 Look, if you're trying to get in shape, if you're trying to lose weight, be more fit, get stronger. There's one thing you can do that will guarantee results better than anything else. In other words, the most effective thing you can do to help yourself get in shape is the following. Hire a good trainer or coach. Nothing comes close to hiring a good trainer or coach. Nothing at all. So if you're serious about your goals, if you really want to get to those results and you want to keep them, look for a good trainer or coach worth their weight in gold. Is that on the upward trend? Or no. What do you mean? I wonder where we're at right now in terms of people hiring personal trainers. Yeah, like I felt like early 2000s, we went through kind of a boom, at least I felt like online maybe? Just in general, period. Oh, at the gyms. You're right. Well, just period, right? So in early 2000s, there was a big boom. In fact, in the Silicon Valley where we're at, where we started as personal trainers, it was almost like a, I don't know, cliche thing to say, right? Like, I have a personal trainer. Like it became like this. Like an accessory or something. Yeah, yeah. Like it was a cool thing, right? Because the dot-com bubble was exploding and you had a lot of people that were making money fast and that was the rise, I think, of gyms and personal trainer culture and before the fitness industry was labeled as the fitness industry. And so, and then it kind of burst, you know, after like the 07, 08 time. And then since then, it feels like it's been on this slow climb back and so I'm just curious. It's grown year after year. Consistently. Consistently since the mid-90s. You know, I want to be, you know, I want to kind of clarify, by the way, a good trainer or coach is worth their weight in gold. Good being the important word here because not all trainers and coaches are created equal. A bad trainer or coach is going to be a waste of time and money. Might actually set you back. But yeah, it's grown. Yeah, but the judge just pulled up a stat. That's pretty weak. No, you can look up ERSHA. ERSHA will have stats or personal training. What if, do you see what that's how that's written? That's such a flight. That's like in a 10-year period of time. Yeah, a 10-year period of time. So, 1% a year, basically. Yeah, basically. Now, I do remember, because I started in gyms in the late 90s and the revenue that gyms were bringing in for personal training was nothing compared to where it got like within three or four years. Also, the percentage, so we used to, I remember early days too, this is talking about late 90s, early 2000s, we used to keep track. The company used to keep track of what percentage of the population are we penetrating. Yeah. And it was like 4% when I first started. It was such a small number. I believe that's over a quarter now, but I haven't kept up with those stats. I don't know if the industry is growing that fast. Based on what Doug just pulled up, that's not very fast. No. 1% a year is pretty steady, slow and steady. Trainers are getting better though, I will say that. And I wonder if that is referring to just personal trainers in gyms, because now we have the explosion of internet coaches. That didn't exist just 10 years ago. Yeah. I don't even think they call online coaches personal trainers, right? So fitness instructors, what would you call them? Fitness coaches. Yeah. How would you classify all of them? I think they would call them a fitness coach. Yeah. But I mean, it's more people know the value a little bit more now because... You know, it would be a better person to ask or people to talk to is NASM. So talking about how we're looking to be working with NASM in the future and they would be a great, like just to show enrollment, how many people are going, getting certified through the real trends today versus, say, 10 years ago. And I'm pretty sure there's been massive growth for them. Well, like I said, revenue wise, I remember working in a big box gym. That same gym started when I started there in 1997. The goal for the club was $13,000 in revenue a month. That same club, same location and everything, you know, just four or five years later was doing over $100,000. In personal training, gyms started to catch on and see that this was a valuable way to keep members and build value. And I do think it did start to reverse though for a second, because then they got in that kind of price war, right? Where it's like, let's see how cheap we can make our memberships and make it so inexpensive that people keep their membership, but don't show up and we, you know, we profit off that. Nonetheless, like if you're it's getting fit, losing weight, it's complicated. It's challenging. And the data's like proves this. Like if you look at the data, about 90% of people who lose weight gain it back within the first year, people lose weight all the time. So it's not as simple as people think it's very challenging. And you having someone there to guide you along the way, I mean, can you think of, if you, if you had to almost guarantee somebody got fit and healthy, obviously you can't guarantee it, right? Because there's going to be lots of challenges. Is a person going to follow along? Is it going to work for them? What's their lifestyle like, all that stuff? But if you had to, like, okay, if someone said pick the most sure way for these people to get fit and healthy and you could choose any method, it'd be a good trainer code. Nothing comes close. Do you think the space over simplifies or over complicates getting in shape? Oh God, what a great question. I think they try, they think they do both. Okay, good answer. Cause I feel the same way too. I feel like we live at both ends of the spectrum. It's either, you're either one, either one, we over complicate it to, to try and oversell ourselves, right? Like you need me. This is way too difficult. You, you know, it'd be dangerous to do it without me. There's that side. And then there's the oversimplification of just like a calorie to calorie. And as long as you abide by the law through dynamics, you'll be fine. You'll get in shape. Like just go in and do some exercises, make some better food choices. It's easy. I feel like it's, it's both those worlds. I think the oversimplification mainstream is more like. Don't eat carbs or just eat this or just do this new workout plan. And it's going to make you lose weight. The complicated part is that people hear so many of these oversimplified messages. They don't know which one to pick and then they get confused. Well, these people say it's carbs. These people say it's fat. Wait a minute. I'm supposed to go vegan. These people say strength train, but how should I string train? Well, there's CrossFit, there's powerlifting, there's this. But what about cardio? Today's YouTube giveaway is maps and a ball. Like, here's how you can win that. Leave a comment below this video, the first 24 hours that we drop it. Subscribe to the channel and turn on notifications. If you win, we'll let you know in the comments section. Also, we got some new program bundles going on and we discounted them heavily. 300 to 350 dollars off. Check this out. We have a program bundle called the new to weightlifting bundle. We also have a body transformation bundle, a new year extreme intensity bundle and a body transformation bundle 2.0. If you're interested, just click on the link at the top of the description below. All right, back to the show. This is where a coach is so valuable because it needs to be an individualized experience. And this is where, like, yeah, I do think you're going to get both ends of those spectrums otherwise, because you have systems and you have methods that they try to capture big swaths of the population, big groups of people to all kind of funnel them in that direction. Or the other one is just like, oh, it's really simple. You just need to take a few of these, uh, steps and just lower your calories, like eat, eat less and just move more. And it's like, that only goes so far. You know, it reminds me of when I was a kid, uh, I got into martial arts. I thought it was so cool to watch these, like all these martial art movies. And I went to the library and I got books on Kung Fu, Taekwondo, Muay Thai. And I had a cousin who was a black belt in, uh, what was he in karate? And he looked at the books and he laughed at me and he goes, you'll never learn martial arts that way. I'm like, what do you mean? The moves are right there. I should practice the moves in the book. So this is, this is what people, and that's even, uh, and that's kind of a good analogy, right? It's like, um, oh, exercises. I'll just do the exercises or all like, no, no, it's a journey. Think about this way. The way you're living now is the reason why you look and feel the way you look and feel right now in order to look and feel the way you want to. That means the way you have, you live has to change. So 30 pound leaner version of you who's stronger and more fit. Who goes to the gym, let's say three days a week or does all these things. That's not the same person fundamentally, not having a guide help you get a go there dramatically increases the challenge and the difficulty. What person or what client has the hardest time understanding this? What person or what client? What type of, what type of person has the hardest time understanding that? That's a good question. Uh, man generally are tougher. Um, and younger, uh, people tend to have a, they're less likely. I'd say the higher trainer. I mean, I, I agree with that. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's why it's so funny too that most male fitness influencers appeal to other young male influencers. It's a terrible business model. It's very short lived. It's so funny. Cause I, you know, it's like, I want to shake them all and wake them up. It's like, Hey, bro. The, the take your shirt off with the cool hype videos behind you and doing stuff like that. Like, you know, you're only attracting every, all the other 17 to 25 year old guys that don't spend any money, you have to keep doing it to get the new ones coming in all the, all the 75, 17 to 25, don't have any money and don't want to take direction from anybody. You know, that's who you're attracting, right? You know, remember when we used to give away, like, I don't know, it was a five sesh first, like few sessions you give away for free, you know, and then I remember like trying to convince like guys to, well, you know, why don't you just, I know you have your program, your routine that you're doing here, just give it a shot. Like you could not get guys to, to go, you know, and make that step or like commit to that. It was just like, it was, it was always frustrating to me, but then I understood, yeah, it's, it's that age group. And it's, it's like, you have this like idea that you have all these things figured out. Yeah. I mean, men in general, right? We, they know, I think they've done stuff. I mean, so, you know, if they've done studies and stuff on this, I'm like, we just don't ask for direction. No, too. I mean, just, it's, and that's exactly what that is. I mean, that's like, that's no different than pulling over and going to a gas station and picking up a map. That's like emitting, yeah, you can help. Yes. Like, oh, I don't want to miss that. Heaven forbid we do that, right? After, you know, that's totally true. Um, it's definitely more challenging, but I think as people get older, generally, if you look at the, and also the cost of personal training, right, hiring a trainer coach is a lot more expensive than just getting a gym membership or buying a supplement or, you know, trying to follow a diet, you know, plan from the internet or something like that, but so you're going to get an older clientele there asking directions to the other part. But when I talk to people about the cost of training, it's like this. It's like, you're almost guaranteed to fail otherwise. So however much money, and I know people are like, you know, maybe watching and say, no, you know, I've done this before where you're, look where you're at now, you've done it in your back, right? Real success with this means it sticks with you for the rest of your life. Not that you can do it when you do it and then you can't do it for some reason when you go back. It's because what you're really, what you're paying for is education. Education, guidance. Yeah. I mean, that's, that's