 Oh, hello. My name is Jimmy Carr, and this week I'm hosting Blox, the podcast that was my idea. And Neil gives me props for every single week because he's a mensch. Neil Brandon is one of the finest comedy minds working. If you're not familiar with Three Mikes and Blox, I suggest you pause this now, go and watch those. Okay, you're back. They were funny, weren't they? Really funny, really open emotionally. Let's talk about the structure. Structurally interesting. Structurally very interesting. For the Blox show, you share a lot, Three Mikes, you share an awful lot of yourself. I thought it would be fun for the listeners of Blox to do a special episode with you. We talk about your Blox, we update your Blox, we talk about the things going on in your life because you are, I think, at the vanguard of... Human existence, human behavior. Where tragedy meets comedy. I mean, your childhood, I would say, I know we're both obsessed by documentaries. Your childhood, it strikes me, would be a hit documentary on Netflix, and people would not believe it. If they had filmed it, your childhood, I don't think people would believe how difficult it was, and I don't think you fully acknowledged that. Sometimes I want to talk to you about your childhood. Somebody said recently, you've experienced as much sadness or hardship as anyone I know, and I was like, I don't think, because you just... Genuinely, I was thinking about it recently because I watched the beginning of that, it was like a cult documentary, and I went, oh, Neil had a worse childhood than that. So talk us through, it gives the beats for anyone that hasn't seen it, the beats of your childhood. Childhood father was a violent alcoholic. He would drink. That's already a movie. This boy's life. That's kind of the main thing. My father was violent, and at that point, you don't know where the violence is coming from, why, how often, and it creates kind of a state of terror. Well, there's a whole thing in psychotherapy about where you were born. I'm a middle kid, so my mother had all the anxiety around the first kid, and then the second kid she was able to be more relaxed, and you feel that you're more relaxed as a second kid. You were born where in the sequence? 10th? Yeah, they don't have a theory on that, because there's not enough of them. There's no theory. There's no book about, well, if you're the 10th kid, you'll be Neil Brennan. That's it. My mother was in labor for 45 minutes. 45 minutes. I mean, literally walked out. Yeah, she looked over and I was walking next to her with an umbilical cord. So no love from your father? Dad, none. And self-admitted, I did not love you. And on his deathbed? Which part of the deathbed took left, wrote me out of his will? Yeah, disinherited, and consciously, I hadn't lost his mind, consciously disinherited, and told you that he didn't love you. Yeah, it's pretty heartbreaking to be your friend sometimes, because I can feel, I'm like tearing up. It's awful. It's just awful. And then I look at your relationship with your mother, and I'm privy to a lot of the list of rules, which you sort of name check in blogs. Yeah, I name a few of them. A bunch of TV rules, like a lot of laundry rules, a lot of sandwich rules, you guys probably all had sandwich rules, right? I'm so obsessed by that you had a list of rules that were put up by your mother, that there again, heartbreak upon heartbreak, like the food, the laundry, the rules, the lack of warmth. She was really warm in her own way. And in her defense, she did stuff that was like incredibly thought-of-a-like. Every night she would warm the plates up for dinner. She made dinner, warmed the plates up, we all had warm, it's like a nice thoughtful thing to do. For instance, I, and I, I'm more, I just spent some time with my mom. Just, there's a straw there. I can, I can almost reach the, the warm plate. No loving your childhood in any, in any way that anyone else would understand. No, no, no real empathy, yeah. But a warm plate. So that's something, okay? If you're thinking about having kids, not as tough as you thought, a warmer plate, that'll do. I mean, it really feels like that's... I could say the same about yours, buddy, for real. Yeah, but let's, let's, no, I got it, but I'm just saying, like, that's why I don't have a ton of... You've got no self-pity, which is remarkable. And also a giant amount of self-pity. Like, there, I spent a lot of time feeling sorry for myself in my life. And then at a certain point, I had a story in blocks that you told me to cut. And I didn't for a while. And then I did when I taped it because I was like, I don't, I can't keep harping on this. It was a story about shitting my pants, like either disobeying my father or shitting my pants. And I chose to, you guessed it, shit my pants. The self-pity pull in my, in my spirit kind of went, I just stopped two, three years ago. I think we talked about this because J.K. Rowling had a great line on it, which is, it's tough love at its toughest. We go, we have to have a statue of limitations on childhood grievances. I don't know what age it is, because it's definitely not 18. If someone comes to you at 18 and says, I had that childhood, you go, oh man, you're okay, you need a hug, you're okay. If someone comes to you at 25 and says, I had a really tough childhood, but you can't be meeting St. Peter at the gates going, my dad... Did you see? Yeah. My dad was a dick. Yeah. But you had 40 years. Come on, you have to get past that at some stage. That's about the calculation for me. Around late 40s, I was like, I gotta stop. I gotta just stop doing this because I don't... A lot of that, before that was a lot of anger at my dad and my mom, and I was happy to talk about it. In fact, three mikes was written as a... The dad part was written for revenge. And at a certain point, I was like, can I give him... I don't want to just go slag him on stage. So I made it more... I put some empathy in it of what did I owe him and what was his life like? Yes. I mean, his life was... I mean, he grew up in the depression. Who even knows? But I think you want to correct that as a parent. I would agree. Yeah. I mean, what's your line in blocks? Both my parents were born during the Great Depression and they were nice enough to bring it with them. That was the Derek DelGaudio line, the director. Again, your obsession with fairness. It's a line in your special. It's a great line. You give the credit to the guy that gave you the line. It's like... Do you remember what I used to do for a litter? Yeah. But it's interesting that thing of the grievances, which is your first big block, holding... I mean, I thought the next special, if you could call it grudge match, and it's just all of the things where... It's the other great line in blocks, where you go... I got to be the only person who has ever asked a question. Neil, would you rather be right or would you rather be happy? And I was like... And knowing you, I go, well, that's bullshit. You'd rather be right. I mean, the idea, like you're bullshitting the audience, like, oh, it was a tough decision for me. I bet that would have gotten the same amount of life. You'd rather be right or rather be happy. Right. Right. Yeah. That would have gotten... Let's move on. Also, that's the right answer. And I can tell you why. So the grudge is the... You've fallen out with a lot of people over the years. And I think it's a... I feel very privileged to be your friend. There's an extra level you get to going, no one's better at friendship. You're really good at being honest and direct and respectful and you add a lot of value. I think when I first met you, I was very drawn to that kind of your mind in comedy. You help a lot, but also you're very giving of lines and ideas and things. But it's also that thing if you go, you're very good at being honest. You're very good at... It's a... I think friendship... It comes from... I think it's... In a weird way, it comes from a bad place. I remember yelling at somebody and I was like, look, I'm not trying to draw blood here. And then I took a beat and I was like, you know what? I grew up Catholic and the truth is I am trying to draw a little bit of blood. Like real righteousness and... So that's a downside. But I think if I apply it correctly, it can be