 Pašli, se vmeste. Kaki vaši dokazateljstvo? Koga inom? Pogledaš? And I guess you could count Lance, because he will be making an appearance tonight, he's just not gonna be interacting with us. They said hi, me and... Is Lance out at the compound or whatever the fuck Timple calls his studio? He is at the compound, yes, he's there. Let me give Lance some tips really quick before he starts. I know he's probably not watching, but as someone who has done this already, who has entered the compound... The Timple compound... I'm sorry, somebody in the comments said, I didn't in quotations, I didn't see your black ass, my bender. What? I would never say such a thing. Anyway... You know, there's... It's gonna be... Someone who sat there before where Lance is gonna sit, let me tell you. I don't know who else is gonna be on the show, but when I was there, Tim had an extra person there. Sean Fitzpatrick or something, some conservative cartoonist or something. And, you know, it was Sean, then Tim... No, Tim was over here, and then there was... Who else was on with me? I can't even remember how many people were there, but it was interesting because you think you're going to talk to one person, but other people are chiming in, and they obviously have positions closer to Tim's or exactly as Tim's. So, you know, you're trying to think, and they're both bringing stuff at you, and there were numerous occasions where me and Tim were going back and forth, and Tim's buddy came in with data he was looking up to refute me, which I obviously didn't have the opportunity to do because it's just me sitting there, I didn't have a backup or whatever. And so, you know, it's a little bit... It could feel overwhelming in the moment, but what you gotta do, and I messed up a few times in terms of trying to actually combat that head-on, but what you gotta do, and I think Ole put this great a couple of episodes ago when we were talking about something completely different, but it was still a debate, just bat it away, go to a new topic, or even just say, I don't have that information in front of me, and then, you know, move to a segue to a topic, or even a part of that same topic that you do know about or informed about, because you can't... Can you hear me? We can, yes. Does that sound clear? Yes, it sounds a lot better. Way better. Oh, thank you, Jesus. I prayed, that's why it worked. Okay, I'm gonna take a couple of seconds to grab my coffee, cancel the other computer. I couldn't leave, like, the screen would... Oh, thank you. So, how do you hide this up so I could be out? Also, there's a possibility that when Lance sat down to get ready in the studio, Tim took his gun off the wall and started cleaning it in front of Lance, like he did with me, and I'm assuming he did it to try... I don't know, scare me or something. Yes, it's an intimidation thing. Yeah, I was very, very, very, very interesting, very interesting. Let me polish my knife while we debate. Right, right. Yeah. Do you know what they are debating tonight, by the way? I'm not really sure why... I don't know. I mean, when I got there, when I got there, Tim had, that day, Tim had fired off one of his anti-abortion tweets. That went viral. And so that became the topic of the episode, which I really didn't feel like, you know, was as much to talk about in terms of a debate, because my position is firm and there is, people should have the ability to get an abortion whenever they need to get an abortion. There's no... There's no addendums. There's no... It's very simple for me. So, you know, it was basically me having to repeat the same thing over and over and over again, and Tim, coming up with his, you know, wild, fictional scenarios, we're like, okay, the baby's head, nine months old, coming out of the mother, is she allowed to get an abortion? And it's like, dude, what the fuck are you talking about, man? I mean, it's stupid scenarios that have never happened. I mean, so, he's so... It became so ridiculous. I would love to go back on and do a show about anything else with him. But that's what became the episode that I went on, me repeating the same abortion stance over and over and over and over again. I mean, honestly, that's probably exactly the kind of content that a guy like Tim Pool wants, right? Because it's repetitive, it's redundant. He knows his line and his audience is kind of... I mean, I don't know, is his audience... I don't watch a lot of Tim Pool, I don't fucking... Unless it's like we're dunking on him for a clip. Like, is his audience... Like, are they... Would you say they're pretty rigidly like anti-abortion, right? I would say so. He likes to pretend he has this audience that he has a lot of people who are right-wingers who watch and he has a lot of people who consider themselves to be independent free thinkers, like independence. But we all know what those people actually believe. They just don't want to come out and say it because they think they're too contrarian to actually put their beliefs in a tightly knit package and just straight-up say they're conservatives or Republicans or far right-wingers. So they pretend that they're too smart for that, but that's who they are and what they believe. I will say, I did get a good number of people who called in to discuss with me. So there are, you know, fence-sitters and people on the edge and the cusp. And, you know, probably more so than any other right-wing program but we're talking about maybe, like, a few dozen people who called in to me over the couple of weeks after I went on the show. You know, and apparently, according to the stats on Tim Pool's videos, my episode's one of his most watched ever with, like, 700,000 views. So, I mean, that puts it in perspective. See, that makes sense to me, though, because I feel like the abortion debate is something that people, it's really clickable for people on the conservative right. You know what I mean? It's just, like, something that, you know, they love to beat their heads against a wall fork. Right. I mean, we talked about some other topics for a short amount of time, like 10 minutes on social media censorship here and 10 minutes on something else there. But, like, we must have spent, like, an hour and a half on me just repeating the same stance on abortion rights and him with his wacky hypotheticals. Yeah, that was the last time that I watched Tim Pool's show was when you were on Matt Bender because I find him separable and disingenuous. And he's still, at least to my knowledge, pretens that he's, like, some sort of a centrist when everything that he is espousing is, like, far right borderline fascistic, if not outright fascist, propaganda. I mean, his response to the Jordi, Jordan Neal, Jordan Nealy situation really, really bad. His response to the Club Q shooting absolutely atrocious. So, I mean, like, he can't keep delving further into the depths of fascism and still maintain this facade that he's a centrist because it just, it's not persuasive at all. It just makes him look like a disingenuous hack. Well, when I went into the show, I had two goals in mind and I accomplished both of them. And one was to reach that audience of Tim Pool's that are open to hearing another opinion inside, which, again, his audience is mostly right wingers, but of his audience, he probably has the most people as a right wing talker. He probably has the most people who aren't right wingers who watch his show. Still, majority right wing audience, but he's got more non-right wingers who watch him than, you know, say, Matt Walsh or Ben Shapiro or Steven Crowder or any of those guys. And then the second goal was, I just wanted him to admit that exactly who he is and where his stance is. I mean, I've known Tim, I was the first time