 Welcome to Breeders Syndicate, the only cannabis show breaking down the myths and history in cannabis. I'm Matthew, seed maker for over a decade and a half and this is my journey into finding my truth in this wild world of cannabis. I invite you to join me and the Canaluminati by strapping into the passenger seat, but be warned it's not always pretty. With the invasion of corporate culture into cannabis it's getting even more muddy, which is why I've made it my mission to have a permanent record before all the history is lost and buried under a pile of cookies. We're the traditional market. The Syndicate is a collection of seed makers that want to push back against all the smoking mirrors. In doing so we will continue to ruffle the feathers of those who oppose and my personal mission has become much bigger than myself. Welcome to the cannabis underground. This is the Revolution. Welcome to Breeders Syndicate. I'm Matthew here with my co-host, Thousandfold and today we have local and farmer Dan with us. Thousand, let's hear about the show and this is our season finale. Yep so we finally get to our Skittles episode and we have Dan and local both because they have had an interest perhaps different angles of interest into the Skittles green-sherb key lime pie question. Both have some experience either with the cut and or with the S1s of either the sherb or the Skittles. Dan has worked with it commercially if I'm not mistaken Dan in some degree. Yeah pretty extensively. Yeah okay and also we initially planned to do this with CSI but he's been too busy so we have his blessing and also a little representation of him right there. So a little bit about how the episode is gonna be structured the first half is really just us unpacking what we all know and have observed and not me so much as these three whether in the cut itself or the S1s and then the second half of it is going to be about hypothetical breeding projects. We won't be going to origin stories per se as we have for other clones so we're not going to be talking about like the people side like who did what when I think that's less the priority today. That's just a cluster anyways so yeah. Yeah I think we want to stay away from that and I you know to be honest I've always been keen on and Matt I know has always been keen on this side of things where you actually work to find out what's happening. Yeah traits. So without further ado we can step in I think to talking about some of the traits of the Skittles clone. Dan do you want to start us off just and we Matt obviously jump in at any time local jump in at any time but we may as well start with what I think is its most notorious attribute its scent right. Yeah like its scent is something that like blows people's minds if they've never smelled anything like that in cannabis and so it's especially for like people that are kind of like I don't know touring a facility or something it's like always a treat to be able to be like oh you don't really smell weed very often like come smell this plant and like to me it's kind of like this like cherry lemon grapefruit thing you know like somewhere in between all of it with like this creaminess that's like really pretty mild compared to some other cuts but like also it's there and it's distinct but like it's it's also like a door little mutant that grows super super slow and has just an absolutely terrible root system that like it and the roots are there they just don't work well for whatever reason like maybe it has like a naturally low respiration rate or something like that but it's it's a pretty hard to work with plant like it's hard to clone it yeah like you can veg them for weeks and weeks longer than everything it's a pretty short flowering plant like we like to take it at between like 50 and 56 days before that nose disappears because it will and just turn into cardboard but yeah that's kind of my little my little summary of it it's a nice plant though all green yeah that on photorealistic it's not the most impressive plant Matt what's your take on the scent is it the same as Dan so do you have a different opinion for me like when we grew it it was extremely I can't I don't want to say citrus in the sense that it's like orange because it's not to me it was like the essence of grapefruit and and the flavor lingers like it gives you the lip smacking thing where it's constantly it stays in your mouth for quite some time after and it's just it it hangs in my mouth like Tangy and Calli Odu so yeah that's why I have a big association with the citrus parts but yeah grapefruit is where I lean most to and local have you have you tried the cut local I can't remove far vast to this I haven't tried the cut specifically but I've tried a few zs ones from Caleb that he grew and those were honestly kind of all within the range of what Dan and Matt both described really heavy kind of like citrusy like kind of candy thing the smoke is like really transparent to like the way it tastes and smells it's almost damn near identical but yeah it's it's really tasty I like it a lot yeah this thing does translate to flavor yeah yeah that's obviously a big deal as we've discussed what is the sense in terms of the fix potency I definitely built up a tolerance to Z and the zs ones and the sure best ones extremely fast extremely fast and but it wasn't like there was ever like a whoa this is deep you know I never never hit there even the first smoke is it like how does it compare in that sense to like other cookie derivatives or hybrids would you say less less potent than average oh wow you know because there's like decent potency and modern you know like gelato base lines and stuff it's not always there but you know with just like a little heterosis from out crossing you can usually bring stuff into the i20s and get you know like a decent effect but yeah skittles like I think you're pretty hard pressed to get high up it I like to blend it with potent weed that may not be the most flavorful like a nice camera and ogee or something and then like add that fruity elements you got like the skunky earthy you know what I mean with the candy so I use it as like a flavor modifier and blends you know one of the things that like I think when we talk about the clone being kind of like a kind of piece of crap because I think some people do agree like growing it it's not the most friendly plant is the branching and when we try to talk about the branching it has even to me it has even more bendy limp limbs structure than say an og and because it's not as tall and it's more short and squat it's very odd looking almost like a train wreck style just to where it just flops all over itself it never had good turgid structure for me yeah and it also like doesn't really have like strong apical dominance like you'll never get like a tall lanky clone so it's always this little ball plant like that yeah without without topping yeah without topping it does that yes we just syndicate 3.0 is coming at you with props guys I wanted to ask this kind of a random question but like in your minds are there any other kind of cuts or lines that are comparable in whatever fashion like does it remind you of anything else for whatever reason whether in structure or smell or anything or no it's quite unique I think it's like sweet peat and grapefruit just along not the exact same but the the the turps are similar enough and unique enough for what spg was at the time to have made the same kind of impact I think that's why I associate them so much and the grapefruit part of it maybe one thing for the people who are not in the US especially like when did it come into the market this isn't in my outline but I just kind of came to mind when did it really like hit the market and how much of an impact would you all say it has had relative to something like gelato 2017 2018 yeah is when it really impacted the market I remember the emerald cup where they were trying to sell every seed form of it possible I think it was like I think it was spring 2017 when the dookie bros dropped their trees and humble because that's what I remember I was still in college but I think it was my senior year or my super senior year something like that and I remember ditching class and going because like they had announced on Instagram that they were you know had limited quantities of it and I think I got the last one it was on the tray and it was like the least well-rooted and like I didn't know how big of a piece of shit it was but yeah we actually didn't end up keeping that cut long-term because the hype hadn't built yet and it was still spelt like the candy too there was no z's involved and yeah I couldn't get anyone to grow it because it was this bad router it was veg so slow just like those growth traits nobody really wanted to grow it because that