 Public Places Committee. The recording secretary will take roll. Roll call in order by last name. Committee member Azdarian. Present. Committee member Faulkner. Absent. Committee member Nathanson. Present. Committee member Puentes. Present. Committee member Sayers. Absent. Vice Chair Kiefer. Absent. Committee member Kiefer. And Chair Baumgartner. Present. Thank you. But the record reflect all commissioners are present with the exception of. Committee members Faulkner, Sayers and Vice Chair Kiefer. Thank you. Do we have a quorum? Just squeaking it through. Yeah. Thanks. Public comments. This is the time when any person may address matters not listed on the agenda, which are within the subject matter of the jurisdiction. The public may comment on the agenda items when the item is called. Each speaker allowed three minutes. Are there any members of the public. Online that are. Desiring to. Make a comment. Kyle. You have no hands raised at this time. Okay. No one present. No one here. Good. So we have approval of minutes. We have three sets of meeting minutes to approve today. Copies have been distributed for your review. Are there any additions or corrections to the minutes? Any comments? We're doing it differently at this time. Not going to vote. So. You think. Yeah, I know. So you're waiting for any, nothing proper. Okay. The minutes are approved as amended. We will now move on. As. Submit it. Excuse me. Excuse me. We're going to move on to scheduled items. For rolling through this. Yeah. Okay. Um, yeah. So we are going to. We're going to move on to scheduled items. So we're going to have a progress report on the strategic plan. Implementation and the annual work plan discussion. Part one. So our staff will share a progress report on the strategic plan. Implementation and then open a first in a series of discussions about the 2023. 24. Annual work plan. Our recommended action is information and discussion. Great. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So that's what we did last year. With our annual work planning process. So we're kicking it off. I think about the same time that we did last year. But the goal here is to see how we're doing with implementing our strategic plan this year. And what our work plan was at the beginning of this fiscal year. So our reminder again, that our fiscal years run June. So we're going to go ahead and review the work that we've been doing. We're going to go ahead and look up the current fiscal year. And start a new one. So we're starting a process. Where we can review the work that we've been doing. Look at what still needs to be done. And kind of evaluate and assess. And then hopefully get to the point later in the summer where we're approving a new annual work plan for next, this next fiscal year. And we're going to go ahead and review the work that we've been doing. This slide is pretty much what I just talked about. It's really what we're doing today. Starting with review. We're going to be looking at our fiscal year accomplishments this year. And then our progress on our strategic plan. Implementation. We'll review our work areas and responsibilities. And then we'll kind of go into that's really what we're doing today. And then the next step in the process will be kind of an overview of what we're doing this year. And then we're going to be looking at what needs to be done. Looking at what needs to be in our work plan this year, considering. How we're doing with implementing our strategic plan. What are our continuing projects and ongoing programs. Considering what has changed this year versus last year. And what new opportunities there might be. And then, uh, and then once that process is complete, the committee will approve an annual plan for 23, 34 years. And then we'll start implementing that plan. So we'll start off by, uh, kind of going over our accomplishments for this year. We actually did quite a bit this year, our kind of year coming out of COVID. I think this was our first full year of really doing projects again, without too many major restrictions. So that was a lot to do. We installed a mural on the Fifth Street parking garage titled Help Each Other Grow by Rough Edge Collective. We launched the facade improvement program including a partnership, partnerships with two nonprofits to provide free murals mosaics and other place making artwork to small businesses impacted by the pandemic. We entered into partnerships with several organizations to bring free public exhibits to the Finlay Community Center in person senior wing. They're listed there, but they include our ongoing program like the National Arts Program, as well as new partnerships, such as with the Redwood Empire Chinese Association, the Office of Community Engagement, the San Jose Historical Society, POMO Project, some of those we've had exhibits with before, but in a slightly different format this year. Continuing with our accomplishments, we hosted the Live at Juilliard concert series last year, last summer, summer of 2022, including six free concerts in Juilliard Park attended by roughly 500 people each week. We launched Art Surround, a partnership with Creative Sonoma to provide grants to seven local artists or artist teams to produce nine temporary public art installations throughout Santa Rosa. We introduced and rebranded a comprehensive out there Santa Rosa website, including a page for the public art program and launched a new destination marketing campaign. We completed equity training with the Art and Public Places Committee hosted by Kim's and creative, including ongoing mentoring with the committee task forces. We launched the arts engagements for the general plan update, which was a partnership with Santa Rosa forward with our planning division, as well as with Kim's and creative. And those engagements are ongoing still, but we're three different approaches. One is a coloring book to gather input from grades three through eight on the topics of health and environmental justice. Another one is a spoken word workshop, leading into a music video, which will be released later this summer. Mainly based on input from SRJC students about their hopes and dreams for the future of Santa Rosa. And, and then a collaborative workshop with high school students that created the kind of installation project, which we'll talk more about a little later, which was an event in courthouse square a couple weeks ago. So, this slide doesn't read too well at this scale, but this is essentially our strategic plan implementation for this current year. And this report was generated as of May 17. So it's already a little bit outdated as we kind of continue to move forward in terms of if more funds were spent between then and now. But it gives you as kind of a snapshot at how far we've gotten with some of the projects we we undertook this year with implementing the plan. So our main categories of our strategic plan are community engagement and input governance and administration programming and projects and PR and marketing. And so this spreadsheet shows the breakdown of, you know, where where money was spent with where where we budgeted or what was anticipated and what has been spent to date so far this just clear. And then this is well, maybe I should pause there and we can if there's any questions about any of our accomplishments or this this page. So it's time to just check in and then we can move on to the next section. So happy to answer any questions or if anyone has any feedback about anything. We haven't spent any money in the top section yet this community engagement. Yeah, I mean, no, the notes there that say adding to Kim's and creative contracts that will take effect starting in our next fiscal year. So none of that has been like, there have been no specific costs associated with that area associated with that area that doesn't mean we haven't been working in certain ways to accomplish some of those main goals as identified in our strategic plan but in terms of like expenditures, right they haven't specifically been addressed. But it seems to me that we were since this is 2223 we kind of started really working on some of that while we were still coming sort of coming out of that weird coded period where there was a lot of hesitancy about in person events and meetings and whatever so. Yeah, exactly. I think there's been a lot of talk about like open house type back ticket activities and doing more social gatherings and yeah it hasn't quite. I mean I think that those are all still things that we can do and we can start rolling out it's more matter of when when they weren't written up as something we should do, we couldn't even do them yet and so it's been slow to launch And I served on the Community Engagement Task Force for this committee but also for the UNAM