I met him in person, but I've known Tim for a very long time. He claims that myself and Sam Cedar booked him on his first ever media appearance back in 2011 when we asked him to come on the majority report. He called into the majority report when he was down at Occupy. Apologies, again, for that. I have to apologize every time. You guys are responsible for making so many people famous. Right. But I wanted him to just say that, you know, this is who he is and that's his stance. And he basically came out and he got a little bit loud and angry at one point and he basically said that if he had to pick between my idea where women should be free to be able to get a pregnancy when they need to get one or when they want to get one or that abortion should be outright a bend 100 percent no abortion at all. He would take that stance over my stance which tells you everything you need to know about him, you know. Yeah. Real quick before we continue on because the stream is going to start in 10 minutes I believe. I just wanted to in case you all didn't when I was gone give Zach and Gavin the opportunity to tell us about yourselves and plug your channel. I thought it was it was good to bring you all on since leftist mafia members have been brigating your streams so frequently. We talked about how was it like two weeks ago how like Ole was in the chat and then Lance revealed himself and then like oh, I'm going to reveal myself too. We're all fucking lurking here. So we all watched the Vanguard but tell us who you all are in case people don't know because they're screaming to a bunch of different platforms. Yeah. So one of my favorite jokes I like to make whenever anybody asks us about our podcast the best way I think to describe it is if all of left internet media, all of left new media was like a giant parade, right? Then Gavin and I would be the dudes with shovels at the end of that parade scooping up all of the shit. You know and I think Gavin and I we never like to come out here and talk about ourselves as if we're like doing any kind of like real serious work. I think that mostly we should like to hang out and the thing that we've always liked to talk about is the news, is politics, is the YouTube channels that we're watching really kind of just old school YouTube style reacting to other streams making jokes and hanging out and yeah we've kind of found a niche reacting to content such as your guys as you know. Yeah, absolutely. Oh, sorry Mike. You all have a lot of substance too. You have good political text as well. So don't be too hard on yourselves. Like you've had some really great segments where you just slam Andrew Yang for example for shit takes on Israel, Palestine. So I mean you guys you know what you're talking about too. So you've got the substance. Oh, I appreciate that Mike. Yeah. Also shout out to Jason in chat saying that the vanguard is the only reason I don't commit suicide. I hope you're joking Jason I'm glad you're a fan of the show to that degree. Either way yeah, I think Zach said it pretty well but I appreciate you Mike for saying that that we do also you know include a lot of substance in our discussions. You know we always like to say we like to include a spoonful of sugar to help the medicine go down and that means that yeah we're not afraid of leaning into some clickbaity titles sometimes are covering that spicy drama that everyone secretly loves to watch even you know if they pretend they don't right but at the heart of it it's still always incredibly substantive conversations I think for the most part like as you mentioned you know we've been covering some of the drama that popped off on this show in part after Anakasparian came for Ole and that triggered the whole controversy and the whole discourse over the birthing people terminology and of course you know on the surface it seems very you know we got to have a really substantive debate about this stuff and talk about you know gender inclusive language and it's importance and the turf movement and all of this stuff that you know again it seems like a salacious topic it seems like a spicy beef but there's a lot of substance here and that goes for any given drama that we talk about obviously we started our show if some of you guys remember some of the first content we made was covering the whole force the vote and that caused of course so much but at the heart of it was a very substantive disagreement or debate over strategy and the you know usefulness of progressives elected to Congress so on and so forth you know this is a substantive debate well I think so I think so maybe some people made it less substantive maybe some people did just take it into the or you know take it into the gutter but we tried to talk about it as a related to strategy and policy so like I said spoonful of medicine to help the spoonful of sugar to help the medicine go down I think it's kind of our philosophy and we have a good time we have a really good community of people and I think we have a lot of fun yeah yeah one thing that I'll say is that I really appreciate how fair you all are and you do not pull punches so if it's if somebody who is really close with you who has come on to the show and you have a good relationship is wrong like you're honest you just say yeah I think that they fucked up here they're wrong and that's hard to do because you know when you have a podcast and you make friends with other people and build relationships and they're like in some sort of a drama it's hard to like try to be objective there and I think that you guys do a really good job so yeah I appreciate that y'all ain't never said nothing bad about me we've never done anything wrong Ole so you know I've never done anything wrong Ole wow I say that getting positive coverage from the vanguard myself they're fair until you I'll come clean actually when I first started doing the show like there are some things I feel bad about right because we had absolutely no expectations about this we were doing like we were COVID bros like we just were like fuck it let's start a YouTube channel you know and I was like I really came in hot you know because I was like fuck it who do I care nobody's ever gonna see this shit like I just you know these are my like wild opinions and I'll just you know come out and say things and you know that I do regret I've tried to really okay like I thought that you were you know bad at like delivering something or like you know your speech patterns were you know I don't know unless you're like a shit head right winger I try and stay away from that and just kind of go into things that I can break down from like a political disagreement standpoint and I do feel like that you know maybe early on in our channel's history we kind of crossed a few lines and I do feel bad about that Zach has gotten soft it also sounds like something with I haven't said it also sounds like something was said about one of the people sitting right here and we've already established that Ole is perfect in every way so what did you say about me or Mike I gotta know I mean look I was actually actually referring to it all obviously I think that the you know we covered some of the beef that you've been involved with Matt Bender you know another joke I like to make is that you know it's like the Oscars like we wouldn't talk about you if you weren't a star Matt you know like we're just you know how to you know how to get get on my good side but no it's you know I don't know like it obviously there is you know the element of the fact that you know these are real people that are doing you know oftentimes more important work than we're doing and to sit back and poke fun at it I understand can be sometimes irritating for people you've gotta