hype hadn't built up yet and as far as the impact it's had I think I mean just look at the modern names on the market everything's got a z in it now whether it has actual skittles in it or not it's actual impact has been that everybody sticks z's on shit now so yeah I think it and GMO also are like single-handedly responsible for the the whole rosin revolution in extracts because z actually does have I forgot to mention that earlier it does have really nice resin traits for washing and those trichomes just fall right off and so those were like I think the first two that were the earliest I think that ended up being washers that have lasted to this day I have a cultural question here is the z responsible for the term zah or is that from something else I would bet yeah I don't think you get zah without the z revolution in no way Matt was talking about a second question if I call it z what will people think I think that you're British just like you are yeah you're T totaler yeah um in terms of like this crappy growing like this kind of uh you know you'll have to mention multiple times and how bad it is is there anything else that grows as poorly or that grows like it maybe urgal or yeah that's gonna ask actually yeah urgal yeah yeah that's kind of like what I would compare it to if I was like being like hey you've never grown this but like here's the reality of it and if they had like knew their purple oh yeah I see I don't have experience with that that's very similar yeah yeah not as leafy uh z is not as leafy as pock obviously but yeah no same kind of structure slow growing shitty roots yeah another thing that came to mind was like have there been any notable outcrosses uh with it historically yeah tons like it just depends on what you consider notable you know what I was gonna say I guess 2017 2018 I don't find anything notable too much but at the same time it has had a major impact on the culture and notably like yeah I mean there's a lot of just like I said the z's are in everything so I mean yeah I think it's honestly I think it's been more of like a marketing revolution than actual like number of plants that have come from it kind of thing there you go that's like skittles and then like maybe moonbow kind of thing and rainbow belts those are the only like three like big names and they weren't really that widely distributed and I don't think the first iteration of rainbow belts was like super well received and so what's the lineage on that I think I don't know about isn't it dosey dose fucking skittles I thought that was moonbow but um I could be wrong on all of it I don't know yeah me too yeah you might be right that is moonbow was rainbow belts bro I don't know but I've seen stuff that looks like rainbow belts come out of like some classic combos of like z og z headband stuff like that sometimes you get those dwarf little guys with the really chunky buds yeah um z cube was the one that I had the first experience with before the moonbows and all that stuff how much you pay for those 500 a pack yeah that's what I remember too and I remember I think it was from fields no I bought it from Shiloh and Shiloh charged me dollars a pack for I think I spent 6k and 500 a pack all the way up no breaks yeah yeah every time I've met Shiloh at like events and stuff he's been a really nice guy yeah he's nice super nice businessman for sure yeah yeah maybe the one I get out of all those dudes all those dudes the only one I get along with yeah yeah Matt since you mentioned it Matt what was it like working with this z or the z cube um there the the skittles smell is not consistent in z cube despite it supposedly being a bx3 um and that was good old bx3 yeah it could all be x3 um a very fast bx3 am I dad uh meaning like it was made very quickly um a year and a half exactly and the other thing I noticed was despite buying many different kinds of the skittles hybrids that everything except the rosés the rosé types were identical like not in and not that everything was uniform but everything looked like the same expressions coming out of different packs no matter what the parent was if that makes sense so it it was a lot to spend to see something I could have seen in one pack um with that said the outcrosses they could definitely outcross z dominant I like the structure better on z cube um the crosses it just it wasn't consistent for the chirp so I had a really hard time calling any of its skittles unless it was uh dominating that particular cross but it didn't really bring much in that in that sense um it could I think it could have been done better relatively speaking like what was the or were some of the more successful results do you think in your opinion um we had a dosey dose nor can I see mad cut across to the z cube early on called dose giddles which is essentially similar to moonbow but it was a few years earlier and people really like that one a lot but again it's like I didn't love it um my favorite was the the skittles glue on it and I worked that further but but that one was like a merging of the the grapefruit blueberry which to me right it reminded me a lot of like um blue satellite you know so and I like blue satellite what'd you call that skittles bonnet I didn't I didn't think you did that I never released it of course I only I only uh ran them and then used it in the blue skittles blue berry mac one send that to me yeah you want this I might have sent the last one to D actually I don't remember what happened to them yeah they were all white they were all shitty seeds so I was just like I can't sell this if they pop it's pretty it happens a lot you know with like a really healthy expression of it that you get a three fair portion of white seed in there yeah I mean they were they were like model the gray but just yeah like not full brown tiger stripe so I knew there's no way I can sell these because people would just like flip out so yeah yeah it definitely has like its own unique seed morphology too I've actually used that surprisingly successfully as like a predictor of like those turps you know and in my line it's like a limey kind of smell but once I fixed that like they were all like really consistently limey like I had one run where I like was doing a breeding project I was pretty strapped for time and I didn't take as good a notes as I should have and so I was kind of just like smelling these like flower bins and the shoved seeds off to the side and like I was kind of just like well that one looked really similar to the mother seeds you know what I mean like oh I'm gonna I'm gonna try that and like when I grew them they were just like amazing you know and so I actually look for that now and I've kind of noticed that's interesting yeah that's interesting yeah like it's not something that people ever like look at but I'm actually kind of obsessed with it to a certain degree um because when you know a line you know what its seeds look like yeah more quality yeah chem d seeds are like little dark brown circular like spherical balls you know what I mean like that's what I've always kind of seen from them and uh I don't know yeah z's kind of like these little dinosaur eggs with these like few but like pretty specific looking uh modeling on it I think is what it's called um those tiger stripes but yeah they look like dinosaur eggs that's what I always call it you know because they look different you know and then the average seed yeah funny little anecdote I had like a buddy telling me in a trim room one time we had some seeded weed on this outdoor and he's like you can't tell the difference of these seeds and I'm just like let me look at them and like I'm looking at these five cups of seeds and I'm like mix them all up you know what I mean and I separated them perfectly and told them exactly what they were you know yeah I mean if you've gone through a lot of seeds and you've made a lot of lines and you just you know sorted seeds a lot like it it becomes very evident like oh this came from that this came from that like trainwreck has its own type of seeds you know like there's all kinds of strains that that really have distinctive seed types yeah yeah I was working a bunch of s ones and so they were like distinct separate oh sure a bunch of kale of stuff yeah I mean it's the same as if you were like oh I don't know a woodworker looking at wood you know like you can see a lot more than someone else could just because it's absolutely spent with it I mean I'm glad you mentioned the s oh you got me I was just gonna say like for that comment me and someone else were talking about a mutual I should call them an acquaintance now a mutual acquaintance that it seems like what they were doing and this is very typical in the weed business was taking someone else's seeds and looking at it what it was and was