 Marc-Antoine, the floor is yours. Thank you very much. Just to go back on this initial statement, Narendra you made passionately about this North-South divide and all the obstacles that are related to that. I mean in a way you're probably right that a number of concerns in the South are not included and taken on board but on the other hand it kind of leads to think that well you know if we fail to tackle you know the climate change properly etc it's because of that divide and I think that's a little bit of a reduction to give you a few examples. I think you know the LNG thing that you mentioned is maybe not the right example because if you really think it's a South-South issue because actually the Bangladesh Minister of Energy or whatever should have surmounted the Russian ambassador and told him why are you cutting supplies to Germany because as a consequence of that we don't get our LNG because the fact that the LNG was diverted is fully obeying contracts. It's a contract. There was no violation whatsoever. The problem is that the Russians have not fulfilled their contracts and hence there was no gas in Germany so the Germans went on a market. It's a market and if you have if you don't have the market you don't have the LNG right and nothing works and so I think there's a lot of South-South issues. I think we have a major issue as far as the South-South issues are related because China that dominates the G77 via Pakistan which is a very strange issue. China is no more a developing country but it is recognized as such in the global climate governments right so they should pay their part of all the development money of all the adaptation and mitigation etc etc. I'm sure you will agree with that. Nothing to do with India, a very separate case. Now is it also an issue of governments? You know for example you mentioned the IEA we had also this conversation but since we we had it I mean India has been invited to become a member of the of the IEA. Well yes yeah I mean they're working on changing they're working on changing the treaty establishing the the IEA so and you know so and and in the same organization there is another of other BRICS countries say that are down the table so I mean there is at least this forum which is no it's a little bit more than the forum anyway and now now then of course there's COP now the point is I think I like the idea of this kind of energy security council I think that's quite interesting now who would you put in there the largest consumers and the largest producers but then there's nobody in Africa so then you have to make exceptions but then all of a sudden you have a hundred countries around the table or 80 or 70 and so then what do you do do you listen to 70 present have you ever attended the UN you know council a national sorry general assembly meeting I mean it's just insane you three days of presentations because every country has I don't know five or seven minutes and then you know you listen to these things so there's an issue of okay how how would that exactly play out and and then what would it actually be able to do because like would we discuss with the Russians you know the gas problems in Europe so the Russians would say you know their narrative then the Europeans would say oh they would start saying this is an insane aggression and then you know after after two hours we wouldn't have moved an inch so the Russians would have said no it's the fault of the Europeans the Europeans would have said no it's the you know so I think there is this issue of not to be underestimated the big problem of global governance is also the effectiveness to act right and we have a chance to have somehow some institutions that somehow work so maybe you know let's try to improve that but on the other hand on the other hand I think this council would make sense perhaps for for several things one thing is on oil it's interesting so we are here in one of the largest world's producers and it's interesting see there are fundamental issues on oil that you also find in gas for example so the issue is how do we how do we ensure a fair redistribution of risks of you know profits between the consumer and the and the off-taker sorry and the producer and and I think this discussion might come back because we are now we will somehow you know have a peak oil demand coming we can discuss when it's coming etc but then we will have to manage you know how much investments we still put into the system to avoid a global instability but still to ensure that we are you know on track to a reduce demand and b to you know align the production the progressive production reduction with that so that requires I think a good dialogue with the Saudis with the Emiratis with the Russians one day when they go back so that you know the oil price is not 130 but not 50 and so that here they can invest in their transition and so that the consumers in India in Europe etc there is no big social unrest and the governments are not destabilized because they all have to focus on the transition and on the stability right so I think this we could discuss in such a format I think another thing is clearly so what do we do with natural gas and here we could also have you know a kind of pathway because now all the emerging economies have been deprived of access to the spot the energy market right and as you said known as being said they're getting back to call but but still we could discuss a pathway where okay you know what is the 15 years perspective we know what kind of investments are coming in upstream energy we know more or less you know what could be the demand profile in Europe and Japan and Taiwan and in South Korea and China and the large energy off takers and so then we could discuss you know what voice could then be progressively possibly freed up again for these countries for you know under what terms etc etc so there's a number of issues there that could be discussed and you know we we mentioned the electricity systems I mean frankly with the inflation that we have with the money all going to the US are we realistically going to be able to lay out you know all the solar panels that we're talking about etc I doubt but what is for sure is that you know even the numbers and the trajectory on which we are on that is two trillion investments by 2030 versus 1.2 last year well that's still two times less than what is needed for 1.5 degree trajectory so in any case we are we are missing the targets but then you know what are the consequences of failure the other aspects that could be discussed is of course to the clash of industrial policies I mean this is a uncooperative world we are entering in and so there's short-term protectionism one understands why but then longer term you know of course it will probably slow down some developments or at least increase costs for some and and what others who have more money might be able to better cope and then yes on the climate governments I I just would like to to emphasize the issue that again we could discuss in such a format you know the need for a carbon price globally so you know in India it might be 20 with a you know with a pathway to 50 over 15 years