 Ozempic will not solve your fat loss issues. It is not the cure for your bad health. Hate to break this to you, but today there is no medical intervention that's gonna solve all these problems. Now that isn't to say that it won't potentially help, but it's not gonna solve the root issue. So don't place your bets on it, okay? You still gotta work on your relationship with food and with exercise and you still have to develop behaviors that will last you the rest of your life. I wanna say that because it is literally exploding everywhere. Super popular. We're at the airport yesterday and I must have saw three commercials for Ozempic. Yeah, I pointed one out to Adam where we're sitting there for its fat loss and health, purported properties and all that stuff. And go ahead. We've had supplements and pills that suppress appetite. What is so game-changing about this one? Is it because the muscle-sparing properties that come with it that are unique? It's not a stimulant. So in the past, things that killed appetite or brought appetite down had a lot of adverse effects. Stimulants tend to raise heart rate, cause people to feel uncomfortable, you build up a tolerance type of deal. Like any common stimulant, Adderall, ADHD medicine can lower appetite, that kind of stuff. But Ozempic has been shown so far to be one of the most successful weight loss interventions, medical interventions that's around, really is. But again, it's not like the cure. It's not gonna change your relationship to food. Like I'll give you an example. We actually, we were just up in Phoenix talking to a bunch of NCI coaches and trainers and somebody brought up a question about a client who had gastric bypass. Gastric bypass is a very dramatic medical intervention for weight loss. They literally take your stomach, bypass it, leave a tiny pouch about the size of my thumb and you're forced to lose weight. Now if you look at the data on people who go through that process, they do lose a lot of weight cause you can't eat anymore, like you used to at least. But lots of other problems tend to pop up because the root issues aren't really solved. Like why is this person using food like a drug to the point where they're 100 plus pounds overweight? If we don't solve that and we just remove your ability to have the food the way you do, it's gonna pop up in other ways, whether it be depression, drugs, alcohol and so on. So the generic name for Osempic is semi-glutide. This is a peptide by the way. I mean, we work with a company that provides peptides. And yes, it will help with weight loss but if you don't combine it with the stuff that's always, you know, things that we've always talked about. Some behavior and practices you repeat. You're, it's just not gonna, it's not gonna do it for you. You have to learn how to eat a healthy diet in a way that's sustainable for yourself. You have to develop a relationship with exercise where it's something that you do on a regular basis. Obviously challenging, it takes a lot of work. But if you don't do those things, semi-glutide or the brand name Osempic is, it's just not gonna solve your issues for you. It's just, it's a band-aid is what it is. Yeah, those effects inevitably go away. It's once you stop using it too. So like what you're gonna lean so heavy on chemically enhancing yourself to be able to provide you with this sort of tapering off of this hunger that you have versus really kind of working through that process and figuring out like how to, you know, work with maybe including more protein and things that are more satiating in your diet and, you know, figuring that out in terms of something that's like gonna last a long period of time. Not to mention how expensive it is in like this intervention that we're constantly, you know, implementing into your daily habits. Yeah, I think the best way to use something like semi-glutide, which again, it is efficacious. This is not one of those things that does nothing. It definitely does something. But I think the best way to use it is if this is a big challenge for you, you first off, make sure you work with a good coach or trainer because that's the person that's gonna guide you to develop these long-term habits. But you would include semi-glutide to take the edge off, to give you just enough so that you can deal with certain things like why you eat the way you do, why you eat the food. But intervention should be temporary. Yeah, and then once you do that, it's like a step ladder. Like, okay, now I think I got a bit of a grasp of this. Let me remove the semi-glutide appetite goes up a little bit. Now let me practice the things that I've been working on. So I could see it being an effective way, almost like training wheels. I could see it being very effective in that sense. But if you don't work on those root issues, and look, it's a moneymaker because, again, compared to anything we've done in the past, any type of medicine or drug or peptide in the past for fat loss, it definitely crushes them all. I mean, you will lose weight when you go on it, but it's not gonna solve all your issues. And I have to just be honest about that. I wanna run it, I think. You're gonna try it? I do, I think. I think that's great. So you could get really some honest feedback? Yes. Yeah, that's why. Not because I think I need it by any means. I think that I really wanna see what a big difference. What a great idea. Yeah, and now's the time for me to do it, right? I'm dialed in right now, right? So I'm consistent with my nutrition. I'm consistent with my training right now. And so if I'm going to test something out like that to see like, oh wow, this is making a big difference for me, I'm curious. What I'm really curious about too, is that one of my challenge when I'm dieting and trying to lean, like right now, I'm more like maintenance surplus because I'm trying to build and but I'm in a position now where I could probably start to cut and lean if I wanted to get shredded a little bit. And when I do that, one of the challenges always was making sure I still get adequate protein while I'm also in a caloric deficit. So if this thing really suppresses my appetite, I wonder what that's going to be like. And how hard will it be for you to eat the right amount of protein? Is that already, you're right. So that's why that study came out that showed muscle loss for people because if you just eat less but you're not watching what you're eating when you eat less, you're not getting enough protein or strength training, your body's going to start to adapt by paring muscle down, slowly metabolism down to meet the new caloric intake. I can't stress enough to the audience to how common that is. I remember that more times than not when I had a client who's, let's say, you know, we had built this relationship with the dunk tank, the hydrostatic way, right? Like one of the more accurate ways to do body fat test. And so they would come to our gym on a very regular basis and all of our clients would dunk and get measured on there. And many times we'd have clients that had thought they had incredible results. They lost 15, 20, 30 pounds. And they would be discouraged. Because in fact, that was part of why I kind of stopped having to come around so much because it would really discourage clients. They would measure and then go like, oh my God, like my body fat percentage didn't change or potentially went up. Because you lost muscle. Yeah. And they thought they were doing so good because they were training hard and they were consistent with their workouts and they were eating a lot less than what they were before because that's like the messaging, right? And what most clients do is, you know, if eating less is good, then eating even more or eating even less is even better, right? Like more is better type of mentality. And so they would like restrict calories and that became the main focus. Stick to my training, show up to my workouts, eat less. Stick to my training, show up to my workouts, eat less. And that was like, and if I did that scale would go down. And inevitably the scale does go down. But what ends up happening is the client ends up paring down a ton of muscle. Now, if you're 150 pounds overweight, then who cares, right? If you're carrying 150 pounds of extra body fat on you and you lose 40 pounds and half of it was muscle and half of it was fat, then so be it because we need to get a bunch of weight off of you but not everybody has to lose 150 pounds. Most people we're trying to lose 20 to 35 pounds or so. The thing is, and this is, this will simplify although it's the human metabolism or mammalian metabolisms are complex. This is generally true, okay? If you eat more, the default for your body is to figure out a way to store the excess energy to save for later. So that's the default, okay? Now that doesn't mean you can't send signals and do things to prevent that from happening so that maybe instead of it getting stored it gets turned into muscle. But the default is that if you just eat more and you don't do anything in an organized planned way to try to build muscle, what your body does with that more is it tries to store it for potentially later when you might not have more, okay? That's the default. The default when you eat less is, oh, we're not getting enough calories to meet our demands. Let's lower our demands. Let's reduce the amount of calories we burn. So the default is to get rid of high demand tissue and the ones that you can pair down easiest without having major consequences. Like your body's not gonna pair down its brain. You need your brain. It's not gonna get rid of your liver. You need your liver. But muscle, if your body doesn't feel like it needs it it'll reduce it. And now your demands will meet the intake. So it's really not any different than like the way people will manage their finances. We got excess finances coming in. Let's save it or let's spend more of it, right? That would be building more muscle. Let's spend more of it or