 All right. Well, good evening, everyone. Nice to see everyone. I would like to call the May 13th, 2021 Airport advisory board meeting to order. Michelle, could you please call the roll? I can Steve Bliss I am here Malcolm Dean is absent. Harrison Earl. I'm here. Kent Jacobson. Here. Linda Jordan. Here Russell Robison. Here. Ryan Weissman. Here. And Council Member Peck. You have a form. Thank you very much. First item on our agenda is our public invited to be heard. We do have a couple members of the public who don't know if anyone would like to jump in on the first public invited to be heard or not. See I've got Don Keith and Keith's iPad. Don, maybe a call on you first and see if you wanted wanted to join in on this Make a comment. Not at this time. Thank you, sir. I have the other opportunity at the end. Keith, would you like to? No, I'll wait till the end of the meeting. Thanks. Thank you. All right, so then we will move on then to the approval of the previous month's minutes. This is the April 8th, 2021 regular meeting. Does anyone have any revisions, comments to the minutes from April 8th? Hearing none. Would anyone like to make a motion for approval? Yes, I Go ahead, Melinda. No, you go ahead. Go ahead. Yeah, I make a motion to accept the meetings of last week. Thank you, Steve. Melinda. Do you want a second that then? Affirmative. Any debate on the on the motion? All those in favor if we can raise our hand then, for I and no one opposed. So motion carries six zero Malcolm Dean absent. Old business financial update. Mr. Slater, please. Thank you, chair. So your today received so far through the end of April is 277,434 dollars and 75 cents. Your today to expanded and in We have 132,881 dollars and 55 cents expended the $26,220 as I mentioned last meeting is encumbered and that is for some work that we're going to be doing on the detention pond on the north side of the airport. There were some some items that last year our stormwater management plan folks called out and so we are contracting under contract to do that and as soon as we get some good weather we'll get started on that in the next couple of weeks or probably So the difference to your revenue and extended is 118,333 dollars and 20 cents to get it So far we have out of our professional contract services right now 40,980 dollars and 70 cents expended a little over 31,000 of that was for snow removal The pep ditch company engineering review. I know that you had asked about that before but I just wanted to remind you that was for a final review on the Plans for the runway safety area project where we had to relocate pep ditch and so we that was the final payment to them on their engineering review Any other questions? I'll be happy to answer Any board members have any questions mr. Bliss and then can't I'll get to you next Not having been here that long. I'm just curious is that 31,000 for snow removal is that one of the highest that we've had There were some a long time ago that were a little higher, but now that we are strictly contract without assistance from city equipment Yes, that has gone back up and One of the last knows that we had had some really thick deep heavy wet snow that We had to Move a few times. We had to stay ahead of it so it didn't get too deep. So we had to have them Pretty much double up on what they would normally do on that particular run And of course we we did add a little bit more to our plate as far as how You know the area that we cover on those north hangars We added a little bit to that but it is one of the highest we we've had You can see last year we did 17,000 dollars worth big change but This year, um, we're 100 contract. So that's that's where we're at on the snow removal. Why did that so far? Why did that change to To work 100 because pre pre previously we The city had snow equipment that we participated and helped make sure the snow got moved rapidly um, there were some issues over the past couple of years where we had a lot of equipment breakdowns um, and had to bring in a sub to help out and Just to get it done quickly We had snow cloud equipment here at the airport that I would jump in and go and help out So it didn't take the contractor as long Now that i'm not doing that and it's strictly under contract. Um You know as far as the contracted areas that that's what is What is costing so far this year? All right, thank you Mr. Jacobson um a couple of questions the cell tower income David is just about your annual budget amount close to it Why and what do you expect for the rest of the year? Is it? Is it you know is your income received the Apologize let me uh divert that I think that was councilmember pack trying to get in. Um, can I can we take just a short break and try to get tested with her? She may be trying to get in is that all right, mr. Chairman Absolutely, mr. Slater and then can't we'll go back to you and your question Thank you Okay, I had to leave her a voicemail because I think she was leaving me a voicemail So, um, what was the question? And do you want to read the cell tower income in four months has almost reached your annual budget? What is what what reason and what's the future? Uh, so typically in february is when we get the base annual payment, which is a significant amount and then each month we get the For a lack of better term royalties um, sir service Revenue basically um for the monthly revenue from from each carrier, um all comes through crown castle. So You'll see that trail off. We'll we'll be getting around 53 to 50 400 or maybe 5700. I have to look at the next check. Um, 5700 a month Through the end of the year. Yeah, so you will exceed budget by some amount By the end of the year then yes, sir. Okay, uh, that's that's what we're hoping for we we anticipated an increase in in the uh, cpi But i'm not sure that it went up by that much in the cell phone tower industry So that that budget that 98,000 may be a little bit high Okay, and the only other question I had is on the on the expenses under e insurance um You're over budget already and it looks like the budget compared to the last two years should have been closer to 17,000 Thank you Curious why Michelle was probably better in explaining the the benefits but on the e insurance Um, they had increased that so right now our budget for 2021 is around 17,000 um And we're at about 9600 right now They do the books here that in a way that I don't completely understand and There are certain categories that Will be higher until they close the books and roll it and some either back or forward to whatever the previous year was but um With that in uh, e insurance i'm anticipating it to be around that 17,000 but it does include both Michelle and myself I believe under that category because of the time that she spends Working on airport issues So thank you Thank you divan. Yes, sir I'm some member peck welcome. Um any other questions from the board on the financial update right now I'm sorry. I was helping when I was asking getting help her again. Can you just repeat that last question? All I got was salt tower question or was the other question There was a bit the um insurance line Okay, thank you I'll go back on this. I just want to make it. I know. Thank you Any other questions from anyone? All right, so hearing none we'll move on then to uh airport needs recommendations to council if any um If anyone wants to bring anything up now, I I don't know if this is a appropriate time to kind of discuss through Tuesday night's meeting and and share some of that in the context of what future recommendations we might want to make Or it's better to do that under comments towards the end But I'd probably prefer to do it now so we can make sure it's include anyone can comment on it in the final public invited to be heard if that works for everyone All right, so I'll always kick it off and then um, you know David and council member peck would love would love your input and it sounds like a few other board members were at least listening in So, you know share perspectives as well we We joined city council on tuesday evening to present the airport's annual report um David shared a bunch of the highlights from the report with council and then we had a number of questions uh, they were focused on The revenue amounts at the airport what we were bringing in what the I think potential was and how we would benchmark it um setting some I'd say more numbers based goals Was particularly around revenue for how we could do that going forward as well as development plans both the long economic economic development plan and how it integrates with the airport and land development and how it integrates with the airport um, and so I think we we we address the comments as we could but certainly some follow-up there um needed particularly around development plans and land