 over to you. I am going to unmute so thank you Leon for this nice introduction and welcome indeed everybody so today well we have our our colleagues from Vietnam going to present and share their their works with us they will present their improved motivation and ability their MOTA framework for agricultural transformation innovation in the Vietnamese Mekong Delta. I have understood that Khun is currently in Paris on a train but he is working on this together with his colleagues Luan Tu and Bin. I would propose that well one of them takes the stage I do not know who is going to take the lead for this presentation now and if they have a presentation sharing abilities to share their screen I'm looking now at Leon on the other side I probably need to do that. Yeah thank you Yap I'm Luan and I will take the lead in the presentation can I share my screen yes you can if you have that ability then of course if participants have questions for Luan and I would propose that we wait until he finished his presentation and then by raising hands via the zoom tool we can give people words accordingly or you could share a question maybe in the chat box with that said Luan yeah can you see my screen now yes we can thank you very much yeah can I start yes please yeah thank you everybody for joining our webinar so this case is a briefing of our work on improving a tool to analyze agricultural transformation in which we try to make it fit to the complex social system so our work starts with a very classic paradigm which is the diffusion of innovation in which agricultural transformation understood as a linear process starting from innovation itself and then we have some early adopters and when the adopters reach a critical mass by the work of extension service and then the innovation will take off and we have a transformation on a large scale so what impact in this paradigm is a linear way to understand about transformation and it's best described by the S curve here you see at the bottom left of the screen so the transformation start by the innovation and then when after early adoption reach a critical mass and then you do have a mass adoption of the innovation so the paradigm is very successful in some historical case and but it also we see some critics because like the critics that it to promote the individualism in transformation even though you know you see in the the compartment the many elements of diffusion innovation you see the the social system and so on the communication channel but it's still very individualism and like it looked of a transformation system as a it's a compartment with it's all wrong and it missed the how the complex how complex the system is and for that it usually missed to comprehend the the context of the transformation next we see the agricultural treadmill we see that this is a derivative of the diffusion of innovation so they are similar in that they promote the idea of individual individualism in uh agricultural transformation so if you are on the treadmill uh there are one single rule that uh you you have to follow that uh is that you better run with the advice if your run is slower or you you you stop then you withdraw our treadmill and uh this uh uh so uh this fits very well to uh the agricultural transformation in uh in in in the west uh country like uh when uh farmer they incapable farmer they they fail to to catch up with the innovation and uh they uh they they become less efficient and they will drop out of the sector and later they will join uh the the industry or the service sector uh this uh happened in the history of uh the west country like america or uh european country so um uh the the treadmill uh promote the idea of uh efficiency in uh agricultural sector like uh uh so for example while you have one park sale plan uh you want to get the best out of it or if you fail to do so uh you will drop out of the the the the business agricultural business and you give land to uh another couple uh the other capable farmers and uh those uh capable farmers uh they can uh innovate uh they can uh turn the market and they will take up land and become uh large farmer and uh you see the result of the treadmill in the west uh country now like uh you got a very large farmer with a very large land vast land landscape of a large land unlike in developing uh uh country you see a very small land very heterogeneous landscape with a small owner um so that uh the story of the the treadmill in uh develop uh society but uh does uh it hone in uh uh developing uh society like in vietnam or african country featured by uh vast majority of small owner uh we uh so you see in the first photo uh that uh it's not relevant to the agricultural sector but uh uh within this uh very relevant it's a photo of a migrant uh so in every uh holiday the year and the year and holiday they they travel back home from the urban area uh uh so uh we uh we did try that uh uh uh and uh uh there's a a leakage uh effect of uh the school of uh optimal management uh in uh agriculture uh agricultural sector uh optimal optimal management target uh efficiency like uh you you want to drop out you want uh in uh incapable farmer or weak farmer to drop out of the the business uh so uh so that uh capable farmer can uh can check up the land and uh and gain more