so invaluable. I mean, when you, when you go through that process, now granted, we're assuming you have a good coach and trainer, right? I mean, because you could hire a bad one. But if you get a good coach and trainer, whether that's five sessions you do with them or 50 sessions with them, it's all education around you understanding better how your metabolism works, what are proper macros for your body? What exercises work or don't work for you? Akes and pains you may have. How to address the next steps. Yeah. Not to take them. Yeah. How to, how to manage intensity, how to, how to prioritize the big rocks like sleep and recovery and other things besides just hammering your body inside the gym. There's so many things that you'll learn going through that process. And what's crazy is that the, the there's definitely a part of this that you're, you know, you want a good trainer to know biomechanics, anatomy, exercise and program design and that kind of stuff. And they'll learn that with good certifications, but there's more than just that, right? You want, you want to work with someone who knows how to coach you along the way because it's Troubleshoot with you. Yeah. So like NCI does a good job with that. They teach their coaches and trainers like how to coach and train people and work with people. Um, you know, we're going to be doing that for a few days for free. Um, or we're going to work with coaches and trainers and teach them the stuff that we saw that really made trainers effective and successful. That's at mind pump trainer.com. If you're a trainer, um, but the stuff that I used to teach trainers and coaches to help them become more successful, it often wasn't the, you know, nuts and bolts of workouts and, you know, macros and stuff like that. It was more about like, how do you guide someone along this path? Cause it's tough. It's tough to make these changes. Behavioral thing. Yeah. Behavioral stuff. Well, the application, I mean, that's what, I mean, you mentioned NCI, I mean, that was one of the things that we always said that was one of our favorite things about Jason and his team was that, I mean, he had a great understanding, uh, on an academic level as far as around nutritionists with that, but he had an even better understanding as a coach on how to apply that information to average people, which is the same journey that we went through as trainers inside the gym is like, it's important to have all that knowledge. Like, obviously you need to be able to answer a lot of these questions that people have and that education is super important, but if you can't get people to adhere to it, or you don't know how to pivot, uh, you know, with all the challenges that you're going to have with every individual, then what's it all worth? Totally. I had, I even would talk to people, uh, or members like this because, you know, hiring a trainer, let's say on average, depending on where you're in the country, you might cost you, I don't know, $60 an hour, let's say. And I would, you know, we would talk about this. And if you got a trainer for six, ten sessions, I mean, it's $600 for some, for a lot of people, that's a little expensive. So I'd say things like this, it'd say, you know, you're going to get way more value out of working with a trainer even once a month for $60, then you will with anything else you can spend $60 on, like think of anything you can spend $60 on for health and fitness, protein powder, nothing pre-workout, nothing comes close to one hour with a good coach or trainer once a month. Now that's not ideal. Ideally, you want to see them weekly. See, I've always found that the psychology around that's so interesting to me is like, how quick we are. I mean, what is the supplement industry? It's a billion, multi-billion dollar industry. It's so crazy how quickly we would, we would buy a powder that is supposed to give us X, Y, or Z. I remember one time, I've told this story before, I was doing body fat tests at one of the clubs I was managing and this woman comes up and I'm testing her body fat. She wanted to lose weight. And I remember I went with, I think the, at the time, because they do that measurements different now, but it was bicep, tricep, subscapula, which is by the shoulder blade and then right above the hip bone. Yeah, we still do those, right? So I'm doing them all and I got to the tricep measurement and the tricep measurement was half of the bicep measurement. That's weird. You guys know that? That never happens. Triceps always more body fat than the bicep. So I did that and I looked at it a few times and I said, that's weird. And she goes, what? And I said, your tricep measurement is leaner than your bicep. I said that never happened. She goes, oh, I had liposuction years ago. Now at this point, she, she was interested in personal training because she needed to lose. I don't remember what it was. It was substantial, 40 or 50 pounds. She had spent, I mean, how much do you think liposuction costs? Tens of thousands. Tens of thousands of dollars. Had she invested that in a good coach or trainer, it, she would have not been in that position. And that's, that's the value that people. I know that place was so, so crazy. It's so, it's so much, it would be easier for me to sell a stack of powders and pills for five or six hundred bucks. And it would be to sell 10 sessions of personal training, which is crazy to think that. And do you think it's because. Maybe one of them, they know that it requires some work. Yes. I just say, I think it has to be, it has to be that, you know, that hiring the trainer is not like, it's not a pill you just take. It's, I'm going to have to put the work in. I'm going to have to show up. I'm going to have to learn. I'm going to have to listen. I'm going to have to apply where it's like, oh, but if you give me this stack of powders and pills, all I have to do is take them. Just take them. I can do that. That's easy, right? And so, isn't that weird how that, how that works? So like how people would, would, would quickly buy or spend five to six hundred bucks on, on a powder and pill that is at best giving you 10% edge. Nothing. There's no supplement. I know. I mean, that's like, I mean, like over exaggerating. If you create a supplement that gives someone 10%, yeah, you'd be a trillion. Isn't that crazy? Like, so 5% at best, right? It's giving you something like that. And yet you, and the value you would get from just 10 sessions with the coach, yet that that's not where people spend their money. You know, it's weird, can, is there, there doesn't even exist a pill that would give somebody 10% that where they would take just a pill and all of a sudden be like, wow, this transformed my body. Steroids. I mean, anabox would be the closest thing, but they don't even do that. Like if you took the average person off the street and they did nothing else, but took steroids, it would have transformed their bodies. No, no, they would still be the same body fat percentage. They probably hold a little water, you know, maybe get a little stronger, but that's about it. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, probably get worse health as a result. Yeah, it's just the work part of that. I mean, people will try any way to find the path of least resistance. You know, it's just like it's human nature. In general, and you really have to fight that sort of urge to, uh, you know, like venture out. And if you really want to change and grow, it requires like a change. Look, if you want to get on this journey of growth, because that's what it is, you want to get on this journey of growth, hire a guide who's done it before and work with other people. That's your best, that's your best bet. I can't, I can't stress how important it is going forward that we, we learn as humans to think more like this, because it's going to get more and more difficult to choose the harder path, right? Like, I mean, we're so close to this AI being here and taking care of so many of the things that are laborious or require you to think a bunch or ponder or challenge yourself. Like, it's weird, dude, really, really weird that this is like around. Soon we're going to get spoon fed by robots, you know, at this point. You know, it's great lift something. What's crazy about this, the data on, on, uh, like happiness and contentment and depression, so it was really clear. You have to have challenge, challenge. Yep. Like things have to be hard. It's so strange, but it's a hundred percent confirmed and true. So like you get these machines to do everything for you. You are going to be deteriorate. You're going to be depressed. That's why one of my favorite sayings is where people say, choose your heart. Right. Like, you get hard no matter what, like you're going to, you're going to suffer no matter what. So best choose it, you know, choose what it's going to be. Yeah, it's hard to get up early in the morning and get your workout in before your day starts or, or it's hard to, you know, sacrifice, eating that juicy meal that you can just drive through, pick up. It's, it's difficult. Like it's difficult to make those choices, but better to choose that hard than the hard that comes from not making those choices and then allowing all that stuff to manifest all these other things inside your body that end up making you ill and now you're fighting this disease. And it's like, you know, it's more, you know, it's even crazier than that though, because people often think of the big chronic diseases. Like, well, if you don't take care of yourself, you get a heart attack or heart disease or cancer, diabetes, all true. That can all happen. But what people don't realize is their day to day. Yeah, dude, is affected with their mood. This is all fact. They're, this, this is all proven by lots of studies. Right. Yeah. Your mood, the way you interpret the world changes. Of course. The highs are not as high. The lows are way lower. If you're uncomfortable in pain, if you're weak, if you're unmotivated, you know, what, how is your mind going to address a lot of these things, these tasks in front of you on a day to day basis? Just don't enjoy life. You're just, you're going to be like, it's going to affect you in a negative. And how sad is, so the sad part is if you've lived your life for a long time this way, you don't know the difference. Yeah. So you might not even know what it feels like. I mean, do you think, do you think it's moving fast enough that we see it in our lifetime where like a lot of this stuff is all completely solved and everybody has pretty much what they want? I mean, everything's taken care of by AI's tools and like the most, most the hardest leading researchers. So like Ray Kurzweil and there's a few others. I don't remember the name. I know his name because he's written a few books. There was like four people that predict like when the great singularity is going to happen, singularity. And they all came, they all averaged out. They all had a range, but the average was 2035. Wow. It's like so close. Yeah, dude. That's around the corner. I mean, it's really, it's the physical. Like I think a lot of the, you know, obviously software and systems and, you know, things that like people are doing for work that requires more thought and like memory and all that stuff is like going to be relevant real fast. Look how close we are to like just food and shelter. Like you, you guys obviously have seen these massive AI tools that can build, build these homes now. Right. I mean, we're 3d printing homes is like around the corner. And they're already, you see all these little miniature houses that are being manufactured for nothing. So have you seen the, there's some cool houses that they're almost literally like Lego blocks. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the one he was showing. Yeah, I sent it. I sent it over to you guys. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was like tripping out like how fun that would have been to like build your own house just like brick by brick almost like just like a leg in the back. Yeah, I mean, I actually, I predict that is what's going to slow them, the housing market up before anything else does, right? So what we'll keep so our current housing prices from not going to $2 million for a house is that you'll offer up those houses will stay expensive like I don't think we'll buy them though. I think companies are going to build them and rent them for cheap. That's what I think. Well, that's, I think that's, that's, I mean, that's a pretty good guess. I don't think they're going to make it be smart. Yeah, there's going to have stuff like that. You have the things that we're doing with genetically modifying food now and we're being able to create meat in a lab before you know it. We're going to be able to AI robots will to have manufacture all this fake food that will be able to, and which, by the way, for people that are starving in certain places in the world, I think it's amazing. That's amazing. But in places like here, like we don't have a food problem. Well, you have a food problem, but it's not. But I mean, like, so those are two big things. Food shelter is going to be handled for a majority of people for relatively inexpensive or not. Do you know what, though? I'll tell you this, the 20th century, the back half of the 20th century, we lifted more people out of poverty in that during that back half than we ever did in the rest of human history. OK, so and we are rapidly moving towards there being essentially no poverty on earth. I mean, we're moving. That's what that is. But the big problem you can house everybody and feed everybody for virtually no cost. But here's what people aren't paying attention to because that is obviously terrible, right? You see someone who's generally like they in a place a part of the world that's maybe war torn or super impoverished, like that's terrible. That is going to we're on the road to eradicating that worldwide. What we aren't paying attention to is the rise, the explosion of chronic illnesses, including mental illness, depression and anxiety exploding at crazy rates in developed in the developed world. It's insane. And then, you know, like these other chronic diseases that, like I mentioned earlier, cancers and diabetes and heart disease and stuff like that. But the mental illness, mental illness piece is going to be such a big. Well, that's the that's to choose your heart. That's your purpose. That's your challenge, right? That's part of what gives you meaning is having challenge in your life and overcoming that, not having that. It could be torturous. Yeah, well, this is kind of like, I mean, we did sort of address the bigger sphere, the bigger vision of this when we were at ARC and I know that that's kind of their mission. But I do think more people need to think in that direction of like, how can we create like a more of a positive outlook on, you know, a lot of these things that are just happening so quickly in these innovations and we're literally, you know, at the cusp of a completely new looking civilization, you know, and that's that's really close with this whole AI explosion and just the way that like, you know, our world shrinking, you know what? It's funny about that, because when you have like this rapid innovation, what tends to happen is we forget the value of certain old customs and traditions and wisdom. And so this is where a lot of, in my opinion, a lot of the anxieties and depression come from because we forget all those things because now we can solve big problems like food and shelter. The moral and the ethical issues, I think need to be more on the forefront. They've been so left behind. The old spiritual practices have lasted for thousands are just as relevant today as they were back then at helping people have, you know, meaning in their life. But what you just talked about reminded me of the front after the French Revolution, I just read this the other day. So French Revolution happens. They get rid of the monarchs, right? They kill them and they're like, it's a new world. We're going to run it with science and reason and we're going to, we're going to just change everything. Right. They changed. So what's our, our calendar is called a what Gregorian calendar? Am I saying that right? I believe so. Yes. They said, this is irrational. Let's create a new one. And they changed minutes instead of being 60 seconds, being a hundred seconds, and they changed how much, how many minutes were in an hour. So it was all balanced. Like they had physicists and scientists create new calendars, new clocks. It was a 10 day work week. They said, this is much more, this is superior. You should kept the Mayan calendar. You got to, yeah, you got to look the sub, Doug, look up. I didn't know that was a thing. French Revolution clocks or, or, you know, after they changed from the Gregorian. Anyway, it was a huge disaster because people were just confused. They couldn't trade with a country that was just a total, like a, like a wonderful example of arrogance where we're just like, yeah, we're, we got something better. This is the better way. Yeah. Everybody's like, I didn't know that was a thing. Yeah. I was after the French Revolution. You can look up pictures. How long did that last? Oh, well, then Napoleon came and switched everything back. Right. There it is. 1793. 10 hour day, 100 minutes per hour, 100 seconds per minute. Yeah. And they wanted, they wanted to make everything equal and balanced. This is the root of Marxism, by the way, was during the French Revolution. These were the philosophy. Oh, wow. So they changed, they changed the names of the, of the days because they don't want anybody to be religious. So Sunday's no longer Sunday. And, you know, I didn't know about that. Yeah, dude. And they wanted to get rid of the months because now Christmas is not being celebrated. Dude, I read this whole article. It's so wild. Interesting. Look up the days. What did they name the days? So how long did you say it lasted? How long they did it? You said 1793. Good question. Or was that when Napoleon came in? Napoleon came and then changed everything back. And I don't know when that happened. I know. Yeah. I was actually reading a little, I don't know a lot about him, but pretty fascinating. I was reading a... Super interesting. Yeah, they just came out with that movie. The autumn months were given, we see different names than the winter months were changed. They changed everything. Wow. They reinvented society to be more... I mean, do you feel like we're kind of doing that with all the work week stuff that they're trying to do and stuff right now or they're trying to do like a three or a four day work week? Well, that's fine. It would be weird though, if they said all of a sudden... No more Sunday. There were six months of the year. Every month has 30, 60 days or stuff like that would be all weird. Yeah. You know? Yeah, imagine how much that changes everything. I heard my brain to think about that. Yeah. 10 hour days, like 100 minutes. Like, huh? Oh, yeah. What time is it right now? 1705, you know? Your brain might like actually like process things differently. Yeah, it would be weird. Pretty interesting. Oh, dude, I gotta tell you guys something else I read. This is crazy. So, okay, you guys know I'm off cannabis, right? So, off cannabis and because of this, I was reading up on like what do people notice afterwards and this, that and the other, and then I pulled up a study which actually gave me some encouragement. Trip off this. They tested and we're about to do a heavy metals test. That's what reminded me of it. So we're about to send in a heavy metals test. Oh, I saw that you sent this over. I saw this. Did you see this? Yeah, I saw this. Bro, they tested cannabis users against non-cannabis users and consistently cannabis users had higher heavy metals. Really? Because cannabis absorbs... Extracts it from the soil? The soil and growers often use like pesticides and herbicides and that have... Oh, man. Now, I wonder how much that is in like if you were somebody who smokes a lot of outdoor versus indoor weed because if... Like is it different? Oh, yeah, of course. No, no, no, I mean, do you think that heavy metals would be different? I would think so because you're less control outdoors. Well, there's no, there's no, they don't use soil indoor, right? Well, when you, when you, when you grow into, well, there's a couple ways you can grow into or you can do hydroponics. Hydroponics, yeah. So you got no soil right there. That probably has no heavy metals. Right, and then, or you could do soil, but this is like manufactured soil. This is like, I would imagine if you have it in a bag that you purchase it from the growth, I would think that that's part of what you're buying some of the cleanest, purest soil you can get. I would guess, you know, I would guess if you measured that soil. Well, these were... But I would think out in the middle of nowhere where a lot of these people are growing where there's... I mean, that's a good question, but that's crazy, right? Because apparently the plant itself, because then I read about it, it's like a... I mean, it's one of the things it does, is it sucks up all the heavy metals. Yeah, yeah. So now imagine this, somebody with anxiety or pain, they're like, oh, I should use cannabis for it. And they get some relief, but then they start to build up toxic metals in their body. They get more, sometimes they use more cannabis, get more... Not know. It's a vicious cycle. Oh, my God. Yeah, I would love to see more, more information around that, right? Because there's also a big movement in the cannabis space, too, of growing organic... Having organic soil, organic... Because then there's the other side, too, right? Especially in the black market, it's like, you know, it's all about yield, right? And strength. And so a lot of chemicals are used for that. Well, trip off this, remember the protein powder study that was years ago where they looked at the protein powders to see in that the organic proteins were the highest. Because organic pesticides, the ones that are higher in heavy metals. So both, that's the thing, too, because cannabis has been touted as medicine at this point, right? And to be fighting a lot of autoimmune issues, while you're ingesting more heavy metals is not good. We all did a heavy... How long ago was that we did that one heavy metals test? Over a year. Yeah, over a year. Oh, yeah, we had, like, mercury. All of us had... It was an alarming, but we all had mercury in our... It was the one thing we all had in common, which made us do, like, what are we all drinking, eating or doing the same, exactly, which is the studio, right? Yeah, and we thought it might be the studio lights or whatever, and so we have this, like, air filter. So we'll see what happens. Maybe it's weed. That's dude, bro! Yeah, we all smoke. Wait, who had the highest heavy metal? I didn't. I've been eating them, dude. I don't smoke, so... I definitely didn't have the highest on that test. I remember that test. I think eating would give you more. Probably. No! I mean, I definitely feel like everything else we do as humans, like, we over-corrected on that, right? Like, it was like marijuana is, like, your brain on drugs. You know, it's gonna kill you. It's, like, so bad, you know? And, like, you know, demonize it so bad. It cures everything. Yeah, yeah, now it cures everything. It cures everything. It's the medicine for everyone. And now they're like, eh, wait a minute. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We over-sold it, we over-sold it. Organic always, you know, and then, oh, whoops. Those of you that developed schizophrenia, maybe it was... Maybe not a good idea. My bad. Dude, I gotta tell you guys a hilarious story at one of our family parties. So, um... Over the whole day or what? Yeah, over the whole day, right? We had a big family party and... So, in my, in our culture, it's rude not to kiss, like, people when they ask for a kiss, especially older people, okay? So, like, grandma, uncle, aunt, they go to a little kid. Is this the two-cheek, you know, hello? Well, that's the hello, but for little kids, even. So, they'll go up to a little kid who's two or three. Come here, give me a kiss. And the kid goes, no, and then you like, go give him a kiss, right? Let him kiss you, okay? Now, I grew up that way, so I didn't see anything weird with it. But as I got older, I was like, hmm... I don't know if that's a good thing, like... Yeah, it's not letting me choose. Yeah, you should, like, a kid should learn that it's like they own their body, that they should not be, like, adults should have authority to force them to kiss. Like, that's how weird shit happens when no one's looking. Like, they should learn respect and say hi and all that stuff. But if they say no, it's their body, they should learn that they have that power. That way, they're not, you know, it's hard to mess with these kids or take advantage of them. So, you know, with our little ones, that's what we say. Look, if you don't want to kiss somebody, you don't have to, okay? Well, the older people in my family don't get it. Yeah. So they'll try and convince and make them feel guilty. And we tell them, don't do that because that's what a predator would do. A predator would play the same game. Convince them with candy or make them feel guilty. What's the matter? You don't like me? It's like, that's not okay, either. Because that's exactly what they would do. But they don't get it, especially my... the really, really older people in my family. So my grandma, we don't... I mean, I could try to explain it. It's a pretty waste of time, whatever. So she always asks, you know, my kid says no. He walks away. She gets upset. And I change the subject. And the more she tries, the more he's going to say no. Of course. Because he's a kid. He's a little kid. And he's learned now that he owns his body. And that's okay. At some point, he'll get older and realize, like, we're safe. Of course. So we went to a family party. And my grandma does this thing sometimes where she slips kid's money. So she'll give you, like, a 10. It sounds hilarious because we piece of salt together. Like, what's going on? Like, what are you teaching these kids? But she did this to me. My great-grandmother did this to me. It's just a... it's an Italian thing. So the little kids come up and she goes, come here, come here, come here. She gives him, like, a five or a 10, right? So she gives my three-year-old a 10. She goes, come here, come here. She goes, give me a kiss. And he goes, no, no, no. And he goes, I don't want to give you a kiss. I say, you don't have to kiss if you don't want to. So she goes, it's okay. Come here, come here. So she gives him the money. He takes the 10. She goes, okay, okay, give me a kiss. And he looks at her, and he gives her the money back and walks to it. I didn't fall for that. I was dying! And I was very... Hey, I ran around... I didn't let her see me. I ran around the corner. Good job. Yeah, good. Good boy. You don't let people convince you if you don't want to. Okay? It's okay to kiss people. It's also okay not to kiss people. Oh, yeah. He literally gave it back to her and walked away. I was dying. She was so mad. That's for a lot of those old things, too. Like, in, like, clean your plate. Like, eat the whole plate. Like, you have to sit there forever in torment. Over, like, I would just obsess about, like, that specific vegetable. And I just turned it into this, like, demon monster just because I was, like, forced to eat it. I am reading a book right now. Do the Work, it's called, Nicola Perra. She's got this great Instagram, the holistic psychologist. I've shot her out before, right? And I'm learning about this... You get this generational trauma. And it starts because, you know, the Great Depression or a war or they grew up and they were really poor, right? So, like, my family, my dad, not even two generations back, my dad grew up poor, okay, poor. His dad was so poor that they didn't have food all the time. So it's like you could literally starve. So the weight, and this is how I would be, if we lived in a world like that where I don't... We don't have food every day, kids. So what's on your plate, you have to eat it. I don't care if you don't like it because we might not eat for three or four days. You have to eat it. Makes perfect sense. Doesn't make sense now. We keep doing that. We have a completely different problems now. Now it's about quality and it's about making good choices because it's abundant. You know, I tried to have this conversation with my mom because, you know, she's the same kind of thing. It's offended because the kids don't want to eat like her famous waffles and, you know, all these types of things. Because it's just like they're like, we're done, we've had too many sweets and, you know, they just don't want it. And she made these brownies and all these things and they're just like, we've had too much. You know, we can't like, and she gets offended by it. I'm like, you know, in still the same things apply. You have to eat this or, you know, you can't. I'm going to serve it to you in the morning. Yeah, another thing, you know, like another one is the fear one because again, you know, like my dad's generation in Sicily, poor his dad especially, like you had nine kids. Yeah. You wait, you can't manage them all and clean the clothes by hand and find a way to get food and raising each other by that. Yeah, like you're on the street, like four or five, like five years old, like they're out, whatever. So the only way to keep them safe, you scared the shit out of them. So my grandma would say this to me when I was little, come inside, no, I want to play. If you don't come inside, the mailman's going to kidnap you. Oh my God. I used to get at the grocery store, like if you leave me, somebody's going to take you to the bathroom, dye your hair and to throw you in a van. I was like, oh no, I don't want that. Just terrifying. So the next level to this as you're reading this stuff and this is for you as a challenge is to can you predict or foresee what that's going to be for you? Like what we're doing? Yes, exactly. Like you got to understand that that happens every generation and there's something that your kids are going to grow up and be like, oh my God, my dad, because he grew up this way, insisted that this and insisted that and like it just was unnecessary because of these reasons, it has to be. I don't know. There will be. What would that be? I can't even imagine. I don't know. I don't know what it is either. I imagine it's going to be something around because again, I think that we're going to see the pendulum swing back and forth with like tech. I think that our kids, your kids in particular were born in the iPhone generation, so it was such a new technology. We didn't put a lot of parameters around it. Now we see some of the outcomes of it and it's like, oh my God. And so now we're probably over correcting a little bit the other way where it's like, God, no, you can't have that. And then it's like the reality is it's going to be, if AI is going in the direction it's going, it's going to be very much so integrated into their lives. And so there's probably some things that we're doing around that that's probably a little more extreme than we realize. I mean, how do you know? How do you know? I can't imagine. I don't know because I feel like we have everything now that we need. Yeah. So what do we do with our, you know, what are they going to say that I can't imagine? I mean, that to me, that's, oh, my dad used to tell me to go outside and exercise. He goes, stupid as that. Now we push this button. Look at my muscle. Get son. I just take a pill. I mean, I, my guess it's going to be something around the tech and so like that. I mean, we're getting to a place with, with AI and, and artificial augmentation and stuff like that, where that's just going to be a part, dude. I have to tell you guys. So the movie, The Creator, and you can see it on Apple. I don't know where else you can see. Oh, so when you were going to say, one of the best movies I've seen in the last few years. What? Yes. Damn it. I don't have it. It was so good. I got to say it for the service. And it's one of the best movies. It's one of the best ones. Here's the thing. I watched Rebel Moon, which was, which was good. You know, it was, is basically, you know, it's a bit of a Star Wars ripoff, but it's, it's still good. Like I enjoyed it. I know it got kind of bad reviews, but you know, the creator itself, like, I know I'm going to like it. What's so interesting about it is it's, it's all, you know, you like X Machina, right? Oh, I mean, I love that. It's a great movie. It's a great movie. So it's, it's very much of the human element. What makes humans human? You know, it's very much of like, you feel a lot of emotion in this movie. And it's all about these, these AI robots and like how basically they're fighting the, the forces like the, so it's funny. It's not right because it's like the Americans. No, I don't want to tell the whole plot, but like, but basically like they're, they're kind of like programmed to be more acknowledging of like the human traits and like, you know, a lot like program for love and program for this, you know, so it's more like they're actually fighting for their own existence and, and program not to harm humans. And so then humans are kind of coming after them. So it's a different twist and more of an optimistic view of, of artificial intelligence. Are they like fighting for independence? Yeah, they just want to be acknowledged as their own species. And that sucks. And that's the matrix, by the way, the prequels to the matrix. They call the animatrix showed that where they created AI and then AI rebelled and then they called a truce. They went to their own island and then the humans nuked the island and that's what started the war. But I mean, it's a dad and it's, you know, it's, it's, well, the imagery looks amazing. It's the thing. The visuals were stellar. It was just very well done. You know, it's always weird to me, though, is that like future, like whenever they depict a future, they always make it look like the machinery and stuff almost looks, oh, maybe not this. This is kind of beautiful, but you ever watch sci-fi? It was believable. That's what I'm saying. You ever watch sci-fi? Like nobody's going to wear aluminum foil clothes. So that's exactly why is that the future? That's always a parameter for me. Yeah, it's like, it has to be believable. Like this is like it, I could see decades from now. Like at least the, if you follow the train of, of technology and how quickly everything's moving, I could see like a lot of the tech in here actually existing. It's interesting. Cool. Yeah, so yeah, you guys will dig it. I'll watch it. I'll watch it. Yeah, sometimes they show future tech, especially if you compare it to like Ex Machina as far as that was a great movie. So that's one of my favorites. Yeah, yeah, I've watched that a handful of times. It's so good. That's a good one. That's one of the, one of the few movies that got me. I could never get Katrina to watch sci-fi though. Why? Oh, even Ex Machina? Uh, she, she did watch that one with me and I don't remember how she felt about it, but if I have to trick her, like, so I won't tell her it's a sci-fi. I'll just be like, oh, this is a good movie. You know, all this, I'll say. What makes a sci-fi, like obviously there's things that you know, like a sci-fi, but sometimes a sci-fi is not so clear, right? And those are the ones I can really get her to watch. You know, that I can trick her into it. She's at 30 minutes in before she realizes it. Like, like, silo, because like, they're all in a community. Yes. And they're interacting and there's lots of like drama, but it's not necessarily like robots and... Yeah, I think it's the two futuristic robot-ies sci-fi that she's not into. So this will be all, Jessica hates sci-fi and she'll say, she'll ask me like one question. She'll be like, is this, is this depicting the future? Like, oh. I caught Courtney crying a couple of times in this movie. Wow. Oh yeah, dude, it's, it's legit, man. Oh, it got you emotional, huh? I didn't say me. Yeah, right. A little bit, a little bit. I don't cry. Choking was that. Oh, I got to tell you guys, so I have a family member, I just turned on to, to see, let me tell you what happened. You guys know what H. pylori is? Yeah. Okay. So H. pylori bacteria, it's responsible for ulcers and lesions and the esophagus and the gut. Yeah, even like heartburn and all that, they wanted to test that. So this family of mine was having bloating and heartburn, can figure out what's going on, started cutting things out of the diet, couldn't figure it out, tested positive H. pylori, antibiotics, killed it. And then they're like, okay, good, I'm good. I'm like, no, now repopulate with some good, healthy bacteria. So he's taking seed now and he's like, man, I feel better than, he's like, I lost five pounds. He must have been holding a lot of inflammation. Wow. From the H. pylori lost five pounds. And he's like, dude, I feel so good. An important thing that a