 Realization today is really the holy grail of digital marketing. I mean, look at the kind of power you can harness putting together data, technology and creativity in real time and providing the customer with targeted content, products and services. In fact, through the entire user journey, you can enhance your customer's experience. McKinsey actually says that personalization leads to 15% increase in revenues, 50% decrease in acquisition costs and 30% increase in the efficiency of marketing spend. You know, I remember that campaign from 2018 at the Boston Marathon where added us a frontrunner and personalization actually prepared personalized video content for 30,000 runners. Yeah. In fact, Unilever CMO actually goes a step further ahead and says that we're living in this age where I can understand on a one-to-one basis my customer at that level of direct engagement that you have at your disposal. Ladies and gentlemen, let's get personal with this next session coming up, the CMO Roundtable. I'm going to invite on stage our session chair, Noor Varsia, Group Editor, Marketing and Advertising, BW Business World and Digital Market Asia, and she will invite our panel members. Hello. If you ask me who suffers from former the most, if you ask this room, most people will talk about teenagers. I think marketers suffer from the most because often presentation after presentation in meetings like this, the question gets asked in one presentation and the presentation again, are you ready for the future? Do you have enough data for the future? The question needs to be reframed and I'll just come to that. This is the classic case of antipersonalization. Anybody recognize this? This is the Ford Model T. It went against the personalization. It gave huge amount of efficiency in this market yet it solved a consumer conflict. Yet it was completely against personalization and we see many examples. This is not a old example. A lot of us wear clothes which are ready made. That bespoke tail ring has gone beyond certain niche audience has gone away. That's antipersonalization that we are seeing all across yet it's solving a consumer issue. So the question that we should be always be asking is whether personalization in this context is needed? Is it desirable? Is it solving a consumer conflict or we are using the tool just because we've discovered a new tool? So as marketers we look at two kind of ways we engage with consumers. There's a place where we are talking to consumers where consumer has a fairly sharp focused issue or that they're trying to solve. He's trying to search for let's say a milkshake. He's trying to find the nearest plumber. That kind of activity I think digital is fairly good at and they're very efficient at that. But there's a very large task that we as marketers and brands perform which is very different, which is frame the problem on the problem, build auras for our brands and that's the task where digital possibly magnificently fails and the personalization magnificently fails. I also saw the example of Otriven in the last presentation. I wish I could have put that in my deck but that's the classical case of stuff that you should be fairly cautious about. One of my all-time heroes Bill Bernback, he talks about that we are in this constant for looking at what is changing, the VUCA world that we talk about. But I think at the very base level we as consumers there are some pieces which are very fixed and there is where the large insight comes from. We might serve people through different new tools that are there but the basic insight of all of us to be looking good, to be loved, to be admired, to stand out, I think those pieces are, those insights are, I think fairly static and fairly common and that's the piece that we shouldn't ever lose sight of in in terms of putting our thoughts through. So consumers don't care about if I have received in the advertising that I've put together for Otriven a context about that it's rainy in Mumbai and therefore you should have Otriven. If I'm able to figure out that this gentleman or this lady needs this problem and I'm able to solve that, I think that's what the consumers care for. The context and sometimes our creations that we fall in love with I think is over complicating our jobs and possibly falling in love with the tool. So at times it's not only about the consumers giving greater amount of choice, it's not necessary at times. The sense of control that consumer is looking for I think at times that's the key issue that we are doing. I don't know if you guys can see this, it doesn't make Coke taste any different right. Maybe at the first go like we talked about my name is on there I might pick it up but we've got to remember consumers for us brands play such a large role in our lives because our livelihoods come out of that. Consumers don't care so much about brands right and therefore till the time I think we are solving the key issue and the key insight I think we are irrelevant. Most times a lot of us would have seen that this so-called personalized marketing is chasing us giving us stuff that we've searched and possibly bought and chasing us about the same thing over and over again. If you may if my task was building consumer affinity at that point of time I actually have pissed off the consumer right. At times we need to know where to draw the line and what is to be done right. So don't be creepy because we are largely talking to people and I think this connection at times is not always there. Personalization and relevance is not always there. We've got to step back and remember that we're chasing relevance and for that I think the biggest piece is insight. There are times where you've got to step back and you've got to remember that all that the consumer is looking for is you put the entire buffet in front of them and they're smart enough instead of the AI ML and many other acronyms that we talk about consumer is able to make the choice for themselves right the simple pieces okay. So insight I think is if I could add a few more arrows on this side is far greater than personalization right. We are not chasing data we are chasing insight and that's the core tool that marketers have maybe digital can provide it we should have that and I'll share this example of baby center we are a five billion dollar company right. We've