 Well, I saw the breakfast in Plus TV Africa. We're excited to have Dr. Eugene Itwa, who is a sustainability expert, as well as an environmental specialist. Dr. Eugene, it's good to have you join us. Good morning. Good morning to you. Well, a bit of it. President Mohammed Buhari has charged the National Council on Climate Change to formulate an appropriate policy towards achieving green growth and sustainable economic development for Nigeria. The president, in a statement by presidential spokesman Femi Adesina, said that development marked the commencement of the Implementation of Climate Change Act of 2021 and a new chapter on the renewed response to climate change in the country. He also, that's the president, directed the attorney general and the minister of justice in conjunction with the minister of environment to initiate appropriate amendment of noticeable implementation challenges inherent in the act, highlighting the losses and damages caused by the recent increasing floods in several parts of the country, as well as in Pakistan, Bangladesh and other parts of east and southern Africa. He described climate change as one of the biggest challenges facing humanity. Now, these inauguration and all of this is actually a response of government to the global climate challenges. Dr. Eugene, what are your thoughts on this? Thank you very much. And I think the president is quite apt in what he had actually said through the spokesman. And I will say this is a watershed. And we at the critical point and the president is taking the decisive step through this miss. And also it's quite appreciated for me is a good one. And we must all support it. Looking at talking about before now, we've had proposals for getting, I mean, in terms of preparing bills at the National Assembly to get the climate change ads on, but we never succeeded in previous assemblies. But now we've had this and the president endorses last year. Also, we are happy. And it's actually coming right on time, looking at the various challenges that we're having. As we prepare for COP 27, one of the critical element of following up giving attention to should be a loss of damage aspect. And the president in his remark has indeed highlighted that. So for me, it is quite a very is a good one. And so I'm happy to see that the government or the president has inaugurated the council. Long before now, we actually had expected that the council would be inaugurated. But unfortunately, there was a bit of delay. But now we have it's inaugurated earlier. We had the director general, who is the secretary to the council that was appointed by the president. And so we are happy for this to see all of this happening at this very critical time. Now, just before we get to the, you know, the crux really of the conversation. I mean, let's also look at, you know, all the factors. One of the issues I was mentioned is the issue of flooding. And we know the flooding has been very critical for the Nigerian states or the nation if you want to talk about across different parts of the country. Flooding is an issue. But if you juxtapose of flooding in Nigeria, in other parts of the country, would you say that flooding for Nigeria is a natural disaster or is man made? Flooding, general, everywhere is flooded, simply people. It's just where is it in the world that is not flooded or that will not receive its own dose of flooding. Everywhere in the world, it is not just about an issue of Nigeria. Interestingly, we are aware that the IPCC Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change earlier has said a whole lot of things about this, especially for the African continent forested. There are the issues of intensity of rain, rainfall. There is, you have intensity of rainfall everywhere. And then dry spurs is some other locations where the rains are not coming. And now we will have rains coming in areas that we are here to have the logout dry spurs. So for, for, for, it's not just about Nigeria. It's not that our issues appear to be a bit peculiar for the fact that we do not prepare to manage these emergencies. We granted that we have even early warning system from the regulatory authorities. Do we actually respect to that? We don't until it's right on us before we start taking measures after the act. I think that's where this, it seems to be overwhelming. And the, the intensity of rainfall we cannot, it's not, it's not man-made. But of course, if you say it's man-made, it already needs to all tie, tie lead to the issues of climate change. Yes. But generally, we know that all mankind's activity has indeed intensifying rainfall, extremes of temperature, extremes of rainfall, just limits. They are all here upon us. So for us, as far as we're concerned in Nigeria, it's not just about being a peculiar situation. That's where it would develop toward, at one time, what you had, how they are on those of these challenges, or is the management that we seem to be lacking, preparing for them and then managing all of this. I think that is where we seem to be overwhelmed. Well, so, so it definitely means that you are agreeing with the school of thought that says that, you know, the flooding that we experience in Nigeria, when you juxtapose that with the entire globe, we're not saying that climate change is not imminent, but we're saying that what we experience in our country is actually man-made, is induced, because number one, I would tell you that you have a country where most parts lack of drainage system, and water by its nature will always find its way. It's a force. It cannot wait for the government or the people to adhere or respect it. And so lack of drainage or in situations where you have the drainage system, the drainage system is clogged. That's due to human interaction. Toss things in a drainage system. You want to call them the gutters or the waterways. And that's really it. So I want to know where you stand in all of this. Yeah, you recall, I talked about management. I talked about even when you have regulatory authorities announcing that the amount of rainfall for a certain period will be more than usual. What are we supposed to do? It's part of the element of management that I talked about. I didn't want to go into those specifics of, say, the drainage lines are clogged or we do not. Recall, I'll give you an example. Lagos, for instance. In those days when they had what they call gang, the officers that would come around before the rain forces, the drainage lines are cleared. And so when the rain is calm, they follow the channels, except those that have their homes across the water channels or close to the water channels that will have the areas overwhelmed. Otherwise, it's known it's given. So there is no need to repeat it. But again, for the sake of awareness, for