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We just touched on a video topic on just this past Thursday, time to find another church and we appreciate the feedback and the encouragement and the commentary from those of you who have watched the video. I would encourage you to share it with others. I'm pretty sure we're not the only ones who have been affected by worldliness, even from churches that we believe and thought were sound and biblical, but have now allowed worldliness in the fraternities and sororities and secret societies to creep in and thus pollute and dilute the impurity and sincerity and devotion to the Word of God. We definitely appreciate those of you who have been supporting our channels. We will be having our website coming up soon this year. We will be keeping you posted and also be on the lookout for that. We will have a mailing list for those of you who would like to stay in contact with us, just in case YouTube or Big Tech takes us off grid. We'll be able to keep in contact and have consistent communication and also populate and post our videos and things of that nature on that particular platform as well too. But nonetheless, this is what God has us at right now and so we definitely appreciate this stream and we appreciate those of you who consistently and faithfully join us here on this time and at this time. Now, I have two brothers that are waiting in the green room that I'll be bringing on very soon. This is my first time actually having a face-to-face conversation with these two brothers. These two brothers have been able to, will be able actually to share their testimony and their experience regarding the topic that we are discussing today and I put up a poll question in the chat. So YouTube family, Facebook family, first and foremost, welcome. Thank you so much for joining. But I did put up a poll question regarding, is Christianity and Freemasonry compatible? If not, why not? And I believe that there lies the rub and the contention with some people. But if we're Christians, we know that what the Bible says about these types of belief systems and rituals and religions and false systems that have come in and guised itself as Christian. And unfortunately, again, the church, the leadership starting from the top, the pastors and elders and bishops and so forth are allowing worldliness, secret societies and so forth to come in and thus synchronize as what they want to do with the body of Christ. And so these brothers that I'm about to bring on with you are going to share their testimony, share their experience on why they left the Freemasonry movement and organization and what made them become Christians. So without any further ado, I bring to you Brother Fred H and Brother Vita Jones. Welcome, brothers, to the stream, man. Glad to have you all here. All right. All right. So let's get it started, man. Fred, are you good? Can you hear me okay? I can hear you fine. All right. Good. Give me a little bit more volume on your end. I got the mic up a little bit. If you can speak a little bit louder, that'd be great. Can you hear me now? Yeah, that's great. Okay. Good. All right. So let's start with you, Fred. You were a former Mason? Correct. Okay. And what degree and what level? And for those of us who may not know the details and intricacies of regarding Freemasonry, because a lot of people may not know all that's involved and entailed with it. So I want us to make it as simple to understand as possible. So for the late person who may be on the outside and may not be familiar with this type of organization, with this type of system, can you kind of tell us a little bit about that and what brought you into that organization and how long were you there? So I was, I made it to the 32nd degree. So I was already in Omega, Omega sci-fi fraternity. So there, I mean, the similarities among secret societies are there. There's things that they do in public and there's things that they do in secret or private. So that's basically what drew me. Just another level, I guess you could say, I always heard that it was a higher level of knowledge to be sought after. And with 32 degrees, that's that kind of is obvious because as you go through each degree, you learn more and more. You go through what's called an obligation, which is basically the oath that we take. So when I, when I initially decided that I wanted to do it, you know, you see all these things around to say to be one to ask one. So I had to actually ask somebody and say, Hey, I'm interested in the Masonic Lodge. And the first thing that they asked me was, was I an atheist or a Catholic? And I wasn't. So I said no. So that immediately, I wasn't saved at the time. But I just found the question kind of that why would secret society even care whether or not I was an atheist or a Catholic? So what happens is somebody has to vouch for you or write a letter for you. You have to take a physical. I can't remember the exact wording, but you basically have to be of, I guess, 21 years of age. I think you have to be a registered voter or something like that. So just to make a long story short, when I got to the Lodge, they tried to make you feel very intimidated. They they just gonna tell like it is just very prideful, prideful individuals, you know, thinking there are all that in the bag of chips. I mean, these are things that I could, I could sense, you know, based on their behaviors. So I didn't know what I was getting myself into. There was at the time I had no internet because this is 1992 93 ish. So there's no internet. So the only way that I could seek out any information is to actually get a Mason to show it to me or hopefully to find a book somewhere about it, which I couldn't do. So as we start learning through their first degree or a ritual, eventually we have to go actually through the ritual. So again, not being born again, I didn't really think too much of what we were doing. And then they they had a statement that they made, though, they said that Masons make good men better. So of course, so of course, I was like, well, I guess I'm going to figure out how they do that. I'm not quite sure how they're going to go about doing it. But if it's anything like a fraternity ain't gonna work, because they don't make good men better. They make good boys. I mean, bad boys is probably worse men. But as I was going through the ritual, there were it was just a bunch of pomp and circumstance, learning how to do handshakes, memorizing the obligation. And I noticed that when we finally went through the first degree obligation, they make you swear that you're not going to give any of the secrets. And this is an over and over thing throughout the whole obligations that you're not going to in any way possible give up any of the secrets. And then at the very end of the obligation, it's that's when they give you the what I call the threat, the threat of giving up the secrets. And when they said to have your tongue torn out and your throat cut across, I was like, this is kind of like, I didn't I didn't I didn't give too much thought to it. It just sounded kind of kind of foolish. Basically how I took it as is if I go out and start giving up the secrets, I might get somebody might hurt me or something like that. So that's what they actually said to you. Oh, those are the things they would say if you were to give up those kind of secrets that, you know, your tongue be ripped out from your from your mouth and things like that. Yes. And as you go along each of the degrees, the obligations and the punishments get more violent. The second degree, I believe it's have your chest ripped open and your like your stomach cut across and literature and entered inward parts spill out all over the over the floor or something like that. The other guy might know a little bit better than me as far as exact words. So and then they talk, they discuss the thing about what do you seek light and masonry. So of course, again, it may not being born again, I'm not really in tune to all of what they're saying. So I'm giving you the story kind of like from my point of view as an unbeliever. Sure. So about two weeks in, I just started reading the Bible because they said that the Bible was an important part of the Masonic large and that you should read it and that there's many quotes and things of that nature taken out of it. And so I started reading the Bible. And I started realizing that there are a lot of things that were being said in there that they're saying that are kind of like skewed a little bit. It's not exactly the same exact words. So that kind of like reading the Bible alone piqued my interest in the Bible. So as I started reading, I started seeing some inconsistencies in what it was saying, and what they were saying, like in the Lamb skin apron explanation, they talked about how brothers would desire to be at the great white throne of judgment. So I was like, well, the great white throne of judgment were unbelievers, end up right. So I immediately knew that that was an inconsistency. But what really drew me away from it was the inconsistencies in their behavior. They talked about brotherhood. They talked about, you know, we're all on the same level, which that can't be true, because if you're a 32nd and I'm a third degree, we're not on the same level. There's tons of stuff that you know and have gone through and have done that I don't. So we had a politician in our group, and he ended up getting raised to the third degree before all of his other line brothers got raised to the third degree. So we asked why, and it was because he was a politician. So masons have a thing where if you're addressing another group of masons, you have to be at the third degree. You have to have gone through all the rituals of the third degree in order to address somebody at a Masonic event. So then we found out that he got raised to the 32nd degree and we didn't know about it again. So again, they do this because he's a politician and they need him for certain reasons. So I'm like, you know, this is a bunch of bulls. This is not what they're saying that it is. Basically, they were not on the square or on the level, meaning that they were just dishonest. So I went home and read my Bible one night and I was reading a story that kind of like aligned with, I'm not saying was the exact same thing. And I read it and I was like, to me at that time, it was contradictory. I said, you know what, I'm just done with, I'm just done with these guys. I'm never going back and I never went back to the lodge after that. Now you said, now what degree were you at? You said he was a 32nd? Yeah. So what happened is when you go from your fourth degree to your 32nd degree, it's supposed to take quite some time, but we did all 28 degrees, 29 degrees in one night because they realized that we were upset about this other fella going, being raised up just because he was a politician. So they gave, they basically said, this guy is important. So then when I found out about what I call the Masonic motto, the fatherhood of God, universal brotherhood of man and the soul aristocracy of the intellect, basically that's just like saying that smart people are better people. They're more, they're allegedly more intelligent and things of that nature. So that's basically why they raised him up was because they needed him for their, they needed him for whatever they needed him for, or they wanted him for what they needed him for, which was his title and position in politics. So now let me ask you this question. When you had, so let's go through the rankings again for those who may not know the levels. So is the first degree the entry level and the 33rd, the highest level? Yeah, first degree is the entered apprentice. I can't even tell you what the second is right now, but the third degree is Master Mason that's considered the blue, the blue house. 