helpful to the person. So that thing of the resentment and the being willing to break up with friends is a very unusual thing. They'll talk about ending relationships, but there's very few people that I've talked about. I thought it might be an interesting bit of stand-up for one of us about ending relationships with friends. We go, you're no longer... Essentially, I suppose I broke up. My father's not dead, but I haven't seen my father in many years and I don't intend to. But breaking up emotionally with someone and going, yeah, I don't need that in my life is quite healthy in a way. I know and I'm on the fence about it, meaning I like having boundaries. The lack of boundaries in my life was really damaging and painful. And then you go to 12 step groups and you learn some boundaries. Now I had them and I never really administered them until the last couple years. And I still don't know if I'm right about it. That's the interesting thing. If I say I don't want to be friends with you anymore, it's always after a lot of consideration and a lot of friendship. I think the main element of friendship is reciprocation. I go to your party, you come to my party. I call you back within a day, you call me back within a day. It has to be fair. I do feel that thing of like some friends that you feel like you're chasing and you kind of go, do I, what am I doing here? Yeah, I'm an adult. Sometimes if it doesn't feel equal, you can't go ahead. That's what friendships are. That seems to be the point of friendship. Do you know what I mean? My theory is I think comedians have career dysmorphia. We all do. And we think, oh, my career is because I'm not doing as, you know, wherever we stand, wherever we are in the hierarchy at the comedy store or the cellar or theaters or how many we're selling or how many nights we're doing at the beacon, whatever the metric is, there'll always be someone doing better and someone doing worse and where do you stand. But actually, if you step back just for a second and go, well, that's all crazy, you're all making a living telling jokes. This is all great. What I've come to is comparison is the thief of joy, right? Unless you compare down, compare down, that's what I've been doing recently. I just go, ah, and then I go, but I'm doing incredibly well. But because you're in the, you know, it's like you watch a marathon and there's like the group of, let's face it, Kenyans at the front. And then they all, they're just, but it's like, dude, you guys are dominating relative to the field. But you're only looking at the nine people in your pack or whatever. Do you feel terrible for tennis players? How come? Because the number three player in the world turns up. Anywhere he goes, the one and two are there. Yeah. Fucking you guys. Yeah. Like you could have gone anywhere else in the world. They were thinking about being a touring comic, especially when you play unusual places. I mean, no one's there. No one's there. Yeah. No one's there. If you're in, if you're in, if you're in Reykjavik, no one's been there for months. I know. I remember here. Great. David Tell said it was great. He was in Alaska and it was like, it was the great feeling to be the funniest person within a thousand miles. Well, I think David Tell could say that most nights in New York, but that's... He can say most places in the world, any place in the world, but yeah. Incredible. He's absolutely incredible. That thing of fairness though, do you think that comes from your childhood and the injustice of growing up the youngest of 10 and having nothing? I mean, your parents weren't poor, but they had so many children there. Everyone's poor at that amount of kids. Yes. I think even Elon Musk is going, what are we going to do for the college fee? I got 11, but you told me that good Elon Musk story about the house. I'm sure you can't repeat it. Oh, no, I could repeat that story. Yeah. Where he was renting a tiny, his friend came around, he was holding two babies. Elon Musk is in a small house holding two babies. A tiny house down the road from the factory holding two babies and the friend knocks on the door and goes, you live here? Yeah. He doesn't own anything. He doesn't own anything anymore, got rid of all the houses just because it wasn't getting him closer to where he wanted to be. And he didn't like how expensive houses were. Yeah. They were the interest. The real estate in Austin had gone up so much that he's like, I'm not paying those prices. Yeah, I mean... Fine, if you're cheap, you're cheap. Crazy. Here's what it is. I believe because violence can come from anywhere, when I'm a kid. Yeah. Every time, you know that like post game thing, I don't know if you relate to it when you're kid and you're alone in your room and you're crying and you're like, mine was always like, this is so unfair. Warn me, let me do something horrible, then beat me up instead of, and I, again, I got the least of my family. So I'm like, you know, it's a handful of incidents, but the fear of it is it can come at any time at anyone. Well, also seeing that, being exposed to that as a child, you even, you don't really acknowledge, I don't feel, as a trauma. You acknowledge when it happened to you, but you don't acknowledge your first memory. Yeah. And my first memory is my brother fighting my dad. Yeah. So I do see it as a trauma, but I don't... I think the lingering one is anything bad can happen at any point for no reason. So if I can create a fair environment, then I'm pleased and I can count on behavior and expectations and all that stuff. And so if I don't have that, I hate it and or... It's what I didn't like about most of the relationships I was in, romantically. It's like, wait, what? You can just yell at me for a thing you're making up? And the woman I'm with now pitched, well, can you empathize with me for feeling that way? And I was like, I can't. And she was like, you're right. And that was the first time I was like, this is new and this could work forever to me. Yes, an emotional kind of match. Fairness. Yeah, like an emotional... Because you brought it up, you can't just hold on to the grievance. If I say things to you that show you that you were wrong logically, you have to agree. Well, I think that thing about you can't tell me how to feel or becomes a very tough way to be in the world because you're not living in other people's worlds, they're living in yours. And that's difficult to form relationships with that. But I think that's what everyone does. I think the ideal relationship is, and we've just found it naturally, is fairness, expectations, reciprocation, you know, like... I remember when we first became friends, we went on a long walk. And a couple of long walks in Montreal, and you said to me at the end of it, you said, okay, so we're going to be friends. And when we're in the same city, we're going to have lunch and hang. Yeah, pretty much it. That's the, those are the terms. You gave me a hug and you said goodbye. Yeah. And it was, I'd never had anyone set down the rubric of a friendship and how this is going to work anyway. Okay, and that's what we do. We're in the same city, we hang out and we have lunch and we talk. And then we're, sometimes we're in our lives a lot, sometimes not. But it really works as a thing. Yeah. I think you can ask upfront what you believe it will be or I guess I... I mean, my theory on happiness is it's expectations exceeded. It's like, why is, why, why are birthdays terrible and new years are shitty? It's because the expectation is this is going to be the best night. Can't be met. You can't meet those expectations. And you go, well, it's just going to be okay. Yeah, okay, I have a question. I don't like parties. So how are we going to handle this? Yeah, it seems like that's, now if someone would say like, you're Neil, you're so autistic for saying that. But I'm like, I get my feelings hurt all the time by friendship. So if I say, hey, can you do this? And you go, yeah, okay. Then there's no, then everything, we can resolve conflict easily. We can, it just makes everything. And the question is, is that valuable enough? I don't know if I've resolved the conflict with you, specifically where you've been wrong. I've been wrong a couple of times. Oh, we haven't had a thing. We haven't had a thing where