thinking oh let me think this has skunk one haze and something else and and all five in it let me say this is you know a tie um afghani something you know like and we'd see him move these things around but the problem was like if people knew those lines well enough that he was confabulating for the others it's still just as obvious because traits are traits are traits and that's the one thing a lot of people miss if they aren't able to see it themselves they don't understand that other people can see it they don't get it but it is there yeah and I think you know that should be a strong implication of this whole episode you know the way we're exploring this is through traits and through observations not through uh yeah not through a you know as I mentioned like a historical lens as much absolutely um which I think I think is a really interesting way to go for us as well even in terms of the show um I'm glad Dan mentioned the s1s obviously we're going to dive into yeah thoughts on Skittles s1s sure some of us want some of us want it's the s1 master um can I ask local before we jump into the s1s was there anything else I know local doesn't uh mention the heat may not have as much to say about the clone itself but local was there anything else you wanted to add before we went into the s1s um not at the moment that's cool yeah um okay if well we can just like briefly just so like people can like understand my kind of experience with the plant in general and just like the timeline so like we mentioned like the dinky bros um breaking up with like I don't even know what their group was called at that point right it wasn't dying breed yet it wasn't her pogs yet like I don't is it third gen or you know what was that it might I yeah I don't know I remember I remember the the Kyle Cushman Shiloh thing but I don't remember anything what it was before then I wasn't as keyed in to like the whole like IG like I was just kind of getting into it and figuring out like who everyone was in California like I was hidden away for a while but um yeah like they do that in 2017 spring I get the clone couldn't get anyone to grow it drop it um I come across it again or the the kind of family in LA that's when I get the green chirp in the sunset and we do run I was telling you about this uh I think like a week ago but yeah like we get the sunset we get the green chirp and um we run them side by side and we're like well fuck this green thing you know what I mean the sunset's the way to go it's purple it's gas it's creamy it's like you know um but like I saw a plant that had like pretty good modern structure like pretty full pretty unremarkable in most ways just like lime green like a little fruit basket kind of bouquet and uh like I forgot about it for another year or two you know until I got a cut called Skittles quote unquote from a buddy in Oregon and um that cut was more similar in structure to the green chirp but it smelled like the key lime pie yeah you know and so I bred with that for a couple years and now recently you know since I've had my current job for the past year I've just been like crossing Skittles to everything and doing tons of in crossing or out crossing work a bunch of different inbreeding projects and stuff and so um it's been interesting to see it all it's just like it's a like we're saying earlier it's those traits don't always line up the way that you really want them to yeah that's for sure yeah yeah no that's great and maybe local can say a bit as well I know it's obviously not on the same scale and not not trying to you know they can feel awkward or anything but logo head you you've run some sure best ones correct yeah I ran two packs from Caleb in the past um and then I have another six going right now I had one dampen off so I'm just down to six um but yeah I mean relatively speaking they're all really nice plants um what I've kind of found it that was cool um is that I know people shit on the structure of CEO lot um that's one thing I did not notice um in the the sure best ones is is there is like no lack of vigor uh so to say um you got some pretty nice like you know decent yielding plants nothing you know out of the ordinary or like you know spectacular or whatever um there was some color on the leaf but not much of it really faded to the bud but then again my room wasn't the coldest um and then um I was showing some picks to Matt the other day and he would pointed one out that looked kind of like uh like what you would see in cookies um which I thought was really interesting um what do you mean by that so like the the nudge structure and I think it would be like the inner nodal spacing like the the way you kind of see them spaced out from each other it's pretty kind of obvious like now that I look at it again yeah um but I don't know like the smell is just really nice too but I don't think it's as strong as like the z s1 smells but they are like the exact same theme if that makes sense I don't know mm-hmm mm-hmm also I wanted to I wanted to add here like we haven't been able to verify the key lime pie is the exact same cut as Korean Sherb there's never been a time when anyone that I know personally has gotten them both sourced from really good sources at the same time to run them side by side so I just wanted to add that caveat actually yeah we should actually really explicitly signpost this because I don't think we actually spelled it out but the speculation is that green sherb key lime pie skittles are either the same thing we'll have something to do with each other no very close right no no skittles is something different skittles is is is definitely a different clone than the key lime pie and green sherb but um key lime pie and green sherb it's definitely debatable on whether they're related I don't I don't really know I'd be like I describe I describe key lime pie different than Dan does for example because we didn't have in the same environment same room all that how how z is related to green sherb like that is definitely speculation but there's a lot so much in common that it's hard to ignore I would say okay so there's speculation basically that they are that these three are at least loosely related yes I think that's fair to say okay yeah gotcha gotcha I mean if we were taking we were like placing bets Dan what would your bet be just I don't know I mean I still don't know that's kind of like why it's such an interesting topic is that um I still don't think anyone's found a dead ringer in a green sherb s1 but I think a green sherb bag seed is definitely part of the equation you know because like for those traits the the way that I've seen the traits break down and how they outcross versus when you sell them stuff is that like the structure and the resin qualities are really dominant and the um aromas are really recessive and so you only ever really see them when you cross it to things that it's kind of related to already which is sure you know and so you can actually get some of those z-turbs at low rates to pop up by even crossing like z into gelato stuff you know um but it's not very common in like as far as like the percentage breakdown um so I would yeah go ahead no sorry you finish oh yeah well I was just gonna say like I think that green sherb like a green sherb double up on some of these traits that being like in an s1 I think is like a necessary step but I also do have a suspicion that it was out crossed so we've kind of pivoted the conversation with this already but Dan would you tell us like uh in terms of these zs1s like what did you observe so I grew 45 of them and um I got 35 jars of flour out of it because some of them hermed and then some of them were just like literally so unworkable and dwarf and slow growing that like it just wasn't gonna happen you know uh with the pace of our work and so um what I saw was like a 90 percent skittles like dead ringers of skittles and its structure and its uh expression but just with cardboard turps you know like not good at all like almost aromalous you know what I mean and then the other 10 percent was eerily similar to cookies and and uh sunset sherbet it had a very sharp look to it and um they were also completely aromalous you know um but there was a handful I think we had four keepers out of those 35 um that were all notable for one reason or another you know some of them had better potency some of them had a more true aroma but I personally didn't see any of them that I was like this when I smell this and real skittles at the same time like that's the exact same aroma it was all like how local was saying it's in the same ballpark which um I call like a mixed starburst you know what I mean like if you had like a cherry a lemon and an orange starburst like all right there on your hand that's kind of like the closest thing you see