grown we are as bricks and brick and mortar and more mortar than anybody gets with ultra tech we've grown at 60 percent in the last I think three years partly because of inorganic acquisitions but I think inspiration comes from very different places. So we're not against personalization but here's a classical example of insight and using data and digital without getting creepy right. It's you know mothers are families are becoming more and more nuclear right and having the first baby you don't have the support system around you I can't call the doctor all the time and yet I need somebody who can help me at the point of time serving and help me choose what is my stage and what is the issue to be sorted at that point of time fairly beautiful simple insight right and used very well without getting creepy without quote unquote tending to be that pseudo personalization right. We've used this simple example we took inspiration of this entire thing because what we know in India there are about six million homes that that get made and most Indians if you may home making is no longer a retirement project in this country right. It's not 60s project it's something that you do at the age of 35 today right. Now if I do make a home at 35 today what does that mean it means that I'm inexperienced I have a knowledge gap I have a I have a trust deficit at the time when I'm making the greatest or biggest project of my life and investing into it. If I have that knowledge gap what do you do about it. In the old world we had I think 10 years ago we had this huge team of about 1100 odd people called technical service who would go side to side help people out and sort people's issues right because this is a huge badge of competence for somebody who's making their homes this knowledge is critical and the cost of going wrong in this entire thing is enormous. So how do you sort that issue out but the issue is this 1100 odd strong team engineers they still serve about two and a half three percent of India's population of people who are building their first time homes right how do you sort that out simple stuff you said we'd give the choice to the consumers and make it easy for them choose without getting creepy we'll help them choose what's the issue that they're defining define it in fairly simple language if they are choosing a brick I tell them three different reasons or three simple steps of how to choose a brick if they're supervising their home find out how to supervise that home and the three questions that you need to ask at the end of the day to your contractor right simple experiment that we'd started I think about eight to nine months back interesting results I just want to share if you could just play this could you help me what these are essentially bite-sized simple in-language videos simple checklist for people to go and the jobs that they need to be doing in making their entire home just go back yeah the videos not playing okay if you could these are bite-sized videos in languages about 20 of them the simplest checklist of FAQs that I have because I have nobody else to go to these have touched about 40 million and I don't have any problems in terms of this being seen in the wrong places the viewability of this it being three second views of four second views because the consumer is asking for it as long as you've got the insight right you are not being creepy you're not you're co-opting and you're creating value for the consumer it's it's been for us I think it's transforming making sure that instead of adding another eleven hundred people with our technical service I'm able to serve far more consumers and for them I'm a truly expert brand right so I'll leave you with this hopefully we can play the video sometime but that's that's that's fine that's fine thanks thank you thank you Ajay yes of course please do interesting information questions for you later just one announcement in the meanwhile there is knowledge center research turn research into money is happening there right now if anybody is interested in that before that of course Vishal I think I I'm going to invite him to go up on stage he is running short on time everybody keep your questions ready after yes we'll be taking questions in all and if that video comes up we can play it after Vishal session yeah hi good afternoon everyone my name is Vishal Sabarwal and I head e-commerce and digital marketing at HDFC life insurance just to give you a bit of a background on HDFC life insurance you know we are a 20 000 employee strong company with almost 1 trillion rupees of assets under management that we manage we work with 1 lakh plus agents today we work with 250 partners both on the financial side and on the ecosystem side and we kind of onboard more than 1 million customers every year and you know as I speak to you today almost you know 10 percent of our customers kind of get onboarded from the e-commerce platform and pretty much 99 percent of the customers you know come through the digital route through the assisted route which our agents kind of help manage now you know the question that is being asked is personalization a reality or a myth in my view the answer is pretty much simple personalization is a reality today have you become you know really really good at it you know I'm not so sure but when we look at personalization I think we should not be at it in a purest technology sense you know there's a certain human angle to it the insight angle to it and you know if you were to look at you know how some of the good old industries used to operate so you know your kirana store walla they would know everything you know personalized in the neighborhood in which they would operate or if an insurance agent were to visit your home you know they would know a little bit about you the neighborhood in which you stay your family the number of children that you had in the home your parents you know your real need and then they would come out and customize an offering to you so what we're seeing in the digital age is nothing but an extension of that and how companies are kind of trying to deliver that at at scale you know a bit of a history of how insurance started now insurance life insurance as an entity you know you know it's almost multiple centuries old I mean if you go back to the Roman Empire people used to keep