 I think I'm going to start, I think I'm going to start because we want to give these gentlemen the full time. So today we have Radesh Balakrishnan, our general manager of OpenStack from Red Hat, and Dwayne Decapiti, Director of OpenStack Product Management at Cisco, and these gentlemen are here to tell us a little bit about how they're working together to deliver OpenStack solutions for next generation IT. Thank you. Thank you, Laura. Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome. So in this session we'll be discussing Cisco and Red Hat OpenStack solutions. We're very fortunate, Radesh, the general manager for OpenStack at Red Hat. We've done a lot of work with your team, you know, Mark and Perry and others, and we were briefly discussing yesterday, and we talked a lot about, you know, I really like the, in the Red Hat earnings calls, you know, Jim Whitehurst and the team, they go into a lot of detail on customer wins with OpenStack. They talk about, you know, the number of six-figure, seven-figure, and even eight-figure deals that involve OpenStack, and when I see Red Hat, I mean, you're clearly, you know, doubling down your investment on OpenStack, you know, almost kind of betting the farm, if you will, on OpenStack. So, like, what are you seeing from your customers in terms of some of the challenges that they're seeing that are causing them to embrace OpenStack at such a high rate? First of all, thank you for having me here, and those of you who chose wisely not to have a beer and come here to appreciate that. So, you know, we're all in from a Red Hat perspective on OpenStack, like you said, we're betting the farm. We're not seeing OpenStack as just a destination in itself, but rather the fabric for everything we do moving forward. So we'll talk a little bit about our portfolio, et cetera, later. Back to the core question here, what are we seeing from customers, you know, day in and day out, I'm spending my time, my teams are spending time talking to customers across the globe. We are paying subscription customers of OpenStack across the globe as well. Probably the first thing that I realized, you know, and I get goosebumps around is the pace at which things are happening in customers' environment, right? You know, I have reasonable amount of gray hair, not as much as some of you or all of you out there, but I think it's been in the industry, you know, as from the tank, if you will. I've never seen a time where the mandate from top down to move a million miles an hour has been this prevalent, right? So that's the first kind of characteristic that I see, which is very different from what we've seen in the last decade or so. It's very true. And also, you know, you're from Microsoft, right, a big driver behind Azure and Hyper-V. And I believe you were the product manager for Windows 2000. So you've pretty much seen almost all the trends, you know. Yeah, that's true, you know, and I'm not, you know, ashamed of admitting my past, right? But, you know, the reality is even Microsoft was woken up to the reality which is in front of us, which is open source is not an if, but for what workloads and what use cases are you bringing in, right? So just like I as an individual have made the transition, a lot of organizations are also making the transition. The sort of the second aspect that I'm hearing from customers is this whole notion of choice of deployment footprint, right? Just five or six, you know, I used to be a Hyper-V guy. Six or seven years ago, it was a, hey, we have to move everything into virtualization and that's it. Everything physical is dead or whatever is the next thing we should move cloud, move it all over there. I think in the last, you know, 18 to 24 months a lot of pragmatism has set in in that customers clearly recognize that there's going to be physical footprint, there's going to be virtual footprint, there's going to be private cloud footprint, and there's going to be public cloud footprint. Now, the million or multi-billion dollar question is what workload is going to be in which footprint and how can a vendor such as Red Hat as well as Cisco provide a solution that they can sleep at night, right, with across these four footprint. So that's another kind of theme that I'm hearing from customers, too. And just to round out my observations in terms of customers, the third one, you know, the slide is also prompting me to talk about bi-modal IT as a construct. I know this is one analyst view, which is Gartner's view, it could be called third platform in IDC's terminology, but the long and short of it is that if you look in terms of the nature of the applications, the set of people, how they behave in building that application. Or, for that matter, what goes into that application, all these three things have changed fundamentally between the old traditional way and the new way, right? So if you look at the nature of the applications in the mode two, as Gartner calls it, or agile mode, if you will, they are stateless VMs, you know, as at OpenStack Summit, you guys all know that, you know, like the palm of your hand. So that's by default the construct that's in the eyes of the CIOs, if you will. The second is in terms of what goes behind in, if you look at a software factory that's making these applications, earlier if IT shops were running a marathon, now they're running sprints, right? So