 Serapsus National Assembly won't Scott to stop lawmakers from taking delivery of 57.6 billion Naira 360 SUVs and Nigeria escapes 11.5 billion dollars habitual fine in UK I am Borla Orba and this Explore Politics The socio-economic rights and accountability project Serap has filed the legal action before the federal court in Lagos against the National Assembly asking the court to stop the house of representatives from procuring and taking delivery of 360 sports utility vehicles SUVs worth 57.6 billion Naira for its members pending the airing and determination of the application for injunction filed by the administration Serap's applications for interim and interlocutory injunction followed reports that the lawmakers are set to procure and take delivery of 360 units of sports utility vehicles each of which would cost taxpayers at least 160 million Naira joining me to discuss this is Oluwadari A. Kola Wale deputy director socio-economic rights and accountability project Serap Mr. Kola Wale good evening and welcome to Plus Politics thank you very much for having me so you want to give us what instructs this application for injunction by Serap against the National Assembly or the house of representatives taking old or taking delivery of these sports utility vehicles what instructs it welcome back we really want to thank you for being patient with us it was a bit of a technical glitch Mr. Kola Wale are you there yes i am thank you very much we would really like you to recap what we were saying earlier on because the line was so bad there was no coherent understanding of what we were trying to to tell the public okay thank you very much i was starting the point about Serap's position on the proposed plan of the National Assembly as the news made around at that time that the National Assembly the plans to spend billions of Naira to acquire what has been standard what can we really be called the luxury vehicles and this again is a background of growing poverty rising inflation and rising unemployment occasion primarily by the rule of petroleum subsidy and so we put out a statement there calling on the National Assembly leadership of the National Assembly to stop the proposed plan and that failed and so we had to go to court while the matter was pending a court we also heard that the statement was credited to the spokesperson of the National Assembly of the plans of the National Assembly not only going ahead to procure the vehicles but to begin a phased delivery of receiving the vehicles and so we have to go about court to file for our lawyers to file applications for injunction which essentially means that the court should stop for the actions of the National Assembly pending when the substantive suit like that is the suit will file for the court to determine the legality of the actions of the National Assembly is determined by the ordinary is this suit against the entirety of the National Assembly or a particular chamber of the bicameral legislature who houses that constitute National Assembly the Senate and the House of Representatives and the two principal officers of course are sending me need a representative capacity for the whole members of the National Assembly because the vehicles have been procured for the use of the members of the National Assembly and ordinary these should not be the kind of issue that should end up in court now these naturally should not be what should what should be about the National Assembly should be focused on this time and really if we have political or public office holders who really believe in the rule of law and the principles of democracy actions are not to be taken on matters that have been submitted to the court for determination this again is an indication of the malfeasance in governance and the misuse of democratic principles or call them a be use of democratic principles by those in the political office and eventually we are looking forward to the court determined in this in favor of Nigerians how would you want to respond to the fact that some people are basically saying this is somewhat of an exhibitionistic move by by syrup because syrup all knows that ultimately these people would ultimately get to use the or get to buy the kind of vehicles that they desire irrespective of whatever may be the ash realities of the Nigerians of economic milieu how would you respond to that what's that not be true and i could not know where that will be coming from perhaps that statement could come from citizens that either become skeptical or cynical of the democratic process it might also come from citizens who are perhaps lost hopes in democracy but we as a legal advocacy organization believe in the judiciary and would believe the rule of law and that is why the subject matters like this to the court in a terrorist to the principles of constitutional basis that gives the judiciary the powers to determine ultimately the rights and obligations of Nigerians visa v government and even determine the rights of arms of government between one another and that takes me to to a very fundamental question what indeed powers those of you in syrup given the fact that the the general political environment itself could be very disillusioning and yet you people are still monster the fortitude of character to challenge those that you believe deliberately abusing the the constitution and the architecture of good governance what powers you what inspires people like you especially when you're doing this problem is not that you're making money from it and yet you know there are no better defenders of the Nigerian constitution that i know today than an organization such as yours what powers you guys perhaps it's the same spirit that drives Nigerians to go out to register at mass every election cycle sometimes knowing that the sometimes they may not eventually get their pbcs ever spending hours in the sun and it's right and sometimes actually that their votes may not that is the perception by the way but people still go about to do this and we still engage in advocacy such as conversations like this to encourage people to do that it is the same spirit that drives us to continue to take steps to old government to account because we understand the basis of democracy that democracy means as as part