33rd degree, they claim it to be honorary, but it's my understanding because I do not have that ritual, but it is my understanding that it's a fairly dark ritual too. So it's just more than an honorary degree. There are some things that you say and do that are suspect. Now what were some things if you don't mind sharing if you were a 32nd degree or can you describe or can you let us know some things that you had done for rituals and the process that you had to go through during that time? So the fourth through the 32nd degree was, I don't remember anything honestly because all they did was read through the rituals, take us through the degrees and then that was it. So that I have very little knowledge, but the first, second and third degrees we were, we were hazed for whatever reason, I don't understand why they did it, but just to make us scared. So things such as hitting, asking us to drink certain things. So I have a habit, I sniff stuff before I eat it. So before I eat it or before I drink something. So when I tried to do that, they hit me and said, we didn't ask you to smell it. We told you to drink it. They hit somebody so hard that the dude fell down and I don't even remember him getting back up. But the things that I do remember about the first, second and third degree were the penalties of if you gave up the secrets. Those were the main things that I concentrated on. So let's do this. Let me shift gears a little bit. Vita, let's talk about your experience. What level were you involved in as a Mason? And let's talk about what brought you into that particular type of organization. Yeah, unlike Brother Fred, I got as far as the second degree. I didn't get any harder than that. I ran away from the second degree. What the thing about my situation was impressed upon me with the Masons was I had a lot of family. I had family that were pastors, that were deacons, that I had people that I knew where I stay here, that are prominent, who were in this organization. So you see the prestige and you see what they say, you can gain from it. It became a memory. And like he said, you know, to be one, ask one. So that peaked my interest just the same. So I did that. I was 2006, I think two years before I got married. And I was a police officer then. And my lieutenant was a 32nd degree as well. He was 32nd degree. And he was pressing upon me, you know, going ahead and doing it. But it'd be a good move. My mom at the time was doing the 32nd degree as well. And he even had a Masonic Bible. I don't know if people even know that, but there's a Masonic Bible. He had, I guess, what he referred to as a Masonic Bible. It was around the thumb through or something. I don't even remember even really opening it and looking at it like that. But it was at my residence. And going into what I'm telling you, I'll come back to that because it plays kind of a big deal into what I'm going to go into. But I wound up going, you know, like Brother Fred did, you know, first degree, second degree, like he says, it's a bunch of hazing, a bunch of trying to remember rituals, a part about the snatching, you know, tongue out and all that. It's the same as that thing. And basically for me, when I went into it, I was actually, I would consider myself a baby in Christ at the end of time. I was, like I said, that was running time. I was going to manpower. I was jakes. I was all that. I was in that realm then. So I was real charismatic. And I was so looking back now, probably wouldn't even believe her, but I thought I was still as a baby in Christ at the end of the time. So I was finding myself being in that. So when I was going through this process, even been a police officer, you know, we're always talk to analyze and know and ask questions. And before you do anything, look at it, take a look at it. So part of it I think was that. And I think a part of two with me was God, because I did remember asking when I got started, you know, God, no, this is something that I should do, you know, press upon me, you know, let me know, give me a sign, you know, again, being a baby in Christ to let me know. So before I even waited for him to respond, you know, I was already hit, hit, hit into it, you know, first degree in doing what I was doing. So I remember having that Masonic Bible, like I was telling you that my a month friend was, I gave to us. And I had a, I was in the first degree around that time. And I had bought it home, really didn't open it. But it was in my room. And my sister came to visit with her son one evening, as long as on Saturday, I'll never forget. And it was later in the night. And I was kind of, I had some uneasiness already, then I don't know if brother Fred could speak to this, but I will see things in the in the lodge or the tip when we walk in. There was I guess on the, I used to say podium, but it was a Bible on one side. And I want to say it was a Quran. I'm not sure, but they always had the Bible on one side. Am I correct in that? Yes, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. And so I will ask questions. I'm like, you know, because they were like, they told him, they will tell me it's the Christian, though it's a Christian organization, you know, it's blah, blah, blah. But like him, I had questions because I was seeing things that were interesting. You know, like, we know, hey, if it's Christian organization, how come we got the Bible and a Quran, you know, why is that just a Bible way? You know, we're trying to be, we don't want to step on toes. You know, we want to be, you know, it's Christian, but we want to be inclusive. But in my mind, you know, even being on milk understood that, you know, God, you know, being a Christian has nothing to do with being inclusive at all. You know, it's God, or it's nothing. So I was the one online asking all the questions because I was really being dealt with while the whole time I was online, I never had a piece about situation. That's how I remember asking God, you know, about whether or not I should do this not by didn't wait. But the whole time I was on his line, I was being wore out spiritual. I really was. I was fighting to stay the one thing. In fact, you know, and I had uncles, you know, like legacy people who are in this. So I think it's got to be right because I got uncles. I got everybody, people that I love, people that I know who are knee deep in this thing. So it's got to be okay. But anyway, going back to that, so the Bible was sitting there in my home. And I came over that night to stay, you know, my mom was there. And so in the middle of the night, I remember laying in the bed and I remember just being arrested, like really being paralyzed. I couldn't move. I heard these steps coming down the hallway. And what was crazy about it was we didn't have hardware floors. We had carpet. So I remember the steps. And then I could hear my sister screaming like somebody was actually attacking her, literally attacking her. So, you know, when it ran in, she was okay. My nephew was okay. That was that episode. And then that next night, I remember the exact thing, you know, the exact same thing. I remember steps coming down the hallway again, we got carpets, not hardware floors. So that was kind of crazy. I remember just really being violently shook. I was being, I was literally like under attack. Like, you know, I wasn't possessed, but I was, I was being attacked. I was being mess with. So, you know, we can, I remember getting up and something was in it was like, no, take that son of a Bible, you know, throw it out the house. That's when my mind went to throw it out the house. And at that time, I knew then I said, no, I can no longer stay in this, you know, there's no way I could stay. You know, it wasn't even a matter of me going back and having to face these brothers and say, like you said, no, they put pressure on you know, it was being hazed, you know, you couldn't leave, you know, I knew these secrets just from being in the second degree. So how are they going to turn me loose without, you know, possibly harming me or those are my thoughts. But I had my mind made up just having this supernatural experience with with it wasn't God, you know, that I couldn't always stay in this. So I remember going maybe that next week and I told me, you know, you know, I can't, I can only be in this is too many things that are inconsistent. And then I've had these experiences that don't that don't add up, you know, to being a Christian. So, you know, from the Bible in the Quran, to, you know, they even call where they go to temples, you know, they, it's a Masonic hall, they refer to as temple. So I even asked, you know, if you all have a have a Masonic Bible and you have a temple, that's a borderline religion, you know, so I will ask these questions. I just, you know, it's like, we're saying we're Christian and then the whole tipping tipping point, they were talking about going to a program or something. I guess I don't know they call it the same thing that the attorneys do conglades or whatever, but they have a program where they go to the automations, no, they meet there for a convention. And I was like, yeah, you know, that's a good thing. I could bring my girlfriend. I remember saying that to one of them. They were like, no, you know, we don't bring why you don't bring girlfriends, you know, believe the wives and girlfriends here, we go there, whatever we do there, stay there. And I asked, like I said, you know, again, in my mind, we're Christian organization, you know, how we operate outside of bounds of scripture, you know, you want, you know, be the man, making better men like brother, brother Fred said, that's contrary. So it was just too many inconsistencies for me to stay in there. And, you know, and just even under the spiritual attack, you know, like I said, the second degree was as high as I got, but I knew then that after the longer stay, you know, when I did go back, you know, I got out, I had guys know that was no, watch your back, you know, all that type of stuff, but it just didn't really matter to me, you know, I just no longer be a part of that, even being a baby in Christ. So yeah, that was my experience. So let's dig into a little bit of the history of the Masonic or Masonry. When you hear people talk about the foundations or its founders, can you guys, kind of like, if y'all remember any of the, you know, the foundational or the founders of these, of the Freemasons? This is the elephant in the room, whatever you want, the gorilla sitting at the bar or whatever, because there is no actual founders. They claim like John the Baptist and all this, but they have no historical, historical