 Contrary to reports that a recommendation had been given by the Senate Committee on Constitution review that a referendum be conducted for 20 new states, the Senate had clarified that the House has no power to make such a recommendation. The Spokesperson and Chairman Committee on Media and Public Affairs, Senator Jibala Bashiru, in a statement in Abuja insisted that the panel never made any such proposal. He acknowledged that the committee received several bills demanding for creation of more states. Well joining us to discuss this is Professor Chris Moukobiya. Thank you very much for joining us, Professor. It's my pleasure. Every time the issue of states creation comes up, whether it's a whisper, whether it's a conversation, I always ask the first question that comes to mind is, the 36 states that we have in the Federation, including the FCT, how economically and otherwise viable are they that we would want to be adding more states or creating more states from those 36 states? Let me say clearly that if we had a truly federal constitution, if we had a system that allows for devolution of power and if you like resource control, we ordinarily would have had states that are effective, efficient, and effectual. We would have states that are viable. But tragically, what we have, which is a pseudo federal constitution where you have a federal government that controls just about everything, where you have a rent taking and a rent seeking system. You have states that are practically, if you like, not viable. That is why most people who are opposed to the call for creation of more states are of the opinion that the 36 that you have, how effective, how efficient are they, how viable are they. But I want to say that what we must do first in the call for a truly prosperous nation is to ask the National Assembly to allow for devolution of power, allow for resource control, so that states across this country will be able to manage their resources. Professor, we've been making, I'm so sorry to speak over you. We have been making these calls and I'm sure that before the 2015 election, the issue of restructuring became the word on every person's mouth, including lots of politicians. It was thrown out even in the media. And then in 2019 it came up again. We always pay lip service to this issue. We always say, oh, this is what we want. I'm still yet to hear from the committee that was put together by the APC on restructuring. I'm still yet to hear what came out of it. That paper is somewhere gathering dust. We have had several confabs and conferences in this country. Nothing has been done. So when we keep making these statements and asking and then we see nothing in return, why continue? No, we have to. It was Madiba, the great leader of South Africa, former president of South Africa, who said that the time is always right to do right. And let me say clearly, I listened to the first segment of your interview and I heard the late Chivem Kabyolasson talk about what time it is, the need for a new energy and leadership, the need for a new generation of leaders who think youth world. I think that the time has come for us to think sincerely and seriously about a new generation of leadership that will address these fundamentals. Because as it were, the present stock, the present leaders we have are perhaps afraid to try something new. They are perhaps scared of daring the status quo. And I think that the time has come for us as a people to dare to do something differently. Because it was all about Einstein who said that attempting to solve a problem the same way over and over again. And if you like, the same way it was created is insanity. I think that the time has come. And I say this advisedly. Look at Kogi, for instance. Look at Nazarra. Look at Benoist state. These are states with monumental resources. Nazarra state is a state that has about 34 mineral resources. But yet cannot run effectively. Because we have a lot, a constitution that devolves the wealth to the federal government. If a state like Nazarra or Kogi, for instance, has almost as much as 32 mineral resources, where to control resources, do you know what will happen? You will be talking about a Dakota steel mill not being functional. You won't be talking about property, disease and want. You'll be talking about states that are able to maximize and appropriate their resources for progress. Yes. But I really, I mean, I like the fact that you're saying you're proposing what we should be targeting or what the direction we should be going in. But of course we have strong men. We have political parties that have no ideologies. We see Chris crossing. It's the same crop of people. How do we break into these ranks? Yes, they've signed the not too young to run bill. And okay, young people are trying to get into politics. But of course, there is a system that actually stops you from getting to a certain level. So really, how do we introduce that new energy in closing? Because we're almost out of time. No, there is a new movement across the land. There's a new movement in the north. There's a new movement in the south. There's a new movement across the system, political zones. Nigerians are saying, and indeed the young people are saying it is useful. It is time to try something new. It's time to appropriate a new energy for a new dispensation in leadership. And I think that I see the coppers have food, not as half empty. And there are a lot of young people who are beginning to buy into it. We're saying that if the old have failed this far, look at what your first segment, I'll come back to it because the former president did talk about the need for a new energy in leadership. And we're saying, that's why I applaud Abiyallah, who did talk about the young man in Kogi. We have a 46-year-old governor in Kogi. They couldn't stop him. The system couldn't stop him. And interestingly, he's saying that a lot can be done. And we all believe that a lot can be done. And that's exactly why I'm saying that nothing can stop a movement whose time has come. He works for the Castro who said some time ago that not even the site of a prison yard, no, the monumental sounds from the cemetery can stop an idea whose time has come. And I do sincerely believe that a time has come for the young people to galvanize, the young people to mobilize and change the ante, change the norm and transform this country because all over the world we're seeing what Nigerians and young people are doing across the globe. And we're seeing what Nigerian young people are doing at home. So I think that the time has come for every young man out there rather than vilified leadership to galvanize and move along with the currency and the energy of now and bet a new republic come 2023. Professor Chris Mokobia, thank you so much for speaking with us. We really appreciate it. Glad you'd mind. All right. Well, thank you for staying with us. I'll quickly give you my take before we wrap this up. So here's my take. Now, our priority from now till 2023, if you ask me, is the reformation of our mindset. Now, it has nothing to just do with our electoral process. No, it has to do with everything. What we must know, what we must do and how we go about it. What we see daily in Nigeria today is the outright disregard of the citizenry by its leaders, the total abandonment of the people by their government and a pursuit of personal interest and gains at the expense of these same people. Our health care is in shambles, yet our leaders have the luxury of Medicare abroad with taxpayers' monies, by the way. Resident doctors are poorly paid and on strike yet. They're even threatened with no work, no pay. Our legislators have all sorts of ridiculous allowances, including what they call hardship allowances at their disposal. But a meager amount is allotted to those who spend their lives caring for us. A clear case of double standards, yet politics is thriving. While we're distracted daily by the infighting between the elites and the mega parties instead of dealing with and addressing what really matters, I have this to say to all of you, we need to reprioritise. Because as elections and campaigns season is fast approaching, their time will soon change. So don't just go and vote. We need to not just vote, we need to make sure that our votes count. We should not allow ourselves to be cowed again by these politicians. So think about it. We can sit at home and let them win. I am Mary Anacone. Thank you for watching.