 use all these services. Okay, hi all, welcome to the JSO office hours today is February 26th, and we run our common agenda. So we will discuss some news, project application status and other bits. And then we will have some time for question and answers by students. So right now we didn't have many students on the call, but maybe it will change. And so one of the problems is that the guitar is down. So not everybody really seem to think about this call, but yeah, still let's press it. Okay, first good news that actually we will accept the Google Summer of Co. 2020. So as an organization Jenkins is published on the website and in addition there are more than 200 organizations for this year, yes. So it looks like it's going to be the biggest ever JSO. It's the biggest ever every year, but still. Regarding Jenkins, our application represents the latest state of the application documentation, which was reviewed by all participants. So we have Jenkins X listed. We have all the information up to date. We still have an opportunity to edit this profile. So this year they edit this feature. So if somebody sees something to be changed, let me know so we still can update this website. Regarding project ideas, again, everything was published. We did a major effort over the past week to update project ideas. And you can see that the main project ideas and the safety state. And some project ideas are still in the draft state, though they're being updated. And again, draft state doesn't mean that you cannot apply. So these ideas are also valid. So we have 18 ideas plus some ideas under the discussion. And maybe we will be able to publish more ideas until the deadline. Another interesting news from this year, that it contains Liberty Foundation. So it contains Liberty Foundation is some real organization for Jenkins, for Jenkins X and also other projects like Spinner Cures. So they have been also accepted to Google Summer of Code. They will be participating as a separate organization. And they edit the topic to discuss how would we collaborate. It's an open question for everyone because I guess now we're doing this code you that CDF is applying. But yeah, anyway, it's great to see them around. And there is, there are many opportunities for collaboration between projects. And let's see where it goes. And last but not least, we've got a blog post by Perichay published. So it's another blog post about Jenkins world and the Rob's world travel experience. So Perichay was one of the student who joined here. Again, you can find some cool photos. It's not some Francisca, it's Lisbon. And yeah, there is a bunch of stuff. So please check it out. And if you're a student, yeah, we are doing our best to sponsor students to go to European events, to Jenkins related events around the world. And hopefully we'll be able to meet you next year. So that's all of these news. We also have some other common topics. New potential mentors in production. Do we have any new potential mentors on the call? So I see Jim Crowley on the call. Oh, like I'm not sure that Jim had intended to be a mentor. I think he was listening in. His work in the platform SIG is certainly interesting, but I'm not sure it's Google Summer of Code specific. Yeah, just in case. So then let's spend some time on Jenkins and CDF. So we had some discussion before the recording started. My understanding of it, we do want to change the agenda for the Jenkins project because once the project got announced, I've got email from my CDF asking about his outline. So for Jenkins, the donors I think that it would be better for us to proceed as a separate organization because we've been participating in JSOC for several years. We have all the agenda of the presentation prepared. We have started getting communications with students several months ago and it's definitely not the best time to flip the table and to rework how we operate. So for Jenkins project, I think you should definitely press it as a separate organization. For Jenkins SIGs, if you understand the correct, you would also focus on this option. Though there is more flexibility there and if Jenkins SIGs decides to participate on the CDF umbrella, it's also possible, we have some time to decide. Okay, as we've done the initial application with Jenkins, I think it does make sense for us to continue forward on this path. I don't see any reason why we would change it at this moment in time. It's very interesting that the CDF is involved in JSOC. I think in the future it could be really cool for us all to be together under one organization and would give the right signaling for CDF but this is a bit late in the game to change. Yeah, so one thing which currently impacts us is that basically CDF is not specific what are the project ideas and potentially somebody may submit project ideas to Jenkins and Jenkins SIGs to the CDF account. And before that we had some collaboration between organizations. So for example, Jenkins and FOSSE Foundation. So we had project ideas which were significantly intersecting and for example, me and Martin were potential mentors in both organizations. So we used this in a potential