 Good, so I just want to give a quick background of who am I? I'm selling product I services for about 15 years now Not Drupal. I've been in other businesses used to be MSDNRD or Microsoft Regional Director for Microsoft for about five four four years It's a lot of evangelizing out there and hence a lot of roadshows talking to many customers Demoing a lot of stuff I co-founded a company which was primarily a mobile first using Drupal in the background. That's where I got introduced to Drupal About four years five years ago. That's where we started off Currently working and co-founding 5G solutions. We are the 100 people shop 30 yard focus on Drupal and Have San Jose as well as India offices out there a quick point just want to cover What are topics which we're going to cover here? product I services What is required to create a product I services? How can I be structured? Can you put a price to it? Or how do you market the product I services because all of these are Sort of cascading effect if you don't do the first you won't be able to do the last And before we move Just wanted to give a fix idea behind where are we going with this? So whatever we can do well, there are three things so what we do well what we want to do what we have paid to do they're all intersected at a certain point and We have to adjust if all three points join together obviously We're making a lot of money there But I'm not sure if everybody is Intersecting at all three angles out there So there are going to be gaps where predicting revenues always be going to be a challenge if you're a services only company If you're a products only company, you don't know what how do I make more money by doing a product and a service Services company so you're kind of in a dilemma of if you've been in the business for a long how many How much can you really go and anticipate for the next three four years? I'm going to make this much amount of money. I don't think so So to avoid or sort of to get out of this Is how you you can actually work on how do you productize the service? So why product I will service? Please raise your hand if you've been through this scenario 5 phone calls you've had up with a prospect two meetings in person that is three proposal rewrites because he's going through a lot of Definition of how things work and so on so forth You spend close to 65 manhards and you've not been able to sign the deal How many of us have been through that process? The idea essentially behind this is How do I increase my predictability in terms of revenue because that's going to be The bottom line for the company which I'm driving or the employees which are going to be along with me Were planning to scale with me, but I don't know how do I project this over the number of years? How do you differentiate against competition? So for us being a Offshore vendor if I go and sell hourly basis consulting. There are tons of those guys already available If I can offer a specific Offering and say if your customers having this particular problem I can go and solve because I've already defined those specs. So I don't have to go and tell them Hey, Mr. Customer. I know what you do what you're going through. I have solved these problems in the past Here is how I'm going to do it Focus on one problem and I'll talk about how do you sort of shortlist on those problems and with one solution? Sell value not just time most of us in the Drupal business have been actually selling hourly basis consulting And of course some of you are also been adding value to your customers, but can you really? Maximize out of by selling value and not just by the time. So that's the perspective here Create an asset Who knows after a few years you may be able to sell that asset and make more money out of it Maybe some other company comes by and says looks like this this guy has this tool or this company has this tool Which can add significant value to my revenue. Let's go ahead and buy that So that might be a additional revenue angle if you are thinking about that which in an hourly consulting That's unlikely to happen that Sell it to focus groups better chance of success. I'll talk about how do you hone on onto a particular group and then? Sell that those kind of approaches So what is required to create a product I service? Basically list all the projects which you have done Get them into a single bucket and then start filtering what it's common between all these projects And I'll talk you talk about some of our examples which we have been through. I'm sure you know We can talk about some of yours as well Identify who's your buyer? Who's the decision maker who's going to sign the check who's going to approve the budget? Who who are all these guys? And why are those required? I'll talk about that and Then the time spent on the proposals how much how much of an effort have you actually put in to build those proposals and Winning the deals and of course executing those projects as well And and the last which is the most important part is you need to be ready to invest if you are building a product I service and one of the diagrams which I'm going to show later that will probably sort of describe why should that be happen So product I service you have features fixed of a particular solution you have You've put a price to it You have prospects identified of the personas that I'm talking about and then you go ahead and create a product I service So how can it be structured? You arrive at a baseline by gathering all projects as I was talking about figure out What are the common elements? What is the common value which you are delivering it to the customer? Is there a particular value which the customer is? Taking you for granted versus it's a perceived value So, you know, there are two different aspects which you have to think about and that's an important element when you're trying to create your own product I service Identify an ideal client or a total accessible market. That's sort of marketing jargon from an accessibility perspective just want to quickly ask who understands Pam Who doesn't understand Pam? Okay so the idea Behind the total accessible market is if you've figured out Let's say within health care companies if your product I services focused on on a particular health care segment within health care segment which are the companies which are likely to buy your product I service And that would be the segment or the market size which you are going to attack and within that How many people are likely to buy so you sort of drive down into our zone down into your sellable market? And then go approach them with specific offerings, which you're coming out with How do you price it because that's also an important element? Because if somebody is buying a product The first question he's here. She's going to ask is what's the price of the product and and Deriving a price is always going to be a challenge Because you don't have a baseline there. There is nobody else who has a ready-to-use product or even if they have You obviously would want to undercut or over add depending upon how your product I service actually is perceived by a prospect so those are some of the aspects like you either derive it by How much cost are you incurring to build that product and then