development that I believe will try to get on a future agenda to have some of those conversations in depth Um, David is there anything you want to at least add in before we kind of open up discussion Uh, no, I think you pretty much covered everything as far as uh Some of those discussions on the future agenda. Um, I think we're going to have some staff conversations about that and kind of help tie it in to the the board's role and once I have a better feel for that then hopefully maybe in july we can have something on the agenda to discuss how that ties in and kind of what the the council was asking about with relations to sustainability and And things like that. So you pretty much covered it all right um I will just say up front one of the things I wish that I had thought to respond back to the questions with um around revenue particularly rose around kind of the broader economic impact of the airport that you know, it is far beyond the 520 000 In revenue we got in 2020, but you know, I looked at the c dot report where we have You know number here of 24 million in payroll 36 million and value added in 68 million in business revenue So, you know, it's a greater contribution when they're talking about, you know revenue per per acre We probably need to broaden that discussion to include some of the impact that is, you know far beyond the half million dollars the city sees so Wish I'd thought to respond that way to council But you know one would at least make sure we stress that in some of our future communication I don't know. I'll open it up to board council or sorry board member robison I'm elevating you to council Russell. Thank you very much. Mr. Chairman Um, I wasn't present at the meeting. I only read the summary in the long montan's call So I guess my question to you guys through there is Did they seem like they were familiar with the economic Expansion ideas in the master plan that we have, you know We've had on on the table for 10 years such as we're going to try to expand the runway to get business jets in We're going to try to build a new fbo with a major restaurant or Were they focused on some other aspect? At least say from my perspective. I don't think there were that level of detail Um, that that came up in the questions. I think it was more You know, we presented a revenue figure and you know, our goal is increase revenue And so it was okay. What are those specific steps? Which you know, we talked about south side development some of those other items We didn't we were talking more short term the long term David, I don't know if you want to add to that at all I think that's correct. Um, I think kind of what it was is is Some of the council members might like to see Something more definitive Rather than a generalized goal a more definitive and measurable goal Uh, and that's kind of what I took away I had the same takeaway to that um, vice chair jordan So I did watch as you know, and I do have several thoughts. Um The so I did hear a revenue per acre kind of question which nobody was prepared for that um, and we've never we haven't really presented that kind of information And comparing it to the current market Real estate values and things like that that couldn't we be making more Money off of the land than just hangers. I heard that from marsha um, and so that's one question is What other are you know, we look at the I look at the cell phone tower as a cash cow Knowing that that was a beacon tower that caused us a whole ruckus Back prior to the latest ruckus that we've had at the airport And that they not only moved the beacon tower, but made it found a way to make money on the one that does sit there Next to the zwex property and I've lived here a long time and remember all that mess and so What a brilliant use of that decommissioned tower when we moved it Is there you can't do a whole lot of rf because of the signals and all those conflicts that they would have but other created ways if I think that's worth Putting that out there to have people think about is can you think of other creative ways that we could make more per acre? With the space because her comment was definitely more per acre than just hangers and then We always would love a restaurant and some other types of facilities like that But the and then other than increasing rates fuel flowage hanger leases things like that that aren't not going to be popular And are going to hit the you know hit the users the the bigger question is The council has never been behind us as an economic developed economic generator. They have not been behind the airport With a a statement a an order a Make this an economic Driver for the city of longmont. We have never received that directive or that kind of support So we've been tied up in noise lawsuits and traffic complaints and You know, that's really the focus of the report because I was very sensitive to the fact that the stuff that we reported on was not what they were asking questions about at all And but last year in the year before in the year before all they wanted to hear about was noise So it's changed which is cool And we didn't you know, we didn't realize this was coming. So it's really You know, what other creative measures or possibilities are there to make money on the airport? and will the state will council get behind us And say we want the airport and support us as we try to lengthen the runway Add more planes add jets because you know what that's going to do To all the complaints that david's going to get about noise And so that's we've always just kind of hung out in this Quiet zone of we're going to try not to make noise Try not to make too much trouble try not to irritate everybody And if we expand we're going to irritate people. So we need council to be Not aware of that and behind us if we're going to really push it and try to get more craft in here Um, if you guys have seen the complaints on next door, especially last year at this time during lockdown when everybody was home. They were it was Venomous they were very venomous You know, why are you guys up flying? Why are you not having a good time not recognizing that? All the things that we know people have to stay current and people were moving supplies and doing other things There was very little pleasure flying going on so It would be a public education process too if we're going to really ramp things up at our airport That's going to really be a driver. But first thing would be that when LDAP came to see us before our complaint had been Or our observation back to them was you've got this X number of page brochure that you showed to smugglers when they were coming in and the airport Appeared that many times in that report. They refer and in their Their stuff they refer to dia. They never refer to our airport. So I don't know how Yeah, they got to play with us. So we're we you know, we can do a lot of things on our own Which is the hangar development and the cell tower stuff but if they really want to put their foot in it, they've got to get behind us to do it as my my Feeling on all that so how we do that But I think we need more support Councilmember packer, please Thank you. Melinda. Thank you for those remarks and I agree with you But speaking for council Since I've been on the council almost everything we've heard about the the airport has been an executive session So to come out publicly with that we cannot do that How we do that I think is what the the next step Discussion should be How do we come out and support? and one of the things That I think And you can correct me if you think this is the wrong way to go Is to actually hire somebody else out there for David because it's impossible to Focus on economic development manage it deal with the noise complaints deal with everything with one person So that that has been what I've been trying to do for the past couple of years is push We need to get more support out that out there if we are going to move forward so if I'm asking The board the advisory board to support council in that request when the budget comes up either as an advisory letter to Advisory motion or however you want to do that To the city because to the council because we are going to start those budget processes Very soon probably in june collecting data on what what each department needs, etc That would be the first step and I have talked to herald and david Over the years and know that there is some interest in economic development out there Part of that has been to get mile high off of our beachfront property so that we can develop it and put in that infrastructure so that it would be It would look It would bring interest into developing At this point, there's no interest if we're going to have people diving Where we want to develop and if there's no infrastructure there yet. So we started the infrastructure, right