cross-collaboration and we should be ready that something like that happens with Jenkins. So if a student applies with a good Jenkins project to continuous delivery foundation, we won't be able to transfer this application to the Jenkins organization and vice versa. So project slots, pools would be different, mentor pools would be different and we still need to understand how it would work but we should prepare to such options. But unfortunately, I don't really know what is the CDF channel for JSOC because mailing list just references a page with mailing list, same for other things. So to be honest, if I was a student, I wouldn't be able to comprehend how to apply right now. So I started providing feedback to CDF folks and hopefully we will be able to fix that. So Slaydan, there was a question from you about could we propose a project idea? Yeah, I guess I see the project page, I think CDF. Yeah, there isn't much information on how to apply. I guess if you go, yeah, visit the ideas list also. It just links you to the GitHub and it just gives you about how you're gonna propose a project. So if at all you're gonna, maybe, I mean, if you're thinking of a collaboration or sort of maybe as an organization, could we maybe propose a sort of project and go through this entire project life cycle which would benefit, I don't know, is the main aim to benefit CDF as a community or Jenkins as a community. So since we come under the umbrella, maybe we could propose a sort of project that could come under their scope. If at all that is the idea, maybe as a potential student, maybe I could, maybe if that is the idea, maybe I could help or something, what do you think? I don't think we should, I don't think we should, I don't think we should combine any of this at this stage. I think leave this separate for next year, then I think we can have a little bit of a better planning ramp to do that. But for this year, I think they should remain separate projects and I definitely think we should be mindful when we're sending out tweets or anything to add the CDF to that because that could create confusion. Okay. Yeah, that's right. Right now, this project life cycle page, even if it's linked as ideas list, it's not an ideas list. Yeah. This is a guideline for new projects being proposed. So for example, if you wanted to propose Jenkins to continuous delivery foundation in the current state, this is the guideline you would have to follow. So theoretically, there might be a student who has a project related to continuous integration who would be willing to propose it as CDF and cubating project or something like that. Yeah. My best guess is that this was just the picture, the link and they need to create their own guidelines. So as Jenkins project, we invested a huge amount of time to prepare all our documentation. CDF just starts, so they may need some help. And if you're at different continuous delivery foundation Slack, it will be one of the topics. And I will also put it to the agenda of advocacy and outreach and seek tomorrow. It's whether we can help continuous delivery foundation with JSOC. But yeah, overall market is right. We should be as discreet as possible. And we need to figure it out. And to agree with Oleg and to really reinforce the point, Sladen, the project list that is linked to the project lifecycle, that really is for existing open source projects which are decently mature. So have some sort of governance structure in place, have a certain number of contributors. So it's not just for ideas. It's really for existing open source projects. It would be very hard, I would think, for a GSOC student to be able to create an open source project at the level that would be acceptable as a sandbox project for the CDF. And that's just being realistic. I think for GSOC, that's a step too far and then you may wanna consider projects more as Jenkins and Jenkins X have proposed them. So projects that have mentors in place and that are already somewhat specced out and then you can take your own approach to those suggested projects. Yeah, yeah, I agree, yeah. Thanks on that. So any other comments about that? I do have one comment and this is, it's more a comment slash suggestion. Does it make sense to send out some type of communication under the Jenkins banner to let people know that these are separate projects? Or would that, I think that would be good, but it also may create more confusion. I don't know, that's more to what everybody, my fear is, is that if anybody goes to the Google Summer of Code website and looks for projects that are showing and they see the CDF, they're gonna see then Jenkins possibly and then see Jenkins X and think it's CDF. I just think there's a lot of room for confusion, but that we may, if sending out a communication may also create more confusion. So that's my question. Yeah, we need to talk to CDF first. Hopefully we will start progressing tomorrow. So for me, the first steps would be to get explicit documentation here on the CDF page and here on the Jenkins page so that we could add some clarification. Maybe we should explicitly remove Jenkins and Jenkins X from