 We're going to get started, and when our final panelists join, we'll have them come up. Good morning, everyone, and welcome to the Center for Strategic and International Studies here in Washington, D.C. I'm Jennifer Cook. I direct the Africa program, and I'll be moderating this morning's session. I'd also like to welcome our online viewers. This session is being webcast, and you can follow today's discussion on Twitter at CSIS Africa, and I think during Q&A we'll take some questions from Twitter as well. This is the second event in the CSIS Nigeria election forum in which we profile the voices of leading Nigerian political leaders, opinion leaders, civil society members to talk about the challenges in the run-up to the February 2015 national elections in Nigeria. The Ford Foundation generously supports this forum, and we're very grateful to them. Our first session featured Electoral Commissioner Professor Atihiro Jega and a really all-star cast of civil society members examining the role of INEC in organizing orderly, free, and transparent elections. A key takeaway from that session was that getting the technical aspects of the election right, registration, logistics, transparency, is an absolutely critical baseline for successful elections, but that it's not just INEC, it's not just that technical process, it's not just Professor Jega that will make or break these elections. These forthcoming elections will likely be very hard fought, a great deal at stake, emotions running high, and a deeply worrying security situation in different parts of the country. At the urging of participants at that first session, we brought together today leaders from the political parties, legislative, gubernatorial, although I'll explain in a moment, and from the party architecture to come talk to us, and asking them what their role and responsibility is in ensuring that Nigerians have the opportunity to make informed choices and are able to cast their votes in safety and confidence that their eventual outcome will reflect the will of the electorate. So we're delighted to have with us today representatives of the two parties. Let me say our roster of guests confirmed as of Saturday has changed quite dramatically as of this morning. Governor Yari, understandably, has stayed at home after a violent attack in Zamfara over the weekend, and our thoughts are with him and the people of Zamfara. But yesterday and this morning, we've also learned that none of the confirmed PDP representatives will attend because of a caucus meeting that was called over the weekend. So you'll see the roster is a little different than your agenda's show, but I think we can have a very good discussion nonetheless. We welcome the participants that have come. They include, and I think you have most of their bios with you. Salhaji Lai Mohamed, National Publicity Secretary with the APC, the All Progressives Congress. We have Dwaya Nakupe, Senior Special Assistant for Public Affairs with the government speaking on behalf of the PDP. We have Senator Baba Femi Ojudu, who's Senator from Akite State, a member of the APC. We have Femi Majameet, Senior Political Advisor to Governor Udugan, PDP. And we have Dr. Sanya Awosan, Senior Special Assistant to the President for PDP. Also joining us in the audience is Oma Jebe, a Senior Advisor to Governor Udugan as well. And I see that we have Ambassador Adifuye has joined us as well. Welcome Ambassador. Glad to have you here. So we thought in this session what we'll do is kind of have a format where I ask a question and we'll give each side five minutes to answer. So I will turn to Lai Mohamed and to Mr. Akupe to kind of designate who might answer. The guests have received these questions in advance and will alternate between the two delegations. That will take us about probably an hour, a little less than an hour, and then we'll open up for questions and answers. So just to start, and maybe Mr. Mohamed and Mr. Akupe, you can start with this one. We're roughly 10 months out from the elections right now. I wonder if you can share with us your perspective on the state of preparations, both internally as a party and externally in terms of the national level preparations. And we'll use that kind of as an opening statement. Where are we in this election process? If when you speak, you could press the button here. So why don't we start with Mr. Lai Mohamed? Thank you very much. Good morning, everybody. Well, at the party level, as the APC, you'll know that over this weekend, the party started its work congresses all over the country. And next week Saturday, it would continue with the local government congress, and then on the 23rd of April there will be state congresses, and by the 24th of May, there will be the national convention. Well, these congresses and convention are coming up now because as you know, the APC did not become a political party until the 31st of July, 2013. And within that time, what interim executive has done has been to put together the party by embarking on a nationwide registration of its members, and now we are going to congresses and conventions to elect officials and delegates for the party at all levels. I heard of that on Thursday, March 6th, the party also unveiled its roadmap to a new Nigeria, which detailed the parties' priorities in fixing the widespread feelings of the previous government since 1999, in order to bring hope and circle to the people of Nigeria. This manifesto, which we launched on the 6th of March, was prepared after a public opinion survey, perhaps the largest ever carried Nigeria, which was contracted by a party with the sole intention of determining areas in which Nigerians will want their government to focus upon. The results were even more revealing than we thought, because in that survey, 50 percent of Nigerians said things were not going the right direction, as against only 4 percent who said things were going the right direction. That survey also revealed that 60 percent Nigerians said they want the government to focus more on job creations, and 50 percent said the president was not doing enough to create jobs. While 59 percent of that survey said that the president was not doing a good job fighting corruption. This led us to believe that job creation, the fight against corruption, and insecurity are the greatest challenges Nigerians are facing today, among others. Of course, these are some of the issues that will shape the 2015 elections. In general preparations for elections at national level, we believe that not much has been done to engineer confidence among the populace that elections will be different from the previous ones, especially in 2011, in terms of credibility of the process. We believe in the enactment of necessary laws that will make the elections free, fair, and credible. For example, we believe the independent national editorial commission must decide that we would use a method that we are going to adopt a voting based on the biometric data system, which would believe to be the only antidote to rigging an election manipulation. Also, necessary amendments to electoral law have yet to be carried out, and this is key in ensuring credible polls. Our party also believes there should be a tribunal to summarily try electoral officers and send a message to all that, to all, that to begin manipulation and violence will not be tolerated during these community elections. Thank you very much, and thank you for sticking within time. That's great. Let's turn to Mr. Krupe with the same question. Thank you very much, and good morning, distinguished ladies and gentlemen. I have a problem here. The question you ask us is we are just about ten months away from the elections, and the state of preparations internally as a party and externally in terms of national level preparation. I have not come here to discuss politics in terms of performance, in terms of what the president is doing, and I don't think that is why the CSI has invited us. Basically, my understanding of this is, as it is usually American, you guys are interested in credible elections, you are interested in free and fair platforms, and it is a fact that in Africa and in Nigeria, we haven't really gotten there yet. We cannot compare any of our elections with what we have done, and I think in order to help the process, that is why you brought us here. We have reservations about discussing our internal affairs abroad, but we honor this invitation because we believe the American people and agencies in America want to help Africa and in Nigeria in particular. Aladilai Muhammad wants to restrict himself to the questions that have been asked. He must not, under any circumstances, cast aspersion on the president of Verdebrook or Nigeria, and if he does, then we will change, he knows me, we will change the theme of this discussion and we will change the mode of this discussion, but for now I will let it go. Yes. Thank you, sir. Good. Why don't you tell us what you have come here to say. I will go to that now. Yeah. In terms of preparation, in terms of preparation, in Nigeria, really speaking, the organization that is empowered to undertake this is Ireland, and we believe that we've got a good man at the helm of affairs. The elections that Aladilai Muhammad discredited in the 2011 elections was perhaps one of the best elections ever held on Nigerian soil. I remember Johnny Carson commenting on this election, Johnny Carson is a respected person in this society, and I doubt whether the American people will not take his statement credibly. It's not just Johnny Carson, many foreign observers passed comments and passed that election. There's no election, even elections that were held in the United States had their own issues. We remember the Florida matter, I remember the Nixon issue, but by and large, if the average performance is such that it does, you know, the better aspect of it does not affect the essence of the election, usually reasonable men will pass such an election as being fair, free and fair. If I could just say 800 people did die in the aftermath of that election. Correct. That was not because of the election, that was because there are desperate people in Nigeria who went and incited unfortunate, you know, citizens to go on a rampage and that is what happened. That is a problem in the country. It was not the process of the election that killed them, the election took place, it was free and fair, but because some people, you know, here in America, in Abu al-Bus said it, you know, for an election to be okay, you know, the winner must clearly, fairly emerge, and the loser must accept. If the winner clearly emerges and the loser is a sports, what can we do about that? This is what we should be discussing here, you know, we all should cooperate and ensure that even though there may be inadequacies in the system, provided the political parties are committed to true democracy, the President of the Federal Government of Nigeria said it in 2011, that he would rather lose the election and go back to Turkey as a President in Nigeria who lost election than to rig the election, and my man did here. I saw the President before I came here, what he told me to tell the American people is that he has not decided to run and that he is not desperate for power, and evidence has shown that in 2011, just a minute, ma'am, just a minute, just a minute, ma'am, in the 2011 election, in the 2011 election, the ruling party lost several states, including the entire states, six states in the Southwest, and some states, yes. We're going to have time. As we said in the instructions before, we would give each side five minutes to one person. Thank you. That's okay. That's all right. We'll be able to come back to some of these questions and issues in the question and answer. So we haven't gotten quite a sense of where you think these elections stand, these election preparations stand right now. The major part of the preparations that need to be done will be done by INEK. As for us, the APC is a very new party. They have problems with manifesto, world elections. We don't have that kind of problem. We