on the the the tech up uh park sale of land but there is a a leakage uh effect like uh uh for in here in this uh from this school of optimal management uh than that uh leakage effect effect uh has impact on uh uh another system like the urban system now you have uh in uh like in uh in vietnam or you know Ho Chi Minh city uh people from nearby rural area when they are uh previously land-based uh who live on land-based livelihood uh when they they can uh do uh uh agricultural uh activity anymore and they uh they they they will migrate to the city to search uh to do some uh precarious uh livelihood and uh it's also of course uh uh a threat to the security of the urban area which is uh the city is very infrastructure is not uh capable enough of uh the way of uh uh immigrant uh so uh just uh understand about that and i think uh this uh uh this is very popular in any developing uh society and uh it's western there is a western about the um uh is uh the dominant narrative in uh agricultural transformation target uh efficiency does it hold uh or there is dominant narrative whole uh everywhere uh and uh can we ask um um is there any other narrative that uh fits better to develop in society uh and uh we we raise a concern about uh the two uh narrative uh that uh we we we don't like uh deny the uh higher efficiency in the agricultural sector but uh we want to ask if there's another narrative that uh target the uh end up in condition like the institution or the infrastructure that supports small hunter in uh end up small hunter so that they they're more capable of doing what they're doing so that they don't have to migrate to the other to the urban area uh and uh also the the normative concern that's uh totally missed from the higher efficiency narrative uh you know uh in higher efficiency narrative which promotes the role of the role of individual individualism they uh it consider farmers of entrepreneur and as a entrepreneur they have to innovate and so they have to maintain to to survive so they're concerned about the environment or uh the the extra the social cost of uh farming activities uh is not that does not fit into the entrepreneur model um and uh these two uh the the concern about the end up in condition and the concern about the normative aspect of uh transformation is uh are the two entry points for us to navigate our our later research so this is uh how we can integrate these two entry into the MOTA framework so um so normally uh Quan has to introduce the MOTA framework for you but uh he's like busy now so I will very briefly introduce the the MOTA framework it's a framework to uh to analyze the farmer such in case of uh agricultural research uh analyze is how researcher to analyze uh the adaptability uh of uh innovation so uh adaptability uh is uh include um like uh many dimension like uh include the two-man dimension uh motivation and ability like uh motivation like uh they uh do do farm a thing uh data by adopting this technology they can improve their profit uh uh does it uh fit the the hydro logical condition in uh their farming area about ability uh like uh are they uh technically uh capable of uh uh adopting such a technology or are they uh financially capable uh so that uh about the the MOTA framework our experience with adopting the MOTA framework in uh in uh agricultural research uh so that uh there are some setbacks uh in uh in the way we uh we use it to uh to understand farmer behavior like uh firstly uh we only use it uh with the focus on farmer at the man agent of uh transformation but uh uh we we think uh we uh uh so agricultural system uh include many actors and uh they they have uh influence on the the transformation of the system and not only farmers uh another aspect of the MOTA framework that uh is uh based on uh resumption about uh rational behavior of farmers uh as i mentioned uh like uh the the the adaptability of farmer is very much controlled by the motivation and ability and uh they based on uh the the the assumption that uh farmer uh has uh ability to to make a rational choice like uh when they hear about the solution or the technology they they can uh balance the the trade off um uh and when they they they adopt the solution they uh and uh and then they can choose uh the option that uh maximize their benefit but uh our experience with uh we're going to interview with the farmer so that the rational choice uh it's not always uh um valid in all in in every case uh we did see that uh farmers uh and uh it's very uh sometimes they are very much uh um like uh they they they the decision is not always uh rational they uh sometimes they're very affect by uh cultural bias and later when uh if we have time we i can give you some example of this uh cultural bias uh in uh um in in in the farmer when uh in in case of Vietnamese and make home delta um cultural bias like uh they um uh they more um that decision is more influenced by the rule uh of the the system they live in uh and uh it's not about individual um rational choice anymore um so uh also uh the more time is uh sometimes uh miss the the the context analysis uh so uh we uh like in miss uh to see the the the the agricultural system in uh in the systemic way uh previously uh um we see that uh the more time promote the idea of uh you know analyze