that's the other dimension of change that I see. And the third dimension is, like I earlier said, OpenSource used to be, you know, somebody called it Kansas, somebody called it, I don't know whether I can bet my business on, et cetera, too. OpenSource is driving the innovation containers to any of the new buzzwords that you talk about, is all driven by OpenSource. So I think we are in an amazing paradigm shift moment, all the things that the customers want between Red Hat and Cisco are in a position to deliver, which hopefully we can cover more of. What are you seeing from customers, from your vantage point? So I'm seeing very similar things. I mean, you're right, it's good to be agile. It's an exciting time in the industry. We talked a little bit about you were a product manager in the past. So I've been in this industry for over a quarter century now. And I was a software developer, as well as a product manager for software products. And I was that person before you're building an application, you want to get it into a customer's hands. And the way it used to be was you had to have someone put a server in, then you had someone cable up the server, then you had someone have to put the access list on. And that whole process could literally take months or even more sometimes. So the power of the cloud and DevOps, the self-serve portal idea, is extremely powerful. And we see lots of interest and lots of adoption with that as well. You mentioned some of the new applications, too, like containers and big data. Another thing that really resonates with customers is things are moving so fast. They want to make a bet on something that they know is going to be protected. And they see OpenStack getting support with containers, with Magnum that we're working on, big data with Hadoop, for example. They see OpenStack as a platform for that as well. So they're extremely excited. Some challenges, too, with the cloud, as we see some things with security and compliance and just visibility in the cloud. But the previous session for APIC with Mike Cohen and Clayton, anyone here stay for the previous session by any chance? So Joe did. They talked a lot about how APIC provides visibility into the cloud and some of the things that we're working on together. So we're seeing absolutely some of the same things. And it's an extremely exciting time in the industry. That's great. So Cisco and Red Hat, it's a great partnership. I mean, from our perspective, we're working with Mark McLaughlin a lot, Perry, Joe, and others, really doing a great job. You should give them a raise, by the way, I think. Look at that. Is that what they told you? I don't think they have to pay for that. So I'm assuming that's a tier for the question. So we're working with Red Hat on a daily, weekly basis. We're building a lot of great stuff together. So I mean, we see the synergies firsthand. And we see it from the Cisco side through the sales force also. But with some of your perspective about why Cisco and Red Hat and how they're helping to solve customer problems in open stacks. Look, this partnership is something that I'm very, very personally involved in and personally very, very excited about. For the simple reason that here we have the number one provider of infrastructure for cloud environments today, that Cisco, getting together with the number one provider of open source solutions for enterprises. And then saying, hey, look, how do we make the lives of our customers easier, faster in terms of their ability to consume the innovation that's happening out there, and at the same time bring all the abilities that old world demanded security and enterprise qualities that you expect off, right? So at that level, it's an amazing opportunity that we both are rallying around. We referenced the teams working together. And hopefully we can do justice to some of the output of the teams as well as we talk through this. So very, very excited about the promise of it as well as the fact that we are aligned in terms of the vision that we want to enable in the eyes of the customer. Now, it's one thing to have a higher level alignment. Of course, at the end of the day, we need to make sure that we are landing solutions that you all can consume as well. And that's the hard work that we are going through. Hopefully we'll touch upon some of the ones that are already available and signal some of the areas that we are working on. But the very fact that both of us are aligned to making sure that OpenStack is production ready makes the partnership very exciting from my lens. What's your perspective on anything to add there? Oh yeah, so absolutely. Red Hat has been a strong contributor to Open Source as is Cisco. So for example, the Neutron database. We at Cisco provided the ability in a team collaborative effort. So you can actually do an upgrade of OpenStack Neutron for the first time. So it's the combination of the leader in the cloud infrastructure market. So Synergy Research Group, a report I believe Jeremy Duke is the author, does a great report details how Cisco is the leader in cloud infrastructure for public and private clouds, compute, storage, networking, as well as security. So you combine that leader in cloud infrastructure market with the leader in cloud and Open Source. It's an extremely powerful combination. And a lot of the components we're talking about, like