even in the s ones and so I do personally think that like um skittles its aroma and profile is a very rare trait combination or gene combination in that pool because I haven't seen it pop up yet just to clarify and the s ones that you you ran uh you were saying like 90 percent of them were aromalous no like 90 percent were like skittles expressions like if I showed you the flower and a real skittles plant like the clones side by side you'd be like yeah that's the same plant like yeah it's a different like individual yeah morphologically yeah but there was a nice spelling things like what is that four out of 35 you know like that's like one in seven has like a pretty nice aroma you know so it's not like non-existent it's just like not very high prevalence you know like when we're working lines I like to fix traits towards like if you pop a pack of 10 you're high of like a few to keep you know what I mean that are in that same range but you're just going to hone in on what you prefer specifically you know did you did you run out sure best ones as well well no you haven't you haven't no I haven't but um I really want to I'm just so limited on my like personal space and I don't think it has like a purpose for my work um at my job you know what I mean they don't really care about like the lineage and uh you know what I mean like the mystery kind of thing that's more of a personal project and so yeah that makes sense you know like I don't see MSO is really giving two shits about lineage they just you know what's already hyped what's marketed what can we hype better things like that yeah like don't get me wrong they want that profile and some of those traits and other things but it just doesn't really make sense in some regard to like be like oh let's go buy seven packs of s ones run them find something that's like you know what I mean like I already kind of figured out other ways with just the clone to kind of get those expressions bumped up a little higher percentage wise and so um I actually had a little side tangent do you know anything Matt about the um the z sprite cut no nothing yeah that one is honestly even more mysterious than Skittles itself and like its whole origins because like it just like appeared no one can really tell me anything about it this bright yeah yeah yeah and it's actually I think uh another little side tangent off that same profile but it really does smell like sprite and I fucking love it and I think it has a better a better high to it and so like I've worked with it I don't know if it's like the real cut but it has like you know the namesake trait yeah and so um that one is honestly even more mysterious to me because it's it's cool it's obviously related you can get some of those z sprite combos to pop up pretty easily when you cross them together and so well if anybody in the comments uh or that's watching this leave in the comments if you know who the sprite came from or anything about it please I also want to ask is real quick let me let me chime in on this because Caleb the one thing that I did or inspected the one thing I did get him to comment on right here was on the prevalence of z turps in the zs ones and that was I think that's the one thing that he took like a different take on he felt like popping a lot of these zs ones that he found that turp in there a lot lot but not the exact dead on term but he said that the scent profile was there but in in abundance but not that same exact clone with that scent profile that makes sense yeah well and I've been kind of thinking about this too because like um you know I got that feedback you know was that a couple days ago or something like that um and I've been kind of thinking of it because I'm just like man maybe I didn't phrase my like question or like wording right but I think what it really comes down to is that like we have very very different cultivation styles and like the work that we're doing and he's doing those like living soil organic beds you know which is like more what I would personally do if I was doing this for myself like he is um but it couldn't be more opposite from what I do at work yeah and our cultivation style which is like small pot cocoa drip line direct injection you know what I mean and so I bet you he's actually getting a higher prevalence just because he's growing weed in a way that like that plant probably prefers more than what I'm doing you know I also noticed this too in a similar way with the bubbleberry v2 like when I first popped uh you know a handful of them I saw a lot of very blueberry dominant smelling plants in it but when the larger population got a hold of it like when I sold it and people got packs of it I was finding out it the the blueberry trips were the least common expressions it was really really bubblegum dominant and it was weird because I felt like I had a pretty good representation there and it's just like different rooms different styles you know what I mean there's so much that goes into it that really doesn't get accounted for in variables like when customers ask me hey what am I going to expect from this is it going to you know help my anxiety etc etc there's so many variables involved it's really impossible to explain unless you give good examples like these yeah yeah there's definitely so much difference in how different people are going to grow weed and so like you kind of have to take an average of those and so like if I even only have two data points it's like well the the reality is probably somewhere in between you know what I mean yeah like um you know maybe the way he's doing it is literally just like perfect for those expressions on this plant whereas like a salt diet and cocoa is just like not really going to bring it out because like there are other cuts that I breed with that I get routinely upset that I'm like well we didn't grow it well so like how can you judge this expression yeah you know and so I was definitely kind of thinking about that for the last few days where I'm like you know what I think I couldn't be really wrong about that based on wrong style or not wrong but like that our cultivation style is so like specific to production and not like like best terpene expression I think I think the way you qualify it isn't that you're saying that this is what everybody should expect and the only way it goes down it's just like you're saying this is how I ran it so I don't think it's necessarily wrong I just think it's yeah a completely different run and take but it's not conditional yeah yeah but it makes me want to like slow down and change some things if I could ever like do that at work you know what I mean because I'm like I've been like I've talked to you guys about my frustration with OG too you know what I mean like it doesn't like that cultivation environment that's like very prevalent now and so like how can you really judge a breeding project if like the expression you're getting is the worst possible one I wonder if that's why everybody thinks OG is just gone despite every fucking OG hybrid out there still oh I think I really think it is I think there's a lot of stuff that people like renamed for clout like I was telling you before like the ghost OG that's going around right now like people have I've heard many people say that it's not the same ghost that used to go around of course and I'm pretty positive that it's like a chem D OG structure and the expression and the potency and acid motor breath around yeah yeah man but like a way better cut than motor breath it actually is a really nice cut if you guys can get your hands on it what's it called just it's just called ghost now it's just called yeah ghost OG that's what it's been going around as but it's actually really nice man and I was really pleased with it when we were in it so that's cool total size I wanted to come back to Dan's questions for Caleb even though I know that Caleb didn't really get an opportunity to answer them Dan I wonder if Dan wanted to at least tell us about why he wanted to ask these questions some of these questions in the outline I don't know if you guys are looking at the outline but the second page is some of Dan's questions okay Dan I don't know if you just wanted to tell us about why you thought of these or like what what you what what kind of outcomes you're looking for yeah well I mean that that first one I feel like we already covered and that may be the second one too um then we kind of go your overall strategy yeah oh I mean the main reason that I was like I've been so curious about this is that like the cut does have nice traits but when you outcross it to just like any and everything like I kind of been doing the last year um you don't see the things that you want as much as the things that you really don't like the dwarfism some like slight