don't have that kind of problem. This is an established party, duplicated, the only party that you find anywhere and everywhere in Nigeria. Well, I'm not coming here to lie to you. This is the truth. Okay. We don't have that kind of problem. Okay, thank you. We're not going to cast aspersion. Call it. Thank you. I would like to get back to some of the specifics, particularly in the government's role in this. Mr. Mohamed or Senator Odudub. Can you explain how your party is going to select the best possible candidates to represent you at the elections? How will you ensure that the party primary process is credible, transparent and democratic? Thank you very much. Let me start by saying that the world is one single humanity and whatever affects the people of Nigeria affects the rest of the world. And I believe today that there is nothing happening in Nigeria that is not known to the world. It's only in those dark ages that you could say, whatever is Nigeria should be said to Nigeria. I remember coming here some 20 years ago, again, under this kind of situation, and the concern then was that if there is problem in Nigeria, it's going to affect virtually all parts of the world. If Nigeria throws out just 5 million refugees, it's going to wipe out the whole of West Africa, and I know quite thousands of Nigerians who are carrying visas or, you know, cards that could allow them to enter into America. So we cannot, you know, be an island on our own. Nigeria, whatever happens in Nigeria, we affect you as it will affect Nigeria. So let me just say that we need to discuss frankly here today so that the rest of the world will not see Nigeria and how to come to our assistance. In terms of how, you know, we are preparing to ensure that the criminal candidates do emerge. As he said, some months ago we carried out registration of our party members, and it was a very credible, very clear and open thing, everybody queued and were registered into our party. And we have this data is available on our website and everywhere, people can access it. We are having our congresses now by May, we are going to have a national congress. We are going to elect our leaders, though we have now our interim leaders. And when the time comes, people are going to be called to signify their interest in contesting, you know, for the president, the vice president, governors and all of that. And again, we are going to invite the rest of the world to come and observe what we are going to do. We are going to ensure that, you know, whoever is interested, we address the congress of our party, that we address the people of our country, that we address the rest of the world, make their ideology known, make their programs known, and they are going to be asked questions. We don't do politics of big manism in our party. People are going to be subjected to questioning. And that was why I, you know, as a senator, you know, had to propose a bill that would set up a debate commission in our country so that anybody contesting for any public office must be made to go through public debate with his opponents. Because in the past, what we have heard is that people are called to come and debate running into election, and they will run away only for them to come and debate themselves. Have you ever heard where a candidate debates against himself, you know, that has happened in Nigeria, or called a popular musician to come and ask him questions on national television, and that is considered as a debate. This will intend not to happen, and we are going to call address of the world. For us to have credibility that is in Nigeria, you must ask whoever is going to rule us to be ready to subject himself to big question by the people of the country. We are going to set that example in our party, and we expect that when the general election comes, people who are going to contest against our candidate must also be ready to debate our candidate. I mean, the last election in America, even my 10-year-old daughter, you know, I mean, was always in front of the TV watching the debates in America, and he became so informed about the issues involved. Why then shouldn't our own leader be ready to talk to us, tell us how are you going to solve the problem of insecurity, how are you going to provide jobs for the unemployed? You probably must have heard about hundreds of thousands of Nigerians who were called to the stadium, now not to any hall to write an exam, to the National Stadium, as if we are going for a World Cup, you know, a World Cup final. They were called in there to come and other go tests. More than 20 of them died in the process. We are going to show you what we are going through, you know, in terms of unemployment. People are going to be asked questions about that. What are you going to do to provide jobs for our school leavers? What are you going to do to ensure that people are not being killed every day? Just yesterday, 120 Nigerians were killed in San Farag. Every day you go into these stories about Nigeria, people being killed. It is not Afghanistan, for God's sake, this is Nigeria. Problem of insecurity, unemployment, corruption. You keep hearing of $20 billion missing, $39 billion missing everywhere. We are going to ask questions about those things. So as we move on to the elections, you must see that there is openness, there is transparency. People must, you know, be ready to serve themself, to be questioned and being examined so that the right leaders could be chosen in Nigeria. Thank you very much. I think the idea of a national presidential debate is an excellent one. We'd be happy to host it here at CSIS too. Although I don't know if I'm going to moderate that. So to the PDP and I'll ask Mr. Koupe to designate. Explain how your party will select the best possible candidates to represent. And how you ensure that the primary process is transparent and credible. Jennifer, Fred is going to take this question, but we have to turn this discussion away from the conversation of the deaf. Is that people or the blind? This question you asked the distinguished senator was, how is this party preparing for primaries? How that went into and cascaded into also, you know, we must change this discussion. Otherwise it will become a conversation of the deaf. I also can pretend to be deaf. I'm not deaf. So let Fred take the question. Well, let me respond a bit, because I think you may have missed the introduction in this. This is really to get the two parties to tell not what the other party is doing, what the failures are, but what they're doing in terms of preparing. What is your personal role and what is your party's role, ensuring that these elections are transparent, free, credible, and peaceful. And I think, you know, the idea of having a candidate's debate in the primary and follow on is what's his response. The APC strategy. What is the PDP strategy? The APC has antecedents. None of the antecedents has ever deputed anything anywhere in Nigeria. I'd like you to answer for the PDP. Good morning. I think as a party, the PDP has an established democracy within the party. We have a constitution and we're not new, except for the APC. You know that in recent times where we've ever had elections. And one thing we know that we don't impose candidates, we're talking about issues, like really major issues. So our party, because we have a constitution, we have already an establishment of a candidate with a credible candidate. And even what happened with the delay in the state, so. And we don't have a problem with the candidate with an incredible candidate for elections. But again, like my little rally said, we're talking about how our elections can be free and fair, and how the America can come to assist us, so that we're talking about here. And I think we started talking about 20 billion, 40 billion, we all know. Because back home, even the figures that I've been able to establish. One breath is 10 billion, the same breath is 20 billion. So I don't expect him to say so, because he's in the Senate. He knows what is happening. So back home as a party, we have put everything in place, we're not new to it already. Because a little recently, like I said, even in the older state, we had the bi-elections. And the process was very transparent, very, very transparent. I was even an aspirant in that election. So the party, those who were interested came out with our issues. What do you think that they can do for the party? They can do for the people? They can do for Nigeria as a whole? Once they are convinced, the electorate, I'm talking about the delegates, once they are convinced to start with it, then you come out. Then anybody who has an opposing view can also come out. And the issue of the base is not new to us. We'll be having debates in our elections. So I don't know why the distributionist is saying that no, no debates. We'll be having debates, except that maybe he wants to make it a law now. Otherwise, because we need to bring yourself for an election. You must be able to face the audience, tell those who you're going to represent, what you think you can do for them, and also do as a party. So I can assure you that for us as a PDP, we don't have any problem. We already have established democracy. We already have a constitution which will follow in the APC that you're just coming out. You can't, I like what you just said, that you don't need a Congress issue of the law. So let them come out with their convention. It's only then we'll know that the APC will start or not. Thank you very much. Okay, back to our APC colleagues. What needs to happen? What are the priority things that need to happen to ensure a credible election process in Nigeria? And what can your party do to strengthen that process? Thank you very much. It's one of the most crucial questions, you know. Based on our nation's history of electoral failures, my party, the APC, believes things must be done differently in 2015. If Nigeria must return to the part of free and fair elections. Therefore, let me quickly raise through the following recommendations that my party believes will ensure a credible election process. The process is a biometric voter registration system. This will ensure that every voter's thumbprint is verified and matched with his or her picture to prevent multiple voting or illegal thumbprinting of ballot. Two, deep naturalization of elections. Two, deployment of troops and policemen is only aimed at intimidating voters. The materializing elections will also reduce violence. Three, ballot paper. This should be designed in such a way as not to confuse the voters. Also, parties that have no candidates in the election should not be included on the ballot. D, role of the media. The media must be more scientific in reporting election results. And must not speculate on results where new examples have been done. E, role of international observers. International observers must deploy beyond the urban areas to countryside where elections are traditionally new, lived by the party, by any party. As well as perceived opposition strongholds to observe elections. They must not be too quick to pronounce elections free and fear when all the details are not in. F, role of the international community. The international community must let the ruling government know that it is not just the outcome of an election, but the credibility of the entire process that determines a free, fair and credible election. They must be on a cubicle that they will not support any outcome of a flawed electoral process. G, voter education. Parties must educate their members and supporters on the entire electoral process and also all them to skew violence, which has made most elections. However, a lot depends on INEC, which must carry out a physical audit and identification of the polling units ahead of the election. Usually, they are eating polling units, not only to the ruling party. Out of any election, leadership of political parties with candidates in the election should meet with the electoral empire and they should jointly undertake a tour of polling units. Also, there should be no creation