have fun though in this space otherwise you get brainwrot like for me at the end of the day you've gotta try to make this fun we're talking about very like depressing things existential crises threats to the planet if you don't try to like bring in humor and some shit talking you're gonna be miserable so you know 100% we're all going down like the world's gonna end we're all gonna die let's have fun until we perish ultimately that's my philosophy which is a very very optimistic philosophy couldn't agree more yeah I mean usually within any given vanguard stream we talk about a ton of substantive issues really important stuff but you know sometimes a good clickbaity headline or focusing on one dramatic topic can really help bring in that audience and just yeah alleviate some of that darkness some of that depression that comes with covering politics at this stage of our society where it does feel pretty pessimistic especially as a progressive you know progressive media has obviously been on though the wane since you know Bernie Sanders movement kind of dried up and it's tough out there it's depressing a lot of people feel very hopeless a lot of people feel very nihilistic for obvious reasons and a lot of people have just straight up tuned out all together which I understand I can understand why someone would prioritize their mental health over focusing on this stuff every single day so to get people continuing to tune in continuing to listen to what we think is ultimately an important message and an important perspective we've just kind of settled on that as a formula as have many other channels on YouTube but yeah that's our show that you've given the chance to introduce ourselves obviously our show is called the Vanguard if you can't tell from the name on the screen but that's where you can find us on YouTube and Twitch and Twitter and all that stuff if you want to give us a sub we'd love to have you in our community and we have about 1500 people watching across all platforms wherever you're at hit the like button we do if you're on Twitch there's no like button I get to see that because I am in the role of David Dole I am the administrator overseeing everything it's a lot of pressure I could crash everyone's stream right now oh wait we're streaming we're streaming on David's stream too we are and he's not even here oh he's not even here oh that's where those super chats are going that aren't going to me why are you giving super chats to a guy who's not even here what's going on I'm here by the way folks I can't see David's super chats neither can I I will try to go through the chat and find them later and answer them but if I miss it that I'm sure that on his next stream the best way to make sure your super chats get ready on this episode is to send them to me true, that's true it is starting officially right now so we'll go ahead and we'll launch it let's see sure calling for help as things kind of heat up but we're going to get into the nuances of that discussion so I'll save a little bit we do have news out of Russia they're blaming the US for the assassination attempt so they claim and we've got some news Barstool Sports fire one of their hosts for rapping lyrics that contain an offensive word I don't necessarily think it's fair to call what he said a slurg he wasn't calling anybody the word but you know he said the word and then pen entertainment was like you're fired and now Dave Portnoy is like I don't know there's nothing I can do I sold the company so we'll get into that plus a whole bunch of other stories and we'll talk about the news banks collapsing we got Paul Stanley the lead singer I'm sorry the front man for kiss is kind of walking back his statement on transgender kids and a lot of talk about before we get started my friends today's episode is brought to you by Casperu coffee take a look at this bag ready okay well wait until that's gone don't want to plug his sponsors right oh he's talking about riveting episode as you can tell we got kiss on the docket we got Barstool Sports on the docket this white dude saying the n word coming up next ridiculous right right yeah I support the show and support our work but Casperu.com sorry I muted it while he's doing this stuff he's talking there's like temple in my ear and it's making me want to off myself in Minecraft of course and it's very distracting but he's going through all the bullshit subscribe all this but by the way that gives us the opportunity to say hit that like button and send super chats into Matt and the Vanguard boys oh we're streaming on the Vanguard's channel too we're streaming everywhere yeah oh cool nice yeah oh yeah gave you guys the Vanguard bump you know you're welcome oh it's streaming everywhere about my panel oh there he is there he is oh man just like everything is here it's wild it's bigger than it looks like right it's bigger than it looks like when you're actually sitting in the room it's actually there's a lot more props than you ever this place credit for I thought there was just like some samurai swords and like the occasional gun or something there's a real Civil War musky yeah that's what he wanted me to pick up he wanted me to pick up what Union Civil War it was never because I didn't want it to break yeah very cool stuff yeah so so what do you do who are you I am a leftist commentator I do politics comedy from a dumpster fire perspective and I have opinions and sometimes people like to hear those opinions and then they tune in to listen to them oh sounds good all right well thanks for joining us I'm sure we have a lot of opinions to go through we also got the exact inversion we just got the inversion that's how they describe me on the streets that's Sean my name is Sheamus yeah exactly I'm not sure they call him Nancy Sheamus I thought Sheamus but my name is Sheamus Coglan I make cartoons we call him freedom tunes and he's British is the volume too loud folks is that why you always gotta take it to an ethnic place put them a little bit lower put them a little bit lower I mean for being Irish I was born here but I make cartoons I have a YouTube channel called freedom tunes I'm also a podcaster that's the freedom tunes dude today by the way y'all might wanna extremely extremely religious this guy have a stream on rumple called shamer y'all wanna take a peek at that as well now we have moon lord himself I am the moon lord he knows no longer he wasn't there the last time when I was there that was his point though he knows one with the essence I don't know any of these people besides simple reality so good to see you Lance so good to be and if you don't know you don't know but I am the moon lord let's get hot and I am surge.com as always guys let's get to it let's jump into this first actually I gotta flag this this is the first time Ian and I have done a show together in almost a year since we screamed about I was yelling at you about religion or something exactly this is our first show welcome back Sharers it's great to be here man evolved on my stance on reality we also talked off air it's worse than the leftist month I just realized this is our first episode of both doing each other cause I've been seeing you for the past two weeks we went last time we talked about they say we talked over each other oh alcohol it's your vice or whatever I said I think that was the real point of contention and everyone's like Ian you're such a dick I was just talking to Sheamus we were just talking I don't remember exactly what it was but I don't really care do you I was just no I was just it was a discussion about alcohol cause I was saying that alcohol is not inherently simple like Christ turned water into wine it was his first public miracle I've gone through this is