 Welcome to Beyond the Lines, I'm Rusty Kamori. We broadcast live on Mondays from the Think Tech Hawaii TV studio in the Pioneer Plaza in downtown Honolulu. This show is based on my book, which is also titled Beyond the Lines, and it's about creating a superior culture of excellence, leadership, achieving greater success and sustaining that greater success and finding greatness. My special guest today, Chris Kajioka, is a great example of all of this. He is the owner and chef of Senya, which is one of the best restaurants in the state of Hawaii and has gained national recognition as well. Chris is a brilliant chef and leader and has achieved huge success, and today we are going beyond restaurants. Chris, awesome having you here. Thanks for having me, and also congratulations on the book. Oh, thank you so much. Working my way through it now. Thank you, I feel honored that you're working on it. Now you're an amazing chef, to say the least, and when did you first start having an interest in cooking? I think from four years old, I wasn't much of a cartoon guy, so I would always watch cooking shows, and there's pictures of me around the Christmas tree with a chef hat and chef utensils, so for some reason, my parents aren't in the industry, but from a very young age, I've always wanted to be a chef. And then what school did you go to? I went to high school, I went to Iolani, which definitely does not churn out chefs, but I went to college in upstate New York at the Culinary Institute of America, which I think is regarded as a top school, and was recommended to me by Roy Amaguchi. Now when you were at Iolani, did you play any sports? I did. I actually spent my whole life playing baseball, basketball as well. Baseball was my first love, and I played baseball and volleyball during high school. And then at the Culinary Institute, that's in New York, and that's a very prestigious school. How did your parents deal with you wanting to go to culinary school versus regular college? I think any parent that sends their kids to Iolani and spends that tuition money, I think they'd be lying if they said they wanted them to be a chef, especially when I was going there. Both my parents, especially my dad, wanted to make sure that I was serious about it, and told me I needed to go work in high school for free. And that's kind of what I did to prove to him that I would take this seriously. And I was going probably the farthest place away from Hawaii and upstate New York, but he just wanted to make sure that I was positive. And once he saw what work I put into and sacrificing my weekends as a kid, he was pretty set. So what was the first job that you were working at at that time? The first job was, I still remember it, it's a Pacific Cafe, it was in the old World Warehouse, and the chef was Jean-Marie Jocelyn, and actually my uncle was his dentist. So he kind of asked him, my nephew's really into cooking, can you let him be in the kitchen? I think I was 60, 15 or 16, and I just remember, I really remember tossing a salad, they let me do that, and it was just mind-blowing for me, it was addicting. That's where you found your passion, you solidified it as your passion? I always knew I wanted to do it, but that kind of emotion of it and seeing the kitchen and the camaraderie of the team, I think it was like nothing I've ever experienced. Great. So you have your wife and your son, can you tell me about them? Yeah, my son is four, his name is Cade, Cade Thomas, his actual name is after Thomas Keller. My wife, she's an extremely accomplished, she's a banker for Bank of Hawaii, and she's extremely supportive of me, and I think anybody who's married to a chef needs to be tolerant. I think that's the number one word is tolerant, and yeah, especially with me. Maybe tolerant and lucky, because she gets to eat great food all the time, right? Yeah, I think that's a misconception. I think anybody who thinks married to a chef, I mean I'm cooking all day, the last thing I want to do is cook it all, and she's actually a really good cook, so I'm lucky. So that helps. Yeah. So she gets to cook for you? Yeah, I don't think she wants to, but she has to. She has to. Yeah. Now you mentioned Thomas Keller, and Thomas Keller is world famous for being the owner and chef of French Laundry and Perse. Now what is your connection with him? So when I first, so when I graduated from the CIA, I made a list of five places I wanted to work for in my career. And actually the first place was in San Francisco, and the chef's name was Ron Segal. Ron was the first chef of the French Laundry. He opened the French Laundry with Thomas Keller, and I had eaten at his restaurant, Massas in San Francisco, and to this day it's probably one of my top five meals, where I completely set the tone for my career. So I sent the resume, and actually Roy, I was sitting in Roy's office, and Roy was like, who do you want to work for? And I said, Ron Segal. So he happened to be a friend of Ron, and literally Roy just made a phone call, and Ron told me to be there in two weeks. So I moved to San Francisco, and I, you know, Ron Segal to this day is my number one mentor. But he's also the reason why I went to Perse, is after I was done with him, he made a phone call to Thomas, and you know, got me into Perse. So it's, you know, it's very, I'm very, you know, lucky, I'm very, to have that, you know, connection, and very grateful, absolutely. So in those experiences, what are some things that you've, you learned? I think we call it the push, and I think, you know, it's, it's one of those things that you have a list of, you have a list of duties that's a lot longer than the time you