 Welkom back. Welkom back. This is why in the morning. Thank you so much for sticking with us. Asana, Asana Iperori, you're just joining us. My name is Ram Aguko. It is a pleasure being with you on this fine Tuesday morning. And of course we still continue with our conversations, with our interviews of the day and you're just in time for the next interview. Let's talk about your health. Now today we see so many people go to the chemists or the pharmacists and they get the over the counter drugs, they even self-medicate. Do these things have an effect on your body? Does self-prescription have an effect on your body? Do over the counter drugs have any effect on your body? What about drug abuse? Can it lead to a drug and substance abuse? Let's talk about your health and talk about these particular issues because so many youths get involved with this. Is it right? Is it okay? Let's talk about how you can better take care of yourself moving forward. And to help us in this conversation, I'm with Karoli Muyaka who is a pharmaceutical technician at Pharma Plus Pharmacy. Karoli, you're well? Thank you so much for finding time to join me because he is also the branch manager for the Kahawa Sukari branch and one thing that I love about this guy he was the best performed... it is his branch that is Kahawa Sukari branch was the best performed branch in the whole company with him being named as the best branch manager overall. Kudos man brother. Thank you. Kudos. Tell us something a bit more about this particular angle because I like celebrating people. What happened to your overall best drugs? Congratulations first. Thank you so much. At first when you are performing good or you are about to achieve something great you don't see it coming. It comes as a surprise. You are shocked? Yes, at first you are shocked because you don't expect it. Basically what made me achieve that you know in pharmaceutical industry is all about planning. It's business. You plan. You are well organized. You are well disciplined. So they... You achieve it. They looked at all of these things. First of all you can... Let's talk about some little things like stocking. How do you stock your branch? If your branch is well stocked your products are moving how much profit you make how disciplined are your staff members and your colleagues inside there. And you are the one that instils all of these things? Yes. Because once you get a mess from a single member of that particular branch you are failing the whole branch. So the performance has to start from down going up. It's bottom up. Congratulations. And as we do that I want to welcome you from home to be part of this conversation. It's all about youth and health. Let's talk about your health matters concerning you. Ask your questions. He is an expert in this particular area which I will be able to discuss and dispense of these issues. You mentioned thoroughly that at the end of the day pharmacy I can get that aspect of business coming in. You mentioned stocks etc. When it comes to pharmacist and I know this is going to be a bias question but what are your thoughts in regards to these accusations that sometimes pharmacists just sell drugs to make money and they don't actually give you what you need for your body and it may end up harming you. Okay. We need to differentiate one thing. We are not businessmen at that extent or let me frame it as shopkeepers. We are not shopkeepers. We are doctors. Trained. We are trained doctors. So by you coming to us we have to make sure we administer the right product to you and at the end of the day we can get home feeling relieved. Before you come or you walk into any chemist the first thing that rings in your mind is there's a doctor inside there. So you trust this person and whatever this person is going to do will make an impact on you. So it's not all about just making money. Although money will come because of course I'll give you the medications you'll have to pay me. Now that's how business comes in. And is that before even as we continue is that what we call an over the counter drug? We have the over the counter drugs and we have the prescription drugs. In a chemist generally the pharmacy and poisons board allows us to stock an over the counter drug an over the counter drug or medication and the prescription medications. We have two types of prescription medications we have the long term drugs those are basically for people with the diagonals with high blood pressure and diabetes. Is that like a duration here? Of course and you know they are given medications depending on the stages of their their diagnosis or the conditions. So you need a prescription for that. You can't just come into a chemist I test you for blood sugar and I tell you now today I'm going to give you some med for me. 500 milligrams. No I can't do that. That's somewhat. I can't just I want you to mention the med for me. Med for me. 500 milligrams. I can't do that. You need a prescription and that's why in a medical field I do enjoy being in a medical field because there is something we call respect of positions. I'm a pharmacist I respect the clinical officer I respect the medical officer that's their job. We will give this drug in accordance to the diagnosis. Of course. Now we have still because we have not yet gotten to the answer where you respond to do we have scenarios where pharmacists just sell drugs to make money and you go to us and I don't know if someone has been through this but every time you go for a check up you will see malaria malaria, malaria, malaria malaria and bacteria infection and you are wondering what's the problem? Okay. On that Is that true? It's true. But you know I'll try to elaborate a little bit that it depends because we are human beings at first. I'll begin by saying we are human beings and you know a human being everyone has a weakness. I might be a doctor yes but where I'm situated or where I'm working I need to make a particular thing from it. So what do you expect me to do? It's not that I'll have to administer a wrong medication for you so that I make that cash. I'll give you the right thing to earn that cash. Although there are some who do that wrongly and we do condemn that every day we do condemn that every day. Does it mean it's wrongly and it's condemned? It's condemned and in fact if the Pharmacy and Poisons Board realises that you