 Welcome back, it's still the breakfast on Plus TV Africa. Two days after the PDP in AQT State held its governorship primaries, the ruling or progressives Congress APC held its own governorship primaries in the state yesterday with Biodu Oyabanji, former secretary to the state government defeating other aspirants to emerge winner. Oyabanji believed to be Governor Kaede Faimi's preferred aspirant was declared winner with 101,703 of the votes cast. The primary was not without controversy as not less than seven aspirants withdrew from it in protest at what they alleged to be irregularities. Now joining us to analyze this involvement is Ibrahim Oshino, who is a former member of the APC presidential campaign council. Good morning to you Mr. Oshino and thanks for joining us. Good morning my brothers, I'm glad to be here. What's it take on this emergence of the former secretary to the government of AQT State as the winner of a governorship primary in that state? Yeah, thank you for having me. It's a great day for democracy. I think of course in the APC there is no loser, there is no winner. We are all colleagues, I'm calling on my brother, Sune to support the candidate, the primary was conducted of course in the full glance of the press and other stakeholders across the 16 local government of the state. With our rank up, there is no issue of ballast matching with the calisthenics and the rest. There's not even gone short, fired yesterday. So I think it's a welcome development. So I don't want us to pander more about that. There has to be a winner, one winner, just one winner and there has to be a loser. So and they are not losers, they are co-op contestant and they should work for our party to emerge and support government to carry the firemen. I think that's the best shot. The winner has emerged, so we have to move on. So don't forget that the PDP has conducted their own and I of IOSA is not a cheap goat in there. It's a grassroot man. They have to look for a way to tame him so that we can continue to govern AQT State and stop the rotational leadership in the state. AQT State is traditionally a progressive state. So we have to cluster that, you know, victory yesterday and ensure that we have a resounding victory of even far, far over 120,000 votes that Oyebandi scored yesterday. So I believe they should work with the governor and the candidates. So we thank the governor that came to conduct the elections. It was actually a total election. Mr. Sino, thank you. You said that the aspirants like Opemi Bamedeli and Koshu Dham pull together and support Governor Fahiri Kaimi or Kaidi Fahimi, rather, following the emergence of this, his, the former SSJC, flag-bearer of the APC. When you say they should support Governor Kaidi Fahimi, he wasn't on the ballot. He was not contesting. So how do you mean? What do you mean by the aggrieved aspirants should support Kaidi Fahimi, who is the current governor? Let me tell you, whether they like Kaidi Fahimi or not, he is a leader, party leader in the state. He is a legitimate party leader in the state. And he has not shown any sign that the Oyebandi, so-called the guy Oyebandi is his candidate. He allowed them to go to the field and when they marched. So there's nobody pointing at Kaidi Fahimi as the sponsor of the guy. The guy has been in the state. He has been the chief of staff. He has been the secretary of the state government. He has been the commissioner. He has been there since the day of Chief Adibayo, the prime minister for trade and investment. So if you know his history, he's a grassroots man. He has been in the state. So to support Kaidi Fahimi, I mean is that he is the party leader and delivering the state for APC after his exit, after eight years, is what they should be taking. And after Oyebandi, the likes of Prime Minister and the rest of them can come on board. And he might, you know, and become the governor. But right now, we can't afford to lose a kitty. You know, a kitty is predominantly a string state, like Oye state. So we don't want to lose a kitty to a position. If you lose a kitty to a position, it's state like where you have fire, where you have fire ship and Oye state. That's going to be spelled doom for APC in the south west. So they have to work with the government and the candidate. And the party at large, you know, some of them are still in the city. Some of them have been a senator. You know, it happens on both sides. Like in the Philippines, you have Mrs. Olujimi. He's a president senator. Opeyemi is also a president senator. So they should work with the governor, the candidate and the party. The governor, I mean that they should work with the party because he's a party leader in the state. The winner is widely believed to be the anointed candidate of the incumbent governor. We know the antecedents of governors over the past few elections since 1999. Each time a governor is living here, we prefer to put an aspirant who will be loyal to him in government house so that he can continue to have some sort of influence on the affairs of the state. And you would agree with me that, you know, most governors would not want to put politically strong and independent-minded candidates, you know, to succeed them so that they can continue to exert control. Are you saying the former secretary of the state government who now is the flag bearer of the APC is a grassroots man? And are you telling me he's more popular than the aggrieved aspirants like Senator Opeyemi Babinele, who has held positions right now. He's in the Senate. He's been a commissioner in Lagos State before. And he's widely known. Are you telling me that this secretary, former secretary of the state government is more popular than Senator Dio, Dio, and others? Are you telling me he's more known, widely known across the state than these people since that's what you're talking about? I think you have answered a couple of questions I was asking. Let me go down the road and so that I can at