a bit of a corpus aside for funeral expenses right so if somebody would die in the family and you know the entire funeral function used to be a pretty exhaustive affair and you would spend a lot of money so around 3rd century 4th century BC that is when actually insurance actually started almost 1700 to 1800 years back you know the kind of the slightly more modern insurance companies started in Europe you would have the evangelists the pastors you know traveling over the world and you know you would not know whether they would return home or not so there was something called as the Scottish widow's pool which was created wherein you know you would know about the people who are part of this pool right and some sense you had enough information you know they would belong to this geography or to this sect and therefore the set of people would come together and you know pool some money you know as in terms of manage the risk and then as the wars you know as they call it the wars between the French and the English Empire started to expand a lot of the people started traveling and you would not know whether this young men would come back home and whether the family you know whatever would start to continue its earnings and continue to live a certain lifestyle that is when insurance started expanding in Europe so it is all in all sense you know if you were to look at it insurance thrives on data points which are very personal in nature even today you know if you were to apply for a life insurance policy I need enough information about you I need you know your statistics for example height and weight any medical history that you would have where you're staying what is your income now all these are data points that we use to personalize you know a premium amount so as to speak you know for an individual so pretty much insurance to that extent is thrives on data and thrives on personalization but that let me just move a bit ahead so you know this pretty much says you know it's only marketers collecting some data so today anytime you move into any outlet right the first thing you ask they ask you sir are you registered with us do you have a phone number right so they ask you about your phone number and then your name and then you continuously keep getting messages you know of some promotion offer which is running or not now that is the kind of personalization which probably kind of throws out consumers as Ajay spoken his previous presentation it has to be inside based and it has to be really relevant to the customer at a point of time when the customer wants a certain product or a service so we have to move beyond you know you know hi Vishal we have an offer running for you why don't you come to the store and check it out or why don't you buy it online so we have to move beyond that level of personalization and you know and therefore inside driven personalization is what I would call it Ajay just picking up from what you were saying and in some sense you know what we call personalization today you know in the digital world or in the services world was what somebody in the manufacturing world would call mass customization right so the true if you were to look at the mid 1980s which is when Dell came up with this offering that you could actually customize the components that you wanted you know in a laptop or a desktop that you were purchasing so that is one example of personalization that was running in an industry almost 30 35 years back and the entire Dell model which is based on personalization and supply chain efficiencies was based on you know what we are calling personalization today and you know what in manufacturing the Dell guys or the Toyota guys would call as mass customization yeah so pretty much you know there's some statistics around this we have to move beyond high first name that is what Ajay referred in his presentation but yes customers do expect that brands and organizations know enough of their past history you know so if I'm pitching to a millennial you know who's not bought a basic protection cover for himself or herself it doesn't make any sense for me to kind of pitch a retirement plan to that particular customer segment or to that particular individual right because it's absolutely mis-targeting of information or communication and that will kind of throw off you know that individual away from the brand and basically I'll go into the spam basket as far as that customer is concerned so what is personalization at scale you know I briefly test about it in my introductory notes in insurance what we need is a lot of data now this was being done by an individual agent or by a pool of people in select geographies now how do you target you know a set of people in a population of one billion plus a young demographic coming up you know do you set up physical branches in every nook and part of the country now that's going to be very expensive so the route that we adopt is building this huge chain of ecosystem place that we have so you know if you were to be an Airtel customer for example I can potentially tap into the Airtel database and you know bundle an insurance plan for you if you're walking into a bank branch I know enough information about you right and or the bank knows enough information about you wherein they can personalize the offering that they have from an insurance company you don't have to go through the process of giving your personal details again your contact details in financial services KYC is a big thing so all I need is certain incremental details from you which are maybe one tenth of the information that you would typically fill now this works not just in a pure digital unassisted model but also if you walk into a bank branch you know your personal banker would know a reasonably amount of stuff about you to customize the plan now as an insurance company if I'm offering you 30 products you know the person in the bank can't be showing you all 30 products like a supermarket right he or she really needs to know your real need your age profile and what is the plan that will suit you so that's how we are using personalization in HDFC life and effectively we're trying to build our own data management platform through this network of ecosystems and we hope at some point of time this will see you know become a reality but you know the early