Cisco UCS servers, Cisco Nexus switches. These are data center staples. People are using them today, the blocks, flex pods, and the ability to leverage that investment and bring it into OpenStack is a huge win. So who here is using UCS or Nexus today? Awesome. Who here is using REL OSP or REL today? Excellent. Good. We have 2 thirds of the audience to convert as we go along. You know, a couple of data points from a Red Hat perspective that I'll touch upon as well. Probably have heard about the fact that we've been associated with OpenStack for quite a significant number of years. And earlier we talked about it's a Pet the Farm initiative from our perspective. We look at stats in terms of how are we doing around community contribution as a metric, not because we want to walk around wearing a t-shirt saying we're number one, but rather, for us, our business model is subscription based. And so if somebody were to call for support, knowing every single p-spot that goes into the product that we make available is like a mandatory requirement. That's the right to swipe the card and get into the building kind of capability. So showing up with code is something that we fundamentally believe in. A related reality also is that we, by default, do not write any piece of code that is a forked version or it's a shadow code tree, et cetera. So the exciting aspect of OpenStack ecosystem is that a lot of organizations are rallying around OpenStack, but one of the potential pitfalls is that some of the players could hijack it for their personal beliefs and or ends that they want to accomplish, if you will. So from that perspective, we are very, very clear that just like what we did with Linux, which is upstream first, anything that we do around OpenStack is upstream first. So there is the guaranteed ability to walk away from ours if you have not done a great job of earning your respect as a customer. So that's one thing I want to highlight. I think if you look at our portfolio in general, OpenStack, I made the earlier statement that OpenStack is not the destination itself for us. It's just the foundation for a portfolio of solutions that we believe customers will start adopting in their environment. So this slide essentially captures, for those of you who don't know Red Hat as much, we have, you know, there's an alternate science to being an open source company and probably, you know, the most successful on planet Earth. We break down our DNA into three steps, right? So the first step in the process is show up with code upstream. Make sure that you're contributing to appropriate community projects. That's step one. Step two is that have a conduit for getting feedback from the early adopters, the mavericks, the ones that are willing to spend their energy, not just play with the product, but also give feedback. What we will call as a community distribution. So, you know, the logos in the middle are all community distribution of the different offerings that we have. And then the last third stage is where we have enterprise ready solution backed by n number of years of life cycle support. In the case of rally can go all the way up to 10 years, if you will, in terms of support. Open stack is quite not there, but, you know, we hope to get there if you will. So as you can see, we have offerings from storage to middleware platform, to management, et cetera. So as we're talking about the mode to deployment, all the P spots that you would need from a technology organization are available from Red Hat in a truly open way so that you can stand up a truly open cloud and be without, you know, sort of the gun cocking moment of a proprietary player, if you will. Well, and it's nice too, because, you know, with that pure open source and unsupported, if you will option, people can get started right away with RDO, for example, where they can go with rail OSP, and I believe this is the same slide that Mark showed earlier today, which is another reason why I should give more raise. No, thank you. I know, so the theme of the day is give Mark a raise. Okay, got it. Subliminal messaging going on. That's right. And also, so Gluster, for example, I think there's been a few very nice press releases done this week. I believe there was one around Gluster and Manila, I believe. Yeah, so if you look at our storage portfolio, we have SAF as well as Gluster, so SAF is for block and Gluster is for file. So there's this, I mean, interesting project called Manila, those of you who are not familiar, which essentially abstracts, you know, multiple, it could even be a NetApp filer, if you will, and services that as a file as a service for OpenStack to consume. So that was the announcement this week. The direction we headed is, we're already seeing every other opportunity of OpenStack and associated with SAF, right? So because customers are saying, look, I'm looking at a new kind of infrastructure. Should I look at storage along with that? Should I be stuck to a three-letter name company for storage or could I be, you know, just like I'm linearly scaling my compute, can I look at commodity hardware-based storage as well or software-defined storage, if you will? So we're seeing a lot of demand there with the addition of Gluster file as a service, we can be offering, you know, all kinds of workload support from a storage perspective. So I could, you know, go on and on