 Yeah. Kindergarten. Kindergarten. Yeah. Yeah, a garden for kinders. Yeah. That's a cute name. Oh my god. Oh no, it's okay. I'm just gonna pack my dish. Welcome back to life lessons in film. Hello. Today, on the program, we are talking about analyzing the kindergarten teacher. There's a good film. There's a good film. There's a lot to reflect on. Wait, I have to do the 22nd thing? Oh yes, yes, yes, yes. To describe it. Yes, yes, yes. 20 seconds to give a synopsis so that we're all on the same page. The movie is about a kindergarten teacher who, an aspiring poet, she's always wanted to be a poet but she did not succeed, so she is living with unfulfilled dreams. Then she discovers that one of her pupils is a child protégé poet and then starts to live vicariously through that kid and that is basically the whole movie. Yeah, basically doing lots of things that go back to her, living vicariously through the kid. Yeah, there were a couple main strains there in that movie. The character, the main Maggie Kellar character is very good. There's a lot of unfulfilled parents out there and it can manifest in a lot of different ways and it's never good. Again, life is unfulfilling for everyone to a certain degree. You just have to accept it and I don't know, I think maybe also it's easy. There are people I think that don't listen to their butt guy own, their gut biome, when it's telling them that you're feeling unfulfilled, maybe you should change something up so that in 20 years you've got kids that are grown, you don't then resent everybody or have so many regrets or all the, yeah, you switch your life up for a midlife crisis, listen then and then see what you can do. To be fair, she is going to poetry classes, right? Yeah, that's true. So we kind of discovered later that she probably didn't finish her university degree and so we think because she's going, she's attending these poetry classes, night classes, she's probably wanted, she probably won't have aspirations of becoming a poet. So she does keep going when she has her career as a kindergarten teacher and then at night, once a week goes to these classes and so she is, she thinks she's following her gut. Yeah, yeah, you're right. She's probably hoping, oh maybe I will get some recognition out of this. I'll do it enough and they also write my own poetry and then I'll get recognized a little bit. Yeah, that's true. So yeah, to her credit she is trying to follow her dreams and to, you know, what you're saying about like people following their gut biome or their butt guy however, as we say that, right, there is that whole thing where sometimes, you know, you talked about acceptance and sometimes I think following your gut means more aligning or accepting your real who you really are instead of pursuing relentlessly your ideal self because I think that's the thing with a lot of people. A lot of us have this idea of what we want and obviously that's molded by society and so you have this vision of yourself that you keep pushing for and sometimes you just keep pushing for it even though there's so many things, so many signs that say stop pushing, it does not work for you. Like I don't have the most magnificent voice but I would have loved it when I was a kid. I used to, the idea of being a singer on stage, I would pretend whenever there was this a singer that I loved, you know, that I was watching and I'm like oh my gosh that would be so cool if I were that but you know then imagine then despite the fact that I cannot sing to save my life, I'm not the worst but you know imagine then I'm pushing for this thing when I'm very clearly aware of the fact that I do not have that capacity. Yeah, do you know what I mean? That reminder or it may be depicting us pursuing our ideal self despite all evidence that you should stop and then look at yourself as you are and maybe start looking at the things about you that or even appreciating. You know what I mean? Like appreciating yourself as you are, I think that's something for me in that movie the whole time. There's this lack of appreciation of who she is at that present moment and she has a very beautiful life she has. The husband that loves her, she has, she's a kindergarten teacher, kids are just fantastic and she's also very good at it. Which is it's it's hard enough to find a job that you're good at that you get enjoyment out of and and as the one person I think in her class said it's an honorable profession to be a kind of grand teacher that's the future that's our kids and you got to leave a good impression on kids when they're young and you know but it doesn't seem to really she's like yeah and I get it right when you do it as a job it's never as magical as someone that just hears that sounds important that sounds great good for you you know because you do it every day and you're like yeah but it's my life you know but I think there is that where people still want more and I think first of all accept again that you know there's gonna be you're probably gonna find yourself a little disappointed with your life but also that's a frame of mind like that you can also just look at it as look like especially where it came from depending on all the hurdles I got over look what I've accomplished and and yeah look you know this isn't so bad you know why do I even feel the need to you know have have things differently you know and when you have things differently you have other negatives that come along with that too so it's yeah you know it's important to keep that perspective I uh the part that that I like thinking about with that movie the most and it's because I just like thinking about it it tackles a little bit about art and the the creativity what is creativity what is good art versus bad art because she's in the poetry class and and the teacher doesn't want them to compare he's like don't try and please me with your stuff just allow yourself to feel free and comfortable and write something which I think is the right approach for good creativity um or good creativity for just creativity um but you know the people are competitive and so you read it out and there's still people being like oh I like that you know and they probably feel like oh my things crap but especially with poetry it's it's it's like painting I think it's a