 Thanks for staying with us. Carrier transitions are like onions, they are complex and there is usually a lot more to them than we see on the surface. Whether you are pursuing a passion or a side hustle, confused about quitting your job for a new one or just looking for a change, know that it's not a straightforward decision. It requires careful planning and thinking through the way, the why, the what and the when. So what are the things you should take note of when you are planning to transition in your career? Please let's hear what you have to say. Remember you can join the conversation, send us an SMS or WhatsApp to 0818 0384663, tweet us at WayshowAfrica1 with the hashtag Wayshow. So this is a playback to last week. What was the one thing that you took away from our conversation last week? Yeah so not to be afraid to make that change when necessary, although that has always been my mantra. I'm not afraid to do anything. I don't know where I get that guts from but if I set my mind to it and I say I want to do it, I definitely get it. I think that she talked about people who, so the involuntary part of transitioning, saying you lose your job, it takes on average nine to sixteen months to be able to find a new job and of course the focus last week was on the financial aspect of it and what you need to do and how much you need to put away to be able to do this but I'm interested because today we're looking at all the other aspects of transitioning, like we said the why, the what and the when and to try and learn as much as we can because you know for me when it comes to transition I'm just thinking we have, what's it called now, technology. A lot of jobs today in another five, ten years they won't exist. Technology would have taken over those jobs. We've seen even as we you know we currently are, even from the time of COVID, there are some things that just occupations that don't exist anymore because they're now obsolete, they're redundant. So even if you're not thinking about career transitioning, the topic today is so important because this is information that you can store in the back of your mind somewhere and if you happen to find yourself in that situation whether it's an involuntary or voluntary, you start to think about what the options are even trying to identify new careers. I mean when you talk to young people today they're not thinking doctor, lawyer, you hear things like influencer, content creator and you're like my goodness you know so imagine you know a 50-year-old person or you know someone who's just retired thinking what is my next move. I spoke to my old boss today and he said oh he retires in September and my initial sort of you know oh excitement congratulations and then I realized that the twinge of his voice he sounded a little like maybe it's not such a great thing. So topics like this just help our viewers to understand that look in every situation like you said don't be afraid to take the chances and we'll see but I'm looking forward to bringing our guests back. She's a friend of the house. Vamele is the chief executive officer of Heserd Consulting which is a coaching and consulting firm specializing in commerce acceleration, career coaching, women empowerment, facilitation and training on the African continent with presence in Nigeria, South Africa, Botswana, Kenya, the United States of America, Rwanda and affiliates in Namibia, Ghana and Uganda. She has coached in multinationals such as Google, Apsa, Investec, Private Bank, Silica, FNB, Vodacom and Anglo-American. She joins us today via Zoom. Hello Vamele. Good evening. Good evening ladies, how are you? Thank you for joining us. We're doing great. Lovely to have you again one week later. Still looking radiant. Good to be back. Awesome, awesome. So you probably heard our banter as we were coming in. And like we said, you kind of gave us some insights last week around what to think about financially when you want to consider a career transition. But we want to sort of look at our options now really on the broader aspect. You know, if you're thinking about the financial aspect, you probably started to think about career transitioning. But we sort of want to wind it back a little bit and say, you know what, what are the top three things or the three categories that we're talking about today? Which is why do you want the change? What do you want to do? And when do you want to make the change? So I'm going to start off with the why and have you talk about or build on some of the things we talked on last week about the why. Why should you be considering a career transition? So there are a number of reasons why people have to consider the why I suppose. And it's underpins everything that we do. Sometimes the why is for a sense of purpose. Sometimes the why is aligned to a career strategy. Sometimes the why goes back to what we spoke about last week, it being voluntary and involuntary. Reasons for you having to transition. So you understanding your why also makes it very clear where you have to transition to. So your why is absolutely critical because your why will also determine the where and the when. When we when we talk about why, I know we talked about like you said the involuntary, the voluntary, just to expand on that because I think we talked about having a toxic culture. What other kinds of things really could be triggers for people when they're thinking about the why? Often when people are thinking about the why, it's one of two drivers. It's short-term or long-term. So short-term is that I cannot handle my boss. I'm very, very frustrated. I'm not stimulated at work. It's just increased season and I don't feel valued at work. So it's very short-term. Something's happened and triggered you to now consider wanting to leave this particular organization. So that's short-term. Then also the why can also go into the long-term. Where we're looking at in essence, I chose to be in this organization for a third period. I may have overstayed my welcome. I told myself I'd be here for three years. I'm now in year five and I'm ready for that next challenge. Or it could be a case of according to my career strategy, the