david Yes, ma'am We are waiting for the mid-year appropriations to come out and as soon as we Have council approval on the mid-year appropriations, which my understanding second reading is uh around july 13th So by the end of july we should have the appropriations and be able to go out to bed on the sewer Okay Utilities on the south side So we need to do those two things first As we attract new businesses, but we have to show that we're we are ready to do that So the other thing and I want to share this with you is that with uh ledp and council Ledp is the one that I would say courts businesses to come to longmont and once they Once they have started negotiations And conversations then council is out of it Mainly because it is the company the organization That wants to come to longmont and develop They don't want this public until they are done with their negotiations Because if they find that there is a lot of public distrust or animosity toward this Certain business that wants to come in then the business pulls out because they don't want to be an adversary um to the community so I think that there's always this disconnect, but um there is support melinda for economic development on at the airport so I just wanted to put that in because we really aren't communicating very well And that's part of the problem And I think that some of the comments that that came out of the council meeting Regarding sustainability and connectivity and so I think there's those discussions that we're going to start looking at bringing in and around the july time frame As you know next month advisory board media is canceled due to staff scheduling Right conflicts, but uh in july I think by that time we should Have something to put on the agenda to to start bringing that Into the advisory boards round so that they can look at it and make recommendations to council on the planning future planning of the airport Right, and I think it has a lot to do with connectivity Yes, and education is huge because as soon as we start having these conversations in public It's going to be a mess. I mean There's going to be the anti airport people anti noise anti so I think a lot of education about runway lengths about You know just a plan where we're going to be in the next five years where we're going to be in the next 10 years But what is it we want to do and where do we want to go with it? And address all those issues. It's hard So thanks for listening I think that was really helpful to understand the context to understand You know, I think council's perspective on what you've been hearing Since we're certainly weren't seeing anything in executive session So to know that where the discussion has been has been I think helpful to at least Understand how we need to start shifting as we have those development conversations, you know starting in july And set that up So then my question back is you know, you said budget conversations start in june Um, I know we've at least teased in prior meetings, you know the the idea of You know, David once you have a budget request done Making sure that we express our opinion to council on whether we support that or not And I didn't I'm glad you brought that up if I can go ahead and just jump in on that. Um because I think I Much to my sugar in disappointment and probably council member packs, you know With the delay in getting the infrastructure in and delay and getting development going even more Um, I think that we're going to have to push it one more year before I make a request for next year Until we can Defendant to please say we have additional revenue that will cover An additional person Honestly with with the maintenance items that we have coming up As we've done this year, uh, I guess I I should probably One thing I didn't point out about the budget Is there were some other areas that I could pull some money from that we Such as non-capital equipment and furniture and some of the stuff we had planned for the expo I was able to rearrange that around to the repairs and maintenance budget and Bring that from a hundred thousand up to a hundred and twenty two thousand so that we would make sure that we're covering what we needed to we had some unexpected expenditures with How many? Uh parts were needed for the lighting system Um and getting all the all those lights back up and running again and Ordering additional supplies and parts for those as we're changing those out. So Um, we did increase the maintenance and repairs budget a little bit. We also have some some pavement maintenance Um, we're in addition to the mill and overlay project, which is going to be a little over forty eight thousand dollars. Um, We have maintenance pavement maintenance that we're doing on the south side, which is a lot of patch repair and Crack sealant and then we're going to be doing patch repair along the taxiway and I sent an email out just before the meeting here Um, kind of updating the the airport Uh folks on this Um The taxiway that goes in front of my office and around to the east end of taxiway alpha Um, there's several areas that that we're doing patch repair and and crack sealant on that and then some Uh areas just adjacent to that as it comes around those first sets of eastern hangars There's some areas it's right adjacent that we're going to do patch repairs to until we can completely rehab that area Hopefully next year and not hopefully but that's what we're budgeting for for next year Um is to do a rehab in front of that And a couple of other areas along that taxiway and then there's an area right over in front of uh h fifteen um And h 14 rows Right in the center that we're having to do a patch repair so that it doesn't yank off a well pant as well We had some potholing back around h 23 and and uh 24 of that area So we're doing a lot of that trying to get that at least patched up to a reasonable Acceptable level until we can do a full rehab next year But as I was saying that carries us over in the next year And of course we're going to have some areas in the public parking area that's been suffering for quite a while That we're going to have to get taken care of as well So carrying into next year, uh, we have those other areas that have been waiting for five or six years um that we want to do a full rehab on next year so With us keeping our maintenance budget pretty high and trying to get some of this stuff knocked out. Um, so that We don't have as as many issues and that we're closer to Getting the airport back in the shape that needs to be in And until we get the actual leases in place, I can't count on that money. So Hopefully next year we will get those leases in place and I can apply for someone for 2023. Um We're also doing a 10 max to the state project that uh, I talked to the state aeronautics division And they we had a runway restriping project for 2023 and they were able to move some projects around and Surprised us by letting us know that we're actually going to get that funded next year So that's part of my budgeting process this year is for for that 10 match to that project So I think that's all good news, but I think as far as an extra person it's going to have to be pushed one more year Councilmember back Thank you for that explanation david um, I So I just want to run this past the board You think that it would be a helpful Whenever i'm on council, I always think that the audience is not the other council members The audience is our residents. It is the city So when we ask for something, um That is financial I would always like to have jim golden Our cfo say why we can or cannot do it So when we ask for another person in and your explanation david as to why because the revenue at the airport isn't Uh capable of supporting that Then I would love to have um Jim golden say why it has to only come From the revenue at the airport Why cannot not come from another fund within the city? And um, this is education again For the residents but also a reminder to the council people As that this is supposed to be a self-supporting enterprise um But how can we get it to be self-supporting and can we get a temporary loan? perhaps From the budget in some aspect or other because departments lend to each other all the time So especially our fleet it seems to be the piggy bank So um Let's talk about that david a little later and see if there is a way we can bring that up at least to get Everybody thinking that this is as important as it is any other department within our city or any other enterprise That's helpful council member peck and I I would certainly love to bring that back to all of us If a letter would be helpful to spur that conversation or Supported in some way um assuming the board is on board with that. Uh, mr. Robus, and I saw you had a hand up Thank you, mr. Chairman. Uh council member peck. I couldn't agree