evidence of how and who actually founded the Masons because I honestly, so I'm just, this is an opinion. Sure. Everybody to know this. Sure. I think that if there were a set of founders of this organization and they decided to say, you know what, this is ungodly and leave, they would just wipe them off, just wipe them out of the organization as a whole. Not kill, necessarily kill them or anything, but just say, you know what, we can't consider these guys the founders, because then if they come out and start saying, well, we were the founders and we found a contrary to the word of God. So there is no true, like fraternities you have, Oscar Coleman, Edgar A. Love, Ernest Everett Just, you have specific individuals who chartered or started a fraternity and you have, and as well for female sororities, but you have no founders for Freemason. There's no real historical, what I would call historical reliable, historically reliable documents to say, here are these guys who started it. Here's our history. There is no history, except for the free and accepted Masons, which is considered, this is funny too, which is considered basically the black Masons. And then you have the ancient free and accepted Masons, AF and AM. There is no history. So can you guys tell me about the, Brother Tarwood had put the statement up here. He had mentioned the Scottish Rite in the York Rite. You brothers know about these two organizations? Yeah, so it's just another, I would say just another web and another strand in the web of deceit. So the Scottish Rite is, you go one way, you go first, second, third, and then the fourth through the 32nd. And then the other side, I can't remember what they call it, but you go through about 18 different degrees on that, on what's called the other, the other stairwell of Freemasonry. I never, I never did that. So what about, so Prince Hall, can we talk about him? He was the first black, I believe, Masons. Is that correct? Yeah. Okay. Can we talk about him? I mean, that's the, isn't that the largest Freemasonry organization here in the country or amongst amongst? Yeah. Okay. What about him? Do you know about his background and where do you get his stuff from? I know it's kind of hard to nail Jell-O to a wall, but nonetheless, it's a lot of nuances and a lot of ebbs and flows with this type of organization. But people will, I was reading the comment, I think Vita, he was in his conversation engaging Cain, the age of the birds, right? And he basically was, he was bristling back regarding the statement that I had made about the Divine Nine, fraternity, sorority, and society. And so he said, quote, he said, he's not a Divine Nine, but I love how the righteous think that they know what goes on inside of a frat house. They have done more charity than Facebook preachers from what I've seen. And so I hadn't invited him on, but he of course did not want to, you know, accept the invitation. But he kept defending, to my knowledge, he was defending the fraternities and sororities. And I believe he was even defending Freemasons. Craig, if I'm wrong though, Vita, I believe he was. I thought he was. He defended him so hard. I really, he went so hard to paint. I thought he actually was. I apologize to him, but he was going to be hard to paint for him though. Yeah. He said, quote, he said, Freemasonry and Greek fraternities, even though they are similar on how their process works. There are two totally different fraternities, and they have nothing to do with the, with the other. What do you all say about that? I can take, I can take direct quotes out of, out of fraternity rituals that come straight out of the Masonic rituals, especially Omega Psi five, because I think three of the three of the four founders were Freemasons. Wow. The fatherhood of God, the universal brotherhood of man and the sole aristocracy of the Inuit. And, and to get to his point about all the charity, you know, from, from a Christian point of view, that's works, you know, in faith, faith without works is dead. But you're not justified. You're not saved by your works. Right. So you can do all the great things and all this and that. And the third, what do they say the path to hell is way, the path to hell is way, but good intention. Yeah, pay good intentions. Yeah. You know, so I never knock those things. I don't knock doing great. I don't knock. If you want to have a have a voter registration, I don't knock if you want to tutor small kids how to read and things that those are those are great works. But the eat you don't sit there and lie about what goes on the frat house. I know what goes on frat house. I've been in frat houses. I've been I've been the good, the good that goes in there. The in the bad that goes on in there, you know, why, why do you, why do you all think? Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Finish the talk. Go ahead. Yeah. And then when people know what I'm talking about charity, like I always say that I'm just not being funny with being serious. Like, you know, the clan did the charity work. I mean, so that don't because people do charity doesn't make them say on the surface, a good situation. Charity is just what it is, you know, people can do those things. Yeah. So I mean, the mafia does a lot of good stuff. I mean, you have the mafia. Charity. I mean, so charity is what it is. I mean, Jay-Z does charity. I mean, so what does that mean? You know what I'm saying? But someone had Grace, Grace Mercy had asked a question. She said, can you ask them about the Eastern Star, the ladies part of the organization of Masons and are they the same? No, they're not the same. They're not even founded by women or anything of that, anything of that nature. They were founded by men to give women, I guess, a trinket because the boys will be boys and then, you know, the girls wanted to be girls, so they decided to start the Eastern Stars. That might be some loose history, but that's kind of like the undergirding of that. Same type of rituals. You know, you come in on a level and you leave on the square and stuff like that. So there's a lot of repeat. They just use different characters in their rituals to personify some sort of thing like love or sisterhood or brotherhood or things of that nature. It's basically just female Masons. Got you. Jackson, when asked the question, he said, can you ask them if George Soros is a Freemason to your knowledge? I don't know. We don't know what George Soros is to be honest with you. We know he's behind a lot of stuff, but I'm not sure what he is, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was. He's rich. Yeah, he definitely is that. Another question I wanted to ask you, brothers, and this is this is tying into the the universality question. They have they have rituals and credit me for wrong from what I have researched and what I studied has been years ago, but they have a religion for Muslims. They have a religion for Mormons. They have a religion for, I believe, every, every facet of, you know, of religion known to man. If you want to be a Mormon, there's a, there's a, there's a, you know, a Freemason report for Mormons or because it seems like they, from what I was told, they don't, they don't want to offend anyone's belief in the God that they believe they serve. Is that correct? Right. So there's, there's no like Mormon Masonic bothers. What they do is they basically tell everybody in the lodge, we're not going to have any discussions about your religion and your religion and this and that. As a matter of fact, that brings back a memory. I had a huge argument before I got out about that. I'm like, hold on a second. So I said, I clearly said, I said, I'm not a Christian. I said, but there's one thing that I know. I said, Allah and Jesus are not the same. You know, I knew that I said, because Allah has no son and Jesus has a son. I said, so I say, what? Oh, God has a son. I'm sorry. Yeah. Yeah. I have a son. Can somebody be hating and say, well, see, he don't know what you're talking about. I just want to make sure we clear that part up. But go ahead, bro. Go ahead. Yeah. So that was just another like red flag for me because if we're all brothers and we're on the level while we're in the lodge, why can't we have these discussions? Why can't we discuss religion? They just didn't want to do it. I think they had a fear of being exposed for claiming to be a Christian organization. But then basically, the great architect of the universe is the God of Freemasonry. And within the within the umbrella of the God of the great architect of the universe, on the tips of this umbrella, you have Buddha, Jesus, Jehovah, whoever else. Okay, got you. Yeah. So that's that's why the rituals obligations and things that they say in in there are basically what I call benign. So you don't have to say like, Jesus is my savior or anything like that. They don't they just avoid it completely. Hmm. So, yeah, somebody had a question for you, Vita, I believe. Proverbs said, the brother on the panel who was on the job, was he partial to criminals who were masons? He was a he was a police officer, right? Right? Okay, his question is, were you partial to criminals who were masons? I guess there's there's some significance, or there's supposed to be a big significance or favorites, you know, a preference to that. So my knowledge, I never experienced arrest and do somebody who was one. And I would like to believe if I had, that I would have been fair, regardless. But no, I don't to my knowledge, I don't remember doing anybody who was based, I was trying to go. Okay, got you. So I wanted to I wanted to go to another another topic here because there are people in the body of Christ who are masons. Um, and if you've been following the comments and the videos that I've that I've done, you heard about me having to leave my church because of the fraternities and sororities that they were parading and, you know, highlighting and acknowledging. But there is that there is a an overwhelming, there's overwhelming prevalence of Freemasonry in pulpits, in particular, in our black churches and our black pulpits. Why do you why do you brothers think that is? And why is that being allowed in our churches today? What's your name, Vita? Yeah, I'll let you go first. Go ahead, Vita, you ahead. I want to say some of this ignorance. Some of it is ignorance. I think the lot of it is self-fidilitary. We want, you know, what we shouldn't have. I mean, you know, I say we were created to worship God. We were created to know that what it is, you know, until Adam and Eve deal with what they did, then I was self-adulterated. I thought stuff can't get me to be. But when that was basically, you know, what it comes down to, to me, you know, we want the prestige, we want the notoriety, we want whatever the purse that comes with this thing. And if I can do this and, you know, and get a hand up, that's what I'm going to do. You know, a lot of us don't consider it, you know, don't see it as self-fidilitary. But what else can it be? You elevate yourself. You almost even become a different spirit. Like I said, you know, I say, hope my wife come in a second. When I went through what I went through, I changed. If you let people that become Omega, Kappa, Alpha, they take on