you've been wrong. But that's maybe... But I just talked about not complimenting you enough. Oh, but I mean, that's hardly, I don't think that's a foul. I sent you, for context here is another podcast, but I sent Neil my special, and he was very effusive and nice about the jokes, but didn't compliment the direction. I mean, honestly, he directed it. Honestly, I got, I was asking you to do me a favor. That's, I'm not looking for praise. I'm saying, you watch it, is it okay? Like I was going to watch it as the, slightly the professor of stand-up and kind of go, okay, that's good. Or that's a bit like that. Or that's too similar to the bit on the previous one. Whatever the thing would be that you go, sometimes you have a blind spot. And I gave you that. Of course, yeah. Okay. You just go, it's great. Is kind of enough, but it's that thing of like where that comes from. I know what that means from you. Yeah. You've heard me give opinions about other specials that you probably agreed with. Yes. I mean, I think you had that Montreal, that thing that you wrote Montreal, which I think should be a bit of stand-up. Oh, I gave a speech, they did not videotape it. So pretty great. Did they not? That's crazy. But it was a speech about like, it was kind of like state of the union of comedy. And some of the beats from that I think would be great. And like people listen to comedy podcasts because they're super into it. Yeah. Some of the beats of that were great of like, how lucky are we? How grateful should we be for our lives? Like how few people can do this? Yeah. Jim Jeffries was here last week, and we talked about how you told him, like where there are, how many great stand-up comedians in the world? That's, those are astronaut numbers. Like there's 60, I don't know how many comedians you think are great, 100. What are there 100 of on earth? It's like a very rare or fine thing. But your thing in Montreal was like, there are 60,000 brain surgeons. Yeah. You know, brain surgeons, pretty impressive. But a brain surgeon meeting a stand-up comedian should be, please. Should jerk them off? This is unusual. Or her off, whatever. Whatever your thing is. With HelloFresh, you get farm fresh, pre-proportioned ingredients and seasonal recipes delivered right to your doorstep. You can skip trips to the grocery store and count on HelloFresh to make home cooking easy, fun, and affordable. That's why it's America's number one meal kit. Each HelloFresh box is packed with farm fresh ingredients and everything arrives pre-proportioned right to your doorstep for less hassle and less wasted food. Ditch the meal planning blues and the grocery store run with quick convenient recipes delivered right to you. 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Get 55% off at babbel.com slash blocks, spelled B-A-B-B-E-L dot com slash blocks. Rules and restrictions may apply. Babbel, B-A-B-B-E-L dot com slash blocks. You got this. The lack of appreciation is interesting. What are you going to need to see from the world that you go and made it? Because I slightly think it should happen earlier in comedy careers. I think as soon as you're playing sets and you're getting paid money to play the clubs around the country. You should be grateful and everything else is gravy. We are doing the same job. Everything else is gravy. So, the people at the store, they should go, well, we talked to other comics in exactly the same way. If I give someone a tag for a line, if a fairly new comic comes to see my show, it gives me a tag. Great. It's okay. Basically, I wrote new blocks that I didn't talk about in the Netflix. First one was grievance. We talked about that. And now we're talking about my lack of appreciation. You mentioned it when you sat here a few hours ago that it doesn't read. When you get a special or get a big check or you do a thing, it doesn't read like you're thrilled because you have such a measured personality. Yeah. Not only have a measured personality, me, my point is, I know how extraordinary my life is and I know how, for lack of a better word, talented or successful I am. I don't often really appreciate it because life is so busy and we're always looking up or we're looking down. We never look out. We never look out and survey the land. And that's the thing I have a hard time with, where my friend David Kabuka came to see the new special and was like, now that's, I think he's Nigerian. He was like, now that's the Neil Brennan we've all been waiting for. He's like, he actually said, he was like, you don't give a shit about anyone. You just like, and I don't even think that's what the special is like, but he was more just like, appreciate. He always goes like, when I think of you, I think of you as like directing LeBron or doing a Netflix special and I'm walking around like Mopey, even on the specials. This one, I'm not Mopey. I wish I could take, I don't even think it's self-esteem. I think it's the minute-to-minute feeling of being lucky or being, because it's not even successful. It's more- It's luck. I mean, to live in this era where comedy is respected in this way, if we've grown up in the 1930s, it's not anything. I mean, it's that thing if you go, it's not, and it's always like that. The illusions, the lies in comedy, it's always, it's talent and it's hard work. And it's always a mix of the two. You have a natural kind of, maybe you've got a predilection for thinking in this way and then you put the work in, but without the work, you're nothing. Yeah. And I even say, I don't feel this, but I do say, you're lucky to have a work ethic. Yeah. Well, it's a weird thing where we will, sort of, if a beautiful woman walks into a place like a model, it's easy for her, she's good-looking. But that was chatting to a girl, it's like an IQ of 180. But the fuck are you talking about? She's beautiful. You're really clever. And you were born with a huge IQ and you have a weird work ethic where you read everything and you go, yeah, that's... That is a form of, like you're... We don't see that luck in the same way. Luck seems to be the thing that we really see and it rankles that people go, oh, that's just really lucky. He's that good-looking, she's that good-looking. That's just a luck thing. But also, looks expire. Yeah. And that's, and our talents won't expire, ideally. I mean, they'll maybe popularity will wane or go up or whatever, but I think it's all luck. What would make it feel like you were acknowledging that success? So when the new special drops, what could you do that would be like you buy yourself something or go somewhere? I had it when blocks came out. I was literally walking down the street. There's like Austin downtown and if you cross the river, it's way like more woods and grass and stuff. And there's one of the roads streets. I was just looking at my Twitter and it was all positive and I just went. And a rocky. Yeah. Like 10 seconds of just like... Yeah. Then you got to walk. Yeah. Then you got to get to where you got to look at the map. There's just life makes you... You say you don't like parties, but I think the next time you do one of those, we should endeavor the people that you're close to a lot. Because you're close to a lot of people. I'm aware of this. You're very close to a lot of people. And you're very good at introducing people. But you don't often bring us all together. It's very much an Avengers assemble with your friends. Like we're not all in the same thing. And I wonder, should you try and do that with us next time? Should you maybe try and share that moment? But I guess the idea is I'm not going to be able to do this. I think it would be great fun if you did. Like even in a non-jokey way, I think it'd be great to... I teared up telling you that. It means a lot to me. But you came from... You came to comedy late. You already established... I came to stand-up late. Yeah. Comedy early, knew what you wanted to do. Directed one of the seminal shows of the last 20 years. And wrote. And wrote. Yeah. And came to comedy late. And then this is the third Netflix special. So in terms of appreciation, I mean it's like... You did it. Yeah. That's the thing is I know... Here's... Part of it is I know that. I know what I... The journey. But I think most people... Most other people don't... They're just