the system uh in like uh analyze it a bit compartment like decision maker farmers uh trader and so on but it's only uh they look at uh each um actor in uh uh like uh uh systematic way like uh like when it doesn't look uh and it means the complexity of of the system uh and uh to explore uh to understand the complexity of the system we recommend that uh the the uh a systemic systemic understanding uh for to see the constraint and uh opportunity uh for uh for for for the intervention uh so uh uh so what uh pretty uh uh the more time uh only are tough on uh pretty analytical analytical choice uh like so because of uh the the characteristics of uh the the government funding in uh vietnam like uh we always start with uh the the solution itself uh we we we rarely have a chance to uh to diagnose for the system to see uh if if the solution fits or is there any uh uh constraint opportunity to promote uh the such uh solution um so that uh why call it a pretty analytical analytical choice and sometimes uh it totally uh uh miss its target and uh stop at uh like on the self uh um research uh it's no uh has no uh social impact um the two last uh setback that uh we think uh we need to improve is uh multi uh target uh quantitative result and has a descriptive aim uh i think uh uh we think that these two uh uh link together like uh uh when you describe uh when you adopt uh when we adopt uh quantitative approach uh for uh social research uh you see that uh their tendency towards uh uh reductionist way to look into uh the the social system and they totally miss the complexity of the system like uh we want to uh to narrow down the scope but it's uh to some uh some major dimension but uh the social system and the agricultural system is very complex you see uh a network of actors everyone of them uh has a role and a relation and the these activities are powered by some rules and informal or formal so uh a reductionist way uh uh promotes by uh uh quantity approach to uh sometimes it's totally miss uh this uh complexity uh and lastly it's have a descriptive aim like uh it will it aim at uh uh describe uh what uh what the system is uh it's not the style with the western life how the system should be uh that's why uh we uh uh and a lot of time it it miss uh the the the the norm the normative concern about uh the the the transformation that we mentioned previously uh so our our suggestion uh for um redesign the MOTA uh and which uh we are also working on now uh manage better uh to address uh these disadvantages uh like uh we propose that uh the MOTA should uh has uh uh suit target a monthly actor uh and uh firstly uh uh it should uh based on the understanding uh the system in a systemic way uh to realize the end up in condition for to the design uh in intervention to promote uh the uh sustainable and just uh transformation and uh it should have uh it should start with uh this descriptive aim rather than descriptive uh like uh to address the normative uh concern of uh this transformation like the the normative about uh concern about inequality and uh environmental cost of uh the transformation so uh um we uh mentioned a lot about the normative uh concern of transformation and this slide uh uh explain uh our idea uh explicitly uh there are two major concerns about the transformation uh including uh the social distribution of uh the of the transformation is it uh uh distributed uh equally uh or somebody else uh worked homogenalized by uh these uh transforming transformation policy and uh and secondly it's about the the distribution of uh externality of uh the transformation like uh is uh anyone uh has to pay for the transformation anyone has to pay so that uh somebody uh can gain from the transformation uh so we suggest that like any uh research into agricultural uh of uh agricultural transformation should start with the two normative western uh like uh who benefit from the transformation and who pay for that uh and uh by asking these normative western uh we uh we can address uh the uh we well um we can address the the the the concern about uh just the transformation transformation that uh um benefit everyone not homogenalize uh anyone uh so the last slide uh some uh some idea for well we we're gonna work you know to to redesign the the the multi so that it can promote uh it can uh analyze uh and uh promote the the the uh sustainable and just a transformation in the agricultural sector we believe that uh uh the multi should uh conduct in a step why why like uh we can uh because the social system is too complex you cannot start with uh uh an operational framework and uh to decide what's in there and go out there to collect quantity data and come up with some uh uh inclusion but it's totally missed the context so uh a step-wide approach uh combining between uh qualitative and uh quantitative is uh a better way to to comprehend comprehend see uh comprehend uh uh to to understand the on one side to explore the complexity of the system uh and uh to uh and uh and uh so uh the the the key point is uh the most important uh step uh like uh like you have to diagnose the system uh first uh to uh to on uh firstly to understand the complexity of the system and uh secondly to to understand the the end of clean condition so that our desire of intervention uh can uh fit