here and say that they participate as a separate project, but yeah, let's talk first. Okay, awesome, thank you. And that's why I was asking the question because of those labels. They really, that's very confusing, especially as a student. You're asking. Wholehearted agreement with the confusion, but I think we can also start even now just being actively promoting the Jenkins project ideas list and contribution to Jenkins. So we can do that without any coordination, just more actively promoting the, hey, the Jenkins project has a really solid Google Summer of Code team with mentors ready to go, mentors expressed interest and interesting project ideas come see us. So I'm not worried as much about confusion as I am if we aren't active enough in promoting and being noisy on social media and other places that, hey, we've got a really exciting set of project ideas come students and propose your project plans. I agree with that. I just wanna make sure that for the Twitter admins when you're sending out tweets, especially if it's a Google Summer of Code tweet, if you add a hashtag for the CDF, and I know we had some communication about this amongst the team already, if you, that could be lending to confusion because of the mislabeling. So just make sure not to do that. I'm not directing anybody that I'm more suggesting not to add the CDF hashtag to any tweet communications. So it was my mistake probably because I did it with the best intention but I agree that it could have caused confusion. So it's specifically about interest a while ago. CDF is referenced here. But yeah, let's just keep in mind for the next promotions. Okay, so speaking of promoting JSOC, so I finally sent a mail announcement but we still could do a few other things to promote it. So yeah, we could just spend maybe five to 10 minutes to list what we usually do and what we could do again. So the announcement blog post. So I guess on both Jenkins and Jenkins text websites, then we could also add Jambatron. So we didn't do it last year because we already beyond our capacity but we could add a JSOC announcement here. Yeah, my name please, that's clear. What else we could do is basically social media. So anyone, if you are potentially mentored, please promote your project because what we do as a JSOC org team, we do a best effort to promote it using standard channels but we don't have been the wife for targeted marketing. So yeah, if you know some potential contributors, potential mentors as a champion on your project or as a neutralized mentor, please invest some time to reach out to the contacts because we need to find students, we need to find mentors and if you just sit and wait, you will get some application. But less application than we usually expect. So Oleg, I wonder if those of us who have university connections might consider actually visiting universities or other facilities that physically have students that might benefit from hearing or from general notifications, from announcements and noise, right? From an advertising conversations. Hey look, you're a student, you could work a summer flipping hamburgers or you could work a summer writing code. Which one would you prefer? Yeah, it's what people usually do, at least some. I went to university two or three times. It's a fun experience. If somebody is interested, what we usually do, we have some template presentations and we can create them up on request. So we didn't create template for GSOC 2020 yet, but yeah, we could do that. So if someone wants to do that, please do so. I'm currently discussing options in Nechotel, the city where I live, which I didn't go to Russia in a good timeframe this time. But yeah, I'll do my best to promote. We can prepare a slide next. Well, and back to your note on social media, you lobbied that the mentors, so that's when I have not done nearly enough and I suspect other potential mentors have the same challenge. That is nothing wrong with me promoting the projects, the ideas I'm interested in on social media and encouraging people through LinkedIn, through Twitter, through WhatsApp, through Facebook, whatever to consider joining. Yeah, I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I think that's a great idea. Yeah, same for blog posts. For example, if you want to create a blog post for Jenkins IO for other resources, please do so. So whatever visibility we could get, it's fine. And we really need help from mentors about that because we have only three or four minutes now. We will probably try to get more. But still, what that means will be handled called bureaucracy and other things. So yeah, we do some common things, but we cannot do too much. So it will be much appreciated. And of course, social media, everything is the same. So if you're active in Twitter, posting there, it's fine. If you're active in LinkedIn, posting there is also fine. And yeah, any resource you're actively use, why not? Thank you. Yeah, in the case of Jenkins, now we have our own Twitter account, but our LinkedIn and Facebook profiles are dormant. So we can't use them. And even if you use them without it would be not that good, I'd say. But still, we