 Good evening everyone welcome to tonight's common council meeting before we start the meeting as usual We asked our city clerk to read the quote for the week. Thank you mayor Patriotism is not short frenzied outbursts of emotion, but the tranquil and steady dedication of a lifetime. Thank you Call the 7th regular meeting of the common council to order. Please call the roll Boren bauk Serta Gisha Hannah Heidemann Kittlesen Clowness Manny Meyer Montemayor Rinflaich Ryan excuse van der wheel for hassled and Wongamon 15 present quorum is present. It is time now to pledge allegiance to our beautiful country its flag Kittlesen, would you please lead us I? Pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God Indivisible with liberty and justice for all Thank You Alderman Kittlesen next item on the agenda is approval of the minutes president Hannah Mr. Mayor I move for approval Motion and second any discussion There being on all in favor say aye. Any opposed? Motion carries minutes are approved Mayor's appointments attorney Adams I hereby submit the following appointment for your consideration Alderman Jean Kittlesen to be considered for appointment to the Architectural review board to fill the unexpired term of Alderman Jim Gisha whose term expires on April 14th 2008 Thank you I'd ask for a motion to suspense so Alderman Kittlesen can begin working on this Second which is second to span any objection to that and then I need a motion to confirm the appointment Second second under discussion under discussion. I want to say thank you Alderman Gisha. It's a great job I I think it's sometimes it's just not possible to to to Meet all your obligations, and we thank you for our work hard work that you did would you like to say something sir? Thank you your honor it's a great group of people as I stated in my email wonderful folks and Jean Alderperson Clayunas was at all these meetings anyway, so it's a not kill so pardon me sorry Person Kittlesen so it'll be it should be a smooth transition. She's a real pro at this stuff And I appreciate the faith in the council in appointing me to begin with thank you. Thank you Manisha president Hanna comment. No, okay any more discussion? They're being on all in favor say aye. Any opposed motion carries appointments approved That's it. That's it. Thank you attorney Adams fourth of July comments by Alderman bulk Please sir. Thank you your honor just a brief Mention of the fact that I am proudest to be an American on the fourth of July and that is because I try to read the Declaration of Independence Every year on that day, and I recommend it to the citizenry it takes about four maybe five minutes to read It is an exceptional listing of why we became the country we became today Why we like elections and not coronations and why we like an independent judiciary and why we hate taxes all those things are Rolled up in there, and it's great family reading too You can take those paragraphs and talk about frontiersmen and brave Americans and Barbarie pirates and we have a great tale of American patriotism for your children So on this great fourth of July I encourage you to Google Declaration of Independence and spend five minutes reading about it Thank you all about And in addition to that real quickly I am 54 years old I've heard the Star Spangled Banner many many times every time I hear it. I still guess good goosebumps That's how important that thing is so thank you Next item public forum, ma'am city clerk. Yes first on the list is Tom Bowers. I believe have you pronounced it? Mr. Bowers, can you give me your home address, please? 2120 North 36th Street 2120 North 36 And you will have five minutes, sir I'm here tonight to discuss the recent appointment of the prior department as the ambulance carrier And over the years I've lived in Sheboygan now since 1964 I've been involved in some Campaigns I've served in some city boards But I've never seen such a railroad job in my life as the thing that was voted on here Two weeks ago, I believe What what has happened in Eau Claire was Eau Claire, Wisconsin? Had a private ambulance service years ago, and they couldn't make a go of it. So He went to a public That as far as I know is the only one in the city or I should say in the state That has done this Now there are other cities that have it the reason that they have the public Abbulance service is because no one else wanted it. You couldn't make any money with the new council that was elected in April. I was kind of excited We had some new members and We lost some good members, but I figured the new ones that we elected You know had something on the ball Now I know it was wrong Now this council is known as the hip pocket council the reason I'm here today is to discuss which is over the hill But anyway, just wanted to bring up some information Some of the information that was supplied by the fire department I'm not saying that's wrong, but I don't think that it was taking a consideration number one is medical supplies It's every car was $30,000 Allocated for medical supplies. I don't think that's enough Insurance was $3,400 a year That is way too low The billing will be done, I guess by Manitowoc a Manitowoc Plus a The also is done by the city was taken over because holy family wanted to go out of the Abbulance business. So now billing is $36,000 Which may or may not be correct, but I do know this that the buildings will be Crossed between the fire department and the ambulance department. Where are the charges going to be if you need four tires? For an ambulance when they go to the fire department where they go to the ambulance department also in the Proposal is three ambulances that are going to be I believe leased And I think the arrangements are already been made to least them My concern is I believe Orange Cross has seven Ambulance, of course they take in the the county What happens if we have two? transfers maybe three transfers to greed may Milwaukee or data Clark Who is going to be in shuwaigan taking the people? Also on the reimbursement now the figures that were supplied and I'm somewhat so much familiar with this Is this just take a hospital ambulance bill of a thousand dollars, which I understand it's high now The insurance companies are allowing approximately 50% Many care. I think it's even lower than that If 50% of the people are paying at least the hospital or the ambulance fire department with $250 But all that aside Let's take the projected revenue 675 thousand two hundred and thirty five dollars Expenses 479 487 Which if I recall rate was somewhere a profit of 190,000 But where are the other ambulance people gonna come from? Orange Cross has approximately 35 to 40 even the projections here That we were going to allow 15 Firemen so that leaves us we're gonna hire for Where are the other 11 going to be? Expenses allocate Let's just take the other 11 for firemen at fifty five thousand dollars, which Is very low because a fifty five thousand projection was for new firemen Excuse me. Mr. Bauer your five minutes are up. Would you like the additional minute you're allowed? Please? Okay. Go ahead Okay, we now have 11 firemen. I'll use fifty five thousand dollars That brings a total of one million 84 thousand 487 dollars Subtracting six hundred and seventy five thousand two hundred and thirty five dollars It's a deficit of four hundred and nine dollars and two four hundred nine 252 dollars all that said Let me back up a little bit when I watched the two weeks ago, I believe it was TV was turned on all I could see was firemen and I found out later They weren't from Shibuya a lot of them were from out of town and the local people were very upset with this because They felt that our console was intimidated by the firemen that were brought in to do this Our local people excuse me. Mr. Bauer your minute is up. I'm sorry. Okay. All right. Well, thank you for your time Thank you Next on the list is Henry Capitulo And mr. Capitulo, can you give me your home address, please? Yes It's 1619 North 38th Street. That's in the town of Shibuygan But I'm here as a representative for home Inc Okay, you will have five minutes sir. Okay I'm here today to encourage you to support the initiative to fund the community policing unit and Support the Shibuygan Police Department in its efforts to do more proactive policing I would encourage all members to read the 2006 conference of mayor's best practices of community policing in gang intervention and gang violence Look at what other communities are doing to support community policing in the and their results I have I will give the city clerk a copy of the report on CD for your information I attended the committee of the whole meeting with the Shibuygan Police Department meeting presentation After their presentation several older person were critical that the police department did not identify a specific plan on How to reduce their budget and in their analysis? They did they did not feel that their presentation had enough numerical substance as it pertained to actual cuts They went as far as to compare the presentation to a presentation that the Shibuygan Fire Department had made to a committee of the Council and how it lacked in comparison I heard the police report the police department presentation and these are some of the important facts that I ascertain from their presentation The presentation did specifically