let's save it, which is, you know, that's kind of the default. If we make less money then the default should be to spend less. So that's what ends up happening. So just eating less, if you don't do it the right way which is that's the beauty of working with a good trainer or coach. The beauty is we know how to pull the right levers to make the default not happen. Oh, you're eating more? Here's the levers we pull so that it doesn't get stored. It's muscle. Oh, you're eating less? Here's the levers we pull so that you lose body fat but don't lose the muscle. That's the, that's, you know, in a nutshell what a good coach or trainer can do on top of the fact that we try to, you know teach you and coach you on how to pull those levers yourself and do it in a sustainable way in a way that you wanna do it that's balanced that feels good and all that stuff. But if you just eat less, if you just take a peptide that makes you eat less and you don't do anything else you're gonna lose muscle. That's just the bottom line. Your body's gonna lose muscle. Now, if you do it right and you lift weights in a way to get stronger, I don't mean just lift weights because people get confused. You can lift weights in a way that is not gonna work. Like the programming makes it, this is why we write programs. It makes a big difference. Rest periods matter. Rest periods and exercise selection and how you apply and take all that stuff which we talked about a million times on the show. If you lift weights, do it the right way or do strength training the right way and the kind of food that you eat when you eat less you combine those two and there's more that goes into that. But you combine those two, now you don't lose muscle, you just lose body fat. And then again, on the flip side, you eat more if we do those things in the right way we build muscle instead of building body fat. This is, I mean, really, if just over simplification this is the big challenge that people have with weight loss and weight gain. And obsessing over weight loss is not telling you the full story which is why Adam, I've had the same experience with body fat tests with clients. I mean, I had this experience with myself being someone who's experienced in trainers. Which by the way, that highlights the challenge. It's not just that easy. Like where, and I remember seeing all my coaches and trainers that work for me, many of them had the, and including myself had that same experience the first time that we all did like a competition with each other of who could reduce the most body fat and that's exactly what happened is everybody including these educated experienced trainers cut too hard too fast and we all lost weight but then when we did the dunk, many of us actually stayed the same body fat percentage. What are you left with? Yeah. Yeah, I was very surprised, I remember that. And you see it in the competitive world. So all the time. Super common. You have these, and who we all praise and put up on these pedestals is like the best or the best bodies or they know the most and it's like, no, it's super common. So it's a, you know, it's very, which is also why when we get a client that wants to lose a bunch of weight, we don't focus on necessarily cutting calories. Now, yes, we inevitably do cut calories to lose weight. That's inevitable, what ends up happening. But the focus early on is not that. It's trying to increase the demand of the body. That's right. To build that expensive tissue you're talking about, we want to put them in a more advantageous place to lose and cut calories from a healthy place that is sustainable long-term. And most people that you hire you have already tried to do it themselves and they've already slowed that metabolism down by eating less and then binging, then eating less and then binging and not building a lot of muscle, doing a lot of cardiovascular activity and circuit type training. And then they hire you and it's like, oh, I'm eating 2,000 calories, I'm 60 pounds overweight, what do I do? It's like, oh, Ozympic isn't the answer to that person. The answer to that person is to build muscle. Now, doesn't mean that that potentially can't be a tool, right? Exactly. I would love to take that, and that's why I want to experiment with myself because maybe it does make a big difference on the way back down, right? So if I could build, if I still take that client who's eating 2,000 calories, the original goal just because they're 60 pounds overweight, again, would not be to cut calories yet. It would be, let me build some muscle on you, let's get your calories up to a place like 3,000, then maybe let's introduce a tool like Ozympic where we come back the other direction to help you restrict from the 3,000 calories. I think you're right, though. I think it's a massive challenge because protein being as satiating as it is, and then on top of that, like what's the biggest function you're getting from Ozympic is, you know, it's- Eating less. Eating less. I mean, that's always been my challenge. Yeah. It's still hitting my protein intake while I'm on these cuts. I mean, so, I mean, maybe that's not, maybe it's not resonating with a lot of people and this is just me. Because they're losing overall size, you know, and I think people are probably just focused on that portion of it when, in fact, if you do get into that percentage of the ratios and you really see what it is that you're left with, it's kind of alarming. Here's where the medical community screws up all the time. They always screw up here, is that they oversell and they're not honest. If they were just honest and they said, hey, some aglutide actually can be quite effective in combination with or used as a tool with, but instead they sell it as the answer and what's gonna end up happening is they're gonna sell a ton of them, obviously. There's no money in honesty, so. Yeah. I know, it's terrible. We've known this. It makes me so mad because if they just sold it honestly, you know what's funny? We've proved this, this is bullshit. I don't, you know what? Here, I'm gonna just roof you out. No, we didn't prove. We'd be way richer if we lied. I mean, maybe I guess you're right. We lied to get them into honest shit. Well, look, hey, look. Hey, true, hey, this is time to be honest here, right? We've worked with many sponsors who when they first start working with us, so we have an interesting relationship with our sponsors. It's interesting because they let us do whatever we want because we deliver, but here's what's interesting about it is in the beginning of our relationship, especially before. Yeah, this was early days. Before we really developed. Not so much now. Yeah, now we have a reputation, so everybody's like, do your thing. Just sell it however you want. But in the beginning, they would hear us on the podcast, be very honest about a product, so we'd say something like, oh yeah, this really gave me energy, but it tastes really bad. Or yeah, this is kind of good, but my gut issues didn't really affect my gut very well. They're like, don't say that. You're not just selling a product. And we ended up selling a lot because our audience is like, we trust you, you're being honest. Like I experienced the same thing. Yeah, so we're just, we're trying to prove that you can be honest and sell products, but I guess you're right, Adam. If we lied, we probably sold more, I don't know. I mean, it's a shit. You know, maybe you're right. Maybe over the course of a decade or two decades, it's a slower process, but maybe in the long run. Cause I think a lot of times those people that do stuff like that, they may have a good run initially, but eventually that stuff comes full circle. I'll tell you what right now. If I was, if I still trained people and I had a client who had just unlimited funds in the sense that they're like, look, I'll invest whatever it takes. I really want to solve this issue. What should I do? I'd say, okay, here's what I want you to do. I want you to train with me and then depending on their fitness and stuff would be something like two to three days a week. So you're going to train with me two to three days a week and I'm also going to work with you through texts for nutrition. So it's going to be a lot of touch points. So we're going to start with that. I'm going to have you get a CGM so that we can start identifying blood sugar issues and identifying them to, you know, connecting them to how you feel and stuff like that. And then we're going to use some of Glutide to help with the appetite and to kind of give us training wheels in the beginning. That's, that's exactly what I would say. To help break some patterns. Yes. And then I would work with those things and I think my success rate would be phenomenal. But if you had to take any of those things out of the picture, it wouldn't be me. That'd be the last thing I wouldn't be like, yeah, just get the CGM and some of Glutide or just do the some of Glutide. Like no, the main ingredient is the, is that we're going to work on these things and figure out a way to do it in a sustainable way. So, I mean, to be clear, it is an effective intervention. It is not, it is not going to cure anything. It's not the end all. Right. Today's giveaway is Maps Aesthetic. Here's how you can win that program. Leave a comment below this video in the first 24 hours that we drop it. Also subscribe to this channel and turn on notifications. Do all those things. And if you win, we'll let you know in the comment section. Also, we got a sale going on this month. Two programs are 50% off. Maps and a ball like half off and maps split half off. Both of them 50% off. If you are interested, just click to the on the, to on the link at the top of the description below. And then by the way, you got to use the code April 50 for that discount. All right, back to the show. Hey, I wanted to ask Doug and Justin, since this was your guys' first like big NCI event. The last two years, Sal and I went, and so this was your guys' first. And