have. Okay. So it's the push to, you know, get it done every day, no matter what. And you know, that every day, it becomes a little easier, and that's when you know you're becoming better. But just the every detail matters, you know, in a Thomas Keller kitchen. So how, how were those details in the disciplines? I think in the beginning, it was very, it was very rough for me, a transition, because there's a certain language in a Thomas Keller kitchen, and I can't really explain it, but the things that they call, you know, even a kitchen towel, it's, it's different. It's just, but adapting, it's almost military, where, you know, they break you down to, to, to, they break you down, and then they build you back up in their style, you know, and I think that's the best way to do it, to be honest with you, because, you know, the kitchen is run with precision. Everyone's accountable. I think that's number one, and everyone's really proud to be there. I mean, there's not that many restaurants that everybody really buys into, you know, the philosophy of it, the food, right? That's what makes a restaurant great. Yeah. For sure. Now, every chef, they ultimately want to own their own restaurant. Yeah. When did you realize that you were ready to open up your own restaurant? It's like having a kid. I don't think you're ever really ready. I think you get to a point where you feel you've had enough training. I didn't, you know, I had opportunities to open earlier. I, you know, I accepted Vintage K when I was 28, and I felt like I learned everything I could for my mentors, and I wanted to take a chance, you know. But, you know, a lot of people nowadays open 25, 26, and, you know, maturity-wise, I wasn't there, and I'm glad I waited. But you don't really ever know that you're ready. You know, I think if you think you're ready, there's so many other things that you don't know, you know. And it happened, you know, when I opened Senia, you know, there's still things that we're learning to this day, you know. Well, now, Senia has been open for a year and a half. This is one of the state's top restaurants. It's amazing. How did you choose the name Senia? So, actually, my partner, Katherine Lamora, who's our general manager, it was one of, having a name for a restaurant is very tricky. You know, I think Google, honestly, Google is like a big, I would say everyone uses Google. You know, just Googling names and meanings. And Senia is actually an offshoot of a Greek term, Xenia, which is where it acts. It refers to hospitality. It refers to strangers coming together. And we thought it was perfect because, you know, Anthony, my partner is from England. Katherine's from LA and I'm from here. And we're bringing it all together to hopefully exude a sense of hospitality. Well, you definitely do that, and you just mentioned Anthony. How did you and Anthony rush, connect? So Anthony, you know, we worked at Perse together, and he was actually my sous chef. And one of the most gifted cooks, one of the most gifted cooks there is, you know, I've ever worked with. And we just really got along together. I think there's a few people in your career that you just, you know, bond with, and you just work really well together, and he was one of those people. Yeah. You guys make an amazing team together. I got to tell you, Chris, I absolutely love Senia. I love Senia, all of my friends do, too. Thank you. Can you tell me why you believe Senia is so successful? I think it starts with our employees. I think every one of them buy into what we're doing, and going back to the Thomas Keller thing, I think if everyone believes in the food, in the hospitality, in the leadership, in what we're trying to give everyone, I think that's where success is. We're very lucky to have really good employees, and we're lucky to have people who have been there from the beginning, and want to pursue, you know, getting better and better every day. I mean, you know, without them, me and Anthony would be a lot busier during the day doing everything else. Sure. And you just, you can't do it without those people. Also, I think we believe in the details. We believe in thinking about everything. We sacrifice seat count for boosts and comfort, which, you know, in a restaurant, financially, you want seat count. Yeah. Right? Also, our kitchen is 50-50 with the dining room, which is not really a good sign. But, you know, I think we feel like, you know, people are comfortable. You know, they'll eat more food or they'll drink more. So we feel like we sacrifice that for comfort and hospitality. I agree with you. Fairly recently, my friends and I, we went to your private dining room upstairs and had an absolutely great time. The food, the wines, absolutely amazing. And then downstairs, you have the main dining room, and then you have the counter. How did you guys come up with the ideas for all of that? I think, you know, the two concepts downstairs, we wanted to, I think people had a perception that two really fine dining chefs are coming together that's going to be fine dining. And I think we wanted to completely go away from that perception and make it approachable, family style, share, you know, kind of how we like to eat when we go out. But we also needed that outlet to kind of execute what we've trained for the last, you know, 15, 20 years, you know? So that's what I think the chef counter really affords us. So it's fun. You know, there's some days, you know, we have a PR who's doing a TC menu, we have a full house downstairs, and with the counter that's full, it's rocking, you know? But the energy is like infectious, you know? It's like, there's nothing like that adrenaline. I agree. I