quite deep I'm learning a lot for transistanciation the properties of bread magic is real folks becomes his flesh and blood point number one see this is gonna this is gonna work against lines cause there's they're all there they're all there it has to be peanut gallery for sure Christ is inside you and then but like his blood is alcoholic is that why it's wine so the properties of bread and wine remain but what we believe as Catholics is that it's his literal flesh and blood but his body blood sold to him but he's not made of bread and wine no he's not literally made of bread alright let's read the news here we go we also have searched you pray sir we already you already did say what's up yes man moon lord thanks dawg alright here's the story we got this ABC7 New York police issue call for help outrage continues to grow over deadly subway chokehold encounter to the death of a subway rider who was put into a chokehold by a former marina train has been called a homicide and now activists are calling for charges to be filed they have planned several protests and rallies on Thursday as the NYPD has issued a call for public help in their investigation Jordan Neely 30 died from a compression of the neck the city's medical examiner determined Wednesday Neely is recognizable to some New Yorkers as a Michael Jackson impersonator who regularly danced in Times Square in the Times Square Transit Hub on Monday afternoon he was yelling and pacing back and forth on an F train in Manhattan witnesses and police said when he was restrained by at least three people including a US marine veteran who pulled one arm tightly around his neck a physical struggle ensued leading to Neely losing consciousness he was rushed to Lenox Hill Hospital where he was pronounced dead on Wednesday a medical examiner determined Neely is a homicide that does not mean he's just reading the ABC news thing now we haven't even heard him yet it doesn't mean criminal so what they're trying to say is though the death was ruled a homicide it does not mean the case will be prosecuted as a murder that is up to the Manhattan DA's office which is investigating but I suppose I'm probably being a little bit too harsh because you can they're not being clear you can make the argument there's reckless homicide there's negligent homicide and so what they're saying is it's not clear that he will be criminally charged they probably just should have said they're gonna say as a part of our rigorous ongoing investigation we'll review the medical examiner's report assess all available video and photo footage identify and interview as many witnesses as possible and obtain additional medical records read a statement from a spokesperson for the DA so we've got video coming out of New York protestors I believe this was yesterday we're seen in the streets and the police made some arrests and we'll get into it in a little bit but one of our reporters a lot of Eliahu Eliahu was physically assaulted by one of the protestors and had his property destroyed while he was in the process of doing journalism but let's just let's just get down to brass decks here because I'm sure there's gonna be a lot of arguments about this one this is the story of a guy who was having a mental breakdown I guess the news that recently came out was that he was a subway performer and his mental health collapsed after his I think his mom was killed is what they're reporting and after that he kind of just lost it and then he had been arrested 40 times he had once punched a six, seven-year-old woman in the face and so you wanna respond? I can mute him really quick we gotta hear where he's going with this okay reportedly the Marine told everyone to call 911 and get the police down there and then he ended up dying which has resulted in the left like AOC whether or not people I don't know if you consider her left but AOC yeah, she's progressive she said this was a public murder and now you've got protestors calling for this guy to be arrested they're saying he committed a murder and I think this is actually a really good example of what is described as anarcho tyranny in that you had 25 people pushed onto subway tracks in the past year you've had like a woman get raped on a train in Philadelphia and we don't hear a single peep from any of these politicians from any of these activists until someone actually stops the guy what? bro, pause if I lose my fucking mind I love Lance I don't know son hey y'all what the fuck what the fuck this is what y'all be watching are we fucking serious? are we dead ass? like they just we just gone launch right into fucking strong man and keep it the fuck up the man was on the fucking subway screaming about not having food and water that is it ain't no what's what pushing somebody on the tracks where the fuck do you get that from and when the fuck in Copaganda ask New York City where Eric Adams is the fucking mayor does anybody get pushed on the tracks and you don't hear about it from that all past nigga put a thousand additional fucking cops in the subway I'm not gonna be able to do it all right, all right it's your Lance gotta say I hear y'all is that correct? so you feel in your mind that it was a proportional response for him to choke him out to death in that situation because he was going to become such a threat to the person who choked him out but you stepped up you made a big leap right there which what's the leap you're ascribing intent to the Marine to kill oh I'm not saying he intended to kill him I never said that but he did end up killing him right so that's your material so well no but what has to be material Tim has to be is he doing what he's doing are you making a proportionality argument or are you making yes I'm asking you that because is what he did proportional to the threat so the threat that he was going it is proportional to subdu someone that is threatening other people and saying he'll die in the process and end up killing him even if that was so see now you're doing it again you're ascribing intent no I'm not ascribing intent I'm saying the results this is what happened the guy's dead he's dead right results are material to the proportionality of action so the proportionality of action in your mind is specified to what he was doing his actual action he held the guy on the ground while he said call 911 and killed him and choked him out till he died you're doing it again no you keep saying I'm doing it again I'm saying this is the end results I'm not saying this is what he meant to do maybe he didn't I don't know I don't know what's in his heart neither do you none of us know what he meant to do that day when he woke up absolutely if someone is threatening other people you are allowed to subdu that and then would it be like an involuntary manslaughter so see you're don't know but this is what happened it's to the point of death so you have it's not a criminal it's not I'm not saying he intended to kill him that's the difference right but if he ended up dying as a result of that was that proportional he needed to be killed no he could have killed hold on stop that you keep trying to say needed to be no that's the end result you're saying the Marine tried to kill him no I didn't say that then why you are saying that you're putting words in my mouth I'm saying that's what ended up happening let me respond then why would you say needed to be killed because what he did to him his chokeout ended up with the guy dying so that was the end result so his proportional response to what he thought was a threat was that I'm gonna choke him out I'm not trying to kill him but I'm gonna choke him out whether or not he dies is going to be something that we're just gonna remain to be on the cards right this is chance