like, well, I've done nine. Or whatever. The people that would be at the party. Most of the people... Yeah. But yeah. You know, I understand. I would... Here's what I would say. We all have to do it. Yes, I think so. And if you haven't done a Netflix special, you literally have to face the wall. You know how the greatest line on this... Noel Gallagher had a great line on this. What was? He was talking about who's the biggest band or whatever. And someone's... I don't know who it was, came after them that sold way more records, did way better. And he went, yeah, but we mean more to people. He's right. And that thing of you go, yeah, that's the... I don't... Now I would say like, I don't mean more to people. I would say I don't mean more to people than most of the people that would be at the party. Well, okay. But the... You would say that, man. Maybe. I think it's also that thing if you go, what's the hidden metric of comedy? Because there's one metric is... Netflix specials, one is ticket sales, and they're very easy to measure. So we tend to go to the things that we can measure. But actually, the metric should be the joy that people walk out of a show with, or what stays with people. Like, I suppose songs do it very nicely because sometimes you hear a song and it stays with you, it's in your head. It's an earworm, it's there. It changes the way you think about that thing forever. I think sometimes if I write a great joke, it stays with people and they kind of remember that. And it becomes something that they quote and it becomes their thing, or sometimes a sticky phrase. And sometimes I think ideas in your show, they last a long time in people's minds. It's really a hidden metric of comedy. I think the champ of that is Chris Rock from Bring the Pain. I think... Yes, 25 years old. And absolutely, it all stands up. It's all current. He could have had a portable Chris Rock of just aphorisms and smart shit he said. He's an aphorism machine. Yeah, and... But yeah, I would argue that I'm one of the most inspired. That would be my thing. I would think I have an actual shot at. It's like, I work hard and I have a fertile mind. And it's just a hard thing to be like, because you can't prove it. So you're like, I think I'm pretty... I think I have a lot of ideas that I like and I give them people or I keep them for me or whatever. So that would be a thing that I would think I would have. Well, it's an unusual thing. I often will write something that based on an interesting idea. And then I'll turn it into a piece of stand-up and I'm not as comfortable stand-up as I am with jokes. Like I'm always very impressed with your ability to get an idea to land in a show. It's quite an unusual skill. So this is a philosophical idea and I'll get this to land. So there's a million different types of sexuality. There's only one type of relationship. There's like dozens of new gender and sexual orientations. There's still only one relationship orientation toward marriage. Who go, what about polyamory? There's no tax cuts for polyamory. Stop that. And you land it. Yeah. There's a really interesting idea when you land it and you make it fun. And it's kind of as an audience member, you go, oh yeah, that's interesting. Yeah. I don't walk around knowing I wrote that. You know what I mean? Like I don't, and that is a thing that it's all, my whole goal, which I've said to you is most of my goals now are emotional, right? It's not like, and then I gotta do. I gotta, it says, no, I want to, I want to do whatever and feel great. Yeah. And so that's, that's a very hard thing to get to because it's so, you know, there's not, you can't really watch YouTube videos about it. I have to have a mind shift, you know. Well, it's that thing of you also go the, the journey is the fun, like putting this, putting this special together is the fun. And then when it's done, you kind of go, okay, well, I'm doing another one. I'm writing another thing. I'm going to do something else. Yeah. And you have to have ideas for that. So that's where I'm lucky in that, like I can generate a good amount of material. Yeah. Let's do another block. You worry about love ending. Yeah. The, I once said about my girlfriend, if she broke up with me, I would be heartbroken and relieved. And I told her that I said it. It's like kind of one of those things. And we've also had a few moments where it was like, I shouldn't say this, but I'll say it. And then we, she's like, oh, I agree, you know, or she thinks it's funny or whatever. I say that because I'm getting the point where it's so society wise, like a little old to be single and dating, right? It's like, and so if she breaks up with me, I feel reject. I'm a loser, but I'm not an asshole. If I break up with her, I'm an asshole and a little old to be single. I'm worried about committing to a person and then I just wake up and it's gone. It's like when people talk about being broken up with or being in love and then the, I was like, have you ever fallen out of love with somebody? Because it's terrifying. Because it's like, you go, we got to, you guys share a car or let's say it's your car that she goes in. And then you, you guys go to the car and it's gone. When you aren't in love with somebody, it's terrifying. You feel awful. So I'm worried about that as like with heading into a relationship with somebody. Esther Perel is maybe the best writer on this, mating in captivity and the strange state of affairs, the state of affairs rather. And she talks about like she's been in love three times in life, always with the same guy. The idea that it will consistently be the same all the way through a relationship, I think is like a, the reason romance movies end with a kiss and when they get together and they never start with a kiss and they're together is because it's ups and downs. Yeah. Lots of ups and downs. So yeah, you might feel like that one that car will be back the next day. Maybe. Yeah. So I, but it's a worry because I'm committing to someone and I'm like, I don't want to disappoint her. I, you know, I don't want to hurt her. I don't want to, you know what I mean? I don't want to be unreliable. I want to be the kind of person I want other people to be, other people. Yes. Well, you want to correct all the mistakes that were made. Yeah. Yeah. There's something about where you're at now in terms of going, it feels like with the childhood that you had and where you've got to in your career and where you are in life now, you're sort of willing to take something else on. It feels like it's, it feels like there's a real liminal, liminal change, like a big shift. Yeah. It's phases of what phases and what your priorities become and what your kind of perception of stuff. How big a shift was the ayahuasca? Jimmy, I thought you'd never ask. Yeah. This is, by the way, the longest the show has ever gone. It's the longest I've ever gone in conversation without bringing it up. Yeah. It's made me, it shifted my priorities. Where I do actually say, as much as I'm joking about, like, I don't want to feel like I'm not a big deal, but. Well, you want to feel like you're the biggest deal. In one sense, you want to go, I'm at one with the universe. That's, that's, you couldn't be a bigger deal. I'm a tiny cog in the wheel. It takes you way closer to tiny cog in the wheel. Because you just go, like, this is going on in a million places right now. Some, I couldn't even, it's like, I feel like once you experience God, you, which I believe I did on ayahuasca and the various things I've done, it just contextualizes you. But I mean, this is, it's amazing to have a list of your blocks and not to have depression on that. It is such an extraordinary moment. I think it might be worthy of one of those. Yeah. You were depressed for 25 years, medicated pretty heavily. Yeah. And. Well, just one, I guess two things at one point, but. Yeah, but constantly throughout that period. I don't feel much pride over it because I don't, I don't think people that have depression are, I never felt bad about it. My family and older brothers would be like, are you going to keep taking that stuff? And I was like, yeah, I don't care. It's like diabetes or whatever. It's not. So. But the fact you're around the other side of it, I do think is remarkable. Yeah, that's ayahuasca. I