of additional polling units a few days before election. H, role of civil society. Society area, civil society has a role to play in educating the electorate. Civil society organizations to a large extent have been pocketed by the government in power, which usually coerces them to do the government's bidding by such measures as denying them grants or even accreditation. I, role of politicians. Politicians, perhaps more than any other stakeholders, have a role to play in ensuring the sanctity of our elections. Since they are the major players, their conducts and personal comportment will go a long way in paving the way for peaceful and credible elections. They must turn the dual-dial politics that has characterized elections since 1999. Looking ahead to 2015, politicians should not try to regionalize or ethnicize elections. As is being done today, they must not use the platform of the church or the mosque to converse for votes. Also, it is wrong to coerce endorsements from religious leaders by subject-fuge. A situation in which our president has been going from one church to another to make pronouncements on policies and issues is not good enough and must have fought with. J, opinion polls. In Nigeria recently, we've been witnessing all sorts of opinion polls that tend to distort the true situation of things. Considering the capacity to influence minds, these polls must be regulated to threat out the charlatans who are in the seat. K, based on our experience at the election that was recently conducted by Enec in Delta State and in Anambra State, it is important to address the issues of credible voters' register. Access for voters to cast their votes, deliberate starving of perceived opposition strongholds of voting materials, late deliveries of voting materials, late arrival of election personnel, and accreditation of political participants. Okay. Would you like to designate someone to answer from a similar? Yeah, this I'll take. Okay. We have to come from very practical perspective. The body that is empowered to conduct elections in Nigeria has already announced that it will be impossible for them to use biometrics. And if we are talking 10 months to the election, it is preposterous. It's not practicable for anybody to insist. That is the basis by which the antecedents of APC put booboo traps on the rule of elections. So when they lose the election, they will say because biometrics was not used. Biometrics or no biometrics, nobody is going to be specially favoured. So let us get that, you know, and let APC know that from now so that, you know, when elections are won and lost, nobody will say it is because they didn't use biometrics. That's why we lost. Now, I'm a politician. I'm a practical politician. And I've been in this business for 35 years. I've conducted, I mean, I've contested elections myself. I've won some, I've lost some. I mean, you know, I know what goes on at the polling booth. I know what, you know, these are practical things that we must do. When in Nigeria, people are called out to come and, you know, to come and be accredited in the morning between 8 and 12. You go there, they check your voter's things and you are accredited, you go away or you stay if you wish. Then at 12 o'clock or so, you come, everybody lines up and then, you know, and then cast your vote and all that. That is cumbersome and it's totally unnecessary. From our perspective, I think once polling opens like it's done elsewhere in the world, if a man presents himself with his voter's card and he's, you know, he's identified as a bona fide voter, he's accredited and he votes and he goes away if he wishes or stays if he wants. That's one. Number two, or even before then, sorry, the most critical part of the election, the most crucial part of the election and the most contentious part of the election is the voter's register. We have, you know, we cannot spare enough time to ensure that we get it right and for that APC, PDP, we must work together. We got to work together and help INEC, not distance INEC and say it is their job. Let us hold a meeting with INEC. This is essential to any successful election. You've got to have a list of those who are qualified to vote and you should be agreed upon by both parties. So if we got to do it two months before the election, so be it so that if there are arguments, if there are issues, we can resolve it so that we can avoid what happened, you know, in an Ambra State where there are two types of voters registered, some say this is the new one, some say that's the old one. My name is here. My name is not there. You know, I'm being honest. I'm being very, very sincere here. We want, we're going to win this election, but we want it to be really, really very clean so that nobody is coming to say because they lost because the system was faulty. No, we are more desperate to ensure that the preparation and the execution of the electoral process is transparent. If it were even possible, we would have even franchised this to foreigners to go on too, but for our national sovereignty and integrity. Now, you know, the voters register is so crucial. We must do that. We must get that done properly and we can work with INEC. We can, you know, both of us can work with INEC and ensure that this is done properly. Once we get that platform, that is the foundation of the election, they will then go to what happens on election day, which are two level accreditation and voting. Number three, votes must be counted at the polling booths. There's a city law in Nigeria that says that you cannot announce elections at the polling booth. That is fraudulent. It is not right. Once we vote and voting ends, the counting should be done at each polling booth or in the federation, about 200,000 of them. Simultaneously, there's technology now. It's not a big deal. We do have an election. You go for three days for a result. It's not necessary. You send this thing through your iPad, your phone, and everything is created somewhere. But everywhere voting takes place, let the results of the election be announced there and then. Haven't done that. I believe that party agents should be empowered and allowed to make a recording of the process of counting and the announcing of votes. So, you know, we reduce area of disagreements completely because every, every voting is local. There's no need to come to Abuja to come and hear any results. It's not necessary. In my polling booth, 560 people are registered voters, 350 turned off for election. You know, this is the number of people who have voted and we count it. We announce it. My agent, my party agent records it on camera, iPad, telephone, camera, whatever. So, it does a record in every polling booth. This can easily be, I mean, you can easily come back to it. And if there are disagreements, no, I've not finished. I've not finished. There must be very serious, very, very serious sanction for electoral malpractices. Very, I'm looking at, like, you know, you go to jail for 21 years. If you, if, because, you know, we cannot move in this country unless you have credible elections. And those who want to stop credible elections should be removed from our societies and put behind bars permanently if possible. So, you know, there has to be very serious, you know, you know, Senator, you know, you guys must go back, make laws that will ensure that you and anybody and whosoever will, will disturb this election, we go to jail permanently. And you know, when people know that you are serious about this, nobody wants to go to jail for anybody. The last point is this, in Nigeria, I know for a fact, I've told you, I've done this for 35 years, I know for a fact that people vote in one place while they are voting. Somebody is standing and this is the voter's card. You know, APC is here. Sorry, PDP is also there. And I press PDP or APC and I just shook somebody very quietly, seen it, it does this. The moment I drop my voter's card, I go somewhere not too far away, collect 1000 Naira or 2000 Naira. Anybody found giving money in, you know, at least one kilometer radius of any polling station should be taken as committing an electoral fraud and should be jailed also. Should be jailed also. So we remove money, we remove tuggery, we put transparency and Nigeria will be on its path to greatness. Thank you. Just to follow up, why is the Electoral Offences Act taking not yet passed? What is the party position on the electoral and then I'll turn to you as well. Let me first of all, before going to that, comment my this President Spokesperson for his candle on the Nambra election. I mean, I'm so happy to hear today that he's agreeing that that election, that that election, that that election is flawed. It's good to hear from him today. And I also like to commend him, you know, for his calling here for penalties for electoral offenders. And I believe that between our election, the President, we vote more money for us to build jails that we're taking a lot of those people from his party who have been known to dole of that. Now, let me say this. We members of people from our party, the APC, we have come up with several proposed laws in the Senate in the House of Reps to tackle some of these problems, but because we are in the minority, the majority have always ensured that that never, you know, pass into law. I give an example of a simple law, very simple one that look, let us have a law that will compel everyone who wants to go for public office to, you know, engage in debate. Again, it has only passed the first reading. Every effort we have made to ensure that this law is passed has been, you know, rebuffed by the majority in the Senate and in the House of Reps, considered by the PDP. Even this is a simple law that calls on the President to come and address us once in a year on the state of the nation has been rebuffed, too. In America, here, everybody in the world wait patiently for the President to address the nation once every year. How do you intend to rule a country that you are not ready to tell the state of the nation? That is still waiting. So even this law about jailing offenders is already there, proposed by members of the opposition, yet they have refute the leadership of the Senate, which is composed by PDP has, you know, refused to allow this to be passed. So that is that on the issue of our preparation. We have told them, look, 60 percent of Nigeria population is made up of young people. We are already mobilizing them. Majority of them are unemployed. We've told them, this is about you. It's about your future. Don't just sit down on Twitter and on Facebook, lamenting your state. Go out, organize, mobilize and be ready for this election. In my locality, where I come from, election is coming in June. We are mobilizing the young men, the young women. We've told them, look, we are going to go and equip yourself with internet-enabled telephones, record every moment of the election. We are going to enable some also with a secret pen. We have five, you know, persons deployed to each polyunit with, you know, with a camera pen and phone, record every moment of it. We have done it in the past. In 2007, we went for election there. It was rigged. We went to court. The court said, we should go back to court. We went to court again. And at that time, too, in that locality, we deploy secret cameras. And when we went to court, we downloaded a lot of these things and gave them as evidence. That was how they took that stolen mandate from PDP and gave it to us. We are deploying that at national level and I should not be saying this year, but I think I need to allot the spokesperson of the president to know that, look, we are not going to allow them a space this time around. This election is very crucial for Nigeria. It's a make or break election, the 2015 election. I dare to say that, look, if we fail this time around, we may not be back to discuss Nigeria. Because Nigerians are waiting bitterly for what they have to come out of this election is going to be. Nigeria of five years ago is not Nigeria of today. There are crises all over. Security, insecurity problem, problem