project and so much of what we I think would have done would have been like town hall meetings and focus groups and things that we would have done in person. And, you know, at the very least we would have had expenses for snacks or something right. Right, exactly. But it's like we didn't do any of that everything was done virtually. So the community engagement was really involved with the UNAM opening but those expenses were part of that project, not specifically the community engagement. And the only thing so if you go into the PR and marketing section where we talk about a maximize outreach and branded equipment for events. We use those that equipment for the UNAM like the tent, the tent that has our name on it the tables and table clause we did invest in equipment for events for outreach that got used at the UNAM event but they're more program wide right there for use at other times too so that they did come out of a different budget. So they, they support the community engagement and input kind of section of this that expenses just don't hit in that category. Yeah. That explains a lot. And I think the other thing that looks like we're slowly making progress there is under the programming and project section. Yeah, there's two main project amounts there that, like one is being held for a project that we don't have control over so it the timing of it may be even another year down the road I don't know exactly. So the pedestrian over crossing project. So I mean that's that that when we did our planning for last year it was we were in the planning phases of it and then it's now been kind of on hold so. So that's, that's what that those numbers there the one that's pulled for emergency response funds, and the highway 101 those two items line items for 50,000 each obviously make that category look a lot larger. But they're not things that we actively are pulling from right now so. I think we've actually made good, good progress on our projects that just those, those two things aren't happening. I don't really know exactly how you budget but what the things you don't spend, you know that we're obviously carry over that effect or budgeting when you have to like we budget for less the next year because you're pulling so much over will that just yeah, I don't really get to use that it all gets used but essentially because our, the public art fund is one contained fund separate from the city's general fund. So all of the accounts that we have within our fund so one is just for general public art one was made specifically for the project one was there so there's different like, yeah, accounts or project keys. In those types of keys anything that is left by the end of that year it just reverts back to the general fund our fund, not the general fund bar it reverts back to just the general pot of money for the public art fund. Right. And so then, if we know that project is still continuing. And we'll use it again, you know, it needs to still be attached to that project we can encumber funds or or like your mark them for a project in contracts. And so that's one way to keep them attached or it's just in our in our spreadsheets budgeting knowing what they're going to be used for but yes we don't know money gets lost in within the public art fund it just rolls back and then we have access to it. The year going forward. And when we anticipate how much will be left at the end of a year then yeah we request to appropriate less funds, because we know it'll still be left sitting there. So it's kind of a process that you have to check and see what's going to be left and then calculate. So curious as to the accountability in a particular area so if let's say, you've got 6,000 or whatever might be in the community engagement fund, and you want to use that for P and PR and marketing or some other use. Is that an administrative decision to move it or do is there some other level of reporting or accountability. Yeah, so if, if what. So, this is what the column that says anticipated. That's what this committee approved last year. If something is different or needs to be changed, we would need to come back to the committee to have you approve that it's so where the. So, I mean, yes, it's not the oversight the oversight of that authority or whatever. Yeah. And it's not such power. The funds themselves aren't like this committee doesn't have the authority to actually appropriate the funds that has to go to count city council. So this committee makes recommendations and what should be in our expenditure plan and improves the expenditure plan. Then what we actually need appropriated in our budgets to do this work goes through the city's budget process and the council approves that. And this level of detail, they're looking at, oh, the public art fund needs this much more added to it this year from from its reserves. That's what they're approving. Right. So we're just basically signing off on what you bring to us and say, you know, this is how we're going to. That's how it should be divided up. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So if there are things and what this is based on is our strategic plan and the actual dollar amounts that we allocated to our strategic plan. So this this should essentially mirror what's in our strategic plan document in the in the back of it. There are several pages of like implementation guides. And an expenditure guidelines and and it. This is essentially what that is the only difference is that sometimes if we didn't get to something in one year will like then add to, you know, combine the two years together and say, well, this is where we're at now with what should be spent on that. So. So we will talk more about this in our next discussion about this when we're talking about what should be in our next year's plan. And I'll have a revised version of this that will be to to date like it'll be updated again so you'll see how we actually finished the year with in terms of the numbers. So, so yeah, we will definitely keep talking about it. But yeah, if there are other questions or things that would be more helpful to see on here. We can definitely make adjustments to it. So this is just that kind of, I don't know flow chart diagram that I created last year to try to capture the complexity of all the different program, the work areas that kind of fall under. Yeah, and my yeah work plans. So, last year we kind of talked about, okay well what what are the different roles and responsibilities, the purple things are main program areas, the green items are different funding sources and the blue items are like advisory or if you know, or like authorities, you know, boards like you, right. Some of them are advisory, a PPC is more, more than advisory but that's what that's meant to capture. And then the little red asterisks is, I think are meant to capture at what points community engages with our program. So like our website out there sounds a website through our marketing and advertising through our kind of strategic plan engagement. In our community like projects at a PPC meetings I think that's that's what the intention was is to signal where those kind of interactions can be. I have dotted lines because there's a lot of things that are connected. So, this is really just a refresher and then this was what kind of came out of that a couple meetings into our process last year was this kind of diagram that shows where the work of the committee over overlaps with the actual program because they're separate entities that work together and have overlapping roles and responsibilities in those main areas that are in the middle there so again this is all just kind of refresh from last year but I think we made some good progress on trying to verbalize some of this or visualize it where we hadn't really spent the time to do that previously so. And then this is kind of what I think we, we land on in terms of where we start with thinking about our annual work plan every year is well for for the for right now we have the implementation of the strategic plan that's a major area of our work plan. So that is what is number one there. And then those are the different categories and what we anticipate having as our like tasks in each of those areas. And then another main main area of the work plan is our continuing projects so we'll have projects that we started this year that will continue into next year, like arts around the assault panels. And then the general plan update engagements our facade improvement program with the place making projects fire station five which we haven't done much with yet but we did start this year so it technically will be a continuing project into next year. And then the highway 101 project which again I don't know exactly the timeline for that but it would be