mean, there are a few people that have. Yeah. I mean, obviously. I see it more as I didn't really earn it. I suffered from it. I mean, when you look at, sorry. Yeah. I tell you what you should watch. Blocks. It's a Netflix special where a guy at the end talks about all of the different things he did. To get through his, he didn't sit with his depression. Like it's, it's a weird thing where you're a guy with depression with quite high agency. And I want, I bought it. Everything. And you went and got these crazy magnets on your head. But they weren't strong enough. So you went to China to get stronger, more illegal ones. We don't care about this guy if I can turn it up to 11. But that thing of like going, you really looked for everything and you found something that worked for you and a non-addictive drug. You know, you get the call, you hang up the phone. You have the message from it. And it feels like you're exactly the same person I've always known. There's an absolute essence of Neil Brennan. But now you're, you're not depressed anymore. I have some, I can hit the gas a little. I couldn't hit the gas when I was depressed. You, there was no ability to hit the gas, uh, energetically. Yeah. And now there's some, I still have, I can hit the gas. Problem is my face doesn't always do it. Yeah. My face just sometimes just like, I think I'm really, I'm kind of abused by how little, you know, how much there's a, there's a, there's a shot Neil has on his phone, his screensaver, which is the, it's him on stage and it's the monitor, which would normally have prompts or something on it if you're recording a special. And it just says smile. Yeah. And it's so funny to me. And I still didn't smile enough. Yeah. I go, I was the irony of your job being, I mean, it's like the, it's the classic old joke about the clown. Yeah. Going to see the psychiatrist and the guy says, when you're depressed, you go and see Pavel, Pavel's playing this weekend. He's the greatest clown in the world. He's go and have a good laugh. That'll cure it. He goes, I am Pavel. That's funny. But the thing you're on stage, making people laugh, making people feel okay about what they're going through, because really your sharing is, is, you know, it's hard to watch one of your shows and not project a little. What do you mean? Well, because you watch it and you talk about, you're very emotionally honest and it's hard to watch it and not go, oh yeah, I've got a thing with, it's not that, but it's this. Yeah. Yeah. Whatever that thing is. Yeah. I, as you're saying this, I'm like, oh yeah, I see that as, I was so self-pitting for so long that now that I'm not, I don't, I don't even understand it. So if you feel like I don't give my childhood enough power, or not power, but just acknowledgement, I don't, I, with the ayahuasca and the depression thing, like I had time and I had the little money. So I could do stuff that most people can. What is also that thing of like, what has your, fairness came from your, a, a fucking awful childhood. You've got this incredible ability for fairness, like this, you're obsessed by fairness. I would say most of your stand-up comedy is a dissection of the world that looks for fairness. Yeah. And you look for things being, well, that's off, that's wrong. A buddy of mine said I'm like a southern lawyer where I'm like, your honor. Yeah, one more thing that doesn't make sense to me. Yeah. That thing that everyone else is doing in the world, I don't like it and you're willing to be unpopular for that. So that, that feels that's quite a super, that you talk about lack of appreciation, but it's, my friend said this thing to me recently that was really, he's a really famous singer in, in the rest of the world, Robbie Williams. He's got Netflix questions. Yeah, no, it's great. Netflix, I think we said I'm an entertainer in the classic sense. If you don't love me, I don't love me. Right. And I think comedians or comedians, but maybe you more than anyone are, you desperately want to be loved, but entirely on your own terms. Willing to do nothing to get it. Yeah, well, well, I will, you're willing to, you're willing to speak to people. You're willing to go on a show and be super funny. Yeah. But like, if they don't like it, it's like, uh, okay. No, but you, you underestimate to me, you underestimate my sensitivity where I'm like, I do the one person wasn't smiling. I do the bad Instagram message. I'll tell you the, uh, the smiling story from Montreal for me. Like I did a Montreal show. This was many, many years ago with, uh, it's been quite a small room. Uh, remember Galifianakis was on before me, just amazing. So I did the show, did like an hour and couldn't have gone any better. And there's one guy in the front row looking at me like, like, like, like, I'd kill these dark, like stink eye the whole time. Well, how, what more do I have to do? Don't come to the show. Definitely don't sit in the front. You just can fucking look at me. It's just nothing, not one laugh. And I'm walking out of the theater and he's waiting in the lobby and I went up to him and I went, and he went, I'm from, uh, uh, Venezuela, but I, English is my fourth language. You're my favorite comedian. I have to concentrate so hard and you go, okay, all bets are off. Yeah, all bets are off. We had a similar one where there was a comedian that we were on shows with where I was like, does that guy hate me? And you were like, you were on stage and he was miming your act with you. I won't say who because it's not important, but you know who I'm talking about. And it's like, yeah, you, we often misinterpret the people's perception of us. Sometimes we don't though. And so that's where I, I, I'm open to the thought that maybe they, they, there's some sort of misunderstanding in my perception of their behavior, but there are times where people just don't like that. Well, I think you're going to have a spider sense for that forever. That's just, that's locked in. You can't have that. We talk about factory settings and I talk about this a lot now with my kids, like the first thousand days being the factory settings, how they are, what they do, how they interact with the world. You want to give, you want to give the therapist the least to do in the future. And you go, what, you couldn't give a therapist more to work with in terms of trauma and childhood. Yeah. In terms of that stuff. And you've seen kind of through it now, which is kind of amazing. That's also why Alaska, where I just became, you know, I mean, my, like I spent time with my mom a few days ago and Philly and I was, you know, it's, at that age, it's how many times, how many more times am I going to hang out with my mom? There's a terrifying fact I read recently about you spend with your kids 98% of the time with your kids up until the age of 18. Yeah. And then it's like you're, you're begging them to come for lunch. Yeah. Yeah, I'll give you money. Come collect the check. And now, yeah, now with my mom, I'm just kind of over all the grievances and I can enjoy her more. Yeah. Well, we thought that was the best bit of wisdom. Someone just threw it away. Stratnism on and they, you know, about parents and whatever. And they just, they went, except the apology you're never going to get and move on. Yeah. I thought, oh, yeah, that's, that's pretty good. Just take a moment just to go, okay, well, what would it be like if they did? It was, honestly, it's, this is a pretty damning thing to say, but it's the first time in my life where I'm, when my mom dies, I'm going to miss her. And I wasn't aware of it before. I may not have experienced it before. And I'm going to miss it. Like I will miss having her. Why, you just got close enough. Right. I, she's done nothing. I've just processed enough stuff where I, it also just feels kind of silly and useless to be like, so where were you in 1978? Yeah. It feels like an investigation so, she doesn't remember. I barely remember. So why am I still, why do I still have her under the lights with, and I throw a cigarette and I'm like, so tell me about my tell me about your behavior from so fucking long ago that I can ruin my life being consumed with it, but as a fairness aficionado. Detective, it is also what made you who you are. You're a very unusual guy. There's, I don't