by the way, you guys got the cool hotel. Were you like, Jason is like- You said you had a little the older one last time. Yeah, yeah. I know the last, the previous two years. And it was like, it was still a Sheraton. It was a nice place. It was just an old, older place. Smaller venue. You guys know Adam. A little less bougie. And I was like, he needs to have the gold plated toilet. Hey, Jason doesn't know yet that I upgraded my route to a suite. On his credit card. He knows now. Yeah, we had a bigger mini bar. You know, it was only a couple hundred bucks. Why'd you upgrade yours? Not ours, Doug. They didn't have any. Oh, they didn't have any? That was the last one. I did ask. Son of a bitch. But anyways, this event was, I mean, Jason just keeps leveling this event up every single time. I remember the very first one, Sal, and I went to it. Every year they're just so much better. Oh, they, like, doubles, right? So what, what was it like for you guys being the first year that you guys got to go do it? Well, I mean, for me, it was really kind of powerful to be there with all these other coaches and like-minded people that were like very much in tune with our message and like asking us really cool questions. Like I think that was probably one of the best Q and A sessions we've had, which was, you know, it's saying a lot because we've done a lot of those before, but I just felt like because we've had those coaching calls, I think with like a good percentage of the people that were there, we've already had kind of that rapport. And then we actually had people that were in there that have never even listened to one podcast of ours that were just like, look, you know, just based off of the Q and A session. So I felt like that, it just felt, it felt like good energy. It was electric. And then, you know, it was not enough. It was just like, I felt like we were there for maybe like five minutes, but it was like an hour and it just went like that. And then we just, it was just like a big kind of whirlwind was my experience. And then going outside and just like trying my best to like, intently focus on one person at a time and hear their story and like, you know, what's going on in their life and how we can all kind of like attack this health thing together. It was really cool, man. It was great. It was great, like exhausting, but like filling up at the same time. Yeah, that's always a weird feeling, right? Like you get this, you're on this high and your cup is filled so much, but then it drains. Physically tired. Yeah, physically tired. I'm exhausted today, like the next day, getting back and then the next, like it always. Well, we stood in the same spot for like four and a half, five hours, just talking to people as they approached us one after another. And each person is invigorating because, you know, they're all coaches and, you know, they're all very passionate about fitness and helping people. And such a difference though, like a physical, like in-person contact. Like it just, that exchange is a completely different field. Yeah. What do you think Doug? Yeah, so you guys, you know, you got caught over there in the corner and early on I said, I'm getting out of here. You know, I wanted to go float around and just talk to people. And I was shocked by the number of people who had never heard about the show. Yeah. And I talked to a few of them, which was a lot of fun. You know, a lot of the people they, I think found the event online, maybe an ad popped up and they liked the speakers, Alex Hormose, of course, being one of the big draws. One guy actually flew all the way from Taiwan. Yes. Knew nothing about our show. That was wild to me. Yeah. And so it was super cool. He became a fan right after. Yeah. So I met all these people, super positive people, you know, obviously people are looking to better themselves and improve themselves. And it wasn't just about fitness either. So I met this one young guy. He is 20 years old. He's in real estate and he saw Alex Hormose. So I'm going to come to this event. Yeah, yeah. So I talked to him. So he wasn't even into fitness, but he's a subscriber now to Mind Pump, of course. That's great. But yeah, I really enjoyed, I mean, I always enjoy any type of live event that we do where we can actually interact with people who listen to the show or even not. And it's always, like you say, very energizing, but it's also very exhausting as well because, man, sometimes you get cornered and they'll talk your ear off and you can't escape and you want to be polite and you don't want to go away, but then you understand there's other people that you probably want to talk to. So, but I enjoyed it for sure. I had fun, man. Yeah, it was great. It was such a blast. Over 700 people they had this time, which that was a lot. Because we only got about 10 feet into that venue area before the whole line started, I didn't get a chance to really walk around like you did. And I saw videos afterwards, like, yeah. Really put into perspective how many people were there. I mean, there was a... I got to tell this story. Towards the end of the night, again, we walk in huge room and then a line form. So we just stood in the same place for four and a half hours talking to people, hugging people, it was a good time. And at the very end, this couple comes up and I'll be nice, right? So they come up. You don't have to be nice. Well, I'm not going to go into the mean stuff. They don't need to listen to the show. They come up and they pitch us. They start pitching us about their business. And I'm like, and as they're pitching, I can tell you never heard the show before. So how many episodes have you listened to? Oh, I've heard clips. Oh, okay, that's what I thought. And so apparently they do like energy work like over the phone. They heal your issues. It's like magic. That's what I said. It sounds like magic. No, no, no, no. Like over skype? It really works. Wow, your power's going to extend. Anyway, so we're trying to be polite. I was surprised Adam didn't turn into an asshole right away. I was like, man, Adam's really nice right now. I've been waiting for Adam to be like, get the fuck out of here, I'll do his thing. So then they finally leave. We were in too good a mid. Yeah, I was in a very good mid. You were. They couldn't, they didn't kick you off that. So then they were done, they left the room. Anyway, next morning we're exhaust that we get up. We got to get on a plane. They find us. She approaches me and I'm like, oh, fuck. All right, here we go. She's going to pitch me again, dude, right now. You know, A for F. I mean, I guess, you know, we got to keep trying. She comes up and she goes, hey, I did an energetic, what does she call it? Like an energetic assessment of you and Adam. And here's all the issues that I found. And she pulls up her phone and she has a list of ailments. She's like little beauty dolls. Bro, it was a list of ailments and she shows me. Now, and she goes, this one's yours. Now, had it blown my mind, I would have been like, you know what, this is really weird, right? Not fucking one was accurate. There were like 15 things on that. You say one, you say one. You're even like giving her a chance. Bro, the one that everybody has. Well, you know what I wanted you to do? I wish you would have kept it. Because I bet you could right after that, Google, what are the top 20 issues that people have? She was like a Pepto-Bismal commercial. She's like, you have right leg weakness, your wrist hurts, you have your vision on your left. Like weird shit. I'm going down the list. And I just literated what I did in front of her. I went, no, no, no, no. As I'm going down the list, none of these actually, none of these apply. Oh, that's because I didn't get your permission to do the energetic or whatever. Get out of here. Come on, man. God, that's annoying. Hey, you know what, look, she tried twice. I'm losing my powers. But please, get that magic stuff out of here. Anyway, that was such a great event. My favorite at the end of the night, though, we were all done. We escaped. Just the four of us went by the pool, hung out. And I hadn't done this with you guys in a while. We're all just hanging out late at night. That was a good time, yeah. And we started telling stories and fucking Justin, bro. That story I forgot all about. Which one? I told Jessica we were on the floor last night. I want you to tell a story of when you were in class and you were writing the note. Oh, yeah. I told Jessica, bro, we were on the floor. You told her a long time ago. A long time ago. This is the best story I've ever heard in my life. You went sixth grade? Yeah, something prompted it, though. We were talking about, oh, we were talking about getting caught with stuff. Yeah, and how you freak out and panic and shit like that. Talking about getting caught with the... Yeah, because, I mean, we had our, like, sort of I got caught, you know, whacking off in... That's how it all started. That was the directionless conversation. Adam wasn't going to say that. I'm trying to paint the picture for the audience. I'm getting too much of a picture here. But this story has nothing to do with that. So that's how it started. That's how you start telling crazy stories like that, right? So I was like, yeah, so I was in sixth grade. And so my teacher, Ms. Bowie, I don't even, like, I feel bad talking, because this is like, I was like a little asshole with this. Like, I admit it. Like, I was like, you know, I was making fun. You know, you don't have to share how mean the noise. I don't want to say that the content was, because it was mean, you know, it was mean, but it was like, asshole mean, you know, so it was like funny, but it was just mean, bro. Damn it. But everybody laughed, you know, like, okay. You're a sixth grade boy, dude. I was working through all that. I was young and didn't really know like, anyway. So yeah, I wrote this poem that was basically like, you know, trying to make fun and poke fun