why is now. Now is the next move because of my career strategy. Also from a long-term perspective, it could be from a family perspective. I've been talking to lots of clients wanting to emigrate. Saying they're no longer wanting to be on the continent. They're looking at going to the UK. They're looking at going to the US. You know the jeopardy phenomenon that's happening in Nigeria. It's actually happening quite a lot across the continent. So looking at that short-term and that long-term helps you determine how you maneuver as well. Because if it's that I've just had an awful fight with my boss, it's a very short-term and it's a very active approach. Whilst I'm looking at not just from a short-term perspective, but a long-term perspective is a more strategic way to really approach your why. Okay, thank you very much. So I know that some people get bored, right? So it's not that they're not passionate about what it is that they're doing. So they're in a particular industry, but then after a while they just find out that their body, whatever it is they're doing at that time and then they start to consider transitioning careers or switching careers and maybe not necessarily moving to another organization that is doing the same thing. Now I'm talking about moving to another organization that is doing something entirely different from what they're used to because they're looking for a challenge. They're looking to do something that is more interesting now. So what do you think people should consider if they start to feel that way? I think when you have boredom in your workplace you have a gift because what that means is you're at a place where you're peaking or some people feel like they're plateauing in the value they're able to give. But what that does mean is that you'd now have capacity to do something else with your time. I always say before you sign their resignation later, is there a master's degree you want to do? Is there a doctor's that you want to do? If work is not giving you that stimulation, can you get that stimulation elsewhere? Is there a trading cause that you've been putting off? Perhaps you're in the financial services sector and you've been putting off doing your CFA level one or perhaps you are in the marketing sector and you've been putting off joining the marketing association and becoming a CM, a chief marketer. All of that are things you now have the capacity to do. So boredom allows you to focus on both education as well as continued professional development because you don't have the pressure of having to perform at a certain level of work because you're no longer seeking that stimulation solely from work. So before going outside of your industry or outside of your organization think, is this an opportunity for me to actually pivot and take my work to that next level leveraging learning and development? Excellent. So before we pivot into the what in terms of what do you want to do, I want to ask, so I was reading the story about Jeff Bezos of Amazon and how he made the transition. So he had a really good job working for a successful hedge fund and he went to his boss one day and said, I want to start selling books on the internet. I want to start selling books online. He thought the internet was a great opportunity and his boss took him out for two hours to have a conversation and say, you know, what do you think? Tell me about this. But his boss was supportive. So what would you say? Because when we start to talk about what you want to do when people are thinking about this, some people will think, or what will people think? So what are your thoughts around how people should handle the situation if they don't get the support that they're expecting from important people around them to make the change? I think when you don't get that support, it becomes important that you in essence create a new support structure. So people support you from the realm of reality. I recall, you know, leaving a senior executive role in the telecommunications firm and going home and speaking to my mom and dad and saying, I'm going to be a coach and they were very confused. They're like, you don't even play soccer. What are you talking about? But they were speaking from their frame of reference. So I had to then say, where can I get that support? And I spoke to people who built coaching firms, who built consulting firms, and they became my support structure during the transition. So if you don't get the support in the issue of the bad from the people you typically rely on, you need to get comfortable knowing that there is no gap, that you can fill that gap that supports structure with new people who have the expertise, who can support you in their transition. Specifically for their transition as a strategic one. Okay. A new support structure definitely is a key one to take from there. Now, you knew what you wanted to do. You wanted to be a coach. What about the people who have no clue what they want to do? Where did they start? So if you have no clue where you want to do what you're wanting to do, the first step is finding out where are you? What do you enjoy about your current employment? What do you not enjoy about your current employment? There are lots of techniques that we use in helping and supporting people delve into what works for them. What are they passionate about? What are they good at? What do people compliment them on? What do they actually want to spend their time doing? That we delve into your personality test, we look at your values, we look at your past history of enjoyment, we look at even things like your childhood inspirations. I love it this now because as a kid I used to put all my dolls together and want to teach them. So coaching is a different form of teaching but that's exactly what I do. That inspiration that I enjoy as a child carries through. So sometimes stripping away the layers of what society has dictated to us to go back to what's in our essence core in our desires is a good indicator. It starts pointing us in the right direction of the place we should be investigating if we are to sort of transition our careers that should be passion-based. Thank