more with that Point of view on where the money might come from And I happened to notice that the administration management service Fee or charge expense that we have in the budget would certainly cover an airport worker so perhaps the city would Make use of that money as I understand it. That's what we pay them for city personnel services for the airport and uh, if if they're interested in being an economic Leader at the airport. Maybe that would be Their skin in the game so to speak any other Comments questions from board members at this point All right. Well, I know we had this under our recommendations to council It sounds like at least for the moment. We're holding off on any other recommendations pending Some of those budget conversations, but anyway, I'll just keep checking in every month since this is our standing item Um as this goes through budget process and make sure we at least continue the conversation there Yeah, I just punctuate that with um as individuals when you're at other airports look around see what they're doing I I think really They store things or they Allow landfill or they do something that they use some of the unused land We've got all this land. It's being leased for skydiving So it's used a portion of the time but not all the time and But are there other uses when you guys are out and you're all you know, we've all got big imaginations Again, the cell phone tower is just a great example of repurposing something that was already there and it's just a cash cow for us um, so we've got um Neon down in the corner, but I don't know. I don't even I think that's just a We must just give them that space or else they'd be under the um public use permit fee Um, and I'm not sure how much that generates if the public if our public use permit fees is that Primarily mile high Um, and that'd be a question to david the 16 000 that's budgeted the 6 000 that's been received Or does neon pay us for that? Is there room for other? um aeronautic and non aeronautic uses on the airport that we could Um leverage to make some additional funds. So as you're out and seeing things or something if you think of something bring it up Because I think there's other ways we could be levering our space um until it's developed fully as a full airport facility with all the All the space serving aviation so for the runways and the safety zones I will say that the majority of of that revenue for public use permit fees is from mile high um, we have had uh, a uh motorcycle Class take place for for training people how to properly ride motorcycles in rougher terrain that they'll they'll do a Saturday class and so they'll they'll pay her public use permit fee. We've had some, uh powered paragliders that have Put a little bit into it. It's not a significant amount, but but more than 50 or 60 bucks um, and then we had, uh Dan Dunn when he was building the the hangars on the south side um, and until he finalizes all that he used some put his equipment um in the in a public use area and so he he purchased uh I don't remember exactly how much it was. It was a little over 500 bucks. I think um 500 or 600 bucks um for an annual permit for his equipment while he needed to stage there So we we have done some other public use permit fees over there, but it's The majority of it is from mile high okay well So david unless there's other 12 months questions from the board. I don't mean to Cut anyone off, but Maybe it's a good time to move to rates and charges and have the discussion on Each of those rates and charges since we kind of we kind of started down that path already so, um Initially just that first page there you'll see in red and underlined um originally we only had the the black fauna above that um For our lease rate and what that did not take into account. So for instance if Someone purchased a hanger two years ago at this rate And then in two or three years you have the cpi escalation They sell the hanger. Well because we didn't have anything else in there. Um Um When we do a lease termination and a new lease for the new owner of the hanger after three or four years um, we would lose that escalation amount and so we needed to Make accommodations for that so for both aeronautical and non aeronautical um We put that in there so that it's either that rate or The current lease rate whichever is more So if for instance someone's on the on the hanger and paid lease for three or four years And it's escalated through the cpi then when they sell that hanger and terminate their lease the new lease Would be whatever the rate is with those three or four years of cpi escalation if that makes sense um As we start looking at development on the south side, uh the city wanted to Provide in a way that in order to help with infrastructure cost um, that a lease credit may be provided for public improvements constructed by lessee um asset forth in the lease section of the the code um And then Interrupt you i'm sorry go ahead What you're saying by that is if a if someone building a hanger were to say build a waterline That's publicly available As part of that development you could give them a credit for summer all of that is that is that the idea? Correct. So and and for clarification it has to be a main line that others can tie into It's not a a field service line that comes off the main line that goes to a hanger That's not eligible. It would be a main line that The public or the rest of the users in that area could benefit benefit from as well Okay, thanks Then we got to the permit fee section and they're in in the in the past There was some discussion about instead of just having a flat rate and doing dividing it daily weekly monthly Um from the annual rate to provide incentive to Take that next step. So if if somebody wanted instead of if they had planned on doing five days They could do a weekly rate and still Not have to pay extra money, you know pay the full seven days Uh on on the weekly rate there would be a little bit of the discount helping incentivize them to take that next step up to that next permit area And as you go from from daily daily is is the The 60 discount or the 40 of the The uh current lease rate. So it's 0.1073. And so if you divide that by 365 that's where you get the point 0003 cents per square foot um on a daily rate Um, that would stay the same then if you did a weekly permit You would basically basically get a discounted rate. So A weekly being seven days you would actually end up getting it for the the price of of four and a half or five days um Same thing with the monthly you would get a discount and wouldn't pay for the entire month It would um Basically give you x amount of days off. I don't really remember exactly how many it is And then the annual permit you would get even more days um, but If you if you wanted a for instance um If you use the large area such as mile high does and if they jump an average of Let's say just just for discussion purposes and to make the math easy 200 days Then if you look at option two An annual permit if if if you jumped 215 days or so And I don't remember the exact numbers so don't quote me on it But uh or hold me do it Without me sitting down and hitting it in the calculator. But basically you would still be getting more than You would under the current daily rate uh But not by much if you increase that jump period up to say 215 or 216 days Um, so if he jumped a few more days um, he would actually Come out better that way and that would entice the annual permit not saying that he wouldn't have to do that but it's more of an incentivized base and We looked at a couple of different options because council likes options and they wanted uh Uh city management wanted me to put down a few different options. So Option one was the first one I put down However for our largest user. I didn't feel that was quite frankly enticing enough for him to purchase on a Monthly or annual basis with those rates um So I came up with option two to where if he did jump just a little bit more It's still more than you would get at the daily rate For 200 Little over 200 days and if he increased that up to 215 Then it would be worth worthwhile for them to select that. So that's the second option and the third option You know council sometimes likes to make decisions for themselves and they can look at this and review it and Set their own rate So we want to leave that option available for council as well If they didn't like either of the other options So we always want to provide a third option for council to Set it as they wish And so that's that's what we'd like to take to council as far as a proposed update to the schedule or its in charges David I'll open it up for questions, but just really quickly the the intent here is that we're going to Recommend one of these options to council when you bring them even