could try. So if you have your own accounts, you can do that. Okay, what else could we do? One thing is local JSOC communities because there are many countries that are specific JSOC channels. For example, there is Chinese JSOC channel, there is Russian JSOC channel, and like there are many others. So you can use these channels, promote Jenkins there, promote your specific project, why not? And yeah, these channels are pretty big. And if we talk about China, about India, basically 70% of students are from APAC region. So yeah, using these channels can be as efficient as using our Twitter account. Probably much more efficient. Any other promotional opportunities you could discuss? Meetups. So if you speak at meetups, just promote JSOC. I had a small slide deck for today's Jenkins online meetup, but it went so wrong that I didn't really use it. But yeah, maybe, so if you do a secret recording, if you do online meetup recording, if you just go on site for the lead meetups, you can also use it in the opportunity. And maybe we could create a teaser video, or whatever it's called for YouTube. Trailer video, I'm not sure. I don't actually use YouTube, but yeah. Okay, I might be just online meetup in the next few weeks about JSOC. Would anyone wanna be interested in that? Yeah, I mean, as a potential student, could I, I would be interested in that. Okay, so how would we organize it? Just. If at all you want me to hold an online meetup like I did today, maybe, as even as a potential student, introducing maybe a few of the projects that we have or maybe some of them. I don't know how it would work, but yeah, I would definitely be interested if at all the community want. Okay, students presenting their projects, not projects, probably experiences. Yeah, since probably it's more of a public domain with the proposals and stuff, maybe we could demonstrate, maybe pick a project or something and maybe demonstrate the idea behind it or something that maybe I would be interested in. Yeah, just do let me know, yeah. Okay. So, yeah, if anyone is interested and if you want to record a short video about your JSOC experience from previous years, just do that. Many organizations do record such videos and if you go, for example, to JSOC Mentor Summit, there are many lightning talks which include videos by students. So probably we could try to do the same one. We were discussing it last year, but we just didn't have bandwidth to do that. I think we could follow up on this later, this Orkard means, so, but if you want to promote your projects, just do that. So, there is a bunch of ideas. And, yeah, speaking of Orkard means, Marky, should we recover the Orkard mean meeting? I do think we should start having that. Maybe we can do it initially bi-weekly and then as the project gets more underway, we can increase the frequency like we did last year. Okay. Are you looking for more Orgadmins when I could do the Orgadmins for Jenkins X? Sweet Mother Mary, we would love more Orgadmins. Okay. Great, thank you, Marky. Yeah, I'm also a plus one for Idenk Kara because really Jenkins X is a little community from Jenkins, but Idenk Kara, you know, helping this would help us a lot. I'm a plus one for Kara becoming an Orgadmins. Okay, any minus one? I'm not sure. Oh, Martin is on the call. Okay, I guess I agree. So welcome aboard and make sure to add you to all the channels. Great, thank you. Yeah, thanks a lot because any help will be much appreciated. On that topic, would it be beneficial to us as an organization to send out some type of communication via tweet that welcomes Kara as an Orgadmin? I think that serves two purposes. One, I think it's awesome to promote new Orgadmins. And number two, it helps us to increase the visibility to get continued Orgadmins. When people see that, they're like, oh, that's awesome. I'd love to do that. So it's just sort of a new thing. I also think it promotes, I think it promotes that we're a very diverse and inclusive project. And that we truly believe in having women as Orgadmins. I truly strongly believe that. So promoting that is a very, very good thing in my opinion. Okay, I like it. Yeah, so we can just tweet a list of Orgadmins because we didn't really do that. Or we can send a special welcome message. Okay, okay. Oh yeah, let's pull up. But I agree with you that we should do that. Okay, anything else regarding Orgadmins stuff? So Jeff, you're not participating as Orgadmins this year, right? And same for Rick. So I would want to make sure that I have plenty of time for mentoring because I feel like we have more of a need for mentors. So I'm happy to do the admin, but I would rather make sure that we have time for mentoring. Yeah, this perfectly fine. Yeah. Perhaps we could think, and we don't need to do this now, but we could think about having emeritus Orgadmins and that way they still retain sort of the ability to participate if time becomes available. And we're not just saying, okay, you're not an Orgadmins anymore. We keep like sort of that emeritus status that allows them sort of preference to come back next year if they want to be a full Orgadmins. That's just a