identify areas that the police budget could generate additional revenue if these expenses would be charged to the appropriate city Departments or other city entities that should be Financial responsible for these costs that are in the police budget For example the police dispatch budget apparently pays for up to 20 to 25 percent of dispatch attributed Shibuygan Fire Department, which is approximately between two two hundred to two hundred and twenty five thousand dollars of the dispatch budget Should this expense not be the responsibility of the fire department and be included in their budget The police budget pays for all school crossing guards, which cost the police department approximate approximately twenty thousand dollars annually Should not this expense be borne by the Shibuygan school district The police department budget pays for part of the school years on officers that are at the two high schools Should not this expense be covered by the Shibuygan school district If the aforementioned costs were covered by the appropriate city departments and or other city entities It would free up approximately three hundred and fifteen thousand dollars that the police department could use towards their community Community policing unit since the Shibuygan area school district can increase their yearly budget without the community outcry Then why should not they be responsible directly for these costs that directly benefit the school district their students families and the community? I written the Shibuygan press at the Shibuygan school district budget for 2007 will increase by three point three percent. This is approximately four point two million dollars I would encourage the two former Shibuygan area school district board presidents Mayor Perez and Alderman Hanna to start a dialogue with the Shibuygan school district to ask them to cover the previously mentioned Costs that are presently being paid by the Shibuygan police department I also reviewed the salaries that were published in the Thursday, June 28th 2007 Shibuygan press article I wholeheartedly commend the Shibuygan press for their efforts and for their comparison with other communities as it lend lend a Better perspective on how Shibuygan ranks with the other communities I would also like to say to the alderman who was visibly upset by the burning of a vehicle just a block away from his home That people do not fathom or understand the criminal element in the community until it touches home and it affects them personally This is why I repeatedly come back to this council chambers to try to convince the older persons That there is a serious problem in the city Shibuygan as it pertains to drugs gangs and crime I know this because I I have dealt with these problems and see them on a regular basis in the community. I Cannot convey to you the feeling that I that I get when you are asked to open a room only to find a tenant dead because Someone sold sold that person drugs and died and they did not because they did not fully understand the repercussions of Taking these drugs. This has happened to me personally on more than one occasion Or to see another tenant that is a nine-year veteran that is in ill health and cannot seem to be able to take care of himself And you contact health and human services only to hear that this case is marginal and they cannot do anything Thank God for the Shibuygan Police Department who responded to a call from another veteran who I contacted to see if he could do something for this Individual the police responded to the call on Friday afternoon And the individual was taken to the st. Nicholas Hospital on a commitment order where the veteran died the following Saturday morning The consolation that I had was that this veteran could at least die in a clean bed Surrounded by individuals that cared for him and his well-being and that I would not be the individual that had to find him dead in the Conditions that were Indescribable please take time to review any additional services by the city of Shibuygan for example At the we at look at the report that is compiled by the finance department for the municipal court Which apparently shows that Henry would you like your additional minute? Yes, okay Apparently shows that it is not generating as much revenue as it did in the previous year When the city made a decision to establish a municipal court They were extremely optimistic and they said they were going to be generating a good deal of funds for the city Now the city is going to provide amulet service and compete with Orange Cross Again, the city is confident that they will be generating a lot of additional funds for the city I just hope it does better than the municipal court Thank you very much. Thank you and Lastly we have Thank you Jeff Schucho and mr. Schucho. Can you give me your home address please? Yes, 2303 South 17th Street And you will have five minutes sir. Thank you. I decided to come today to speak to everyone After I had a conversation on WHBL last week Involved actually a front-page article in the Sheboygan Press in regards to the apparently Large amounts of overtime that we've been paying out and when I ran for alderman a while back I was I was doing a little research and little digging around my Myself and into that sort of thing and I more or less ran on a format of Doing cost time analysis and taking a look at all not just the police department but all the departments and Where the moneys were going and what could be done to help things along and in in regard to that I had mentioned the eight-day work week Which that work schedule which I could see was generating an additional 34 days off a year paid for every officer on the street and That amount of additional time off is Putting a stress on the department in essence. It's keeping Officers that are on duty shorthanded The excessive amount of time off then leaves a lower level of service for the citizens and it's kind of a snowballing effect That's where having civilian positions fill in where possible. I thought was a very good idea But I know sooner got off the phone and a retired officer called up and started throwing a bunch of Disinformation around about how I should we should do our homework and that sort of thing. Well, I'm afraid I'm afraid I did and I had also contacted as a result of that conversation Representative van Akron and this was I had contacted Representative van Akron in regard to the Sheboygan police departments attempt to bypass our second amendment rights They had recently charged three teens with disorderly conduct for attempting to play airsoft combat in a city park I don't know if any of you people are aware of those guns, but the public can mistake them for a weapon I suppose but their toys In my view, this is nothing more than an attempt to set a precedent So law-abiding citizens who legally carry unconcealed can be charged with the same offense if someone however uninformed calls them reporting someone with a gun The police department has just recently stated this very fact on WHBL publicly as Civil servants these individuals need to be reminded of who they serve and who dictates policy public trust is Something that is earned not just given away And I'll explain this next comment because people may not like it But I I wrote acting like New Age Nazis is not their place as civil servants and they should be reprimanded for their arrogant behavior Sadly, this is not the first time this kind of behavior has been observed and further demonstrates The need for oversight of this department's activities and policies I further demand my second amendment rights take precedent over local ordinances which Mr. Van Akron had assured me the state law does take precedent over Local laws and he provided me with some additional information I didn't file a complaint however the very next day after I appeared on WHBL I had a van in front of my house parked with a uniformed officer doing surveillance on me And I looked at this as a real waste of money Plain and simple. I'm here to help Thank you. Thank you That's it Wish to thank the citizens for addressing the council tonight Next item on the agenda is hearings first hearing is amend the city ordinance amend the zoning of property located at 507 Washington court from class NR six to class NC Commercial classification and the second hearing is amend the zoning of the Wells Fargo parking lot from class NR Six to class NC, which is neighborhood commercial classification Is there anyone in the audience that would like to address the council with respect to any of these two hearings? Is there anyone in the audience that would like to address the council? Is there anyone there being none president Hanna? Motion and second to close hearings any discussion There being none all in favor say aye. Aye any opposed Motion carries hearing their close Next item is consent agenda seven one through seven twenty three president Hanna Thank You mr. Mayor I move that all ROs be accepted and placed on file and all RCs be accepted and adopted Motion and second under discussion Alderman wagerman Thank You For a separate vote for a separate vote for a separate vote we do Reason being that myself and Alderman Finelson are members of this insurance group With respect to this item we will both abstain when it comes to a vote, okay, and it is a A real problem. I understand