all day long about all the offerings in here. So great announcements, it's a great point about storage. I mean, some of the newer technologies like OpenStack Swift, you know, for example, is gonna make three copies. Big Data Hadoop, we talked about, makes multiple copies. But when you combine kind of software-defined storage, if you will, like Gluster and stuff, you combine it with, say, like Cisco UCS. So UCS-C240, up to 12 large form factor drive, 60 terabytes, the UCS-C3160, large form factor drives up to 360 terabytes. But you see, I mean, it's very much a complete compute storage networking solution between Red Hat and Cisco. Yeah, absolutely. So Cisco's strategy with OpenStack, similar to Red Hat as well, you know, big believer in contributing to open source, you know, we mentioned the neutron database being committed upstream. SR, single root IO virtualization, right? That was another big one because we contributed that upstream. So now we can start talking about one mission-critical workloads like even high-performance computing, for example, or even NFV network function virtualization that needs SRIOV as well. So lots of upstream contributions. Top reviewer, certainly for the last release, according to Stack Analytics. We also give our customer choices. We talked about some of the press releases this week. You also had a great quote in a press release for the Tech Validate, the report, I believe 310 Red Hat customers were surveyed, 75% are planning on supporting. Not even Red Hat customers, you know, 310 decision makers across the globe surveyed by Tech Validate, like you said, 73% are saying they have OpenStack and they have plans in the next 18-month time frame. 82% of them are saying the number one need that they have is enterprise class support, which by the way we offer, so it's music to my ears for sure. So yeah, pretty exciting times for sure. Awesome. And then even in the report, I believe the majority, like 75%, roughly we're planning on deploying OpenStack on KVM. I believe roughly 18% on Hyper-V and ESXi as well as Zen server. But it's Cisco because we support multiple distributions, multiple hypervisors, we give customers choices. And we've also innovated a lot around OpenStack, like one example. So the Ceph EWS, the early warning system. We have that in the Cisco GitHub repo. It's a nice way where you can get visualization into the Ceph storage, get notification before a Ceph OSD drive fails. So lots of innovation around OpenStack in addition to upstream contributions. You know, very dedicated to customer success, however people want to use OpenStack, you know, the global intercloud of which Red Hat is a big partner of ours. You know, Cisco's invested, pledged to invest a billion dollars in the intercloud. So however people want to consume OpenStack, they can start putting an application right away on the intercloud which is based on OpenStack. They can deploy on-prem as a managed service behind a firewall. I mean, this is through the MetaCloud acquisition. Phenomenal success with MetaCloud. The acquisition was actually just done in September of last year and already the number of managed CPUs has doubled in that timeframe. Or, you know, deploying an unmanaged on-prem OpenStack cloud, Cisco, UCS, Nexus, and Red Hat, you know, with Cisco-validated designs. So however people want to consume OpenStack, you know, we have a solution. That's great. Just back to the survey that you were talking about. Another data point also is that 59% of those surveyed say that they're gonna use it for new workloads and 52% are saying for existing workloads. So that's another area, you know, because I'm sure you all have heard about pets versus cattle argument. I personally don't like it. I think, you know, OpenStack is like a horse. You can call it a pet or a cattle, depending on your taste or where you're from. The reality is that OpenStack is becoming more capable of handling so-called old workloads or legacy workloads as well, right? And in fact, we are personally pushing the envelope on a couple of fronts as well. High availability, for example, right? You know, using pacemaker as the open technology at all levels from Hypervisor OS to OpenStack services. So that both on the admin side as well as the tenant side, you can get to high availability solution, right? So I think a lot of work to be done but we are excited about the kind of the start that we've had in this space, if you will. Definitely. Another thing about that report that came out this week, I believe it indicated that 40% of those 310 IT buyer survey plan on deploying containers in an OpenStack environment. I mean, that's a huge number, 40%. So absolutely. New workloads as well as mission critical workloads as well as future workloads. Absolutely, and you know, from our vantage point, unlike some of the other virtualization providers, we don't have an axe to grind, right? So whether you go for container as a format or VM as a format, depending on your workload, we are absolutely fine. So what we are working toward is making sure that from a tenant's side on OpenStack, you could be having a bare metal physical footprint or a VM footprint or a container footprint and still be able to manage that with similar level of processes and maturity. It's an excellent point. I mean, we've been collaborating on the Magnum project for containers. There's