uh better to the to the context uh and lastly uh we uh uh so the the multi now is no has no mechanism for uh reflexive uh analysis uh we will we will we can we can have the and uh graphs and understanding about how the system is but uh we don't have have no mechanism to see how the dynamic of the system how it changes over time and uh what's the different between groups and uh here we propose that uh uh to combine the the the um the final data analysis and uh randomized control uh for uh to reflect the evaluation of uh the desire intervention so uh this uh some uh uh uh just a brief frame of what we are doing now uh more will come in uh I think uh later and uh there's some key reference that uh we use for this uh presentation uh about uh agricultural innovation system and uh uh to my college uh we will present uh uh the the the improved mortal framework uh so if if you have any lesson uh maybe uh we can uh start after the presentation are you here yeah thank you so I will say my ring now yes if there are any immediate short questions for one um then maybe we can deal with them now before two is continuing no then I would say uh to please uh please continue hello everyone my name is Tung from the city and uh you hear the presentation of uh that uh in the Muta we are looking the environmental contest in analyzing the transformation and the adoption of uh and innovation and the reason why uh uh the team of ICD are doing to improve the Muta uh in in the sense that we want to improve the application of the Muta in uh in adoption of innovation in the Mekong Delta and uh this is the the the framework developed by Dr. Binh one of our research team uh we're in uh in Vietnam and uh in his bible booklet uh last year uh he analyzed the transformation of our carol system in the Mekong Delta and in his research he he presented to analyze the uh the transformation of our carol system we need to analyze the whole the value chain uh that means we need to analyze the license where the farmer live uh the producer um uh dimension sushi uh result a bit availability or knowledge attitude and we also need to analyze the market drivers in good condition or the our good condition and we also need to analyze uh the policy rival the circular land in the implementation with uh some time to resolve the the farming level and uh we are uh landing to apply this uh into the Muta uh by this and uh as you see in the presentation of Mr. Lin there are no feature of uh environmental content or the setting of uh transformation and there is some why Dr. Binh want to uh ask one more of the rival transformation of the 4b of chain like policy rise like a reducer uh to the the lean between the impact of adoption to uh the ticker by acting uh learning and feedback uh that mean uh the multi the ability of the reducer will affect the perception and then affect the motivation and then it will have to an action of the rebound and then lead to the outcome and uh with the outcome it will impact a different group and musical scale and then uh the impact will affect the whole rival of transformation for example policy or right or late or reducer uh via the learning and feedback and uh we aim to uh apply this kind of uh uh ramp work into a case study in the coastal air of the Mekong Delta by exploring the uh transformation of rise to uh stream or right rim in the coastal yard and uh you can see in the uh in the uh figure that uh the different busway uh from rise to right rim or stream and uh we apply the the developer to understand why some number uh seep from rise to stream and uh some number uh seep to right rim and uh from the jump from make some room rise to a right rim or stream it's also different impact on different style of farm work and then it will affect the adoption or the rejection of uh farmer in the next fight of the the transformation and uh did the another approach that we want to link between the inclusion and innovation theory and the multi-ramp work and uh the theory of diffusion innovation a uh by uh Mr. Lung from City of Four characteristics the part one the innovation the second one is communication channel and the third one is time dimension and the fourth one is a social system and then uh we want to ask before uh characteristic of diffusion innovation into the multi-ramp work that you can see in the right hand of figure and I will explain in more detail uh the character of the theory of diffusion innovation before uh I give a contribution of big kind of theory into the multi-ramp work and uh they mentioned by role you there are four main element of the diffusion innovation the first one is the time dimension uh the second one is the innovation attribute uh the third one is the communication channel and the fourth one is the social system and on the feature will affect the adoption of any innovation and uh among the feature the innovation attribute such as the relative advantage of capability, complexity, credibility, observability, in the main factor that influence the adoption of people and the communication channel are also the factor affects the the adoption of people like via mass media or interpersonal communication and also uh social system which uh will uh last fight into the formal chapter informal social chapter and will determine which kind