suggestion. It doesn't have to be anything concrete. I wouldn't talk about complicated because everybody is welcome to return. So we have technical limitation. JSOC website limits the number of Orgadmins to five. But being Orgadmins on the JSOC website gives you very arguable privileges of being responsible to ensure that all mentors submit the evaluations in time and other things. And the rest of Orgadmins duties can be handled in the main piece. So last year we had seven Orgadmins in the main piece but only five on the website. Something like that. Yeah, we can find a way. Yeah, for now we can just proceed but if anyone is interested, we still have one slot. Okay, any other topics before we start Q&A? Hello, this is Marta and I have a quick question. So a potential mentor on the mailing list is asking, where can mentors meet to discuss their own projects? Do they have access to the Zoom? I don't think so. No, they do not. Does Hangout still exist? Yes, it does. No, it does. It's not that name anymore, I think it's something different. Sorry, Oleg, I'm fucking... Yeah, so the main difference is recording because you can do on the recording of a single person on Hangouts, on YouTube Live. If you want to meet, basically you can use a free Zoom account if it's just limited to 40 minutes but you can use it for any kind of recording and we can upload it on the JSoc site if you want. And if you do not want to be recorded, yeah, then you can use whatever service you like. Given the global nature of our communications isn't a first point of contact for mentors inside a Gitter channel, probably related to them or is it Martin, were you specifically asking about face-to-face style meetings or meetings where they were live with each other? I think I'm asking to know all the ways mentors can meet. I've found it useful myself to personally meet potential mentors that were on the same project as me just using a private video chat for maybe half an hour. And then the rest could follow under the official channels. So I guess the answer is clear. Like they can use this, like Oleg's writing a self-organized video chat for introductions and early information exchange and then they can move on to the Gitter chat once the meet and greet is, phase is done. Well, and so I like that, go ahead. They can also join the official office hours if it works in their time zone. Yeah, plus if there is interest to organize a chat, we can do that. So for example, last year we had a number of code dive sessions, a number of demos by mentors. And if you need to do that, just drop a message to Orkard means or Gitter channel and we will help you to organize the session because all current Orkard means have permissions to access Zoom account. We will also share access with Cara or I guess Jenkins X has its own Zoom account maybe. I'm not sure how it's organized, but yeah. We can definitely host recorded meetings and publish videos on our YouTube channels and whatever. And also for mentors, once the project gets started, we do request that the mentors check in with us weekly. So they'll, and that's via email. Yeah. So yeah, then for video recordings, we can also publish them. So basically if you send us a link to whatever recording, well, file, then we can deploy it on the Jenkins YouTube channel. I'm not sure Cara, does Jenkins X has its own YouTube channel now? Yeah, indeed it does. And we have a number of playlists as well. So we can make a specific playlist for GSOC. Yeah, it would be better if we post Jenkins X recordings on the Jenkins X list. So for playlists, we already have one from Jenkins YouTube. I'm always afraid about this moment. You open it and get various suggestions. You haven't seen that. But yeah, if you switched the Jenkins account, you can find even more interesting suggestions. Yeah, I've seen some, I've seen some really like exercise videos. I'm like, what? Okay, so yeah, let's keep this part but yeah, really we have a number of channels. So there are playlists and playlists specifically for GSOC. This is a playlist where we post all these meetings and we can post specific items to more than this. And we still have a Jenkins X backend list here but yeah, I guess it's obsolete. So are we offering mentors to coordinate their first meeting together on Zoom? Or we're telling them self-organize a meeting with the other mentors and report back? Well, we will be definitely helping people to organize during the community boomerang phase, taking our experience with previous years. Regarding the application phase, to be honest, I'm not sure. So if we have time as our communes, yes, we can do that but to be honest, I would not expect people to self-organize. For clarity, Oleg, in this phase, the mentors are not yet formally assigned. We're potential mentors, is that right? Yeah, that's right. So basically nobody commits to anything right now. Okay, all right. So my conversations with other potential mentors on the projects that interest me are perfectly fine. We go ahead, we could meet if we want, we could organize if we want, but we're still in the prep and get student proposals collected in that will then be