though they'll have all three choices. Is that correct? That's correct. Okay Mr. Robison Thank you, mr. Chairman. Uh, David since you on option one for the permit Since you crossed out the last few decimals Uh, is that the current rate that mile high is paying or Where point one oh seven three is the current Annual permit rate. Okay, so Cross that out to show the change to a different rate. Gotcha. All right, thanks It's it seems like option two is the most reasonable. It's the middle of the ground acceptable and Then on the non aeronautical rates back to creative ways to make money For the storage of all the heavy equipment He would have been charged at the non aeronautical rate And then there's always been a question about neon Are they they're paying a non aeronautical rate, right? And I just I'd love to know what that's What that contribution is with neon. Do we even charge them or is it is it anything we can expand or Lever through the non aeronautic rate Being fair and and incentivizing the people who are on the field to do things. Well what the Two different items there so the equipment that dan has stored is in the public use area So it's it's not an exclusive use area And so it's done at the public use permit Okay, great. Gotcha. Okay The the formerly neon now betel Is the new contractor and we did a lease Assignment because the national science foundation is the one that Funds all of this and and they have a new contractor. So it's now betel But when that original lease was set up it was set up under an aeronautical rate Because justification was provided and given that they could If the city so desired they could provide Atmospheric data To the city that could be considered For aeronautical use It's never been used that way We do have an awos and I don't know that we would Have a mead For the types of sensors that they have out there But it was set up that way because of the potential that it could be used that way Once that gets to the end of the lease I would suspect there may be some Discussion about that and see if it's still justifiable. Was aeronautical or non aeronautical, but I think one could make the argument that it's non aeronautical Is it does it amount too much is it? Oh, yeah, it's uh, you're well I don't have the exact number in front of me. I could look it up. Uh, while we're discussing something else Like 100 and then come back to you. Okay. Yeah, just I mean, I don't want to You're talking about an acre of property. So you're looking at Around 43,560 square feet. Okay. It's yeah, I Spend time on something that's not, you know, it's not going to amount too much But if making sure they're on a non aeronautical fee rate And the square footage is enough to make a difference to actually, you know See a difference in it Then that would be interesting But otherwise option two seems to be the most reasonable That there's flexibility for the people Taking the permits and The rate is figured out because that was the other thing that came up Sort of in between the lines with council was A request to look at well, no, it wasn't in between the lines. It was it wasn't asked look at 10 other airports and see what they were getting for their Dollars per acre and we are unique. We know that there aren't a lot of airports at high altitude and against the front range and The things that make it a special airport, but there are a few we can compare ourselves to and just I think that these rates have been within reason obviously So option two seems to be the best one and then just do we want to beef up our Be sure we're classifying things correctly as aeronautic versus non aeronautic to get the most bang for a buck when we are permitting something out there Mr. Robinson, did you have a comment as well? Thank you, mr. Chairman David, I guess My first question is I might have missed. Why are we looking at reducing the annual permit rate if we're trying to generate more money? Why wouldn't we keep it the same? Because currently the way it's set up. There's no incentive to do anything other than a daily rate, which The way we're proposing it now A daily credit that's unused can be carried over Just not past the end of the year Okay, no, but you can carry you can carry over Daily credits so if he pays for 30 days or anybody pays for 30 days And they use 15 of the days and the other 15 is because there was bad weather or high winds or whatever the situation that they just didn't use them Then They're still 15 days that you get a credit for I know I understand all the the previous time you said that now because I was assuming the mile high just had an annual permit But they do a daily for just however many days they use that right? That's correct So if you if you have an average use which may be around 180 200 days If you have a good weather year and you can increase that by a few days and make a little more money It would be more advantageous and convenient And actually save him a little bit of money and we would still get a little more money than than what we're getting at 200 days So it would save him a little bit of money and everybody a whole lot of convenience just to do an annual permit so we're trying to To provide it to where It would make sense to do an annual permit Yeah, that makes sense. I just assumed they already did that. So that's what I was missing Sure any other comments questions from other board members mr. Bliss Yes for david You mentioned dan dun he he parks his equipment out there and then On the airport property. Do we charge him for that? Yes, sir. That's that's what I mentioned earlier under the public use permit fee He that's that's the area for the public use permit fee that's just being used and it's non exclusive So it's done under the public use permit fee And so he gets he he actually purchased it full price an annual permit for that area Is it a specific area or do you go out and measure? Outline it measure it out on google earth draw it out on google earth and print it out As the designated area and how many square feet it is and It shows up exactly where that area is and that's the area that the equipment is staged in Oh, I didn't know that. Thank you. Sure All right. Well without any other comments um, I think the necessary action here then is a motion to Make a recommendation if for if we're comfortable with it Um, mr. Robison All right, I was just doing the math there. I was a little slower than you were so the math works out to 314 days on option one Reference the current rate and 212 days on option two David, do you have uh average numbers that my life has been paying for in the last few years? the last I recall they jumped between 180 to 200 days, I think uh As of I don't remember what year it was it might have been 2019 or 2018 even I don't remember the last time I ran those numbers, but um 2019 I think or 2020 We were looking at at around 200 days, I think was the average Uh over the past two years So it could be a little less or it could be a little more Option two at 212 is pretty close then I would say so I would think that that that would be his Selling point of if he jumped a little bit more it would be worthwhile If he can you know, I know it's weather dependent. It's not like you can just pick What the weather is going to do on any given day, but You know you're asking him to gamble Yeah, over over 12 days So that's around 1200 bucks Actually, if you if you do it if you do it at the At the daily rate, it's It's right now the current rate is 99 Dollars and 36 cents per day for the area that they use That they pay for um So around 1200 12 days would be around 1200 dollars at the current rate at the reduced rate then It would be less than that Mr. Weiss So it sounds um, like I said, this is a question for david um as I understand this proposal it is geared at the Largest user of of the space, but it does sound like we've had at least One entity that has elected for an annual permit um At the current rate structure um In the last couple of years how many companies have elected to pay for an annual permit at the current rate structure And other than other than the equipment staging, um That's only your annual permit that we've done in a while since we've changed the The way we charge for the public use permit I guess, uh I guess I have one one more follow-up question. Um, that sounds like the advantage to switching to an annual permit is to cut down on on paperwork Currently is there Or what what is the what is the savings from the airport's perspective and and having the annual permit? convenience factor, um as opposed to uh daily permits If you get an annual permit You jump as much as you want through that entire year it cuts down on a significant amount of time of me Having to scroll through and see what days were jumped and what days weren't and Him having to write a