whatever persona, whatever fraternity or sorority or no more mason that, you know, whatever they take on whatever persona of that organization that they are, you can't, you almost can't even deny it. You can't even not do it. It's a spiritual thing. So when you, when you attach yourself to these things, you know, it's just a bunch of, I mean, those self-adulteries, a bunch of me, me, me type of stuff. So I just don't know how you can know, be in it. And if you look at a lot of pastors, a lot of them are fraternity slash masons and not one or the other. Most of them are both. Wow. Wow. Brother Frey, what about you? Your thoughts? So most, most frats were founded probably about a generation after slavery. But of course, the slaves were from Africa. And there was a lot of things that they brought over from their culture and from their religion and how they worshiped and things of that nature. And a lot of these things that you see in fraternities, you can trace it back to what actually groups of African tribes do now, such as like the formation of a line. There's a ritual where young boys are taken from the tribe, taken from their mothers by the fathers. They're taken and they're placed in isolation. And the purpose, of course, is to make them into men. So what they do is they put them in line and they're all down on their hands and knees. And then the grown men rub their genitals on them. And humiliate them in any kind of way that they possibly can. And I'm not saying that that's the whole reason why we do what we do now. But you can't, those are things that you just can't overlook. The whole purpose of pledging is to isolate you from society, especially even your family. You no longer have a name, you have a line name. And then once you go over, people don't know you. People don't know me as, hey, that's Fred Hatchet. They know me as, oh, that's Fred Hatchet, the cube. So now you've assumed this, I'll just call it a Superman status, right? So you've gone from being Fred to being whatever your line name was, or you're just a lamp. Lamp number one, scroll number three. And then now you're a capo or you're a Omega and Alpha. And now you're out there for the world to see. But what the people also see, like on college campuses, is that they see you, that you have reduced yourself to cut, to shaving your head, to behaving in a certain way. And in order for that to happen, you do have to willfully do it. Now, I'm not a psychologist, but when you want something so bad, you're almost willing to do anything to get it. So the, me and a friend of mine had a discussion about how many, many pull pits, meaning the pastor and the deacons, they're basically one, a lot of them are basically one big fraternity. They want to run the show. They want to tell everybody what to do. You know, they want to, and they don't want, and this is the one thing that they don't want from their underlings, which is what, when you're pledging you're an underling, they do not want any back talk. They do not want any objective thinking. So if, if you tell me that, Hey, do you want to be an armor bearer? I'm going to say what I want to be an armor bearer for. So I was asked a question and that we were having a men's leadership conference. And the guy said, Well, you know, if there's a storm of tornado and the pastors with his wife at his house, you're supposed to leave your wife and your family and go protect him. So I rate, you know, I do the thing where I just raise my hand and I ask a question. I'm like, but doesn't the Bible say that the wife is way more, more important than the pastor? So these, all these guys came in as like this group mentality thing, all these guys came in and said, But, but if the pastor gets hurt, who, who, who, what are we going to do? I said, Well, if the pastor is smart, I said he'll have somebody who he believes that can take over his duties. And but I said, Here's, here's the bigger problem. You're so worried about protecting the pastor. I said, but what if, what if somebody's points are done at me? What's the pastor going to do for me? Isn't he supposed to protect the sheet? You know, and they realized that that scenario sounds it's a good, it's a, it's a, it's a, they understood that it made sense. But yet and still they just continued on down that road. And then when the guy said, Well, if you want to talk to the pastor about it, we can go down the hall right now. So I'm, you know, I'm like, Okay, let's go. I'm, I'm walking and I look back and he's not there. This whole group, yeah, this whole group thing and being in groups, that's one thing. But then now you have these like these nine separate groups in the, in the divine nine, as they say, cracking on each other. Look, they fraternities and sororities can't even come together and buy a hotel, have their national meetings and use the hotel to generate money. They just, it's, it's, it's like they suffer from this, from the problem of, well, you might get more than me or you might get over on us. And they, it's just a common symptom of the society of society. I think that black culture, go ahead. I'm sorry. No, it sounds like the most, most churches today, crabs in a bucket mentality. Yeah, crabs in a bucket. Wow. Someone had, I think it was Jackson, he wanted to ask this question, he said, to ask you, brothers, do you know of any presidents who were Freemasons? Yeah. Yeah, who are the people in Congress now that are Freemasons? If you know of any, I know that I know that the early presidents were, I mean, in fact, I know, I believe Bush was president, I mean, was a, was a Freemason president and a few others. I mean, most of the, most, most Congress and those political office are. And proud, and some of them are proud of it, either either they are Freemasons or they are part of a fraternity or sorority. I mean, proud. I know, I'm not, this is a print. I know Sharpton is a signal, but he's also Boulay too. Boulay is a higher up, even from the, that's the whole of the situation. But it speaks to why they back, what they back to when you see what they stand for. I think a lot of them, they seem to use, they seem to use, matter of fact, they seem to use the poem Invictus. Yes. And I asked somebody about that. I said, you guys talk about Christianity, but the one, the one line where he says, no, I'm the captain of my soul. And I said, well, how can you be the captain of your soul and be a believer? And Christ is supposed to be, you know, Lord of our souls, Lord of our lives. Right. And I could never get a, get a straight answer from that. But Mason Hughes was, I think he was Omega, but he wrote that poem, I think. Right. Wow. So, yeah, Earl was saying it was a requirement in the African American church in the South. If you wanted to be a pastor or deacon, you had to be a Prince Hall Mason. I can't attest to that. I don't have to do research on that to know that to be true. Yeah. So, so needless to say, I'm Christianity and Freemasonry are incompatible and why is that from a core, from a core doctrine standpoint? We can, we can talk about the, the rituals, which is also going to be a core issue. But, but just from the core, what do, what do Freemasons believe in order to go to heaven? What, what must a Freemason believe? Do they believe that there is a heaven? Do they believe that there is, you know, that they must repent in turn to Christ? I mean, what, what, what do Freemasons believe? What do they teach? You say no for it, huh? No, absolutely. No repentance. Just be a good Mason. Works, but works. Works and be a good Mason. And that will get you into the, yeah, you will get into the canopy in the sky if you, if you're a good Mason. Wow. I'm just looking at this comment that, uh, because I was, I told, I told, uh, Kane, uh, if he was going to be, you know, watching to, he said he was going to watch much of his, but I had invited him on to, to give an opportunity to, to share his, his position and defend it. Uh, but he said this, he said, and I'm trying to trace all with it, with the comments that he mentioned. He said, he said, please save me this. He said, please save the scripture talk because I was speaking with him about what does the Bible teach? And he said, Seiko, please say the scripture talks. Scriptures have nothing to do with personal experience and pledging for a fraternity or sorority. What's we going to use? We're Christians. The baseline, what we do need to do. That's what he said. Let me give an honest, let me give an honest. Please write it. It doesn't, because if you're going to go and get your butt beat for eight weeks, it doesn't have anything to do with scripture. You just violated. That's what it is. You're, look, people who say, I know I'm a sinner, but I can tell you right now, hazing and that pledge and stuff, they say that is the devil. I'll give it. I can't, I don't have it in writing, but I'll tell you what a guy said on a website. He said, when I first got hit by a cane when I was pledging kappa, he said, my soul jumped out of my body, went to my car and waited for my body to get there. But if we're promoting brotherhood, if we're promoting brotherhood, just on that, on that part alone, how are we promoting brotherhood with the virus? I mean, we talked with the Christianity part, just low hanging fruit, just on the hazing alone, the secrets. It just doesn't, the ecumenicalism, just being inclusive. People do all these big things, but if one part of it is wrong, then it's all wrong to God. It's all wrong. It'll be a whole bunch. No, it's low hanging fruit. Yeah. He said, he said, I will listen to your show and hopefully someone from the divine nine comes on there and educate you. Now, again, on the origins of fraternity, sororities, and also freemasonry, secret society. This is what this gentleman had said to me, because he says that, well, you're getting your information from YouTube. I'm like, no, bro, I'm not getting my information from YouTube. I'm getting my information from people. And if they just happen to be on YouTube and they're spitting truth, what's the problem with that? I mean, he basically was coming against anybody that was contesting against these types of rituals and against the demonic origins of these things. And he said, he said this, he said, they had nothing to do with religion. Your religion and the deity you praise is your own personal faith because you need helping life. I hate to be the better, I guess he meant to say bearer of bad news, but everybody doesn't need help. Some people can tread in deep ocean water without light or without no life vest. Others can't. There's a difference between people who use faith as a shield. I know I have nothing against what you believe in and what you practice as your own home. But once you start criticizing others for not following what you follow, that's when it becomes a little crazy. This is what this guy was saying. And I'm just like, well, bro, so, so let me let me defend him. Okay. So Jesus did not have to say that your religion is wrong or that it's bad. When he said, I am the way the truth in the light, no man comes unto the Father, but by me, he is excluding every other belief that somebody may have. Right. So be mad at me, be mad at him. So you're right. Because that's what I