know anyone else like you. There's no one else in that bracket. I agree. And I felt sorry for myself about it. I mean, that blocks is kind of a version of that is like, can you believe I don't have a tribe? I don't have a good family. I don't have a, I can't get a good relationship going. I think a lot of people feel like that in the modern world. The things that you touch on there where you go, well, I'm, how liberal are you, which is one of my favorite set pieces in there. How liberal are you? Like, you go, yeah, you, you know, you kind of join or ally yourself with the political party and then they shift over 20 years and you go, well, what happened there? Yeah. It, you know, things change. You go, well, I don't, what was your line? I don't believe, I don't agree with anyone about everything. There was the Mark Twain thing and it was like during one of Dave's trans episodes and everyone in the press line was asking us like, so what do you make of the trans? And I go, I don't agree with them. It's fine. I don't, and I don't agree with any single person about everything. It's just not, but it's lonely, writ large. It's lonely as, as like the blocks, all the, all my beliefs sort of conflicting with people or conflicting with norms. I've stopped at something happen. I probably ayahuasca, but I don't, I'm not very aware of, it's not something I think about. It's, I've just been like, look, man, this is who you are. There's trade-offs and let's try to have fun, like literally smile as much as you can. I have smile flashing behind you right now. No, it's like you, I can't harp on it. I was just harping. I was constantly harping. I will say I still harp on some of the grudges because I can't believe them, but, and I just, I came to something a few days ago where I was like, this is not fun. It's just not. It, my brain wants to do it and I've had to stop. I've just gotten away from it as much as possible. I've just go like, no, stop. No, stop, stop. Like the first thought comes up and I'm like, stop. This show is sponsored by Better Help. Not surprised. Look, you know, kind of all we talk about is therapy. It's one of my things. In fact, I'm dating one anyhow. Therapy has made me the man you sit before you. Only the good parts. A common misconception about therapy as it pertains to relationships is that they have to be easy or right. 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The ayahuasca thing, like I had such a strong God experience the other night on ayahuasca and I was like, I gotta align more with this. It was so overpowering, just like the idea of like God's love and it's like, God's, what do you even talk? It's, my experience with the God thing was so strong that it's like, yep, yeah, yes. This is God being like, yeah, but I gotta, like what do you want? I don't even know, I barely know what you're talking about. I'm so massive, so whatever. Can you let go of those grudges now then? Can you, because I don't know whether it's, if you want to repair any relationships or if you want to reach out to people you've fallen out with, but it strikes me that that's, at some stage when you can't remember what the fight was about, you. It's, a lot of it is like having stand itself regard. Yeah, I don't want to be friends with somebody who doesn't hold me in the same esteem as I hold them. I just don't. But it's right sizing the grievance. I've fallen out with very few people over the years. I fell out with one guy that I had a crisis and he put the boot in. He, you know, getting canceled and you go, well, hang on. That's, if you can't be there for me when the bad stuff is happening, I don't need you at a party. Yeah, thanks. If I, and I support you and it's a, that's a one-way street, is it? Oh, okay. Yeah. That's. And you go, well, there's a pettiness to that, I suppose I could forgive. But you go, okay. And then what? Yeah. And then you're, you've forgiven someone who you know is not going to be there. I feel like I've devalued every friendship if I do that. I feel like I'm absolutely correct. You can be, I don't have any standards. You can treat me any kind of way. It speaks to someone who has incredibly shallow relationships. Like, yeah, I don't care if you, it's like, dude, what are you, I'm not looking for, I'm looking for dependability. I'm hoping that it's about low-level shit. I, you know what I mean? But you kind of have to prepare for like, something bad might happen to me. And I also have the fantasy of I'm on my deathbed and they all come back. So. Is that the fantasy? Is that the? Yeah. And then my new standard is like, I'll give you 15 minutes. Like, again, it's all just, I was- It's interesting though. Go on, what's the- Poorly treated as a child and, and I've learned boundaries. And I think I was friends with people for a reason. And then once you find out that they don't have you in the same regard, I think it's over. Cause, cause again, what do, what's the point? It's like, forgive someone's own. Okay, then what are we then? Then they're a person I know who I cannot count on. Doesn't seem like right. But I have a, you know, a hallmark thing of like, so-and-so's here to see and I'm like, send them in. But it's, it, I also know it's silly cause they're not changing. Nobody's changing. I don't know. I think we've both- You and I change. I've changed quite a lot in the last five years. I mean, it's actually really since we've known each other and you've been, I mean, to, to give you credit, you've been a huge part of my life in terms of my intellectual growth and growth as a comedian and aspiration as a comedian. How come that? I didn't, I never thought about that. Well, when I first saw three mics, heard the idea, saw like a bit of it in Montreal. Didn't see the whole thing, but saw a bit of it. I went, this is, that feels interesting. And then got, I went, I'm only doing one of those mics. I'm not doing anything from stand-up really. So I've learned how to write stand-up and I do more stand-up now. And, you know, you come and podcast you're more emotionally honest, which is sort of the, it's a different medium for the third mic. And it feels like that's a big influence on my life, but also just spending time with you. It's kind of, it's pushed me in another direction where you kind of go, well, actually, what do you rate in comedy? I'm not really interested in the, in the metrics that most people look at. I'm interested in what's, what's a great show that stays with people. What's a good special? How do you craft that? How does it look? Kind of thing. You've been a huge influence on me. I regard you as a peer, but I also regard you as one of the goats. I really do. I really feel like your specials, I often cite, you often get asked, what's the best special? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Three mics and blocks, I think, are really great specials. They're in, they're in the panacean. Thank you, thank you. There's nothing better than that out there into the proper shows. Yeah. And then I go, but I'm not even the 40th most popular, like, you know what I mean? Then I can, I can discount it because a lot of life, a lot of my life is, going like, I'm, am I, I feel like I'm good. I feel like I'm good. I feel like I'm how I'm trying, trying to make it better, try to explain, explore. But then. It's also comedically, I mean, not just as an individual, as a man, as a, as a comic. Like, can you imagine, there's quite a lot of, if we went to the comedy store tonight, there's quite a lot of people that you wouldn't put up again. Oh, don't put him up because he's just been up. She's just been up. So maybe let's leave a gap between the next because there's a similar flavor. Right. You're on your own. Yeah. No one else is doing that. No, I don't do it at the comedy store. But I know what you mean. Like, yeah, I agree with the, here's one of the problems is I kind of agree with you where I'm like, I feel like I'm good. And, but my popularity isn't commensurate with other people. So I go, I guess, I don't know, maybe I'm not. So. But what's the, but the popularity thing, I just think is the, it's the wrong metric to look at. I know, but it's still a really, I think it's the one. It's only because it's measurable. It's so easy to measure how many shows, how many tickets, how