson. Yeah, right. He was also a bad guy. He was a bad guy. And he was controlling politicians. He was keeping files on politicians. And he was trying to control government. Right. We didn't know it at the time. Right. He set up the Black Panthers. He infiltrated a lot of radical groups and instigated a lot of, like, riots or violence in... He infiltrated the civil rights movement as well, you know. So he... He had... He had files on political officials. Okay, there was a list. I mean, you could be on... On profit, people, and... I mean, really bad. Right. And we found out about this in the 60s and 70s. And I think that was a time when people began to question whether the government was properly motivated. Well, the... The government probably isn't properly motivated, but the election... That's sacrosanct. That's us. That's us. Don't mess with our election. That's us. That's not the government. That's us. That's how... That's what makes us different from other countries in the world. Yeah. We have a clean election. That's our voice. But then you have people in the government, you know, come from nowhere and make statements like this. And, you know, this isn't the first time the FBI has kind of, you know, done that kind of massaging over the e-mail thing. It's been a regular affair. Going nowhere, but in the press. And now, of course, Donald Trump is making a big thing. He's making pay. This is his worst awarding day. But we don't even know what happened. We don't know what the substantive problem is. We only know that he leaked it, and it's bad. But we don't know what it is. Jay, it's so convoluted, though, this guy, Anthony Weiner, that's sending naked pictures of himself. You have this woman that's the chief of staff of Hillary Clinton that was married to this guy. You have stuff that Hillary Clinton has done, maybe destroyed him. It's so... It's all conflated. Ugly. And the guy who doesn't know, and most of us don't know, is going to conflate it all together. Weiner, bad guy, bad pictures. Okay, Hillary Clinton's somehow responsible. This woman with the e-mail and the e-mail problems that Hillary has somewhat connected, must be all connected. It's all connected. The Clinton Foundation, also in the mix. The Clinton Foundation, it's all a conspiracy of all the stuff, which isn't true. You know what? I know rationally it's not true, but do you know that even myself, I find myself being sucked into things? Is there something there? Is there something there? I mean, because it's just constant, you know, this constant collaboration. And like, you know, this thing with the e-mails was really undermined Hillary Clinton's candidacy. And now this is worse. And it may be not over. We still have a week to go. Maybe Comey is going to come up with something else. But one thing I think we can agree on about Comey is that he did this for self-serving reason. He did that to this... Well, worse. This is not a patriotic act that he did. Well, it's not a patriotic act. In my view, over time, you take these step after step of massaging, you know, these issues. It sure sounds like he's increasingly trying to affect the election. Right. And Putin. And that's crazy. I mean, who would have done that? For a government official to do that? I know. Once against the law. Right. And I think she's right. I mean, I'm with her on this part, attacking him for having done it. Oh, he shouldn't have done it. He shouldn't have done it. I mean, I suppose if there was something that he could have done it after the election. But doing it at this vulnerable point right before the election, especially when one candidate is lobbying these rigged election allegations. Although, but did you see also Donna Brazil? Donna Brazil, who is a CNN commentator and a big wig in the Democratic Party, was forced to step down from her CNN position because she was found guilty of transmitting to Hillary Clinton questions during the debate. So it is all kind of messy. It's all kind of like one big, you know, I don't like Donald Trump. But one thing I have to say that I think Donald Trump is right about is that it is a big cabal in Washington that needs to be smashed open by somebody, some hero, some legislator, some jurist, somebody, you know. Oh, I don't know about a big cabal in Washington. I think it's a big cabal about people in favor of Hillary Clinton. You know? I mean, you feel strongly about Hillary Clinton, so you send her the questions, I guess. So, but that's so unethical. It's not journalism. It's unethical. But it's not part of a cabal. You know, there's not a conspiracy here. It feels like it. It feels, you know, after a while, it kind of feels like it. I just, you know, the Clintons are so secretive about, you know, all the things they do. And, you know, I just, like I said, intellectually I agree with you. But emotionally, sometimes I give me pause. I think a lot of people are going to jump on Trump's notion of there's something really bad here worse than Watergate. And, you know, and we're going to see, we're going to see people come out of the woodwork on this. And again, we're not over. You know, Kumi may have some more. Yeah, he might have more stuff. Kumi may have some more and other people some more. I mean, every day this week, there'll be the risk of more of this happening on both sides. And what he has may be bad. They don't even know if they can go through it all before the election. So here it, he has stuff that... Make the worst interpretation against her without knowing what you're really interpreting. I just think, I find politics these days really, truly terrifying. I think Halloween is a very good day to just cut this. So blood sport and the election cycle is too long. I mean, the politician, you know, the politician election phenomenon is too long. I'm fatigued. Yeah. What about the mayoral race? What do you think? I think all those are going to win. Well, he's got a lot of stuff going for him. I got a telephone call yesterday from somebody I know, an official, by the way, city official, telling me what I should do. And I would say that he's got a lot of things running for him. Oh, yes. But there are a lot of people coming out of the woodwork on the shoe, too. I know. He's got a lot of support now. He's got strong support. But I heard Caldwell on NPR, HPR with Beth Ann Koslovich last Thursday. He was good. He is a very smooth, very smooth... He really is. He's very, in person, he's incredibly charming, incredibly seductive, you know. You know, Juju has a little bit of that nervous energy or something, but not called a little, called a smooth like glass. So what do you think is going to happen between now and next Tuesday? And by the way, before we get off that, the decision in Oregon... Yes. ...about those people... Who overtook the refugee camp by force and then were found innocent, yes? They were found innocent by a jury who felt... Of their peers. A jury of their peers who felt... What was the reason? They felt that they didn't undertake... They weren't a threat, even though they had guns. They were armed, fully armed, that they weren't a threat and they had not made an agreement amongst each other so that there was no conspiracy to do the crime. Okay, underlying reason, I think, is that people don't like the federal government. No. And this was a prosecution they just didn't like. Oh, absolutely. They're making a statement against the federal government. It's jury nullification. Everything the federal government does. And this is a problem. It plays in the national election. It plays in every election. It is us distancing ourselves from government in general and it's going to play even in the city elections somehow. So my feeling is the point we should make here and she said is the government. They're us. We are the government. The election is us. We can't besmirch it. If you don't like it, run for office. Make a statement. But don't pull the underpinnings out from under our government. No, don't take your marbles and go home because you don't like the way it's going. And if you do that, we are all at great risk. This was a hard-fought government. Democracy doesn't come easy. No. And if you want to throw it away, you're rolling things back to a very hard, difficult time. Which founding father? One founding father said it's easy to create but difficult to keep a democracy. I don't know who said that. Yeah, that was Ben Franklin. Oh, Ben Franklin? You told me that. I told you that. A woman who asked him what kind of a government he's a Republican, Madam, but if you can keep it. Right. And can we keep it? Can we keep it? Oh, so... He said, she said, can we keep it? We'll be back soon with more on Halloween and what to be afraid of.