of, you know, of economy and all manners of corruption is now gone beyond what we used to know in Nigeria. So, Senator. Okay. Mr. Okope, the electoral law, the electoral fences law, how, how, why is it not yet passed? Why is this a part of an issue? Jennifer, should I pretend to be deaf and just answer the senator or should I answer your question? What do you want to answer the question? The electoral law. Let's focus on it. I love you. I'll just answer your question. I will not answer the senator's question. Well, you know, you know, I expected the senator, the distinguished senator to talk more seriously about this. You know, this is not it's not home video. I mean, we're talking seriously. You know, it is directly in his purview. He is, they are the lawmakers. I only watch from the outside. And, you know, if there are intricate problems and issues, you know, I will expect him in the spirit of our current discussion here to enlighten us and to enlighten Nigerian public. But what I can assure you that I did what I say here, I do not speak alone. I speak with the force of the Nigerian government and we control the Senate, like as he said, and, you know, what I've said here, we will ensure that everything will be done. You know, you had the threat he's talking about. Wait, can I can I ask? Are you saying the opposition is blocking the passage of the electoral? No, no, I've not said so. I've not said so. I'm saying that what are the opposition? They have no capacity to block anything. OK, they don't have the capacity. Why has the what where why has the electoral? I cannot I cannot I cannot honestly and sincerely answer you truthfully before this distinguished audience. And I would not like to have a position on the electoral. It is in our interest that this law is passed, you know, just like the P.I.B. law. Thank you for that. You know, it is our interest that this law is passed. And I'm telling you that it will be passed for the election because we do not want any kind mantis when we win this election. We don't want people to say it was because of faulty days and faulty that we are going to do everything. You know, this president is committed to free and fair election. How many presidents will preside? We know, I haven't been I haven't won the election. We now preside over other elections in other states and we didn't lose such elections. We lost election in a state to APC. We lost election in a state to APC. We lost election in a number of states. So, you know, in legal states, in legal states where the state lost many local governments, where the electoral officers announced the results of our elections on television, the legal state government under the leadership of the leadership of the APC stamped it out and said the candidates can go to hell. These are people coming to the national secret. Mr. Coupe, OK, thank you. Thank you. The APC has no record of ability to conduct free of fair election anywhere in this history. OK. So what we got is that you are fully behind the passage of the election. 100 percent. Thank you very much. I was talking about that. OK. OK. You have a problem here. OK, back to the APC. Do you have a codified code of conduct for the election and what standards of conduct, whether in speech, action, will be put in place for election candidates and party affiliates? And how will you enforce them? Well, again, that takes us back to the reform of the electoral law. All of these things we are talking about, even the law on on campaign financing, they all contain in their proposed law. We've called and we've appealed, we've protested. There is nothing we have not done before we go into this election. Let this law be passed. Again, as he has admitted, the majority in the parliament, you know, we can only have us say why they have their way. It is I mean asking them to pass this law for them is like committed suicide. So and I don't see them easily committing suicide. But again, not you must not leave us only to it. The world must continue to press them to behave like the rest of the civilized world. Let there be law that will guide our elections. OK, what does your party in terms of a code of conduct in terms of rhetoric in terms of discipline, party discipline? What does the what does the APC does it have a codified conduct? How will you enforce it? Of course, that he has mentioned part of part of that. We are spoken to all our partikaders. Is it written? Oh, well, this is contained in our code of ethics, just like the code of ethics, you know, that look on no account. Choose anybody bring religion, for example, to the issue of electoral campaign. On no account must anybody be seen giving money out to anybody, you know, in the cost of voting. On no account must anybody engage in any act of violence. All of these are stated in our code of ethics that will govern our election and our government. And this we launched in Abuja less than two months ago. They are aware we are asking them to come up with their own so that we can we can match codes for code and ensure that Nigeria behaves like a civilized nation. We've done that and it's a challenge to them. They should either adopt us or come up with their own. And just to follow up, if a party affiliate violates that code of conduct, what will how will they be held to account? If a party affiliate violates that code of conduct, if you could remember a party violence or a candidate of your party, if the candidate does, he gets disqualified. Small fact, I don't know whether you read our guideline even to the Congress, we said that anywhere where there's any violence and can be traced to anybody, that fellow stands disqualified from contesting a platform for any other post. Same question to you. Do you have a codified code of conduct? Is it written and how will those who violate it be held to account? I am amused when APC, a party that is yet to be really truly formed and beyond the ground, is advising a party that is 15 years old, that has existed for 15 years and that has entrenched party ideas, party ideology, party policy and it is self-evident. You know, it's the only party in the general that has not changed its name, changed its logo, you know, changed nothing. You know, it has been consistent. You know, we are happy that you are documenting your own policies and all that, so that at least we have a very reasonable and fair competition. We have, you know, we have code of conducts, we have code of ethics, we have constitution, we have policies, we have manifestos that are tested. And how are those who violate them held to account? Jennifer, if we do not have a code of ethics and conduct, how will Governor Oshimole be sitting as a governor, elected governor of the state? We contested that election. That state belongs to the, you know, I mean, that states, you know, you know, we have the chairman of our beauty coming from that state. It was a monumental disgrace to us that we lost that election. We use everything that we had, everything that, you know, every restraint to ensure that democracy thrives in Nigeria. You know, we have, you know, for us, it is a non-issue You know, it is great that, you know, an upcoming party like APC is imbibing that and we are happy for that. At least then we are, you know, we're probably going to end up on the same page. We have, it is already documented, it is in practice, it is entrenched. You know, there's no doubt about it. It is also practiced. OK, can you imagine, but either side, writing a joint code of conduct on violence, on regionalization. We've got to get there. We should get there. We should get there. That would be good. That would be great. I'll understand. Let them also talk about that. A basic code of principles on rhetoric, on anti-violence, on non-religion, not bringing religion into it or ethnicization. Can you? I think if the Nigerian elites are serious at all, these are things that we must do. It's important. You know, we want to do it and, you know, we are prepared to spearhead that if they're willing to cooperate. And I do see why they should not cooperate, because at least they have, they have hope and aspiration to win. It's only when they lose that they're not turning within the upside down. Would you, do you envision a joint code of conduct between APC and PDP? You're committed. So we'll look forward to seeing that. OK, let me move on, because I do want to open up for questions and answers. But this is my final question, although I do have one more for you, Dr. Coupe. If you lose the election, on what basis would you contest the outcome and how would you do it? After the 2011 elections, as I said, 800 Nigerian citizens lost their lives in post-election violence. So win or lose, if the results are disputed and violence seems imminent, what will you personally and the party more broadly do to ease tensions? Well, I have no problem taking on that question. But I think you omitted another question, which is what will you do to promote an election campaign based on policy? Well, I thought because we're running a bit late. OK, thank you. Election is a process which will commence in voting on election day. Once the process meets international best practices in elections, once the integrity of the process is not compromised by dual dire politicians, once the military and other security agencies are not used to intimidate the opposition and its members and supporters, once the election is based on the parliamentary voting system that eliminates multiple or illegal voting, we don't have any problem accepting the outcome. But where that is not done and the election follows the same patterns that were witnessed in recent years. Then no one will accept the outcome. Of course, our party will not accept an outcome. We have a record or challenging flawed elections in court instead of resorting to self help. That probably explains why we also have a history of achieving some successes at election tribunals. But let me warn, even the court option today has been shot out by those who have bent on evolving in one party state. Those who are allergic to free and fair elections. This is because the constitution has now been amended and it gives only 180 days for anybody who has any problem with an election to conclude the case. Our experience in 2011 is that most cases were knocked out on the grounds that they had exceeded the 180 days, maximum 180 days. And this is very worrying. Now, we will accept the outcome of an election, which is free and fair, but will challenge in court any election that is not a process of a free and fair election. Thank you. Thank you. I think Dr. Awosan will take that from the PDP side. Well, thank you very much. I am most of the things that Elijah Lehm, Muhammad and my friend, Femi, are admitted here are mere superstructures and the superstructures cannot behave differently from the foundation. You see, the problem we have in Nigeria, one of the major problems we have in Nigeria is the inability of the opposition to submit itself to salient civic virtues. Civic virtues of responsibility, patriotism. These are important ingredients in political engineering. You will agree with me that the last election, the 20th level election, that was a job to be free and fair. Even before the conclusion of that election, members of the opposition began to make inflammatory statements. Nigeria will remain ungovernable. This election will be counted on the blood of innocent citizens. At the end of the day, you were all witness to what happened after the election. A lot of innocent lives were lost as a result of irresponsibility of the leadership of the opposition. Nigeria is greater than individual. Nigeria is greater than PDP. Nigeria is greater than APC. Until the political class, particularly the opposition, come to a level of understanding that whatever happened, even if I am injured as an individual, the institutions that hold the pillars of Nigeria must be defended. We will continue to have problems. Already, public trials and I've already been the the one that Laji Muhammad mentioned that we have to use machine. What is important is for us to