many things. I agree. Does that mean you're a better comic than someone else? No, it doesn't. It's also, there's a test of time. I'm pretty sure in no year over the last 50 years, George Cullen was the biggest comedian. I don't think he was the biggest comedian even when he had his big years. That I don't know. In one or two or three. I don't think he ever had maybe one or two. He may have been. He may have been for a long time. But let the, let the record show. Yeah. As things go forward. Lots of people, they're popular at the time, kind of fall away. I think with popularity. I, A, I think it's kind of shallow in a weird way. But legacy thing, I think is nonsense. Because you go, you're never going to enjoy it. Of course, you're dead and whatever, yeah. But you've always got an eye on that. I think it's more just like, am I respected? And people are glad I'm around. I think that's more, and like, do I feel like I'm doing a good job? So, so I do think about that. But then it's no one. The thing with popularity is everyone just, it becomes a cultural thing of like, everyone standing behind. Like, I remember somebody saying like, yes, Shane Gillis is going to be the new Louie. And I was like, how did you decide? Like, it just seems like there's a cultural wave. And they go like, he's got, he's round stomach like Louie. So he's going to be the next Louie. And you're like, and he's great and all that. So I don't think I'll ever get that. And then I go, why don't I get that? It strikes me that you're being kinder to yourself in a personal arena. And you've not quite got there in a professional arena yet to be kinder to yourself, to take a moment and look around and acknowledge. I agree. And also being happy where you are, the acceptance of going, well, if this is it, if it all ends tomorrow, my God, what a run you've had. You'd never want to roll those dice again. This is a fantastic life. I know. It's hard to contextualize yourself within comedy and then within all lives ever lived. I mean, within all lives ever lived, we are so far ahead of the pattern. I totally agree. But then you go, am I? Because I've had like mental health stuff and bad childhood. And so I don't, it's hard. It's all like shifting context. And yeah, the mental health stuff I don't think is, and I think we mentioned it, we haven't made it a bit. Depression for 25 years that you've got through, that's like hearing someone had stage four bowel cancer and they're fine now. Oh, no, it's gone. It's been gone for five years. They're over it. That's like you have, because depression is one of the biggest killers in the nation. And it's, people see suicide as a separate thing. It is a symptom of depression. You've been through it like a proper dark times. And you've come through it. I mean, it's extraordinary. Yeah. No, I agree. How do I feel? That's what I said. My life is amazing if I could just experience it for one minute. Yes. Well, I think that'll be about letting someone else in. And I think that's going to be about someone else. That won't be about- That's interesting. Because I don't think I agree with that. I think I have to get there on my own. There's an illusion in life that we're individuals. There's no such thing as a baby. A baby on its own, then 12 hours. There's nothing. Nothing without other people. Nothing without a baby and a mother is a thing. Baby and a father, baby and an auntie, baby and a stranger. Fine. But a baby on its own isn't anything. And we're all babies. We all think we're individuals. And we're all so interconnected. And it's so matters. And it feels like that you're a little bit isolated, but you're letting people in. And there's a growth in that. And you're becoming more connected to the world. And I could see why you'd be isolated. I could see why there's a self-preservation, there's a protection there you're worried about. I mean- Yeah, most of the problems were because of people I let in. I was letting the wrong people in. And now I feel like I'm letting better people in. But how would you possibly know the difference between good attention and bad attention when your whole childhood was no attention? There was a tension when I was funny. And it was a tension. I did get all- The other thing that I have a hard time feeling sorry for myself about is I was the center. I was funny from early. And I was the youngest. So there's just tons of attention. So yeah, there's the parental stuff. But I was so lucky in other ways. And I do- I am more cognizant of that as years go on. So yeah. So now it's about, dude, you're not helping these grudges, these swirls of thoughts and are just, they're not helpful. You just got to stop it. I found that CBT stuff to be the cognitive behavioral therapy, even if you're not going to go, if you just read the list of thought patterns, you just Google CBT thought patterns and you go, oh my God, do that, do that, do that. And actually just knowing sometimes that that's what you're doing is enough. You kind of go, oh, I'm doing one of those. I'm magical thinking. That's just magical thinking. Because that then that, or the counterfactual thing, on my deathbed, they'll come in and I'll, this is just an imagine. This isn't anything. This isn't real. What's real is now. And I think these friendships and these grudges matter a lot because the other thing isn't there, but when the other thing comes- I think now I'm in a phase where I have been where it's just like, everyone out. And now I'm slowly meeting people and letting them in. They're like sort of having a better, because I had a ton of magical thinking about friendships and people and what it was going to be and we're all going to live in bunk beds and we're going to be fucking. And then recently I've been more cautious about like, can you have a friendship? Can you do this? I think you can. Okay, let's try it. Well, comics become very good at getting on with people. From starting in the clubs, you're with people and you might see them every day for five days and hang on the bus and go on trains and planes or whatever. And then you don't see them for two years. And I feel like the difference between acquaintances and friends, like if you're doing small talk, it's just an acquaintance. And if you get right back in when you left off. Yes, great. Yeah, so like I'm having better habits with that. And the things I need were better friendship habits and better mental habits in terms of what am I thinking about? Because the thing with the grudges is I've a couple of weeks ago, I was like, you never write jokes from this. I get no bits. It's just a, it's the spin cycle. Yeah. And then so it's like, Neil, stop and write a bit. Just stop and go write a bit. Yeah, I do think that thing of like the, you know, when comics ask for advice, there's a great thing on the website Strange Loop, not doing the thing. You've seen that? Just about comedians, what they're, what they're, it's not about comedians. Do you want to hear it? It's pretty good. Yeah. It's, yeah, not, okay. So Strange Loop are the, I don't know who these guys are. Preparing to do the thing isn't doing the thing. Scheduling time to do the thing isn't doing the thing. Making a to-do list for the thing isn't doing the thing. Telling people you're going to do the thing isn't doing the thing. Messaging friends who may or may not be doing the thing isn't doing the thing. Writing a banger tweet about how you're going to do the thing isn't doing the thing. Hating on yourself for not doing the thing isn't doing the thing. Hating on other people who have done the thing isn't doing the thing. Hating on the obstacles in the way of doing the thing isn't doing the thing. Fantasizing about all of the adoration you'll receive once you do the thing isn't doing the thing. reading about how to do the thing isn't doing the thing. Reading about how other people did the thing isn't doing the thing. Reading this essay isn't doing the thing. The only thing that's doing the thing is doing the thing. Yeah. And I have a good work ethic. And I still were like, yep, I read that and I was like, yep, that's totally true. And it seems like most people spend their 20s doing that, their entire 20s, and then half of their 30s. And then by the time they're in the 40s, no one has any interest in them doing the