we'll leave it up to chance so you are making a huge leap right there there's no need to him what he's doing what he's doing is that proportional is choking someone but the possibility of death with the possibility of death yes yes absolutely let me tell you so if someone tried illegally entering my home sure I will use whatever force necessary to stop him oh my god that's not happened oh my god wow I have the legal justification he does this all the time he does this all the time he brings up these hypotheticals that aren't legal do it nothing now you can't invite someone in and there's actually some legal barriers here if someone actually walks up the man was not being violent too the guy didn't threaten anyone either he didn't threaten anyone the door was open there was no obstruction and then you'll make an argument about entering the domicile could be considered fourth degree burglary depending on which state you're in if they actually open the door and enter they've now committed felony burglary and you are entitled in West Virginia to use whatever force necessary to stop someone illegally after your house that doesn't mean you just intend to actually kill someone so in terms of you're out in the street someone is threatening someone else you are legally entitled to subdue them now yes absolutely because where you're going with it is like what act of subduing would be permitted in your mind then like holding his hands tightly one that doesn't have a possibility of death I would say give me one and your martial arts expertise zero ok so there's I think I can contend that no one here has any right hold on is Tim Pudin is Tim about to say he has martial arts I was going to say your proximity to Joe Rogan does not give you martial arts credibility hostile environment oh my god he is doing it he is doing it he is not did you know that he has to legally register his hands as weapons when he goes to the airport simply we'll contend however if someone is threatening harm against another person and three people find it reasonable to subdue him and the person dies that person was in the process of committing a crime if you lose your life in the process of committing a crime this guy wasn't committing any crime or in the process of committing a crime when you're saying victims you mean the people who killed them the people who were being attacked see Lance Lance is going into he's falling for the hypothetical it's hard when you're there for example but he's got to just bat this away and say this doesn't matter because that's not what happened yeah nobody was being attacked nobody was actually physically harmed or in danger and going up to their face right and so you're saying at that point you have the ability to proportionally respond with violence yeah actually there's a video of this myth informed as it's seven years ago this man was called a hero for defusing violence by putting another man in a chokehold a man in the subway was getting up in people's faces and he was threatening them and another man got up behind him and put him in a chokehold and he was put on national television and he was celebrated as a hero for doing so so this is what I'm talking about anarcho-tirani I feel like you're latching onto this completely from the point of you don't have knowledge on proper technique for subduing an individual oh wow he should not have been subdued by some random guy on the subway period that's kind of an absurd thing it doesn't matter what the technique is well look also if this marine had the ability to properly subdu him then wouldn't he have not ended up this guy put him in a chokehold for 15 fucking minutes even expert MMA martial arts jujitsu whatever fighters have come out and said you do not put someone in a chokehold like that for 15 minutes without expecting this person could possibly die yeah and this wasn't a self-defense instance again like the guy was not doing anything to harm anyone they were uncomfortable because he was yelling but he wasn't physically like assaulting anyone cops are not gonna mess with that guy and that's what was reported and there were three men right exactly it shouldn't be a death sentence he was not he just says words yeah he's just making shit up oh my god this is so disingenuous yo run the room i need to get a title and i'll really quit like not for nothing this is a lot like what i feel like ideal with hosting rising and you have to shut the shit down like this is mm-hmm yeah six hours ago and asking specifically what are they supposed to do what are people supposed to do in this situation are they supposed to sit there if someone's screaming they're gonna hurt somebody you just sit there hurt somebody why is he letting me strawman and i'm just miss the strawman just letting them letting them re-write it right beforehand jump in and say dad it's not the fucking facts of this case we've yet to hear what actually happened this is fucking irrelevant i have the exact quote i have the exact quote according to someone who is there what he told the press so nili is on the subway he says i don't have food i don't have a drink i'm fed up i don't mind going to jail and getting life in prison i'm ready to die nili then took off his jacket and threw it on the ground that's the entirety of what he said that's the entirety of what he did he didn't say this in anybody's face or lunging for anybody he didn't say there was no explanation of what he even meant by that it sounds like it could even mean that he's gonna steal food or drink there is no actual violence threat in anything of what he said yeah the way i interpreted was that he was trying to get arrested so that he could to jail he was saying i don't have water i don't have food as if he would rather be in jail where at least he would have those basic necessities met which obviously is insane to think that anyone would rather be in jail than free but that's how i interpreted in fact the only person the only person he ever mentions doing harm to is himself when he says i'm ready to die yeah besides the state obviously for denying him food, water, shelter, et cetera the basic necessities that we all need to live to all the news reports the police and the witness statements can we see the footage i haven't seen that yet i think we can show the choke out okay so according to the news reports the witness isn't the police he went and threatened violence against people which is assault but you're saying he specifically threatened violence against the people who subdued him do we have evidence of that it's one thing for him to be in jail you're not winning an argument i'm not trying to win an argument you're being awfully pedantic awfully pedantic yes how would you use pedantic in this form as in like i'm trying to get to the root of this problem it's absurd to imply that if a woman if a guy walks up to a woman and says he's going to harm her that another man can't protect her right and so this is why i'm asking did he say to the people who subdued him i'm going to harm you i'm going to hurt you it doesn't matter it doesn't matter it is a material but not for the reasons that timfings right and then someone said i'm going to stop you before you hurt someone that is legal self-defense acting in the defense of others no it fucking not stopping the guy threatening people the victims of a violent individual who is trying to cause harm i just find it fascinating that there's an effort to defend the aggressor in this circumstance oh so you're suggesting that the guys even if the guys that were choking out weren't the ones being threatened that they're still considered a victim because they stepped in to defend other people i'm saying out right that if you're on a train and there's a