was going to ask you. I was going to ask you guys because Freemasonry is an is an inclusive religion, right? Yes. And so what you just mentioned, what you just mentioned for Christianity is exclusive. It's only one way, one way. That's it. So, so when I when I hear these, when I hear these people, you know, for the record, I was reading his, his, this is a conversation he and I had last week. So he's not, he's not responding to me live. So forgive me for not clarifying that. But this was a comment that he made to me regarding my, my public disdain and, and, and coming out against, you know, frat sororities and secret societies, but he was basically making those statements in defense of these groups, because he believes that those of us who are Christians, we just basically being judgmental, we're being self righteous. We don't know what we're talking about, you know, the whole nine. And so again, I had invited him to come on at the time, but he, but he never did. But so when we talk about the rituals, right, if the rituals don't bring you to Christ and these preachers, these pastors that are, that have pledged or that have given their life to these organizations, then what does that, and I'm just asking for you all, you, you all, you know, a personal opinion, what, in other words, what would you say if you're, if you found out that your pastor was a Freemason? What would you say? How would you respond to that? I would go ahead. Just to my experience, I don't know how you can be without, I mean, cracking open the plethora of scriptures that that speak again. I mean, there's no way that you can, like I said, I was on milk, most of my process, but there's no way if you are a pastor that's been in it any length of time, that you can ignore scriptures that totally in the cross here speak actually against this and still stand the pulpit. I don't see how you can do it. I don't, I mean, it's, it's, it's clear. Yeah, it's clear. Now, whether you want to ignore and continue to do what you're doing is one thing, but the Bible is clear on this. And this is another thing. When we're before God, we really are seeking the truth. God, what one withhold that from us? If we're actually really wanting to know the truth of some situation, like I asked myself, God won't withhold that from us, but a lot of us sometimes get the answer that we don't want and continue on. You know, so I don't see how you can. What's that you brother Fred? Yeah, so when I, when I know I have a personal, if they allow, I have a personal discussion with them. And I might even, like if I go to shake their hand or something, I'm going to hit, I'm going to hit them with the, with the pressure on their knuckle. So they'll know. Oh shoot. And then so what happens is usually in that case, Oh, what's up, bro? Yeah. Can we talk about, can we talk about that handshake? Wow. Already I'm broken. Yeah. I've already broken protocol because by saying, let's talk about this handshake, that's not even how you're supposed to go about doing it. But yeah, I'll put my finger on the knuckle or I'll pump the hand like for fraternity brother, whatever, I'll pump the hand as many times as I need to to get his recognition. And then we can go on go forth after that. That's pretty slick. That's pretty slick, bro. Pretty slick. Justin, he had asked another question. I'm not sure y'all know this question. So, but I'll ask it. I'll put it up nonetheless. He wants to know what about Trump and, and I think he said Biden of whether you all know if they are Freemasons or not. And I don't know if y'all know him now, but I'm just, you know, Jackson, I'm not sure they know that or not. So, I wouldn't know. Okay. All right. All right. So, I know for well, with those presidents, a lot of them go through the skulls and bones to become what they, what I read, research, yeah. Now, what's the difference between skulls and bones and the, I mean, what's the difference between skulls? And again, for those who don't know, or for those who ask and inquire, since you mentioned that, what's the difference between skulls and bones and Freemasons? Or is it, is it pretty much, you know, kind of like an overlap? It's an overlap as far as, you know, the secrecy aspect, except they seem to be able to function more in secret than the other organization. You don't see guys going around wearing skull and bone shirts, you know, rings or anything like that. So, they really operate under the radar more so than anybody else. Wow. So, Christianity, is Christianity a secret religion or is Freemasonry a secret religion? Freemasonry is not really a secret religion. It's just an aberration of the truth. So, it's a, it's a religion, but they, they choose, they pick and choose what they want to reveal about themselves or about their religion. The, almost the, like the universal brotherhood of man and fatherhood of God, that's in their ritual, but it's also something that they come out publicly and will say, yeah, we're, we believe in the fatherhood of God. They'll say that in public, but they won't say anything about, you know, entered apprentice or anything like that out in public just freely. But the thing, the thing that about Christianity is you have millions and millions, I'm going to say millions and millions of Bibles. If you want to read a Bible, you can go online and read the Word of God. You can go anywhere you want basically and read the Word of God. Now, if you're in a Muslim country, you know, of course, you might have some, it had some problems, but if there's a Bible there, you can freely read it. And the thing about having a relationship with Christ is no matter what happens in the end, you're going to be all right. But with these guys, you never, you never know, you just never know how it's going to end up for you without, without forming some sort of relationship with Christ. So, you might form a relationship with Christ. You might not immediately come out because it, you know, you have relationships. There's things that you may or may not understand. But I believe that eventually God reveals himself. He reveals the truth and, you know, hopefully that's enough to bring people to a denunciation. Wow. I wanted to share this because I believe by the way you had sent this to me. I think it's, I think it's important for us to, to read this. And let me go ahead and just share the screen. And if you, and if your brothers, if you can't see the screen, there's, there's an up and down arrow on the bottom of your screen that you can probably see a separate screen if I, if I share this, but let me know if, if you can see it there. Can y'all, can y'all see that? Now let me open up my screen. Big house looking at some other stuff. Oh, yeah. Can y'all see that there? Do we have to share the screen or anything? Well, no, well, I know I'm, I'm sharing it. I'm sharing it for the viewers. I think the viewer can see, can see it on my end, but I want to make sure that that they can, that they can see it. If not, I'll just read it because I think it's showing behind my, it's showing behind the, yeah, it's showing behind it. So let me do this. Let me just take this off here. And I'll just do it this way here. Let's go back. And now it just took my, it took my thing off. See that dog on it? What did it just do? So you want me to read the part about the lamb skin apron? Yeah, that'd be fine. Yeah, go ahead. Let me go, let me get to it. Let me go back down here. Where is my thing at? Make sure I'm on the right degree. Take this off here. Okay, I got it. So you ready for me to read it? Yeah, go ahead. All right. My brother, I now present to you this lamb skin or white leather apron. It is an emblem of innocence and the badge of a mason. This is the distinguished badge of a mason. It may be that in the coming years upon your head may rest the lower wreath of victory. Pendant from your breast may hang jewels fit to grace the diadem of an Easter potentate. Nay, more than these with light added to the coming light, your ambitious feet may tread round after round of the ladder that leads to to fame in our mystic circle. And even the purple of the fraternity may rest upon your honored shoulders. But never again from the mortal hands, never again until your enfranchised spirit shall have passed upward and inward through the pearly gates, shall any honor so distinguished, so emblematical of purity and all perfection be conferred upon you as this which I can now bestow. It is yours, yours to wear with wear throughout an honorable life and at your death to be deposited upon the coffin which shall enclose your lifeless remains. And with them laid beneath the clouds of the valley, let its pure and spotless surface be to you an ever-present reminder of a purity of life and rectitude of conduct. A never-ending argument for nobler deeds, for higher thoughts, for greater achievements. And when your last and when at last your weary feet shall have come to the end of life's toilsome journey, and from your nervous grasp shall drop forever the working tools of life, may the record of your life and actions be as pure and spotless as this fair emblem which I place within your hands tonight. And when your trembling soul shall stand naked and alone before the great white throne, there to receive judgments for the deed while done here in the body, may it be your portion to hear from him who sitteth as the judge supreme the welcome words, well done thou good and faithful servant. Wow. Man, let me see if I get my wall back up here. I don't know why it went away. Let me see if I can find it again. Let's see here. Let me do this for a second. Give me a minute, fellas. I don't want to do it again. I don't know that much. Go back. I was wondering, I wanted to read another portion in here because it was it was basically discussing the beliefs of the different, different, different religions. And in it, it was, it was addressing. I'm trying to find it real quick, but my screen is acting up right now. So let me, let me do this for a second. Give me one second, guys. Because I had everything fine. But now I know not to do this again. Let's try to put it up in this one. Let's see. Here we go. All right. Here we go. So I'm just going to read, I'm just going to read this, this section here on the screen. I'm not going to share because I want to lose my background on here. So it was, it was the the Masonic paradigm and I'm quoting right now. It says, it says, quote, Freemasonry is able to accept the Christian's faith, the Christian's faith in the father, son and the Holy spirit as evidence in the existence of a quote, supreme being in quote. Similarly, Freemasonry is able to accept the Mormon's faith in a God who was once a man living on another planet as faith in the existence of a supreme being, quote unquote. Freemasonry, likewise, except the Muslims faith in Allah, a God who has no son as faith in the existence of a supreme being. The Hindu is also able to satisfy the Masonic requirement of faith in the existence of a supreme being, quote unquote. With this faith that everything that exists is part of Brahman. How is faith, how is Freemasonry able to accept these different incompatible concepts of God as expressions of faith in the existence of a singular supreme