potentially continuing this year. We also have ongoing programs which aren't really projects they're just things we always do year to year. So they're they don't change that much we always have rotating art exhibits of some kind. We always have our cultural events like live at Juilliard, we have out there Santa Rosa, and the asterisk is here indicate that they're not those programs are not funded by the public art fund. Public art program staff are responsible for them but they have separate sources of funding. That would be the same for the saw panels to correct. Yes, yes and no it had it did get an infusion of PG and one time funds. Okay. I suppose it could have an asterisk on it. You'll see later in our process that it will need some additional funding from the public art fund. Okay, we can talk more about that but if that hasn't been approved yet. Okay, so. So yes, currently you're right it should have an asterisk on it because it currently is not funded. That's good to know. So then we have our ongoing maintenance and conservation of the public art collection. And I put two different things under that because we have maintenance of our items where we kind of know what needs to be done to those items we have funding encumbered on a contract already and then we have improvements to the Zag light installation which I think will require additional funding above and beyond what we have more budgeted in normal years so there may be an additional request for funding for that coming to the committee as well. And then that is the wrong number it should have a four there for new opportunities, but that's something that I think is like the, the last main consideration or work area within an annual plan, and your work plan is like well, are there new things we should be considering. So again to refresh, this is just the process that I kind of over over did an overview of earlier that we're reviewing our accomplishments. We're reviewing our strategic plan implementation progress and we're reviewing our work areas and responsibilities. And then kind of going to a iterative plan planning process. So that's all that I have for today because I think we, that's that's all we, we needed to start this process and I think like what will be at the next meeting will be the next step which is okay. Maybe what has changed what new opportunities are there do we just keep doing what we're doing. I think that we probably need to present to you kind of an honest assessment of well if we're continuing everything we're still doing. What else can we do is the room for anything else so I think that that's something that we'll be working on to share with you and then if there's any new priorities or if there's things in the strategic plan I would encourage everyone to review the strategic plan. And then during this time because I think it's good to see, well what still brings true like we wrote that in a very key moment in history and there's still very important things in there, but have things changed to the point where certain things are more of a priority than now. Should we, like at our last meeting I know it was a priority to tackle our toolkits, and we are just now getting to that at the end very end of this year so it's like it, it we didn't have the capacity to take it on earlier than we do now that then we then now so I think that like, considering some of the things that that do fit under our area what, you know, what's the priority I think and that's where the committee can really help shape what's in that work plan is prioritizing. So happy to answer questions or go over anything. There's no motion so we can just take questions anyone have any. I'd like to see that slide again they had the, the Venn diagram showed in the middle kind of what our responsibilities were I just wanted I didn't. I wrote down annual plan community engagement but I didn't get that third thing. I never seen it kind of written like that. Maybe you showed that to us but. Yeah, yeah, project evaluation. Okay. Is that I mean that's obviously simplistic, you know in terms of like, you know just summarizing but is that really the core of what you're really seeing us doing as a team space. This is what it felt this was this is what felt right as of last year and things have shifted and changed a little bit so I mean if there's things. I think that it would be interesting to think about what is that really how it went this year. Like, do you know what I mean, like, this is what we thought back last August, right, July, July, August, I think. And so it's like, well, okay, did that, did that happen I think we did work well together with our community engagements for projects like the UNAM, for example, and the fifth street parking garage. And so I think that we're, community engagement in terms of having a celebration inviting people to an event for project. The annual work plan I think is still work in progress in terms of how we work together but I think that in theory, we're bringing you stuff to respond to but we want your input we want you to help us prioritize and shape what the work plan is sure. I don't think we have a great system for that yet. I think we're still working on what that looks like and I think the project development task force could spend some time thinking about what a project evaluation process could be that is a joint process between staff and the committee. What's the objective in that evaluation. Yeah, I think it's like, I mean, we, we, we ended up doing a way. We haven't really completed it but we ended up doing a slightly new process this year with UNAM, as an example, because we were already working with Kim's and creative and their mentoring of the task forces we had them include a conversation about how the project went with all the task forces. It was a goal to have them report back to the whole committee, the themes that came out of those conversations and areas for improvement or things that worked well, etc. So that, that will be a version of a project evaluation when it's complete it just isn't complete yet. In the past, I don't think we really had a formal process I think it was kind of like project was done and it was like okay great job everybody and we moved on. Yeah, there wasn't really a way we've never developed a way to actually evaluate so I think what what my goals would be in a project evaluation would be to like kind of look at well how did how did community engagement go in that process how did interaction with the artist go in that process how was the selection panel like each component that makes up that project I think there should be questions developed to assess how successful it was, and if it, if there are certain criteria to help that help with that evaluation such as like, did, did we receive enough community engagement to meet x y and z goals you know what I mean it's like I think that it's, it's a, it's comprehensive it needs to be looked at comprehensively to figure out what, what makes a successful project. The project is slightly different, but I think that there are probably some core goals or values that need to be addressed for every project. Yeah, but they would be those evaluations would sort of be weighted towards the procedural questions as opposed to aesthetic questions. Yes, I don't think that I mean, yes, I don't think that the goal is to evaluate the artistic merit of the finished product. What's that I said hopefully that had been addressed at some level. Yeah, I mean I suppose that there could be. Yeah, there could be that could be a component of it, but I think that, unfortunately, I mean, I don't want to set up a system that then second guesses or, or somehow negates the process that the selection panel went through, because the selection of their job is to. So, so I guess that if there's a topic of the evaluation is the selection panel process, then you can capture feedback there about that, but it doesn't directly talk about the actual finished product. But there are certain things that feed into that, for example, I think part of an evaluation that's really effective is, did we attract a pool of sure applicants, yeah, where where we got high quality proposals and we actually, you know, had something to select from. And then once the project is installed and completed and dedicated to the public. I guess in my experience is like if you don't get any really negative feedback from the community you go, yes, but you know there were those times where you get significant. You know feedback from the community that you have to evaluate and go okay, why did this elicit this particular response. So I think it would be good for the evaluation process to allow for that. Yeah. In some ways I think each of the teams or committees that we have the subcommittees could