signs right now of enough success that we are driving why does personalization at scale matter to marketers I think the answers are quite simple to this one is you know I believe that personalization can drive higher return on the investments that we are making so the onboarding of the customers can become seamless the communication can become more relevant at the same time you know you're not kind of doubling down your investments in categories you know where you're not getting the right results right and using all the automated tools which are available at our disposal today you know we can bring down the cost of you know marketing to consumers what we can also do is let's you know kind of talk about an example now you know you come to my website searching for an insurance plan but you really don't know you know what is the quantum of an insurance plan that you should buy now you give me very basic details and I can you know work out what we call an insurance parlance a human life value right and then I can customize that offering to you so for example you know you I come to the website I kind of fill in basic details about my age and income based on some backend analysis analytics and the entire history that we have I can go back and customize and say hi Vishal I believe that you should buy a term plan which is which ensures that you have a cover of 1.5 cr and this will cost you xyz do you need anything more on top of that and then you know as the machine start learning more and more you know some of these offerings keep getting customized as more and more customers come on board so this is something that we are doing even today and you know we've seen enough success in the last 12 to 18 months and this is become we are becoming better and better at it the only risk I see is you know if you buy some of these marketing technology tools which which are sold you know by marketers of technology firms but it's it's like buying a Ferrari honestly you know you need to ensure or a formula one car you need to have a Schumacher or you know you know a formula one driver available to drive the car otherwise that asset is just going to sit in your garage so be absolutely sure what you want to do with you know some of the tools that you are purchasing so that's one caveat I would put because there's a whole you know they truly benefit you but if you don't make some of the other investments in people culture integrating the technology creating the back end you know deciding the customer ownership policy you know as one would call it you know because today does a does the distributor own the customer does the company own the customer you know some of those questions come to light and when we are running a omni channel or a multi-distribution kind of a company so some of these basic principles need to be cleared up front I basically touched upon the right approach of making personalization at work just you know for this repeating it very quickly make it inside driven make it really personal don't spam the customer yeah what prevents companies from you know personalizing at scale it's it's largely how you kind of tie in the technology bit I think the marketing inside bit is you know is available you can continue doing all the research the machines can self-learn and throw some of those insights which Shagatha spoke about you know in his presentation the technology is available you know how do you integrate the human element with the technology and the organization practices culture that in my view is is a potential road black so you know if you're planning to deploy any such thing in your organization please ensure that you know some of these things are tied in which include the resources the culture the policies because if you don't do that it's going to be really really difficult to achieve the ROIs that you had envisaged when you know you kind of purchase the tools yeah so pretty much just summarizing my talk here yeah it's a core pillar of marketing not and I would go beyond marketing it's a core pillar of what more organizations are doing and you know we are doing it across the board not just at the onboarding stage but also you know customers need to know their fund value their premium renewal dates you know you know how do you underwrite a policy basically it's happening across the value chain in our company for life insurance yeah pretty much some of the other things that I've spoken about so I won't repeat them in the interest of time pretty much just ensure that whatever you do is customized to a customer you know to a customer or in our case we drive personalization to influence what our agents go out and sell in the market so each industry is different but I believe personalization is here to stay there's a gap between you know what is promised and by the time you executed you know you have to go through a few road blocks and if you can learn from practitioners who've gone through this journey before it would be a great thing thank you so much thank you so much thank you so much that was awesome yash is going up he's going to take 10 minutes and then you're all up hi good afternoon my name is yash van i'm the founder of this company called the thick shake factory so we are essentially a food service qsr retailing chain very simply put we sell milkshakes and we are very good in them we started about five years back just a brief background about us with one store in hyderabad that today we have about 120 operational about 35 40 more in the pipeline we present about 25 cities and we are one of the fastest growing qsr chains in uh india and we're proud to say that we are still bootstrapped and haven't raised any VC funding so far which we pride ourselves on that aspect so um like who are the who are our consumers right i mean for us 80 percent of our consumers are millennials so i'm primarily focusing on this particular um tg so first of all the human beings all of us are wide to connect and interact among ourselves right so i mean right from the stone ages when people were talking with sign language and then the language evolved and then people were talking on telephone and telegram and now it's digital communication so it's it's the underlying human need to interact with each other just that the mediums have been changing and today with the advent of the technology