bit more of an abstract art music to a degree you can still feel like people most people even if you're tone deaf yourself you can generally tell when people are singing out of key so there's still a bit of that kind of technical like that is at least your least hitting the notes properly where the poetry and painting there's even kind of in my in my point in my mind might be less rules uh concrete rules with that apart from like being able to spell be able to actually like read the yeah um so it's hard to really know it's all about do you connect with it yeah and everyone's going to connect with different stuff differently so it's really hard to tell and they have like not a they have a poetry competition I think at one point in the movie which again it's I think it's more just it's you can only ever take it so seriously because it's so subjective a lot of competitions are but especially but that's not a bad thing either I like the poetry subjective but anyway it's all it's it's to think about you know what is good technique in things like poetry or art in general and how do you develop that she got critiqued at one point because her metaphors were kind of the stuff that people go to a lot when you're first starting out so you know it's it's kind of like your mainstream your mainstream or and then kind of just yeah like the stuff like okay you clearly took that from like a well-known poet right you're kind of which but the the thing the reason why the the teacher recognizes that is I think he gets the process of poetry it's like if you're starting off playing guitar you first okay what are some of the most iconic fun licks to play so you learn like some of the classic jimmy page jimmy hendrix licks right and then from there you try and change it up and you played enough that you start to develop your own but everything you know bob dillon started off just ripping off I think Woody Guthrie you know you have to at first um creativity is only ever so original it's mostly just taking stuff that's already been and you mix it in different ways so everyone has to first just start ripping off people and then you you hopefully also have to immerse yourself enough to have different influences and then yeah and then your own voice is kind of a different amalgam of these things yeah but I always find that very interesting when it comes to what is creativity and and how do you keep a creative mind and and trust yourself enough to feel like I think this is original and and I also don't think that you know how do you avoid you know plagiarism and things and um yeah it's it's fascinating for me I don't know I was just thinking about her that the relationship she has with the with the poetry teacher that the poetry teacher points out later as when he discovers that she so she starts writing the the the child protege's poet poems and then presents them as her own in class initially but then later reveals that they were her the kids all all along and when the poetry teacher thought that they were her poems that he then has his conversation with with her about how wow you know you've really come a long way I'm very impressed by it because initially when you started I thought you were really not a good poet and then you all of a sudden come with these things these poems and it's fascinating and then she sees him see her as her ideal self right and and that makes her sad in the beginning because at that time when they went when she's having that conversation with him she'd gone there to recite a poem that she that was original that she'd written and he's like ah it's okay but you know it's not one of your best but like you've been really good I'm sure you wrote it you know maybe you were tired because she does that I was tired and she's like and he's like yeah but you've been so great like the path the refers again to the kids poems and that she feels really lush it knocks her down but then as after not after that happens he goes and he and he goes back to talking about the how incredible the poems that she's been reciting have been the kids poems right she just looks she sees him looking at him that way and she revels in that you know and I think it's really interesting you know how sometimes even though even though it's a lie in that moment being seen for this thing that you aspire to be I think it gave her this it filled that emptiness that she had in that moment and so that's when she just ends up having the affair which is obviously very problematic you know just to enjoy the moment of being adored for this ideal self that she keeps pushing for so relentlessly you know I can see that she's really putting in the work I think a lot of us you know we would have it's it's hard for all for people to keep putting in the work every single day you know even with just this youtube thing sometimes you know like after work I'm so exhausted but I'm like okay we commit it to this and we love it and and so we're gonna do it despite how exhausted I am and so and then you keep at it and you get better you know and but then when you're when you're doing that when you are truly putting in the work because she is and it's not getting you anywhere it is so um what's the word yeah it is it is so deflating and it just and you just feel like man can I can't can't I catch a break so I feel bad for her in that sense and I think that's probably why it is that her mental capacities fail a little bit and that's why she ends up doing all of these things that are just make no sense and she does not see clearly I think that's what it is yeah although I would say I would even bring that back to uh you know what is creator or how do you maintain creativity and a sense of originality is is even though I think we all now and then even if you're someone that truly just does their creative outlet there are purely for the enjoyment of the process of it and not caring about getting recognition or oh I should you know I should catch a break by now they don't care about any outside recognition or or you know esteem they don't care about any of that even though now and then everyone enjoys that but that I think is crucial to have because then that's also what helps you develop your own sense because I think eventually you also stop stop looking at other influences