be integral to developing part of that evaluation, like from a lens, in a sense, because and also think I think the speed and the kind of proximity to the project is really important. We're not talking about aluminum until next year, the spring, and we had like this years long stretch out with just cove it let alone just the time since it was installed. We're losing the sense of the, you know, you just forget things they just don't get recorded, as well as I think that the selection committee would be really helpful to have them do some evaluation. If I said this and I respond was I listened to was I I mean those kind of things was, was I happy with how actual construction and fabrication happened. Was I, you know, that sort of thing because I feel like when you if I think you've probably all been on one of these I've only been on one or two but you really put a lot of time in a lot of energy and heart and soul and I know we're on zoom that was even more frustrating so it'd be good to have that feedback. Yeah, you know I think it's good for us to note that a project like unum, which really was conceptually based in community input right it was supposed to be a. It was supposed to really emerge out of a community engagement process and here we were in, you know, in the middle of coven and we couldn't even have a session where the community come and meet the artist and sort of have that interaction. So I think we can learn a lot from the process but we also have, I think we have to give ourselves a lot of credit, you know that it turned out pretty darn good considering we had so many obstacles. Yeah, so that's exactly the type of thing that I think we can dive into a little bit further next discussion is like prioritizing the things that we need right so if we need a project evaluation process. How can the committee support that each task force could, you know, do some piece of it right and then. Yeah, it gets done collectively so I think that's. Yes. That's great approach and then I think the other areas of the work plan can be looked at that way too. Yeah, yeah. So I'm wondering that the project selection process doesn't end up in that. That combined area, where the. Like that that sliver of the Venn diagram. Yeah, because it seems to me that staff has a pretty significant role in the selection process even though the vote is actually taken. The selection of the artist or artwork you mean like what project gets done, like what exactly do you mean, I was thinking about actual projects and the selection of the artists the proposal that is. No staff doesn't have any role in that. It's a selection panel 100% we just facilitate we don't have a vote. I guess, but because, because you facilitate that vote, you have a role, I guess, from how I view it. You see that might move into the middle because we're both have some right because yeah. Because the conversation is happening with committee members who have a voting members but also staff who are presenting and facilitating the, you know, the discussion. So that's a pretty significant role. Yeah, I'd be more interested in whatever what your questions were and what your concerns and stuff because and and I did with an onkins and creative work starting to work on the called artists the proposal application process and stuff and how to revamp that and how to after doing the equity and how to apply that to that location process and how to make it more accessible and to our community and actually attract more people within our community and to do the process. So, I know we were, we did start working on that with Nico. That's good. I think that I think it could move into that center area I think that the reasoning or the thought behind how it's divided out here is like so under our public places committee in the bottom project development and project selection are under the committee's responsibility. The way that I feel like it's captured or was attempted to be captured under the program is just project management of projects. We consider that part of the project management is facilitating the artist process selection process but I can see that that's not super clear and outside view other than in my head. So I think that that we can definitely shift that to the center. I mean it's not a criticism or any, you know, big deal. It's just an observation that, you know, maybe there is more of a shared participation in that process. Thank you. I mean, I think we'll continue this really was meant to be the starting point for that and so again I think the, the requests are for the committee members to review our strategic plan, specifically kind of the implementation sections of it and see what falls out to in terms of what we haven't done this yet this should be a priority. And, and I'll, I'll try to prepare the packet for our next meeting, a little bit more in advance so that you have time to review it's always hard for me to meet the templates to get the information ahead of time but I think it's always more helpful obviously to have more time to look at what the slides are for them. Yeah, yeah. Any other questions about this. Is there any public comment? Is there any public comment on Zoom? Is anybody actually there? So there are no hands raised at this time. Thank you. So seeing none of those will bring me back here. You guys have more things you want to present to us. Yeah, this is for, let's see, we call the item 5.2. Oh, I thought there was something else in this one. Okay, that's it. All right. 5.2 program and project updates. The staff will present updates on current programs and projects. This is information only. So Tara and Jessica. I've got our program and project updates. I will start off with live at Juilliard. We announced the lineup last week. And we also this year newly have it on our out there Santa Rosa website, which is kind of last year than our city website. Of course it's there too. And we're also getting materials printed. So we'll have those for you at the next meeting. And then we'll have our lineup. I'll send this all to you, but just so you get to know now is going to be the real Sarah's, the King Street Giants furrows and Dillback, Erica Abram and the eclectic soul project, and the Dylan black project. So, and we've got food vendors every other week too. That's exciting. Oh, I'm sorry. Food vendors. It was really hard to get food vendors. It was the perfectly wrong timing coming out of COVID. The vendors were hit so hard. I know that's great though. It's got to be a huge add. Yeah. Yeah. I've never seen mom's food. Okay. Yeah, no, I mean, we had what last year, maybe three of the 16. Which, you know, certain people were like, Oh, where's the food next week? They were like, Oh, I brought food. You never know. We'll have one every time. Yeah, it's going to be Cita's kitchen and sushi show who that are trading off. So it'll be sushi bowls. Okay, so moving on to art surround. That's the project or that we're partnering with creative Sonoma. So I've got updates on all the different seven artists or artists groups. One has some stuff going on and their projects on hold right now. So we're not sure about that one. Yeah. I think that Barbie Watts is going to be installing her water catchment sculpture. That's going to be in the city hall. The demonstration garden for drought tolerant plants. Hopefully in the next couple of weeks, she'll be installing that so I can email you all when we have an actual date for that. So we have a couple of phones who was created a native edible and medicinal plant garden at Escalar. She held her workshops there. She said they went great. Kind of a cool thing about this project is that the garden is going to live on. So that will continue and she said that the native community that she worked with was particularly into and grateful for the project. Christian is our other artist who has a project at Escalar. She's going to be holding a writing workshop in early June. And she's going to have a big blowout reception chat book release, and that's going to be on August 5. Or around then. Once we get that totally nailed down. We'll invite you to that too. Christian is still creating her project. She's doing a decal walking tour of local activists. And she's done a ton of community engagement for this project like several interviews per person that she's representing. She wants to have her launch hopefully at the library and then they can, she can invite anyone who's still living. It was an activist that she's featuring to be there. And then we would go and walk towards a couple of them and check them out in person. The idea of the day that are the time. Yeah. This summer. Yeah, okay. Yeah. We've got the three muralists and Jay Linda lawyer, Josh lawyer and Maria key house. They are all ready to install murals on the museum. And then also at HD barber. It's a basketball avenue. Quite sure of the exact location. But anyway, they're kind of waiting on us as soon as the city has a contract for them for the building owner to sign. They're ready to rock. And hopefully that will be soon. So, um, yeah, MJ and Josh. It's working out that there's actually three murals happening. Yeah. So we have two, two on our museum and then one across the street. Yes. So I just want to mention you because arts around and the facade improvement program are both. Part of this package. Just want to say thanks so much to the city and the county and we got some additional funding from the vendors foundation and it's in Tara. Say it. Say it publicly. And the first of the three murals is completed. It's on the seventh street. Okay. Yeah. And the street side is supposed to be done this month, I believe. We hope. Yeah, we're supposed to get our agreements approved for use tomorrow. So keeping it. I just hate to say that word tomorrow. We really hope so though. And then I think the parking garage across the street. Yeah, yeah. That'll be down the line. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Very cool. Yeah. So then our last arts around project, you might have seen it when you walked in. Yeah. Yeah. And then Julian Bellotti and Anna was the other day are gilding the native rose on the towers at the center of the city hall. Courtyard there. And at the end of the meeting, we can look at their progress, but they did one on the inside courtyard and then one facing Santa Rosa Avenue, which you can see from Santa Rosa Avenue. So we're going to be looking at some native roses at the base there. So that's going to happen this next week. And then their celebration reception party is not going to be until August 23rd. And that will be four to 6pm in the courtyard here. We'll send out invites when we have, you know, for sure dates and stuff. Well, that dates for sure. Okay. For sure for sure. Next up, I've got our rotating exhibits. Still up at the family center is the low rider lifestyle exhibit. We have the reception yesterday. It was super well attended. The exhibit itself is for local photographers that do low rider photography and for the reception. A lot of them invited their own car clubs and other local car clubs in the area. The public art program teamed up with the Office of Community Engagement on that. So Office of Community Engagement, they invited all the different car clubs to show more of their, they call them historical artifacts like their plaques, t-shirts and some of them brought like magazines from the 80s and stuff that they were featured in. Really cool. Lots of history there. Art shows up through the end of this month. And then just across the courtyard at the person senior wing, the becoming independent art show is still up there. And that's going really well. They're having sales come through for that and stuff. So you can check that out for the end of the month as well. That's during the weekdays. Yeah, Monday through Friday. That's only that. Yeah. That's the only time they're open to the public. Yeah. And then lastly, I want to update you on the small business support program, which is the facade improvement grants and the place making murals. That is the, that's where we're partnering with the two nonprofits, Art Start and the mural project. So with all the businesses that applied, we're working with 20 total. So we're working with 20 total. So we're working with 20 total. So those businesses will be paired with either Art Start or the mural project. And, or they already are paired. 14 of those businesses are getting a facade grant and also wanted place making. And six of those businesses just wanted straight up public art. Yeah. Is there a timeline for that? Well, So tomorrow. Yeah, we can get going on the public art ones right away. So, yeah, we're just waiting on that. And to our credit tire and I submitted these contracts long ago. Yeah, I'm sure. Months ago. So yeah, just takes time. Okay, I will continue with some updates on our conservation and maintenance. Okay. So we're going to paint it tile mural at the transit mall downtown. Titled live oak lives on was cleaned and stabilized recently. It gets a lot of wear and tear, especially along the bottom where it meets the sidewalk. And so next year we may want to pursue additional funding for a stainless steel kick plate along the base. So that they don't, it's pretty much tough to get cut off. But it also takes long to get rid of any of the, any of the losses along the bottom edge. Otherwise it holds up pretty well to clean, and all of that is just that bottom edge. And then the sculpture installation at Fremont Park, the cancer survivor Plaza sculpture. Has deteriorated substantially over, over the years that it's been there. And we have cleaned it a few times. One of the bronze figures is actually stolen, so it's missing a bronze figure completely, and some of the components of it are not bronze. The figures are all bronze and the plaques are bronze, but the archways that the figures are coming through as a symbolism for surviving cancer, they are made out of like a foam material that's coated in a kind of plastic, like, taxi kind of, I'm not sure the exact materials, but it's in very bad shape. It's really deteriorating. It looks pretty bad. It's peeling and the structure itself isn't stable anymore. So it was not a project commissioned by the Public Art Program. We kind of adopted it or inherited it many years ago. It was a kind of a partnership between the Parks Department and the Block Cancer Foundation, the Block Family Foundation, who put these monuments all over. It's not a unique piece of art. It's in a series of several that are found throughout the US in cancer survivor plazas. So we've contacted the foundation and tried to find out what their wishes would be about the piece itself. And we may offer, if the piece itself is approved to be deaccessioned, we may offer the components of it back to them for them to take back ownership over it. But that will be on a future agenda for you to discuss if there's a recommendation to do that. But that's kind of where it's headed right now, given its current condition. So a couple of questions. Do you know when that was installed? I don't have that number right, that date in front of me. My recollection is like, no, it was like early 2000s, I believe. Another, this is a little out there maybe, but I wonder if it might be possible to put out like an RFP to artists to engage with the remnants of that sculpture at some point. If that would, I don't know, that foundation would have to approve that or something, but that might be an interesting kind of springboard for the other members. Yeah, it determines like, so when an item is deaccessioned formally, the process is that the committee has to recommend that that's the action that's taken, then it actually has to go to city council. That's what our policy says. So any items that are permanently deaccessioned, meaning we don't want them anymore, period. That's what that really means, would go to city council for approval. If they approve that, then technically, we can't gift the items to anyone. They have to be like put up for surplus. And the only exception to that is we can offer the items back to the original artist or artist family or state. And in this case, I think it would revert back to this block family foundation. Otherwise it goes to auctions, is that what you said? Yeah, it goes, it's essentially surplus city property. And then it goes through an auction process because we can't gift public funds to any one organization or person. Uh-huh. So that's what the deaccession process would look like. If we don't actually formally deaccession it and somehow we decide that we want to turn it into a new project, we could potentially go down a different path, but I'm not sure that then we want to still have ownership over it. See, if we do that, we own it still. Right. And that means we're still responsible for its care, its placement, maintenance. So it's a conversation that the committee would need to have in terms of what resources we have to do that type of project. Yeah. Thanks. And let's say it goes to auction. What happens to the funds? I don't know the answer to that. I think it just is like, they go through an auction process. They, there's a couple of different companies that I think the city has contracts with. And I think the funds just go back into the city's general fund, but I don't, I don't know, I don't know that 100%. I'd like to look into that because public art is different than let's say artwork that might be in a museum collection, but the ethics of museum collecting very specifically states that any items that