an ironic plug-in for Cisco UCS for bare metal as a service. Even the next version of Rail OSP7 will have, I believe, the group-based policy plug-in as well. Support for group-based policy for sure. So lots of innovation. Right. So in terms of the things that we're building now, right? So we talked a lot about the OpenStack customers and the adoption and the traction and some of the drivers behind OpenStack. What is your take in terms of the state of the stack, if you will? I mean, with your history, you've seen lots of different themes and flows and changes in the industries. What kind of proof points are you seeing from your customer in terms of where OpenStack is and whether it's ready for production? I think we kind of let the cat out of the bag. You used some of the survey results earlier. You know, we're seeing amazing level of interest from both the enterprise customers that we spend our time, day in and day out, as well as on the telco side, given the network function virtualization has become a key driver. Both are happening at the same time except that in telco space, this calendar year is where all the proof of concepts are happening and next calendar year is when the initial deployments will be happening and we are working really hard to make sure that carrier grade features make its way to our OpenStack offering. So we're fundamentally taking the approach that rather than get a carrier grade version of OpenStack, let's make OpenStack carrier grade as the approach, right? So which is very different from some forked approach that some of the other players are taking. The catch with that is that clearly we need to make sure that it's upstream aligned, blueprints are approved, et cetera, so there might be some slight delays, but I think eventually the community as well as the world at large will benefit if you did that. Back to some of the other momentum points, this I believe came from the last OpenStack Summit survey, essentially calls out three key points. One is that it's not a toy that people are playing with anymore. 46% is saying they are using it in production. Secondly, in terms of workloads, we are seeing maturation of the type of workloads. It's not some, you know, the CIO's, you know, pet projects kind of thing, but rather we're talking about from web services too, even, you know, database apps, et cetera, being onboarded into an OpenStack environment, right? So I think the work around database as a service, et cetera as that's maturing will help fuel this even further, right? So that's the other data point. From our own lens as read at, a data point that we look at very carefully is how many partners do we have, you know, think of ISVs, SIs, you know, other providers of technologies around OpenStack itself. In the last 18 months we've had from zero to 275 partners with certified solutions around our commercial OpenStack offering. So that's another sign of maturity that there's choice across computer storage, networking management and applications that's available on this platform of the future. And the good news is the future is not tomorrow, it's today, right? So that's a great place to be in. Absolutely. Yeah, so, and we're seeing very similar things on the Cisco side. Like so one joint customer we have, you know, the Eli and Edith Broad Institute of MIT in Harvard or as Joe likes to call it, the Broad. So they're, I mean, this is, you know, they're doing genome sequencing, you know, part of the human genome project, you know, literally doing work to make life better, you know, changing the world. And some great quotes, you know, from Chris and James about how Cisco and Red Hat together, you know, the leader in cloud infrastructure and the leader in open source software are getting together to solve their customer problems. I believe they're deploying, you know, UCS blades also, so you see another nice proof point both blades and rack mount servers, whoever wants to, you know, either form works, all managed by UCS manager. But I, you know, we're definitely at Cisco, we're seeing the same thing. Conversations are kind of, you know, transitioning, you know, from how to do a pilot to how to do production. So it's very exciting. That's great. So I think I'm supposed to ask you the next question, which is, you know, how do you see our combined vision coming together and how are we working towards delivering on that promise? Yeah, so I mean, we're delivering a complete, you know, compute storage and networking solution, you know, public, private, hybrid clouds. You know, it kind of starts with the plug-ins, right? So, you know, rail OSP and stuff on UCS, networking plug-ins, right? So there's the Nexus 1000B plug-in. You know, there's, say, you know, a Nexus 9000 or hardware based Nexus Switch plug-in for VLAN provisioning. There's the APIC plug-in, you know, that Mike Cohen and Clayton talked about earlier with key info systems for, you know, a nice spine and leaf fabric, you know, which is very powerful. And then the ACI policies as well, right? So I mean, and group-based policies. This is a fundamental change, right, in terms of how applications kind of configure the infrastructure, right? This is a way the application actually configures the entire leaf and spine infrastructure. And the application intent, you know, it's no longer defining IP addresses and punching holes, if you will, in