agree that common concentration, we will defend the integrity of Nigeria We will defend the sovereignty of Nigeria. When the opposition loses a election, the election is not free and fair. Any day they win a election, the election is free and fair. When the court gives judgment against them, Nigeria judiciary has been brought over. Nigeria judiciary is irresponsible. You will agree with me that our controversy surrounding the judgment of the APC court. When the Justice Salami was there, I don't want to watch a dirty name in the public. For such occurrences, they are true, they are not that as long as it's favorable, the opposition. For us as a party, we believe in assuring that ethics are properly followed. Unlike the APC, they said, sorry, last point. The standard that the APC said they maintain, what is the same standard they maintain during their party in the state? A lot of people lost their life. Party leaders within their own party were harassed. I mean, I personally like to say washaba was the only kidnap. I mean, so those are not we asked you to speak to the PDP role. OK, I'm going to ask a final question because to Mr. Koupe, who works with the government and so has the government has a particular role in this and a leadership role in setting a model of conduct. So what can the government and you in your position do to promote a civil political discourse during the election period? Thank you very much, Jennifer. I think at moments like this, God deliberately puts people who, you know, will do things right. We're lucky at this point to have a man at the helm of affairs in the person of President Gulok, a village owner, a man that is already satisfied with how far God has taken him. He's grateful to God. He has done very well. As I said, it's not a campaign speech. Yes. I'm doing the foundation. I'm doing the foundation. I'm doing the foundation. The point I'm trying to make is that your personal role. Yeah, the point I'm trying to make is that government has a major role to play in the success of this election. Because, you see, in power, power in the hands of desperate people, no matter how you plan the election, can be totally destroyed. Mr. So, but this president will not do that. Let me repeat the question because I don't think you got it. OK, maybe. Yeah, you know, you know, I told you at the beginning there was issue of deafness. So, you know, let me hear you again. Maybe I should talk in the other ear. What can you do in your position to promote a civil political discourse in the election period? By creating a level playing field, by ensuring that the position is not molested or harassed in any way, and by being very accommodating, which has always been our disposition in all these matters, and by not being or not responding appropriately, effectively to the over-desperation and the overampecious pursuit of power by the opposition. That way, we believe that, you know, government will help. Thank you very much. I wish the President Spokesman could have put his heart and on his heart. Why saying those words? Thank God he is not saying this in secrecy. You've heard him and he said they are going to allow level playing ground. If and when they do not do that, we are going to call on you. To put that word right back to him. You promised us in Washington, why have you debited from this? All of you are going to be witness to the next election coming in Nigeria, and you are going to be our witness on that. We have made up our mind that we are not going to allow anything lying low. We are going to stone every term made by them. No, we are going to stone every term. We are going to stone every term made by them, not to allow the most of you to count. Thank you very much. Please identify yourself for the webcast. Thank you very much. Welcome, you distinguished gentlemen from Nigeria. My name is Samuel Okimban, I'm the Executive Director of the Nigerian American Leadership Council right here in Washington, a non-partisan independent organization. I got a few observations here and it's great to see how the political process is evolving in Nigeria. I think one of the best things that has happened so far is the emergence of two strong political parties. This is actually something to celebrate. It's not something to fight about. It's something to celebrate because when you win at this level, you win fairly. Are you deserve a part of your shoulders for that? Now, there's a question that Jennifer asked here on behalf of I guess all of us here that I never really get a response to and that is the primary process. It's really very important that the primary process be paid attention to and be seen as free and fair because if you cannot get the primary process within your own parties correctly executed, then you bring it up perhaps a flawed or a product of a flawed candidate into the space because the Nigerian American Leadership Council is totally non-Paris and I'm not going to certain things but in law as a trend lawyer from Washington DC, there's something called the fruit of the poisonous tree. And if you end up with the fruit of the poisonous tree, then you've already started out with problems and also I'm going to ask you to just wrap up. OK, OK, thank you. Although it's a good point. Yes, and then also the rhetorics, the decorum of the process. We'd like to see a lot more cordiality and decorum among the players than what we are seeing right now. We'd like to see the chief terms of PDP and the chief terms of ABC go out for a drink after the usual Hula Baloo and the fighting in the Senate and the House of Reps in Nigeria. Well, OK, so. All right, we'd like to see much more of that because I would tell you that there's a lot riding on this election. Nigeria must get this right. Anything that Nigeria does wrong embarrasses Nigerians, Nigerian Americans and embarrasses all of Africa. So you have a lot of responsibility on your shoulders. Thank you. Thank you very much. That was excellent points and a comment from a very important US based organization. Let me OK, let me. We'll try to keep them a little more brief, though. The gentleman in the back there and then we'll go here. Gender, gender, gender. Oh, OK. We'll get to that. OK. My name is Dr. Jonathan Obona. I'm a John Professor of International Security Studies at Washington Trinity Washington University and I'm also a candidate for the PDP nomination for the Federal House of Representative isn't it? I have a federal constituency. My question to honorable Muhammad is party neutral. You cited some statistics that says 50 percent of Nigerians says that the president that is president, Jonathan, good luck is not doing a good job. Fifty nine percent of Nigerians cited that he is not fighting corruption. My question to you is are you trying to tell the audience that 50 percent of Nigerians, you know the population of Nigeria, right, that 50 percent of Nigerian in your survey conducted a survey on 50 percent of Nigerians and 59 percent of Nigerians? Or if that is not the case, what is your sample size that you use to extrapolate that 50 percent of Nigerians says something is wrong? Thank you. Monished on the gender thing. Well, it's the lady here and then we're going to go to this section and it will take a first round of answers. No, the lady. Good morning. My name is Teru Dukoe, a student of American University Washington College of Law and doing a master's in criminal law and international law. So my question is we or I personally had experienced the elections in 2000 and when did we have elections? 2011, I'm sorry. And I realized that after that, a lot of people went to court and did a lot of suits and said these people didn't do this right and these people didn't do that. Right. So for the PDP, my question is how inclusive are you? Because we realize that as much as everyone wants to believe their party has the answer to every question, not everyone. You can't be an island. There are people in APC or the other parties who are also equipped to help Nigerians of our problems. Our problems is not a one party problem. It's a Nigerian problem. And you have people on the other side who are good enough to do this. So how much do you look outside your party partisanship to get people from the other side who could actually help you? And two, to the APC, how much are you willing to give up your partisanship to help them? Because you have people, but you might be keeping them because you think, oh, when we get power, we're going to be better and we're going to show the country that we could do this. We don't have that time. We're 50 years old. We need to move forward. So how long are you going to put that aside and start working together or 50 something? I'm sorry. Thank you. Let's take that initial set. Well, we'll take one more because that was in fact a comment and then two questions. So I think here, Carl, you were going to be next. And then... I'm Carl Levan from American University here in Washington, D.C. My question for the gentleman from the APC is how do you see a state of emergency in three northeastern states affecting the political climate for campaigning in an open and free election? And as a related question to the presidential advisors, what steps do you see the Nigerian government taking to either discontinue or to ensure that campaigning in places where the opposition has historically been strong that there's a climate for peaceful exchange of ideas? Sorry, I didn't get the answer. I didn't get that question properly. You want for the government? The gist, as you say in Nigeria, is that the state of emergency in the northeast, those three states have traditionally been states that have been popular with the opposition to the PDP. And so there's a legal question and also a political question of how you will ensure that elections can take place with open and free competition from APC and others. Professor Lai, we have a quick question on the sample size of the survey. That's just a quick answer. Yes, the survey was conducted by a professional firm, AKPD, and they interviewed 29,000... The poll conducted was in January. Samples size was 21,091 interviews across all 36 states. Margin of error plus minus 1%. Thank you. The question of kind of partisan, non-partisanship in kind of using the expertise of the other. Would you like to tackle that? Again, yeah, thank you very much. We realize this. And that was why when we were about to be formed, we consorted widely across the country. And that was why we were able to pick five governors of PDP who we know that in their intent and purposes, they can work with us and they have good plans and programs and ideas to develop Nigeria. In the Senate, we went also, after some of the senators, those who we know can collaborate with us for good governance, those with bright ideas, those with good intentions, we also brought in about 12 of the senators from PDP to join us. They are now members of APC. Of course, you're also aware of what happened in the House of Representatives. So, we'll be doing all of these at the local level, at the level of young people. If you look at this outcome of the last election, a good number of young Nigerians invested hope in the candidate of the PDP. They campaigned on internet, on Twitter. They were looking towards this man with young person in a PhD who is going to turn Nigeria around. Today, the story is different. We are reaching out to those young people. They are going to come with us, they are going to vote for us and we are going to ensure a bright future for them. Thank you. But do you have to join the APC to work with your party ultimately in the government? I think that was part of the question. Oh, that PDP to join with us? How would you work with members of the PDP? Yes. Or do they have to switch parties before you work? Well, there are so many who believe in us, we have not switched parties. We are working with them. We are living them there, land their ways. Let us know what is wrong with them, why they have not been able to turn Nigeria around. Okay, thanks. All right. I'll take that question on inclusivity. I think the senator obviously does not understand what bipartisanship means, really. That's the problem here. It's not a matter of APC joining PDP or PDP joining APC. The issue is that we've got a Nigerian problem, PDP in APC. At what point do you come together and see how to solve the problem? Am I correct, madam? Yeah, that's it. So, Mr. Senator, you got it wrong there. But the issue of inclusivity is crucial. And it is a failure of the elitist group in Nigeria. That is the basis of this problem. The elites in Nigeria cannot even defend their interest. They have not been able to identify, they have not been able to identify what we can commonly refer to as national interest. You see, I'll give you a classical example. You know, let me just give an example, just an example. One example. 