are deaccessioned from amused. And generally we would deaccession because we don't want to work any longer, usually not because it's been falling apart outdoors, but that could be the case if it's in an outdoor sculpture garden or something, but that the funds have to go back into the collection. And there are very strict rules around that. So they were loosened up recently. It used to be that if you deaccessioned work, you could only use the funds to acquire new work, to accession new works for the collection. Now it's expanded to you can use the funds for collections care, for conservation or the care and management of a collection, but you can't put it back into, like if we deaccession something, we can't put the funds into our general operating fund. Yeah, no, that totally makes sense. I can look more into that and I think that the committee could also develop a more substantial deaccession process. It's only mentioned very briefly in the public art policy and it essentially says what I said that the committee can decide or can discuss and recommend that an item is deaccessioned then it goes to city council for group. That's really all it says. It doesn't talk too much in detail about it. Yeah, I think it'd be interesting to actually have the rule state that the money goes back into the public art fund. I agree with that. I think that this situation is slightly complicated because the public art fund didn't put any money into it originally getting it here and it became an item in our collection kind of through default, like it's an odd, it's not a liar for sure. If something like Unum ever needed to be deaccessioned, for instance, I can't imagine that the committee, whoever's on it at that point, would just approve it going to auction, you know what I mean? So I think in the absence of having that policy though, there's definitely a good reason to develop something stronger. I think this might be a really kind of an exciting opportunity to find an artist who's interested in questions of kind of bureaucracy and the intersection between sculpture and municipalities and develop something that really could be probably very inexpensive from the perspective of the city and might kind of offer us an unusual lens on how those processes work and how we might maybe make productive adjustments to those systems. Well, I think that I'll have to put this item for more conversation on an upcoming agenda because we shouldn't have too much more conversation about it now, but I think that looking at that as an option can definitely be a part of that conversation. I also need to make sure that I'm bringing all the actual correct information about the foundation because when the city, I believe that when the city accepted it from this foundation, there was some kind of agreement as to how it was used. And I don't know if we actually have the ability to repurpose it given what that agreement was. So there might be more nuance to it because of that situation, but I can bring all of that when we have it actually on an agenda. Thanks. Yeah. Okay, so then let's see our ASAWA panel update. We have finally, the public art program has finally provided all requested renderings, engineering calculations, dimensions, and stamp drawings to the fountain contractor. There's a long time coming to get all of that to the standards that was being requested, but we have done that. And so then the next steps are for the fountain contractor, which is through the Hugh Futural Corporation to actually submit the plans for the fountain itself. Those plans will have to be approved by the city and then they will have the green light to start construction. I don't know, I don't have an estimate on that timing yet. But once they do start construction, it is anticipated that the construction to build the fountain would take about five months. And then once the fountain is built, then the bronze artwork panels will be installed. And the foundry that is doing the art portion of this project should be able to provide me with a timeline of when they'll actually have the bronze panels ready for installation. But it's kind of like each process is working parallel, but they have to connect at certain points. So we're hoping that the timing connects again at the appropriate time so that the fountain is done and the art panels are ready to be installed within a reasonable timeframe. So, but again, like I said, there's still no start date known that I know of yet for the actual construction of the fountain. Could you state again where that is the location geographically? Oh, that's in Courthouse Square. Sorry, the south side of Courthouse Square near Third Street. Great. Okay, in terms of an update on the Fire Station Five public art project, I've mentioned before that we have an opportunity to be involved with a new public art project site-specific project for a new fire station being built in Fountain Grove. That is to replace one that burned down in the Tubbs Fire, not in the same location as the one that burned down, but it is to replace that same fire station, fire station five. So currently Fire Station Five is in a temporary location on Parker Hill Road. This new permanent location would be at the southwest corner of Fountain Grove Parkway and Stagecoach Road. And so the fire department and public works the whole project team, they're working with design build firm to design and build the structure and we're working on locating or identifying exact options for where public art could be incorporated within the site plan. And so we're working on drafting a project plan and an RFQ and so that will come to the committee for review very soon. They right now it's being reviewed by the fire department and then the project development committee, Nathan and Kristen will be looking at it and assisting with finalizing it and then it would come to the whole committee for review. And then the artists in the general plan update, I mentioned that a little bit in our previous item in terms of what we've accomplished this year and then what's still coming up. But I just wanted to shout out to Kimms and Creative and Brianna Hendren and Erica Lutz for doing such an amazing job at the May 21st event. And thank you to Anne and Lisa for attending and being there that day. We had our public art booth set up in the square and there was a really good kind of steady stream of people throughout the day interacting with these large scale puzzle pieces that the artists created that had imagery and were in the shape of items that came out of their workshops they did with high school students about the future for kind of environmental justice and housing in Santa Rosa. And yeah, it was great. It was music. There was a lot of families came by that was interactive things that you could do for smaller kids. You could work together with teams of people to move the larger puzzle pieces together. There was a whole wall where you could put sticky notes giving your own input on what environmental justice, health, housing issues. So it was a really nice event. And then our APPC task forces, we, Jessica and I've been working with Kims and Creative to review the progress that they've made working with the task forces this year. And then presenting back to the full committee and update on kind of the next direction for those task forces. So prior to that meeting, we should all receive an outline that kind of goes over what each task force is objectives are and what kind of the deliverables will be based on the kind of the work that's been done so far. So that's coming up and we'll have a fuller conversation about that next, at the next meeting. So that's a lot. Approximately. That's a lot. But we're done now. Sorry. Any questions from, actually public comments on this? Is there anyone still there? Person chair, no hands raised on Zoom chair. Thank you. How about anyone here? Any questions for Tara about Jessica's last things that we've shuttled through? That was very thorough. Yeah. Give us lots of info. Yeah, we're all going to be quizzed on everything. I know. So we'll move on to the next item on the agenda, which is the committee member reports. Everyone is willing to make comments or announcements because we did this last time to get anything going on. This is the time for the city to step, and you're aware that you're coming up organically and planned or things you want to raise up to the public and to this team. Want to highlight anything or comment about before we go to the task force reports? Isn't there Mr. Instur? This is the quilt artist, isn't it opening tomorrow? Yeah, there's a quilt artist reception named Sable Regalia. She does these pretty amazing psychedelic quilts that we'll all be up at Spenster Sisters in the reception's tomorrow evening. Five to seven, I