you. So I was going to ask how can you tell if what you actually want to do is change careers or just get a new job? You know there are two different things right so some people want to switch careers totally and some people want to move to a new job doing the same thing they were doing in whatever organization it is doing for them. How can you tell what exactly it is you want to do? That's a great point because when we look at career transitions there are a number of different types of transitions. The first is from organization, no the first is from department to department where you stay within the same organization, you love the culture, you love the people, you're probably in finance and you now want to move to sales for example. So that's a career transition within itself but within the same organization. Then you have I love what I do but I'm unhappy in this organization and I want expertise from another organization. So let's say you are a marketeer, you work at one order firm and now you're going to work at another order firm that is an inter-organizational inter-industry transfer. So same same job different organizations. Then we've got different industries where you might find yourself in the fast moving consumer goods industry and you're wanting to go into the financial services industry. So you might still be an accountant but now in a completely different industry. Then you've got the ultimate career transition where you're saying different organization, different industry and completely different style of job where you're transitioning like I did from the financial services sector into telecommunications from telecommunications into the into the human capital consulting sector where I'm doing something completely and utterly different. The reason for those transitions are very very different. So you need to go back to say okay I love what I love the organization but I'm frustrated in the role that I do. So I'm happy to stay here leverage what I know and then do that inter-organizational transfer. Or it's a case of I've learned as much as I can in this particular organization. This culture is no longer serving me. I'm feeling a little bit stuck and I feel I can be grown and stretched still mastering this particular discipline in another organization. Then you say I'm staying in the industry but I'm going to take my expertise to another organization. Then of course we've got now where we're saying actually even the industry for me is not what I'm looking for and this happens a lot as different industries look for different expertise. We're seeing trends right now what we're in the financial services sector. There's been a massive drive for people in the arts and people in engineering for the school of thoughts where typically it used to be commerce that was required. So that's a little bit of a different thing where you're now being recruited into a different industry and then of course the ultimate is to say I've got the expertise I've worked in this particular organization in this particular industry for several years and I just want to complete an utter disruption and that for me is usually the the career transition that most people really battle with. Excellent. So I want to talk about thinking about myself as a hiring manager and having someone who wants to transition careers sit in front of me. Now I remember you talking about you even mentioned it today getting a master's getting certifications but I find that the further you get away from having been in academia like in university right and the more you work your your work experience becomes a lot more important and a lot more relevant. Now if I'm making what you've called the ultimate change so I'm changing you know industry I'm changing you know all of that how do I convince hiring managers sitting across the table from me to pick me over someone else who has experience in the industry when I'm trying to transition. The best thing to do is to really sell your ability to solve the problem they're solving for. Every time you're in front of a hiring manager every time in front of an HR executive or someone who's looking to fill a role there's a problem in their organization that they are looking for you to solve. Your ability to understand and comprehend that problem is the first key. The second is then saying why your current experience is the best answer and often a lot of us actually don't even start applying because we're like I don't have experience in that and experience isn't always the best solution so what do I mean. I mentioned moving from financial services sake tipping and you know head of executive and operations to running strategy and utility communications company and the first thing I was able to say in essence was you are starting to get regulated that's never happened you've never been as regulated as you as you've been in the past year in your industry. I come from an industry that's been regulated for hundreds of years I understand how to respond to regulation so yes you can pick someone from telecommunications who knows the lay of the land but is also responding and not really knowing what to do in solving this problem. This is a problem I've solved over and over again in my industry. Let me give my expertise to help you solve it so your ability to position yourself as the best choice in the long term makes sense. So I think for me our understanding of the expertise we bring to the table and our ability to answer the why for the hiring manager the why for the HR executive will often supersede not having had experience of that sector if you can prove your ability in your track record to solve that particular problem. Quite profound I was just going to ask that same question because so let me use myself as an example so right now I do business development for real estate right and just two days ago someone sent me a message oh hi Chinayla so my friend's looking to hire a business development manager for a fintech and I stepped back for a you know I saw all of the he sends me all the details the offer and I'm like interesting but guess what I've never worked in fintech so I don't even know what the