are doing such a thing your premise will just be cleared off. Alright. Because it's risky. I can remind you of a case that was once around Nairobi here where a baby was injected anastasia. Yes, I remember that issue. You know the essence of doing something is not all about I want to achieve maybe I'm targeting 100,000 per day I have to make this 100,000 per day so I just give out anything now. You see this is a pharmacist who is in a pharmacy he has received a particular prescription he gives out the medication but lacks something he's not keen on something you don't want to ask this particular person or the patient you don't want to do further investigations. That's a laziness and you see in a medical field a doctor is like a police officer you are at war because you are fighting diseases you are at war you go there there are bullets flying around viruses are flying around bacteria are flying around and then you are giving someone to guard or to protect we are going to save someone and you forget one single step the life of this particular person relies on your hands the blood of this particular person remains in your hands for the rest of your life. Now my brother let me ask you because you've clearly stated that there are people who are professionals and you are professionals but there are those who if found to be engaging in this I would call it malpractice then there are consequences for that should Kenyans Kenyans trust the pharmacies that are there next door how can a common mananchi know that these are good chemists these are good pharmacists do we have those tricks that you can pick out and say even if I'm going to buy over the counter drugs I can trust that my life is in yes you can how can you how can you differentiate how can I know that Karoli is a good guy by the way it's very easy to know to figure out someone who is just trying to make money out of your situation and someone who is trying to help you because you know pharmacy is not all about come I give you drugs go give me money now at first we are trained well we are taught well we know about guiding and counseling before I give you any medication I need a history of your sickness so we need to flow there are steps you give me a history you give me some signs I understand the signs after you explain everything you get me a history I've been moving from this place to this place so someone who asks questions is someone you can trust that's someone you can trust because this person is looking for something inna before administering anything but you know kuna waila mbo na kuliza jina lakuneni kuna skia vp enda pandush kwa dawa and you are wondering is that it mostly there are some conditions that I can't I can't just give you drugs I'll first of all ask you main you need an anti-malarial drug have you been in any area prone to malaria infection have you been in any area prone to malaria infection in any area prone to malaria infection yada yada yada uli safiri uli kwa tu karibu karibu siku safiri siku napali I won't give you that why should I give you the anti-malarial yet we have not yet confirmed whether you have malaria because if I give you the anti-malarial and then a week later you are diagnosed with malaria for sure my friend I want to assure you the anti-malarial will resist it will resist now there are many who go to hospital still this is over the counter drugs but every time you go to the clinic they tell you hech pylori hech pylori hech pylori tell me about this that's a very common case it's very common it's very common something that you people should understand and she'll know that hech pylori is a normal flower it's a normal bacteria it's in your system it's in everybody's system it's a normal flower so I should not be afraid do you know how or when bacteria is now confirmed to be abnormal when you know in every human being we have these life bacterias the bacteria that will help us they will help us in at least fighting some normal stars and then the amount of the bacterias the amount of the bacterias in your system try to to overreact like let's say now the hech pylori basically talk about the hech pylori the hech pylori virus or the bacteria hech pylori bacteria it helps in a few things it's basically in your stomach the the GI GI the gastric so it's basically there the only the only position when these bacteria is now identified as an abnormal is when it's now reacts in excess because they are a particular amount of bacterias that are normal when they exceed that number they now become abnormal they have to be suppressed and by suppressing these bacterias you will be given antibiotics they clear antibiotics will act in different ways there are some that kill the bacterias there are some that just create an environment that is not suitable for these bacterias and the bacterias will simply be released so when you are given an antibiotic like the bacteriocidal antibiotic it kills the bacterias your body now lacks the normal flora because you've killed all the bacterias they have normal bacterias and the normal bacterias so someone will be asked to take a probiotic what's a probiotic you again returning the bacterias into your system because you need them this is confusing because we need to understand these things and as a pharmacist you've clarified some of these gray areas but how can in your expert opinion how can pharmacist bridge this gap so that we don't have this space between youths who do not want to go to pharmacist they want to go to the hospital or youths who don't want to go to the hospital they just want to go to the pharmacist and get over the counter drugs is there a role that pharmacist can play to help you understand more about their health yeah there's a very big role at first we need education we need to educate youth talk them through their their advantages of visiting a hospital being tested in a hospital before going back to administering drugs for themselves over the counter or by going in a chemist and requesting for anything or just buying something and then you keep it in the house then you keep it in a house that is a miambili at least in Mejipang in Mejipang you know we can teach or we can give them my education or we can figure out on a way to at least guide them through the steps of having to acquire these particular medications and what type there are some conditions that a