so much because then you just start getting into your own groove and then you just enjoy that your own groove so much that it evolves on its own thing without being influenced as much you know and then you're also not worrying about you know will this so then you can focus purely on that which keeps you motivated keeps you inspired and then that's how it evolves I think I think if you're living life with the view to get validated by other people if you are someone who is in that space of not being okay with yourself not having that validation within yourself and not eating other people to do that for you I think if you are that then you can be creative and write and all these things without being knocked down by external influences you know what I mean yeah but and and I think for example as much as she's here kind of seemingly flogging a dead horse with the poetry classes she keeps doing this and then she keeps getting negative feedback from her peers and that then turns this love that she basically her relationship with poetry becomes very unhealthy and toxic for her and the people around her and but then this is the thing that she loves right and so for me if she was more confident within herself these things wouldn't knock her down do you know what I mean and also no one knows what's going on in your head and your heart and with something that's really creative I think it's just difficult to get direction from someone because their direction as well stems from so many things their personality their character right there how they were socialized whatever you know what I mean it's a tricky thing with creative stuff to take someone's advice but then also listen to what you're trying to do yeah stuff thing and it's kind of create art creating is kind of a different version of do you compare yourself to other people or do you compare yourself to how you used to be because then that way that keeps you motivated you're like well I know I've improved from how I used to be in this way you know because you'll never there's you'll never really feel good about yourself you're always looking outward you know there's always going to be someone who's thicker than you or wider than you or larger than you yeah you know metaphorically yes yeah one of the things that stood out of course in the movie is her relationship with her kids you know her being this regret that she has for her unfulfilled dreams it then affects how how she parents her children and the kind of relationship she has with her kids there are those parents who want to live vicariously through her kids I think she first she in the movie we see her living vicariously through this child but it seems based on the relationships and the conversations that I had with the family that she initially was trying to do that with her kids a lot of parents do do that right like they see their kids as an extension of themselves and they have this idea that if you're if you if there were hope if you had hopes and dreams that you didn't fulfill you can have a kid and then you can channel your kid towards your own hopes and dreams and then when the kid accomplish the accomplishes those hopes and dreams that you've never did then finally you can breathe that sigh of relief finally having accomplished this thing it manifested in a very bad relationship with the with the with her kids right yeah leads her to steal a child as much as we talked about how not you shouldn't want external sources of validation but it is very different when it comes to your parents you want your parents to not to be proud of you because these are people you love like even if you have a horrible relationship with your parents and you fought and you feel like you're in you're so angry at them and you move countries they are with you your family your blood is with you no matter what even that anger that anger is a sign that you love them no matter how much you try and you know fool yourself into thinking that no i'm over this family and so your life and your happiness in primarily depends on um how good a relationship the kind of relationship what you have with your family with your parents and you know how your how your family uh works also then will translate into how you interact with the world right this they influence in so many ways so having a parent that tells you i'm so proud of you that really sees you and appreciates you for who you are and talks to you and says to you i see this thing about you even though it's completely different um from who i am and um you know what like what i would like i really love this thing about you and i'm so curious about it i want to learn about it and i'm so proud of you for for finding things that you love and following um your dreams you know and so that's the kind of relationship you'd ideally want with your parents and she doesn't give that to her kids because she's so obsessed with her own ambitions and she's wanting her kids to fulfill her own dreams and she talks about how the kids the kids are not cultured they're not into poetry you know and intellectualism they're all about instagram and commercialism and how did this happen this generation and i'm like how do you these are your kids how did it happen parent you are the parent your kids are the way that they are because of you yeah can't blame it all on the school or society you know you have the biggest impact especially early on exactly maybe people kind of like that takes away some of the like the the uh responsibility yeah maybe like ah well it's the world's fault yeah it's not going to do with me everyone wants at the end of the day is to be appreciated seen for who they are by their parents primarily but also by everybody or as many people as possible and uh and that's where so much of the the fights i think come in the dysfunction and an over identity and who you are and and trying to find something that that feels like a true self that's ever everyone's going through that so really be a parent and just have kids and i know it's it's maybe easier said than done but uh that that's that's like so much of the struggle in the human condition is just not being seen for who you want to be seen as yeah just let people have a human experience yeah let them be yeah you just be yeah it's it's