the medical benefits and but this year our insurance has won up a hundred and twenty dollars a month We'll be starting next year, and I'm sure that many of the retirees out there such as myself to find this to be an excessive burden Although I'm not blaming the city for it because I know if this the way things are and It's a it's a real sad state of affairs And we'll see that Wagon would you like to make a motion to accept an adopt report a committee and put the resolution upon his passes, then you can abstain Okay, is there a second to that second Under discussion on just seven twenty two To Alderman will abstain there being on please call the roll Boran Bulk hi, sir. Duh. Gisha Hanna Heidemann Kittleson Cleanness Manny Meyer Montemay or Rinfleshe Vanderweel Verhasselt and Wangeman We have thirteen eyes and two Abstentions motion carries now we will move on to seven one through seven twenty three with the exception of seven twenty two Is there any further discussion? There being none, please call the roll bulk Hi, sir. Duh. Gisha Hanna Heidemann Kittleson Cleanness Manny Meyer Montemayor Rinfleshe Vanderweel Verhasselt Wangeman and Boran Fifteen eyes. Motion carries communications and petitions seven twenty four through seven twenty six to be referred The port of officers two seven twenty seven we will hold for action on seven forty two please make that notation Seven twenty eight through seven forty to be referred Resolutions introduced three seven forty one by Alderman Meyer, Hanna and Boran Approving the rental of police officers ATVs for the use of the Fourth of July Alderman Meyer Thank you Your Honor I make a motion that the resolution be put upon its passage Motion in second under discussion Alderman Bauch did you wish to speak? No, sir. There being none please call the roll Serta Gisha Hanna Heidemann Kittleson Cleanness Manny Meyer Montemayor Rinfleshe Vanderweel Verhasselt Wangeman Boran and Bauch Fifteen eyes. Seven forty two by Alderman Meyer Ryan Montemayor and Heidemann Authorize and enter into a contract for the boardwalk reconstruction on the west side of the river from Rotary Riverview Park to the H Street Bridge Need a motion to suspend on seven forty two and seven twenty seven Alderman Meyer Thank you Your Honor I ask for a motion to suspend Is there any objection to that? There being none Need a motion to put both resolutions upon their passage So moved Is there a second? Second? Under discussion Alderman Boran Thank you Your Honor I have a couple questions When was it determined that this boardwalk had to be replaced? I know I've been down there a few times to some of the restaurants down there and walked on the boardwalk Is it in that ill repair that it has to be done? And when would the construction begin? Hopefully if when it does begin it's not going to be an inconvenience to the businesses down there And I see the price tag with all of the add-ons and to hear if my math is correct is Two hundred and sixty six thousand three hundred and ninety two dollars and forty five cents And that's another concern of mine if you know could this With the budget condition that we're in going into for two thousand and eight And of course even this year is there a possibility that this could be put off Is it absolutely necessary that this be done now with that dollar figure thank you I will call on Alderman Rinfeich but Mr. Bebo be ready to answer that Alderman Rinfeich Thank you Mr. Mayor I guess an additional question for me for the committee as well Is all the other riverfront work we've done involves the pouring of the concrete A much well made it as picturesque but much more durable Have the has it been estimated what that would cost to replace the boardwalk with So we can avoid having to do three hundred thousand on up every several years as well That's the other question what happened Okay Mr. Bebo would you please come forward Paul Ed do you have something to add to Okay let's take Mr. Bebo first the Miss Anders I think Paul Ed can add to this as well because her office has been involved But I can at least answer some of the questions in terms of the material concrete Versus the wood that we chose the wood that we chose is is much more durable than What you have now it's pretty much what we have is pressure treated lumber out there What we're looking at doing is it is actually a rainforest type of board It's an EP it's a certified rainforest so it's it's coming from Brazil And this wood is being used on the Atlantic City boardwalk it's very durable It has a very long life expectancy anywhere from 40 to 50 years we're expecting to get out of this product This budget in terms of this project it was identified two years ago already in the capital improvements Programming as part of the overall south pier district improvements last year already we had The first phase of it where we've improved all of the all of the lighting along the boardwalk This is now the second phase of redoing that decking it is becoming a hazard We do get concerns with trips and falls out there The proposed project schedule on this as well is to occur this summer We've talked with the contractors we had a pre-bid meeting and what they'll be doing is we'll be All they can do is tear off as much as they can replace in a day So at the end of the day of the construction day the boardwalk will be reopened So we'll be done in sections as they move along I guess that that's where I can answer any other questions as Paulette committee You will just hold on Thank you your honor Rainforest what is what's going to be used? Correct but this is a certified this is certified rainforest wood that it's not coming from the rainforest It's coming from Brazil it's it's it's certified by the government of Brazil It's certified by the government of the United States it's being imported We researched this very stringently to make sure everything is above board The company that we're getting it is out of Milwaukee who's supplying us We've already purchased that at the at the previous meeting We the city pre-purchased it that way we save on on the taxes we saved about a couple My second question would be with Alderman Rindfleisch said you know What about concrete? Rainforest is sounds like very valuable resource that we're using in Sheboygan The the problem with concrete is that this the substructure For the boardwalk is designed to hold the wood if we went with concrete then we're adding It's very expensive redoing the substructure adding it's basically it's suspended over the river So the under structure which is some steel timbers and some and some wood timbers that support the current boardwalk Would have to be redone to support the weight of that concrete Okay Alderman please Thank you Alderman Vanderweil Thank you, Your Honor. My question I'm trying to remember back when it was built My question is how old is it when it was built? It was built in the early early 80s it's approximately 25 30 years old Thank you Alderman Rindfleisch Thank you Mr. Mayor I have a couple of questions but follow up on the certified it's certified what certified renewable resource It's not coming from the actual jungles it's farmed is that correct or explain the certified to people at home Correct and it's not you're right it's not from the jungles necessarily where it's it's Virgin Timber It is a it is a resource that is it's a it's a lumber that is it's readily available And it's marketed and it's it's it's controlled in terms of how much can be cut and where it can be cut and how much can be sold in a year It's not as if we're going out and getting teakwood from from the Brazilian rainforests. It's just coming from the country Alderman Gisha Thank you, Your Honor. First of all I wouldn't support concrete the whole term of boardwalk kind of takes away from the possibility In my view of the ambiance of having actual boards on a boardwalk but second the we already own the lumber so that's really In my opinion a moot point I guess did you look at so this is kind of just a follow-up me for the future Do you look at any sort of extruded material which you see a lot of people on decks and stuff and second and maybe this is a question for Paulette This was already in the plans can she describe where the funding came from as a general fund money tiff money etc etc Thank you. In terms in terms of the composite or plastic lumber again It doesn't have much structural quality so then what you need to do is is add so much under support structure to support that quality And we just had that at Maywood for instance on their deck they went with the plastic lumber and lo and behold The under structure was had to be three times the structure normally needed for for a deck Thank you Paulette Thank You Mayor and County Council The the amount the budgeted amount for that project was general fund we did have it in the capital improvements program it had been put off It's a need of repair as David said we are staging it so that those businesses stay open and in business Again we did look at a variety of materials over a couple of years when Tom Holton was still here I remember we did talk about the you know the plastic decking that the jury is still out on that we weren't very confident in that material as of yet And so I know that I think Ryan sasma from engineering did travel up to Superior and took a look at the decking that