 15 out of the 18 political parties in Nigeria are justling for the governorship seat of Lagos state. Now the 2023 Lagos state humanitarian election will take place on the 11th of March next year to elect the governor of Lagos state. Of course we know that Lagos is the economic capital of Nigeria. Now concurrent with the elections of the Lagos state House of Assembly as 27 other humanitarian elections to all other state houses of assembly. Now incumbent APC governor Babaji Desong Walu is eligible to run for re-election and has been nominated by his party. Again while some other political parties are yet to conduct its primaries, others are battling the party crisis in picking their guba candidates. Now joining me to discuss this is Badebo Rhodes Viva, he's a politician and a former member of the People's Democratic Party. It's good to have you join us this evening. I'm good. So you know when somebody hears that we're talking about the battle for the soul of Lagos. Lagos seems to be one of those places that if you are governor of Lagos it's as prestigious as being the president of Nigeria. That's a bit exaggerated but like I said in my opening we see a Babaji Desong Walu getting a ticket to return. In PDP we've seen a person who moved from the APC to the PDP getting the ticket but then we're yet to hear of other political parties. Many would wonder if it's going to be a two horse race, a three horse race or a four horse race. Now many have also pointed to the Labour Party as being an emerging third force but do we see that as a party that has its structure in the ground here in Lagos and would it be able to pull its weight come 2023? Okay so I can speak for the Labour Party. I can't speak for any other one. I do feel that the energy that I see in the Labour Party currently I have not seen in Nigerian politics in a very very long time. You know when people talk about structure usually people that you have put in place and they have responsibilities and they share, they get stipends or some money or some sort of reward system and that's what keeps them interested. With Labour Party you have people volunteering, you have people giving their time you have people already meeting autonomously and just waiting for the structure to plug them in. You have people in world groups, so it's no more just WhatsApp groups it's now we're in the same world, we are meeting online and then they are now meeting physically. So the kind of election that's going to happen in 2023 is something that Lagos State has never seen before and it also is helped by the fact that we now have new electoral laws that will actually allow for the real reflection of voter turnout to be seen because for a long time it hasn't been. I mean during my election four local governments were held almost two days while other local governments have been announced, you can't do that anymore. So you're going to really see the voice of the people in this election obviously they're always going to try and reduce vote-seeing and try and stifle it in places where opposition might be strong but it's going to be very different. I don't think Lagosians actually are fully aware because the wind is actually going to attack them. But they're the ones who are voting so if they're not fully aware how would they be able to participate? Lagosians that are viewing it and thinking that it's going to be the same of the same. The people that are very passionate people that are bringing all this energy people that are going to register, if you go past these places and you see the passion to get their voters' cards, right? Those people are not trying to participate in the same of the same. That passion is to create a completely new power structure and there's an emergence of an ideology there's an emergence of an ideology. It's no more just oh I have the bad boys and I have the money to buy votes. No. It's not about who has the vision, who is preferring solutions that make sense. What's your ideology? Can you speak well? Can you communicate your vision well? And there's a group of society that normally stays away from politics that are going to be very involved in this next election. Why do you think that there's that change in the tone, in the body language in the number of people who are now interested? Why do you think that is? Is it as a result of the Labour Party's movement or is it, let's say, an isolated case of people tired of same-same? So you see, it's two things. One, in every society every society works like a pendulum. So it goes from ultra-conservative to ultra-liberal and then it swings back. You saw it in America with Trump coming in and those swings will always throw something new up. Now the fact that the people that have emerged as presidential candidates are six and a half a dozen, you have a situation where there's so many allegations against them that kind of situation throws up somebody that now everybody's looking for somebody that does not have that much baggage can prefer solutions and has a clear understanding of where they need this country to go. And with the kind of situation we are in in our dire straits with our finances in this country you need somebody that's going to steer that ship, you know, off the cliff. And people are looking for that because now the Niger that we exist in today you cannot say you're going to ignore politics. It's affecting everybody. I was calculating on my way here that if I needed to send a thousand pounds it's almost like just short of a million. There's a time where that was four thousand pounds and the people are not earning money like and keeping a lockstep with the rises in prices of everything. So even if you have money, your accounts, bad policy and governance is reducing the