add margins on to that and then distribute that across your customers add maybe a little bit of Margins again on top of that and that could be one approach the other approaches if you have already sold these solutions May not be product I solutions What's the total value of the project or an average value of the project, you know That could also be a consideration for putting a price to your product I service When you're trying to approach your prospects In terms of trying to sell this service One Product can actually be applied to multiple prospects But the language which they understand would always be different So you have to create sort of I Messages which is coming down to the same solution, but The way it is perceived or the way the first prospect understands is always going to be different So you have to create those similar sounding messages So what I'm referring here is we have different versions of the problem. So if the problem is Let me take that an example. Let's say healthcare companies trying to build a Patient intake farm Now the farms Fields within the farms are pretty much same for almost all hospitals and clinics But the way the CIO Perceives his problem versus the CTO or the CMO the chief medical officer Perceives that problem is totally different So you need to have a separate message for all these personas and then reach out to those guys That's something which you can do Position as a problem solver so the questions would always go as hey Do you want to improve your patient's experience? It's a very broad-level question But the ultimate goal is for them to create those patient intake farms whenever that patient walks in He signs up on that particular tab and that's the product which would essentially go and sell to all the hospitals I Wanted to spend a lot of time on the marketing aspect But that'll be a whole lot of different session all together on how do you pick up a product and start market marketing it out to different prospects This is something which you should not do is the cart which I'm trying to depict out there The point where I was referring to about investments If you are Assuming you have recurring business coming in and you know that for months or years together This customer is going to I can scale my business along with this this customer or these customers That's the growth which you have But if you are trying to create a product I service you are bound to invest There is going to be an inflection point over a period of time when you actually make more money Then what you're pay by serve pay by our service is going to make Having said that there's always obviously a flip side on both sides Not making enough money as you would have been in just by being a doing a consulting work So you have to sort of think about both aspects So sort of word of caution before you figure that it's going to be very easy. It's not And I'll talk about what's not great about that If you already saw this idea to some of your clients They may not like that that you have now created a Service offering which has boundary around it because you actually milk them sort of Already from the customer. So that's not, you know, they may not like that It requires a lot of work Because you're defining a feature You're setting up things. You're making sure that You know, you're talking to prospects figuring out what feature works for them. What doesn't and so and so forth So that's something which you have to sort of Create that and it can't be done overnight with a lot of people perceive it can be but it's not Package it to convey great value and be profitable so it's sort of a Lema a lot of times when you're talking to multiple prospects and customers with this, you know Bring the value and and also be profitable. So that's something which you have to think about There are two approaches which you can actually take or think We've actually taken both and I want to talk about that There's an inside-out approach where a bunch of our customers had multiple websites media companies very specifically where They had a Drupal website. They had a wordpress website. They had a ROR or Ruby based websites and They had two people for each of these sites maintaining which the cost of that, you know, was significantly high Can I create a overarching solution which I can manage all three of them? All three web properties and they were acquiring two more under one single umbrella So we call it the central admin panel and that's the solution Which we've created which is live right now Sort of 70 to 80 percent It's already there. Why because the back end solution is pretty much the same It's just they you know fetch an API from different websites and start throwing in from asset management user management perspective The reason why it's not hundred percent is every customer requires a different UI and says You know it the the way it's managed internally within my system It should give the same look and feel so that my admin guys are not running around and there's no extra training required So that's the aspect where it's seven seventy to eighty percent frozen and the rest said Twenty to thirty percent is where we go ahead and define the UI or the customer goes and defines the UI So it depends upon how big the shop isn't So we figured who's the guy we should be supposed to sell what are the features What is the price and I purposely not put a price here? So that's that's an inside-out approach because we've sub built those solutions already for multiple of our customers We know what goes into this Create an overarching solution fixed features in terms of users What properties are we looking for and so on support is an inside-out approach and outside in approaches where we knew that there's a problem in the industry and Can a distro or a product solve that problem and Who are the likely candidates to whom we can sell this and can it be a feature-fixed You know challenges Around patient intake farms most of the time is hey, can I go integrate with the HR's? How many people are in healthcare domain operating out here? So maybe I should skip this part, but the idea is the first question They're likely to ask is can it integrate with my system and if yes, how easy is it or how difficult is that going to be? 100% frozen in terms of features because we know what The farms are most of the times defined by CMS. It's a central body for healthcare regulations so we've known that those are pretty much fixed and Hence we went ahead and create a distro which is free available on these seven the eight is going to be released this week by end of this week So those distros are already in now. How do we make money out of this because distro is free? Any integration work? That's where we come in because we've been doing integration for Four years now and hence that's the value we bring and the revenue which we make out of that some of our estimation tools Sorry, some of our product services, so we have Estimation and sprint automation tool Essentially every shop has a lot of excel sheets or maybe have an internal tool to do estimation for projects We've learned from over the years how Difficult or challenging from a complexity creation could be or resource allocation could be There is a demand from the customer