that's existing today we can communicate and connect to everyone with a click of a phone so today the scenario is that i mean man as such has stopped mostly talking in person we are mostly online so we are still talking but maybe we're talking online majorly maybe that is the evolvement of the consumers um that are there today i want to take uh i wanted to show two examples probably here it is too um uh small the text is too small here so one company that i wanted to project was tinder so what did tinder do and why was why has it become so successful right so previously the people um i mean however relationships formed in earlier right so if you see how were they formed um people used to meet and talk but today the consumers are more comfortable talking online so uh what tinder has done is it has provided a platform for two people to interact online because that is the medium in which today today's people are more comfortable interacting so once you have an initial interaction on tinder and you don't have so much of time to invest whether you want to like or dislike someone you just swipe left or right so for today's generation and for today's instant gratification and decision-making ability um this has been the problem uh this this company has been able to solve that problem so end of the day any company um or any startup or any company exists for uh solving a particular problem whatever is the age so now coming to the uh specific topic about personalization as we all know there are two types of marketing inbound and outbound so how do we personalize inbound and outbound is uh what i'm going to talk about so um actually i want to mention this point by mr uh ajay about how coke as a product exists so from the last hundred years coke has been coke prides itself on saying that we have the same taste since hundred years so in the food service industry um it's about consistency rather than giving a new product every time so it's not about personalizing your product at every single point of time but rather you take pride in saying that the recipe is is a hundred year old recipe or a 400 year old recipe right so um in food service industry it's not about personalizing the product every single time probably but it is more about um personalizing the brand for your consumer so that is very important and relevant because if the brand is not personalized to the consumer the brand will uh cease to have any relevance so uh what we have done here is that our we sell our shakes in a glass right so initially when we started out we uh uh wanted our consumers to think that uh whenever they see a glass they think about our brand so hence we state uh we you know designed our logo in this way and also the word thick shake is a generic name but when we started about five years back nobody were selling only thick shakes the specialty retailing so we named also the brand thick shake factory in the hope that when people think about a thick shake they should think about the thick shake factory and it's been working out that way so what is more uh personal than a uh festival right i mean how do we remain relevant to our consumers and how do we attract consumers so we do this kind of campaigns where for every specific uh festival we uh come up with a specific uh creative and and run the campaign so if you see different uh types of fates but we always uh we actually personify our logo that's our typical campaign we personify our logo and make it like a hero and um play with it in the background so that's how we have been doing it and uh again if you come back to the seasonal uh variety variants uh you know there are seasonal personalization so one is the uh you know when it's the summer you personalize for the uh you know the seasonal varieties that are available and so on like a Christmas season and for the summer season you come up with the mangoes so it's not about personalizing the product every single time but what i'm trying to say is that for every different occasion you have to be personalizing your brand like um uh so what we say is that uh there is a thick shake for every moment so that's our uh uh your focus so for every happy moment in your life or for every sad moment in your life if you're frustrated with your boss or with your job or your life you have a thick shake and it makes you feel good if you are happy and you're elated you want to celebrate you have a thick shake and if you are feeling moody you know to lift up your mood you have a thick shake uh you know you want to have a write an exam or you have an interview tomorrow to burst your stress you have a thick shake so it's about personalizing every single moment in a consumer's life so that the consumer is always related to you that's how we are trying to build the brand and so far it's been working well for us um so if you see some specific campaigns like no shave November right so we have um we had done this campaign which worked very well for us on instagram and on facebook um that we personified our logo itself into a man with a beard and we said we are shaving off 15 percent off so a lot of bearded men started coming to our outlets and you know doing this so i mean we had no idea that uh who's wearing uh who's having a beard like me at this point of time so we can't target these people online but when we run these campaigns at a specific tg uh across online uh mediums thankfully we have we are able to do that kind of targeting um so this kind of campaigns are really working well for us and um even if you see like recently one for the india pakistan match so it's about we said you know you celebrate this you're watching the match or you order this so we ran a campaign on swiggy and we got a very huge response i mean i'm talking about 250 percent sale increase within a week because of a single campaign that we did um so again i'm coming back to some specific campaigns like so basically when uh today's consumers are also very passionate about causes they don't care about the product only so once the product is available widely and it becomes a commodity um it's about what causes the brand is related to and only when the brand is associated with some good causes so in the minds of the consumer only then they will actually follow the brand so you we have to be relevant to the changing trends and times the classic