lot of people don't consider, right? Like once you solve that problem, but now you got to repopulate. Especially if you treat it. Do you think that's a good, like, basic practice for anybody who takes an antibiotic? Yes. If you take an antibiotic, you should follow it up with like a seed. A probiotic. Okay. Yes. In fact, in fact, hospitals would recommend it now. Oh, it's not. Because they used to not. No, but now they will. They will tell you, yes, it's a good idea to have. Oh, see, I haven't, I have not, well, then again, I haven't had an antibiotic. In fact, I take, people will think this is stupid, but let me explain. I'll take probiotics with antibiotics. And everybody's like, well, why? It's a waste of time because you're going to kill everything. No, I take the probe. They'll take the antibiotic. I'll wait two or three hours, take the probiotic. Yes, the antibiotic is still active. It'll still kill the probiotic. But what it does is that those beneficial bacteria, they'll go in the gut. Yes, they'll die from the antibiotic. But just because they went in the gut, they help prevent the overgrowth of things like fungus. Oh, so antibiotics kill everything. That's right. Fungal overgrowth are a real thing. And so you'll see people get like Candida or C. diff. Ooh, that's a bad one. That'll, that really ravages nursing homes when they go on antibiotics because of that kind of stuff. So interesting. Yeah, it's important. So seed, they're taking seed. So all right, look, you heard me earlier in the episode talk about trainers. I mentioned mine pump trainer.com in six days or something like that. I'm going to be hosting a three day free course for trainers and coaches to make them better and more successful, more successful as they make more money, but also more successful as being more effective for their clients. That's mine pump trainer.com. Check it out. If you have children, you probably care a lot about them. Well, there's a company called Haya that makes a multivitamin for kids. And it's not a gummy candy. This is the only kids multivitamin company we work with. Go check them out. Go to HayaHealth.com. That's H-I-Y-A health.com forward slash mine pump. And on that link, you'll get 50% off in your first order. All right, back to the show. Our first caller is Woodrow from Texas. Woodrow, what's happening? What up? How can we help you? What's going on, guys? It's happening. Happy New Year. You too, man. How can we help you? Hey, just again, just wanted to say, you know, thank you for all you guys. This is just information. Been listening to you guys for a good year now. And man, it's, you know, a lot of people say knowledge is power, but I think I got too much knowledge from you guys. I don't even know where to start. So some back story, man, I'm about 245 right now, I'm 59. When me and my wife met, I was like 165, I was active, you know, I was doing jiu-jitsu, training, lifting, you know, just active. But now I'm married to kids about three year old and 18 year old. And one thing I do enjoy about you guys is, you know, beliefs or values is, you know, the family aspect, you know, spending time with your kids and stuff like that. So I make that a big priority of mine. And then I also, I'm in the automotive industry. I work five to six days a week, probably 10, 10 plus hours a day. And I just, I just want to see your guys' thoughts on some guidance on, you know, what to do. I don't even know where to start again. Like I said, I just feel like I got too much stuff that I don't know where to start goals is to, you know, at least drop down to 200 pounds, you know, build strength, you know, look good, feel good. And just lack of sleep as well. And I'm limited to equipment for sure. I don't go to the gym. I have a few kettlebells, dumbbells, some bands. And then I've just been following like YouTube or like Instagram workouts, like your full body workout type of deals. And just, just want to see guidance with you guys. How long have you been working out now, consistently? So when I sent my question up to you guys, man, it was August. Some family stuff happened. And, you know, I kind of dropped a fill out of that, especially now holidays, too, I'm not really doing anything right now. Okay. This is going to be easy for the workout. I think math 15 is going to be a hundred percent. Yes, I would do math 15. The, and you could follow the suspension trainer version of it or the original version of it, not the advanced version. You also, I mean, it's, it's, it's worth the investment to just to barbell in a couple of places. You wouldn't need much to follow maps 15 as it's laid out. So you, so you could do it with the suspension trainer. And then as you move along and you're like consistent, get yourself a barbell, uh, some plates, uh, you know, in a rack and then you're set. And then you can follow the, but even with just the suspension, especially where you're at now, because you're not doing anything now consistently, you'll get great results following that. And it's literally, literally 15 minutes every single day. Okay. That's all that every single day. Now you add it up and it's like you're doing two full body workouts a week in terms of total time, but there's a lot of value in the frequency of the workouts as well. So it's actually more effective than if you did two full body workouts, uh, there's especially a guy like you that's kind of grinding the hours that you're grinding 100% now diet wise, you said you wanted to lose weight and I could give you all, I mean, we could go down the list of all different things, but based off of what you're saying, you got a busy life. I think we should, what we should do is focus on one thing that's going to give you a big return before we get into the nitty gritty of tracking and all that other stuff. And honestly, I think there's, there could be two things that we can focus on, but I think one of them is going to be, uh, more effective than the other. And that is I want you to hit your protein targets for your target body weight. You said 200 pounds. I would aim for 200 grams of protein a day from whole foods and eat that first in every meal. That alone should result in at your current body weight and height, um, you should see some nice fat loss alongside some good strength gains just by doing that. So what does that look like? That looks like, you know, 200 grams of protein. A day, let's say you eat four meals a day. You want 50 grams of protein with each meal. That's a, that's a large serving of protein. So, you know, what is that 10 ounces of chicken or something like that? So, you know, or steak or something like that, eat that first. So whatever your meal is, let's say you got, let's say you got steak, potato and vegetables, eat the protein first, hit that 50 grams, then eat the rest until you're satisfied. Um, but get it from whole natural foods. If you can consistently be within, you know, and get close to 200 grams approaching a day from whole natural foods, you will see fat loss. You will see muscle gain at a nice steady pace while following math 15. You also ask what's the best time to fit in the workout. And that's, that really depends on you, what you think you'll be most consistent at. So even if I said in the middle of the day is probably more optimal for you for sleep and energy reasons, it doesn't matter if you won't be consistent at that time. So whatever time you're like, Hey, I can always dedicate this cause the kids are in bed and I can get it done at night, or I have the ability to always get up an hour early before everybody else and I'll do it before work, or I got a great flexible job where they give me a nice hour to our lunch. I can bring the suspension training to the core and I could bust it out in 20 minutes at work. Like whatever you think you're going to be the most consistent with, that's my recommendation. Forget all the other things. So you've got to kind of figure that part out. What a great piece of advice because Woodrow, do you get an hour lunch? You work 10 hours. They give you an hour lunch? Yeah, an hour lunch. Yeah, bro. Listen, you literally you could bring your suspension trainer. If you got a place to hang them, I'll use a doorway. It's 15 minutes. Start lunch with that eat right afterwards. Like you're you'd be set because you're already at work. You already got your hour. You're good to go. I mean, you could do in the morning too, but it might, you know, mornings might be hectic or tired or whatever. I love that advice. Adam, that's, that's like that would be, that's how I would do it. Cool. That'll be, that'll be interesting. I'll be the one in the break room working out. I mean, it's a perfect place to start where you're at right now. There's no reason for us to throw a, you know, a workout that's an hour long. You don't need to go to the gym yet. I mean, simply taking the diet advice that Sal's saying, focusing mainly on that. That'll get you far. Yeah, it will. And then, and doing the suspension trainer every day, those two things are going to move the needle for us. And then when we start to see plateaus two, three months down the road, we can talk about tweaking other things, but first prove to yourself, Hey, I can be consistent doing this. And then we build on that. I think the pitfall for a lot of people is that they don't think that, you know, these short bouts of exercise really are that valuable and they need a full length workout. But what you're going to find is just how much more your energy increases, how much more your strength increases. This is really like a snowball effect. If you can look at it that way instead. Look at your body weight and height and your goals, I think you, I could pretty confidently say, if you're consistent with the protein and you eat it first, by the way, it's not going to be easy. So I know it's only one step, but eating 50 grams of protein is hard. You're going to find yourself being like, man, I, I'm full, which is fine. That's what we want. No problem. But hit those targets. You can expect about 20 pounds of fat loss just with that alone. So I don't remember your body weight. What did you say you were 240, 239? Yeah, it's a 45. Yeah. 245. Yeah, I would, I would bet money that you get down to 225, no problem, just by doing that, but you got to do it consistently. So don't do it where it's like, because here's the trial, here's going to be the struggle with it. You'll do it, you know, in the days you go to work, because you'll prep your meals, bring them with you. And then on the weekends, you're going to go off and that'll definitely slow it down. But if you're consistent every day with just the protein, not worried about anything else, you're doing the 15, you know, math, 15, I would bet money that you get down to 225 just by doing that, you'll probably end up going down lower than that on a consistent basis. But 225 I would bet money on that you get there. Woodrow, we'll send you, you don't have math 15, do you? No, I do not. Okay, we'll send that over to you. And then I believe when after Doug sends it to you, you get an automated email for 50% off our suspension trainer, I believe he gets that. Does he get that automated to him? Or do you get this? I don't know. Well, maybe Doug will send it to you no matter what. So we also have those here. And then when people get the math 15, they get half off of it. So if you don't have one of those already, I mean, I think that's like 50 bucks or whatever it is. So okay. Yeah, that's awesome. I appreciate you guys. Yep. Yeah, you got it, man. Is there anything else? That is it. Thank you. All right, brother. Good luck for calling in. Thank you. Take care. Bye. Got it. 18 year old and a three year old. That's like a yeah, that's insane, bro. I know I got that. I know I was gonna say you can relate or guy and I'm looking at it like I can see the pain. You know, the protein one people listening who doubt that try it and be consistent two weeks in a row. First off, I dare you because most people are like, Oh, I could do that. They'll do two, three days of it. And they're like, and then they can most people already think they're getting a good amount. They're not. So they actually, you know, place their eyes and attention around it. And it's like very, very, you know, alarming. I'm always missing that. And I'm like aware how like it still doesn't matter. And you're a fitness professional. Yeah, it's like it's really hard to