most of the time. Hey, can you share the whole sprint plan with me or? You know a generic plan before you even start executing the project or get my buy-in on that So we've created that automation tool Then the patient intake form I talked about We also attempted a d6 to d7 migration, but we sort of thought that there's not enough demand and It's sort of shelved right now. It's still on but we're not aggressively talking about that Multi-site multi-app publishing framework, so we've worked with large publishing companies They've had issues where I need to create a site and a mobile app within two weeks site somebody understands but Mobile app within two weeks. It's going to be a challenge Especially every customer needs a new UI or hey, I want iOS, but I don't want Android or I want both I just want Android depending upon what they're looking for. So we created a framework which would Spin off this website and the mobile app within two days Dump in the framework capture all the data which is there Spin it out. The only challenge with iOS says it'll take another two weeks to get approval from Apple Apart from that that's something Which is fairly fixable in terms of creating this framework and central admin panel I talked about Quickly to summarize Try and standardize Your processes tools methodology If you have to create a product service If you want to Deliver value you have to You know have to make sure that there are you're focusing on a limited amount of customers But you maximize your revenue. That's the good part And then promote and sell Figure out what your total accessible market is Also predict your revenue Or you can predict your revenue based on hey, I know out of my Thousand times when I say times as in my thousand prospects in the total accessible market I have able to sell it to ten and likely to replicate this to another five or ten twenty And that's how you can actually predict your revenue versus the services which you have been selling So those are some of the aspects These are some of so I'm done with my sort of discussion here open to answer any questions How to I'm good on time. I think I have more five minutes to go any questions Anybody already thinking about practicing your service facing a particular challenge, so we actually are building a Foundation like for a grant management system for foundations and we had already some clients on a Drupal 6 version of it And then our clients agreed to pay us to Bring it to Drupal 8 and Then we had them pay us over three years. They have to pay us like Maybe like 50 grand a year to like have the whole new thing in Drupal 8 and then they're also kind of in the model So they know we're gonna try to sell it to other people and then they get a small cut If we sell it to other people because they can also help us sell it to other people because they are already in the market So now we're just really trying to figure out the so we're lucky that we kind of had somebody to pay to create the product But now we have to figure out how to price it and market it and sell it I guess one of our biggest problems is We tend to we have a lot of developers and like we don't really have you know people with experience like Selling products and like getting that out there. So that's what we're trying to figure out now. Yeah, I think we've Had a similar I wouldn't say challenge but a business proposal out here And the way we figured out was that if our customer can sell on our behalf Because as you said they would likely to reach out to that prospect base is much better So let them do the front-end part and then you do the back-end part That is one approach and it's sort of working for us in Where we are a professional services partner for the product and they are the selling partner for the product So it's a buy-in or a skin in the game Any other questions Sort of it might be a two-part question. What's your take on creating a minimum viable product prototype first? Yeah, so it's it's always a good idea. That's how we've been going about it So the patient intake form is exactly a MVP It's not a full-fledged product because we knew that it has always going to be a challenge when people deploy it in their location Because it's a distro, but then the next step is always going to be hey Can you integrate with epic? Can you integrate with so-and-so EHR or my billing applications? And that's why we've torn down the whole scenario down to okay We'll just give you forms. That's an MVP and then you can take it further if you want okay That's a good approach I say because I don't know if you do any customer discovery if this is a lean startup And if so do you do the MVP before or after you interview your customers? so That is for when you build product for a startup company It's not a product. I service per se. Okay. It's a product where? You know your feature list is or wish list is this big But you figure out that's the maximum number of people who are going to use and scale over a period of time That's the feature list which you want on to create and we do that for our healthcare business by the way We're a lot of customers come in and say can you build this wellness app for us? Or can you build this population health management for us? It's a fair enough. What's your wish list and then they come out with use cases and say, okay This will take two years and so no, no, we don't have that much time Come it down to three months four months. This is the MVP Reach out to your prospects. They might come back to you say I need this feature and that feature and then progress it Good. Thank you. Anybody else Three minutes I have looks like I'm curious My team spent time building a product of B2B a commerce platform that hooks into an ERP And we're having this problem Where we're we've released it for 12 customers We kind of went through a lean process and now we're getting new customers that are asking for features that are way more cumbersome and not valuable to prospects So how do you what's your methodology for saying no to those customers and pushing them away? Well, I would say yes to them But it would be additional Custom job which needs to be done because if if all these features are across Common across most of your customers Then you may want to invest that and then distribute your cost get more money in yeah But if it's very specific requirement of a customer and say, okay, this is what comes out of the box Anything apart from that you're going to be charged extra. So so you say yes to everything not everything 90% of times I said yes But sometimes I have to say no because I know that the customer is not going to go anywhere Because he's already using my platform But I want to maintain that relationship with them and hence I would say no, I can't do this Maybe somebody else I can find and say can you go ahead and help him out and just on top of that do you open your system up and then allow outside vendors to Perhaps be a partner to that customer. Maybe there's something my team can't do But so the patient intake form I talked about yes It's a distro as I said anybody can deploy it and go ahead and expand if they require So in in certain cases yes and certain cases now cash it. Thanks. Thanks Yeah, very good. Thanks. Thank you everyone