 We are talking about radios that you make from scratch, lamps, wooden extensions, power banks, zasimu. From scratch. And where do you actually operate when you do all this? I'm based at Lake Isama, it's besides Kasarani. Initially I used to work from home, but recently because the business is doing well and more people are reaching out to it. So I decided to have a shop just in the nearby place where I stay. So people buy actually these things? Ya sure, people buy. What do they say, they feel from the ground? They are very powerful and durable, so people are switching from the other source of lights to these lamps. Because they are now noting that they are more durable and they are also affordable. And they also come with the warranty. And the warranty is for how long? For 6 months. So how did you come up with this idea in the first place to go and make something out of waste? I started since my childhood in my early teens. They say that the chick that will grow into a hen and this also implies to the one that will grow into a coke. Is seen on the day it hatches. So the day you hatched, you knew your potential? Ya, so in my early teens I started exhibiting characters that were to be recognized little later. Ya, I started doing things that today turned out well today. So my dad used to buy lamps so that we can study. But I was not good in class, so most of my time, I took most of my time opening the lamps wanting to see what is inside. So in the process of opening, I did not have a screwdriver or the required tools for opening. So I used to break, maybe I hit with a stone. So after breaking, after seeing what is inside, to return was a problem. So I used to tie it to the silo tape. And silo tape was also nowhere to be found. I just tied it with a thread or even the mahogany glue. But now these items that you are breaking, what are your father's items, all of them? Ya, my dad used to buy lamps a lot because at rural home there was no electricity. And buying paraffin was also expensive. So that was back then when you were at home? Ya, in class 4, class 5. So growing up you grew up at home back? Ya, I just came in Nairobi in 2017 to look for green up pastures. Means you grew up from a humble background? From a very humble background at the beginning. So he bought lamps? Ya, he bought lamps. You break them up, you find out what is inside? Ya, in the process of returning back to its original place, you find that it could not come back to its original position. So when dad came back he used to quarrel maybe sometimes. Because the lamps was to be used by the whole family. And you find that one person had destroyed it. So that's a whole kenning that he received? Ya, but eventually, slowly by slowly, he came to realize that this is a talent and potential. Ya, so he also, when he started getting the west, he used to bring it to me. So he embraced your kind of unfamiliar character of breaking items. It became something that he familiarized himself with. So he said that I brought you this one, so don't touch mine. Ya, so just destroyed the one that is already destroyed. Yes, and live along with mine. So growing up, how were you doing in school? Because you said you didn't like much of the books. You preferred going hands on. Your hands of kind of a person? Ya, back in primary, while I was in class 6, I was an altar server. So in a few years to come, I would be ordaining as a priest, but electronics took most of my time. Ah, you used to be at the altar. Is that where you still are? In a few years time you will be ordaining. Ya, I would be ordaining maybe. If I had continued, that is. Oh, ya, if you had continued. Ya, but electronics took most of my time. I could not concentrate in church. So I started most of my time while at home or even at school. I used to come up with the things that took most of my time. Let's take a look at these things. You can describe how each one was made. I don't know how you made it. Are they all made in the same way? Ya, they are all made in the same way, but in different shapes. I think we can light it up. Ya, let's light it up and see. Wow, looks beautiful. So they are all made in the same way? You can give us just a brief overview of these things now. Okay, like this one, it's 90% ewest. The only thing that I bought from a shop is the switchbox. The patrice. Same to this one. This is 100% recycled. This is 100% recycled? Ya. I'm seeing some cables here. Ya, the cable was void and thrown away. So I took the other side. Ya, because the other side used to charge phones, and the other side is inserted in the charger. So how is it powered? It's powered by... Okay, you can charge it using the normal phone charger. So you connect this to a phone charger? Or just in place where they use beacon. So you get an adapter for this? Ya. And also when you charge, you see it lighting here, up here. Ya, there is a signal not for you that it's charging. So when it doesn't charge, it won't light here? Okay. Yes. I wish you had... did you carry a power bank? Ah, no. No? You said you make power banks also. Ya, I make. I wish I could see one. Ya, I make a lot of things. So I just carried this specifically because most of the people buy the lamps. Ya, I make power banks and radios but I only get order from my client. Oh, okay, okay. So it's not like you just make them and display them. It's per order. Ya. All right? Yes. What do people say when they see things like this? Ah, people get happy. Especially your family. And your father, is he still there? Ya, he's still there. Ya. And when he sees you do great things like this? He's very happy and he wished me all the best. Ya, he's a very prayerful man. Ya, he do pray for me, even my mum. They wish that they predict good on me. Ah. Yes. They support you. They really support you. This is quite good, Patrick. This is quite good. So the expense used to make this isn't that much. You just buy what is inside here. Somehow, what is it called? Electronics. For this lamp? Yes. How are electronics and electricals? What's the difference? Okay, one is electronics are the tiny things that are the tiny components. But electricals may be the hardware, the big things like these ones. Okay. Ya. So you only use money to buy the electricals? Yes. Okay, all because like in the slum where I stay, they sell a lot of wind electronics there. Oh, okay, okay. So when it comes to this, somebody can trust that it can last long. How long can this last once it's lit up? It also depends on how you take care of it. Because you can't just mishandle it and you expect it to stay for long. But I try to make something durable so that I can win people's trust. The one that has gone for long, the one that I know has gone up to one and a half years. Yes. So that if you really take care of it, but sometimes they fall? Sometimes also people… Of course, normal day to day running, you know, unagonga meza in anguka chini. Ya, in most cases, you see, you find out that people leave it to their children and children also want to see what is inside. Just like I used to be. Because there is another Patrick somewhere. Ya, there are a lot of Patrick's. You want to break and find out what is inside? Somebody want to break and find out what is inside