least, you know, expose it to few things I don't know. You said Opeyemi Babinele has been a commissioner in Lagos State. Not in the state. This guy has, I'm not a sports person. But he's a senator right now. He's won a central election. Look, election is won in this country by structure. If I bring you out as APC candidate and the structural party is there, you will become a senator. I'm not saying Opeyemi Babinele is not, you know, it's a low belt and you're not going to, you know, find him as a world candidate in the APC. Yes, he is. All of them are immensely qualified. But Opeyemi Babinele is not a fraud. He has been in the state as a local boy. When they say someone is a local boy, he spent most of his political career in the state. He's a local, he's a pure breed local boy. That is not, he is not, he's just a gentleman, you know, from the distance and from a few of my friends that knows him. He's just a gentleman boy in the state. Opeyemi Babinele is not who, he's not, I don't know, he's not a cheap girl. So he knows he has been in the state as a commissioner, chief of staff, he has been in the state as a PhD. You know, so many things. Has he contested in one election before? I mean, you were the one talking about popularity. You were the one who brought up the issue of the candidates and their credentials and the fact that Oyebanji will be the best candidate in terms of his extension into the grassroots of a kid's state. But has he contested, just to know him better, has he contested any election and won in a kid's state before? Look, when Governor Faraday came, he has never contested for a look at government chairman. He has never contested for councilor. But at that time, the structure of the party and the people of the state believe that they need somebody that is more exposed and enlightened like him. Same way, Oyebanji, same way to Governor Ayie, Governor Ayie, Minister Ayie, Mr. Ayie crossed into from PDP to APC in less than, in less than a year, and he got the senatorial ticket and he was elected a senator. Okoyemi moves to a kid from Lagos in a party that is well-organized and structured, he won election back to the Senate. So, what are we talking about? So, if you are saying that Oyebanji, who has spent most of his life turning a kid's state, most of his political career in a kid's state is not popular as a grassroots. Of course, you know, that person must be a joker. I'm not going to measure... I'm just asking if he has contested and won an election. Just to know, are you saying no, he hasn't? He hasn't. Let me tell you, look at Governor Lagos state. I'm giving you instances, people who have never contested an election and they contested for governor and they won. Governor Lagos state has never, you know, sought for elective position, but it was nominated for a governor and he won. He won a primary against a sitting governor, a sitting Lagos state governor. So, today is a almost three year and a half year governor in Lagos state. And so many, many, many others like that. So, it doesn't really matter whether you have contested or not. What matters is your popularity, you know, your consistency with the party, your loyalty to the leadership of the party and to the people, finally to the people of a kid's state who will be the final judge in this case. So, let's also talk about the issue of internal democracy here because that seemed to be, you know, major concern. And the back and forth at the time with the electoral act amendment bill, whether to adopt, you know, direct primaries as it were or go for indirect primaries and consensus, these still crocks of the matter. But you also have a situation where seven aspirants, according to the report, have withdrawn from the particular, I mean the polls talking about the primaries that were conducted on the grounds that they had party loyalists in the system. So, would you say that, you know, the equity governorship primary election that was conducted promoted the issue of internal democracy? Would you also describe it as fair? And secondly, don't you think that with all of these issues right now, the abnormalities that's been reported that had witnessed with the APC in a kid's state, would this not further divide the party and cause internal crisis in a kid's state? You know, direct primary is the most linked democratic process of nominating a candidate. A pure one of that equity. You know, I don't always measure, you know, the intensity of a primary with crowd that of course is in there. But what I can say is that, what I can say is that what happened in the kid's yesterday from my observation and a few members of the committee who are friends of, right, it was a pure and genuine and legitimate primary that was conducted yesterday. And that shows that there is a high democratic process that played out in the kid's yesterday. You know, God emerged from all the 16 local government and it has been happening. People when you notice that you cannot win in a primary, you will reject, you know, it happens in PDP, it happens in APC, it happens in, you know, in other parties, you know, when you notice that you can't win an election, you will reject it. And that is the, you know, the joker of politicians. You know, so it's not a big deal. What happened? The process was transparent. The process was clear. And it shows that, you know, we are developing in our process of nomination. So it's not a big deal, you know, the process is clean and clear. So would you say that it was the method of adoption for, you know, the governorship candidate was a consensus or it was, you know, direct primaries that was adopted or indirect primaries? What would you call what happened in that elections? That is a direct primary, no question about that. Nobody can question that. In a case where you have seven candidates withdrawing from the election on the grounds that you have, you know, the Godfather system actually playing where the former governor is having a hand influencing