do. That's why when people tell me that I'm like, no, bullshit. Like, I know I know how challenge, especially if you're like maybe if you're like 110 pounds, it's not difficult to get 110 grams of protein. But you're 200 plus pounds, do you need 200 grams of protein? Like very few people consistently eat that. Even the people who consider themselves big meat eaters, lots of protein. It's like, dude, that's like four, 50, 40 to 50 gram meals of protein. Like very few people eat four meals with 40 to 50 grams of protein. That's a big serving of chicken or steak or turkey or whatever it is that you're eating. And to your comment about the 110 pound, find me a 110 pound female who can eat 110 grams of protein per day consistently from whole natural foods, and she'll tell you the same thing. Yeah, it is not easy. It is the most effective way to control your appetite and to prevent you from overeating. Yep. You're getting those essential nutrients and the studies are clear on a calorie per calorie basis, a high protein diet like we're talking about compared to one that is in the RDA. Same calories will result in more fat loss and more muscle gain. You're also doing something that we always talk about to our coaches and trainers, which is you're you're doing like reverse psychology on them too. Oh, 100 percent. You're not telling. I'm telling you more. There's nothing you can't eat. Yeah, you're not telling your client, you know, you can't have these things, which you have no idea how how valuable and important that is when you're teaching somebody good habits around eating, because they don't get into this like bad relationship of I can't, I can't, and then they want to rebel naturally, which we all have in our nature to do naturally. So by you saying, hey, I'm not telling you can't do that, just go get this. Go focus on that. By the way, I could have also said avoid heavily processed foods. And I want to be very clear why I said eat the protein, because if he hits the protein, it's going to take care of the heavily processed foods. That's right. If you avoid heavily processed foods, it won't take care of the protein. You try to eat the protein first and go ahead and try the other stuff afterwards. It's hard. It isn't easy. Yeah. Our next caller is Will from South Carolina. Well, what's happening? How can we help you? Hey, how's it going, guys? Good man, how are you? Hey, first I want to say really appreciate y'all taking the time to answer my question as well as all the positive content y'all put out. Thanks. Thank you, man. So quick quick background. Twenty twenty one. I lost 60 pounds crash dieting and kind of do some circuit training. Twenty twenty two actually maintained that weight by kind of just like making better food choices and some cardio with weights. And then twenty twenty three decided to start some barbell movements. Three weeks ago, I competed in my first powerlifting competition. Kind of fell in love with it. Really like doing it. But I am five eight two hundred and fifty pounds and I've got to lose like thirty forty pounds. So my question is what's the best way to lose weight and actually maintain the strength that I have? Yeah, good question. By the way, see in your question that you herniated a disc doing burpees. Yeah. And now you deadlift and powerlifting competition. How's your back feel? Feel stronger. Never. Yeah. So I just want people to hear that, right? Burpees hurt your back. Deadlifts made your back feel stronger. People freak out over that kind of stuff. So all right. So here's the deal. If you lose weight, you're going to get way better at body weight exercises. So we'll focus on that kind of stuff. Just kidding. Here's like here's the deal. At your level and your competing, it's going to be really hard to maintain strength and a calorie deficit. And it's not necessarily because of muscle loss. There's a strength component that comes from having excess calories. Essential nervous system fires harder. You've got more energy reserves. Like you could literally put someone in a deficit and they lose no muscle but they'll be weaker. And I'm not talking about stamina. I'm even talking just general overall power and strength. Or you could take someone, put them in a massive surplus the day after they're just going to feel a lot stronger. So some of that's going to happen and it's not necessarily muscle loss, muscle gain or whatever. And I'm telling you that because you're competing. I don't know. What are your lifts, by the way? What did you hit in your competition three weeks ago? Hit a 397 squad, a 336 bench and a 501 deadlift. Yeah. So you're a strong dude. When you get to a certain level of strength, you're definitely there. It's really hard not to see the strength changes go down or up just because of the calorie surplus or calorie deficit, zero to do with muscle loss or muscle gain. That being said, you can definitely minimize that effect by going on a cut but cycling your calories or doing like an undulating calorie type of a diet. So back in the day, they would call like anabolic dieting or they would, you know, where they go with some low calorie days and they'd have a high calorie day. Bodybuilders would do, would call carb, carb front loading or back loading or cycling stuff like that. I think there's a lot of value in that for sure. Even if there's no, I mean, the evidence on the muscle, there's some evidence that shows that it might be helpful, especially for high level athletes. I definitely believe in the psychological effect of it is above and beyond. I know when I cycle my calories, it's just like I'll have a higher calorie day, the day before a hard workout makes a big difference in how I perceive the workout, my control, my stability. And I think that makes a difference in just how effective my workout is anyway, regardless. So I would, if you want to lose weight, you got to go on a cut, keep the protein high. I'm sure you know that. But go, but do some cycling. So you could do like a, like a three, three week mini cut, one week maintenance, throw in a day or two of a slight surplus and kind of play that game. Your fat loss will happen slower, but you should maintain more strength doing it that way. And then your training, I wouldn't change your training except for reducing volume. If you notice that you're more prone to overtraining because of the reduced calories. You're in a really good, you're in a really good place right now if you're eating 4,500 calories, this shouldn't be a problem. Yeah, you did write that, right? The hardest part, and I don't know if I'm reading into this too much because we literally just met, but you seem like an all or nothing type of guy where you like, you go balls to the wall at whatever you decide to do. And so that's probably gonna be the biggest challenge with you is that what Sal is recommending is kind of a nice gradual slow approach of fat loss during this process. And typically clients like you, if I'm guessing correctly, they have the challenge with the slow progress. They like might take Sal's advice for two weeks and they're like, ah, it's not moving fast enough. So fuck it, let's do the circuit stuff and let's cut harder. And so- When the scale goes down two pounds and the deadlift went down five. Am I guessing correctly over here? I feel like, yeah, you're shaking your head. Yeah, pretty much. Okay, so that's gonna be your challenge, bro. You're in a great place. 4,500 calories, powerlifting with that kind of strength means you're gonna lean out, but you just gotta trust the process and understand that it's, and understand that actually slow results is what you want. If you all of a sudden started dropping weight really quick, your strength is gonna go off, is gonna fall off too because you're gonna lose muscle really quick. So in a perfect world, you're following what Sal's saying and you're reducing those calories slowly over time and you're actually barely seeing the scale move at all, really, but you're feeling leaner and leaner and tighter and tighter. And it's just, it's a slow gradual process. You gotta trust the process. You know, I will say this though. Powerlifting, a lot of people might disagree with me, but I'll make my case. Powerlifting style training, the longer rest periods, the low reps, doesn't seem to be as negatively affected with an appropriate cut than let's say bodybuilding style training. Now, the reason why people think it's the reverse is because bodybuilders don't care how much weight is on the bar, but when you're doing high reps, high sets, all that volume, and then you cut your calories, man, you just, yeah, you over train fast. Like I like to train like a powerlifter when I cut. The workouts just feel better. I don't notice as much of a like drain on my body. You know, if I go, you know, 15 reps, squats, and I'm doing supersets and shit like that, and my calories are low, it's like I wanna die. Like I'm not just in the workout, but throughout the day. So now here's the other thing too that might help ya. Obviously as a powerlifter, you're competing weight classes. I would start looking at the weight class you're aiming for and comparing your strength to that. That might help a little bit. And you can also use, it's all in the tip of my tongue. What is it called Wilkes? I think it is where you figure your relative strength, your body weight is a formula that you can figure out. So as you get leaner and lose weight, rather than looking at the total weight on the bar, use that formula. And you can say, oh wow, I lost this much weight. My lifts went down a little bit, but my Wilkes score went up. So I'm actually, and that does favor lighter lifters anyway. So you'll say, okay. And that might help with the psychological, you know, aspect of maybe the strength not going up or maybe going down a little bit. Yep. Okay. We already have, do you already have our powerlift program? I don't know why we didn't ask that. Are you following mass powerlift? I've gotten that split and I've kind of followed it here and there a couple times with that. Well, let us send you a mass powerlift. I mean, that's right there. Wait, do you have a coach? No, he already said that, he has no coach. Nothing, no coach. Yeah, yeah. We're gonna send you a mass powerlift, bro. Yeah, take a look at it, see what the program, it's really good programming and let us know what you think. But are you gonna continue to compete? I think I want to. I think the biggest thing I enjoy about it right now is just sending kind of a good example for the boys. I got two sons and I like watching them and kind of seeing me do something. Awesome, that's awesome. Yeah, follow the program. Even if you're not gonna do the powerlift, follow the program anyways. I think you'll appreciate it the way it's programmed, the coaching that's involved in it and so with that. So you'll like it, follow it. Yeah, by the way, at your caloric intake at 4,500 calories a day, I mean, you could even, you could go down to 3,500, I think you'll be okay. I don't think you're gonna notice a huge drop in strength. There's probably something in there, by the way. If you're eating 4,500 calories, I'm guessing you've got something in there to help you boost up to 4,500 calories that you could probably easily just eliminate and just say, hey, I'm gonna avoid that. Yeah, is that like whole natural clean food or are you like eating some other stuff too? No, I mean, that's pretty much all mostly meat and pretty much clean food. Wow, yeah, he's exactly what you said Adam. He's like all or nothing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, okay, yeah. No, you're good, you'll be fine. The only other thing to add, I think for me is just like to consider adding like symmetry in there as an interruption to kind of address anything in terms of like, just to see anything like discrepancy wise like left to right and just to build that back up and reinforce your joints. And so, just running that in conjunction with your powerlifting pursuits would be great. Awesome, I really appreciate you guys. All right, man. Thanks Will. Very easy. Yeah. You know, it's weird about... Justin's face? Yeah. Tell us. It is great. Nothing, it's perfect. You know, it's your late 15th. You know, it's weird about weight loss and the big three, deadlift, squat and bench. Squat gets affected by weight loss, I would say the most. Bench is probably pretty close. Deadlift is very