this? Yes. Okay, okay. So when it comes to the market, how are you marketing yourself so that this can go outside there? This kind of technology? I use various methods of marketing. Initially I used to work from one person to another. But the first generation lambs, people used to criticize them a lot. Ya, people could laugh and say that I'm doing things that they used to do in early 60s. So that really discouraged me. Ya, that was before COVID-19. You know, people sometimes can be very discouraged. So they told you that whatever you're doing is outdated? Ya. So I should come up with new things that I featured in the 21st century. Wow. Ya. You never gave up? I gave up for a while. You stopped it? Ya. What made you come back and how long was it that you took a step back? I started it in 2018. Ya, as a business. So, due to people criticizing it, I stopped. But during the COVID-19 pandemic, ya, you know, everything was in mess. Ya, nothing was in order. So there was no money, everybody was to fend for himself. So I got a donation from GiveDirectly of 12,000 shillings. That's $20. So I used the money to restart the lamp business. How did they get in touch with you? How did they reach out? Give Directly usually give people money. Ya, poor people money for their personal use. But I used the opportunity to come to restart the business. Because initially the customers whom I had sold the lamps initially were requesting. For more lamps? Ya. The more people criticized it, there are some who had seen the importance of it. Ya, so I chose to go with the people who recognized it. So I decided to continue making. You know, there's one thing that is quite interesting and that many innovators fail to get. Taking advantage of your networks. Taking advantage of the people around you, the customers you have and of course the organizations that are there that offer assistance or support. Ya, you know, most of the people, when people get money, maybe one may be tempted to buy good shoes, expensive clothings and maybe to party. It's not easy to handle money, especially unexpected money. Because I did not expect the funds from Give Directly. So it came abruptly. So I had a lot of options on what I can use the money to do. But by that time, because I had some customers requesting the lamps and also I had always been wanting to restart again the business. Ya, because I liked technology a lot. So I was finding the best thing I can do in technology. But I'm aware that you also work with the kids, children? Yes, yes. I feature the kids. The certain percentage of money I get from sales, I give them. Some are street kids. So you give back to the community? Yes, I give back the community. I give back the light. And also, there are some people that I give light as a grant, as a donation. I just don't sell to everyone. Because maybe there is an old person who is selling, maybe has a small grocery. He doesn't have light. Maybe he just want maybe if we can just get a hundred chillings only. So you see such a person raising the money for lamps. One for lamps is a bit hectic. So there are some factors that I consider before selling. Because the mamambogas need something like this? Yes, because electricity is not everywhere. And also in some areas you see the blackout is frequent. And also in rural areas most of the places doesn't have electricity. What are your target areas, especially in the slum areas? Which particular places do you target when it comes to this as your market? Okay. I target just Kenyans, but specifically people with glossaries. People places with the frequent blackouts. Like which particular slum? Because in Nairobi you have so many slums. In Korogocho and Ngomongo? Ngomongo and Korogocho. Yes. And even in Kayole I have sold some most. So you walk around and meet, sometimes you give away for free and go for yourself? Yes. So when I give away for free you tell that person the lamp costs this amount. So you will find out that another person comes. So he brings you the person by referral. He says that somebody saw your lamp and he is interested. So he links me up with the person and I sell the lamp. So now most of the time people just call me bring me another lamp. Because when a person buys the first lamp there is high probability that he will buy the second, third even the fourth. And if he doesn't buy he will bring me another custom. So they often recommend. Yes. And that's what I was saying earlier. Sometimes we fail to take advantage of the customers we have. You know, marketing ourselves. Ninauza he tell a friend, tell a friend, tell a friend. Yeah customers really play an important role in marketing. Because they can recommend you or even not recommend you. For example if the lamp was not good or durable. They could say that maybe this lamp, if you could get another alternative just go with it. Because the lamps are not good. But you see they promote me. They spread good gospel. They say the lamp is good so you can buy it. Wow. Yeah so they play an important role. Very very important. Yes. I don't know if you had those photos that I received. If they are ready we can declare a few of them. Faith. If they are maybe you can let me know. Are they ready? No. Amakuna. Those particular photos. Alright. Let me show you. I hope they are ready. Because I wanted you to comment on those particular pictures that you had sent earlier. But as we come to a close. What are some of those things that you've seen in terms of that particular experience that have really inspired you to want to do more especially in this area, in this industry? I've been inspired by a lot of things. First of all the customers. When a customer buys the lamp he recommends it positively. He tells me to keep it up. And also most of the people wish that they had the talent I have. So I see that if someone else is wishing the thing I have. So I should work on it thoroughly. Also I have some good friends that support me. After I give directly posting my story. I have friends across the world. You post your stories? They posted my story on LinkedIn. Your friends posted your story. We need such kind of friends. Everybody needs such kind of friends. They are very supportive. And that's why you also got to be known by other people beyond where you are. Thank you so much for coming Patrick. I wish you the best. Thank you. Keep doing what you're doing. I love this. I think everybody needs lamps like this. Especially this one. It's quite small and I love how it looks. It's durable and portable. We can just carry it along. We can carry it anywhere. Especially the ladies when you have bags. Instead of carrying that iron box. Thank you so much for coming. I appreciate it. Thank you for having me. Of course that brings us to the end of this particular conversation on lambs from EU waste. Of course we are with Patrick here. An inventor and innovator giving us his thoughts in regards to this particular issue. So I hope you've learnt something. Keep talking to us. The hashtag is why in the morning. We want to make sure Patrick will be back in a bit. And of course my name is Ram Magukko. Thank you so much for being part of this conversation. We still have more coming up here. We are right here on why in the morning.