handled at a later date. Yeah, that's right. So the majority of the traffic will be student proposal drafts and questions from our students who are interested. So some questions can be answered with counter-response because many people just join channels, ask questions and disappear forever. But we really need to engage with students who are interested in the projects. For that, it will require significant time, but hopefully it will be enjoyable activity for everyone. As we are coming up on the 15 minute left mark, I do wanna make sure we have give time to students for Q and A. Yeah, what's the song? Potential students. Okay, whatever. Potential students are actually students somewhere at the universities. I couldn't say so about mentors, but whatever. Okay, corny. So question from Slavin about custom distribution service. So speaking of mentors self-organizing meeting, he's one example. So we are thinking about the meeting for the project and right now there is a doodle pending. Yeah, if anywhere my is interested in this project idea, just vote so that we can schedule a meeting. I'm interested in lottery. So I think this is the answer. I will be the mentor. Yeah, yeah. And regarding any other interested mentors, it's a subject for outreach. So hopefully we will get more potential mentors. But yeah, right now it's a bit relaxed. So we have discussions and we see who is interested. Because yeah, we want to spend too much time on this. So potential mentors are fine. Once we get into a situation where we have proposals and when we don't have enough mentors, we will start reaching particular people who might be interested. But right now we just collect a list and invite everyone to participate. Yeah, it sounds cool to me. Okay, so Jeff, if Ramon are interested, that's fine. If not, it's also fine, let's see. Yeah. Yeah, no, I'm definitely still interested. So maybe you would like to add yourself to this project. Do you mean by add to the project, do you mean the Doodle? Doodle for meeting can maybe list of project ideas. Because it would be nice to have your name here. Okay. Okay, that's a minor thing. So yeah, these lists, all of them are moving targets. So there will be people joining and leaving all the time. So until we have a project announced and project selection for Easter Island, we just use it as a reference. Okay. Any other questions here? No, just not. Okay, about YAML proposal. So what's the other questions? I guess it's this one. So reading this email list. So yeah, building a separate plugin. It could be built a proposal on the top of that. It's actually a good question. So this is a situation which is not that common for JSON but it happens. So we put a project idea and there is somebody working on this project idea or more or less on the same area outside JSOC. So these things happen. And right now I think that it will be the best just move for this project idea back to the draft and to document this mailing list. So that students who explore this project idea are aware that there is potential collision. And after that, we can figure out what we can do because right now I also don't have a good answer. But yeah, this is open source. We basically work in competitive environment, meaning that at any time there may be a pull request coming out of the blue, this would have a chance you have never expected. So it's normal. I will move it to the draft state and I will be commented. Yeah, sounds cool. So it doesn't mean that this project is not going to happen because there are even now in this pipeline as YAML project ideas, there are many angles from which we can approach. So including exploring ways to better integration with Jenkins X pipeline, which is definitely not a target and they might increase maybe a bit of deep integration with libraries like MPL or port. Again, it's not in the proposal and other things. So there might be still opportunities, but it's definitely needs to move back to draft. It's just one while I'm here. Any other questions about this idea? Well, why are we here? Okay, any other questions? Yeah, I guess that's it from my thing. Good published. So if you see any issues or if you want to make amendments, just do it on the website. This project idea is so you can edit them dynamically, okay? Yeah. If there is no other topics to discuss, we can just close down. It's getting quite long anyway. Sumit, is there anything from you? Or maybe from Rahid Sukesh, who will send the call? No, no questions today. Okay. So thank you. Yeah, it starts providing feedback in your project idea, but later than never. Yeah, so if... Yeah, I'll work on it. I was thinking about those comments. So thank you. Thanks a lot. Yeah, it was just the beginning. And yeah, that's the reason why it's better to submit the project proposals earlier. Because yeah, now it will be a period of two or three weeks when everything is relatively silent, but after that it will be crazy. So these are the best weeks to get the feedback. Right? Yeah. Okay, then yeah, thanks everyone for your time and see you again next week. We have a bunch of extra items to execute on. Thanks everyone for...