the system. You call that direct primaries? I'm sure you have to be careful of your choice of word. Those are allegations, you know. I can tell you are a thief. But I have to prove that you are a thief. Those are mere allegations. And you know, the politicians, you know, how we do, you know, a lot of shenanigans will take place. Of course, God does not codify me for instance as a right to just one vote in His word. So what are you talking about? So those are information and honestly, I don't really react to, you know, allegations and, you know, and the rest of it. I want the facts so that we can sort of fact, you know, the new figures on the table. Those are mere allegations. I don't want you to get bothered about that. Those are mere allegations. Godfather playing out. So let's also talk about the fact that a lot of people are not dissatisfied with the system of, you know, picking who would be the flag bearer of the elections come June. Do you see further agitations? Do people go into courts? You know, in APC, I can speak for APC, you know, you have the right after exhausting all the, you know, the parties, you know, reconciliation process, you have the right to go to court and challenge if the process is not clear. It doesn't really matter. APC is a democratic party. You can talk up and challenge the process if you feel it's not clear. But you have to make sure you address all the processes, the internal process and make sure that, you know, things are looped into quickly. But you can be, you have to be, sometimes you have to be a good loser. You have to be a good loser because it might be your turn tomorrow, you know. It has to be a good loser. I can see two senators after those guys that you were talking about were elected from the primary process and people did not challenge them. You know, you have to be a good loser sometimes. You can win all the times, you know. Those are the things that I see, you know, sometimes you can be a good loser. So, for two nominations, a lot of things is going to play out. I want us to be a little bit, you know, mute on that because hopefully the president will sign the amended electoral bill. Let's see what the, if it signs, if it signs, of course, the atmosphere will change, obviously. So we'll be able to discuss further, you know, details about the new bill and the process of the election and nomination. So I think we can give a good judgment to that right now until the bill is signed, then we will see what's in the bill then. Of course, we can share more light about that. But without the bill that is pending on the table of the president, I think we have a limited we can have a limited conversation. I mean, Mr. Ibrahim Osino, you were a politician. You have a lot of experience. You were a member of the presidential campaign in the APC. If you were to contest an election primary or a primary election in the APC and you go to that election the day before the election to find out that the presiding officers and the returning officers are all government appointees or loyalists of the governor in the party because everybody knows who everybody is, you know, who is who, who supports who. So, you know, you have to figure out the outcome of the election and the fairness of that election for someone like you who is not may not be considered in this scenario close to the governor. You said an ally of the government you know, all the staff that you mentioned that you are referring to. Government appointees? APDP you know, I don't like to propose it to their family you are pushing me there. APDP who is returning officers? Is a governor, is a city governor? They know themselves. Everybody know themselves. I have friends in PDP I have friends in APC. Do you get what I mean? So, nobody is going to say because is a governor for everybody? I ask you a simple question sir If you went into an election with the knowledge that one of the opponents one is preferred by the governor and that the returning officers and presiding officers for that election who have been appointed for that election are government appointees will you be confident in the fairness of that primary? These are my allegations. I heard you said would you be confident in the fairness of such a primary? I have a question to not be posed to me by grace of God I am coming to the city by grace of God when I make my final declaration you will know I will inform your channel by grace of God you can pose that question to me I am a party lawyer man you know the leader in the south west is a chairman of the general government so answering that question directly might not be fair on anybody because virtue of being a governor and a leader in this country will know a lot of people and those guys you are talking about they know a lot of people as well so those questions cannot be answered directly because all of them know this particular person besides I don't want to border you too much they find me as a constitutional right to support whoever he feels is helping he will go to the palace we just won't vote in this power we just won't vote so what I mentioned but Ibrahim Osino you said governor Fahimi is the leader of the party in the state and he can support whoever he wants to support okay fine so if he is a party leader he has a supporter he can support whoever he wants to which means he probably would have he is supporting someone if he has influence as party leader who is the person no you said he well he is actually a well believed to be but let's leave that out let's put that aside if you went into an act again with a governor's influence presiding officers and returning officers what they are saying is that they agree with their aspirants they notice that the names of the presiding officers and returning officers are government appointees and these are the people who fill the result sheets so they don't have confidence in the fairness of this election so they will not even go there to be embarrassed so isn't that