hermaphrodism like it's definitely not a herm bomb like um I've heard some people describe it as but there is some hermaphrodism in it um but like the main thing is is that like I would cross it to all kinds of stuff and I never got even a semblance of the nose and so like that's partially I think due to cultivation style from like you know our previous little anecdote but um at the same time it's also just that like I've heard plenty of people say that you know that it's just like you don't end up with that aroma and outcrosses which leads me to believe that it's some like very recessive combination of traits that actually make it smell maybe and express the yeah or some link I mean the link traits like the aroma is definitely tied to the dwarfism as far as I've seen you know um but um I try and stay out of like the linked trait whole thing just because it's like so theoretical yes theoretical is almost impossible to prove it this way and I mean even talking about the aroma as like recessive it's like well it's probably like dozens and dozens if not hundreds of genes like yeah that all need to be correctly aligned in the proper way to like express that way but um what I've actually it reminds me a bit of like Matt talking about crossing to super scum types yes yes yeah yeah double recessive and whatnot well and that's kind of like what I'm getting to is that like so maybe skittles like like for simplicity's sake let's call that a aroma profile like a double recessive if it was a single trait so like the only way to like really ever get that expression then would be to find something else that also has a double recessive you know and that's kind of honestly like the success that I've had in like upping the the rate of expression for that really nice aroma even the ballpark of it has been from using two children at z that both have those traits and or children quote unquote like one of them being like the z sprite and one of them being rainbow belts you know because rainbow belts just smell similar to z but it's definitely not as like pungent or as nice you know sure it's um yeah it's just good you know but um I actually had a pretty decent rate of uh you know z-terps pop up and so um that just means that you have to like only in cross it really like weird types of in crosses cousin to cousin kind of thing to be able to ever maintain that profile in a line and so it's yeah it's it's challenging to work within that regard because like you can only really cross it with itself to get those expressions out and I don't think that like I think other people have talked about like using s ones and like maybe the s one will pass it better and I'm like no I really don't think it will because you're going to break it up again yeah let me pause you here because I think that's gonna I think we're gonna move straight into um possible directions projects etc just to wrap up this kind of like your your and and even locals observations on the sure best ones like um but actually wait no one am I saying sorry your your experience with skittles s ones what do you speculate it's lineage to be based on what you've seen I know that like again don't hold down to any of this this is just like what is it Dan well the only the only clue you get right because if you see 90 percent skittles types is the shurb expression and so it just leads you to shurb which is still kind of like not really an answer either you know what I mean and the green shurb I try to know but that's what's funny is that it looked the ones look like sunset you know what I mean I didn't get it really much of anything that reminded me of the green shurb cut or the the key lime pie and structure and so um it's all just skittles you know um but that's kind of the whole confusing part to me you know it's definitely not a child of sunset but like it shares a common ancestor you know or like a shared lineage with the green you know like that's why it's so I mean we can talk in circles for hours about this kind of thing because like there's only enough info to ask questions but not enough info to ever have an answer you know Dan you're so keyed up on this dude I can hear those like sharp intakes of breath yeah where you're like you don't even end your sentences yeah local did you have anything to say even just based on your like distant experience with this just on like speculation like you know I mean there's some kind of relation like obviously between like shurb and skittles of some sort um yeah based on what I saw I mean some cookie look alike I mean maybe that would be some kind of thought on what it could be no not it's like 100 percent but you know maybe that's something in there but yeah I really don't know what it is well I think there's another like conflating part that makes it equally confusing is that like the only difference between shurb and cookies is the supposed outcross right of pink panties well what the fuck is pink panties Matt you know that was yeah yeah I had experience with it from running it it's kind of a shit plant but um and a shit breeder at that too I mean it's better than it's a better breeder than it is a grower but actually looking at f1 derb I would be quicker to think pink panties is related to f1 derb based on a lot of the same um traits it has a lot of the same stem traits and stuff and and the way it sets the plan up um yeah but like I've looked it up it's supposed to be like what Burmese or Burmese kush maybe crossed to I forgot what the other part of it was but none of it made any sense to me um yeah I think they say like Burmese to OG yeah something like that some stupid it's not and there's no possible way yeah it's not it's not a good cut bro it doesn't have the same scent profile does not have the same term profile whatsoever it's not even close kind of fruity not not all it did was kind of beef up the shirb whatever it was yeah it's it's I wouldn't go with pink panties I really really wouldn't and I know shirp shirp says that's what's in it and you know he seems like a nice guy but I after growing that cut I just am very hard pressed to see that um oh by the way rainbow belts it looks like it's uh as ghettles crossed to moonbow number 75 so it's like as ghettles dx one I think the pledge did okay yeah that makes sense there you go yeah which actually may get you farther away from what you want then you know what I mean yeah um the other thing is like we aren't going to go too much into history but when I think about the people working with that cut and the history basically that it came from some dudes girlfriend's dad in a tray blah blah blah was labeled cookies um and I think about what the third gen dudes were growing they were growing a lot of sweet tooth and something called adini and uh russian kush there were a few other things that were staples in their crew and when I think about sweet pink grapefruit grapefruit and I think about like sweet tooth and stuff like that I'm like hmm I wonder but it came to them supposedly by the story ready so maybe that's just like a red herring but yeah I just don't know it's really hard that is a very confabulated telling it's gotten much worse since third gen dying breed and the the other dudes um broke up and stopped being frenzies it's gotten even worse on the on what they say things are and who did what where it came from less consistent I should say so you don't subscribe to the grape eighth grapefruit crime you know it's funny like I say grapefruit but like it's not like obviously that's not great it's there though I I remember tasting some early extracts like some bho of skills and it was like pure grapefruit it's very great and that's where like a lot of my z stuff is extracts that I that I smoke and it's like this is fucking grapefruit this is sweet pink grapefruit like I know what this is and um but I don't know that that's why you know I don't know if the cuts in it I basically I really doubt it because sweet pink grapefruit was a robust big huge healthy plant but um yeah whatever like the process was to make skittles I think it involved a lot of in breeding and s ones and not on purpose yeah exactly like most shit right like just a lot of accidents and re re labels and renames of clones and trays and shit like that yeah someone got super lucky on that like one in a thousand one in ten thousand bag seed you know like otherwise I think we would see sisters to it you know what I mean like if it wasn't so obscure and rare and recessive I think that you would see sisters because if you get a bag of bag seeds or like the way I keep bag seeds you know what I mean it's like I got like you know like ideally like 20 30 of them if it was really seeded yeah you know so yeah I have to agree on that but trying to find out even guess what could be in skittles other than like those