at some things about the teacher. And so it was like passing its way around the class. Everybody's laughing. Everybody's laughing, ha ha. And the teacher was like, what's going on over here? And points it out, and like I have the paper in my hand and just like froze. She's like, give it to me. Yeah, give me that paper. Give me that paper right now. I'm like, no. She's like, no, you give me that paper. You're going to go to the principal's office if you don't give me that paper. And I was like, in my head, I'm like, I'm going to the principal's office. Anyway, my parents are getting called. Like, this is all bad for me. She wrote some serious stuff in this letter. Like, I'm not going down with this letter. And so she just gave it to me and like starts coming over and like reaching for it. And then I just boom, right in the mouth. Chewed it up like, no, give me that. Like, she was actually trying to like fish for it. Like my mouth and I just chewed up as best as I could and just swallowed the whole thing whole. Totally convinced that these are as guttish as you say. Yeah, everyone's like, there's some dye in there that's probably stained. He's got mead paper and number two pencil and this fucking gut light is still on. Yeah, I got half a tree in here like stuck. You literally ate it. Like, chomped it, swallowed it, and that was it. Yeah. But if you think about it, brilliant. Like, what are they going to do? I mean, there's no evidence. Now they have to guess. Like, what was on that paper? Well, for sure, whatever. She knew it was bad. But it was way lighter than what it would have been. How do you got caught? Oh, yeah. I mean, I ended up just having to stay outside the rest of the class. Right, right. She can't prove it was all this. She thought it was probably like a dirty pig, like a note or like a love note or something embarrassing. Not that you were talking about her personal issues. Yeah. Bro, you ate it, dude. Swallowed it. I got home last night. I was talking to Jessica. She's like, how'd it go? And I told her that story, bro. We were on the floor. Yeah. Dying. That's a brilliant move. No, are you guys, okay. So that's funny. When you guys get back from that, I'm really bad at this. I'm so exhausted. I love that. You know, Katrina and I have been together for so long. And she's been through this with me enough times that she don't even ask me because I'm like so. You're so tired. I'm so tired. I don't even want to talk. And even like the flow of it, like it hasn't even all settled for me. And so she don't even like pry that much. Like, oh, how was it? She'll ask me like the generic question. Like, how was it? Was it good? Did you like it? And then it'll be like a two days later that I'll start sharing stories with her of like how everything all played out. Cause I'm like, if you try and pull it out of me right then and there, it says it doesn't go so well. Another thing that was awesome, this had nothing to do with the event. The event was obviously amazing, but we haven't all worked out together. In like five years. Years. This was the first one in years where we actually didn't go to the gym and then just like, like separate. Same exercises. We did the same workout together. That was great. Yeah, I enjoyed it. That was a good time. You were a good sport too. It was fun, dude. Yeah, cause we were taking you through straight bodybuilding. Yeah. Light weight. How hard just to want to add weight to everything. I was like, I mean, it was a pretty weak sauce workout, let's be honest. It was just a little pump and hang out and stuff like that. But it's still, we hadn't done that in forever. It was actually just Doug's ass that wasn't with us. Yeah. Doug went off. You notice the pattern here? Yeah. I'm always doing my own thing. Yeah. Doug left into his own thing. Rogue. Yeah. And then we, I mean, we went in the pool, dude. That was like, I mean, we actually like did things. I didn't go in the pool. You guys did? Yeah, we did. We sat and ate. The pool's nice. Yeah. I mean, the whole hotel, that hotel, you know, shout out to the Sheraton downtown Phoenix. So that's a really, that's a really, that whole area was nice. You know, the one, the one thing that's funny. So this is before Sal got there, which is ironic because I think there's, this is a second or third time where we're on a mission to go find like Wagyu steak when Sal's not with us. And we go, we go drop like a thousand bucks on steak on the nights that Sal's not around. A bunch of jerks. So that's kind of like a thing, right? So what's become. What time with you guys we get tacos. What's become a tradition for us is when we fly into new cities or new areas that we've never been, we, we, one of the, one of the treats that we, we do is we find like a really, the best steakhouse we can in the city or town that we're in. Did you guys actually find one? Well, so listen to the story, Sal. I'm sorry. What I'm telling you right now. It's so hard. It's just like, you want to keep talking or what? You want to tell a story? You want to tell a story for everybody? We'll jump in. There's a timer going off right now in my hand. Say something. So Doug goes over and he knows, Doug knows this and Justin and I aren't even doubted yet. So Doug does the, what I would say the smart thing to do is go talk to the concierge, right? So he goes over to the concierge and says, Hey, we're looking for the best steak around like, you know, where do, where can we get a good steak? You know, and she's like, Oh, you know, there's this place called, was it antagonist? No, the arrogant butcher. Arrogant butcher. Which sounds like close. Antagonistic butcher. I don't know what it was. Whatever. He walked in. Hey asshole. Obviously it wasn't very. The cocky cook. Memorable, right? For me to remember the name that well. So she tells it, she tells the name. We're all excited. We're walking down to this place and, and I mean Doug kind of got the feel as soon as we got there. He's like, yeah, this doesn't quite feel like the white tablecloth, you know, Japanese five Wagyu steak that we're going to get here. I mean, it was better than that. I don't want to, I don't want to shit on it that bad because I had this like pretzel and cheese appetizer that was phenomenal. And I had this like breaded chicken dish that was pretty good. But I mean, not even the same universe as like a steakhouse that like we really wanted. So that was like a big let down. I just thought that was so funny that the concierge of all people when Doug asked for like the best steak. They probably looked at you guys like, what can they afford? Yeah. We look broke. We look broke. We definitely downplayed. Your sweatshorts. That was their gym outfit. I'm not even, so I'm not even, I don't know about you guys, but my house, or like I don't have in my dresser and I pack away all summer stuff in the winter. And then vice versa. When the summer comes, summer cup stuff comes out in my drawers. And so I don't have all summer stuff out yet. It's still, I mean, it's what 63 here today. It's still very cool. I mean, you wear shorts all the time, bro. Yeah. You wear it even in the winter. You're like that weird kid in school who would wear a parka and short. Remember that kid in school? Oh yeah. He is totally that guy. Yeah. I've never seen him like that before. I don't care about legs. It's, yeah. It's just the upper body. I got to keep a bit warm. I mean, if I had, if I had hammocks like that, I'd wear shorts all the time. But your legs don't feel cold? Not really. Really? I mean, if I get my feet cold, then I'm screwed. Like my whole body's cold. I mean, my whole body's cold. Well, yeah. At least I don't wear sandals. Jesus Christ. I don't do the Jesus sandals in the parka. That's not a good look. If I walk around and flip flops, I'll get a little. Yeah. So I don't have any of my summer stuff up. So I'm like, literally all the shorts I grab, it's like my nighttime before bed shorts in the house I wear. Like pajama shorts? Yeah. Like pajama shorts when I had for like the week. But I saw the weather and I'm like, fuck it, I ain't wearing pants out there, dude. It's like 95 plus out there. At least it's tight. Yeah. You guys know me, man. I love the heat. So I go out in that sun. I'm like, oh, let me just stay in the sun. Dude, we were talking earlier about like, like feeding the kids like fancy food and whatnot. Like, does Jessica make like a real elaborate breakfast? Well, I've been, you know, giving Courtney a bit of grief for this. Well, it's just, you know, we got a two year old and we try to say no or save no for when it really counts. Right. Otherwise they start to like push it and all that stuff. When is that? Huh? When is that? Yeah. Well, like if he's going to hurt himself or like, it's just getting ridiculous or whatever. But when it comes to food, So if he wants filet mignon for breakfast, that's not like a no. It's not like a hard no. Well, depends, right? So this morning for breakfast, she sent me a picture of this kid's breakfast. It's like a lamb chop. Grape sliced in half and hummus and crackers. You know, he's specific. He was very specific. Yeah. Mama, I want, so she sent me a picture. She goes, yeah, it's getting a little excessive. I think so. He thinks he lives in a far five star hotel. Dude. Yeah. Like, especially like Ethan's always been kind of like that. He's like a big foodie. Like just loves, because if we'll go somewhere, I'm always like conscious. Like, Oh, he's going to want a version of that at home at some point. Right. And so, like, so for instance, they have bacon all the time in their sandwiches, you know, and I'm like, you get bacon. Like just for like your regular, like your turkey, whatever. I'm like, I'm like, this is crazy. I go into the refrigerator the other day and I'm looking like, what is this? There's a jar. And like, you know, normally you put mayonnaise on bread, whatever for a sandwich. It was chipotle aioli. And I'm like, oh, dad, that's my