they've used there They're happy with it and so we move forward with that chosen material Hold on a minute Vice President Board Thank you your honor Paulette one is this one is this actually scheduled to begin the construction In July I think that's why we're asking for a suspension tonight so that we can begin it we've already we have some of the wood It's been it'll be stockpiled or is stockpiled at the armory that's the only thing that could throw the budget off by a little But we'll still stay within budget is mobilization for that material Okay I don't want to dwell on inconveniencing the businesses but why couldn't this be done in the September through mid October after Labor Day When the traffic is going to be you know just a snail space compared to what it is now I you know I don't even want to inconvenience the tourists there this summer Why not wait until after Labor Day when you still got it's going to be colder but there's not going to be traffic down there before the snow flies I think a part of it is and I can't answer that fully but what I'm aware of is it is that wood and paint for the wood and kind of in staging it And bringing in when it's available if we can't get it from the lumber yard when it is available then that delays the project So if we can start now stage it with the wood we can get it completed before the winter season Thank you that concern was was also expressed before Vice President Warren and I believe that the boardwalk will be constructed in sections And every sections that's ribboned off so to speak will have a detour for the for the residents and tourists Thank you Paulette Okay we are voting on 742 and 727 Please call the roll Gisha Aye Hannah Aye Heidemann Aye Kittleson Aye Clioness No Manny Aye Meijer Aye Montemayor Aye Rindfleisch Aye Vanderweel Aye Verhasselt Aye Wangeman No Boran No Bauch Aye You pressurized eyes Heikste Mek Aye nine Okay案 No Hei nothing 1 9 10 9 The 9 10 Nobody Nothing Important Our A Five Step Thank you, Your Honor. I agree with the decision to suspend the rules. I think this has been out there long enough and it's time to move it along. I appreciate Mr. Capitillo's suggestions that he brought this evening. Those were some good suggestions with some numbers tied to them and some alternatives. I'm encouraged by the rapidness with which the SPD and the unions have responded after our community, the whole meeting last Monday. I spent a good dialogue this week and I think there's a good faith effort underway for Alderman and the unions and the SPD to sit down and find good faith long-term solutions that will result in long-term efficiencies. Like on the 4th of July I've heard from several constituents over the past week saying for goodness sake why on the 4th of July are we paying sworn officers $130 or that's what it will cost the city $130 an hour to have sworn officers on the parade route that day. Some of these officers taking in over the course of the year $12,000, $18,000, $19,000 a year. On the 4th of July we're going to spend or it's going to cost us about $23,000 on one day. We can use private security and save $17,000 that day alone. That's 10% of the of the challenge that Chief Kirk has for this year of that $175,000. So on one day we can make a solution like that. I hope that the unions and Chief Kirk and the Alderman will come back with great solutions like that that keep our budget flat if not shrink them because if there's any doubt in anyone's mind what what the voters think about our tax levy they voted this week when the population statistics came out and people are moving to the outer cities and moving out of the city of Sheboygan because they like the proximity they love the lake they love the restaurants they love what we have they just don't want to pay our taxes they don't think it's worth it to live that close. So I am going to vote no this evening but for a very specific reason. I want to be proven wrong. I want Chief Kirk and his team to work so well between now and the August budget time frame that they're going to be able to come back with great ideas in August and say Alderman Bauch you were wrong and here's our great list of savings. So I look forward to seeing that list and look forward to the great solutions from the police department in the unions. Thank you sir. Thank you Alderman Bauch. Alderman Meyer. Thank you Your Honor. I also am voting no on this. Two or three years ago when Alderman Shusha was chairperson of public protection and safety she brought up many of these items for budget to look at in the budget process and possibly eliminate some of these expenditures and at that time we were told no by Chief Kirk and one of them was having a private firm do the parade routes and the picnics and we were told no and I'm hoping that this time seeing that they came forward and said they're going to change their their way of doing business. I hope that they will look into these other cost-saving measures but until I see them I cannot support this. Thank you. Thank you Mr. Mayor. First of all question has come up within public protection and safety committee multiple times and this is a question then for assistant city attorney while you're sitting with us today. My understanding is is that the state statutes only allow a sworn officer to stop and redirect traffic is that correct? That is correct. So technically we can't hire a private firm to stop and direct traffic unless we're breaking the state statutes is that correct? Specifically direct traffic you have to have a sworn officer. Okay and the exception for school crossing guards is what? It's in the state statutes. It's the one example given the state statutes. So I agree I think there are a lot of ways that we can save. I think these areas that we want to talk about and bring up are good areas we need to partner up with our state representatives to get those laws changed. We can't just simply decide it's bad policy on our own. We know it's bad policy. We need to be able to make a strong statement and and go to where those changes can be affected. Second of all I understand the frustrations of hearing consistently no within this department. I'm uncomfortable voting one department in exemption to what we're trying to do and as a control of taxes throughout and not say that any one department is more important than other departments in this in the city. However if people are moving out and they're voting with their feet because it may be taxes but it may be safety issues and having driving around the city all day as part of my job I see those safety issues all the time. I see you know drug deals in broad daylight in somewhere heavy as trafficked areas. I see property crimes with vandalism and with garbage being tossed in people's property that aren't theirs. These are quality of life issues as well and I think that this community policing is one of the best ways that we can partner with our departments that we're looking at working with instead of being dictatorial towards them. So for this year I will vote to support this one. However I urge the department to look deep to find out other ways that we can continue to find cost savings so that the reasons why people are leaving we eliminate one the crime is controlled and two our taxes are the line is held on that. So it's an effort that we have to work together with our police department and not dictate to them. Thank you. Thank you old man in place. Old man Van der Wil. Thank you honor. I agree with Holman Reinflesche and I agree that we need to look in the long term solutions and with budget time coming up sooner than we think we're going to be dealing with that very quickly. But we can't forget the reason why we're here tonight. It's not because the chief police asked us to give him money. It's because we got 63 documents sent to public protection safety and finance asking us to find the money somewhere. And I was looking through these these documents. I have 63 of them right here. I was looking at them. One of them stood out to me because what comes out from from the elder man's most a lot is that we need the trust from the people. And it's just a few sentences I want to read from Jeff Mueller stating that he usually doesn't take the time to write these letters as he feels it is usually a waste of time and that it's been his experience that politicians will always be just that politicians. They will tell you what you want to hear but we'll do whatever they want regardless of the citizens concerns. This latest move to indefinitely suspend these two critical units is one of those worst tragedies that he has seen happen as a result of politicians being politicians. This is the reason why we need to do this tonight. There's no other reason the people want us to. That's why. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you your honor. When this all started remember Chief Kirk decided to stop these particular programs so that he would have the money for general fund over time social security retirement patrol regular social security retirement communication social security retirement CID social security and retirement and he chose to cover those by stopping these programs and he's a very intelligent man he earns lots of money to figure this out and I will bet before the end of the year he can find other ways of funding these particular things other than community policing and street crimes. I'm going to vote no further discussion. I want to make some comment myself. I would ask the council to work with me. This is a management decision. Chief Kirk and I have discussed this budget. Proper time next year would be to allow an increase in overtime if that projection is so made then to start spinning wheels in the middle of the budget year can be dangerous for a lot of departments and as people like to say a precedent is established what's to keep another department from coming and asking for the same thing. It's important that you allow me as the executive of the city to work with department heads and and resist the temptation of getting beyond that little line of micromanaging you hold me accountable for that budget. I ask you to hold me accountable for that budget but if that budget is going to be changed mid-year several times that may not be a good thing. So again I support the police department. Chief Kirk and I have had this discussion before we've talked about putting together an additional plan whereby we increase street crimes in particular for drugs in particular for crimes that are being committed out in the community by city residents and perhaps non-city residents. I also wanted to address the issue of the high taxes. Obviously and I say this without most respect obviously the town of Sheboygan and the town of Wilson can afford to have lower taxes. They don't spend ten million dollars on just their police department because the county provides that 33% of that budget provided by you on top of that. So obviously they can provide lower taxes. They don't have a man fire department. It's a volunteer. Of course they can cut taxes and the point I'm trying to make is that when somebody says they move into another town because they pay less taxes you better believe it that's what's happening. It may be some crime but it's also the big factor is they're moving because they can afford to pay lower taxes because all of us are paying those taxes and the people who live just outside the border a skip away can still come in use our parks use our streets use everything there is all the amenities and all the services for free. How do we prevent that? I don't think that we can. I really don't think that we can but that is the dynamic that's occurring now out there and it's not just happening in Sheboygan. It's happening throughout the state and other states. People have figured out that when for example Sheboygan is landlocked. We're landlocked to the east the lake we can't build there. I tried but we can't. We can't go west. Kolder is there in I-43. We can't go south town of Wilson. We can't go north town of Sheboygan. So we're landlocked. Our budget is a lot bigger I guarantee you than the town of Sheboygan town of Wilson village of Kolder. Of course they can afford to provide lower taxes. People have figured that out. What's the solution? I don't know but what I want to point out is there is that a main reason for people moving out? Absolutely. I hear it all the time. People tell me that. People say I'd be stupid to live in the city. Now I'd be worried. I think I told Mike Kinsley that I'd be worried if they were leaving the town and taking their homes with them because then we don't have the tax base but the homes are staying. We do have for our benefit a new movement of people moving into the waterfront the condos. It's slow but it's going to take fire and it's going to grow. We have that happening. I predict that some of that some of those people that are moving out will be eventually replaced. Now this is a trend, mind you, that has occurred since 2002. It hasn't ended because the next census 2010. So it's been occurring for quite a while and people have figured out. It doesn't take much to figure out that if you move outside the city limits. There's some benefits to that and there's some benefits to living there and coming into the city. Alderman Bauchay have a comment sir? Thank you Your Honor. I had one last thought based on what Alderman Reinfleisch and Alderman Van der Wiel said and that is I got conflicting counsel on about those same state statutes and I was counseled that we could put non-sworn officers on the street but if I am wrong I would encourage if I'm getting bad counsel I would encourage those 63 citizens that wrote those letters and I would encourage every citizen in Sheboygan to write a letter to State Senator Leibow and to Terry Van Akron asking them to help us save our community policing units by changing that very silly statute that says we can't have fine decent rental security or citizens that have been through the police academy stand watch at our 4th of July parade. Let's flood their offices and say save our community policing units. We need the money for better causes. Thank you sir. Thank you Alderman Giesha. Thank you Mayor Perez. Assistant city attorney it's easier to say look at it in paper than say is there anything stopping the police department from swearing people in for one day or for one hour or for a half a day in the statutes of the state of Wisconsin. In the statutes? Correct. There would be contractual issues to deal with. Right but from the statute standpoint you could do that that's I'm not saying that to to rebut the the police department request here I'm just saying there are opportunities like that we just heard oh you can't do it it's in the statute we got to fight our representatives when in fact you can do it in a little different way thinking outside of what traditionally was no you can't or somebody telling you yes you can there's a middle ground here and my hope as I said last week is I'm voting for this money but this is the last time I'll vote for this money and in the hopes of just this little scenario right here that there is a little middle ground it isn't just no you can't or yes you can it's right there in the middle and I'm I'm hoping that with the discussions that that I've seen starting to percolate that we don't have to go to the route of a consultant because frankly if we can't fix it this time that's our only choice in my opinion and I and I will put the piece of paper in the IBM's electric and type out the resolution calling for it but but please don't look at his black and white this is just one example of there actually is a middle ground thank you thank y'all Magisha we will call the vote on 7th what was it 746 746 please call Hannah Heidemann Kittlesen Cleonis Manny Meyer Montemayor Rindfleisch van der Wiel for Hasselt Wongamann Boren Bauck Serta Gisha Levin eyes for nose motion carries 749 through 751 to be referred reporter committee 6752 by law and licensing recommending denying beverage operators license number 74 79 based on the applicants non-cooperation with the committee vice president Boren thank you honor I recommend that the reporter committee be put upon its passage accepted and adopted motion is second under discussion is Nicole M Levendelsky here tonight just not here your honor please proceed it was a unanimous decision of the law and licensing committee to deny the license based on non-cooperation with the committee Ms. Levendelsky was given two opportunities to appear before the committee second one by certified letter and she did not appear either time so I recommend that we deny okay thank you vice president Boren any further discussion there is none please call roll Heidemann Kittlesen Cleonis Manny Meyer Montemayor Rindfleisch van der Wiel for Hasselt Wongamann Boren Bauck Serta Gisha and Hanna 14 eyes one abstention motion carries 753 by finance recommended filing various documents doesn't have your name on it but we need a motion to accept and adopt president Hanna thank you mr. mayor I'd make a motion to accept and adopt motion is second 753 accepting the doubt under discussion Alderman Cleonis thank you your honor can I have explanation on number 3 RC number 7870708 president Hanna yes thank you this was a requested the money had originally been approved for our visitors from Germany and so this should go back into the general funds and if it's to be approved it needs to come back out through that motion anything else there being on all in favor say aye any opposed motion carries reporter committees 7754 by law and licensing recommended denying beverage operators license number 7168 based on the applicants non-cooperation with the committee the record of violations related to the license activity and the applicant status as a repeat law by later vice president Boren thank you honor I move that the report of committee be accepted and adopted motion second under discussion thank you your honor is Tiffany Stalbert here tonight it's not here your honor please proceed again it was you know unanimous decision by the committee to deny based on the applicants non-cooperation with the committee again this applicant had two opportunities to appear before the committee second one by certified letter she did not show up before the committee she also had a record of violations related to the license activity and the applicant status as a repeat law violator okay need more discussion there being on please call oh Kittleson Clowness Manny Meijer Montemay or Rindflash Vanderwheel for hassled Wongamon Boren Bulk Serta Gisha Hanna and Heidemann 15 ayes motion carries 755 by the special committee on risk management making a favorable