value of that money. You know, so people are looking at this and it's affecting them personally and if there's somebody that shows that he is in this race to actually correct these wrongs and can actually, it's no more just about people that you meet the minimum. You have the school sat so you can be president. We won't see people that have the cerebral capacity to actually push this country forward because all these countries that we look at at our vans look at the quality of minds that are leading those countries. You know, politics cannot just be our popularity contest and people dancing on the stage and being cool with the grassroots but they cannot govern. We need to consider your capacity to govern. It's no more okay to just let us win the election. You win the election, elections last for one year and we deal with four years of mediocrity and failure. I like how this is going. I love the narrative, the conversations, the jaw-joing but when it comes to walking the talk how says Nari that this will hold sweet? I take you back to the local government elections just last year here in Lagos, appalling. Yes. Vote to turn out, vote to apathy. Well, one complaint to what happened in Oshawa and Iqiti as isolated cases but then let's look at, I mean because if you look at government from the grassroots that's the government that you're closest to most. How many people know who their grassroots leaders are? I agree 100%. So again as much as there is this movement of sorts whether it be, I mean people will vote on different platforms but how serious are we taking this? It's great that there is one movement but that movement is it enough to spark something within the average Nigerian? I ask this again because I want to bring it back to Lagos. Looking at the guys who, let's say for the APC, the PDP, the ADC and the Labour Party. Let's look at the personalities of these people who are running and there are those who would say that oh well the government the governor of Lagos State has done well so let's bring him back. There are those who would say well we haven't seen anything let's point to something that he's done for us but looking at the qualities of the other three who are running against him who is the incumbent, what are the qualities that they have or possess that could trump his possibility of returning? Again, I don't want to focus on individuals in the other parties. I do feel that if you're talking about capacity the APC tends to usually put people that have capacity forward. The issue is how their hands are tied and how they have to service the Godfather that put them there. That's the main issue. So even when I sympathise and empathise with the governor of Lagos because I know that because of the way Ambody was removed even if he wanted to do visionary things in Lagos he cannot, right? No, because look at the kind of moves that Ambody made and he was literally punished for it. That's my interpretation of what happened. But if government is a continuum and I'm guessing that that's what Lagos needs, what Lagos wants and this is why people pay taxes to seek a continuity of sorts if government is a continuum why did governor someone do not continue in those developmental strides? So those are questions you have to ask him, right? Because like I said, these interests are mainly centered around the accumulation of wealth of the oligarchy in the APC. That's how I see it. But when I'm talking about this movement and going back to local government elections you see what I've found is because I've participated in local government elections myself when you don't have candidates that create a source of excitement candidates that people can see might give some kind of hope we can do hope in people you find voter apathy will just run through it and also when people don't believe in the system at all and that's what I said it's very amazing that this electoral act is going hand in hand with this movement, right? It's like this. So when they're seeing what's happening in Osho and they're realizing that you know what once we can hold our polling units our voices will be heard. That gives people more faith, right? And you have a very inspiring candidature in the form of Pitalbi that has been consistent with his message and people are binding into that message and you find that that movement is going to come out in a very, very realistic form that you can touch it's not going to be something that I'll give you an example so I'm not just talking I was at the inauguration of structures on Saturday and these were people that came out they were not expecting you to give them anything to go back home they're not asking for any transport they were there to give their time talking about how they can even give their money, right? And all they're asking for is a better Nigeria, right? Politics generally tends to attract people when you're in power or they work in the hope that money is going to come and there will be beneficiaries of it this is a completely different bargain. But this can be also isolated we say that this mindset was picked up in a day it's the system that created these monsters, right? When you say the system it's the political system that created these monsters I remember a sound bite I listened to by Paul what's his name? Malumba and I was talking about the fact that no matter how you know, lyrical you wax when you're done telling the people what you want to do they say well in the interim what are you giving to us so I'm saying the system had created that mindset so how do we even start to play that mindset? So it's Vota Apati okay look with all this great grandeur of APC in legal state barely 1 million people come out to vote out of 6 million people that are registered to