mean, wherever you go, the private dining room, the main dining room, or the counter, you cannot go wrong. Now you are a brilliant chef. Thank you. And your dishes are exceptional. How do you keep coming up with these exceptional dishes? I mean, I think, thank you for saying exceptional. We don't always, you know, we want to make every dish exceptional. That's always the goal. I think we follow seasons, because that's really what we trained. We trained in New York and San Francisco and London, and it's very seasonal there. You know, Hawaii is not very seasonal, but we still try to follow that guideline where, you know, we're not using tomatoes all year. We're not using corn all year. You know, we love pumpkin during the fall, you know? So I think that's where a natural progression is that the dishes will always have that, you know, sinew, I guess, core, but the ingredients will always change. So I think that's where we can separate ourselves. And Chris, you, before sinew opened, you guys were featured in the New York Times. I mean, national recognition. How did that make you feel? I think, you know, obviously it was a huge, it was huge for us. It was huge PR. It was very unexpected, to be honest with you. But, you know, we had such a long lead up to the opening of the restaurant that, you know, it helped us, but it also created a sense of expectation that, you know, I think I struggle with day to day. You know, people come in from far to dine with us. Sometimes they come in for one night to dine with us. And, you know, it's, we need to kill it every day. Oh, yeah. So that's, it's daunting sometimes. No, and you guys are doing it, and it's just amazing. I look forward to going to sinew all the time. Thank you. Now, Chris, when we, we're going to take a quick break. When we come back, I want to talk to you more about success and leadership. Okay, great. You are watching Beyond the Lines on Think Tech Hawaii with my special guest, Chris Kajioka. We will be back in a quick minute. Aloha. My name is Mark Shklav. I am the host of Think Tech Hawaii's Law Across the Sea. Law Across the Sea is on Think Tech Hawaii every other Monday at 11 a.m. Please join me where my guests talk about law topics and ideas and music and Hawai'i Ana all across the sea from Hawaii and back again. Aloha. Aloha. I'm Wendy Lowe, and I'm coming to you every other Tuesday at 2 o'clock live from Think Tech Hawaii. And on our show, we talk about taking your health back. And what does that mean? It means mind, body, and soul. Anything you can do that makes your body healthier and happier is what we're going to be talking about, whether it's spiritual health, mental health, fascia health, beautiful smile health, whatever it means, let's take healthy back. Aloha. Welcome back to Beyond the Lines on Think Tech Hawaii. My special guest today is Chris Kajioka, the owner and chef of Senya, which is one of the best restaurants in the state of Hawai'i. And today, we are going beyond restaurants. Chris, Chef Alan Wong, Chef Roy Yamaguchi, Chef Mavro. They're famous chefs here, right? Absolutely. Now, how is your relationship with those guys? You know, Roy is a mentor. I've come up in his kitchens. I think people choose three routes coming up. You go to Mavro, Alan, or Roy, right? So these are those three schools, right? I came up with Roy, and Roy has always been extremely gracious with me. Maybe it's because I went to his alma mater. Maybe because I always ask him too many questions, but I think he knew that I was a guy who was never going to settle, and he knew that I wanted to explore. Chef Alan, again, he's got a huge legacy here. You look at around the state, how many chefs have come up under Alan. That defines him, and he's a James Beard winner, as well as Mavro. Mavro, I've always admired Mavro and his style. He's done fine dining for so long, and that's so difficult, so I admire all three of them. And they all have those high standards, and they're just consistent with everything they do, and they have some signature dishes. Are you on your way to having those signature dishes, as well? Yeah, I think when I was younger, kind of ego sets in, and you're wondering why chefs have dishes that they cook constantly for 20-plus years. I always wanted to change, change, change, but then you come up with a dish that everybody loves, and everybody comes in with. You kind of want to hold on to those dishes, and hope that you can strike magic again. Now it's like, if I have a dish that everybody loves, it's not going anywhere. It's just a lot harder. Yeah, I get that. Now, Chris, let's talk about my book, Beyond the Lines. I know you have it. You're working on it. Tell me how you're liking it so far. I love it. I love the keys, how you break it down. I think obviously you've had a ton of success, and great leadership doesn't always result in success, and I wish you did it every time, but I think you find a way to combine both and really take us in your shoes. I enjoy it because as a new business owner, it's juggling so many things per day, it becomes overwhelming, but you sit back and you go through it, and it's like, okay, I can do this. And it's rewarding after the day. It is rewarding. Some of these are more rewarding than others, usually Saturday night after knowing we have Sunday off. It's really rewarding, but yeah. Great. You're very successful. You're 35 years old, and you've experienced so many things already. What do you ... I want to know, Chris, how do you define success? That's a really good question. I think some people define success as money, financial. I describe it as having a legacy. Having people who work under you, who learn