chipotle aioli. I like that on my sandwich. Like, who are you? I didn't even know what that was. Like, it's, you're so fancy. Like, do you know how to deal with that? Remember the sandwiches we ate when we were kids? Yeah. It was Wonder Bread. It was PB and J, and like, it was Wonder Bread. It was mayonnaise, Kraft Single Cheese, and a slice of bologna, which is basically just flat hot dog. Yeah. And that was it. That was the sandwich. Yeah. Actually kind of good. I mean, I like, I'm happy for them, but also it's like, kind of like thrown in my face. I didn't have any aioli. Hey, talk about food. You guys see McDonald's? What? You guys see the news on McDonald's yet? Oh, they do. Oh, you did it? Okay. I saw a layoff. Hold on. Let me guess. Did they get the same Spokesperson Bud Light? No. No, no, no, no. Listen, Las Vegas. That wouldn't go well. Las Vegas, Fort Worth, and I believe Denver are the three cities. Full. Automation. Yep. 100. No humans. There you go. Pull it up, Doug. Wow. You got me, Andrew, yet? I mean, this is kind of where I saw things moving. I'm grabbing questions for the call. That's what I said. Yeah, I got it. I got you. Give me a second. Okay. Look at both. I got you both watching porn ads right now. No. Come on. Really? One of the chances. We need a third guy now. We need a third guy. Where's Dylan? Get Dylan. Old hot women in your area. You signed up. Those test systems that could change the fast food industry, bro. Yeah. Yeah, I saw an article this morning and I'm pretty sure it was. It's all fully automated. So it's all No humans. Not at all. Yeah. I mean, that makes perfect sense. It's, you know, if you can provide that service at a low cost for the owner. Just for a second, though, think about how much that is worth. Oh, wow. Look at that. Think how much this is going to shake things up. Yeah. Well, okay. What do we mean? Well, you know how many, do the math on Burger King, Taco Bell, all the fast food restaurants, how many of them, how many people work for them? You're talking about hundreds of thousands of people. Yeah. You're not talking about a few people. Well, look, okay, here's the deal. Inefficiency and everything improves. Okay. So we've got to be clear on this because this is going to be, if it's not already politicized. Okay. Automation of stuff like this. How do you politicize McDonald's? Huh? How do you politicize McDonald's? What do you mean? You don't see, you can't see the easy political ton of employee attached to that. Look, you have, on one end, the right is going to be like, this is what happens when you raise minimum wage. Okay. On the left, this is the 1% getting rid of jobs. So now that, okay, so that's, it's going to be a politicized issue if it's not already. Here's the truth. Obviously it's somewhere, somewhere in the middle. It was inevitable. Isn't that crazy? It's crazy. Look at this video. Yeah. It was inevitable that stuff like this become automated. Inevitable. In other words, going to happen no matter what. Now, raising minimum wage only made it happen faster because the cost of automating became less expensive than the artificial bottom floor for, you know, paying people. So that's, that's the fact. That's the thing that I checked out on it at the airport yesterday. No. Oh, dude. So you know how like a self checkout line, which that's not like crazy. We've seen those everywhere. Oh yeah. But this new one, I was, the guy had to come over and explain it to me because it was like, I didn't, I've never seen one like this. He's like, no, no, just put it all on there. Yeah. It's not like an individual bar. I don't want to scan anything. I just put it all together. And it was like, there's a calculator. Calculated all of my, they already knew what all the items were. And then it just, a one time. Oh, that's awesome. Set it up there. Put your card in and pay for it. Like, where's this been? Yeah. Wow. Boom here. Wow. That is really cool. Yes. That is really cool. It was about the size of maybe half this desk right here. So whatever you could fit on that, which is a lot of stuff. Right. You put that all on there and it automatically instantly calculated all of it in my total. I just card in and out. You know what's interesting. So let's, so let's talk a little bit more about like deeper what this potentially means for business owners. When you used to own franchises like McDonald's, Taco Bell Burger King, you own the restaurant, but you were also a manager of lots of employees. Right. These entrepreneurs now that buy these franchises, you know, because what would separate a great McDonald's owner from a bad McDonald's owner was how good you were at managing your staff and creating a culture, just like any business. But when it's fully automated, you don't need to do any of that stuff. You just pop it open. I imagine the upfront cost is going to go up substantially. Yeah. The machine. Yeah. And they're probably going to, what's it called? Let me tell you what sucks, so speaking specifically to McDonald's. So one of my long, long term clients was actually a franchise owner. She owned nine of them, her and her dad. And what McDonald's does in situations like this, because they obviously have innovated and continued to be able to reduce costs. They, so McDonald's owns so many and then there's a percentage of them that are also franchises. And the company, when they do stuff like this with the cost, they will also cut the costs on the burgers with that which squeezes the franchise owners. So like she's always like, the margins for them as franchises, they don't crush. That's why she has nine of them. Like she, in order for her to make really good money. It's a competitive market. Oh, it's so competitive. Yeah. And when stuff like this comes out and you would think, oh, wow, this is going to save, you know, the company and the franchise, all this money and stuff like that. No, they just squeeze everything else and then that the franchise owner has got it. They don't have the flexibility to raise prices based off demand or whatever that they have to fall in line with whatever corporate is doing. And so as she's continued to be in this industry for, I don't know, how many decades now, it's gotten more and more and more difficult. And at one, there was a time when you could own one McDonald's and make a very good living owning just one McDonald's. But she literally has to own like nine of them to make the kind of living today is what it would be like one just like two decades. Well, have you ever read about the consumer base of McDonald's? Have you ever read about them? There's like a percentage that are like super regular users that eat there on a regular basis. And you're dealing with the consumer base where if the price goes up a little bit, it'll significantly impact them. So it's that plus the fact that you're competing with other chains. You can't, you have to keep the prices low or you're totally screwed. It's not like a expensive chain where like whole foods could raise prices and it'll affect them a little bit but not much. Did you listen to our show today yet? What? Our favorite podcast? No, no, no, no. Oh, wait till you hear this. So somebody has already built on top of chat GBT called, shit, of course I'm going to forget the name. But now it's fully autonomous. Oh, they're teaching each other. So you can, you can give two of them like different skill sets and then they train each other to get whatever desired outcome. It's crazy. They're talking about how you can like to like build, build a sales team and sales force or something like that. Like, and then they're, one of them is like, okay, you know, to be very empathetic and do these things. The other one, okay, I want you to be able to close, use these, these tactics. And then they, they cross. They work together. They work together and teach each other to build like. Wow. Yeah. It's crazy bro. It is crazy. It's like speeding up so fast. Yeah, it is. It's the first time that I've ever, that I've ever really considered the fact that we will be, that they will feel like I need a seat belt. That innovation will get rid of pretty much all work. So, I mean, that's going to leave us with existential crisis. Not that we're not going to have money. That's the problem. Everybody thinks we're not going to have money. That's not what's going to happen. It's going to be so efficient. It's going to do so much of our work that we'll have money. People not knowing. Yeah, that's it. So what, what jobs do you think are the, because I mean, I feel like I could think almost how almost everything is somewhat replaceable, right? Yeah. What, what, what do you think are the last to go? Like with the things that you would think would be the most technical, like, you know, brain surgery, so that those will actually go quick. Yep. Because of the precision of what they can do with AI and stuff like that. So, okay, that takes out a lot of that crazy stuff. I think the stuff that requires the most human, humanity, the most human touch is going to be the hardest because the massage therapy. Yeah, maybe. Maybe. Well, that's like, like I, I mean my touch is like, like you meet someone and you talk with them. So I don't agree with that. I agree with little, literal touch. Like that is because you need a human touch to do that. I don't agree just because, because they're the AI is being programmed to. Yeah, like her, that movie. Yeah. Did you see that where? Yeah. So it's just got a therapist like here that they talk to. Well, no, that's what I mean. But I think the, the closer the, okay, the jobs that require you to really be with someone and meet with someone are going to be the ones that are going to be the last ones to be replaced because there's so much more that goes into making it indistinguishable is what I'm trying to say. So like a therapist over the phone, that'll get replaced before a therapist in person. Sure. That's what I mean. But yeah, the technical stuff. Parallegals. I