of adoption uh taken by the farmer for example of no innovation decision or collective innovation decision or authority innovation decision uh that mean the adoption is uh conducted or authorized by the authority and uh then we put on for the future into the the wrap book in the right hand side uh we can see in the multi-ramp work we don't have the the social system and we don't have the communication channel and also the link between the outcome and the chica also not clarifying in detail and uh in this framework um we uh listed on of the five car third innovation they mentioned before like relative advantages and uh observability and so on so it will help the wrap work can be uh um applied more easily but we we know which kind of perception we should measure or analyze and uh according to the theory uh the relative event the car third of the innovation can have plans for 49 to 87 percent of the variant of the right adoption innovation so the one of the main rival of adoption and also the social system and communication channel are very important especially in the in the context of now because the dissemination of agricultural innovation many organizations in the department of agriculture and rural development and it belong in agency and also people committee or farm association and union and rural women union and uh it's by uh all the scholars the social network also like very important role in the adoption of any innovation because also into an order factor like a set of information or markets already or subsidized and the self-de-net of farmers and depending on the different adoption the social network of uh a person or the formal network can have a immortal role in the adoption and uh the third one that we have to verify the link between the outcome of the trigger because not only the in the motor we analyze the impact of the adoption on the trigger but we think that the impact of adoption could also be on the whole system for example the trigger the ability and also the communication channel because by over time there are more people involved or adopt the innovation then it will affect the communication channel and also the structure of the social and then it will in turn affect the adoption and uh it can land for the right adoption over time why some people after adoption they live uh the implementation and uh with the uh soft um presentation on what we are learning to improve the motor thank you very much thank you also too um and luan if you might be able to see there have been some questions posed in the in the chat box um and maybe luan you could give an uh an answer also to uh well i i want to say a question by joana but it is leon of course that wrote the question in the box so interesting ideas and concepts more fit to study agricultural transformations with all the limitations of mota for these types of processes why do you still want to work with mota as a starting point what is useful about mota for studying or monitoring or support transformations so maybe it's a it's a it's a question to the whole vietnam team and maybe also in a further response to the whole team of the project yeah leon hi am i yeah you are a mute queen yeah thank you you want to uh answer this go like uh uh i'm going you you want to answer you want to address this question you you you can go first okay you you can go first oh yeah okay yeah thanks leon i'm sorry everyone turning a bit difficult enough in the in the station yeah um yeah thanks leon for the question uh actually we um i think we in this study we still based of course on on developing uh mota so uh i think um what what we've been working on especially over the last uh last term i think we uh we didn't have enough time to to go really more on that theoretical uh aspect uh especially uh looking at also more um behaviors related to uh topic and i think in this one leon presented we wanted to supply more uh yeah to develop more uh inside on that at at a theoretical one what is really uh resemble uh behind the motivations or especially the the motivations and uh at the same time we'll so look at a bit picture picture as at the framework which is two is presented where we try to link the motor with the uh agricultural transformations and and especially the innovations aspect so because um example as you see in in some picture we have the rise stream model which we call it kind of innovations um uh practice in the make home data because it's a multiple benefit but uh but yeah so so how this can link to to the motor also another uh thing that we wanted to improve so basically we have two key on for for this from theory background but also more on framework background which is um linked to using make home as a case study yeah yeah so of course yeah motor we have been using and yeah i think this is uh it's useful in a lot yeah of course but now also um because when we we we found quite some challenges when we developed the questionnaire and and also to really take it out as quantitative methodology i mean meta quantitative assessments so this time we also try to use this uh so that later we can apply some now quantitative but explanations uh uh using let's say a guy of a econometric yeah econometric uh uh resgressions analyzes something like that yeah so that's that's what he's