vote let's even say 2.5 million of those people are fictitious so we have about 3.7 or 4 million people there let's just say 4 million people 1 million people come to vote 3 million are sitting at home with their voter cards so what will bring these people out, right? it is true when you talk about we are buying these people that are created by the monsters we are buying votes and everything they are still like 20% the rest are sitting there in their house and you cannot buy their votes they just need to be inspired enough to believe that when I give my time it's going to yield a progress it's going to take us to a more hopeful place again I like this but every time I talk about voter education I'm either talking to an INEC official or I'm talking to a civil society person but then the onus is purely on political parties they have a right to in fact it's their duty to do the voter education thing but how many parties do this all we see is campaigns like you said and dancing in the streets and all of that noise is this deliberate so that certain people do not necessarily come out for the election so that if the kind of things that we see in terms of the buying and electoral violence can continue to take place is that deliberate? I'm asking you because you're a party man yes, you see a transition is happening and this happens in all societies right you cannot give what you don't have if you don't have the capacity to prefer a vision you cannot give it you might be grass shoots, people know you they drink with you, they like you you are one of them but can you take them to another level if you are one of them and you guys are so close and they put you in a position for that all you do is just take back and probably share lifting the conversation lifting the economy you might not actually be one of them but you have to be able to endure their hopes, endure their vision endure their their faith and then the conversation can then get to a higher level so that's one and secondly you see if people are now pushing another narrative dropping numbers I remember when I first started in politics and I was talking about manifesto you are talking too much, it's too much you sing a song, you call me sing a song you write what you sing with you everybody clap what I like him is a fantastic politician he has not preferred anything that's going to better your life or your lot but he sings well and he's likeable for him, that is the problem that's the pain of our problem but like I said if 90% turnout has been happening in Nigeria I'll be very worried that 90% of people are buying into all this nonsense but turnout is so low especially in Lagos so when you start seeing a turnout that will reflect the cosmopolitan sophisticated level of Lagos I believe that we're in for we're in for an interesting 2020 so I'll ask that question that everybody always wants to ask how do we see how soon do we see Lagos for once a better word broken from the jinx of Godfatherism, some people say one party system do we see that changing in 2023 or should we look for another messiah I see it happening in 2023 I see it without a doubt I am so confident it's going to happen the energy I've contested in co-op I've seen people get their hope kindled and I've seen them come out but you have to go and do convincing convincing I've contested in PDP platform and I've seen how people were just tired of what was currently going on so they voted because they were tired then I'm in the labour party now and I see pure excitement hope people giving their time for free people donating money the issue is now just conducting that and making sure you have proper structure and just getting all these willing volunteers properly plugged in and that's a good problem for a party to have finally why did you leave the PDP and what exactly is there in the labour party that I mean because people would say that the major position of the APC in the state was the PDP why labour party I left the PDP because some agreements were made and were broken we want to go into it we want to go into it now what agreements were made I was supposed to be the deputy so that was the agreement for me to withdraw and then that agreement was reneged on and for me I cannot join the APC I cannot join the APC and the labour party for me was just a natural fit you know its ideology is people that appreciate intellect several capacity I was talking to the secretary and I think he was interviewed recently and we were talking about Claude Ache right so these people have a depth of political science and political understanding and an ideology and secondly the unions make up the labour party and all I've advocated for since I entered into politics was that its time for the working class the people that believe in dignity of labour the people that believe that my vote cannot be bought to be responsible stop being irresponsible and leaving elections to only people that are looking at their voters cards as things to harvest every four years you are the custodians of democracy because you vote your mind based on a vision that someone's preferring or manifest to get involved so I could not be in any the people the core and the excitement that has jingled into it is a beautiful thing are you being promised anything in the labour party? I'm in the running I'm in the running yeah I see well Viva Rhodes is a politician and a former member of the BDP now in the labour party we wish you all the best and we hope to see you soon well that's the show tonight ladies and gentlemen thank you so much for being part of the conversation this has been plus politics we'll be back tomorrow talking for development on the biggest stories in our political scene I am Mary Anacone have a good evening