would actually think it would be more stuff like a plumber, like things that are more hands on that will need someone to physically turn and physical robots in that kind of thing. That's going to take a while. That'll take a little while too. So yeah, honestly, that's, I've said this, you can go back in our podcast of like where I see there being opportunity and it's really like back in the technical space and in, you know, a lot of that like, you know, these like plumbers and electricians. Yeah. I literally nailed it. No, no, yeah. So, so here's what it says in Forbes. They said the jobs that are going to be difficult will be a caring roles for workers. So that's what I meant. But also business roles where you need an understanding of your clients and then skilled trade work. Yeah. Jobs that require lots of mobility, dexterity and flexibility in unpredictable environments like electricians or plumbers. Right. And they make good money, dude. It's just, it's just so crazy to me that it's, it's been scoffed for so long like, you know, these trades, they're essential. You know, that's what keeps everything running and moving. It's crazy to me. But I mean, wouldn't it be wild if that become those become like the most like high paid jobs? Like 100%. Yeah. That's what we're moving. Yeah. But I mean, dude, like developers and coders and diamond dozen and plus like AI can do that. Yeah. It's going to, it's going to, this is my prediction. I'm going to predict that at some point, they're going to, there's not going to be any work for people to do. So they're going to have to figure out ways to, for people to be taking care of. And so they're going to have like UBI type stuff. Okay. Everybody gets these services. And then people are going to be left with like, what do I do? That's going to be the challenge. What do I do now? Before I had to go to work, that give me a little bit of a sense of purpose, even though I hated my job or whatever. What do I do now? You know, I don't know. What do I do? I guess I'm going to go paint. I'm going to go read like, you know, people, by the way, people who are listening were like, that would be a dream. If you look at the research on people who retire, this is a massive challenge. It's not what you are, it's on a beach and drink my ties all day long. Yeah, for what? 30 days. And then you lose your mind. You'd have no sense of purpose. So that's going to be the challenge in my opinion. I think that's, you know, kind of where, where we're, so food prices dramatically going up, staying the same, going down down down down. Yeah, way down. You start to remove here and here's the other thing. So currently what gives us efficiency are, like prices. Prices are amazing signalers to tell us where to allocate resources. what's more valuable, what's less valuable. And it really does produce lots of efficiency. It's why markets are so good at what they do. But when you have machines doing the jobs and communicating with each other, you can multiply that times a million, now supply and demand is instant, instant, instant, and they're gonna be able to be so efficient with how much food they produce, when they deliver it, how it goes bad, where it needs to go. It's gonna, it'll drop the price of everything. Everything's gonna be much, much less expensive. To mention here, we're gonna get to a place real soon here. We're gonna be able to make these fake meat, fake burgers, and all robots are gonna be able to do it. It's gonna be very little humans to do it. So that's gonna be super cheap to do that. Meanwhile, California has this idea that we should bring grizzly bears back. What? I heard you say that. What? Can you believe that? Wait, wait, what? Do you guys think that's a good idea? What do you mean? They're gonna bring grizzly bears and throw them in the woods here? Yeah, they think that like- Why? They wanna bring them back in- Why? In this natural habitat of like, what, a thousand something years ago they were here. I think they, so they reintroduced wolves like in the Yellowstone and like, so they had some bit of success. But think about how densely populated that is. It's not. There's nothing but free open land, like all over the place. For hundreds of miles. Yeah, and so like, think about California. Where is there like humongous open plots of land anymore? It's like- Sierra Nevada is, it's about it. Barely even that. But like, where are these bears gonna go? In everybody's backyard, in their house, like they're gonna be mauling people left and right. Yeah, cause- So I don't understand, what's the, why? Are they, are grizzly bears, are they going? I think it's some environmental like sort of initiative. But what's the point though? Is it because they used to be here? Or is it because it's gonna serve some environmental purpose? Yeah, I think, yeah, they're trying to justify, I think because- They're trying to control populations. They're not letting us do a lot of hunting here. Like there's very minimal amounts of deer hunting and all these other types of, like it's the populations out of control with that. Of deer? Of deer, I believe. But it's honestly like just open up more of the hunting and that'll like reduce it down. So it's like bringing grizzly bears back? Like it just, there's nothing but potential problems. We would bring back dinosaurs if we could. Yeah, they used to live here. That's how stupid we are. Let's put some dinosaurs out here and see what happens. Direct from out of the street. I don't know, dude. Like just these ideas, it's just, I can't believe like it gets crazier every day I wake up. It's like what I think we've talked about before with like, you know, science, you know, science doesn't question whether we should, they just question if we can. And so it's like, oh, if we can, let's do it. What does that say, Doug? Is that- So yeah, I pulled it up. There's definitely a petition going on. They want to bring it back to California. Basically they're just endangered. Right now they have them at about 1500, 1800 today and they're thinking that it's a good trip with the population of them. And they want to bring them back to the home of the American West essentially. And so is Alaska where there's a lot more land? Yeah. Right, that's where most of them are is Alaska, right? Yeah. And so is the population of them declining? Yes. Yes. I mean, they haven't been in California apparently since 1920s. Yeah. Yeah, for a little while. There you go. I mean, until they start eating people- Did we intentionally eradicate them? Not on purpose, we just hunted the shit out of them. Yeah, that would be intentionally eradicated. They're monsters. I mean, like if you have one of those in your backyard, like your kids are playing outside. So I had a trainer. You kidding me? I had a trainer who used to live in Alaska and she said, you walk around with a sidearm. Like a 45 caliber sidearm because- Yeah. Grizzly. They don't fuck around. It's like a back bear. Isn't in Alaska, aren't they worried more about moose than they are actual grizzly bears? Aren't moose scarier? I heard moose. They're way more aggressive, right? Super dangerous. You ever seen a moose? No, I'm like, like close. They're like a ton to like two tons. It's the biggest thing I've ever seen. Yeah, they're huge. I saw one when in person once. It's comically big, dude. I've seen them in Alaska, but I've never been up. I was in a canoe and it was like coming down for a drink and I saw just like trees bending over as it was like making its way. It's like, oh my God, this thing is big. They're giant if you ever see one. Here's a fun fact. In North America, moose attack more people than bears and wolves combined. But that's because there's more moose, right? I knew that, probably. We were about the moose. Well, no, they're also aggressive. But worldwide, do you know what animal hurts the most people? Hippos. Hippos, you're right. Yeah, they're the most aggressive. That's because hippos are aggressive. Look how big that moose is. Yeah, they'll flip a car over. Have you guys ever seen the video? There's like people on a, I don't know what it is, like a riverboat somewhere and there's a hippo kind of far away and it dives under and the guy's like, he hits the gas because he knows and then you see it pop up because it's swimming after them. Yeah, and it's like going to take them out. Have you seen that video? Oh, was it in a fishing boat? It was in some kind of a boat. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think we all shared that actually yesterday we were talking about that. Terrifying, terrifying. Anyway, I want to tell you guys about some of the value of having a massive family like myself. So I have such a huge family that I never run out of opportunities to come up with commercials for our sponsors. And you know, you should try out I saw you, you had a picture of just from Easter of like the Tire family. Oh, yeah, it would be funny would be to draw a line in like what supplement they're all taking to see all the products that are being pushed on everybody. Yeah, no, we took my grandma took a picture with just her grandkids and great grandkids. It wasn't even her kids, a huge picture. But anyway, my aunt who she's been trying to figure out why she kind of gets dizzy, can't perform well. She gets headaches and she's a registered dietician. And I said, it sounds like you need more sodium. She's like, no, no, I get enough sodium or whatever. I said, I think this, why don't you give it a shot or whatever. So I sell her, I sent her some. Sell it. No, I give it to her for free. So she didn't buy it. Well, the perks have been really good. I give it to her for half off. So I sent her. I sell my clients. I sent her element. Oh, I sell my family all the time. I sent her element and it completely, that's it. All her issues were gone from that. She's like, I didn't realize I wasn't having enough sodium. And I said, you know, you were brainwashed so hard by the medical industry. Did