finance space is I've never had any experience with finance at all and I was like I'm not sure if I can if I should apply for this because I don't have any experience with fintech and then from the requirement it says at least three years experience in the finance or fintech space. Now Vumile how do I go and this is first-hand question now how do I go about this what what would you advise what do you think I should do? So I love that question because also when we see a jobspeak we must realize that a jobspeak is a company's dream guy we all know right in our dream world we want someone who looks like Idris Alba has Damgote's money but is like so sweet and caring like it could be your brother this is your dream guy and then you're going to go and just date a simple chuku like he's just like he's just a guy we settle and the same is true for organizations that jobspeak is their dream candidate but hiring managers are very much aware that what they are seeking will they will not get a hundred percent of so what you do is then you break down the jobspeak of this jobspeak what do you mean what do you mean and what's always an interesting statistic is how men and women view it a little bit differently typically a man will see 40 to 65 percent and say I'm good enough to apply a woman will only apply typically if she meets a minimum of 80 percent of the criteria so the first is being kind to yourself and knowing I am not going to be the Idris Damgote person I can probably get 40 to 60 percent of this right but what is the core functionality can I answer the core functionality am I a great salesperson yes I am do I have any engagement with finance yes I do I've worked with the bank before I've been a customer so I understand the experience am I engaging and interested in tech yes I am I'm always on my phone and I actually read a few tech magazines that I know what some of the trends that are coming so I've got a bit of an understanding then of course the research component is then deep diving into understanding the organization understanding the space and then understanding where are the shortcomings and a lot of us underestimate the ability to ask simple questions that will shift how an organization behaves so I remember coming into telco I used to ask why do we do that and all of a sudden people like actually we've always just done that historically and that can we change it and things changed like that so you cannot underestimate the value you bring to the table and also another thing remember you used to be a teacher right so you understand how young people are working that's the target audience you had years engaging the target audience bring that as an advantage as opposed to actually I've never I didn't work in commerce in that time as opposed to I was engaging your target audience I know how they think I get they psyche so from a customer user experience this is some of the things I potentially could add thank you very much women that's such a nice fresh perspective so when we started the conversation today and with our quote we were talking about dreaming big and I love the example that you just used about Idris Elba slash dangote so a lot of people in that scenario can spend their whole lives waiting for the Idris Elba slash dangote so what is there a way or should I not say is there a way what should people be assessing and thinking about is there any transition that is too big is me sitting here thinking I'm going to be the next Beyonce is it realistic should I be thinking that big from a career so is there some way to sort of assess wow is this realistic or is this something that I might do long term short I mean should there be any limitations when you're thinking career transition I think there should be no limitations but they should be a very healthy dose of realism so if you're wanting to transition to a particular industry you have to see the trends within that industry right so I was watching actually an interview with Ashake who I love right and if we had had that conversation 20 30 years ago about him being in Good Morning America speaking about Afro beats it would have seemed 30 years ago not quite feasible but the trends in the industry in the past five years indicated that his ability to be more successful were higher so analyze your industry analyze it from a 10 year trajectory to a five year to a three year to one year what are the trends if you know that to be the CEO of a top 400 company you're going to need a master's degree you might want to start with the master's degree before saying you want to be the CEO so looking at the trends and the requirements becomes important me saying I want to be a brain surgeon there has been no brain surgeon who has not completed the undergraduate degree in medicine so me saying as an accountant background I'm going to all of a sudden do surgery that trend does not exist so you need to study the industry you're wanting to enter into there are some anomalies but the chances of you being the anomaly is often very much vested on your talent very much vested on your networks so if you don't necessarily have that then the likelihood of you being anomaly is just simply not realistic interesting so dream big but be realistic and get some information okay so I think we can start to talk about the when so we sort of picked apart the why and the what now when will the change happen I had a very interesting conversation with a colleague many years ago where he said he had what he called a no matter what date so on that date he was going to quit his goal was to become a CEO and on this part of his journey was getting the experience he was getting at our current job and then that no matter what date no matter what happened on that date he would quit because this part of the cycle was done so what are the things that really start to bring us to that point of knowing the when beyond just being financially ready so I think self-assessment becomes critical the the skills gap the knowledge gap the experience gap the network gap all of that determines the when so from where you are to it is that you're wanting to be and the requirements to get there