trying to improve yeah now i'm sorry i could not it's the same earlier but maybe for those who who haven't know about motor i think we want to apply it in all many other contexts apart from agriculture i think if you can stay with you some other difference we do it for urban flooding contexts but also uh biodiversity uh yeah some ecology and so yeah so this can be applied but we still see that the the inside the theory we still can be able to improve a bit yeah i think the multi actor already is is stressed by some of the papers but you know some other works uh but this one uh i think last time we used more on that uh system uh i mean separated actors but now we try to get more resemble the papers we work with the dorians we also look at it from a government's perspective and and other working with farmers so this time we we wanted to look at it also through uh the value chains because it seemed to be very important in in agriculture transformation so yeah i think maybe you try to that's very a bit yeah thank you thank you uh could uh luan would you like to add something to it or can i go to a next question yeah i think that's enough okay thank you because maybe the next question is maybe for you or for uh too as well and i i think i'm going to merge some of the questions inside the chat box which is a question in relation to the the the communities you are working with in your research or do you have specific communities farming communities that you are working with and in relation then to also the transformation and the time aspect how long have you maybe already been working with these communities and are you tending to continue working this and that might relate also to that aspect um asked about the understanding of the earlier adopters and do we need to see early adoption maybe in a time scale or maybe more in a scale of the the quantity of people taking it up how can we you presented also the that normal distribution over time of early adopts how can we see that maybe in relation to transformations but maybe first part of the questions with what farming communities are you working with and is this a long-term relationship uh continuing yeah uh we start our research with um our understanding of our agricultural system in the area we uh we're working at and uh also some secondary data publication we rely on secondary data and publication uh to to pick the the the actor of the system uh that uh we uh we will become to to do uh our research and uh but normally we we want to start uh as uh broad as possible like the recent case when we go to the coastal area and make home delta we uh we have uh had interview with the trader uh decision maker at uh many level uh provincial to uh district level and uh uh we will so uh talk with uh farmer uh uh stream stream farmer at uh also at um many times of stream farmer like extensive semi-extensive uh intensive stream farmer and uh industrial intensive stream farmer and uh the our experience here the the social system of agricultural system social system is uh very uh very diverse uh very diverse uh in uh stockholder complex very very complex uh and uh complex is uh another aspect uh where they are personally uh they're very diverse and uh their relation and uh and uh role in relation in the system is very complex uh so uh my understanding till now i'm not sure it's correct or not but uh we uh we should start if you're using the first case and then we just should start as uh broad as possible and try to utilize uh any uh material available to us uh and uh and uh and uh the bigger case that uh the familiar the most uh to to us to like uh in uh later they say you you have to uh choose a domain to to act on uh um before firstly you have to choose a domain like uh agricultural you want to work on uh sustainable agricultural what type of uh actor you want to to work with uh how many types of farmers uh out there you you want to uh do to come to and uh yeah my uh my answer is uh it's flexible yeah since I never start with a fixed uh set of farmer yeah thank you um maybe this is more uh then you can add also a bit uh on on the adaptation from bp so it was yes so thanks uh thank you uh yeah um we we work for example the the one I mentioned example on um on the agricultural innovation practice the rice swim models it had been I had a very long time now in the moopong delta but uh recently it's get more intent uh in in intentions by uh by both local and also national uh governments yeah so especially the last the thing for years it's getting more so there are some uh because it's it's it's really a multiple benefits uh solution and also highly uh resilient to um to the climate change uh but in the case we are working now in the bin chair province it's it's going good but now it's getting again like going down because uh people seeing is not really bring enough benefits for them so they're more for example changing to intensive stream farming so so that if you see in the picture of learning about uh the development of innovation so it's going up but then it's going down but there are quite some constraints with the uh political agenda so institutions related aspect uh I think it's two things it's really um uh really interesting yeah and also we also like to have more on the cultural uh yeah