person on Nezapuji and I were cabins and you are like okay this do you have those ones that you can just see yeah there are some that you can just see so if someone comes to your chemist and you've easily been pointed what their problem is they should not feel like oh this person is not doing investigations how did you know no you have to engage the client first you have to engage the patient make them understand you have to make them understand these what you have seen and these what they are feeling and why they need to go for check up instead of just buying over instead of just buying drugs over the count you have to engage them you have to go through everything it's like you know I do say as doctors we do have a very big family because you do meet so many people you are open to so many people and so many people are open to you and for a person to be open to you as a doctor that means they trust you you are a family because you can't be open to someone it's a big family it's a big family and as a member of that family you can't just allow the family to get into you can't kill your family member for instance who does careless purchase over the count of drugs have a negative effect on someone's body very big effect very big effect I'll give an example of a drug that is very commonly purchased especially in this city the P2s say it again the P2s it's called it's called postina postina 2 man these ladies are abusing these things they are abusing that thing it can affect them they are abusing that thing and you know postina is a hormone progestin is a hormone in the body female body the estrogen and the progestin hormones are sex hormones you will find a lady complaining that I have hormonal imbalance why? because he chose a family planning method that is progestin only or there is an increase of the progestin hormones in the system these ladies can't contract any pregnancy immediately or she won't in future if you overuse that drug you'll have to pray for very long time you'll have to pray for very long time of course how frequent should a lady use the P2s is there a limit? there is a limit because you've said overuse there is a limit basically if you advise a patient or any lady or any man buying a P2 to give you your girl a P2 more than twice a month that's bad that's bad we have condoms why not just use a condom avoid these drugs why not just use a condom if you need an oral stuff you need to enjoy it orally you need to fill the tangible stuff but contraceptives are important contraceptives are important and that's why you know most contraceptives are long term you have the depo that is injectable is a long term 3 months is controlled the release of the hormone is controlled we have these implants they are long term the release of the hormone is controlled but you can imagine taking a P2 taking P2 is like taking how many tablets of Femi plan what? does around 8 tablets of Femi plan taking one tablet of P2 is equivalent to taking 8 tablets of Femi plan you can imagine that and that's why so many ladies after taking the P2 you will experience a very heavy flow a very heavy flow because your bodies the hormones are so high and they will completely resist anything that tries to attack itself the walls of the womb the walls of the womb is expelled I love the example you are giving just careless purchase of other counter drugs can be negative can have a very adverse effects on the body and if you give an example of the P2 that you say ladies abuse nowadays it can cause hormonal imbalances and giving birth may be a problem you said atataji maombi atataji maombi I want to bring this conversation to a close because there are so many things that I want to know but because of time I want to talk about this what about the issue of some of these sexual transmitted infections and HIV because once someone feels like they want to purchase this over the counter drug is there a way that are having sexual transmitted infections and HIVs are also covered in this conversation of purchase of over the counter drugs briefly basically when someone I had given an example of using a condom I buy a condom I go at home do my thing the condom busts in the game so tomorrow morning I'll run into chemist and ask kuna pep of course if it's there you'll get it I'll taste you but how many times are you going to take this pep that one doesn't need for those who don't understand what a pep is a pep that's a post exposure prophylaxis it's a medication given after you're exposed to believe me I never do what the please it's a medication given after you're suspected to have been exposed to a virus the HIV virus so you take it for around 28 days a single tablet per day a combination of three drugs you take it for 28 days you can take that let's say you take that for the first time you take it for the second time at long last any other time you'll be testing for HIV you may not get the results maybe you have the virus because you're always suppressing the virus so the multiplication of this virus may not be visible you have to undergo some other serious tests for you to identify that no I have some viruses so we should be careful I want you to have a final word just within 30 seconds talk to the youth watching it today what is your parting shot ok for all the youth in general I urge you health in youth is a very great thing let's consider our health as the biggest goal to achieve the biggest success to achieve is the health in youth live alone having a lot of cash having a big job and all that you can have a lot of cash but your health is at risk we consider having a better health one let's eat smart let's exercise let's follow the guidance that we are given in terms of administration of medication how we are going to utilize our pharmacies and chemists so that we don't risk our health our bodies to that extent there are so many things that I know we might have wanted to talk about but thank you so much for sharing your thoughts on this and I believe that us youth we are saying we should be careful do not just carelessly buy the counter drugs thank you for coming thank you so much that is Karoli Muyaka taking us through this particular aspect of the effects of counter drugs matters concerning your health right here on 1 in the morning we are taking a short break we will be back with more coming up your way keep it 1 in the morning