interesting. Deadlift gets affected, but less than the other lifts. This has been, my experience has been the anecdote of lots of other lifters. I've actually gotten lighter and my deadlift total pounds gone up. That's never happened with my squat. I don't think I've ever really thought about that but I would confirm that. Because what I definitely know squat always is. Squat goes down when my weight goes down. As soon as I cut calories, squat goes down. That's right. It's wild to me. There's something to do with the leverage, maybe even body fat and the weight or it helps. With deadlift, I think especially if you start to get kind of round, I don't think it helps. I think it hurts. You see some of the top deadlifters and they're, you know, kind of long and long. Interesting. Our next caller is Ruben from Maryland. Ruben, what's up man? What up Ruben? Hello guys. What's happening? How can we help you? Awesome. Pleasure to meet you. I love listening to you guys to show when I'm driving. Definitely like my number one podcast and everything. So thanks for all the value and knowledge you guys have provided me. Like not only for like lifting, but also, you know, like family and just mental health and everything. I appreciate it guys. Awesome. Thanks. Thank you, man. So my question, I'm gonna give you guys a little bit of background first. I'm a college student, currently 20 years old. Lifting for two years, consistently like focusing on progressive overload and like my diet and all of that. Currently about 217 pounds at range. Pretty high in body fat though. So like 28 to 30% body fat. I've been able to build, yeah, considerable amount of muscle in those two years. But I wanna be more like the 15-ish range, just, you know, to be happier with my physique and be healthier as well. I've tried multiple cuts throughout those two years, but I've always failed the cuts. Like I first thought that was just a lack of discipline, but I now know it's because my metabolism was just too low and I was cutting my calories too low, wasn't sustainable. So when I sent this question in, I was kind of like deciding, well, should I just do a cut like a fat loss, dedicated phase or should I reverse diet? Since then I did reverse diet. I built my metabolism a little bit. I did it the wrong way though. I gained fat, I gained muscle and strength and everything, but I also gained some fat. So I bought the reverse diet guide and used that, followed it a little bit better. But I mean, I've gained a lot of strength and muscle visibly, but I just don't want my weight to get any higher. Like I don't wanna gain any more fat. I really just wanna get down to that 15% range. So I'm wondering, is it in my best interest to just stick with it, keep on reverse dieting, even though my weight might get kind of high and I might gain some more fat or just do this dedicated fat loss phase at this point. Where are the calories at right now, bro? I am eating like 2,800, 50 up from like 2,700 after doing it for about like three months. And this is consistent, Ruben. I want you to be honest with me because I've never met a college student that was consistent with their calories. So every single day you're hitting. Yeah, well, I'm in community college. So I have a lot like, I'm living at home. So I have a lot more control over like what I eat. So I've been counting calories like consistently for about, I'd say three or four months at this point. So every single day you're averaging about 28, 50? I would say so. And if days that I eat like a little bit more, I'll try to like average it out, eat a little bit less the next day. And I try my best on the weekends. It's a little bit more intuitive. But I mean, I have been doing it like, this isn't my first time counting calories. I did it before as well. So I have like a little bit of an idea. I need to be more disciplined on the weekends. I'll be honest with that. When the weekends, bro. You know how much that'll throw you off, right? Yeah, yeah. So that'll make it. Yeah, not only will throw it off, it can either reverse it or it just makes it so that your progress is so painfully slow. You feel like nothing's happening. Especially if you're guilty of being just like how I was, which was if there was a day that you slept in, it would be the weekend. If there was a day you took off from lifting, it would probably be the weekend. If it was the day that you would make a worse choice diet wise, say pizza or beer, it would be on the weekend. So you start adding up all those things that potentially happened on the weekend and those weekends can really set you back. And that's why I don't know how long you've been listening to the show or if you've heard me say before, like one of the best hacks personally that I've ever had in setting my goals and achieving them as far as like aesthetically was literally just focusing on the weekend and not even worrying about the week. If I just won the weekend, it set the tone for the week and I always had success in the week. And I was already more active. I already had either work or school going on. So I was more likely to follow a diet or make my meals. And so I can't stress how valuable it is to focus on those two days, even more so than the week. Your metabolism not too slow. So let me give you an example, okay? Let's say you're at a consistent, like you measure and everything and it's like, okay, Monday through Friday, 500 calorie deficit Monday through Friday. So let's say you know for a fact, your maintenance is 2850. So you're 2350 Monday through Friday. Saturday and Sunday come long, a little bit more intuitive. You go 500 calories above 2850, which is not hard to do. It's super easy to do it on accident. Okay, I do it all the time and I've been doing this for two and a half decades. So now for the week, for the week now, because of that weekend, you're only 1500 calorie deficit. You know what that means? That means you lose like one or two pounds of body fat a month. That's how much you're gonna lose. And it'll be almost like you can't, you're not gonna notice it. So you'll do three months. Did the scale move much? Maybe you held a little bit of water so the scale doesn't even show it. I do feel like I'm getting smaller, especially if you wanna get build muscle. So now the psychological effect is happening. You know what? It's my metabolism, this isn't working. I need to stop doing this. That happens all the time and it's far more common in people your age because you guys, you're doing a lot of different things. You got a lot of energy. You're going out with your week. I don't want you to like take that away from you. But if you wanna see the fat loss, you gotta be consistent seven days a week before you can diagnose yourself with having too slow of a metabolism. So if you're consistently 28, 50, if that's your maintenance right now, I would cut it down to let's say 2,200, be very consistent every single day. Hit your targets, your protein targets. So whatever your target body weight is, hit that in grams of protein, be just as consistent with that. And I guarantee you'll see nice consistent fat loss and then just stay consistent with it and then you'll get down to 15% no problem. Ruben, do you own a Fitbit or an Aura ring or any tool like that? I've actually bought a couple of smart watches, but to be honest with you, I really don't like wearing a watch, man. It's just kind of uncomfortable for me. So I usually just go naked wrists, but I have had a couple in the past and they've been okay. I mean, the only reason why I ask is, because again, at your age or the stage you're at, I remember having this massive epiphany when I first, back then it was a Fitbit or a body bug, which is before all of these things. It was like the first one that had any real accuracy to your metabolism. And it was just super eye-opening for me. I just real, this is where I adopted that whole philosophy of win the weekend because I realized exactly what Sal was saying. And it was even more egregious than I could have thought. And he was a personal trainer, trained clients, like this was his job. Yeah, like I should know better. And I thought, oh, you know, but it can't be that big of a difference, it was. It was that big of a difference that, and I don't know your exact life. I don't know exactly what your weekdays look like compared to your weekend. Just for me, it was very eye-opening to see the difference and how easily one or two days of me not moving as much, not training, and or making one or two, you know, off the menu type of decisions could totally stall my progress. And so, I mean, maybe look into that or just simply take the advice that Sal's saying, which is you gotta really string the seven days of week consistent because you're not in a bad place. I mean, you're only five nine, you're eating 20 hundred. I'd love for you to be like 3,000 or 3,400, but I don't know how much you're moving. If you don't even hit 10,000 steps a day, you actually probably have a decently, a decent metabolism based off of how little of movement in your size. So it's not, you're not in a bad place. I think you just need to string some consistency together. Yeah, let me put it this way, Ruben. If I had a controlled environment, if I could put you in a building where I watched everything you ate and this is in the context of your metabolism or your maintenance is 2850. So let's just consider for sure that's your maintenance. If I had you in a controlled environment and I put you at 2,200 calories, we would get you to 15% body fat, no problem. That's true. There's no problem. Okay, so look, let me ask you this. Are you, do you have a job? Are you able to pay for things? I know college can be tough or whatever because I have another, okay. If you wanna invest in something that I think is gonna ensure that this will happen, go to Nutrascents.io forward slash mine pump. It's a CGM, Continual Glucose Monitor. Helps you monitor blood glucose. You can connect that to how you feel in your food, but it also comes with a nutrition expert on the other end. And you literally will enter your food in as you eat it and if you don't, they'll know you ate something because they'll see your blood glucose move up and down. So it's hard to fudge. And you're working with a professional who's gonna individualize your diet. With that, that's your best bet with nutrition. And for sure, 15% is within, you're not asking to get down to 6% body fat. 15%, you could totally do it. What are you following program-wise right now? Are you following one of ours? I don't follow one of yours. I do like, you guys probably know the guy on social media, Jeff Nippard. I've been doing his programs and I've also looked at it like this. You know those programs where you're going around. Those programs make people fatter. Here you go. No, I'm just kidding, bro. I love him. Really? He's a mess over here. Yeah, Jeff Nippard puts out, get fat programs in the last week. No, no, no, he's got decent programming. Ours is better. Let's send him a workout program. Anabolic or even like, well, it depends on his schedule. How many days a week can you work out? To the gym? Yeah. Another reason why I didn't want to buy anabolic is because I'm not gonna log into my mental health. I need to go like four days per week at least. Just because I'm the type of guy that'll fail rest days. I'm supposed to rest and I'll go in and get some arms or something, man. Just because it's getting the pump from my mental health. But I try to go like four days per week. Yeah, I do like to spend time in the gym. I mean, you do your trigger sessions in the gym. Yeah, you can, but let me see here. Look, if you promise to take the week D-loads that are in the program, can you promise me? There's D-load weeks that are in the program, meaning for a week, you're gonna work out very light or not at all after every phase. Can you do that? Because I'll send you a week at the week a little bit to kind of like... I'll send you a program that'll kick the shit out of anything that Jeff Nipper put out in terms of muscle. But you gotta do the D-load weeks, otherwise you'll over train. Okay, I'll make sure to do those D-load weeks. And then for the cut, what would you guys say are like three or four pillars that I should focus on every day to be successful with the cut? Okay, let me start with the program. I'm gonna send you maps and a bulk advance. Follow that program. Sounds good. To a T. All