check every 30 days or so Are me having to issue a permit every He so for instance if he if he purchases 30 days He may jump 17 of those or 18 of those And then have some weather days and then or days that he just doesn't operate And so then I have to go figure out. Okay Confirm the number of days jumped he requested he might request Five to seven more days For the next permit And so he may jump four of those and then I have to carry that one over into the next permit Which leaves him uh 11 days and so he may want seven days or he may want 11 days So it's you know scrolling through to confirm what days have been jumped and what days haven't Dilling with all the credit carryovers him having to constantly write checks every 30 days or so and Reissueing a permit every so often it's A huge convenience a time saver and and quite honestly if he has a good year it probably saves him a couple of dollars To do an anal permit and might even be worth it for the convenience of doing of just having one permit issue for the entire year All right. Thank you. And that's why I think that the we're looking at trying to be enticing with uh With the Daniel permit fee I think it's worthwhile for everybody's sake Okay, thank you. That's a lot of time and effort. All right. Thank you. Sure It's helpful to understand David. I think I'm looking at this the first time I was a little confused on all that so That context is is valuable sure Any other comments or I'll entertain a motion Don't everyone jump up at once I'll move that we recommend option two. We that we would support option two um to david to Present and recommend to council Melinda, can I maybe ask you to amend that slightly to Council adopt the entire schedule of rates and charges with Yes, I recommend I move that uh david recommend council adopt the entire schedule of rates and charges um with the option two rates We're a second Mr. Robeson second Moved in second at any further discussion All right, so all those in favor of the motion on the floor say I and raise your hand please I Anyone opposed I saw six hands. So no So that's six zero motion carries So then david I assume Should I be writing a letter on behalf of the board then to convey that recommendation and I'll coordinate that with you on how that's helpful All right, wonderful. Thank you everyone. Um, we will move on then to our final public invited to be heard We have a handful of folks on the call If you guys don't mind, I'm just going to call you out on the order that's on my screen to ask if you'd like to make a comment If you don't either know or silence and I'll move on If you dan's iphone He's still muted I'm going to take silence as a no, but dan if you want to I'll come back I just I'm sorry. I just came on Uh, I don't have any comments on it. It's good to listen to uh to the comments of the council this evening It's uh Is uh, I'm dan done when you were talking about with the equipment over there. So Um, I always like to know what's going on at the airport and Doing what we can to help over there when we can So appreciate y'all's working with us And thank you for uh, thank you for being on and participating. Appreciate it Um, Keith, would you like the opportunity to make a comment tonight? Uh, yes, I wanted to say that I agree with david About deferring a new hire to focus on maintenance for the next year or two My point is that you'll not enhance the economic development potential of the airport by skimping on maintenance and presenting a shabby facility that Doesn't look viable to a potential new client. So I think his approach is exactly right and and That's the way it ought to be done Thank you very much. I declined to start this off with asking if you could state your name for the record Could you do so so we have Keith Griffith Thank you very much. Mr. Griffith Uh, don dulcy would you like to uh make a comment this evening? Yes, I'll make a comment Um, and uh, it is don dulcy for the record Thank you. Go ahead. Uh, I I uh wanted to Agree with malinda's comments that In, you know in summary that the council has not appeared to be real supportive of the airport Back on the count back in the board years when I was chairman We had the same issue and it's carried forward pretty much for the last 10 years and Back in that era one of the things we wanted and never got was just a single sentence from The city council that said we are in support of the airport and we want the airport to be an economic driver for the community And unfortunately, we never got that statement But I think everything relative to The growth of the airport could stem from some Verse like that from the council in writing The discussion about Hiring someone for david to assist in the efforts that He's trying to achieve I think Keith summarized it well that right now may not be the time But one of the things that did come up and in the prior years was there was a need Through what would now be the ledp? because they have people That are focused on developing the downtown economic situation and We recommended to council back then that they look for a person In that capacity That was focused only on the airport Someone that could really drive finding those businesses which are on almost Every airport surrounding longmont The upholstery shops engine shops maintenance Avionics all of those things are all around us and try to drag those businesses onto this airport But we need a person that's really focused on just aviation to make that happen And at the appropriate time, that's maybe the person that would be most helpful Thank you Thank you I think we've gotten everyone from the public who's on if I've missed someone please speak up But I don't see anyone else on the list Thank you all for participating and for the comments I'll move on to board council and staff comments and I'll start with the board linda I had some other notes that I'd written during the presentation the other night that I just uncovered when I moved my rates around One of the questions that came to me was and this would be toward um, john and david Does council also ask the golf course? what their revenue per acre is or the parks or In reservoir some of the other areas that are public charge for access Do they get asked that same question as well? I felt a little defensive And so it was like well, do the others does the golf course also have to to show a revenue per acre And what would that look like? Union reservoir same thing And those were the things I thought of the park And those are community I don't really consider parks as much of that because those are community features but things that do charge So the the ones that came to mind were the golf course and union reservoir So do they ask for that from everybody and so are we being asked a question that is Are we being driven to to be? profitable at the same With the same commitment That is given to golf courses other Permitted fee based facilities within the city. Hope i'm making sense, but We were asked specifically about dollars per acre and I look at the golf course across the street from me and a lot of people enjoy it But some people pay to be on it and then again to that discussion the Just on the economic development side again With the new hire I don't know that that would be if I were going to apply for the job to be the person out trying to get The things brought to the airport. I don't see that being a full-time job so again back to the other Entities that the city has Is there a way for us to get 25 time or 50 time? Share an employee that would be doing because if economic development for the airport in some ways if it's going to be avionics and aircraft related Then yes, that's a certain person But I would expect that the city would pursue Business like smugglers as an example Uh, they're not just presenting one aspect of the city. They're presenting that we have golf courses. We have bodies of water We have an airport. We have Rhythm on the river. We have community events. We have all these things going for us our school system Our district that's so highly regarded so I don't see that the airport needs its own Full-time equivalent person to promote it that who could we partner with and does the city put Money time or energy into promoting those other aspects of the city That we haven't been being promoted. We didn't see it with smugglers at all that we were not the airport was not promoted as an asset to entice smugglers here and It could have accelerated some of our plans to extend the runway some things like that potentially and so it's just, you know, it's a cycle and so Where are my question back to the city would be where are you committed? in the cycle to support us to support you to support us and It's definitely it would be somebody with that marketing, you know A very specific person that does