a network. The application configuration stays with the components. You know, whether it's the load balancer or the firewall or the databases, the VMs kind of move without the network. So it's extremely powerful, right? So it's an example of how, you know, ACI kind of drives policies across the infrastructure. You know, you talked before about how it could take months before an application could go on to, you know, a physical server in kind of the old world. This is an example too, where something, that configuration and that operations, that monitoring that used to take a very long time, I can now take just a few hours to design and then it's up and running in the fabric. So one example of what Cisco and Red Hat are doing, you know, Chris from Red Hat's been very involved in the standard. Yeah, just to add one perspective here, right? So when you look at OpenStack, one of the areas that I get the most feedback on is around networking, right? So in terms of maturity of features, functionality, et cetera. Now with the combination of ACI, where you're actually moving up the complexity and over to a policy-driven infrastructure and support for things like group-based policy, we can bring in the agility that's needed for networking, it doesn't have to be a silo. And more importantly, solving the problem that customers are facing with networking around OpenStack itself, right? So I'm doubly excited about the potential here. Excellent. And the inner cloud that we mentioned as well, you know, so global inner cloud is production, you know, infrastructure is a service, platform is a service, you know, OpenShift is certainly part of the conversation. We have a great demo of Red Hat OpenShift in the Cisco booth downstairs. Also we talked about big data. There's CloudDera as well as Hortonworks and MapR, I believe demo downstairs in the Cisco booth. These are all kind of things that are part of the conversation of the inner cloud. And the inner cloud Fabric221 was recently released also, which is, you know, a hybrid cloud architecture, which is really exciting because, and that is currently in beta. But what that allows is say you have a workload that was on say ESXi, for example, it can now be bursted in a hybrid cloud, you know, to the inner cloud, or even architecturally speaking, right? Say a workload was on EC2, and now maybe that can come to a private cloud, you know, on-prem deployment with RELL OSP and KVM. So it's another area of collaboration with a hybrid cloud that we're extremely excited about. Right, right. So Peter, just to summarize from the join partnership, clearly if you look at from a hybrid cloud perspective, you need to have a private cloud and a public cloud. The public cloud offering is into cloud, that's based on our OpenStack and our join efforts there. From a private cloud perspective, you have clearly the UCS offering as a starting point, and if you're into SDN and you want to solve the networking challenges also in the same vein, ACI is an amazing offering that's certified with RELL OSP as well. So with the combination of these three, best of, you know, across physical virtual private cloud and public cloud, you can stitch together a cloud infrastructure powered by Cisco and Red Hat. Absolutely, yep. And other areas of collaboration also. So, you know, we talked a lot about OpenStack. We're also doing a lot of innovations around open daylight as well, and even in Mike's previous conversation on ACI, extremely powerful. So the OpFlex agent where there's actually an open daylight, open flow-based controller through ACI pushing policy now down all the way to the KVM hypervisor through that OpFlex agent. So it's extremely powerful. There's also a great demo of open daylight a little bit earlier. OpenStack Neutronite can plug right into an open daylight controller or as well, you know, in other traditional network controllers as well. So you clearly have this kind of complete open cloud solution, you know, between Cisco and Red Hat with the APIC controller for, you know, bare metal through Ironic through VMs as well as containers through Magnum. Yeah. So we're quite a bit on what is already available, the areas that we are working together, et cetera. Do you want to venture to, do you want to guess where the future is headed? Sure. So lots of things that we're working on for the future. One thing is we've started the process and we're going to do more of it in the future. It's just the CVDs, the Cisco Validated Designs. You know, we hear a lot, you know, love OpenStack, love the idea, you know, but how do I get started, right? Kind of the Cisco Validated Design, you know, de-risk that proposition shows kind of the step-by-step provides, you know, all the blueprints, if you will, and the best practices. So we continue to do that. You know, infrastructure is a service platform, as a service, it's a great area of collaboration. You know, the OpFlex agent, you know, some of the newer releases of ACI with floating IP support. These are something that we're extremely excited about, you know, with more tighter integration, you know, with KVM and the Hypervisor. And from my perspective, clearly, continue to get excited about Cef, as in, you know, in many ways I see Cef and OpenStack as chips and salsa of the today, tomorrow, if you will. So working with Cisco and making sure that the consumption experience