being? Answer, Freemasonry, it says Freemasonry is able to do this essentially because the Masonic paradigm of God holds that all men worship the same God simply using a variety of different names. Someone like Hinduism, Freemasonry holds that all of these various gods along with the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob are all in essence the same God, viewed from the different vantage points of the many world religions. Freemasonry rejects the concept of a false God as well as the concept of false religion. These Masonic teachings are clearly explained in Masonic monitors, Masonic code and other Masonic materials published by the authorities of Freemasonry, the Grand Lodges and it says consider the following excerpts, quote. This is from the Louisiana Masonic Monitor, 1949, quote. There never was a false God nor was there ever really a false religion unless you call a child a false man and that's quote from Max Miller, Max Miller, quote from the Kentucky Monitor. As Masons we have one faith, one hope, one charity. We believe in and depend upon the same God, have the same hope of eternal life and that same charity which is of an enduring and uniting nature which will enable all the good and true to keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace and in righteousness of life. Not only does Freemasonry tease at all false gods are actually God by another name. Freemasonry also applied the teachings of eternal life to all Masons without faith in Jesus Christ. So just wanted to, just wanted to point it out, brothers, to you because I think this was, this was being something that would be important as well. Someone had asked the question, I'm not sure if you wanted to answer this though, brother Vita, and it was regarding denunciations. I believe my wife was asking this question. Let me scroll down and see what she said. I did not get to Jackson's question because he has a lot, but Jackson, I can't get to all of them, bro. Sharon said, how dangerous is it to denounce these groups? How dangerous was it for you guys? How dangerous was it for you, Vita? I think for me, I thought this was going to be more dangerous than what it was. I think honestly like Freemasonry alluded to, just depends on what group and who you're dealing with. They made some isolated threats and said whatever came from leaving, but my mind was already made up. I really didn't even care what they were going to try to do. So my own experience with anything other than things being seen and our role, but for the most part. Okay. Jackson asked this question, it's a two-part question. Do Hollywood actors have blood sacrifices and to get to where they are? I think we've heard this before, so. I guess I'm holding the level with that. Yeah. Pedophilia and everything. Hollywood was on the whole level. Right. Got you. All right. So let's see. All pro sports is rigged. He says, a lot of pastors and YouTube ministries are a part of the Brotherhood Freemasonry, Wolves and Sheeps Clover. He says, I believe there should be a public renouncing of Freemasonry in all of its many tentacles. Let's see. And then someone else, I'm trying to read y'all's comments before we wrap up. I think Grace Mercy said, what you know about, what you know now about Masons, would you say a person can't be a Professor Christian and an active Mason member? It's impossible. If you're a genuine follower of Christ, Jesus says no man can serve two masters. You can't serve two masters. You're going to love one and hate the other, despise one and hold to the other. But you can't do both. My wife just mentioned that right there. You can't do both. That's like saying you worship Satan and you worship God. You can't serve both. You cannot serve both. It is impossible. All sports is rigged again. He says, a lot of those in the Brotherhood, especially on the lower tiers, don't know the deeper roots of its evil and higher degrees. So we have to pray for those lured into this deception. So yeah. Yeah, I think that this is again, a lot of this, I believe, a lot of this I believe is wrapped in the demonic. I do believe that without question. I do believe also that when we don't address these types of things, then it just gives the enemy more room to move into the church. And it just disappointed me because someone had mentioned about R.A. Vernon. He'd be rocking his Greek frat gear and stuff in the pulpit. But it also shows a lack of accountability amongst these men. There's no biblical accountability among these men that are supposed to be pastors. If they were biblical elders, biblical leaders, I really believe and if they understood this stuff, it wouldn't fly. Why did I just do it myself? I just got rid of myself. Let me bring myself back in. Lord have mercy. Where did I go? Bring me back in. You can still hear us though, right? Yeah, I can still hear you guys. It's not y'all. I ended up hitting the wrong button and ended up getting out for just a second. Hold on. Let me do this again. Okay. Where am I at? So I tell you what, because we was getting ready to wrap up anyway. But go ahead. How do you reconcile? I mean, I guess just speaking just to the general but how do you reconcile? I mean, a lot of these chance because I said I was police officer on HBCU for 17 years, you know, in the deputy as well. But and listen to a lot of these chairs, a lot of these fraternities, you know, sororities say most of you can't even say in the church. So that number of stuff, I mean, how do you not understand? Because I listen to some of the things that they say when they have these probates, when they go over. And I said, if you all carry half that into the church, you couldn't even say it. So how do we just how do we not understand that we these things just not not not they're they're not of God, they're not. And some things that these people say, you know, if your parents heard you say it, but I mean, I guess they're they're adults now in college, but you can't go into the sanctuary and say it. So what do we not understand? Fred, any final thoughts, any thoughts before we wrap up? All right. So although, of course, it's it's it's all anecdotal, but you have to ask this is this is what I used to get phone calls a lot about. And I still do every now and then you have people who are engaged or and or married, and their spouses will not reveal the secrets. They will not show them their rituals. And it's it's a great strain on their relationships. Because it's like, well, what do you what are you hiding from me? Nothing? Well, how do I know that you're not hiding anything from me? Why don't you let me read your ritual? And let me just be be sincere here. The information, most of the information contained in these rituals are already public knowledge anyway. That's why most of them who try and claim this copyright mess is it. It has to be it has to be esoteric knowledge and most of the knowledge that they have is not esoteric. They just use this secrecy to bring in the people that will go through whatever they'll go through to get in. And the whole for for the guys, I'm not sure how it is for women and fraternity and sororities. But if you're if you go out and you perpetrate, and you get a lot of the ladies and stuff like that, that that's what the fraternity is really trying to protect is is the fact that you didn't go through what I went through. Therefore, you have no right to impersonate me. So what I always used to say to to my former Omega brothers is, Okay, if if if I'm a Christian, and I wear your and I'm not no member of your fraternity, but I wear your paraphernalia, wouldn't I be the ultimate example for you? Wouldn't you? Isn't that what you would want? Because they go out and brag about how many bros are preachers. So if if I'm wearing the shirt, you don't have to worry about me damaging the the damaging your fraternity in some type of way, because I'm not going to go out there and paddle somebody, I'm not going to go out there and start running a whole whole bunch of women or something like that. So that's what I always used to say, you know, what is it about me wearing your shirt that bothers you? And it's all it all comes back to the fact that the only thing that fraternity and sorority members have in common is the process that they went through to get there. That's it. Wow. Can I ask a question? Yeah, go right here. Go ahead. Well, brother Fred, on that process, I know a couple years back, I think it was some a.k.a. somebody had drowned in the ocean doing something that was like a national hiatus on on hazing. Is it still frowned upon for people to go against the quote unquote paper or are they still, you know, they kind of relax? No, there's two separate brotherhoods and sisterhoods out there. If you don't pledge, there's there's still a vast amount of people who will call you paper. And, you know, my thing is if your paper, of course, I don't want you going through the rituals and just saying these things and whatnot. But by refusing to be hazed, I think that's a I think that's a good thing. You're you're actually doing, you know, something that other people aren't willing to do. And that is stand up and say, I know I don't know what you I don't know what you're going to have me saying these rituals because I haven't seen them yet. But I know you're not going to put a paddle on me. I know you're not going to slap my face. I know you're not going to spit on me. And nine times out of 10. What'll happen is you'll just get dropped for the line because they don't want you. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead, man. Yeah, I was saying, so a lot of that talk was window dressed. They basically still do the hazing basically pretty much still glad here to talk about people and how people pay for it got worse because it drove pledging underground. Gotcha. That makes sense. Okay. Wow. So someone had asked this question for you for your brothers. Just a couple of questions before I let you all go. This is from Grace Mercy. She says, How did you get out of the Masonic Lodge? How did you how did you brothers get out? What was your way of getting out? I'll start with you, Vita. For me, it was easier with me only having been second degree, but I just simply went like I said that next day after I had that experience, just told them I wanted no more to do with it. You know, take me off whatever scrolls, books they had me on, but I was basically done. And of course, they tried to talk me out of it. You know, they said that I already knew too much and I couldn't, but I was going to stand 10 toes down on that situation after what I experienced spiritually. But I think had the further I had gone in the harder it would have been for me to get out, but to me being two degrees in wasn't that hard yet. Got you. Fred, what about you? So as far as Freemasonry, you know, not not being born again. I just like I said, I saw some things that I didn't agree with. And I just I physically separated myself from them. And that was that was all that it took. And to show how much they cared about me, they didn't get in touch with me for about four to six weeks, because they were wondering where I was at. They should have realized the first Sunday that I didn't show up that something wasn't right. Somebody should have called me right then and there, but they did about six weeks. But as far as the fraternity, once you once you repent, you know, Romans 116 from not ashamed of the gospel of Jesus Christ, where it is a power of God for salvation, everyone who believes so to the Jew first and also the Greek. So once once you repent and ask God to to forgive you of your sins and things of that nature, um, that's the only denunciation you need to give. You don't have to send a letter to somebody and say, you know, I'm out, take me off the road, because some fraternities have a rule that they don't take you off the road. So what are you going to do? You don't think that yeah, they don't cap out the side does not take you off off the road. Oh, you in for life. You in for them, you're in for life. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. That's right. Man. I don't, I don't think, I don't think Omega South lies removed me from their roles. They said they did, but I don't think they've removed one name from the role. Wow. So I was the officer, one of the officers of Memphis that beat the black guy. I think he was on the other thing. They removed him. Is that because that nature of the incident is that different or right? That's how you that's how they have to kick you out. You can't out. Right. Got you. Got you. Yeah. So here's a, here's a, here's a question and I'll, I'll put it up on the screen. What is two? Is sexual assault a part of the hazing process? And the second question was, is there, is there a bigotry in Freemasonry, like separated by blacks and whites? I believe that was at the beginning, wasn't it? Yeah. Yeah. So basically Prince, Prince Hall, oh, I'm sorry, go ahead, bro. Prince Hall had to have permission granted from the Lodge of England. I think it was, I think he got that in eight, shoot, 1796 or something like that. So the Lodge of England actually had to give him a charter to be able to practice Freemasonry. I'm not saying that this had anything to do with, with racism or anything like that. But once, when whites didn't want to allow blacks into their Freemasonry, Prince Hall said, well, we're going to, we want to start our own. And I guess they let them start it because you needed to have all the rituals and all the information to go through all the degrees. So, but I look at it as, yeah, it's segregated. I mean, the most, what did they say, the most segregated day of the week is Sunday? Sunday morning, yeah. Sunday morning, because of course, on Sunday afternoons, especially when football seasons around, everybody's all together, black, white, Hispanic and otherwise, they're all together, you know, rooting for their teams. But yeah, there's bigotry. Black people do not want, I'm going to just say it straight out, black Greeks do not want white Greeks in their organizations. They just don't. There are some, but they just don't want them in there because they are, they say, well, they might try to subvert the organization. I don't know, maybe it's true. Maybe that's why, maybe that's why a white, white guy will get beat, beat half the death. God, I can't believe what I'm saying. Get beat half the death to be a part of a black fraternity. Hmm. Which explains, which explains the BGLOs, the BGLOs came because of the fact of the, of the, the white Greek letter organizations. They did not, they did not want them into theirs. So that's why they started their own, their own black fraternities and organizations. Was that a two-part quiz about the social assault part? Yeah, it was. Yeah. Yeah. Well, let me read it again for you. Did you get it? Yeah. So it says, he said, is sexual assault a part of the hazing process? That was the first question. And the second one was about bigotry. Is bigotry a free masonry? I'll tell you, well, that's supposed to be the biggest mature part of it, but as far as the sexual assault part, being a police officer on the HBCU and it never failed for the most part every spring, a lot of reports that we got and we dealt with. Now, I don't know if Mr. Hatch to me with this, but I know for Omega, I think Omega, the capital, sometimes they have was called Omega sweets, capital sweets. They have certain girls they pick that they have that do some things while they're in the going through, whatever they're doing. And sometimes these things turned into, you know, unpleasant situations, gang rapes. The girls would be drunk or they would get high or whatever. And they wanted to take advantage of them. They'd be video. So yeah, that happened more than a little bit. Absolutely. Wow. So two questions, what I mean, here's the last question. And then I wanted to wrap it up with this question in a form of an appeal in the answer. What would you say, what would you brother say to someone who is a Freemason or part of a fraternity or sorority? What would you say to somebody that may be watching this live right now? Because there are some curious Georgians out there right now watching this live. Okay. And they probably won't want to come up and nothing like that. But there are some people out here watching this live and they're hearing what you brothers are saying. What would your exhortation, admonition be to those people? There's absolutely nothing in these organizations that are going to help assist your relationship in Christ. At some form or fashion, you will be asked forced or to compromise or just keep your mouth shut when it comes to your Christian faith. That's right. I would say, you know, you listened to one brother tonight that wasn't even a believer when he walked away and myself, like I said, I was, you know, a babe in Christ is low hanging fruit. You know, if you really want to know the truth about these and you're actually asking God with a sincere heart, God will show you. But you have to be asking what's in your heart and be diligently seeking the answers to what you're asking because he'll give them to you and just be ready and understand that, you know, it's going to require the total opposite of what you got into it for. Do you want, instead of being about yourself, you're going to totally surrender yourself and ask not to help you through it because I had to have help to get through that. You know, it went from what I wanted to do to now. I have to help myself and walk away from this. So God is there. God does not desire that we be ignorant of the truth. If you really are asking and truly diligently seeking, God will look into those answers. Amen. Absolutely. Absolutely. So I wanted to say this to both of you brothers, man. I'll put you both on screen for some reason. I can't be on this brick wall with y'all right now, but you'll hear me. I wanted to just say the first, first, foremost of both of you. I appreciate you two brothers for coming on. This is, this was long overdue. Fred, you had been following my manager, man, since I had Fred Price Jr on. Remember that. That was back in what 2012, 2013, Fred? Yeah, we kind of like busted him out a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So and he came on and we were talking about Christians and fraternities and sororities then. And you and I had clicked up, but we never had the opportunity, man, to dialogue the way we did now. But it was in God's providence. I'm grateful, man, for our friendship. Grateful for you to be able to share your heart. And I know, though, this is just the tip of the iceberg ladies and gentlemen, there's more to it than just this. But just wanted to, you know, give your brothers your flowers topside and tell you guys how much I appreciate your candid approach and your no-nonsense commitment to the truth, man, regarding that. Vita, you, brother, you were a part of an organization even or you supported G Craig Lewis, right? Absolutely. It's funny. And you didn't like your boy. You didn't like your boy. So let's, can we, can you talk about this a little bit before I let you go and how God dealt with that? Yes, sir. I sure will. I was, somehow I was on YouTube and somebody was talking about your name and about somebody coming against Greg Lewis. No, coming, coming against Greg Lewis. Like, yeah, this guy in Sicklewood's got these videos and seeing all these things. And I'm like, you know, let me go see, you know, not, not understanding. So I'll go on and not listen to what you were saying. I'm like, I mean, no, you know, no, no way, you know, nah, nah. And, you know, I listened to everything that you said, but then I was on a Craig Lewis support group on Facebook and I was like, man, this dude on here, you know, talking jobs and this and everything. I said, but I'm gonna listen to what he's saying. Again, you know, being, being police officer, no, I was actually done with police by that time, but I still understood just in investigating. I listened to what you were saying. And then, you know, I started, you know, going back to some things that you were talking about, some things that he had said and done and then again, like in the guest, you know, examine and like, like the scripture. And then when you bought on these people, these, these victims, these women, and, you know, again, unless you want to be a fan of someone long enough or not face truth, what they were saying, it just didn't, it's too coincidental for these women not to have known each other and say the same things that they were saying. And then listen to the men that were protecting him and all the things that was happening. You know, I went from not liking what Seiko was saying to like, wow, this brother here is bold. You know, he was saying what he was saying. And, you know, I had, I had to apologize. You know, he didn't know who I was. I was like, no, I got to apologize. Because when I first seen videos, I didn't even like, like who you were, you're coming against a guy that I had basically idolized, you know, and then I was even idolizing him until you upset my situation with him. So I had to, you know, like, you know, this brother, he came on here and really set things straight with me and help me understand that it got dangerous that the support that I was giving someone was going above a healthy situation, scriptural. Wow. So, you know, I thank you for your boldness and what you do. Even now with this, John McCarthy, you know, you've always been consistent. And anybody that's coming against you, what's going on right now, all I ask is, look at what the brother's been doing and saying, he's been consistent. He hasn't veered away from what he's been doing and saying the entire time. His tap is just what they are. He's come with you with scriptures and Bible. And no matter who it is, you know, let's take the idols out of the way. Is there this line of scripture? Are we examining enlightened scripture? Is it right or is it wrong? So, you know, so I thank you for what you do. I thank you for letting me share the stage with Brother Hatch. I follow his ministry as well. You know, awesome, you know, what he's been doing too. So I just been honored tonight just to be able to do what you are. Thank you. I appreciate your brothers, man. And let people know, man, if you don't mind, if you wanted to reach out to you guys, man, I'm pretty sure, because, you know, this is not my wheelhouse. I'm just basically laying out the carpet, you know what I'm saying, for people to come on and walk the stage. So, Fred, let people know how they can reach out to if you would like, if you want people to, you know, if they have questions and need to, you know, want to hit you up on the side, man, behind the scenes and just have a conversation. How can they do that? So I've never been too shy about it. So my phone number is 919-278. 