that job to go out and try to bring business onto the field But I don't know that it would be a single full-time equivalent Although then to Russ's point the Administrative management fee is definitely a handsome salary. And so What does the city allocate for these other interests? And I don't know the answer and I would love to know that what Where does the city put its money in promoting city services and things that are available when they're trying to enhance trying to attract Other businesses and I have noticed some in the tech field that have come to town Not necessarily going to need to leverage the airport or the golf courses. They probably already lived here Real-core satellite is the one I'm thinking of in that regard that they moved Real-core and the battery division up here to some of the old maxed-door buildings and so They probably didn't have to do a lot to entice them. But where do we fit into the picture? And where are they spending money and time already? Can we get at least onto that and co-tail that until we can justify A full-time person I hope I'm making sense. I feel like I went around circles. But just yeah, we're you know, we're interested Are they interested? Can we be a part of the other entities in the city? that are being promoted and Ride that until we can justify a full-time person I certainly want to hear when we have that discussion In the coming months, it'd be really good to bring in some of those perspectives david as part of that discussion Melinda what can I ask you to? share the quick update on the expo A couple points before the meeting officially started and want to make sure Yeah So we did agree that we should push it to 2023 Because of some of the stuff that's going to be happening on the field construction wise and then I think we could do it in 2022, but another year's fine. So I did contact recess factory They are in business. They are anxious to work with us again. They supported our last year show in 2018 And he it's too far out for them to bid on the pricing We know what we spent before and for those of us that worked at we know Visually what services we've received. So I did ask him to put together more of a menu of services of what They would be interested in providing which would be I think everything we had before and then maybe some additional services so that we could bid those Perhaps they I don't know that they can provide water and refuse cheaper than we can get it from our own city But we could look at that and see we can do a fair comparison and we've got plenty of time So they They were out leaving to go do a big effort that they do up in the midwest And then we'll get a list of services perhaps by next month to just at least know safety security entrance gates water Services they do our security fencing soundstage and then we did some of the things that are running the beer garden perhaps we have a non-profit that we can run that and do it as a Revenue generator for a non-profit to benefit the airport so far. We've used it for some scholarships and some we did the I think funds came from friends events brand to do the Handicap access between the ramp at a week and up to the parking lot after Jay's accident So they've used we've used some funds and we raised that from the beer garden And we did a fundraiser for Jay that year as well after his accident So that's do we give them the beer garden and put them in charge of serving and that just everything we give them Of course reduces our need for volunteers and tip certification and some of the things that we run up against So they'll get back to us and then the date that I picked was june 17th 2023 That'd be a saturday. We typically start with everything friday, and we're doing all the airshow all that Choreography and getting everything done on friday And then saturday morning. We started usually at 7 a.m With pancakes and that would be the day before father's day, which I think is a A good weekend the weathers we usually are not getting snow anymore at that point That's one thing we can kind of almost count on so june 17th 2023 We'll get a menu of services from recess factory ballpark bid and then it would be a matter of just starting to get the leadership put into place and then Recruiting the volunteers and just mapping out and getting creative And that's the nice thing about this extra time is that we can get creative with how how much we want to offer And all of you that go to air shows know all the variety of things simulators More, you know warbirds simulators new tech old tech all those things that we can really make it a real best show to the Developing the airport the community loves the airshow and they see it as purposeful and A really fun community event and well, I think we got one complaint about the f-16 We should have gotten hundreds and we didn't because people Enjoy it and like last year with the flyovers people really enjoyed that during lockdown so we do get the support in that regard and The complainers are a small number of people that are highly, you know highly sensitive to it But the bulk of the community appreciates it and on the facebook page We get constant questions when is it going to be when is it going to be? How do we volunteer? I want my kids to work at it and they are disappointed to hear that we're not going to have one yet But that's the way it goes So people also have no idea how much it takes to get it organized and the really big ones are going to be leadership and then the All the dod requests if we want to try to get a military flyover because those need about a year So those will be our really key things. So just leadership would be our next thing and then we'll get some Services from recess factory and figure out what divisions we need to divide and conquer Melinda, thank you. Thank you for the update. Thank you for you bet You've been doing so far and we'll just keep checking in on this and until we need to actually Make decisions in the coming months on it. Perfect Any other board members wish to make any comment at the seabank? Mr. Robeson Thank you, mr. Chairman. Um since blended gave her update. I'll give mine Uh to become an air boss. I am going to shadow some actual air bosses or current air bosses at air shows in Nebraska Kansas Wyoming and Utah this summer And then the process is if they feel that I've learned enough they will recommend me and I take a written test And all of this shouldn't take more than a year. So I think all this is feasible Um And The only costs are $95 for the application fee and $375 a year to join their um international air show club essentially so I seem to remember someone quoting a very high figure for the air boss, but I think my costs would be well under $3,000 total even with all the travel So if that sounds good, that's what I'm planning to do. That sounds really good Outstanding thank you for pursuing that wrestle. That's that's wonderful Oh one other thing can we go back to meeting in person in july? So this was a conversation at the council meeting as well For our topic it was before the cdc's announcement this week or today Right on vaccine individuals. They were certainly waiting for I think some boulder county guidance That they were expecting to get early june I would assume we're following council and you know, I looked to david really for that answer But I I think if councils back we're back. I would love to be back too Um, I don't think we're probably not able to do anything before they do I specifically asked that question and was told we have to wait till council comes back. So Once council is back then words can be in person Go council Thank you. Thank you because I'm a chef of that information Is it is there going to be a question as to who's vaccinated? Is that gonna I get mine. I get my second one next week. So I can ask that question It's kind of just you can basically on uh, what the full level or kind of public health says After june 4th, okay in 4th there's the next Mask ordinance or mask, you know Information coming out. So always do this at that point Yeah, the upside to this is no mask In person is preferable definitely and and then it would be a matter of risk I did hear that and the council meeting was risk. So if Somebody in this group was at a higher risk and couldn't be vaccinated Didn't want to be Then how are they, you know, how do you get handled? You do is the majority meet and you Bring the others in via zoom things like that. I get the logistics part of it I think it's kind of got to be all or none. It seems like to make it work. Well Yeah, at least, you know my recap from council, they were pretty clear They want they wanted full public to be involved as well. Yeah, that's right That was definitely the requirement for bringing back in person is that you you it wasn't just council It was