cookie type sherbet types yeah like the other factor would be really really shooting in the dark I think yeah that's why I want to eventually go back to the green sherbet s ones and like I actually run through those it's just like I don't have the like capability of doing it at the scale that I would want to like I want to do like 120 you know I'm glad we're here because this is where I think we pivot towards looking at it it's potential but before we do that I guess it's like so the question is like what is the future of z but before that I want to ask like who cares do we care does Matt care no how far can it be taken and okay Matt so Matt I doesn't seem super enthusiastic about his future why is that Matt just the future of the clone in general even talking to Dan like the fact that they're having to do all these go to all these measures to keep it alive to be able to reproduce like I can see it being kept alive in other lines but as far as that clone goes I think that there is going to be a day where that clone is gone because of how sickly it is not necessarily with hlv but I mean just like it's natural structure is very not not good it's been in a lot of shitty rooms before it made it up to a bunch of us and it's just not hardy I don't see it living as far as like it's not widely held either yeah exactly like people couldn't keep it they couldn't root it they couldn't you know what I mean that's why I don't have it I couldn't keep rooting it um yeah I just I don't know like I think because it's an inbred type plant but it's recessive I don't know what kind of future it would even have in breeding I mean people are going to keep doing it whether it should be done or not or whether it's making better shit because the market's determined by names and it doesn't really matter how good it is as long as it's hyped so in this kind of market maybe it'll last forever in hybrids you know because I've actually heard from Dan despite his excitement um that he just kind of cares about solving the mystery if I'm not mistaken Dan yeah I don't even like it that much yeah yeah yeah which I think is flavorful but I think it's a really shitty breeding tool unless you want resin traits that come with a ton of baggage so like meme of sour essentially like I don't I don't love sour better than anything else but the mystery of it has held me for so goddamn long that I'm not gonna drop it until I figure it out for sure yeah it's it's like the whole like murder mystery kind of thing like I'm not really into that stuff but I can get hooked on it if I get that introduction of the story you know what I mean at the party we need to have a murder mystery game yeah like what happens you know what I mean I gotta know what what happens you know and so like I've just been around it a lot and had like experiences but like I don't personally like it that much and I hate working with it because it never does what you want it to yeah um but like going back to that whole like theoretical like recessive thing you can actually have a recessive trait like that that's in like dominant and a dominant prevalent in a population but everyone has to have it you know what I mean because like over generations if like there's even like a handful of individuals that don't those are going to be dominant over the recessives and eventually take over at like a population scale over time you know and so like I think it's kind of a doomed tool because of that you know what I mean like there I think it'll be around and like people will hold cuts of different crosses or like s ones or whatever because like it is really tasty and it makes delicious extracts but like as a breeding tool I think it's like next to useless honestly unless you love breeding for resin traits I want to pivot to local here because I know local is looking at some shrimp s ones as he mentioned and maybe I'd like to hear from him like what he thinks might be possible or what maybe first of all why is he looking for in the s ones and then if he does find that thing you know what what does he think he could do with it later um honestly bro I'm kind of just looking for some saw that's really it um yeah I mean I am like I need some cultural context like oh um like you know it's like tasty flavorfully exactly yeah that people would eat up bro yeah because even though it's low potency people fucking love it like yeah low potency isn't always bad you know but what else local like is there something that you want to do with it as well um I don't know um I don't think I like it's really nice like the flavor and everything but I don't know if it would make anything particularly worthwhile in my collection like it's not something that I would go back to and like dig through extensively again or you know but you've talked to me about like having some ideas for potential outcrosses oh um yeah I mean I don't know if I'd ever get to them but I mean there's some really nice mango gummy bear tasting eb appy plants that could be like maybe a cool outcross to a sherbert-like thing I don't know increase the legs a bit keep like those candy notes and like intact possibly I mean I really wouldn't know how to pan out funny enough I'm pretty sure Matt might have mentioned something like this in that I don't know one of the weird cookies episodes that we did about like how you would try to counterpoint cookies with something and I think we did mention api as like oh probably yeah like a pairing that would be interesting yeah I guess just to the point of view of like oh sorry you go Matt yeah no just I remember trying to think about it it was like um trying to add speed a better high and all kinds of stuff my first idea was like c99 and I was like wait a minute I have something way better than c99 that accomplishes all that and is way more dank and way more pungent that's api so yeah definitely yeah yeah because I guess for me this this section is interesting like more or less all of you have said that you don't care that much about his future which is funny so I'm trying to force you to pretend that you do uh so that we can have can kind of like tease out some like possible hypothetical directions maybe we can pass it to Dan now Dan I like the api idea but the problem is is I think it would take a minimum of two steps oh easy yeah yeah like guaranteed a minimum of two steps where it's like you'll have to make the cross and the harder part will be like well how do I find the plants that to double up on to get the expression and the aroma that I want out of it you know where you're kind of just picking at random we don't really have that type of genetic phenotyping yet and so um it'll take a lot of trial and error I think but I think it could potentially be really awesome you know I went with them yeah I like that angle I think blueberry z would be fucking awesome I think I had a what was it the blue skittles clone yeah um and I never really knew what that was because like the dying breed one was blue domino skittles or whatever but like the one that I saw was kind of like a squirt grapefruit like super nice easy to grow you know what I mean like I've never actually I wish I still had that clone because it was if it was what it says it was like lineage-wise it was actually like a really nice expression what was it supposed to be lineage-wise do you remember well that's what I don't know is like I just got it as blue skittles but like it could either be the one that you made or the one that dying breed made I'm sure it's the one they made because I meant mine came way later than that got you yeah yeah yeah I didn't I didn't come across that honestly though until about like 2019 2020 that sounds about when it showed up I'm pretty sure that's when it got real popular I remember it 2018 emerald cup a lot of people were smoking on blue skittles there and I I've been thinking this is not very this is not blue what the fuck are they doing but uh yeah I know I think space invader kept clones of the the main blues to get bluesy pop that we did from our stuff I think he kept that one yeah there was some good breeding clones in there too that we're still not pure z but in the outcross with the mac one there is one that looks like blue bonnet with mac the z-terfs so that does exist it's just crap shoot yeah that's kind of where I'm at with like my work with it too is like trying to push those boundaries of like well what's closely related enough to like get the right expression but like not just going to be boring and z only you know and trying to get away from those morphological traits you know yeah um and I've had some mild success but you know there uh um you know it's I still have never come across a dead ringer it's always just ballpark yeah and the z-cube stuff too like I said it was very unpredictable it was wildly