think? Also, next Sunday is the Railroad Square Music Festival, which is all day long. Kristen working on that too, isn't she? She volunteered yesterday to collect funds and stuff, and then I think her partner, he also was volunteering. Okay, so we had some direct connection. I think that she also works with Shady O'Barrell House now, and I think they're hosting an after party. Okay, so that's kind of stilling over there. Yeah, excellent. So that's two days? It's just Sunday. It's just Sunday? Yeah. Okay. Feels like two days. Are you guys really involved with that? Out There Santa Rosa and the City Community Promotions Funding is sponsoring the event or providing event support, I should say. So we're involved kind of through that, and Out There Santa Rosa will have kind of a booth slash wandering presence there. But not specifically public art stuff, more outdoor stuff. Great. So the museum will also have a presence at the Railroad Square Music Festival. We'll have a booth with hands-on activities, primarily for children, but for children of all ages, children at art. But unfortunately, I won't be there because we are also that very same afternoon hosting a celebration of life for the artist, Jack Stuppin, so for anybody who knew Jack. Actually kind of sad he was 89 when he passed, so he lived along, but unlike Bruce Johnson where that was a very difficult celebration of life to go to at Luthor Bank Center just a couple of weeks ago. But on a happier note, the new abstract painting exhibition, Nature Abstracted, opens at the Museum of Sonoma County on June 17th. Two of the three artists are Sonoma County based, which is fun. So anyway, one for each of you. So I brought you all announcements for the exhibition. So I hope you'll come by. We will have the museum open for free to the public at our regular hours that day from 11 to five and reception with the artists from three to five. I also went to it afternoon opening. I think you don't know what it was. It's right on the corner of like E Street and you'd be like seventh or ninth. There's like a Sonoma power or a Sonoma clean power, Sonoma clean power. Which I really didn't know much because I don't know much about these things yet, but someone just grabbed me and said, come. And they had sort of had a curator come in and put in art. But it was interesting in that they were doing something like this. I thought that they actually hired this woman. It felt very kind of connected to something like that would be at the Sebastopol Center or something. I felt like many of the people were actually exhibit there, back there or some different that were, I didn't know all artists, but a lot of them, there was a lot of women in one man, but they artists were there, they had a reception. They totally like how to be party thing. And it's a really beautiful space and it is public, but it doesn't take public city funds. The way you may have it on your power bill, you can opt for a clean power. You can pay a little more. And they have other sources of getting the electricity that you get. I don't know if you do that on your own bill. We actually do opt for it, but it's just, that's where the money comes from. But anyway, just to say that, I don't know if you're aware of that and that that's interesting that they were doing that. Yeah, the person they hired, Vicky Comfort, who curated it was the arts coordinator when I was hired. So she was- Oh, interesting. Yeah, I met her briefly, but I didn't. Yeah, interesting. It was just a presentation and I don't know how open it gets or how many people can get in there because it's obviously private offices, but it was pretty big. I mean, it's just this space. Cool. It's also out at the Soys. Yeah. One more week. One more week. One more weekend. That's right, yeah. Okay. Okay, great. So you're being passive at these, I always want to get on it. Okay, thank you. Okay, now you have a chance for us as the opportunity to provide updates. Would anyone like to go first? I like the- Just our, you and I, our update with the last what we were doing was working on with Niko and that was brainstorming how we could use the equity training that we had and apply it to the application process, the call to artists and how we can make that more accessible to our local community and attract more people. Great. Community engagement has not met and Melanie is no longer on the APPC and over that task force. So I guess I have to regroup. Yeah, you do. I think when we address the whole kind of structure of each group next at the next meeting we'll have an opportunity, I think to either ask people if they want to switch committees or just assign our new member to the engagement. Great idea. Yeah, that's good. What do you guys, Nathan, do here? Well, we had a brief exchange about setting up a meeting and I think we haven't set a date. I don't think we've set it yet, but it's probably what it's next couple of weeks. I think next week maybe. We were gonna try to meet Nathan, Christian and I to look at the project plan for that fire station project. Yeah. Oh, cool. Yeah, I like that, that's great. Okay, any public comments about these, Kyle? Chair, no hands raised at this time. Thank you, appreciate it. So we'll move on to the next one. This time is reserved for the staff to provide a briefing on issues of interest. No action will be taken except for the possibly place a particular item on a future agenda for consideration. Great, I do have a brief item to share today. This could have fit under, oops, let me get the right window open. It could have fit under my project updates, but it's slightly outside of actual specific public art program. Projects, it's out there, Santa Rosa website, but I wanted to quickly show that. I know I showed that when we first launched it, but I wanted to share it again because it has a new page that we've created specifically for the public art program so that we can send people here to get their information about what we're doing as a slightly more engaging experience than the city's website. And it also introduces folks to the whole website. So this is the whole website that you can see when you go to outthereSantaRosa.org, you can search by these categories and you can also search by neighborhood. This is one of the most exciting things about our website is this map and the ability to search by neighborhood. So you can also click on the map itself and it will take you to that section of the website. So if you haven't explored this website, I encourage you to do it, it's pretty fun, but just for- It's all the way down. Oh, all the way down, sorry. Okay. This is how we're working in corporate. Oh, there we go. I haven't even checked this out yet. We have them add this footer so that we're promoting Live at Junior, right here on this page. And if you go to read more, it will take you to this page which shows each man each week. Yeah, nice. And this is just so much more exciting than what we can do on our city site and more engaging with photos and stuff. Yeah. And it links back to the city's website as well. So we can use that footer if we have something going on. Yeah, that's very cool. Yeah, very good. Okay, and then this, if you go into art, the first one in here is our public art program website. So this is now a dedicated page for the city's public art program. It talks about what public art is and then the committee. And then if you can click more, find out more, takes you to the site on the city's website that talks about when meetings are, how you get agendas, gives a slight update about things we're working on, just small little things with the SOA, little blurb about that, arts around. This link sends you two creative synomas. You can find out more about the whole program. And then we've got a section for recent projects as well. So folks can see what we've been up to. And then our art exhibits. Hey. What? Go Jessica. Nice work. And then our current opportunities with our facade improvement, placemaking. So anyway, that's really what, the main point of sharing that website was to show you the public art page and live at your page, just so that you can see that. But there's lots more to explore here. You can go into any of these categories and see just some really cool, local Santa Rosa stuff going on. And each one that you might click on will take you to a page about that. Venue or artist. And the goal is that it's categories by neighborhoods. You could find it if you searched by neighborhood as well. And we really just wanna direct people to that place. So then there's just a short little quote about why it's so out there. And then a website link or some link to get to that place. And so that's- And so if the department's putting this together, like which one is oversight saying that- That's