bringing it to Otherwise, there's not a whole lot of value in being in person zoom works to bring everybody together No, it's not the same but Any other comments from from board members? Just I just want to say again Thank you for your time presenting to council and being on your feet when the questions came in And I was definitely talking to the television But you did a good job and the questions were good. I'm glad we're having these discussions. I think I feel like To jones point that it's out. We've got a little bit more transparency And We're more aware we've been kind of working on our little projects, but we've been You know, we always know there's a bigger picture out there, but we really haven't felt like we had a and a directive To work on it. We've talked about it and to dawn's point There's been a request for quite a while to get help for david Marketing somebody to just market. Well, he run the airport and somebody else run selling it And so it's I feel like it's all finally coming together that we'll have Progress we'll see meaning meaningful discussion and progress Well, thank you melinda and I it was good to get us out in front of them and actually be able to talk through it Anybody remembers two years ago the last time we had a report to council. He and I were there I think until 11 30 p.m. And we had about 30 seconds. Yeah, they put you at the end Really valuable and you know, clearly more to do on communication, but it was a really good start. Yeah Um, I may be wrong, but I recall that being closer to about 12 55 I do remember it being very it was late. Yeah, maybe we've walked it out david. I don't remember Yeah, and to jones point too that the public there's a lot. I mean again to the accident yesterday at centennial There's the public doesn't know aviation aviation is complex It's not Not understandable, but it's complex and it's not easily understood. I know a lot of things I didn't understand until reading operations are doing rules and regs a few years ago And so they think two jets collided and I mean just the public misperception Maybe a choice of words, but they don't really get it and so anytime we can go before the public and explain what we have been doing And and how things run and that we are trying to make a profit And put money back into this, you know that we bring money into the city and that we're trying to return it councils really other than a public service announcement on channel eight, you know, this is our chance to do that so Um, it was I think it's good and we came in at a normal time that people were watching they saw it. So yeah In between sandwiched in between other things So hopefully some other people saw it and it hopefully will generate some discussion and some questions. So that'll be the best outcome absolutely Um councilmember peck, would you like to add any other comments tonight? We appreciate the perspective so far Um, I just want to thank all of you. I think you're doing a great job and I am also very Very happy that we're getting more Transparent I I should say in our discussions and I I think that the job of a liaison from city council is to bring the board the council together and and the residents to work on a vision and a plan and um Be a be a connector a liaison So, um, I I'm glad to have your input and to don dolce and heats comments and dance. Thank you very much and uh I think that's something to do that. I wouldn't mind bringing back to ledp About the marketing for the airport bring that right back to them Rather than try to hire somebody to do marketing for us. That is their job So, uh, they need to include that in their total Economic picture for long line. So thank you for that. I'll bring that back up to their next meeting Thank you councilmember peck Uh, mr. Slater anything else you'd like to add this evening. Yes, sir. Just a couple of things first, um Board member roverson started talking about air boss and everything and just about that time I kind of started shaking my head and smiling a little bit I just didn't want that to be taken the wrong way And and to explain that briefly it just still boggles my mind that somebody's a sort of like air traffic controller and has to go through this course somebody that moves planes on a regular basis and It just it still boggles my mind. So that's why I was kind of smirking and grinning about that Um, and then the second thing is I know there's some question about, uh, board members possibly meeting to discuss, um expo items um And I checked into it. I don't believe there's any issue with that However, and michelle jumped in and correct me if I say this wrong Um, I believe the recommendation is that it be recorded for transparency so that there could be Some form of minutes put together because technically if there's three three or more right Three or more then it's technically a meeting so Um, at least you can keep it relaxed You don't have to worry about the rovers rules and all of that and just have discussion about the expo but just make sure that that's clear and that There's a way that it's recorded so that we can have someone Be able to put minutes together because technically it does fall under the meeting laws That's my most recent information And that is totally, uh, correct from my understanding too for sunshine. Um, I did create a one note binder with tabs and information and kind of did a brain dump after our last meeting Went through some of my old notes and created that and I would certainly be happy to take Written minutes. We could also meet over zoom and record it We'd be limited as private individuals to I think it's 50 minutes for a meeting So that if you want to do that and you want to take that time in june We're ahead of the curve going to 2023. So before I was proposing that with a 2022 date So yeah, so since we're since we've got another year We probably don't need to do that and could look to do it at a time, you know further a little bit further down the road I'd love for you guys just to be thinking about it and thinking as you go to things and Russ, you've got a tough job ahead of you. This is going to be great If we all want to go along with him see what happens Um, so yeah as you're participating in things or noticing them and just see what catches your eye As things, you know, they're in the past have been wings credited education programs We do kids programs You know fly in the air show piece, but then for the static displays We have the expo area with all the vendors, which are quite a variety But we can add in more aviation Information displays we could focus on military aircraft or vintage aircraft or whatever we want to do So that's really what I would love you guys to just keep pondering and then when you're out and things cry, you know Now put it in your focus Clever ideas and things that we could do to set our air show apart But the big piece of it is for our public for the people around here with the flyover and and being able to get the Kids out and get on the ramp and look at all the aircraft but do we want we usually theme it and We had vance brand the last time and and kind of a theme on that We can theme it for the future for green aviation for the past for Service, you know all the rescue stuff and all the First responder things that happen so we can theme it however we want. So that's really what I'd ask you to do is ponder those things when you're flying or driving and Make a list and then we could revisit it in another board meeting. We can put it on the agenda In the summer sometime and circle back around and then start to refine things I think that sounds great. Melinda to come, you know, keep us all thinking about it We'll we'll at least mention it in july and maybe maybe we come back kind of more More discussion in august or or september depending on what else we need to be bringing up Exactly, that'd be great And then I'll keep the notes in the meantime. Yeah, I've been I've got all my old notes and then Started some new ones. So if there if anybody does want to have a discussion on it, I'll be I'll be writing it down anyway, so I'll do that Mr. Slater, did you have anything else? That's all I apologize for the odd angles. I before I turned my camera off Notice the van on the other side of the urethane I just want to make sure they're on the runway or movement hurry over there, but they're not Sorry about the odd angles. And it's all coming so ahead All right, so just before we adjourn just a reminder that our june meeting is canceled So, you know, unless we need a special meeting, which we don't anticipate at this time We will see everybody in july And with that then I will adjourn our may 13th meeting. Thank you everyone for the participation Really good discussion this evening and we will see you in july. Have a good evening. Good night. Thank you