the sake of reminding us, if you are looking at it from that angle, yes, it is part of the entire challenges. But it is not, if we clear, if we have enough drain lines, unfortunately, we don't have enough drain lines in a number of locations in a number across the country. So we first and foremost need to be able to put drain lines where they should assist. And then the drain lines, of course, should not be clogged, like you have already pointed out. But again, just to let you know that when the rain is calm, when the banks of the rivers are over flooded, this leads you really can't do. Other than to allow this rain when they come, they have a channel to go to follow through. It plays like a platu state. I recall, especially just, nothing we ever had flooding. Because when the rains come, there are channels because of the landscape, the water terribly goes away. Well, as we have, we have a plain land. You don't have channels. The water cannot go, it remains there. So not on, this is part of your mind. Let's progress through other issues. Dr. Eugene, let's look at all the issues. I like the fact that, you know, the president has made reference to the Climate Change Act of 2021. The act provides a framework for Nigeria. I mean, this committee doesn't agree that, I mean, we're big on saying let's implement whatever it is. And so the Climate Change Act of 2021, the act provides a framework for Nigeria to achieve a low greenhouse gas immersion through inclusive greenhouse or green growth and sustainable economic development and implementation of Nigerian's commitment to meet zero immersion declared at the time. We're talking about that Paris agreement that, we're part of this agreement. But my question is, do you think that this is rational for a country that is highly dependent on oil, you know, gas? We're talking about oil now for earnings. So do you think it's rational that as a country in Africa, we're getting into such an agreement, where we know that we're highly dependent on the oil economy for earnings? So what becomes of us? How much have we even emitting, I mean, emitting at the end of the day, if we talk about immersion, when you juxtapose that with countries of the world in the south. So you're talking about the north and the south now. Do you think it's rational that we are getting into this agreement as a country? I'm not even talking about Africa as a continent. Maybe I should separate the arts from the Paris agreement that you talked about. That agreement, of course, we signed it in a number of countries also had and endorsed it. And so it's operational. Just to let you know, as we're looking at the issues of emissions, we're also looking at issues of beauty, resilient society, adaptation elements. So the floor that you talked about just relates to that aspect of building a resilient society. So that agreement also talked about this. The challenge perhaps you want to take from that is, oh, we continue to talk about emissions like you have just mentioned. But again, it's not just all about emissions. No matter how small it is, we contribute. But going beyond that, what is it that the agreement said, a other element that I just talked about, that will not be our focus. For instance, not too long ago, I am aware that some world leaders met in Netherlands on the platform Global Center for Adaptation, looking at the common focus for the African continent as we build up towards COP 27. And the issue there is what can support the African continent, what can support Nigeria? Yes, it is said that the African continent, for instance, the emission from it is about two to three percent. I think that is what is said here and there. But no matter how small it is, we admit. So how do we all move together? That is what you're talking about now. We should all move together. But then we should emphasize our own molecular challenges. If they are saying, oh, we do this to bring our emission, we should also be able to emphasize over and over to say that, look, the one that touches us is this. Let's also emphasize the issues of adaptation. Let's also emphasize the issues of building climate resilience in our community so that even when we have the flood, we're able to deal with it. Let's talk about the issues of loss and damage so that we can adequately take account and prepare for all of that and manage them effectively and reduce the impacts. So it is, like I have said, it is not so too with the climate change arts. A climate change arts, like based on what we even just said, talked about the issue of resilience. Yes, we have a carbon budget to meet. Yes, we have issues of decarbonization even right in the arts. Dr. Eugene, just to let you know, as much as it sounds like as a country, because I don't think that we're being honest with ourselves as a country and a continent. If you juxtapose it, it's not fair. We're talking about a country where there's equity, justice, and what's the essence of having countries come together for national prosperity or global prosperity. When nations come together, they should be looking at the interest. You know that our mission, I mean, look at the statistics, 6.692% is what Nigeria has emitted in July at a certain time. Can it be juxtaposed with other emissions from other parts of the country? Why should we be getting into this kind of agreement? Should we be following it? Because the world is saying, oh, we need to reduce, we need to protect the environment, which is very valid. I understand the world is a global village, but how much of the toxic are we contributing to the environment or to the globe as a country and as a continent? We'll leave it at that. Thank you so much for being part of the breakfast this morning. Dr. Eugene Utu. Well, that is it. Thank you. Just to quickly, just to make a final remark that yes, issues of climate justice, I certainly agree with you. But if we are not there, we cannot pursue it. If we are outside the bus, you say inside the bus? Yes, we can also make our voice count. That's why we need to sign and be part of it and indeed we have signed. Thank you very much. Well, that's it. I totally appreciate your time. Dr. Eugene Utu, thank you for being part of the breakfast this morning. He is an environmental specialist as well as a consultant. We have been talking about the plan to inaugurate the committee and also ensure the implementation of the climate change act 2021. That's it on the breakfast. If you missed that on any part of the show, we'll be all right to follow us on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram and do subscribe to YouTube channel where plus TV Africa and plus TV Africa lifestyle. You can also follow us on Lymex at www.lymex.tv and glow TV app anywhere in the world. My name is Messi. Have a great day.