of the many things that democracy means it is the power of the people to participate and participation does not stop and name with voting at elections it does not mean that every action of government cannot be challenged and what we do is to go to court to submit to court for the judiciary known as the last of our common man to determine the rights of obligations for the people in this instance and what about the courts we are bound by it and that is how we've gone to court and the court sometimes it agree with us and we abide by it and sometimes also most times i must say it agrees with us and they put it and those in public offices end up not obeying these judgments of court but we cannot afford to give up we cannot that is part of the that is the basis of democratic practice that is where we are they also talk how would you then respond to the fact that the central argument of the national assembly and indeed some members particularly members of the labor party who whilst refusing to akin to the billions of the chairman of the party is that you know what we need these vehicles as tools to to undertake our work are you in any way shape or form saying that they shouldn't they should not get the real the the requisite tools they need to to get to do the work it's very important to understand and that what underscores the work we do in sarab is advocacy for good confidence of course within the thresholds of transpiration and accountability and that is devoid of of politics the tribe of religion or other sentiments so you're expecting of many of the political party that is involved these advocacy is directed every member of the national assembly you of course by the office is representing constituencies in Nigeria which are made up of Nigerian citizens so no matter the political affiliation of those in the national assembly spending this morning in the interest of less than 500 people and not be justifiable and this is within the context of growing poverty and this is just a mismanagement of public resources which is a direct conflict with the oath of office that each of the members of the national assembly are strong to uphold it is also in a breach of the code of conduct of public officer that applies to every public officer in Nigeria including the president and the members of the national assembly and that is right focus is not for citizens to hold this individual to account so is it the amount that you have issues with or the fact that they are getting vehicles that will help lubricate the machinery of how the best serve Nigerians we need to we need to get the niceties of this well enough is it the amount the price tag of each of the sport utility vehicle or that you really don't want them to get any vehicle at this juncture no no no it is not about the vehicles it is about the cost attached to the overall cost of these vehicles and when you do the cost benefit analysis what is the gain of spending so much for less than 500 people that is injurious to so many Nigerians team last comes the Nigerian big roof statistics have listed out millions of Nigerians over 100 million Nigerians are poor couldn't cut these funds be used for projects that would really help Nigerians that would be a benefit to Nigerians and these are huge money 557.6 billion there it could build hospitals it could build roads this could ensure that Nigerian children get quality affordable education the number of thousands after school children is growing it is 20 million as we speak i really i really have to play i really have to play the devils advocate not so much because i love doing that but i really have to let you get to hear some of the arguments that people supporting the national assembly have also preferred they saying you know what at the end of the day they would have to go oversight budgetary allocations they would have to go oversight do their oversight functions and they need to go in reliable vehicles and if this is the price of of that particular brand a model of vehicle why should they not get it out the sticker and then really the conversation we should be having now is out and these individual members of the national assembly justifying this spending to the members of their constituencies i would really love to see a site where each of these members these members individually they go to their constituencies and they tell the people of their constituencies which of course they may join because it's not six are there to explain to them that we are spending fifth over fifty billionaire to buy vehicles for ourselves against the background of poverty that they also see and this is also with the context of an amnesty it should be added by the president that has called and are still calling on Nigerians to sacrifice to pay the price for the common good so is there any can these be seen as a step as leadership by example is does these action on national enemies show any willingness or commitment to the ideals of beats so let me let me also re-ask some of the some of the pro-national assembly cynics line this is bad belly these boys know they are they they don't this is bad belagio so some are saying how would you respond to to that it's looking like some Nigerians are really resigned themselves to to the fact that they may be so important that even when an organization such as yours is out there trying to fight the corner of the public the disillusionment is so it's so profound that they don't really believe it will amount to anything you have referred to two different classes of people there are those who perhaps the society due to whatever perspectives they share that this is the good action that they are entitled to to that to that position which is why this is in court and there are also people that you have referred to that perhaps do not really enjoy the state of affairs do not think this is the right step in the part of the national assembly but they have resigned themselves to them they have become pessimistic they've become cynical and that has made as freeze any kind of action in on the apart these is not good for democracy every election cycle i next spend millions billions of nair as part of his public advocacy to encourage Nigerians to go out and vote which is just a totally part of the democratic process