that will determine your when and that will be based on your research I spoke about looking at your industry I didn't also speak about looking at yourself and assessing yourself to then determine that so if you know okay you want you to be CEO I know I knew at 30 that I was going to want to run my own business but there were things that needed to exist I needed to collect the networks I needed to become known in particular industries I needed to travel a lot of the continent because I wanted to run a pan-african business I needed to study in the UK needed to have experience in the Americas so all of that could not happen in the three-year period giving myself a decade to do it and I love the saying that says we often overestimate how much we can do in a year but very much underestimate how much we can do in a decade so I tend to plan my lives in decades because I can fill them in so looking and saying okay that decade is how long I'm giving myself to get the networks get the finances make sure that all the all the academic requirements are made make sure that all the skill requirements are made all of that will determine when because you can be you can have you can have the why you can have the you know what it is that you wanted to do but if you are not giving yourself enough time it simply is not going to happen and of course a dream that's just you know just to wish it becomes just to wish if you don't have enough time in order to realize it I think we've packed so much into the conversation so far so we're going to take a quick break and we'll be right back to continue the conversation stay with us if you're just tuned in you've missed quite a bit as we're discussing the topic planning career transitions with Vamile Imsweli please hear let's hear what you have to say remember you can join the conversation send us an sms or whatsapp to 0818 038 4663 tweet at us at waishio africa one with the hashtag waishio so do you have a question okay so um we're talking about when right so um why when okay so my question is you know I've asked about how okay I know that's now I want to move I'm probably doing something um let me use an example of being in the finance sector now this thing this thing about my own finance sector recently I don't know what it is but you have any plans and then I know okay you know what I think I want to do entertainment and oh I want to do media and I don't have um any experience so to speak in the media or the entertainment industry but I know that that's something I enjoy I will enjoy doing because I have never tried it but then it's something that I think I'll enjoy doing I sometimes imagine myself in the bathroom and then I have all these really cute dreams and you know big dreams like we said I know that that's that's a a a nudge for me to know okay you know what you maybe the next thing you should start doing is find places that you can put in that energy you know on the side even if you're still doing your regular nine to five or whatever else it is that I'm doing on the side but at the same time in some of these industries people would then say like Utsi rightly said earlier experience they would ask you okay so what have you done before where have you been what give us some people who haven't got as far as asking for a portfolio you know and things like that when you are faced with such situations I mean what do you do how do you navigate such such situations a lot of them you get the experience right so no one and I this was a I love that example because it's very practical to me I thought I would be so good on radio and that'd be great I could do this it was like oh we love your voice you should do radio but when I approach some of the big radio stations they weren't interested they're like where's your demo let's hear what else have you what have you done so what I did is in essence I went to a university radio station and I volunteered to read the news and I did that for several months and then I said can I actually now have a bit of my own business show and I took that over for a couple of months so by the time some of the biggest radio stations in Botswana in Nigeria and South Africa that I now am on I had a portfolio of evidence because I simply also didn't know the technicalities of radio I didn't know which buttons to press I didn't know how to work with a producer I didn't have any of that and even when approaching some of those big radio stations to begin with I did it completely voluntarily I was like I started producing myself a pitching to a producer she likes some of it and worked with me for a year so by the time I'm saying you need to stop paying me for these services it made sense there's certain things that unfortunately the technical experience you simply cannot do it goes back to the medicine example you can study the theory of medicine so many people have done an undergraduate degree in medicine and a great doctors in theory but still you're not going to allow yourself to go into surgery with someone who's simply never cut before they've got to practice with a cadaver then they've got to be overseen and supervised by a special resident doctor and there's been years doing that and only then are they unleashed in the world to go and have patients on their own so when technique technical competency is required unfortunately you do have to earn your stripes you do have to get comfortable knowing you've either got to volunteer or you've got to build that credibility over time there's some transitions where you can bring previous experience and that can pivot and add value to the next job but there's some where the technical competence is so steep and so so required that you simply could not do the job with your eyes closed without having had that experience so if I hear you correctly Vumele you're saying up your skills right and don't be afraid of volunteering to do so if you have a clear understanding word is that you're wanting to be you need to get comfortable volunteering you know people often see see the success stories not realizing that that success story the foundation was often in not getting paid was often an apprenticeship was often