recommendation regarding the rental of the police officers ATVs for the use on the 4th of July for patrol on the lake of the Lake Michigan Beachfront and other law enforcement purpose is needed for $15 for the day in accordance with the proposed ATV rental form agreement Alderman Meyer thank you your honor I would move that the RC be accepted and adopted motion and second under discussion all in bulk thank you your honor I just have a question about how long we've been doing this I think this is a great idea is this something new or second year second year I'd just like to commend the members of the police department for coming up with what a great innovative solution is they need mobility on that day they need to get around it's a great idea and I appreciate them volunteering or basically volunteering their personal vehicles thank you all about present half yes I just wanted to address Alderman about statement this has been an excellent program one-year history you know they stepped forward and it just allowed them to keep us safer on the 4th quite frankly trying to get along in that sense not easy so she's a very handy tools Alderman Meyer thank you your honor and I would just like to say that this is a huge cost savings to the city because we cannot afford to buy our own ATVs and these officers are bringing their own personal vehicles for this $15 a day that's a good deal I would say anything else there'll be a non please call the roll Clowness Manny Meyer Montemay or Rin Flesch Vanderwheel for Hasselt Wongamun Boren Falk Serta Gisha Hanna Heidemann and Kittlesen 15 eyes motion carries report of committees 8 7 56 and we held 7 43 we will act on 7 56 first by finance recommending authorizing a transfer of appropriations in 207 budget with a recommendation to select medtech and a notion and a notation of commendation for the fire department's effort to be 5,000 per unit under estimates president Hannah thank you mr. Mayor I would make a motion that we accept and adopt motion and second under discussion vice president born thank you runner I just wanted to mention that I brought up I brought up during the finance committee meeting and I'm not going to make a motion but I just want the council and the citizens to know that I'm going to be keeping an eye on this if it does come to fruition that we do not lease these vehicles and they are and they are purchased at a cost of over $400,000 and it does and if it does end up coming from the motor vehicle fund we receive five percent to five and a quarter percent depending on the current interest rates interest on that money in the motor vehicle fund so if it does in fact come from the motor vehicle fund and it is a purchase I'm going to bring up in finance as I brought up the other day that the fire department will have to repay this $415,000 with interest I think it's only fair thank you thank you all the one born for their discussion all of them for hassle thank you your honor I just like to ask the question I guess why there's a difference for one between 743 and 756 in the dollar amount I imagine there's some supplies or something in there that's a difference Mr. Gabbard question is why is there the difference in the amounts in 743 and 756 thank you yes there is some additional equipment in there that besides the three ambulances themselves that the fire department will need I think I include defibrillators and radios and other equipment that will be needed that'll be brought in under future contracts from different vendors follow-up question thank you so I might understand are these fully equipped partially equipped ambulances at those prices what I might have to turn what other to give you more of a detail what's included in the vehicles themselves not that familiar with that I would just like to know what other dollar amount is following behind this number or is this the number that we're going to have delivered to us again I don't have a listing with me of all that detail I don't know Deputy Chief Sharp might we'll ask Chief Listosky in a minute Alderman Manning you're next we have a question for Mr. Gabbard thank you my question is do we plan to follow a depreciation schedule on these vehicles and what's the life expectancy is that determined yet we do want to keep a fair and accurate accounting of expenses these are the revenues and I wonder how that's going to work out at this point right now there is the question of how the vehicles will be financed if they were to continue with the initial here that we're doing with having the motor vehicle fund yes there would be depreciation on the vehicles there would be a replacement factor in the rates if we go with leasing as the alternative then of course there would not be any depreciation would just be the lease payments do we have a life expectancy how long we would plan to own and operate these vehicles understanding seven years okay we'll get we'll get to that a minute oh my president born do you have question for Mr. Gabbard or for the chief list okay you want to go my cousin born thank you I think all of the council members have a sheet tonight Sheboygan Fairly Department Abulant procurement proposal with a lot of numbers on it it would have been nice if all four of these companies that are mentioned if we would have seen something something on that company's letterhead with these numbers on it we don't have anything other than these numbers on a piece of paper stating that for example medtech is locked in at 138 395 we've got nothing on their letterhead that says that and speaking about professional presentations it would have been much more professional on the fire department's part to have something with each company on their letterhead saying that that price is locked in we don't have that we've got a sheet of paper and that's all we've got thank you thank you I was president born arm and that for hassle for Mr. Gabbard please do thank you matter rich could you explain the technicalities of why we're providing this authorization on the likely plan or at least everybody's leaning towards leasing you explain that certainly after discussions with the fire department we realized that the leasing option which is new to the city to proceed on the vehicles that there is any different areas that we need to look into the committee did want us to have three different proposals in at the same time there was a need to expedite the contract so that the construction of the vehicles could start on the assembly line and what we proposed here is what we've done before like with ordering buses is to utilize the motor vehicle fund to be able to get that contract that order out even though the funding may come from somewhere else such as the buses and you know my funding may come from federal grants later on but this would basically allow the contract to be let to start the construction so that the timetable is not held back and the same time give us time to look at the financing options here of of leasing and to get multiple proposals so basically this resolution is saying medtech go build these ambulances we'll figure out whether we're going to lease them or buy them correct that option of financing could be answered after this okay and oh question why are we waving the formal bid process in this case it's a fairly large sum of money again I imagine it's a time constrained but I guess I want to pose that question why are we waving the formal bid process and again dollar amount might have to turn to the fire department on that I know these are specialty vehicles a lot of times to get into these areas you don't have multiple vendors I know in this case we're four proposals received but yes there would be a time element again with that if we were going to the formal process because we'd have to allow people a period of weeks before they make the proposals after the formal opening and evaluation of that so that would take more weeks to go through the formal process could you explain the actual bid process that took place here that gave us these four sets of numbers again the fire department deputy chief Sharp I think was at the responsibility of obtaining those from the vendors okay for Mr. Gephardt so we're going to we're going to vote on establishing five hundred and forty thousand dollars so somebody can build an ambulance for us but we still might be able to lease it okay that would be the appropriation and that would include the other auxiliary equipment also thank you Mr. Gephardt Chief Lastosky who would like to go first Alderman Mr. Mayor yes thank you and members of council I would ask that deputy chief Sharp be allowed to come up and answer questions since he's the point person on this project I need a motion open the floor second all in favor say aye any opposed motion carries deputy chief okay who wants to go first thank you Mr. Mayor deputy chief Sharp how many bids were you asked to procure three how many did you get four thank you the bid that happens to be the lowest is it not about ten thousand dollars less than your estimates in your proposal actually our estimates in the proposal for an ambulance built on this Chevrolet 4500 series chassis was approximately 143 thousand dollars so where it's about 9000 based on the prepaid price with yeah looking at the prepaid price correct so we we commended you in our resolution for being five thousand dollars under