interesting to me because we've had this conversation a lot about parents and how they don't when you're when they have children they they don't see you as an individual and they don't raise you as an individual which i think that's what parents ought to do when you're having when you have a kid i don't think it's fair to have a kid just because you're like you know because this is someone you want to mold in a certain direction i think being a parent is looking at your kid and seeing what are the what traits does this person have what kinds of things are they interested in if they are like you okay great it makes it easier you know you can channel them towards you know towards a certain career or any first or something it's easier for you because you're similar right because at the end of the day as a parent you're supposed to be guiding your kids through life right you're the person who helps them socialize into their society and so that's your role as a parent but if you do it in a way where you are um in a restrictive way you know where you say i want you to become a whatever you know and you're doing that just because that's something that you wanted to do and so well if i didn't do it you have to do it so i can finally be happy yeah and then you start ignoring who your kids are and then it kind of feels like a contingent love i only care you only love me if i if i act this way and if or if i am this kind of person and on the on the flip side it's either wanting to live vicariously through the person through your kid or uh there seems to be a lot of people that struggle with yeah i guess like thinking not even more abstractly but just being more open-minded where they can only get along with people that like this sports team that have this kind of job that live in this area so that really limits what your kid can then do so then you know understandably they kind of want to hold on because they're like well i'm i love my kid because growing up you can create this bond but then what if they start to become someone that goes in a totally different career chant then i'm not going to be able to get along with them yeah that's fine again you can still find common stuff to get along with them like doesn't it suck when you your body starts to age and you notice you you start to creep and crack and it's you struggle everyone can relate to that or like find just universal things everyone can relate to if they do end up being you know an architect versus working in finance it's like you can still find you know but some people to have like unless you are the exact same i can't get along with anyone else who's not who's slightly deviated from me yeah and which is the other interesting thing right because um i think that's that is why she does that because and a lot of parents i think do that too where they're trying to have their kids be interested in the same kinds of things um that they were because then there's that similarity you create your own kind of friend and in the family like on the dinner at the dinner table then you're having a conversation around things that you as a parent understand instead of like of things that you know that you don't understand again that is really problematic if you're the kind of person um who's who needs to be into the same kinds of things who needs to you know watch the same kinds of movies or uh i don't know like the same kinds of fun activities or extracurricular activities if you're that kind of person who only makes friends with people who watch exactly the same things you know that's i don't know that's such a limiting thing you know i also don't think that material things um should be the premise of a relationship because we could be watching the same movie we could love hiking both you and i and we really truly love hiking but what's happening like um at the height the conversation the conversation is not really filling me up here and um after i just feel very dry or even drained um after having after going for the hike with you which never mind the height you know at that point it doesn't really matter well like i said that's why i think everyone should talk about their mortality more with people because that's something we can all relate to it's a it's a looming thing uh and instead of exactly because as much as we were saying you shouldn't need to have all the same material interests to get along with someone and then i'm thinking myself i'm like to be fair if there's someone that i can't really connect with on just a base human level and all we can do is talk about oh did you want do you like that show would you watch that and if you don't have those same interests it does make it hard to be on that person but that's not what i'm saying i'm not saying like we're not supposed to hang out that's the that's exactly the point right even if the um someone enjoys stuff that i like i know people who enjoy the the material things that i like you know the outdoors right i know people who love that and but but despite the fact that these people enjoy those things we do not they're not people that i really you know like we don't connect in ways that matter yeah i don't feel well that's what i'm saying is if you can't connect with people on the on the on the real the heart on the soul nothing else matters yeah to me that then you do need to find people then it is important that you like the same material things why because then you can at least be like oh wasn't that great yeah that was great that was a cool for what for a relationship a lasting relationship it's not gonna be great but i'm just saying you can at least if we're talking about if we're talking about small talk yeah sure yeah but even then yeah i feel like but that's the thing is i think why some people look like you gotta like the same sports team you gotta have all these things because they're unable to connect on more uh meaningful levels then that's why they're so desperate to like i hope you like the same sport as i do hope you like the same music as i do because that's all i got yeah but i yeah exactly but that's why i think people should talk about death more well i don't know what people should talk about more i i don't necessarily want that we don't talk about death at all no i mean we do for whatever reasons