in earning your stripes in order to gain that credibility yeah I love the fact that you shared your radio story it's very similar to mine so people ask me these days oh how is it that you're so you know you just it seems so effortless I'm like I started doing hospital radio when I was 16 I did university radio I went from actually doing university radio to realizing I wanted to DJ I DJed and like I've been all over the shop I think TV was the last bit for me to close that that gap so my open dream I've I've subconsciously been doing the work I'm telling you it's a lot of work that goes into it but I want to touch on something I think that everything we've talked about so far Vumele has been very positive the fact that you know the why you figure out the what you get your funds in place and you know then you go and do it the when happens and it all goes swimmingly but I want us to add a pinch of a pinch of pessimism and realism realism to it not everyone is going to be successful in their career transition if you find yourself in a place where things aren't going as planned what should you do I think having a very honest conversation with yourself sometimes a lot of us overstay our welcome in a career transition because we are holding on to the hope of what could be as as opposed to the reality of what is right so it's similar to it's very similar to entrepreneurship we all know that a minimum minimum of 60 percent of businesses are going to fail yet somehow when we are the ones failing we're refusing to see that this is not this is not working in particular so I think having an honest conversation helps your research is also going to be a great indicator right so you're going to start seeing that the trend state that by year one year two year three this is where you should be in your career this is where you should be in your business and if it's not happening you have to ask yourself is this anomaly because the industry is new or is this anomaly because I'm doing something wrong and understanding that becomes very very important and there's a difference between the data versus how we feel because often I say like I was having this conversation I think a couple of nights ago when I was saying at the dinner table I believe in the rule of three things often take three times longer than what we think they often cost three times more than what we think and when you when you've given it that time period and it's still not working then you must grace graciously accept defeat take the owl learn the lesson and keep it moving because I'm also a big believer in that nothing is ever wasted and I don't know one successful person who says everything I've ever touched was gold they learn more from their failures than their successes and I think that fear of failing sometimes keeps keeps us going as opposed to us accepting the lesson and I think for me we must remember that failure is nothing more than feedback interesting I think that I was going to ask the question on fear but then you've just sort of talked about it because I think fear is the number one reason that a lot of people won't even think about or consider a career transition in this part of the world like you said if it takes nine to 16 months to find a new job then why do I want to give up the one that I have now to then go and do something where I don't have any assurances I don't have any guarantees around what will happen so when we talked about the what we talked about people not knowing what they want to do but then we didn't talk about the sort of side of people who maybe have a side hustle or have a passion how did they sort of make that work to eventually transition so I love it because we call it the gay economy or the shared economy and it's where the world is going we anticipate that by the year 2030 one billion people are going to be part of that economy one billion people can be freelancers and not just employed full time we're already seeing the trends of uber of airbnb where where assets aren't owned but are utilized for a portion so that side economy that that side that side gig the gig economy the shared economy there's definitely a space for it and of course we also know that for you to become very wealthy you need several revenue streams so yes definitely have one but when to know to transition to say actually i've been working at this particular employer my side hustle has actually started generating so much revenue that i potentially should be focusing on it i think for me is a time and energy question do you have time to grow it and if you were to spend your time where would you spend it with your employer or with your side gig the second is the energy piece the energy expended is not just when it's fun and it's your side hustle that you get to escape to it's now having to deal with the reality that is going to be difficult it's going to be challenging it's going to come with things you don't in particular like coaching was my side gig i did it after hours it was so much fun and then i built a business around it and all of a sudden i have to deal with tax i have to deal with admin i've got to deal with managing people um it was not just a fun coaching piece so realizing that your side gig when you decide to get over that fear then becomes a full-time job is also the reality we have to face and then the question of fear and fear for me is not so much fear as it is regret we are afraid of the unknown and that's often because we fear the unknown more than we fear regret and for me i fear regret i fear waking up in front of god and saying oh my goodness i could have done that oh i wish i tried that i'm afraid of that more than i am afraid of the unknown so having to balance that for me becomes important is would you rather have tried or would you rather have never even attempted and also we have to have an honest conversation about the seasons in our life sometimes the seasons in our life don't allow that you know there's a season where for example you have young children the consequences of your actions the ramifications are not just you so it makes the fear more dripple because the ramifications and the stakes are