of Cef plus OpenStack with UCS is meeting the high bar that Cisco has already set from enterprise consumption is a key priority moving forward. Container, we talked about, you know, I can't contain my enthusiasm around containers. I'm assuming most of you are in the same category as well. We clearly have work to be done to make sure that the experience, ongoing administrative experience, as well as ongoing living with containers is reaching the same level of maturation as virtualization as a technology. So that's another opportunity area that we are working toward. Definitely, definitely. Well, we've got the countdown sign from the back. We really appreciate, you know, the time today and really enjoyed the conversation. We have a few moments left for Q&A before we close. If there's any questions from the audience. No prices for the first one. No prices for the first one. Just a moment, please. Hi, just a quick question. So quite understandable why Cisco is so motivated to provide plug-in, neutral plug-ins to OpenStack Neutral. Obviously a lot of, you know, switches and then obviously API, sorry, EPIC and the ACI infrastructures. It's quite understandable. But I'm wondering how much Cisco's committed to the open-delight control SD and control side. So, yeah, that's my question. How much committed is it to open-delight control? So, you know, we at Cisco, you know, very committed to open-source standards, like open-stack and open-delight. David Ward was here today. And in fact, Cisco has, you know, open-delight controllers as well. And there's some new releases with open-delight that we're extremely excited about. So we're actually kind of, if you will, just getting started with open-delight, right? So, you know, you had the hydrogen and the helium release, you know, the lithium release we're looking forward to. I think you're also gonna see open-delight actually kind of embedded in other kind of products, if you will, as well, because, you know, it's a great orchestration technology, you know, for network function virtualizations. So committed to open-stack and open-delight. And it's not even an either or. I mean, you know, you can use them both together. And, you know, the off-flex agent is a great example of how we're actually using open-flow, open-delight, kind of to make ACI and open-stack better, if you will. So there's, you know, at Cisco, you know, we're a big believer in giving choices to the customer. And, you know, there's more than one really good open-source networking choice. But open-stack and open-delight, we're very excited about. Question to Cisco and Red Hat. So what's the percentage you moved towards open-stack for your internal environment? It's an excellent question. That's why you should answer that first. Sure. Well, it's funny because someone just came up to me and told me about a new application on Red Hat Open-Stack platform in Cisco. So we at Cisco, I mean, we're completely bought in, if you will, to open-stack. We're getting, you know, applications on open-stack, you know, as quickly as possible. Huge Red Hat customer. Lots of rail, lots of rail, OSP as well. For new initiatives, I mean, it's almost becoming the standard, if you will. In fact, there's gonna be a presentation from Cisco IT tomorrow about some of the stuff that we're doing on open-stack platform. And even, you know, the inner cloud, you know, we use that a lot internally to kind of spin up new applications as well. But your comment earlier, I thought was spot-on about how, like, you've almost never seen this much excitement and momentum before, and we're seeing it within Cisco IT also. So from our perspective, you know, if you look at Open-Stack Dev Team, we have an internal cloud. I always say that, hey, this is the largest cloud that we are ever gonna be building because we're not in the public cloud business. A lot of dev tests for several projects, heat, for example, is all dependent on what we call as the OS1 infrastructure, which is an internally running plain vanilla, what we sell to customers with no mods being managed internally, right? We are also actively looking at our net new applications that we are bringing in and then saying, how do we make sure that by default, we are using Open-Stack as the preferred target destination. So we already have Red Hat Enterprise Virtualization, which is KBM-based footprint already. We're not kind of disrupting that, but landing more workloads, both from engineering perspective, internal pre-sales usage perspective, and in some select cases, we even provide sandboxes to select few customers based on this infrastructure, right? So clearly, I worry a lot about making sure that that's pervasive internally, it again fits in the same category when we look at the contribution to upstream. It's not about bragging rights, it's about gaining the knowledge, right? Until you cut code and until you deploy and live with it, you're not gonna be able to understand it, right? So it builds that confidence in us that we can actually help our customers go through the same journey as well. Very true. Okay, excellent. On behalf of Cisco and Red Hat, we thank you so much for hanging out with us a little bit. We know the agenda and the events are packed in this afternoon, but thank you so much for spending some time with us today, and we hope you enjoy the rest of the summit. Thank you very much.