each unit but actually it's more closer to ten thank you medtech you have some experience with correct medtech ambulance company is owned by the Pierce Corporation that's the same builder that we've used for our majority of our fire trucks for a number of years yes the the process because we are looking to waive the competitive bidding process and the question is arisen tonight as to documentation of these numbers being accurate what as far as actual quotes from these vendors to hold them to these numbers what do you have from these vendors I actually had a proposal this one that I happen have with me is the medtech proposal I had one that was similar in size from all four of these vendors before we even got to this point all of this information was shared with Kimber health and we reviewed it in his office thank you final question is has to do with defibrillator some talk in the committee about that about the inability to get a certain ability 12 lead defibrillator because of some FDA issues and it might be helpful for you to express to the public that that is your what you have discovered with that and what path your father was a whole medtech physical control would be the vendor on that and there was a hold for a period of time for them not to be able to do business it wasn't a defect in product or anything like that it was something to do with other regulations that has since been lifted for the 12 lead defibrillator monitors so they are currently available and I've been in touch with their representative and have the paperwork in place and have started to secure the pricing information from them just as a final follow-up I'm sorry the price the it's my understanding that the intention of the ambulance when delivered which we don't have to pay for until they're delivered is is that they would be an all-in price so when we're looking at whatever numbers these are versus what we're what we're projecting to either lease or or lend to ourselves an excellent suggestion by by alderman born of the finance meeting that met no resistance whatsoever that was to charge interest if in fact we do use the motor vehicle fund but these would be basically turnkey with the monies that we have allocated that's correct the thank you the difference between the purchase prices or the acquisition price for each one listed and the amount of money that's needed is for the other peripheral equipment that's needed alderman play this thank you honor a question for deputy sharp what is the life expectancy of these vehicles the life expectancy of the vehicles I would say is a minimum of 10 years I think one of the big factors just like it would be with anyone's personal vehicle life expectancy is somewhat driven by mileage right now the services is set up that we would handle 911 calls in the city limits if that were to change and we were out to go to the surrounding communities or even do transports out of the city the obviously the miles would increase that may have some impact on the life expectancy but I would believe that a 10-year figure even going into the surrounding areas and some transport work to other facilities out of town is accurate thank you president Hanna thank you very much deputy chief two questions really did you speak with anybody at orange cross and going over the specs and bounce ideas around and secondly under the current proposal for coverage transport's going to be incidental to what we're doing the primary transport's going to be orange cross at this point yes the primary transport out of the city would be orange cross I did speak with the people from orange cross off the record over a period of time just about what ambulances they use and I spoke with one person in particular who's familiar with their purchasing process and how they spec ambulances and things to look for I know that some of their most recent purchases of ambulance have been med techs and they're very satisfied with that in working on this project I also spoke with representatives of the Green Bay fire department and the Oshkosh fire department and went to both of their departments and looked at their vehicles and their most recent purchases are also med tech ambulances thank you just to clarify are these fully equipped turnkey ambulances or is there additional equipment I'm hearing both I think peripheral equipment was used thank you in our proposal the lease amount covered fully equipped ambulances this is a portion of that based on the fact that the vendors are not the same and when we put these things all together we could we can meld them into a lease package that covers both equipment and vehicles but for the purpose of ordering this out from this vendor we need to have a specific purchase order for in a specific amount for that portion of it when this is all combined will be a total amount not to exceed the amount that is listed in the other portion of this document and those lump numbers could either be a lease package or out of the mortar vehicle fund whatever the wish of the the council is at that point but at that point when those things are put together then there will be one package price that will be a it'll be a completed project so we won't be exceeding the 540,000 for ambulance equipment or related equipment correct okay can you explain I asked Richard I think he deferred to you why we are waving the official bid process or the formal bid process well a portion of that is the time constraints and the fact that this had been pushed out for a number of weeks and the process that we've had to go through in order to do that deputy chief Sharp it's very diligent that and knows these vendors we've looked at these the packets on each as he said on each individual product and each individual vendors about this thick and that was based on numerous visits vendors came in with equipment we had a committee look at this equipment we've gone to other cities we've talked to other cities to to attest to quality and costs and everything else associated with the purchase and essentially other than them not being sealed it's what deputy chief Sharp did he brought in all these vendors they all knew were competitive in that we're going to each of of these vendors trying to find the best price and the best product and they put together those packages and then he reviewed those with the city purchasing agent because they're very detailed and it's each specific ambulance isn't exactly like the other one there you know there's just it's not like a you know a vehicle where it's it's more generic there's one has a different been here or a different device there but they're very close and comparable and he reviewed that with the city purchasing agent and we came up with the best price okay I guess it's in finance here about a month ago and I just pose it here again at this point time seeing some time has passed seeing that we're putting the manufacturer Pierce this is a parent company are putting them under such duress to get this ambulance out and almost half the time probably 40% less time than they typically would construct this ambulance do we have any way of knowing whether we're paying a premium as if we would order then wait 10 months do we have any way of knowing whether we're paying a premium well I think we're looking at four vendors here that all gave us a price I don't believe we're paying a premium for that they have a construction process and certain vendors are able because of their size to to move that process forward insert people different purchasers into the mix and maybe W. Chief Sharpe can comment on that process but no we do not believe the cost of the vehicles was compromised by doing this way okay it's a it's a more rushed process then we normally liked it to see but we believe that we're going to get to the proper result here okay thanks yeah Alderman asshole very hustled you're you are correct normal build time on an ambulance would be approximately nine to ten months and we're going to be actually setting up the whole service in seven and hoping to do this construction in five months I think that the comparable numbers here bear out the fact that there's no premium being paid here that for the shortened timeline all of these manufacturers told me that they do in their production schedule build in some time for certain things that may come up and they would use some of that time they call it a pipeline as things are flowing through their pipeline they said there is there are some slots built in there for certain types of emergency situations okay that's a good explanation I guess the numbers here wouldn't really indicate anything like a premium just because it all be relative to the same time constraints so they might not be the best indicator whether there's a premium or not but I appreciate your explanation just one last question that I wanted to know the original resolution that was put forth was for $500,000 ambulance equipment expense correct if I'm seeing this right now we're at $540,000 my understanding my following this along correctly are we and I'm not trying to do one of these gotchas here we are trying to point this out but am I following this right that were $40,000 beyond what we originally planned and that $500,000 resolution here from a month ago I would say that yes we're beyond by $40,000 that was a number that when looking at the top dollar possible