us. You guys are specifically. Yeah. I didn't know if it was them. No, Out There Santa Rosa now falls under the Public Art Program. So it's, yeah. It's Jessica, myself with race as input as well. Great. And are you using a graphic designer to get some of that? Yes, we have hired an awesome design firm called Studio B and she and her team have really helped us get this new brand, this new look. They've developed this whole website structure. They've worked with local artists to kind of make sure that we're representing each neighborhood through actual people and artists and businesses who are in those neighborhoods. So be the main, the owner of the business has collected a group of people she calls Outside Insiders. Is that right? Yeah. Outside Insiders? Outside, Out There Santa Rosa, Out There Insiders. So that they're kind of like ambassadors for each neighborhood or each kind of like area that we're representing here. And this, we really talk about this whole campaign as kind of like an insider's guide to Santa Rosa, but focusing on kind of the more urban, kind of weird, Out There experiences that you can find in Santa Rosa. So that is all I have to share for department reports. I think it would be really good to keep Santa Rosa weird and getting it weirder because Santa Cruz has prided itself on being weird and it's not weird anymore. It's like so touristy and kind of mainstream and it's like, quit saying that. You guys aren't weird anymore. It's a lot weirder here than it is there. Well, that's good. We've made it above Santa Cruz on the weird one. Okay, anything else there? We could move on to the future agenda items. That's number eight. Any discussion about something that we would place on a future agenda? Something you might wanna think about talking or we also have a list below. The private partnerships, how ATPC could support community programs, budget for visiting artists and lectures, heritage walk, we could move those up to the agenda. We could vote to do that. Is that a vote? If we did that? Yeah. So Tara, we had that meeting with Laura Lee and kind of connected her project to the heritage walk. Did we want to, should we expand this agenda item or move it up? Yeah, I feel like there's probably more to talk about now that Floralie has brought another community member who actually was on Art and Public Places many, many years ago, had a similar idea to the heritage walk idea that we've since met about Jeff, the museum myself and her to try to see if we can combine efforts on that. So I don't know if we have a lot to report on but I think that it will probably be an item soon because I think if we can get a little bit more development I think we kind of had some question marks after our last meeting but I think at some point it would be nice for the committee to be more involved with. Maybe we can generate some ideas that can turn into some sort of reality. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Another thing I just wanted to, I'd like to put on the list to think about is when we were at that future, for what was it called? Forward. Journey to the Future. Journey to the Future event. It was like we were sitting on this big open space and people just coming up and talking to us and I was just there for like an hour and a half but it was just really hit me just how many people approached me because I had a name tag on and I was behind the booth and they really were like, how do I get connected? How do I, I'm an artist. I went to know other artists. I mean, it really felt like, obviously it was a small little piece of the, you know, but I feel like there's something there. Like we talked to some people from Petaluma and they had a much more kind of organic. They said they had like, they were located, it didn't sound like it's the same organization as us. They didn't get that vibe. But they were near like a lot of gathering spots and people just rolled in and I just thought, what if we had a little more facing forward? We showed up to different. I mean, I'm not going to solve it right now. I'm just saying the idea that we would be places and say artists come to our booths, you know, we want to meet you, we want to know you. I don't know, we do with that information. I don't know. And we can't promise. A lot of people think they're going to get us, get their friend connected if they give us their name. It's like, oh, it's not quite how it works, but I am sensitive to that. Especially coming out of COVID. Could we provide another lens or place for people to engage and be known? So I just want to put it on there, maybe. Right, then just objects. We could be about people to the community. I was involved with actually a Downey board member and then ultimately executive director of an arts council years ago that would do a quarterly, I'll call it a mixer since people kind of know what that is. But we call it the artist connection. And it was for anybody who is a creative, not just visual, but young musicians. And so it was just like a quarterly gathering. And in that case, there was a board member who had like a really cool warehouse space that we would just do in space. I mean, I could probably offer them. I know, it's a really cool space. Yeah, I could offer them. Also, you have it. Yeah, I mean, I could offer them museum. When we were going through our community connection gathering collaboration process post 2017 wildfires, we hosted a series of gatherings at the museum, which is really about collaboration and response to the wildfires. But then it became sort of this movable feast, right? It started with us and then ended up going through other locations around the city, well, actually around the county. And that's what I'm talking about. I don't think we want to be having to be responsible for everyone. But it's like allowing, yeah, creating an environment where people can kind of make some connection. Well, it's interesting because I proposed to Kristin Matts in that Creative Sonoma, the sort of the organizing sponsor of such because I thought, it should be more than the museum. We're an organization, but it should be something to have. But if we, because we don't have an arts council per se, and Santa Rosa, maybe this is the organization that kind of, and we could be sort of an organizer, even if it can be moved around. And it doesn't have to be every week or every month. But it could be at least on some sort of schedule. Yeah, maybe that's something we can add into the conversation about the task forces because I think the engagement task force could be the spearheaders of organizing a series of all of those types of events. What happened to the arts council? Well, they kind of went under and dissolved. Gosh, what was that? Like 2012, 13, like that? Was it even earlier than that? I can't remember. There were several issues kind of, I think, with their organization, but they just couldn't get happening anymore. So some of their programs, such as Art Trails, got picked up by other organizations. So Art Trails now lives within the Sevastopol Center for the Arts. Asda does art at the source, which is interesting that they oversee both. It's been hard, I think, for them. I'll bet. It could all work. I ran San Francisco open studios for a few years. And like running an open studio event because it is really tough. So does that go on a list or something? What I just said, is that how it works? Yeah, cool graphic. I mean, I think that, yes, I think it's a good item to put on those. But I also think it can be wrapped into other items. Yeah, I'm sure. And from earlier, we'll put the DX session on the art feature agenda. Yeah, I would like that totally. I was thinking about that DX session. I kept thinking about it as if we'd stop talking, but it could be interesting in the absence of it could have interesting purpose of something else to reflect that. I don't know. OK, great. All right. Anything else, people? I'm going to close that we adjourn. And the next meeting is going to be July 3rd. It's not a holiday that Monday. So don't be writing it off, because it feels like it is. I'm wondering, does anyone here know that they will be available to attend the meeting that day? Because we will have agenda items if we can get it for them. So July 3rd. The day before the 4th, yeah, the holiday. A lot of people are going to take it like a 40 a week. That's what we're asking. That could be a tough one. Yeah, I'll be here. I know I will be. But anyone else know they're going to nod or anything? I don't know. I don't know for sure. Yeah, I don't know. OK, well, probably near the end of June, we'll send out a little absolute like what poll type thing. We'll be here, yes or no. So that, yeah, we can check the corner ahead of time. Yep. OK, OK, great. Meeting is adjourned. Thank you.