guy you're on a train you can't get off that train you are you are trapped no you could switch cars i used to take these trains every single day i've seen this i've seen this and worse i've seen people in the middle of episodes where i was like this person could potentially either harm themselves or harm me it never crossed my mind that i need to choke them out to the point of potential death in order to protect everyone else on the train that never even mentored my mind so that's why i'm asking you do you have specific footage of him threatening people i was just even a controversial thing for to be saying but why i don't think i don't think that's all i want to know what does that have to do with what i said that's why i understand even if that was not your intent i understand that you don't think he intended to do that fine but even if that was it were they threats to him in the immediate present were they on the verge of committing an act of violence towards him that required proportional violence that ended up in death but it's not a requirement someone threatens you for you to act in defense of others there was no need to defend others because there was nothing going on in an unnecessary direction and elaborate if you're on a train and you're trapped in a box and someone is threatening violence then yeah you're a victim because so i've been a victim multiple times then i was in these subways absolutely it's the craziest thing to me i don't feel like a victim i've never been hurt i never was hurt by people who were going to those kind of episodes other people have been i'm not saying they haven't i'm not saying this is a good thing 25 people were pushing in front of trains how is that directly related were these people also going through episodes were they also people who were homeless did they have mental illness were like i would say did Jordan nearly push all 25 people in front of the train because what's the purpose of him bringing that up yeah also isn't his position just like vigilante just but that is the position people need to understand that they are advocating exactly for that this is not a mistake yeah then why put a guy in prison for finally saying stop killing people this is like tim if i approached you today and i was like hey do you know what goes on in Rikers Island have any of you done a show on what happens in Rikers Island how they hold people in Rikers Island do you know what not Rikers Island specifically but we talk about prison reform all the time ok do you know about bail reform and the fact that people die in Rikers Island waiting to have their day in court because they can't afford it and we talked about it and you've done the entire shows on that and we talked about how people literally die in prison while they're waiting for that shit that's terrible ok so we actually talked about one guy who got wrongly arrested lost his job was kicked out of his apartment went to Rikers for three months only to be released and then told sorry there's nothing you can do about it the city owes him nothing because they consider the prosecution not to be malicious but this is the problem man like wait but that's not a guy who died in Rikers that's the one guy you talked about and it wasn't even a guy who died in Rikers what you just gave me was not me talking about the systemic problem of people who are poor being in Rikers Island before they before they get to trial they die before they get they're not released you just gave me a story of someone who was released prior to that i'm here at the apple of a specific show we've actually talked about someone wrongly held and had their life destroyed ok i still don't understand what the fuck this has to do with the men that was killed on the subway this happens to all the people being held in Rikers Island i don't understand it's a tactic if you can't address the substance you distract you bring up some other case or hypotheticals i told you no one's on the other side of this no one is pro where's people on the train where's your protest where's your protest where's my protest where's your protest where's your Rikers protest we headed on the show but you don't watch the show you did an actual protest you guys stood up and then walked to the streets we don't go on the streets ever that's not a good thing to say if you're doing journalism we've never got on the streets ever why haven't you talked about this Lance the fact that you haven't talked about this means that you don't care about that that's not true though that's the implication of what you're saying right now my implication is instead of helping us deal with this when we talk about it you make up garbage about us and then post nonsense on the internet what have i brought up garbage about people pushing people to trains this is the most random example i'm not talking about you saying you don't talk about it right i'm not criticizing you for not talking about i'm saying finally when there are people who are like we've had 25 people pushing in front of trains we've had two of them killed i'm not gonna let this person hurt somebody it's y'all saying that person should go to prison so how is that solving the problem you guys are is he an abolitionist now we're supporting the criminals make this worse so our solution to this if you're asking when you're saying you mean the left right our solution to a lot of this you're speaking in support of the criminal so i'm saying you okay so i'm saying that the the criminal the criminal is the murderer stop oh my god in front of a son the whole the whole motherfucking analogy of like oh there were 25 people who were pushed in front of the train yes the people pushed in front of the trains of the victim of a crime just like Jordan Neely is the victim of a crime be assailant to push them in front of the train they are analogous to your murderer here oh my god right this is insufferable rewards this is something that i are you against that idea about investing heavily into mental health care public health care well then there you go that's a much better line so here's my issue my issue is when this story came out in october we talked about it and we said why is this happening what are the solutions what are the problems when this story comes out now you completely ignorant of what's been going in New York side with the criminal and so people like me are flabbergasted that we've been focused on the the issue of crime the issue of mental health the entire time going back several years because and this is why i left in New York because two cops got murdered outside of my apartment and then what do we hear protesters in the street defending the criminals you keep saying criminal i have a problem with criminalizing people who are homeless or people who are poor or people who are mentally ill and then suddenly i'm not saying he's a criminal for being poor i'm saying he's a criminal because he threatened people with harm he did it it's not a crime he didn't commit a crime oh the free speech warriors all of a sudden want people to be criminalized for their free speech rights apparently say this is what happened or we can agree no one has any idea so there's no point even talking about it i think the interesting maybe confluence is that you are don't we literally have the transcript you just read the transcript what do we mean we'll never know what do you think about defensive measures like people should be armed and ready for this kind of thing regardless of the prevention methods i mean when it comes to defensive measures because you're probably very pro gun here right i'm just making well you would have happened if someone pulled out a gun on a new york city subway and started shooting there would have been