right, pillars, hit your target body weight and protein from whole foods. Eat that first in every meal. Just do that. Just do that and hit your calories. I don't care about your carbs and fats. Just those you can balance out how you feel or whatever. Hit your protein, target, and whole natural foods, eat that first. And only utilize like shakes or bars in order to make that up if you don't, right? Don't make it- That's like a last- Right, a good goal is to always go after whole foods, get the protein that way. If you find yourself, it's seven o'clock at night and you realize you're 60, 70 grams behind on protein, have a shake. Use it like that. Otherwise, go after whole foods. Yep, that's it. I appreciate it, guys. Thank you so much. You got it, man. I think you're calling it, bro. Yeah, keep us posted. I'd like to hear where you're at in another month or two. Absolutely, definitely. Thanks, guys. Yeah, that was, that's such a classic example, right? It's an archetypal- Well, you know, that's the example of is you guys are too old for him to even buy a program for me. He's gonna buy it from the kid just because he relates to him more. She's gonna listen to all your- Why don't you say you guys? We're all the same. Yeah, yeah. I'm young still. Okay. I'm the youngest guy here. You're not on YouTube with your shirt off. Yeah, yeah. What? What are you talking about? What are you talking about, bro? Hey, listen. If you want to get fatter, buy those other programs right now. It was a study guy. Hey, did you see the look on his face? I hope we can cut that. We gotta be able to cut that. Can you believe me? Holy shit, man, I've been doing it all wrong. No, there was this study. You'll put it up here. My editor shows that Jeff Nipper's programs make people fat. So you can read that if you want. I wouldn't follow it. I wouldn't follow those programs if I were you. Our next caller is Holden from Virginia. Holden, what's up, man? How can we help you? Not much. No place I'd rather be right now. Hey, man. Calm down. You're going to get a program, bro. Calm down. Nice. That's it. I'm out. What's the question, bro? How can we help you? Yes. So my question is, I've been doing a lot of lifting, exercise over the years. And I also have a little bit of a medical history. And I did some testosterone tests a couple of years ago. And they came back at, like, 267, 275 time, or number. And then I got some more recent tests. And they've been up in, like, 450 to 500 range. Like, it's a 23-year-old. I know that's kind of low. So I kind of want to see what are maybe some things that I could do to raise that or kind of keep improving my gains in the weight room. All right. What did you do to go from two to more than double to testosterone in that first round? I really didn't do anything. I was pretty shocked. I don't, yeah, I was thinking the number was going to come back right at the same range. I don't really think I felt too much different. I know at the time I was in college. So maybe, like a week before, maybe I was just, like, more stressed. But I know multiple tests came back at the 260s. And then I've had the past two or three tests come back at those 400s. I'm not really sure what I did. I really didn't change much in that time. The stress could have done that. Yeah, so let me see here. The first test was September of 2021. The higher testosterone tests were done, let's see, about eight, nine months later. Were you still like, was your lifestyle any different? Were you in college, out of college, girlfriend, no girlfriend, no girlfriend, girlfriend? No, never had a girlfriend or anything in the time frame. I mean, I was in, I think the last 400, the first 400 one that came out, I was still in college and then the other two have been, you know, since being out of college. That's what I remember. Okay, I think I could do that just in self. So just so you know, especially in young men, testosterone can vary wildly depending on lifestyle, sleep, thought patterns, infection, nutrient deficiencies, this is a big one. A lot of men, a lot of young men don't realize that they maybe have suboptimal levels of certain nutrients that can negatively in pretty profound ways affect testosterone. Things like vitamin D or zinc, copper, selenium, certain minerals, boron is another one. Sometimes that'll be too low and cause like bound, testosterone to be more bound up and not free. So there's a lot of things that can cause testosterone levels to fluctuate. Typically what you want for good healthy testosterone levels are you want to make sure you're free from nutrient deficiencies. That's a pretty easy test, right? So you could go to your doctor or, you know, Dr. Cabral's team, maybe Doug, you can get that link for me so I can give it to him. They have at home nutrient tests where you could look at certain blood, you know, levels of certain key nutrients. And if those are low, really easy, you just supplement with them and you get those back up. So nutrient deficiencies, you want to have good sleep. The biggest challenge with young men is that they go to bed and wake up at different times during the week versus the weekend. And so what happens is you go to bed at a certain time Monday through Thursday, you wake up at a certain time Monday through Thursday, Friday you stay up late, Saturday you stay up late, you try to sleep in. But what it does is it throws off your circadian rhythm come Monday or Tuesday. Now you've got some jet lag. So you're essentially giving yourself jet lag every single week. That'll negatively affect testosterone. You know, I also, I have like a medical history. I actually, I had like cancer when I was younger. So like part of the reasons I got those exam was just like being able to check that. Do you think like, I mean, I know the doctor said, you know, that definitely like made a difference in my testosterone with, you know, getting medications when I was younger. Do you think like that kind of like, obviously that had an effect water, maybe not other items I could do, but maybe just like different adjustments that may be like more unique for me. If that's, you know. No, okay, so cancers are quite unique. I don't, I'm not going to comment too much on that because I don't want to speak outside of my expertise, but the general advice that I'm giving you is going to apply to pretty much anybody. Now, whether or not that's going to affect you as much as somebody who hasn't had, let's say chemotherapy or cancer treatment, you know, you might have less of an effect. Nonetheless, you know, getting good sleep, adequate sunlight, high protein diet, lifting weights appropriately, not over-training. All of those things will positively affect testosterone, regardless of who you are. Now, what that upper limit is, that can be determined by things like genetics and or maybe previous treatment. You were young when you had cancer, if you don't mind me asking, was it, was it a blood cancer or testicular cancer? Brain cancer. Oh, okay, I see. So you had, so you went on some, some stints of chemotherapy. Yes. That could affect your testosterone. Now, you're in the, in the 490 range, you're not, are you, do you feel symptoms of low testosterone as well? I don't think so. I mean, I grow hair and I can build muscle. And yeah, I wouldn't like, I have a sex drive, but like, I also don't know how that's relative to another person. Like I can't, you know, just like see how they feel too. Did you notice a difference when you were at 490 versus when you were in the 200 range? I said he did notice. I did not notice. I was thinking the last test I took, I was thinking it was going to be in the 260s. I think I actually felt like a little bit like less energy even though I was kind of a little bit healthier and out of college. I was pretty surprised that it was still in the 400s. Was there a big difference in your free testosterone? Cause you're giving us the total. I am not sure about that. That is something I would have to look at. I want, okay. So here's, here's why I say look at that. It's probably a lot higher the second time around with the higher tests. But sometimes what happens is your, someone's testosterone levels will go up, but then so much of what will be bound by sex binding globulin hormone that it makes it essentially not active. So sometimes you'll see a man with a good total but low free. So they'll have symptoms of low testosterone because when it's bound up, it can't be used. So I would look at the free testosterone. That's actually what matters more and see if that was a big difference as well. Cause what might've happened, I doubt it, okay? But what might've happened is your free might've changed a little bit, but the total changed a lot. In which case then there may be some other things to look at. Are you working with a hormone specialist with all of this? I've talked to the endocrinologist, but it hasn't been like anything too serious. Like it was kind of the conversations were more looking into the TRT when the numbers came back low since it kind of come back higher. Haven't really talked too much about it. So if you go to mphormones.com, they work with doctors who are specialists with hormones. And now depending on your circumstances, okay? But there are medical interventions. Now, nutrient deficiencies aside, if there's a nutrient deficiency, I would take obviously that's first. But that aside, there are medical interventions that you could do before having to take testosterone that could raise testosterone. So there's like things like enclomaphene, HCG, and in young men, they typically go that route first because they want to maintain things like fertility. And obviously you don't want to be on testosterone. Being on testosterone, if you have to, that's fine. But if you could raise it with enclomaphene, HCG, go off and keep it high, obviously that would be more ideal. So I would definitely talk to them and see what they say. Okay, perfect, perfect. You following any maps programs? No, I am not. Yeah, let's send you maps at a ball, dude. That's a great program. Nice. Yeah, and another thing like, everyone says thank you for all you guys do. Can't thank you guys enough. I would've found you guys right after like my freshman year of college. And I have no idea where I'd be at if I wouldn't listen to you guys in terms of lifting, exercise, and even like some of the professional business sides. I definitely can't thank you guys enough. And then I'm also originally from Lancaster, Pennsylvania. I know you guys talk about the Amish a lot. So that's kind of like the home of the Amish. So always cool to hear you guys talk about that. That's cool. Good deal, man. Yeah, enjoy maps at a ball, huh? Awesome, thank you. Have a good one, guys. You got it, thank you very much. Yeah, the, I don't want to have to, you know, get in too many details in this. Again, I'm speaking way outside of my scope, but there are definitely areas of the brain that help regulate hormones that could be affected. Obviously, we don't know what the details are about that. So I want him to talk to a specialist to figure out, you know, kind of what's going on. But ultimately total testosterone, could it be higher? Yeah, but if he doesn't have symptoms, it's okay. Yeah, he doesn't sound like he's complaining about that. I don't know why he's, I mean, that hung up on it if he feels. Probably because the first one was so low. Yeah, just the numbers. Sure. And that could easily be just stress from school, dude. Yeah, I know. It's cool not getting the best sleep, knowing your test is on Friday, you didn't study. I trained a man is, this is, let me see how old was he? He was in his mid to late 30s at the time. He tested in the high 200s total. We, he changed his diet, sleep, stress. He was overtrained like crazy. So it cut down on all his training, put him in a calorie surplus or whatever. Six months later, he went from the high 200s to 900. He tested. In fact, they thought it was, they tested again and again and again. And it kept coming out between eight to 900. So you can really affect testosterone with your lifestyle, big time. You can make a huge impact. Look, if you like the show, head over to mindpumpfree.com and check out all of our free fitness guides. We have a lot and they'll help you with your health and fitness. You can also find us on Instagram. Justin is at Mind Pump, Justin. I'm at Mind Pump to Stefano and Adam is at Mind Pump Adam.