and in the US and Europe be it the shadow price or real price we start at 100 and then we move to 150 you know and and at least that there is a that there is a global movement in that sense and I and I'm confident that it can be done I mean we have a minimum taxation for large corporations which was negotiation for a very long time two years ago people thought it's impossible but at the end it was achieved right and and I'm sure in Russia we even in Russia there were discussions and you know stakeholders interested so it's not impossible it's not impossible even for fossil fuel producing country and yeah and the last word of course that could also discuss everything related to sustainable finance because we can't have 200 definitions of you know what is green finance what is not green finance what is you know in the taxonomy what is not so obviously it is a massive need of harmonization here because if I'm a global investor well in in Europe nuclear by the way it's not entirely in the taxonomy it's under conditions same for natural gas but you know in Japan there's no discussion about nuclear and the taxonomy neither in China neither in Russia neither in India I'm sure if you put one but so again and in the US of course not so here of course also need anyway I'll stop here but yes let's take this conversation forward on this on this governance issue if I have the just quickly respond to it won't take much time you see interesting points I mean I think this is what's required we need conversation it's not that I'm 100% right or you 100% wrong or you 100% right or we 100% wrong no such thing we need more conversation around it for instance international energy agency you say that India and China have been invited to be to be members no there is no truth in it India and China both the giants and the second or the third largest consumer of energy are been invited to sit outside the room in the lounge they associate members so you can invite somebody you invite somebody to this conference and say you can't come in because this is sacrosanct space go and sit in the lounge so that's the status now we have to be honest the fact is that there are many members of IEA especially the smaller OECD country they don't want to change the constitution of IEA is the idea of the president chief executive of IEA that means that many of the founding members of IEA don't agree we also have consultations with them we also have regular consultation so on IEA so we need and moreover IEA is a kind of DNA is what happened in early 1970s in response to the oil embargo from this part of the world so is DNA is different to ask any professor who specialized on DNA to change DNA is very very difficult takes generation why can't we just create something new the quick point on this south-south cooperation or the south-south problem it is not because you see anything that happens for instance if we buy LNG from Qatar you see a we pay in dollars money has to go via somewhere in the west majority of lawyers specializing in international contracts are based in London New York and such places third you know when it comes to technology LNG technology is with very limited number of country there and all in the north actually mostly Germany Lindey and others so it's actually is it's not really we can't just say there's south-south because it's actually both north and south it is a north-south issue now that's how we need to kind of look at things without being you know when I say that we need conversation or not I'm not accusing anybody all I'm saying is have conversations have dialogues we listen to you you listen to us otherwise we are going to create thousands of energy Ukraine's across the world do we want energy Ukraine's around the world now final point I just want to make is that when it comes to you know when you talked about you know these agency I let me give you an example there is an inter governmental organization called international solar alliance how many in this room have heard of it none yeah so international solar alliance is an intergovernmental organization it was anchored by India and France is headquartered in India India has been pushing very hard to kind of make it like the IEA of solar energy and you know the country which are resisting supporting but at the same time resisting it's a fine art it's not that easy you can't say you're resisting because I'm a member of international I'm even contributing but I don't want you to be able to grow so it's far more complex my friend so what we need is honest conversation that's all I'm saying I'm not accusing anybody I'm not saying IEA is bad all I'm saying is the world has changed and the world is changing gravity center has moved to our part of the world this is a new world if the north still kind of is very adamant they refuse to listen to even to a conversation trust me they will regret it in 25 years from now thank you very much just to to build on what you said you mentioned the solar alliance I think in energy there are groups or institutions or association on natural gas and nuclear and so on the thing is that it's it's very often polluted by politics and you see it's my experience at the UN my experience in the private sector it's very difficult to have a honest conversation and we see that nowadays in gas and many other sectors so it's not an easy task it's an important task to and we have to move forward in this way for sure there's one platform that that is interesting according to me is the regional commission of the UN in Bangkok escape where India is a member with all these nations and they are doing a great job on all these issues Fridbert the floor is yours I'm a bit skeptic what concerns this idea not because I I'm against talking and talking between north and south and and and of course dialogue is always good but the best governance for for energy was a liberal free energy market not politicized well that has broken down as has as the whole world has turned more protectionist more my nation first well Trump said America first but mr. Biden is doing pretty much the same a little bit nicer words a bit more diplomatic but the the core is the same and wherever we we look around in the world this notion of a multi-polar discussing world looking for better governance is pretty much vanishing away and what we see is more and more a g2 world a confrontation between the real two superpowers and basically they they all tell us make your choice on which side you are and I agree and that's a little bit the ideology of India during the block confrontation in the cold war the block free nations we should do our utmost Europeans Indians not to go into this polarization try to get rid of that as much as we can but I fear that the signals in the moment are going are showing in exactly the other direction you're heading for energy cold war yeah thank you so much other comments from the room last question or comments you would like to raise no we close here I thank you very much it was a great pleasure to have you all here I think the conversation was very useful and thank you to hold the speakers and panelists have a great evening thank you so much