example is of course the amul classic marketing campaign whatever the event or occasion is there you know they come up with something brilliant so right from our inception we have been inspired by amul and we try to associate an you know an event or a trend with with our brand so that it remains relevant in our consumers mind so these are some of the campaigns that we did for an international woman's day and age day and so on actually these are videos but unfortunately i don't know the videos are not playing so this is what i wanted to convey by saying that you know you have to suit every specific occasion to our product and that's how we have been doing this our store is also pretty personalized by what i say by which i mean that every city that we go to we have a separate wall dedicated to that particular city alone so this is a creative that is there for Kolkata and this is another city for in Bombay and so on and one last thing that i wanted to say was with advent of aggregators like swiggy and somato with two three billion dollars of funding coming to them today the mostly food service is about delivery and takeaway which is increasing rapidly so we have a lot of the data that we can work out with like for example we have access to data like when you search in a particular geography for a certain product and if that product is not there like for example in you're sitting in Bandra and you're searching for a thick shake but there is no outlets giving you thick shakes then we will get to know that there is a demand for this whether the consumers are searching so based on this this called demand shaping so based on this we are actually locating our outlets because we have you know a lot of data so this is been really driving the industry and you're more or less sure short about the sales so the data is really helping us and the entire industry thank you so much for the opportunity to speak in front of you thank you yeah he really rushed through that thank you questions who has question you get to ask one question because we're extremely short on time how many of you are dying to ask about this whole personalization versus privacy yeah so you know what we'll just ask it on your behalf which is everybody is yeah so i'm i'm doing the thing of yeah we can everybody's talking about how personalization happens at the cost of privacy and that's a big challenge at marketers are navigating through that opt-in is one audience but that other audience especially because of that spam that we have started as a culture has opted out how do you deal around that to actually get to personalization at scale so maybe i'll recraft the question privacy is like he talked about the neighborhood banya was always there right he knew about you he knew about your father your kids and we never minded that privacy invasion the question where consumers get irritated where a all of us have received hr letters with our name being there and very personalized letter right this is the great achievement you've done for the last year and it's it's digitally signed etc when you fake personalization and don't add value with that entire thing i think consumer is asking the question as to why did i let you in and what did you do with this you obviously misused a privilege yet if you are creating value i think consumers are absolutely fine but that line of creepy that you mentioned yeah when it is not insights driven both of you have spoken about that which is bad personalization when that happens and that happens a lot so how do you then you know circumvent or navigate that my question just one small piece i think we are too much and which is why i said this form of we've found this new tool and we've got to somehow use it i think the refrain that we need to as marketers have if i don't have a good use of it it's fine telling the consumer right dealing with the consumer in a normal fashion if you don't have use for his information it's absolutely fine not filling a 20 page questionnaire with the consumer this is the information we do not need of you so i think you've got to put some self-restrain into into yourself Vishal you want to add to that yeah i mean my experience has been that customers are willing to give you more information if you're willing to give them a promise of better service or delivery yeah so there's a huge market for that you know even the adhar debate which happened which was largely oriented around privacy i think that was more to do with big government and you know how government would use that data to you know survey customers but as far as individual institutions are concerned i don't think consumers had a fear about that so you know nine out of ten customers definitely were willing to give their other card and information for a more convenience onboarding or a service promise thank you thank you yes i'm sorry i cannot let you answer because we really are very short on time just to summarize this whole thing of course personalization is a reality personalization at scale is work in progress from what we have understood what it gives us is lots of benefits it will generate revenue it will give you brand loyalty it will give you improved user experience for your consumers it will create a longevity towards your brand however it cannot be and i'm going to now steal words from these gentlemen it cannot be creepy it has to be it cannot be what was this irrelevant and it also cannot be something that you know it's not cutting down on your wastage of marketing budget which means it has to be data it cannot be data before insights it has to be insights driven it has to be good personalization hence individualized experience of your consumer gets better i'm hoping to god that we have answered the question that we started with but a loud round of applause for my panelists they were awesome and for yourselves i think we were before lunch we let them go now and nor you have one more job to do please present our panelists with me mentors token of our appreciation thank you all thank you really please stay with us on stage this is our way of saying thank you to you for taking out the time and joining us at tech munch 2019 thank you i didn't know there was like a tax on claps and applause and all that is there i don't know there isn't thank you and please come together for a group photograph