scenarios for all this peripheral equipment we use that that amount at the recommendation of mr. Gephardt to make sure that we are totally covered I do not believe that we'll be spending that amount I believe that will be spending much closer to the $500,000 number if not I know if I should say it but possibly even a little bit below what you know you've been involved in this deputy chief sharp quite a bit are we leaning towards the lease process or the purchase at this time I don't know that one of the things that drove this was that fact that interest rates went up a little bit over one half percent about six weeks ago just when we were getting into this I've been watching it they've started to come back down that final decision would be made along with mr. Gephardt's recommendation and with the oversight of the finance committee we'll make the right decision there and we will do comparables with several different leasing agencies before a final decision would be made vice president born thank you you're out of my questions been answered thank you all my men will thank you honor we have four proposals here and I don't need to see them on letterhead but if an alderman would want to see more proof that that that these numbers are valid if they contact you would you be able to give them that proof I have all that information in my office and I'd be glad to do it I'll be in my office tomorrow morning from shortly after seven o'clock till approximately four thank you thank you gentlemen better we'll okay thank you gentlemen we are going to call for the vote on 756 all men cleaners thank you your honor I didn't want just before we vote I just want to say that if we listen to the people regard to the police issue and authorizing 175 thousand dollars more we should be listening to the people who have also spoken on this issue and have said that they don't want this to be done in the city of Sheboygan it's an extra service and we're paying for it and people are moving out because of that as well so I will vote no thank you all men cleaners we will call the roll on 756 please do Manny Meijer Montemay or rin flash excuse me thank you van der wheel for hassled wongamon boran serda gisha hannah heidemann kittlesen and clio nes levin eyes for knows motion carries back to 743 I need a motion to suspend thank you mr. mayor I'd make a motion to suspend their sec second any objection to that there is none please proceed I would make a motion to put the resolution upon his passage is there a second second under discussion I think we've had it's all men for hassle thank you your honor I just wanted to pose the question to all men hannah being on the finance committee that the wording here is to enter into a contract for the purchase of three ambulance vehicles is that wording appropriate or should we be looking at more appropriating the funds because we're technically not asking them to go forward with entering into a contract correct purchase or lease appropriations for the perk the warning coming out of the finance committee purchase plan on the gisha thank you mr. mayor just for point of clarification a purchase is a lease it just doesn't purchase by the city it's purchased by a leasing agent the city then pays the leasing agent manual or monthly payments the language should be appropriate for either thank you okay we will call roll Meyer Montemay or Rin Flesch van der wheel for hassled Wongamun boron no bulk sirda yeshah hannah heidemann kittlesen clayunas and Manny Levin eyes for nose motion carries ordinance introduced 10 757 lies over matters laid over 11 629 an arrow our own number 1660708 by the city plan commission recommending amendment the zoning of the Wells Fargo parking lot between Washington court and Wisconsin Avenue from class neighborhood residential six to class neighborhood commercial classification Alderman Montemay or thank you your honor I moved to accept and file the arrow and the ordinance be put upon its passage motion and second under discussion there is none please call roll Montemay or Rin Flesch van der wheel for hassled Wongamun boron no bulk sirda yeshah hannah heidemann Kittlesen clayunas Manny and Meyer 15 eyes motion carries 630 our own number 1670708 by the city plan commission recommending amendment the zoning for property located at 507 Washington court from class neighborhood residential six to class neighborhood commercial classification Alderman Montemay or thank you your honor I moved to accept and file the arrow and the ordinance be put upon its passage it's motion and second under discussion Alderman bulk thank you your honor just like to commend the group that's working on that piece of property the property's been rehabbed and it's a beautiful piece of property and what they intend to do there is the beginning of really improving the long-term viability of the Washington court area of district two thank you Alderman Boat be no more discussion please call roll Rin Flesch van der wheel for hassled Wongamun boron no bulk sirda yeshah hannah heidemann Kittlesen clayunas Manny Meyer and Montemay or 15 eyes motion carries 647 resolution number 440708 by Alderman Hanna boron clayunas Boat and Gisha authorizing a transfer of appropriations in the 07 budget president Hanna thank you mr. mayor I moved that the resolution be put upon its passage motion and second under discussion there is none please call roll van der wheel for hassled Wongamun boron bulk sirda Gisha Hanna heidemann Kittlesen clayunas Manny Meyer Montemay or and Rin Flesch 15 eyes chief Kirk did you want to say something please come up thank you mr. mayor the members of the Common Council I believe this document dealt with the purchase of rifles I wish to say thank you for that I wish to say thank you to mayor for this you're the one who addressed this in a discussion we had with you many months back we talked about rifles and alderman boron I believe you also had you know we're somewhat concerned about our officers excuse me having a purchase some of our own rifles this was an issue that we tried to equip our vehicles with rifles and as we left it go mr. mayor you brought it up several times and I believe your effort on this is what led us to this decision here today so for the safety of our officers and for our community I wish to say thank you for that thank you chief any further discussion there being none please call roll we did what we did I'm sorry 648 resolution number 45 0708 by alderman Hanna boron bulk Gisha and clayunas rescinding resolution number 14 0708 and to authorize a transfer of appropriations in the 2007 budget president Hanna thank you mr. mayor I move that the resolution be put upon his passage motion and second under discussion vice president boron thank your honor I'm going to be voting no on this transfer however I want to bring out for the people that are watching that this this $300,000 is going to be tracked under a special revenue fund for the ambulance services so this is going to be a way that we can track this $300,000 and I think it's appropriate that it goes under ambulance services rather than under the fire department budget so as I said I'm going to vote no but because I don't support the transfer but it is good that it is going into a special revenue fund if it's going to happen thank you thank you all vice president boron there be no more discussion please call roll for hassled Ronderman boron bulk Serta Gisha Hanna I'm sorry thank you Heidemann Kittleson clayunas Manny Meyer Montemay or Rindfleisch and Vanderwill Levin eyes for nose motion carries 657 general ordinance number 150708 by all women for hassle Montemayor Heidemann Gisha and Meyer amending the code so as to change the TO for the finance department accounting division all women for hassle thank you I'd like to make a motion to put this general ordinance upon its passage motion and second under discussion there is none please call roll Wongamon boron bulk Serta Gisha Hanna Heidemann Kittleson clayunas Manny Meyer Montemayor Rindfleisch Vanderwill and for hassled 15 eyes motion carries general ordinance number 16 0708 by all women for hassle Montemayor Heidemann Gisha and Meyer amending the code so as to change the TO for the department of public works all women for hassle thank you your honor I'd like to make a motion to put this general ordinance upon its passage motion and second under discussion there is none please call roll boron bulk Serta Gisha Hanna Heidemann Kittleson clayunas Manny Meyer Montemayor Rindfleisch Vanderwill for hassled and Wongamon 15 eyes motion carries other matters authorized by law each one will be referred to the appropriate committee indicated except 763 a resolution by all women Hanna and Meyer ordering a hearing on the vacation of discontinuance of a portion of North 26th Street adjacent to lots 3 and 4 Smith garden of subdivision First National Bank of Manitowoc president Hanna just put it on his passage thank you mr. mayor I'd make a motion that the resolution be put upon his passage there's motion and second under discussion there being none all in favor say aye any opposed motion carries other matters attorney 765 submitting various license applications for the period ending June 30 2008 in June 32,000 thank you attorney Adams that will be referred to law and licensing motion to adjourn motion to adjourn all in favor say aye stand adjourned