not predictably skittles like you could find him in there but you'd be finding a lot more other stuff in there like I know um when when dying breed and whatever they called them platinum skittles I think they called it at the time broke up um they one of them had a z3 which was the platinum skittles guys uh phony mendo and those dudes and uh it was a uh like z-cube so I'm not sure that those were any different they said that they were after they broke up they're like yeah ours is hindu kush ours is with this I saw a lot of hindu kush what I what I recognize hindu kush stuff inside of the um z-cube so I don't know which is which I've had some later iterations of uh um bx2s of skittles um I won't name who they're from because I'm about to talk some mad shit but they were fucking terrible like some of the work like like imagine if you had the shitty all the shittiest traits fixed perfectly in a population so they were all dwarf they they were resinless somehow so they lost the good resin trait and they were all cardboard yes and like I ran a lot of them and I was like what the fuck is this trash how is this group so popular yeah doesn't surprise me so all you have to do is go type in who made skittles bx2 you'll figure it out yeah well welcome we may well have a shorter episode today uh we're kind of like come to the end of like at least the structured questions that I had for us um so we can talk about whatever really at this point um if we wanted to start wrapping up um any you know any kind of final questions or thoughts from everyone um I knew that we wouldn't get to you know I knew that two hours is quite long for skittles sure yeah yeah there's only so much to say you know right yeah it's like um the plant is cool but it also sucks you know what I mean and so I mean I'll be honest with you in many ways the plant was really just a foil for us to talk about looking at traits and what yeah from looking at traits like that's really I think my what I cared about more than anything yeah yeah now honestly that's kind of where I'm at too is like I've been really getting into like visualization of data and like looking at the inheritance rates of these things and like trying to quantify it and make like visual aids to like assist my own work with it and so it's been really fun because it's been a challenge you know what I mean and which is forcing me outside of the box of where I would normally hang out like I was never really a data guy I was always like breeding and selecting plants on instinct and my little handwritten note like it's given me an opportunity to like really expand the toolbox to more like analytics yeah that's cool you know me and local have been talking a lot about traits lately privately mostly revolving around super skunk the different looks of it you know I talk a lot about like privately not even privately like on the server about the dog tongue traits inside of super skunk and and I've given examples of it I think there's probably examples of it in another episode even is that like the single bladed leaf yeah the little it's like a little leaf that looks like a little dog's tongue but it's absolutely it's rounded and that's a very specific point to it because there's a lot of stuff that has those little pointing leaves you know yeah yeah but no I that's what I look for in like as a sour trait you know exactly and that's in it's in Giesel it's in it's in p91 it's in clockwork orange it's in it's it what I've come to realize over all this just by observing not just that trait there's other traits inside a super skunk that I don't really talk about much that I've talked about to local that I kind of keep back because I I don't like other people using those traits against the plant if that makes sense well yeah you'll see it on a stringly listing tomorrow exactly exactly like look it has this trait and it won't and I'll be pissed so but the one thing I've learned is I think just because of looking at traits and nothing but traits I do think that and this goes along with what Neville said one of his highest selling seeds ever was super skunk and it looks like super skunk proliferated in the early 90s throughout the United States and a lot of different groups picked it up ran with it found their specific cut and it became like a local legend in a lot of different places uh under different names and a lot of the the history on it's gone like the history on p91 is just so obscure but the one thing that you can follow is traits and traits just don't lie they really don't I mean there come be times where like um maybe a trait isn't just standard to one line you know what I mean and that can pop up and be like oh shit well that means nothing to me then it's just another data point I guess I was wrong but in this one I haven't really seen that specific trait and it's not just the dog tongue it's how it's the pattern of that's laid out on the bud specifically that that denotes the super skunk trait for that one yeah so like following traits to me I'm slowly learning over time traits can be a lot more honest than trying to untie people's stories and go back talk to these people get inconsistencies talk to them three years later get more inconsistencies that just leads to you spinning your head but really really understanding traits and breeding traits can take you so much further when you're trying to figure out what stuff is in my opinion yeah does that dog tongue trait appear in the like the original sensei super skunk yeah yep in the original picture a sensei super skunk can see it gotcha sorry dan yeah I was just gonna say I had this thought earlier is that um when you're a newer grower it's like pretty easy to like look at the landscape of like what's available for purchase or like collecting and think that there's this like infinite diversity within the gene pool and like what my experience over the last you know like 10 11 years has told me is that like honestly there's really not you know there's a lot of stories but there's not that many traits and so like I recently saw like an argument on ig about like lemon cherry gelato you know what I mean not like the most desirable plant by any stretch in my opinion um but I did s1 it and I've run through a bunch of hybrids of it and um one thing that popped up at a really low rate was lemon tree the exact like not dead on but like the mouth coat yeah everything I can't it was like the the basement version the the the stanky version you know what I mean like a musty musty version of fucking lemon tree and so like to me I don't give a shit about what any of those dudes on ig we're talking about it being a renamed acai like gelato 47 or like you know being a renamed runs all that and I'm just like bro like it's got lemon tree traits in it like it's not a really high prevalence but like it's it's in there you know what I mean and like it didn't come from out of the blue you know these combinations of traits that give you that expression like they're less common than you would imagine being a newer grower you know what I mean like if you smell lemon tree the chances that there's lemon tree in it regardless of what anyone says like it's probably in there and for me I smell lemon tree and I smell lemon g like that it's like a hard burnt rubber lemon peel that's just offensively lemon yeah it totally just yeah that reminds me of that one so much yeah now that's a whole other clone that's actually taken my interest in the last year or two is that um I've had lemon tree under like four different names yeah but it was all the same exact plant lemonade and all that yeah lemonade is there a big people associated with that one I don't know yeah so um yeah there are people associated with lemon tree one of them is a complete lunatic like anti-semite so and he's the one likes to talk about the most so it's really hard to get the actual back history and know if it's correct but in the end none of them know what it is at all or have any clue so yeah yeah but I've gotten it out of lemonade and lemon tree myself yeah I've got lemonade lemon tree organ lemons and um god it was like a play on lemon tree um uh like maybe it was just lemon trees or something I can't remember the problem it's all been the exact same plant yeah um yeah but honestly I try and stay away from that stuff because it is like really dominant you kind of get the same thing dominant yes yeah the same thing over and over it's definitely not something that I've tried uh you know down here um but I'm a bit scared too based on what you guys say the way I mean some people love it some people really like you some people love it I describe it as picture a lemon coming to life growing legs and a ballsy dick and pissing in your mouth like pure lemon lemon fluorocleaner but not like low g but like just