substantially higher so you also then have to decide based on the stakes what would make sense i know when i jumped over and i did my own business i was single i was alone i had properties so the risk so if all else fails i just go back to corporate the risk was substantially lower if you wake me up now and you say vumi would you do the same thing right now because of the season of where i am in my career i would choose stability and something secure over the risk i took of becoming an entrepreneur yeah so the timing is really really critical if i hear you correctly so the same person different timing and different season in life would make different decisions so that's quite powerful time really does fly when you're having fun so we're just about coming towards the end of the show and i'd like to take the rest of the show to sort of have you almost we've talked about a lot in the last two weeks give us a paint by numbers here's a step one you know here's 10 steps you should take when you're looking to transition your career and then tell us i mean you're a coach i'm sure that you've worked with several several clients who are on this journey of career transitioning share with us maybe some of the most interesting things that people have realized along the journey that maybe they didn't think of or didn't expect at the time okay so for me the i guess i'll call them the six steps to consider first self-assessment baseline evaluate your current skills where are you um and what are these skills can i transfer what are these skills and experience do i need to acquire but to get to where it is that i'm wanting to be so that's the first bit but and that is underpinned by the second step which is research research research research look at the trends look at the numbers look at what's required it's going to be important then the practicality of training and education how do i start acquiring the skills how do i acquire the academic qualifications how do i acquire the people i'm going to need which takes me to the fourth step around networking who do i need who should i be speaking to what should i be reading what's the information i need to completely immerse myself in in order to ensure success and what we dealt in a lot is the fifth step last week your finances what is your budget you know that if you are sitting in Nigeria the cup that that a six nine months that it's going to take you to get another job is a reality do you have savings for that do you need to downgrade your lifestyle do you have you planned accordingly financially for that transition and then of course the timeline how long is it going to take realistically and what happens if that timeline isn't met have i thought about the ramifications of having to make that career transition those for me are the things you thoroughly need to investigate and really interrogate in order to use in order for you to have a solid plan for your career transition and when i think about uh i think probably the most interesting career transitions i've held and funny enough both were doctors one was wanting to go into being a makeup artist but didn't want to lose the qualification and we have to go in aesthetics business which thrived and she was one of my favorite clients absolutely thrived and she makeup was a side gig in her passion and she was able to take her nine to five and merge it with a side gig where she literally could you know started doing the metology and also was able to do your makeup in the weekends which was fantastic and it's a business that's really worked well for her the second is a medical doctor who wanted to become a CEO and she had never worked a day in corporate as she thought i could never work with work in corporate i know this is the process when when you're a doctor and i said that's a great thing you understand process you are a doctor which means you thoroughly understand the importance of a bedside manner which is just customer experience you understand systems you've learned to the human body system if you study the system of this particular organization you can probably find out what's wrong quite quickly and all of a sudden she was like i've never thought of it like that she pitched and is now the CEO of in corporate and is doing very very well so don't allow what you don't know to take away what you can bring from a values perspective she didn't know finance and i said you don't need to know finance that's what the chief financial officer is for she was like but i don't understand marketing that's what the chief marketing officer is for you know what it's like you go into theater you've got you're needed to supporting you you've got great nurses you've got aftercare you've got the physio to help you post you know how to lead a team the job of a ceo is to successfully lead a team once that clicked she thrived so i think it's very very important that we're able to do the same thing what's the value that i can bring what's the knowledge of my gaps who can help me fill those gaps in order for me to successfully transition into a career that i'm ready for and in the future excellent thank you so much for me as always it's an amazing time with you on ways we look forward to having you back again to discuss i mean you're so versed you know versatile that you know we could pick any topic and you could probably talk about it so we look forward to having you on the show again thank you so much chinello i've had fun on this tired friday evening for the both of us but looking forward to the weekend and an awesome week next week so before we go please ensure that you follow us on instagram at waste your africa you can interact with us further drop a comment and most importantly follow all our social media media engagements and remember to like share comment and invite your friends and family to watch us and follow us if you miss today's quote here it is again without leaps of imagination or dreaming we lose the excitement of possibilities dreaming after all is a form of planning that's by glorious dynam so we'll see you again on monday at eight p.m as we bring another great conversation to your screen have a good evening