uh every now and then but it's um i i don't i never first thing you should do when you're meeting a new person is you're like how are you gonna feel right before you die are you gonna feel good about yourself no but just being vulnerable is the most important i think that that is the foundation of a good relationship being vulnerable naggy gillen hall's character um so vehemently tries to mold her kids in a certain way attest to her inability to connect in that way her inability to connect with people outside of material things and i think that's then that then manifests as a parent then you become that kind of parent who who only sees your kids mattering if they do perform a certain way and unfortunately you know like that creates a very distant relationship you know because then your your parent is never even the things that you accomplish your parent is never recognizing as accomplishments because there aren't stuff that she wants you to accomplish at the end of the day so you're never feeling you know like someone is proud of you you're never and the person that matters the most is proud of you yeah i'll say that's pretty much i don't know funny did we talk about like the relationship between the her and the kid it was unhealthy i liked it me too i absolutely love it i i love the movie it there was a lot there to talk about um no i just remember one time when she talks about the kid she's like don't let your nanny call you puppy bear oh yeah she's infantilizing like a baby you know she's infantilizing you and i'm like well she didn't say infantilizing she just said she's being treating you like a baby yeah and i'm like he is five yeah first of all it's five also you're in some ways treating him like a kid by taking away his agency yeah like i know what's best for you even though i'm just your teacher yeah so but but that's how people do it is you know you can you can you can twist things so much to being like no i'm seeing you as an adult and i'm treating you maturely no you're kind of treating them the same just in a you're being selfish for your needs and they're kind of being so the the the character you know the uh the babysitters selfish needs are it's money so i'm just gonna like oh yeah make you happy you want some ice cream or that will play games you know that kind of thing or i'll call you call you a duggy puppy dog you know because for her mind she's like it's just a gig you know i just watch over the kid it's pleasant enough yeah and it's also so interesting you know because she all goes to the parent and says you know you have a project here i i think we should cultivate this and the parent is like no i just want my kid to be a kid which is also very extremely fair although obviously he's quite a neglectful parent so i'm not even saying that he's great it's kind of just fine like i want to continue being neglectful yeah exactly so yeah because i'm thinking okay he's a kid yeah be hit let him be a kid but also if he is not a day find a way to find that balance where he can be a kid but also nurture this um this skill that he has this gift that he has it is so problematic to have and to to to think that you know better what how someone else should live you know it is the worst thing because you know like you don't you don't even know how how you should live right because think about yourself every single day i mean if you're someone who's really healthily living life even if there are problems in your life you are always constantly reassessing and looking at yourself and trying to figure out what am i doing wrong here you know how did i interact with that person it was i right when i said that you know i think that i might have maybe overstepped or let me call and let me you know kind of make make amends or myself right okay i tried this this didn't work what does that mean am i really capable here you're reflecting reflecting all the time and so even for yourself you're never really certain you can never really you know say that this is a hard fast true or the truth or fact i am this way or what i do is right or this way that i'm living is the right way you know especially looking back yourself 10 years ago look at yourself now so much of a difference so what kind of audacity you know must you have to tell a parent that someone else that they should parent their kid a certain way and also how do you how can you really truly say that you know for a fact that this is something that's good for someone yeah well anyway that's about it that's it that's the kindergarten teacher yeah kindergarten kindergarten yeah yeah i'm garden for kinders yeah it's a cute name that's so what do you guys think of the kindergarten teacher i give it honestly like maybe i'd give it a nine simply because the end was a little contrived with her getting locked up uh but everything else i gotta say still not nine out ten is still good that's the only thing seriously i'm giving it a ten out of ten truly well just because like it wasn't flawless to me i guess okay that's fair yeah for me a 10 out of 10 like the last few movies that were 10 10 i'm like i really can't pin down anything in particular that i would have changed you know yeah but like i i feel like it was yeah i don't know i think that it ended the way that it oh it should it i like how it ended how else could it have no well that's well that's why i understand why it's just you're just upset that because because the the lock was outside there was a lock outside yeah yeah it doesn't make sense if she got yeah but but it could happen if it had if it if there's a key yeah you know you could have the um that key that's out that's maybe the key is outside of the door and obviously maybe the person who was there before i left it out there maybe in some hotels they have doors that can be locked from the doesn't make sense i'm gonna say that's literally the only reason you're giving it a nine out of ten yeah i'm allowed to rate it however i want to rate it that is fair i'm giving it a you've rated other movies lower than i have in the past that's true i'm a little more yeah okay so then nine point five yeah out of ten yeah that's good that's fine that's fine i don't work with that yeah so what do you guys think yeah and next time till next time until next time bye