pure like actual cleaner and that's what it's very much like that lemon man pissing in your mouth yeah you can get it to be a little sweeter towards just like a really potent lemon candy but that that cleaner side of it's always kind of there where it's like offensive you're like oh uh but it does let me tell your mouth lemon g is the hard offensive part of that to me like it's just same mouth coding same everything and it's it's one of those where like I know it was super popular in Ohio and I'm like how could people smoke this shit over and over for years it is all lemon it is wild well when all the weed just tasted like burn shit before that they're like yeah it's delicious yeah probably right yeah when we say cleaner in this context like is there any relation to kind of like oh gee soapy like clean oh no totally different no yeah like like like pinesol pungency but like tiny like lemony so like I don't know lemon cleaners are pretty common like gougon and like if any of those like limanine citrus cleaners that's pinesol yeah yeah like a furniture polish and no gee is very furniture policy whereas this is like lemon cleaner like just yeah it's it's got the same pungency of terpenaline but in its own life yeah it's perfect way of putting it yeah and it's not just limanine that makes that because those cuts aren't even that particularly high in limanine yeah like I think today I actually just saw like my first test where I like I saw over one and a half percent limanine and I was like holy shit like that's a fucking lot of limanine like mostly on anything specific um I can't remember off the top of my head I was doing a ton of data entry today and so like I just noticed shit that like is abnormal you know like when a cannabinoid profile like you'll get like a total total THC or like you'll get some cannabinoid total cannabinoid and then total THC and they're all calculated slightly differently and so when there's like large discrepancies between some cannabinoid and total THC like more than 10% of the potency I'll go and kind of like dig in the cannabinoids and be like well where's all that extra percentage coming from because it's got to be something like cbg cbc uh is cbg one percent cbg common to finance stuff or not one percent is very common yeah up to like one and a half or two percent because like cbg is the precursor for a whole strew of cannabinoids right yeah cbd and thc included and so um when the plant is not quite finished you'll see an abnormally high cbg content but for me to notice that like 10 threshold like average difference between those two metrics is like five to seven percent and so when I see like 10 percent or above I'm like oh what the fuck is in there and yeah it's usually cbc and cbg but it's like that's like kind of one of my next avenues is uh trying to get like I have one plant that's like pretty high in cbg but it's also very high in thc and so I can't I haven't quite figured that one out yet because it doesn't like really make sense like that cbg would probably all convert to thc if I ran it long enough like 11 12 weeks but like when you harvest it at nine weeks like it's done and it's like you know loaded with all these accessory cannabinoids and so I'm wondering if I can like if I find another one I'm like oh I'm in the money you know what I mean I can cross these two together maybe it's due to the same kind of like genetic play at work you know what I mean yeah but that's all like guess and check work it's like you just got to find two plants with the same trait and hope that it's for the same reason and crossing together right what happens like that's kind of where I'm at with my with my rosin work you know um because at least it's an easy to test for trait I don't have to do like analytics I can just go wash it real quick and do a test wash you know yeah but um yeah I have no anywhere we're hidden I don't know either anyone just talking about weeds yeah I mean we could probably tie it up whoa is that Dan's household oh he's my little boy letting his his real shrieks out yeah that might be a sign for us to to wrap it up here guys yeah that's fine for the first time in a while we have a one hour episode usually when I know right it ends up just being two hours anyway yeah today two and a half if you have me on telling my bullshit right so I don't know I think we take the we'll take that as an opportunity to have a more chill day is there any last thoughts from any of you local Dan I know sorry local I know you didn't probably didn't have enough like much space in this convo but yeah anything from anyone any shout outs yeah um shout out to our boy here mr mr inspect mr inspect shout out for him showing up to the episode and helping out thanks Caleb he's got pretty pink legs bro I needed him here we might do if he actually ends up being available we can do a follow-up yeah for sure his what he's found yeah yeah yeah Dan hard one man now I got nothing none I mean just like shout out to the homies on the server and I haven't been around much I've just been busy and fucking exhausted now you're fine dude especially after you had you needed a break after that one week where you recorded like three shows as well yeah yeah I've been joining the like the sickie club that we have on our server too or I've just been like not feeling good this week so I think I'm gonna do it too yeah I'm passing off to all of you through the mic yep wipe down those discord voice chats shout out to coma what else do we got local you got shut up local um not this time now shout out to a call of duty shout out to fucking bonbons in your mouth while you're seeing that um I'm eating a payday right now oh it's a payday okay yeah I just ordered in the cart local has this local you go to send me some junk food from over there man for sure bro yeah all right okay it's a good idea actually well they allow that as a customs yeah yeah anything that's kind of like commercially produced and like packaged is fine just like no live biomaterial and nothing that's like open yeah unsealed yeah I'm gonna start thinking up all the greasiest tastiest crap we have how am I gonna get that to you yeah all right everyone all right matt you want to you want to wrap it yeah wrap it up like a sheepskin condom um sorry I just had that picture in my head and had to finish it off um yeah so check out our discord you know that's where we hang out and shoot the shit and act like idiots and have fun um we talk about strange stuff all the time theoretical non theoretical help each other grow help each other grow in life sometimes in many cases um go check out right seeds.com we have lifted seeds which genetics.com I can't remember which one it goes by um but he's on instagram he's carrying a bunch of our dude stuff we also have uh who else do we have uh right seed code europe and maddie booze at Gert by seeds in austria so check all that out and I think I mean if you guys have any comments leave them below um I always like it when the comments get blown up with a lot of people's opinions and uh counter opinions to anything we say it makes it a lot more fun and interactive so yeah please you have new codex entries matt oh yeah there's new codex entries that's right we added f1 derb I'm going to be adding abc soon or did I add it no that's still to be added you had it at the end of though as well yeah and we're going to have some more info on abc soon too which is I mean first there's only a few of us that have chased it you know 15 years plus and we're finally getting to the bottom of some stuff so it's really cool and I'm stoked about that same with headband um yeah we got the headband entry in too that was very interesting yeah one thing was that so this is the end of uh quote-unquote season nine but we I think we've got some exciting stuff lined up for next season yeah um some cool interviews coming amen yeah yeah and no one's even breathing hard yet and with that we thank you uh we'll see you next week thank you everyone for showing up thanks everyone actually we might have a week break maybe we'll see I'll talk to you about it yeah yeah okay all right cheers can't you want to sit at the table with the syndicate check out our patreon and our link tree or description below our merch site is officially live we have all sorts of shirts hoodies and goodies to sort you out and shipping is super fast and most importantly the quality is top-notch I've been saving old designs for years for this purpose so please check it out syndicategear.com we also have an underground syndicate discord where we get together and solve old strain history together daily it's an amazing community of learning away from IG and it's an amazing resource for old catalogs and knowledge we hope you join our union of breeders and growers come check it out