30 seconds. You know, in America, there are issues of race, et cetera, et cetera. But you will not see a Reverend Jackson go to Europe or Africa and condemn United States. It never happens. It's not gonna happen. But what do you find? You find the volatility moves of this world, the air refines of this world, when they are pinched, they run to America, pick a rostrum and condemn their own country. So, you know, how do you relate and work with that caliber of people? We tell them we're gonna get there, but it's gonna take time. We'll get there. We wanna kind of stay off the ad hominem stuff too, so. Okay. What was it? The question on primaries. It was on primaries. Oh, primaries, yes. On primaries, I'm sure that everybody knows if another prime is, because society begins at home. And we as a party, I think we have learned our lessons, we don't want to impose any candidate or anybody any time again. Because I'm sure that one of the problem we were having was these differences were having primaries and we have sorted that out now. And when the most recently was talking about PDP going to APS, I'm sure only what happened then were some differences, those who were parochial, who were self-centered, because the hierarchy they made at our last convention, that's why they moved from the conventional ground. That was what happened. And for those, they were about serving, but two know that, ah, no, they were making them, basically they've come back to PDP. So I'm sure that even the rest who are there now, they know that strict bedfellows, they'll come back. So they just say that they are doing so well and that has nothing to do with our party. And one of the major problems that we have said are we impose candidates and they join the primaries who were in short level playing ground for all last brands. And of course, like I said earlier, we have a constitution and if you want to contest for any elections, if you think you are calling for it, you come out to convince the electorates, convince your party members that you are serious. And once you convince them, of course, then you go to, you go for the primaries. And once it's leveled, of course, any candidate makes it, everybody will, that's all. Like I said earlier on that, only in October here, I was in Asperian for the bi-election in my state, it's just a data center. And of course, we went there and one candidate made, and nobody even went to court. So what I meant to say is that we all know the importance of primaries. And most of the problems parties are having is once they are not satisfied, they tend to move to other parties who will do that. We're sure that the ground is level for everybody, anybody who wants to aspire for an office, you indicate your interests. And once you follow the due process and you're made, of course, the party will follow you. So we don't go to impose any candidate. We have the rules out there, we have the laws out there already now. Once you confide yourself, then all of that's all. So, and for the APCs, tango is not a national party now. So let's see how it goes with the primaries. Let's see even those who are there now, what are they, won't even move to other parties because we know what happens in the APC. Okay, thank you. Leader, please come here. Thank you, thank you. That can become the candidate of the party. Thank you. Primaries, quick word, and we'll try to keep the questions and answers. It's always amusing when people talk about internal democracy, as if they say one pill for all diseases. Internal democracy in any party must follow the constitution of that party and the guidelines of that party. In APC, we are proud of our tradition. They mistake our cohesion and our discipline for imposition. It's not so. We have a very robust internal democracy and you can see what happened even on Saturday. We are the world congress where every registered member of the party killed behind a poster or the candidate is our choice. And that is the bedroom of democracy because it's only the world congress that is by direct election. It is those who are elected at that world congress that will become delegates to look at government congress and state congresses and national convention. In our party, we are very concerned about internal democracy because a party that last term democracy cannot give one when it comes into power. And there's even much more than that internal democracy. If you don't have a transparent credible primaries, you are going to have a lot of disenchanted members. It will not vote for you at the end of the day. So it's in the interest of our party or any party for its own self-survivor to ensure that there is internal democracy. We want you to judge us by our constitution and by our congresses. But I can assure you that no party can survive in the long term without internal democracy. Thank you. Okay, let's get to the question of the northeast, which is a big uncertainty in these upcoming elections. We'll turn to this side first. Who would like to take that on? Which one is up? The question of the northeast to this strategy for. Well, on the northeast, it's a major, major, it's a major challenge. Here we have very serious insurgency activities. People are still being killed, bombs are still being thrown, and any time there is a gathering of people, it's a challenge. Even marketplaces are a danger point. So these are issues, which I think the lady here was talking about on issue of bipartisanship. We cannot have the audience as alone. We've got to sit down and work this out with INEC, with APC, and what we're gonna do. Because you're worried about security, you're worried about safety and lives of property. The insurgents are looking, you saw what happened at Farnistan. The Taliban promised that they're gonna make it impossible for elections to take place, thank God elections did take place. But even two journalists were killed. So we've got a delicate balance here. It's a non-partisan issue, and it is also a legal issue, like you rightly said. Because the people there are entitled to take part and participate in the electoral process. But the government also has a right, I mean has a responsibility to ensure that the people, while they're exercising their right, are safe. So these are issues that if I were to sit here and tell you, oh I've got the answer, I will be fooling you and I will lie to myself. The truth of the matter is that what our young lady has said here is what Nigerians must bring to fall. We've got it on a bipartisan level, sit down and without sentiments, critically examine this matter and find a solution to it. Thank you. Senator. Thank you very much. This is an area that is of special interest to me. I'm a member of the Committee for Defense and Army in the Senate and I've taken a three-day tour of these affected zones. And I think I can speak with more authority on this than our brother who sincerely, you know, they've not tried to even visit the place at all. Now, if you go to that place, it's a whole devastation. You have an entire town already destroyed. You have places, so many towns, without schools any longer, without churches or mosques, without police posts, local councils have been destroyed and all of that. Yet, and I'm serious about this and I know what I'm saying, a lot of what I know I cannot say at this forum for security reasons, but I know we have a major problem on our hand that call for all of us, all Nigerians to come together and find a solution quickly. If we do not, if we do not, I mean, I can tell you that it pertains a lot of danger, not only for the noticed, for the entire country. You was a part of attacks in Benwe, which is in Mindu Belt, in Nassarawa, in Katsina, in Sanfara. For me, I'm seeing a trend, you know, that may, you know, in no long time, move to Kogi State from there, maybe, God forbid, to Maikiti State, on those states or those states. I think there is an agenda. What that agenda is, I don't know yet. We are still trying to figure it out. But thank God, my brother is there. It calls for more seriousness than we are given to eat now. If this thing continues and moves as it is moving now, for God's sake, that election of next year may not be realistic. And we should ensure that election is realistic. Let us all work together. Let those who are holding power at the executive level, who are the commander in chief of the military in Nigeria, of the security forces, let them do more than they are doing now so that things can be better, you know, not only in that region, but across Nigeria. There are problems. Thank you very much. I see the issue of insurgency in the Northeast, I think is probably the single most serious issue challenging facing Nigeria today. And I think this is one area that the APC has offered not just suggestions and solutions, but has really told the government that this is not a matter that can be politicized. This is a matter where both the APC and the PDP and all the stakeholders should come together to address. Unfortunately, the government of the day has not distinguished between the message and the messenger. Now, incidentally, our three governors, that is Yobi, Bruno, and Adamawa, are frontline states in the Northeast. They are the ones that actually feel the pinch of the insurgency. They are the ones that lose subjects every day. They are the ones whose economy is not working. They are the ones whose schools have been destroyed. They are the ones whose markets have been destroyed. Therefore, they are the number one and primary stakeholder in this issue. So when a governor from a frontline state, for instance, goes to the president and complains out of desperation, he's not criticizing the government. Point of order, point of order, point of order. The question was, the question is, it's got to do with elections in the Northeast. If you want us to talk about Boko Haram, I am more than a person to do so. Allaji Mohammed, point of order. Would you respect? Point of order. Would you respect? You can't talk about insurgency in the Northeast without talking about Boko Haram. You can't talk about the election. Excuse me, please. You can't talk about whether election will take place or not without actually talking about the reason that for the Boko Haram. Okay. Until and when you are able to address the real causes of Boko Haram. And while you really are able to address the resolution, you will not only not stop elections from holding, you might even stop elections in the whole country from holding. What we are saying today is that what we have in the country today is what I call the strategic stalemate. And I believe that until and when we stop politicizing and factoring 2015 election into the way we address Boko Haram for so long without being a solution. Thank you. Okay, thank you. One minute to Mr. Okubbe. Thank you, Jennifer. Basically, I said it before, this is not a conversation of the deaf. The question the gentleman asked was, how are we going to ensure that in spite of the security challenges in the Northeast that elections still take place? But because Lime Mohammed has gone beyond that. Okay, no, no, no, you're not going to be able to go. No, because he mentioned the advice to the president and he also mentioned that a particular state governor came to the president and complained. That particular state governor did