a lot of friendly fire a lot of casualties whether you know injuries or death from people that they didn't mean to hit no one else does it's a uniquely american problem that the mass shooting thing is a uniquely american well it's i don't think it's fair to say uniquely american because there are mass shootings in many proportionally happening here well mass killings aren't a uniquely american problem but mass killings done with the use of firearms is much more uniquely american i guess what he said he just restated the position i'm gonna jump out a window this is a really bad oh like oh like you should come on you should come on the show go on the show list of countries by no no ok i'm sorry i'm sorry no bro i do not see the educational value i also think this is what i do on rising there are rising's not this have you seen what i'm on rising are you thinks that rising isn't like this because why cause they say they're not i guess i haven't watched rising since oh their comment section is deranged somebody who i've covered this the rising's comment section is pretty deranged speaking of rising did you see batia sargans like bat shit take on this no i didn't see it it was it was like tim pool oh god jason these people on this podcast are so deranged holy shit except for lans listen new yorkers experience this sort of stuff all the time and we walk away unscathed and the person having this episode walks away unscathed well unscathed in terms of no one killing them on the spot they still deal with their issues that they're not getting help with but i mean we're acting like there's just homeless people or mentally ill people just roaming the streets in new york city being violent and killing or trying to kill all the time and it's just not true this is such a rare case that here we are talking about the one instance that got to this point because it's so rare and in this instance it was the homeless mentally ill individual who got killed and yeah sweden has more grenade attacks than any other country but grenades are illegal there what i've got a feeling we just came in and i'm hearing how this has to do with jordan miller if you ban guns than grenades if we look at all the g20 countries the united states disproportionately by ratio of the population has way more gun deaths way more gun violence and a lot of the gun violence i will tell you this i have lived in new york city my entire life born raised always been in queens new york the most diverse place in the entire country if not world and i will tell i've taken public transportation by myself nearly every 1.5 century if not longer and i can tell you this city has never felt safer than it does right now and it will continue to get safer the idea that new york city is some scary place i gotta tell you i worry more about my well being when i travel anywhere outside of new york city lem me tell you this could be applied to united states federally you could have a program a federal program you tax the gun producers and the weapons manufacturers and then you get them to pay for it so poor people could afford this program but you can't do that because gun ownership is a constitutional right gun ownership is a human right guaranteed protected against government infringement that's a human right but not healthcare in schools i think the public schools should have gun training for kids what the fuck i would highly advocate for more training but you're just suggesting that you can't force it on people the constitution clearly and according to the writings of the founding fathers and to i think heller versus dc gun ownership is a human right and the constitution protects against government infringement of that right that is what the fuck we got the updates the NFA in the 80s so certainly gun rights have been infringed to an absurd degree you know what not to mention back in the days when they codified the constitution people owned warships privately and halliburton north of grumman well i shouldn't say halliburton they're a construction thing but north of grumman bowing et cetera blocky these companies are private companies that build nuclear weapons so we basically where we're at right now is that private corporations with no accountability can have the most powerful weapons of mass destruction that's bad too but them and the government and like so the con it doesn't follow either the people have the power or they don't have the power it's tim about to say he thinks everybody should have a backyard nuclear weapons nuclear weapons right let's be clear these regardless do the choke the guy out i think what's gonna come up is was it was it adequate force or was it too much and i feel like it was too much he did what the fuck are you talking about neda he said what do you mean if it's too much because he could have fallen backward when he hit his head are they serious this is the crux of the issue it doesn't matter if the force was too much or not enough or whatever they're gonna crazy shit they're gonna argue there was no physicality there was no threat before this guy this marine decided to physically get in touch jorda nili christ this is honestly painful holy shit i've said it a million times it is a mistake to engage these people in the weeds and to be talking like you're trying to convince them they are throwing out they don't believe none of the bullshit they say it's just a bunch of fucking straw man it's just distractions and you make a mistake when you deal with them as though you're trying to convince them they are literally one band one sound they come there for the purposes of fucking what you disagree with there's nothing you could say they're not there to be convinced you should be addressing the fucking audience and cutting off these fucking straw man and addressing them for what they are every fucking straw man hypothetical they've thrown out we are down 64 weaves my nigga this is painful this is painful yeah it's this is life over it three men don't we only got an hour and a half left subdued and they subdued which sucks it's unfortunate did it get a cause of death it was a compression of the neck yeah homicide so you've got a massive platform did he seriously ask this about the Jordan Neely oh my god it's going to affect a lot of people's lives if this is a problem that genuinely concerns you why isn't it something that you would frame and want to advocate for more resources for mental health access and bring that up on a regular basis and i'm not saying okay hold on tim i'm sure you've done it before i'm sure you've had a special before we do it a lot we do it a lot okay why isn't that the focus why isn't today hey by the way everybody this horrifying tragedy happened on the New York subway we gotta talk about this here's our angle our angle is we need to invest in mental health we need to invest in giving access to public health care for Americans first of all when it comes to the issue of violence in this country conservatives have been screaming about mental health for decades Reagan is one of the ones Reagan is one of the worst presidents his country has ever had no fault divorce how about that? look at this he knows what he's doing strong man i love my aunts but ima have to dip out this episode early for my mental health i cant do it i cant do it its giving my friends episode buy audience im sure those who hate me will love this get an episode without me i understand i understand we love you we will see you next week dont even blame this is really hard to listen to im actually no longer regretting being on the episode that was just me for an hour and a half going abortion is human rights abortion is human rights i think that's preferable to add something in a little bit of local news im