89911. Put that up again. 919-278-8911. All right, moderators, if you can get that out, I'll put that up on the screen. If y'all have, uh, were able to write that down and I'll populate it on the screen if you, uh, if y'all were able to hear that, that number. One more time for them just to, just to make sure, um, brother Fred, case they wanted to put it up on the screen for you. Okay. 919-278-8911. All right. All right. Somebody said spam calls. Here we go. You said, he said he's shy about it. So hey, he not, you know, I have a phone out of, yeah, I have a phone out of it. They'll say, they'll tell me if it's spam or not. So they can always text him. Yeah. Yeah. We should, that brother vehicle, man. Appreciate that, brother. Thank you so much, man. Appreciate that. Uh, let's see. Here it is right here. Here's the number here. 919-278-8911. That's brother Fred's number right there. So, um, again, appreciate you, brother, man. Thank y'all so much. Um, brother, brother, uh, Peter, how can he reach out to you, bro? Um, three, three, six. Oh, y'all giving out numbers. Well, y'all dropping area calls up in this joint. Okay. Yeah, I forgot. He was in North Carolina as well. He's down the road. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Moderators, get ready to write this number down. So we put it up on the screen. Go ahead. Yeah. Yeah. 336-473-0176. One more time. 336-473-0176. All right. I have no problem with any questions. Yeah. All right. So ladies and gentlemen, if y'all have any questions or comments, so you want to get more information regarding Freemasonry, the teachings, if you're trying to help someone else come out of it, these two brothers will be able to do that. All right. They'll be able to do that. Um, I believe in referring people to, to information that I don't know. I don't have to have all the answers, but I can point you to the, to the ones who may have the information and the answers for you. So, um, and that's what the body of Christ is for. This is what this is about, ladies and gentlemen. We keep talking about body, life, body, life, body, life. This is not a cliche. This is, this is supposed to be a culture. Okay. Uh, I don't, I don't, I don't care for cliches. I'm all about culture. I'm all about making sure that we, um, are able to be a blessing to the body of Christ, uh, anyway we can. So, uh, nonetheless, let's continue to, uh, to do that, uh, for people that are, you know, in search and seeking for, for the truth. So, again, brothers, man, thank you all so much, man, for, for, uh, coming on, for joining your brother, man. Uh, I definitely be keeping in touch with you, brothers, man. Y'all stay up and, uh, we're talking to you guys again soon, man. Thank y'all so much. All right. Take care, man. All right. Ladies and gentlemen, ladies and gentlemen, that was the live. That was the live. That was brother Fred Hatchet and brother Vita Jones, uh, two former, uh, masons, uh, coming to share their testimony and praise God that they did. Also, let me, before I wrap this up, I need to give another announcement. I did put it up in the, at the beginning of the, uh, of the live and it was during the, uh, the intro and I wanted to, uh, publicly put it up again here, uh, if he's still here. This is black. Notice, notice the name. Do y'all see the name? Do you see the name now? I would love to get in contact with this brother because remember weeks and even months before and months ago, this brother came by the name of black atheist, black atheist gamer, gamer, I believe it was, right? Now he has the name black Christian gamer. I ain't an atheist no more quote. What's goodie? I'm back. I am. I ain't an atheist no more. I repented of my sins, cried out to God to work in my heart, to take away my hatred. I know I deserve hell. I believe Jesus died on the cross for my sins. Come on some body. That's what I'm talking about. If that ain't the best news that I have, man tonight, I, I bro, listen, pass the offering plate. Let's just walk down the aisles, collect the offer. We, we about to go home. We about to go home. That's a wrap. That's a wrap. That's a wrap. Brother, all I would say is praise God. The angels are rejoicing. BCV family are rejoicing. I pray that you can get connected wherever you are. Uh, as Peter said, make your calling and election sure. If you want to reach out to me, brother, please do so. I really, really do mean that. Uh, if you're watching this live, not sure if he's still in the, in the chat, but if you want to reach out to me, man, do so, please, sacredwoods.com. This is the time where we need to make sure that you are rooted and grounded and that you are able to stand 10 toes down in the faith once for all delivered to the saints. All right. Um, again, praise God. We, I want to connect you with some people, man. That's going to help you wherever you are. Is he, is he in New York? Uh, is he, is he in New York, bro? Brother Proverbs, if he is, bro, you know what I'm about to do with you. For real. AS says, brother, I pray you can personally disciple that brother, spare him the agony of man. Yeah, listen, absolutely. I would love to, if I can't do it, I'm definitely going to put him in the hands of people that I'm, I know they are in our confidence that they can handle it for me, man. So, uh, we, we need the, listen, this is why, this is why the enemy has been attacking channels like mine, uh, has been trying to come against what me and my wife have been doing, have been trying to discourage and, and create doubt and all this kind of stuff because if we're not, if we're not doing this, if we don't get the support, if we don't get the encouragement, uh, cause we need each other. I'm just telling you, I'm not, this is not manipulation, but this is what this is about. This is what this is about. Um, if, if left to our ourselves, listen, if I am in my own strength and in my own flesh, I could have been tapped out, could have been tapped out, but it's for the body of Christ. It's for people like, uh, black Christian gamer, AKA, uh, formerly known as, uh, the black atheist gamer. This man came on this channel before we even, we even started doing anything else and said that he has been saved, that he repented, turned from his sins, gave up his hate, and now has embraced the risen Lord Jesus Christ. Man, that is good news. I'm telling you all, that is good news. That, that blesses me. That encourages me and, and, and helps me to keep going when I feel like just like, oh man, the stuff ain't, the stuff ain't happening. It ain't, it ain't, you know, coming the way I think quote unquote, God always, always brings around those things to bring encouragement. We need each other. I need you. You need me. We are interdependent of each other and this is how we grow. This is how we develop. This is how we become more and more strengthened in our faith by locking arms together for the glory of God and for the benefiting growth of his kingdom. So, brothers and sisters, thank you all so much. Again, thank you and salute to brother Fred Hatchet and brother Vita Jones. Saturn, thank you so much for the super chat. Thank you. I appreciate you. Thank you so much. I definitely appreciate that. Brother Rodney, where, where did, there you go. Brother Rodney, thank you again, brother. Thank you so much. I definitely appreciate you. Thank you. Yes, black Christian gamer. Amen. Listen, I need you. I need you to hit me up. I need you to hit me up. Seiko Woods at yahoo.com. Let's, let's set up a time for us to talk and make sure that you're good, man. Make sure that you, that you got some place where you can, you can, you can dig your, dig your, your heels in, man, and, and, and grow. All right. So, just want to be of an assistance and help any way we can. All right. But there's the email right there, brother. Seiko Woods at yahoo.com. Seiko Woods at yahoo.com. Please take advantage of that. Email me and we can set up a time for where we can talk and make sure that you are able to get the spiritual food and nourishment that you need as a new babe in Christ. So you say he's in Brooklyn. Okay. You say if he, if he is in Brooklyn past the Drake. Yeah, man. Yeah. Absolutely. Let's, let's do that. Let's do that, man. Let's, let's see if you, if you're in Brooklyn, if you're in Brooklyn, Christian Gamer, let's, let's, I'm going to give what you man. So you can go ahead and hook up with, with Pastor Drake. So yeah, definitely. If once he hits me up, I would definitely get that information to him. I would definitely get that information to him. So, but anyway, this is a great live, great conversation, great testimony. Once again, God wins as always, as always. You know, we praise in God for the transformation, brother. We sure are. Yeah, do that, brother. Do that. Send me an email, me your number, and I'll, I'll shoot you a text and we can, we can schedule time to talk sometime this weekend. So, but anyway, let me go ahead and get a body here, let you all get a body here as well too. Again, praise God, man. Praise God. Hopefully maybe sometime next week we'll do the, the fraternity sorority interview panel discussion and my guys Grace will go ahead and continue to help brothers and sisters in Christ grow. Pray for me that I continue to put out the content information that I believe the Lord wants me to, to give to the viewers and others as well and continue to support this channel. Again, if you would like to do so, you can definitely do that by, by liking, subscribing, sharing, hitting the notification bell again. We, this is how the algorithms are, are, are triggered to keep putting out the content as well. So please, please, if you don't mind, please like, subscribe, share, and hit that notification bell on the, on this video and on this channel. We definitely appreciate that. Again, the links below for the support of the ministry can do that either through the three options that are tickered across the screen as well. You can do that. And are also, if you'd like to support the ministry, you can continue to do so as well through the BCV merchandise, full store, get everything there. And we, we're going to add more merchandise and, and different items as well in the, in the very near future. Again, love life and marriage with the woods. Love life and marriage with the woods. Please go over there and subscribe to that channel. We want to get a thousand subscribers so we can go ahead and start doing our own live on that particular channel as well. So again, we definitely appreciate the, the, the love, the support. Thank you all so much. Definitely a blessed, a blessed live. I definitely was encouraged by it. So anyway, that's my time. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you so, so much for yours. Y'all know the drill, whatever you do, do all to the glory of God. God bless. Thank you for sharing this night. God bless you. Good night.