something to be concerned about that you don't have neutral people appointed or people who may not necessarily be just a mix you take people from different factions and different camps and say okay let's have a visible here not government appointees you know what is good about you know what is good about this party in a couple of days maybe on Monday they can approach all the allegations you are mentioning I am not aware of it all those I don't know can you hear me this is what some of the seven are grieved aspirants who withdrew from the race in the early hours of Thursday they have noticed that the names they have seen of the returning officers and the residing officers are government appointees and loyalists of the governor and they are not confident of what we are written down as a result I don't know if I didn't watch the plan to make the supporters or voters queued behind the poster of each candidate was carried out but if that was carried out then of course it would be plain for everyone to see do we still have you Briobos? yes I am here so I don't know are you aware of the mode of voting yesterday? it's a current problem you bring the poster of each candidate and you queued behind it and that was what happened go and do your research and tell them to approach the national community that we set up by the national community that you approach it and file their complaints I don't want you to bother to say about allegations let's discuss facts so basically this was open for everyone to see each voter queued behind the poster of their preferred candidate the APC has been bedeviled with internal crises and randlings splinter units parallel factions ex-colleagues, parallel chairmen in some states of the parliament ward elections and state elections or congresses as well in river state and in Zafara state in last elections because of the place of court cases the APC was not on the ballot in the general election Okpemi and Kua are saying that if this process was not cancelled that they would have no other option but to go to court. In fact, they said we want the process to be cancelled because we don't want the committee to embarrass our party by forcing us to confront them in court. Are you not worried about the impact of any court process on the fortunes of the AAPC in Eketi State? Don't forget Faesheh is still around and Wike is his friend. Faesheh is my very good brother and I can tell you in this coming election he will be defeated last night in Eketi because of what the present government has done in Eketi. Now there are some straight statements you read out that are truthful in nature and you know I don't really want to go. I'm not from Eketi. I have no link with them. I don't really want to go more into their eternal issue but I can tell you that if they approach the court the candidate and the party also will meet them at the court you know and most of them will be seeking re-nomination very very soon so they should take the party I will call them to go to court and take the party here then we'll see how it goes. So I don't want to make comments you know or call it just a statement. I don't want to promote any one of them so they should approach the court. Sometimes I say that you can be a good loser. I've been a good loser for the last election that I won the result I don't know you know I approach the bill committee you know so it's not a big deal I will call them to be a good loser and work for the party other than wasting their resources and constituency money on the failed mission. So I cannot show if I will be defeated automatically so you know it's candidate and PDP are nowhere to be found in Eketi I cannot show you that. So it's not a big deal you know the party leader who happens to be going to file a name, perform credit bill, will campaign, will showcase what he has done. This is the second term in office and you know he knows that he needs to file a return with the people of Eketi. So and the party has immense confidence in his leadership so there's no there's no big deal about that. Okay so um just as we you know course this conversation down one of the issues that have actually bedeviled you know our democracy and the party politics is the issue of having internal democracy whether or not we want to agree with some of the issues that have been raised and we say they are alleged of course they're still being left in the realm of an allegation until the facts have been put out there but we still cannot in our conscience and our subconscious not take out the fact that the issue of internal democracy lacks in our political structure across you know different political lines. So I'm now not talking as an APC you know member but speaking as a politician and as a democrat what would you say and what can we do to build internal democracy in our system? You know if you look at the text of the present bill that you know Senator House of Representatives amended you know then you know sent the president for our side what I would say is that you know we need we're still in development nation you know a lot of things needs to improve in place in terms of you know you know you know echoing what internal democracy is and I believe that the National Assembly has done a fantastic job in amending you know for you to do direct indirect or you know concept source candidate and they have you know underneath as place a strict trend process you know for a candidate to be nominated there has to be a ratification there has to be this there has to be that so a lot of things that's what I said we might not be able to discuss much until the president ascended to the bill and we have something to discuss because it's going to be a brand new process it's going to be a new process of nomination and everybody will fit into that because it becomes law after the asset so I would suggest that we should wait you know I support internal democracy and down for it but this bill that we are waiting for to be ascended to