not know what he was talking about. He said that the Nigerian army was not competent and cannot contain Boko Haram, which was an absolute fallacy. It is wrong, it is untrue, and I do not expect you here and at this forum to raise such issues. Okay. It is nonsense. Let's, let's, let's, okay. This is one of the reasons, yeah. Let's go to the gentleman in the front row there. No, here, yeah. Femi. My name is Saad Farouk Mohammed. I'm from Zomfara State. I feel the questions raised are clear enough to give one the opportunity to predict the reactions or the preparedness of every party, as far as fairness and the maintenance of peace is concerned in the next coming election 2015. We know the antecedents of PDP as far as internal democracy is concerned. I have experience of what happened in 2011 in my own state. Keep this very short and make it a question. So what I am trying to say is why has PDP not said what it is doing internally as far as democracy is concerned? In terms of incorporating or harmonizing the interests of those people that they are coercing at the moment within their faults. One we know that most of the crises that follow elections are generated based on the satisfactions from lack of fairness by candidates. Okay. Yes, the gentleman, yes, yes, yeah. I feel like I've won the lottery. Thank you. My name is Chime Sonye. I'm the executive director of Niger D.C. We're a group of leading Nigerians connected to America's capital. When Nigerian thought leaders come to Washington D.C., we love to talk to you guys to hear about the condition going on. We have a standing invitation for any of you if you wanna talk to our group. And we've been doing that for a little bit now. My question is, I have a question for the PDP and for the APC. My first question for the PDP is to push back a little bit on the question of deaths. I actually think it's important to talk about certain types of deaths. The question of what? Debt, people who died. For instance, the young people who died in the stadium. And why I think it's important is because it seems to distinguish one party from the other. APC, for instance, moved to sanction the minister, et cetera, for the issue. And I didn't hear that from the other side. And young people and the role they play if they don't have jobs is very important in the elections. We saw what happened in 2011 with corpers being killed. We know that young people are ones that go and snatch ballot boxes, et cetera. So whether young people have jobs is very important. In the last election, I'm a director of an organization and we hosted the first-ever youth-focused presidential debate. We didn't have President Goodluck Jonathan there. We would like, and so I would like to ask today if you guys would commit whoever was fielded to be part of our presidential debate if we ever hosted another one. And if that's not the case, I know President Goodluck Jonathan is fond of media chats. We would be more than happy to have a youth-focused presidential media chat. Often this happens with journalists, but I think one focus with young individuals would be great. My question to the APC individuals today, I don't really know how to distinguish APC and PDP. I understand that PAPC talks about themselves as vanguards of change and progress, et cetera. But when I look at it, all I've really seen out of APC outside of political institutionalization, i.e. voter registrars, et cetera, the overt political action I've seen is when you connected the idea of the budget, whether passes of the budget would happen to destabilization in Bialsa. I don't know if you understand what I'm talking about. You said there was a crisis going on there and you would not pass any legislation unless that crisis was resolved. River states, thank you, river state. And my question to you, so that's from my understanding that's one of the biggest political actions I've seen outside of who you would field for candidates. And I was curious why you didn't use that opportunity to pass things like the national health budget, the electoral alliance. Why didn't you condition that on passes of an important piece of legislation for the Nigerian people versus the crisis that was going on in river state? Thank you. Let's take one more. We have a lady here. Yeah, who? Hi, Regina Campa. I work for a company named Seidel that provides technology for elections. And my question is regarding the Aspera. It's my understanding that they don't have a right to vote in these upcoming elections. We're talking about 17 million people. And if any of the political parties foresee any changes in the future elections. And come back. So we had a pushback on the primary process. We had questions from the young man here. And you want to? I listen to him, really. Well, you know, he was talking about fairness and why are we not making efforts to bring up? In terms of democracy. In terms of democracy. And I'm amazed because, I mean, you know, the Nigerian electorates are so politically differentiated to the extent that they have used and they retain the capacity to punish any party that fails within its own system to be just. It has happened in Lagos before. A particular candidate, a particular primaryist was killed and was organized in the wrong way. The Lagotian said, OK, then it was AD or something in a Balajabi time. NRC and SDP. Yeah, NRC. Though the population, you know, mainly was SDP, but they decided to punish the party that was unjust and gave the victory to NRC. You know, at that time, NRC did not really qualify for that. So I want to assure this audience that, you know, in terms of internal democracy, there's no need for us to come here and ban time and talk and all that. The Nigerian population, the voters are waiting to punish those who will be unjust. So gentlemen, you don't need to worry about that. You will see it happen. No, again, it's about the antecedent. Well, antecedent of PDP, yes. You know about antecedent of PDP, I don't know. Which party are you in? Which antecedent are you talking about, antecedent of PDP? Because I don't understand what you mean by that. You don't need a mic for that. Because I know. OK. OK, OK, OK. But I'm sure that you have heard me. I'm sure you've heard me. I've said it repeatedly here that in position of candidates won't happen in PDP. Again, I said it before now. And I also said it to you that if you recall what happened in our last convention, some persons, ones that is grounded, they are not satisfied with the way Prime Minister come here, leave the party. Like Malina Ali said, once permits are not free and fair, of course, we all know the consequences. And nobody is going to do that. We are the biggest party in the whole of Africa. We were put out in order. Like the new political party that just broke up now. We're waiting now. They're not a national party. Let's see how they will conduct their own prime minister. It works. Thank you. Sorry, I think it is essential to emphasize that political parties are indeed very important in reviving democracy in any society. And I think looking critically at both parties and be objective now, I think where we have the problem actually is with the APC. The APC do not believe in two-processed, when it comes to the selection of countries. And I think we have to work on that. I don't think the mutual recriminations really serve the constructive dialogue here. So let's hear from Mr. Mohamed. Thank you very much. I think the young man, you asked two questions. The first has to do with what is the difference between APC and PDP. And to the best of your knowledge, the only thing you know about APC was when APC decided to direct its members in the National Assembly not to consider executive bills until and when the rule of law is restored in river states. Now, I think it's very important to give a short background to that. What happened was that we had an anomaly in river states. River states, as many of you will know, is one of the 36 states in the Federation. And there was some disagreements within the party, within the PDP, and especially between the president and the governor. And we noticed at that time that the commissioner of police in that state became the de facto governor. So we, on our part as a worker party, we made representations. And I think the both chambers of National Assembly also went and conducted the investigations and they recommended that the police commissioner be removed. These recommendations were not hidden. That it's got to a point where lives and properties belonging to APC members in river states were not safe. So we directed our party in the National Assembly not to consider any executive bill until and when normalcy was returned to river states. Now, and I think this is a normal democratic tool. As to what is the difference between APC and the PDP, I think it's exactly what we did on the 6th of March when we unveiled our roadmap to New Nigeria, which is a manifesto. And if we go to www.New NigeriaNG, you will see our roadmap. We talked about what we're going to do when we win elections. It starts from job creation, to fighting corruption, to healthcare system, to housing, to security, to agriculture, to housing, and to security and peace. So please, if you go to www.NewDangeriaNG, you will see exactly why we're different from the PDP. Thank you very much. Okay, thank you. Diaspora. And Diaspora. And Diaspora. Again, let me say, particularly here, that members of our party, particularly at the National Assembly, have been at the forefront of fighting for the rights of the diaspora to vote. The bill for that was proposed by Honourable Abike Dabri of APC in the House of Reputative. And we have been campaigning. Our party have been fighting for that. Again, as we said, we have our say, they have their way. But I can assure you by next year, when we are in the majority, we are going to pass this bill, because it is very important. If you know the only between the diaspora and the people at home, you will know that look, they are sacrificing a lot for the betterment of our society. Many are going to school today because of the money they receive from diasporas. Many are surviving today. A good number of good things are being done by this. They are enlightened. There are thousands of Nigerian professors abroad. Hundreds of medical doctors abroad. With their input, Nigeria will become a better place. They are well informed. They've seen it all out there. Nobody can buy their vote with 1,000 error, you know? So, and I believe that if they are allowed to vote, it's going to make a big difference. That is why the majority is sitting on that and not allowing to happen. Most distributed, I don't understand. Each time the bill is not passed, it's PDP. Okay, yeah. Why are you always saying so? I'd like to hear what the PDP position on diaspora voting is. Well, let me help the senator. The diaspora organizations and members are people that, I'm not talking about PDP, that President Junatan and this government take very seriously. You will see that there's a lot of inclusion of members of the diaspora, even in the cabinet. And they're doing very, very well. Aganga is one of them. Okoji and Walai himself is one of them. And in terms of voting. No, I'm coming to that. And also, when we have a group of Nigerians who are through their efforts and their sweat and their labor are able to remit in the excess of 32 billion U.S. dollars a year into the Nigerian economy, we've got to take them serious. The problem we have, and this is the problem of Nigeria, this is not a partisan issue. And Senator, you know that better than anybody else. Just hold on, sir. What is stopping the diaspora from voting is not any law. It is the question of practicability. The people who are in Nigeria presently are unable to vote effectively and for their votes to be counted. So we have issues with that and we're still working with that, not to talk, I mean Nigerians are virtually everywhere in the world. I see this lady say that she works for a technical company that helps. These are the kind of things that, when these type of things are, you are requesting