you say that? I did. You did? She knows it. I mean, this is the aunt that you've gone kind of back and forth with for a long time, right? In the past. Oh, so she's now like confirmed. Oh yeah, because she's on board now. Not just me, but she's done it herself. She's seen herself, like how the recommendations are garbage. And I said, look at the studies on sodium. And except for like special percentage of the population, people need more. That below two grams. It's crazy how demonized the salt has been. Dude, look at the studies on migraines and sodium and dizziness and sodium and all cause mortality and sodium. When you take out the special populations of people who are really sensitive or sick, it's like, not only is two grams that recommendation too little, it's actually bad to have that little for a lot of people. She just added a packet, did her yoga class and right away she texted me. She's like, totally gone, all of it gone. This is something she's been trying to figure out for years. That's awesome. That's awesome. All right. I have a shout out for us. It's probably somebody who's super famous, so a lot of people already know. But it was somebody who I definitely did not consume any of his content, say, two, three years ago and before in her. No. Who's that? Russell Brand. I love his stuff now. And I used to. He's so sharp. He is. And funny. I love his content. I love his stuff now. And I didn't care for it that long ago. And I feel like in the last two to three years, he's literally been just, he's a great voice of reason. And he's hilarious the way he does it. I've watched several interviews too when he gets on some of these political shows. Super sharp and witty. He is, dude. I know he's a bit of a word salad sometimes, but it's still hilarious to listen to him. So if you are not following the voice of his content. I agree 100%. Hey, check this out. The perfect, gut-friendly, clean protein snack for the go is here. Paleo Valley makes meat sticks that are grass-fed, delicious, and not dry. They have a lot of other amazing supplements and products as well. For example, they have a bone broth that's chocolate flavored that tastes better than anything I've ever had in my life when it comes to protein powders. I swear to God, I'm not making this up. Anyway, go check this company out. Go to paleovali.com forward slash mind pump. Use the code Mind Pump 15 for 15% off your first order. All right, here comes the rest of the show. Our first question is from Lee Pollack. What's more important for building muscle, reps, or load and tempo? Well, all of them. Yeah, all of them build muscle. I think as a beginner, you probably are going to get the most out of load and reps. Tempo starts to become more important as you become a little bit more advanced. But the reason why I don't like questions like this. Yeah, I don't even like that answer. Yeah, because now someone's going to take that and discredit. Yeah, not only that, but I think I've said this before in the past. One of my favorite things to manipulate or focus on when I have a new client is tempo. Not because I think it elicits the most gains, but because at that time in their journey, I think putting emphasis on the form. Sharp in the mechanics. Yeah, what a great way to sharpen. And by the way, I know that I'm also progressively overloading by slowing the tempo down. So I do know that I'm eliciting some gains and some benefits from it. But more importantly, I'm really honing in on their mechanics on the exercise. And so I make that decision. Maybe if I would have loaded it with an extra 50 pounds, I could probably elicit more growth. But that's not the goal at that time. I could say in terms of order of operation, this isn't like, this is totally general advice, but I would take somebody in. It would be more of a tempo driven just because I'm so geared in looking technique and looking any kind of instability or something we need to address. Then I'm considering reps because now we're just kind of working our way through that technique and we're practicing it. And really the big emphasis on the practice of it, I'm not quite loading it substantially yet. Now after they master that, we're going into more of a heavier loading situation. But that would be sort of my... I think a good way to put it is that progressive overload is what builds muscle. All of these can be used to increase, yeah, to progressively overload someone. So how does load increase progressive overload? That's an easy one, right? Add weight. How about reps? Well, yeah, reps. What about tempo? Well, take an exercise that you can do 10 reps with. Slow it down. And slow it down. Now you can only do seven reps, right? And so now you've progressively overload the body. So all of these are equally important and some of them are more important than others depending on who I'm talking to. If I watch someone work out, I could tell which one is gonna give them more bang for their buck. And it can be different from person to person. Well, let's give examples. Okay, so let's say I take on a client. I've got, let's say, a female competitor. She's actually really experienced. She's got great form and technique. But I noticed right away that she, you know, she tends to slow the tempo down and manipulate rep ranges more than anything else. And she's a bit afraid to load the bar. I'm gonna stretch her there. I'm gonna challenge her in that area because I know that that's an area that she probably hasn't pushed. And I know she's got more gas in the gas tank than that and we're gonna get more bang for our buck. So that's an example. Take another client who's brand new, can't even do a bicep curl without rocking their elbows and shoulders. Like I'm not gonna load the bar on that client anymore because they can't, their technique is so off. I'm gonna focus on the tempo and slow it down so I can show them how to keep their shoulders in the fixed position and keep their elbows pinned by their side and like, and I'm gonna teach mechanics. Meanwhile, knowing that I am also progressively overloading because I'm slowing the tempo down. So, I mean, it's gonna be different for every client that you take on. Take somebody who's been powerlifting for years and actually competes at a very high level. Reps, have them trained with some higher reps, that's happening. Right, never seen 15, 20 rep range before brand new stimulus. We had Stan Efferding was on the show. He was very experienced as a power lifter and wanted to get a pro card, hired Flex Wheeler. And Flex Wheeler had him do 20 reps sets for lower body which he'd never done before and his legs totally grew. So they're all completely changed based on the avatar that's in front of him. This is like saying, what's more important when you're making a cake? Eggs, milk, or flour? Or it's more like, what's the best exercise for X? They all move the needle. That all changes based off of what that person has currently been doing, what that goal is. And so it's a bit nuanced to say what's more important. So what's most important is that all of these are tools in your tool belt. And if you're not using one of them, you're missing out on potential gains. Next question is from Aurora Madison. I can often grind out a few extra reps if I take a pause for two to five seconds between the last few reps of a set to catch my breath. Does that mean I am cheating and should just end the set when I start slowing down too much? No, you know what this is like. It's like a rest pause a little bit. Yeah, or a rest, well, you could call rest pause, cluster sets, that's a technique. And I think that a great strategy to utilize this, but if that's how you train all the time. Too much. Every time you always work out and you never mix it up or you don't give yourself any rest when you go right in the next rep, then you're missing out on gains. So it doesn't mean you're cheating. That's a valid way to get new gains potentially if you've listened to this and you've never done that. Well, yeah, and if you're seeking an adaptation more of like muscle endurance and you're doing more super setting, obviously, you know, that's not the focus. So at that point, you kind of go until you feel like you have to stop. And so if you have to pause and then do more reps, it does sort of defeat the purpose in that setting. Yeah, I actually hate the term cheating in an exercise sense. And it comes from, I guess, competition. Like if you're a power lifter, there's a certain technique. And if you're outside that technique, then they won't give you the green light and they'll say it doesn't qualify. So like if you're bench pressing, your butt comes off the bench, well, that's cheating. It's a bad lift. Really, it's just better technique, better applications of, you know, methods and worse. So is it? Or different. Sticking with your intention going into it. Yeah, but there's better or worse. Like you could do like kipping pull-ups and that's a style of pull-up, but this is effective as a strict pull-up, generally speaking, no. It's better for people when I do kipping pull-ups, but not for most people. This is just, like you guys said, it's a technique. I think it's a great way to increase intensity. I don't think you should do this all the time. For most people, it should be too much intensity if applied on a regular basis. In my opinion, if you're advanced and everything else is going good, I think this would be great to add maybe every other week to squeeze out the intensity, but doing it on a regular basis and you'll probably hit a wall pretty quick. Next question is from Guy Pettigrew. What is the value in picking exercises that train muscles in the shortened and lengthened positions? Yeah, well, so the value is this, okay? There's a pretty, the body adapts pretty specifically when it comes to strength, meaning if I get good at an exercise that loads my bicep with the most weight in a shortened position, then the type of strength I'm gonna gain is gonna be most applicable