by the president will address most of this question that you laid you know for me to answer you we will make a good you know deal out of it once the president ascends to it then I'll be glad to be here on other channels to discuss the internal democracy that APC government has pushed to enjoy you know it's everywhere I'm not going to accept APC it's everywhere all the parties have this challenge of you know nomination and the rest you know for some people to believe but if you win if you are the winner you won't say the process is not fair because you are not the winner that's why you are saying you are going to cut you are going to please you are going to I will encourage them to you know to to meet with the national what is it called national reconciliation or appeal committee you know so that they can vent their their concerns you know legitimately and be a party man you know you win some you lose and in this case they are all winners you know you support the gentleman and see where we go from there but the election just on the corner so if I have democracy is crucial and I'm sure APC government is working in that and that's what this new electorate means addressing so you can rest assured that APC would deliver a good electoral law for our country interesting there from you are Mr. Ramoshino we've had mercy quite a number of attempts to cancel primaries protesting aspirants and all that and it seems to be a pattern meaning the in the PDP primaries in negative states you had them the likes of a Shagoni also you know protesting and and Biodom Senate of Biodom Lujimi attended her letter withdrawing from the race just hours or a day before the primary of PDP in AKT state we're seeing pictures of videos of protests the APC supporters of some other candidates went to the protests the PDP supporters of the other candidates went to the protest and allegations of preferred or anointed candidates you know by by the power brokers and the parts that being these political parties IFH a former governor of AKT state was quoted as saying you know that you can't eat where you did not so you know you can't eat where you did not work so in other words he's been he's been working in the party he's so there so is it's time to reap and there were pictures even videos showing the delegates going to show him their ballot paper as put up by the cable Niswapra online and so so it makes us you know worry about internal democracy and the politics of the strongman or the godfather as it were and Mr. Sino or Sino before you go um what do you say about this internal democracy and the politics of the strong and messy has asked you that question um i mean what don't we need to have in an open space you know a more open space where um one person cannot be allowed to determine who emerges in a party i think direct power who address that question in the direct power you have almost about 500 000 party loyalists voting so that's a direct primary that's the democracy you know showing me because you can't say my word i have my loyalist nobody can take that that's my right i have my loyalist that people believe in me so showing me that um the uh voting pattern does not really really mean anything and as long as that person is not mojo to vote or in the state of you know you know uh uh is in the state of duras to vote for a passport the gentleman i saw the video he went to go and vote on his own and he's coming back in his own volition showed it to you whoever he showed it to you know it's a pdp issue but generally i believe that our party needs to announce all the parties in india need to announce internal democracy and as i said this electoral bill we have taken a lot of things i will encourage you guys to have you know the copy of the amended bill and see what and what and channel even with the primary even with the indirect primary and the consensus candidate so these are the ingredients of you know expanding the cost of you know uh a party nomination and internal democracy for all the parties in india so i believe this after signing of this bill then we'll have a lot of things to talk about because most of the question must have been addressed like it's making we did a lot so you know it doesn't really matter anybody have their own base you know you can't take a kitty away from my fashion it's the two-time governor of the state is a grassroots man in one day every weekend to eat you know and uh for you know he's a he's a local man he can go to the market and eat he can go to anywhere and eat with them so they see him but what i can say is an pc would fit him if he likes he's going to eat a sorrow at the flugging there this time around hopefully i'm going to be hopefully i'm going to bring a kitty to to work for our candidate and i can assure you if he likes he's going to eat a sorrow eat a blueberry but we need money we'll beat him this time around interesting um it might not be a bad idea having um oyeba and jay also uh going to buy some corn or somakara or something on the road so he can be put on social media because that's what the politicians uh do i saw i saw i saw a collage messy of um of uh previous pictures from the likes of atikoboca rochas okorocha and ko when they went to eat corn on the street or plate here amici and ko and uh someone said well we're hoping for the next one uh to come around it's quite interesting but um ibrabo osino we want to thank you very much for your time yeah i appreciate it thank you so much it's nice to have you get to see you guys again all right thank you okay well that's it it's it's it has been an amazing conversation and we do appreciate you uh for sticking with us we still have one more leg to go and when we come through we'll be talking about the afghan the quarter finals the fact that you have some you know teams falling out and those that are still still in the game what are the expectations of these teams hopefully we're being joined by sports journalists to make sense of all of this