for biometrics voting pattern and we have not even been able to, we should be there. That is, Ghana is already voting using biometrics. So Nigeria also should be there. But we've got to take it one step and within the shortest possible time it's not a matter of legal framework. The diaspora will inevitably be part of the democratic process in Nigeria. I can give you that on very good authority. Okay, at time, I want to ask one final two minute or three minute question to each side and then we're going to turn to Ambassador Adefu Yehia who wanted to say something very brief to wrap things up. Because we're here in Washington, we want to hear from both sides kind of your final message today to a U.S. audience and your priority questions and I hope you'll be specific and brief in terms of what you would look for from the United States government in supporting peaceful, credible elections in 2015. Why don't we start with a lie, Mohamed? It's a message today. That you would like from the United States government in terms of support. There's no doubt that Nigeria, as Nigeria inches towards the 2015 elections, all eyes on Africa's most populous nation. Why many cities elections as a watershed and an opportunity for the country to turn the corner and get its elections right? Others, including many people in this country as skeptical and doubtful about the conduct and transparency of the elections. If history is anything to go by, Nigeria has hardly come close to holding free and fair elections. We're more so away from the quality of elections and integrity of the process that was achieved during the June 12, 1993 election. So that time what we've had of experience has been election after election has been systematic and near criminal manipulation of election process. In most instances, the brazen right of election results took center stage. These three ladies and gentlemen, Nigeria today stands at its crossroads. The direction it turns with regard to the conduct of the 2015 elections will determine whether democracy survives or remains perpetually threatened. On behalf of my party, the APC, I would like to thank our friends at the Center for Strategic and International Studies for their invaluable efforts to contribute to the success of our forthcoming elections. We would ask that the U.S. and all foreign nations that are friendly to this contemporary democracy should insist on the process not being flawed rather than the outcome. It is the interest of the whole of democratic world that we're going to try this time. Elections are not rigged only on election days. It is a process that leads to election day that are so crucial. And I'm happy that we both agreed on one issue that is incredible voters register. If the voter has no access to cast his vote, that election will be flawed. And the experience we had in Anambra State where we had a different sort of register given to political parties and a different one on election day where most people run around they could not even find their names. Situation where even the chairman of the commission had to admit that yes one of his officials was induced with money to disenfranchise thousands of people where registers are so manipulated that names starting with a particular alphabet removed from the register will not make for a free and fair election. We're not asking for much. We're only asking that let there be a voter's register which is credible. Let people be able to vote and let their votes count. Thank you very much. Thank you. Jennifer, very distinguished ladies and gentlemen. It's been a great and wonderful opportunity for me as a person and representing the president of Nigeria to participate at this occasion. And I'm also deeply moved and gratified by the fact that there are people outside Nigeria who are very much interested in the welfare and well-being of Nigeria because if we do not get the process of electionary properly and regularly done well it will be difficult for us to join the rest of the world. And for these CSIS we thank you immensely and we will distinguish gentlemen and ladies here. I also extend my gratitude. I want to assure you and I'm not being partisan here and I'm also not campaigning. This is the truth. The man at the helm of affairs presently is a man that is committed to rebuilding Nigeria and he agrees and he recognizes that the starting block of this is by having a credible free and fair election. He has distanced himself and he has resisted party pressures to intervene in elections that have taken place since he became president and to ensure that the will of the people are not thwarted. And I'm talking seriously and these are facts. There are many elections that have taken place both by elections and state elections where PDP under the watch under the watch of President Gulok Jonathan has lost elections and he has refused to participate. He has refused to influence. He has refused to influence anything on his table in 2011. He said and I quote, my victory is not worth the life of any Nigerian and that nobody should do anything in terms of violence in order to assist him. And he promised Nigerians that the election will be free and fair and to the best of my knowledge and to the best, I mean, to the best that I have had from the observers, international observers, it was adjudged as one of the best elections ever. I will be the first to admit here that we are not there yet. We are not and we cannot be there yet. We've had a checkered history with military background, military interregnum, alternating with civil civilian administration and all that, we are not there yet. But where there is a will, always there is a way. And there's a commitment from this present government that there will be a will. This government will ensure when Professor Jega was appointed as the chairman of the Electoral Commission. The president came to the public and said he has never, ever met Jega before. This is not what a desperate politician will do. He has never seen him. He has never had a relationship with him. He asked for people to give me a list of credible Nigerians that can fit this bill. And out of that lot, you know, they picked this gentleman and he immediately instituted him as chairman. And- Mr. Coupe, in one minute, the U.S. room. Thank you very much. We are going to continue to improve on the electoral process. We are going to try to continue to improve on it, give the support that is necessary to the electoral body to ensure that they perform their job very well. For the United States of America, a good friend, a great friend of Nigeria, it gives me great pleasure to stand on this soil to talk about another great nation on Nigeria. You know, we are, our destinies are linked. You know, we are today, what America is to the world is what Nigeria is to Africa. And of recent, you have just heard, Nigeria has been declared and, you know, has been recognized as the largest economy, the largest economy in Africa. And I know that the United States of America is, I mean, used to be one of our great, I mean, one of our largest traders. So, you know, we have a destiny that is interlinked and I'm not surprised that you are interested in our well-being. What we will need is in the area that you have, you are evidently superbly much ahead of us in areas of data collection, data processing. It is so important for us to get assistance from the U.S. in the area of building up a credible voter register. And I think you are quintessentially qualified to give these assistance. This is a major support that, you know, that we will, you know, we will desire because that we create a major level playing field so that everybody in Nigeria can be comfortable. Distinguished ladies and gentlemen, I thank you very much. God bless you. Maybe just a very brief final comment. Jennifer, I'm sorry it will not be as brief as you say because these are, I would try. Please, please. No, no, no. This is the main reason why I'm here and I really do have to put a few things in perspective. Well, no, no. I will try to be brief. Thus, I want to direct my intervention on my conclusions to three states of people. First to CSIS. Let me say we thank you most sincerely for this meeting. And you in particular, I don't envy you for moderating this debate. And I can understand why you said, whether it's a debate, you will not like to be the moderator. The thing is that what this meeting has shown is the vibrancy of we in Nigerians. And I don't want to thank you for that, but one thing, the topic was about the elections 2015. And the only, the only mission I thought, I know Jega was here some weeks ago, but I would have thought that there's somebody from INEC here to respond to a few of the questions through that INEC. That's number one. Number two, I do know Jega as a person. And I knew his background. And what doing said about the way it was appointed, very correct. And I know him and I as a person have observed elections when I was the director of Africa in the Commonwealth. I've observed 35 elections in 15 countries. The 2011 elections in Nigeria was around among the best conducted. And I must say, you may disagree with me. You may disagree with me. But we had a seminar here in which all the participants, all the election observers from here, were there. And that was two days after the presidential election. They were here, and they testified to that. And included people say, I'm coming, please. Is it meant to be a final wrap up? Yeah, I'm coming. Also, what this has done, as demonstrated to our friends here, is that I know the Arambra elections was flawed. But the embassy and the Nigerian government, through with the US, we are making efforts to ensure that the voter register is put in place and that we satisfy all Nigerians. And to our American friends, I will say this. You see the vibrance of Nigerians? We are committed to a free, fair, and credible election. Whatever happens, all those amateur critics who see an possible end to Nigeria by end of 2015, those pundits who are in Nigeria for two weeks and come back to be experts on Nigeria, we have gone through a lot. We've gone through civil wars. We've gone through military coups. We even have to invoke the drunkenness since the one time or the other. But we are determined to have a Nigeria that is democratic, that is stable, and secure. I can assure you, we are going to have 2015 elections. There will be protests. There will be court cases. By the end of it, Nigeria will survive. We shall survive as a country. Thank you very much. That's a great note to end on. Finally, finally, finally, let me say this, please. Let me say this in sentence. I enjoyed this discussion. It wasn't as heated or controversial as I thought. And those who are conducive are congratulating you for the way you have handled it. The only thing I just want to say that next time, let us restrict ourselves to the questions. Do not let us come and watch our linen in public. Campaigns are meant to be conducted in Abuja. I'm saying this to both sides. Not in Washington, not anywhere in America. The base of what is happening, those contextual issues, should be limited to our country. Not here. The embassy will resist. And I'm saying with all the forces at my command, the embassies will resist any attempt to make America a campaign ground for Nigerian elections. We are going to resist that. Talk issues, and I'm talking to both parties, go and discuss your campaign in Abuja and other cities. Don't come here and have political beacons, counter allegations, exposing our linen to the public before the Americans. Let us, the transnational, don't do that. And I will not sit here and see that being done. Thank you. Thank you. Just, I want to say thank you to our panel once again. A lively debate. We love dirty laundry, Washington public. We hope we'll stay in touch. I'm glad that you're the possibility of a joint statement, a code of conduct, a lot of agreement on the voter registers, the Electoral Offenses Act, and a debate. So we'll look forward to this. And thank you all for being patient and joining us today. Thank you. Thanks.