because governance is a continuum people continue to engage in government by participating participation also means sometimes criticizing the actions of government which is why citizens must understand the importance of democracy to know that the democracy does not stop at them making political choices about who to vote or who not to vote for democracy continues with them engaging with government saying what they want desizing actions of government praising government where they can and that also means holding those in public office to account in this instant we believe itself that this penny is not justifiable it is against the law and we if we have cities we have lots of cities who also believe this this is why this is the public interest lawsuit and we're entitled to this position and we're not only holding it to ourselves we're subject to the court for the court to look at these actions look at the laws we are and determine who is right and wrong in this instance and so citizens feel to hold the opinions but ultimately they cause with the timing in the public interest whether the actions to be must answer in this instance can be said to be lawful and justifiable just wanting to play the devil's advocate again let's just say why should i appear to be playing so well i think i just have a job to do and i may even understand you know the difficulty i'm going through emotionally and intellectually having to to do this but somebody has to ask the question now some may also say okay ultimately if sarah if sarah gets a good positive pronouncement by the court what would ultimately stop these people from just tweaking the model and going for another model that may even be be more you know cost wise than the one that sarah has probably successfully gotten them to to dump how would you respond to that and that is why it is advocacy is not against the choice of vehicles it is about the spending and of course we understand that the spending will naturally inform the type of vehicles that they should buy and that is why even the fiscal responsibility act is very clear on the obligations of ministries department and agencies and public institutions in the use of public funds in this instance what is the cost benefit analysis of purchasing these vehicles when they gain okay if you're against if you're against one and sixty million naira per unit you know per vehicle that's possibly the vehicle if you're against that what's the reasonable amount that you as a member of syrup and a strategist in syrup what amount would be reasonable to somebody like you i am not an expert in cars i cannot advise us to the type of brands was to the spending perhaps looking in what and are they not made in the union vehicles that would cost less that would not only mean contributing to the economy of our own homegrown industries and they are not vehicles that can solve these purposes and that is why the question i'm asking is what is the process that has gone into deciding into this choice that he has taken in that has taken cognizance of the public interest and that is why this is not about the private interest of the legislators and the legislators explain to the girls what is the process how did they arrive at the choice of these vehicles and the amount and did they consider at all the public interest of these vehicles that they considered locally manufactured vehicles what are the pros and cons how did they arrive at this choice and we are saying all these can be argued within the context of this truth and also in the court public opinion i was once on on a radio program and i was you know proceeding just like you doing now that it ought to be incumbent on representatives of the people using vehicles especially vehicles assembled or made in Nigeria and somebody called into that live program and said do you also use those vehicles and you see i was a bit kind of you know what i mean i wouldn't quite ask you that directly but how many of us you can you can't answer that is why sometimes it we need to understand public office is a sacrifice these are individuals that have pulled them out because they wanted to say i don't forget because it's not a requirement of being a member of the national assembly it's not that easy and the process of being a member of the national assembly is not also easy you have to scale the various orders in your political party you have to be accepted by the INEC you are nominated then you go to the campaigns then you are you go to elections it's a process that shows individuals that commented to public office and that is why you see the code of conduct for public officers in the constitution is not binding on me it's not binding on you it is binding on public officers because they are put themselves out to serve they must conform to those rules and they can draft the constitution they draft on the constitution accept me like if you are a public officer this is the minimum threshold of conduct that you should do i didn't swear any oath of office as a private citizen but if i take up any public office today i will swear the oath of office and i must abide by it so get the rules applied to a private citizen those not applied to a public officer the law is clear in this regard which is why we hold them to a doubt using the instrumentality of the law to what i think what the law says and in this instance the code of conduct for public officers the oath of office they took is very clear as to the considerations they should have for every action they take whether in the lawmaking process or for any action that contributes to that process they must always think of their interests of one hand and the interests of the public that they should to serve on the other hand and this action of allocating more than 50 billion lira to buy vehicles for themselves in the face of great poverty in the land it's not justifiable and not be said to pass the threshold of acting in the public interest that is a fantastic place to leave it mr kolawale we really want to appreciate you for guesting on the show today thank you for the illumination you've given on this subject to a viewing public thank you thank you very much so well it's been a pleasure we go on a short break now when we back we take out another interesting issue