thing. It's like you just kind of can't. Getting the other stuff out of the way. And I think that's Stoic thing. I got a lot from talking to Chris Williamson this year, actually, the Modern Wisdom podcast, which is where that's from. That thing of like going, do less better. Do fewer things in a better way. Yeah, do fewer things in a better way. Be a stand up, just do that. And I think emotionally going, well, your friendship group is spread out across the world on lots of different things. I think just focusing in. I think you have a load to give. I think it's, it feels very exciting. It feels like there's a new, there's the third act here. Right. I am curious about what that is. We also talked about death, the thing of I'm the youngest of 10. I'm probably going to have to bury statistically. I'm supposed to bury nine and I think it is. I think you may want to invest in a mass grave. It's a lot. It's a lot of people to go. It really is. Yeah, you're right. How many graves does it open? Do I leave it open until the next person? Until they all die? You'd be crazy to close it. What are you talking about? This? Yeah. Yeah, I think you're right. And you don't even close it. Someone else, you just go there. You just leave a note saying, throw me in. And then that's the Brennan's. Yeah. When I started to feel very tired, I head toward the grave. Yes, you're going to have to bury a lot of people. And I'm also worried about death. It's a weird thing. Are all your siblings still alive? Yeah. Because what's the age gap? Who's the oldest? Joe. He's 66. Wow, okay. Yeah. So I worry about death in, I don't want to die for my girlfriend. I'm really interested in being with her and spending as much time with her as I can before I die. I often have that thing like before, you know, when there's turbulence on a plane and you think you're going down, what do you think? I just hope the cookie gets there before the plane crashes. I used to have a thing where I went, whenever there was turbulence, I would always think I had a pretty good run. I had a really good run. Yeah, I agree with you. And now I go, oh no, there's a fear now. Because of your wife and child's children. Yeah, you've got babies. Yeah. And you go, oh, I can't miss that. I can't miss that. It's the great show on earth. Yeah, no, but I have received some weird messages about like, you're going to die soon. And one of them was on MDMA. I was like, what are you fucking talking about? And they were like, no, it's fine. And then a few people lately have had dreams about me dying. So I'm like, I'm worried. This feels like this is the bit of the podcast that we're going to have to dig out on that day. No, I'm giving you footage for the documentary. I get at least like a YouTube documentary. I don't think I'm going theatrical. But now I think about- But that's, I mean, that couldn't be more magical thinking. If we were trying to define magical thinking, that would be it. That I'm not going to die? There's nothing to matter with you, you're fine. Do you know what? It might be good to mark it as a thing of like going to a health check, go and do something positive that you can go, I finished with that thought, because I think that's going to wear around for a while. So if I were you, I'd go and get a medical- No, I thought I had skin cancer and I'm psoriasis. So like, and the rest of my levels are great. So I don't know. And then to two people who said they had a dream about me dying, there were different ways. So I'm like, all right, this is, I think this is hogwash. Sorry. So you think dreams aren't real because they're not consistent? Okay. I mean, also, if two people have a dream and you're dying exactly the same way, that's just a coincidence. Don't worry about that. Right. No, that's what I was like. When I figured out, when my sister told me how I died, I was like, all right, well, that's totally different than the other one. So yeah, I, you know what, maybe we should do a public service announcement. If you have a dream about anyone dying, maybe just eat it. Yeah, sit on it. Just, you don't need to share that. Certainly not with a person that you think is going to die, because what are you? I know. A Native American wise man. I mean, I guess if you are, then share it. They probably know something. Yeah. Yes. People don't know how to discern what's like, you know, spiritual and what's just random. And but even the thing where- But I think also taking death as a, you know, let's be hippies for a second, okay? I said earlier on a different podcast, I think. I don't believe in an afterlife, but I believe in a next life. And I think the old Neil is gone. I think you were depressed for 25 years. You were a different kind of guy. And now there's a new you. There's a new phase, the third act, whatever we're calling it. So that's a type of death and rebirth, as there always is in life. You know, you kind of put that behind you, you go, well, this is a new thing. Yeah. I'd also just written a will. Well, that will do it for you, because that's such a depressing conversation of like, where does everything go? Yeah. Well, why can't I keep it? Yeah. Because you're dead. You're like, bury it with me in a pyramid. And yeah, yes, play or in the pit. Yeah. In the pit with the other brothers. Yes. So that made me philosophically. But I think the things that I would like to accomplish is more consistent joy. Some sort of emotional resolution. I want some resolution with some of my issues. And I would like to spend as much time with my lady as possible. Like, that's what the, those are my two goals. They're not, they're very not professional. It feels very achievable. I think you have to give yourself a, through the depression and out the other side. And in terms of like closure, it's not going to get any better than that. Right. And I will agree that I know I've had an amazing life. I absolutely know that my life up to this point has been fucking incredible. And some sense of that would be good. And I think. But you do have a sense of that. In the intellectually, you can acknowledge that, you know that. And you go, you're thinking, I will feel a different way. I think that's an illusion that you think you'll get to the top of the mountain or you'll buy the house or buy the car or get the watch. Whatever the thing is that signifies success, that you go, I don't feel any different. It's the dopamine thing of going, I need the thing, I need the thing. And then you get the thing and it doesn't feel any different. Yeah. You're probably right. But every once in a while, you get something that does feel different. Every once in a while, you're overcome with this. I think a little bit of the success in our business goes a long way. Once you get the first, I don't know, whatever the thing was for you, the Netflix special, and look around, you got the house, you go, okay, we're doing fine. But acknowledging that on a daily basis, the gratitude, all you've got to do is practice gratitude. From my point of view, to make good on that first ambition, to have closure is just practicing gratitude. And you do, but it's like just more. More consistent. Yeah. We're not more, yeah, but just more of that, more gratitude. Yeah. Before you go to bed, when you wake up in the morning, just great. Yeah, I'm so great. It's, I've done things I can't believe. It's unbelievable. So. Well, you get back to the lack of appreciation. Yeah, that's on you. You don't even appreciate how good it is. You can't even believe you did it. I don't know, I'm underestimated. I'm underrated in my own head. Yeah. And I experience it from everybody else, and that's why I get so mad about it. But it's like, dude, you got to. You started it. Yeah, it's like you first. Like, you know, I have, you're right. I have to do it. It's such a pleasure spending time with you. I totally agree. I mean, the podcast is a fun way to look you in the face for an hour and just chat about you. And I think you're great. I think there's only better things ahead. I think it's, you know, your kind of, your growth and the fact that you share it with people so openly. There's a generosity to you that's extraordinary. Thank you. Let's leave it there. Great to see you, man. Love. Love you. Said it on the last one. Still mean it, two hours later.