things which is um cultural but also a try off values which is for example this system style from practice can also reduce capital on emission but it's not yet payment so if we can include this and we can get more favorable uh solution meaning the farmer can get that's income then this may have for this transformation process yeah so you want to add more to I have a follow-up question to what you have mentioned thank you uh Kuhn and Luhn and it relates maybe to an earlier question um by Marissa in uh in the chat box um and that's maybe also it's more about the the feedback given from populations but maybe also then in relation to what you mentioned so some of these transformations in rice shrimp farming you see that they are now maybe developing towards more intensive what is then your position as a research team also in feeding that information from the field maybe back to the the policy domain and how maybe things could be steered towards more sustainable uh transformations maybe I asked some of my ideas about the the time of the the kind of transformation we make on them and I think the the the chamber rise to a rise stream stream taking place in the Mekong Delta like 1990 like several decades ago and it's a continuous process that means what is happening in a few uh community in the Kothu Yon and then because the effect of saluting, choosing or other faster uh the error with change to rye rim or rim have been seeped further in land for example the the farmer in the Kothu Yon thought they adopted rye rim or stream and then uh later on the community inside the Dupurai or Chippurai Yon and um I think there are some kind of feedback between the adoption of of change for some of the farmers in the in the Kothu Yon they see from uh rise to rye rim or stream then uh the salinity choosing will be linked into the Dupurai field then the farmer in the nearby community have to share something like this and uh for the the western on the the palm scale I think now we can see a little in the figure uh presented by uh Mekong Delta for the first 50 percent of the people in the community uh the rye of adoption will be in free overtime but then the rye of adoption will be in free overtime because there are no uh remaining adopters in the community for adoption anymore and uh usually for the 2 percent of the people who adopted in the community we call the innovator and then we have early adopters for 14 percent of the population and then we have early adoption and late adoption and late gap who are the person who did not apply and if it's kind of blamed by the us up for in in in of adoption we have the rye of us in free overtime until 50 percent and then it is free overtime I was uh reminded by leo that I was muted and that took me extra time to be realized that I was muted thank you uh to thank you Luan thank you uh Gwon thank you Vietnam team I'm looking at the clock it's almost uh 2 pm uh central european summer time that means that we are uh towards the end of um this first webinar I found it very interesting thank you I would like to give the floor to Anamika our project leader in this case to to give maybe some of her final insights first before we close this first webinar thank you thank you yeah and thank you to the Vietnam team for this very interesting presentation and um very happy that you took the initiative now that the ball is rolling we hope that many more will come up and fill up the form uh thank you yeah and your team as well for taking this up and uh let's hope that this continues um we will meet in this week sometime soon the mail will be sent out for the you know monthly meeting we can decide how often we want to do these webinars but for now thank you very much and we look forward to listening to others as well and uh for sharing this very interesting framework uh Vietnam team thank you thank you Anamika and indeed as you have said it was pasted in the chat box by Leon if you want to share your your knowledge your work any interesting ideas into a webinar you can find the google docs form link in the chat box I will paste Leon's message again so it's at the bottom have I done it no I have not well we will also share it again I think by Neil but please share submit your ideas to be able to further organize these webinar sessions thank you very much yep can you please save also the the charts because I cannot do it but we can look at because we cannot address all the question uh yeah so we will get it and this works without a team yes we will um then I give the final final words to the person that opened this meeting and that is Leon oh that's nice well then then just thank you everyone I think I have nothing more to add to all the other closing words but it was really nice to see uh uh not just the interesting presentation on on the motor and and the new thoughts about how it applies to transformations I think there is a further further challenges ahead there but but very interesting but actually also for everyone joining us including I think even in in the very early hours from Mexico but that is assuming that that is where Marisa is so that is very much appreciated and hope to see you all soon for project meeting but also for the for the next webinar and thanks yep for the nice facilitation I'll stop the recording bye