from you, you want them to be better than you. I've had a lot of cooks have worked for me that have gone on to amazing restaurants and high positions, and that makes me so proud. That's a direct influence on what I brought to them and what they brought to me. So if I can churn out superstar chefs, that's everything. That's everything to me. That's the legacy in the community as well. I take a lot of Sundays, and I do a lot of charity dinners, as well as legacy for my son. It's not secret. I want him to be a chef. I always tell him, what do you want to be? A few days ago, he was like a firefighter, and I was like, what else? He was like, a chef. I was like, okay. Well, he'll be a chef first. I'm not one of those parents who want to guide them away from ... I want him by my side. Is he cooking some dishes for you right now? He is the most picky, not interested in food at all. I hopefully one day he'll get into it, but my mom always says, don't force him. But I'm like, he's got a restaurant he can take over right now, so it's so easy. That's good. Now, I want to ask you, Chris, why do you think you're successful? I think I've been able to train under amazing mentors, as well as my family. I have a very good core, a foundation. Me and my dad are very similar. We're very hardworking. I don't think we say a lot, but I think that hard work, coupled with amazing training advice, I think I'm successful. Oh, you are. I mean, I think those things, it was a path for me, and I took it, and that's the reason why I'm wearing it today. It's not me. It has nothing to do with me. It's everything to do with the people who surrounded me and gave me their insight. You're so passionate about doing what you do as a chef and an owner, and it's so clear to me that because you have that passion. You've found your passion. That's leading you to finding your greatness, which you found, and now you're helping everyone else find their greatness, and I think that's very inspiring. I want to ask you, Chris, what has been your greatest obstacle in achieving your success, and then how did you overcome that obstacle? I think we all get into during training. Most people work in great restaurants for 10 plus years, and it's the grind, the grind of it, working 80 hours a week, barely being able to cover costs, your rents, eating. That gets daunting, I think. I was lucky. My dad always supported my passion, but I think the grind of it, the mental grind thinking, am I ever going to be a chef or am I ever going to be able to lead a team? That's just the day-to-day grind of being a cook. Also, now that I'm an owner, I think employees managing personalities, it's the hardest thing. If I could just concentrate on the menu, our menu would be changing like 30 times a year, but it's like juggling personalities, juggling people's schedules, vacations. It's never ending. It's never ending, and you never turn off. That's what excites me, but that's also what stresses me out all the time. You're only 35, like I mentioned. What are you hoping to aspire to achieve in your future still? I want to do more projects, but I want to do projects that are meaningful and are all different. I want to help if our young cooks want an outlet, I want to give them an outlet, but I want to do projects that I'm really passionate about. I want to do projects that we've always said, we'll never do another Senya. Senya is like, to me, it's the magic of me, Anthony and Catherine, and all our employees. It's very singular. You can't bring that somewhere else. That magic is in that building, so we'll never do another Senya. We'll do maybe other concepts, but I just want to be proud. I really want to be proud of what concept we're doing, and not it'd be cookie cutter or something that we're not completely behind, I guess. So what do you feel gives you ultimate fulfillment and happiness? I think, number one, our employees are happy, and they're proud of what we're doing. That's number one, and I think another gauge of, I guess, success is financially sustainable. I applaud Roy, Mauro, Alan for being around for so long. I mean, we're going to hit two years in December, and I can't imagine doing it 18 more years. 20 years is incredible, but that's what you want to be. You want to be that restaurant that's the standard. You want to be Liliha Bakery. You want to be those places that high-stake house that I went to as a kid, and they haven't stopped getting better. You still remember how good it was. Well, you're definitely on your way. We'll see. We'll see. You're definitely on your way. So how do you keep innovating? How do you keep predicting what people would want? I think it's, I mean, the short answer is we eat out, we go to cities, and we see what's going on. I think that's key to anybody is eating out and figuring out what everyone else is doing, as well as we're always thinking about food. That's what I love to do. It's not a job for me. I get paid to do what I love. Not many people can say that. Well, Chris, I have to just say that it's been an honor having you on my show today. And Senya, absolutely phenomenal, exceptional food, like I said earlier. And I can't wait for my next visit there and really want to thank you for your time coming on to the show today. Thank you. It's an honor to be here. Thank you, Chris. And thank you for watching Beyond the Lines on Think Tech Hawaii. For more information, check out my website, RustyKamori.com, and follow me on Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, and Twitter. I hope that this show will inspire you to create your own superior culture of excellence and to find your greatness and help others find theirs. Aloha.