in a similar way. So a lot of the strength gains are gonna come in that shortened position. If I load it, if I do an exercise with a load as heaviest in the stretch position, same thing. So the reason why bodybuilders train with lots of angles and different, like you think to yourself like, why do five exercises for your biceps? Why not just do the same exercise as many sets? So instead of doing 15 sets with five different exercises, why don't you just do 15 sets of one exercise, all the biceps, what's the difference? Well, the difference is this, is the adaptation is quite specific. Some exercises load in the shortened, some exercises load in the lengthened, elbow position matters, hand position matters because of the specificity of the adaptation. So this is true for any exercise. So they're both valuable, you should probably do both. Yeah, I like to just pay attention, especially like I like talking about this with a bicep and tricep, right? Your arms is in a workout, I try and make sure I include both, right? Something in the shortened, something in the lengthened, in a workout like that. At the very least, you should be aware if you're always training in one or the other because to your point about, it's a specific adaptation, like there's massive value there if you're always training in the shortened position or you're always training in the lengthened position to make sure you include the other. And I think people actually unintentionally do this and then they think that there was something magical about a specific exercise. For example, like if you always do like all these cable push downs and like skull crusher and so that and all of a sudden someone's like, oh, you never do dumbbell overhead extensions and then you do them and you're like, your triceps blow up and you're like, you think all of a sudden there's something magical about the overhead tricep extension. Well, maybe it was less about the overhead tricep extension being magical and it's that you never train your triceps in the completely lengthened position like that and there's tremendous value doing it and it's a total different stimulus compared to all those other tricep exercises that you were doing. Yeah, and you're just able to build fuller, you have more opportunity to build muscle in that lengthened position and also too from a functional perspective, like if we train too much in a shortened and that's our entire goal is to hit that peak of the muscle, what is that gonna do in terms of my overall movement potential and what I'm able to do in terms of functionality. So I'm strongest just in this one small portion of range of motion versus like, now I get in an extended position and I'm not able to stabilize properly. I'm opening myself to be vulnerable to a tear or like your body's gonna respond negatively. Yeah, so here's a good example of what we're talking about. Let's say you took two twins, so same exact identical genetics. So identical twins and they also lived in identical lifestyle, ate the same, slept the same, same stress, everything was identical. One person only did leg press, the other person only did barbell squats. Well, the person who only did leg press is gonna be stronger than their brother at the leg press, but the person who did squats all the time is gonna be stronger at the squats than the brother who did leg press because of the specificity of these types of adaptations. So the theory was, which has been proven, that if you do multiple exercises, you're gonna derive better benefits than if you just do one exercise or only strengthen something in a shortened or lengthened position. So that's the value. So there's value in both positions, there's value in mid-range positions too. Some exercises don't load the muscle heavily in the stretch or the shortened positions, really in the mid-range position and those are also valuable. So you wanna train with multiple angles. Next question is from Ricky Bobby 01. What are the best lower body exercises for older people with osteopenia in the legs? So osteopenia is before osteoporosis. This is when you start to see bone loss or bone weakness before it becomes, it starts to get really, really bad, okay? And to be clear, any kind of strength training for the lower body will build the bone just like it builds muscle. Anything that builds muscle builds bone. Muscle anchors to bone. If the muscle is under more stress, then the bone is under more stress and the bone strengthens. And nothing has been shown. Nothing has come close to strength training for strengthening bone. Okay, so to be clear, any exercise will be great. Now I'm gonna speak more generally in my experience working with older people with lower body weakness and osteopenia, one of my favorite exercises, mainly because most of them could kind of do it and so we could right away get into strengthening was pushing a sled. Pushing a sled was so appropriate for, first of all, it's an exercise that could do with advanced people. And so when I would have a complete, like an older person, as long as they could walk, right? So not someone who had a walker or whatever, but somebody could walk. I would have a sled, I wouldn't load it at all. So it'd be a little bit of resistance and they would just push it across the grass and it would provide enough resistance for them that would be, and it was just, it didn't require a ton of skill. I don't have to like take them through this technique curve of learning the technique and stuff like that. And then we would see strengthening happening, right away. So that's one of my favorite things. I love that answer and not what I was thinking because I was trying to take myself back to those types of clients that I train and what do we try and do? And it does really matter at what level they are. I mean, whatever I start them on, the goal is can I get them to do a barbell back squat at one point? Can I get this client strong enough to eventually load a barbell? And you might never get there. And we might never get there, exactly right. So and where did I have to regress and start them? I love like, you know, split stance unilateral, like a stationary lunge is what I recall doing a lot where I'd have like a, I'd put a pad for their knee to come down to. A lot of times I'd have to assist them where they were like holding my hands or they had something by their side. Yeah, or TRX straps, something to kind of help them stabilize. And that is how we started. And then the goal was to get rid of them holding on to anything. And then could they actually stabilize themselves and then eventually do something like a very small step up, you know, and then I could gradually increase the step up over time and stuff. Although in this pursuit of, can I get this person enough stability and strength to be able to do a bar that that's the like, and that would be like, by the way, like that's like a huge celebration. Forget body fat, this, whatever like that's like, man. And I would, in my presentation, that's what I would be telling her. If she sat down with me and she goes, this is what I have going on. This is what the doctor told me. He says, I need to strengthen my lower body. I'd say, great. These are the type of movements that we're going to start with for these reasons. But our goal is, and what will be a huge win, if we can get to a point where I could load you and we can do a barbell back squat, that is going to be an amazing day when we get there. And then that would be the goal is like, let's start progressing that direction. 100%, I mean, again. But I love the sled is like the most. Yeah, that's a great answer. It's super easy. Literally almost anybody could get start with that. The super light sled. You just push it across, small steps doesn't have to be big. Very low risk, you know, because you just let go and it's like, no more demand. If you feel anything kind of like affecting the joints at all. And so it's, that's a fantastic exercise that most people should be doing. Totally. Now I love if you do that because that's so concentric focused, I would like couple that. So let's just pretend because obviously you go that direction because this person is incredibly like. Yeah, they're older with osteopenia. Yeah, they can't do hardly anything. So they can't do the other ones I talked about. That person, I could see myself pushing the sled and then actually doing like an eccentric sit down squat where I would stand in front of her. She would hold my hands and I'd want her to lower herself as slow as she could down to the chair and then get back up, slower down to chair as slow as you can. So now I'm getting the benefits of the eccentric portion of strengthening her lower body. And then I'm also getting the positive from the concentric on the leg. But I will say this when you just get started, just do one. It's really easy to do it. Right, right, right. No, yeah, no, yeah. They can push the sled. Great point. Like that would be a different session. Totally. Right, so if she's never trained anything, sled pushing for a session is like enough work and it's gonna listen to something. And then the next time we might focus. And dragging the sled, you too, obviously. That's another one. Look, if you like Mind Pump, head over to mindpumpfree.com and check out our guides. We have guides that can help you with almost any health or fitness goal. You can also find all of us on social media. Justin is on Instagram at Mind Pump Justin. I'm on Instagram at Mind Pump DeStefano and Adam is on Instagram at Mind Pump Adam. Today we're gonna teach you everything you need to know to build a strong, well-developed chest. When I think of weak points and areas that I struggled with developing for a really long time, chest was up there with the work. Yeah, it was for me for sure. I got more caught up in the weight I could lift versus how I was developing my body. I think it's one of the most challenging muscles to develop for most people because of the form and technique.