sure you guys saw the Ralph Yarl case going around a 16-year-old boy that was shot for ringing the wrong doorbell that guy Andrew Lester the fucking 85-year-old white supremacist that shot him that dude is out on bail right now and then you see this other gentleman i dont think he is in custody at all i dont even think he is facing criminal charges right now for murdering a man on the subway its crazy to just see people like Tim Pool who has such a ginormous platform just come out and like carte blanche condone what are essentially targeted killings basically white supremacists that are just waiting for their opportunity to commit murder and broad daylight thats what this guy was doing he saw a guy and he thought i can fucking put my hands on this guy and show how tough i am and manipulate this person's body and fucking kill him i dont know just fucking wild they are pro vigilante thats the takeaway for sure the guy who tried to stop the violent offence see that is anarcho tyranny there was no violent offence then you have ongoing crime when you have victimization people being killed and a woman being raped on a train i will say tim is very good at what he does he is very good at steering this in the direction he wants to constantly bringing up outrageous hypotheticals that many times dont even line up with the actual story or event being discussed i think this is what happened with me i think lance will get back on his feet as this goes further and he realizes whats going on and it happened to me while i was there an aoc calling in a public murder im like yo aoc i didnt see you call out the public murder in the subway trains and again maybe its ignorance but the problem i see is this is why i refer to the left as npcs or a cult there is complete ignorance to the problem wait but here is the problem notice for a second because i dont think that anyone has made this point if this marine killed jordan neely and then the police arrested him booked him put him through the court process theres a date for him to have his day on trial whatever we probably wouldn't be discussing this to the height were discussing it just like when a mentally ill individual pushes someone on the train tracks and they are immediately arrested and taken in and they are put through the system but thats not what happened here this guy killed someone who was not posing a threat to anybody and the police talked to him let him go didnt mean hold him for more evidence to see what was going on to talk to to see nothing just let him go i mean thats why were talking about this and that is the regular issue where these are the type of issues that the left regularly focuses on its when the justice system doesnt do its job we simply cannot talk about every crime every death that happens across the country so we need to focus on the ones where justice is not being served and even then we can focus on all of them yeah another great point also i just cant get over this they keep saying the marine this is a trained person a marine your surely trained in these areas if he was just trying to subdue him then surely he could have just subdued him for 15 minutes again this is a marine the fact that jordan nearly ended up dead tells me that it was a murder i mean i think you are giving the marine court too much credit there gaven i dont know if they are i think they know enough about how to handle a human body to not kill one in 15 minutes i think if he actually wanted to just subdue him he could have not that i would even defend that but yeah the fact that he ended up dead tells me that it was pretty intentional being able to take care of themselves necessarily the perfect indicator of whether they need to be committed to one of these institutions i have no idea however what i do know is once we push the goalpost all the way in the other direction and say they have to demonstrate that they are a significant danger to themselves or others often times they dont get committed until after they've already hurt somebody so its a much more complicated situation that's how it works when we don't even have a solid definition is this what you call it a minority report we do not jail people are to commit them before they commit a crime i agree this is not a conservative show but if you are in a cult you wouldn't know that you would only hear what the cult says so here's what i have to respond to that objective person say an alien just showed up and looked at your channel tim and went through all the videos and you were to ask them pull them is this person and his views where would you place them most likely they would say conservative that's gonna be my bed that's actually but more because the guests that come on ten to identify not just any of the guests but the way they're framed the thumbnails the words that you put in red i fucking hate this guest slide and you know whether they're not gonna speak or point your hands just own it not fucking dance you can tell me that you guys don't like the democrats and you don't like them this is not a republican show and you're obviously conservative podcast tim pull is conservative yeah but there's a lot of right wingers who watch you right so that's what i mean when i say you do have a voice and you do have an audience of right wingers who are going to vote at one point to another 30% of your audience is right wingers most of the people who watch this the largest faction is libertarian the next largest right wingers right exactly but along party lines who are the libertarians gonna vote for not the libertarian party most likely they're gonna vote for whoever when they come on this show and say abolish the police so many conservatives don't want to identify as being conservative because they know it's not popular and not cool and not cooth it's that simple it's that simple they know their opinions are seen by most normal people as horrendous so they try to be contrarian they try to brand themselves as something different that's all it is they do really believe those things but they're aware of how that's viewed by the majority of people yeah oh, don't clip this I will lose followers I can rag on Trump all the time and like people still watch the show Seamus and I can have an argument that Trump would win all 50 states in the 2020 election and if I pull up all sides with 3,770 ratings Tim Poole is a centrist but you think I'm conservative because you live in a bubble right because I'm too far left the overtime and it goes too far away is what you're saying I don't go hangout in Washington DC and I do I go to National Harbor or I go to Baltimore Maryland Life I don't know why you do that Washington DC the people who come up to me and are like hey man I'm a big fan are not conservatives they hate Donald Trump in fact I was at a poker table last week and the guy said I just hate Donald Trump man I can't stand him I wish somebody else would run but I can't vote for Joe Biden I think you're surrounded we talk about this quite a bit sure if all sides has nearly 4,000 people rating me and the end result is centrist if I'm actively pro universal health care not to the same degree as like Bernie Sanders I believe in private health insurance oh my god shut the fuck up I am absolutely not a conservative in this country I've listened to your debates on pro-choice though your pro-choice from a Tim Poole's perspective I would say I'm pro-choice from a traditional liberal perspective as traditional liberals have been but not from what people who would define themselves as pro-choice would say like you concentrate very heavily on the ninth month abortions and baby guillotines and stuff like that like yeah I remember watching you debate baby guillotines yeah okay so baby guillotines is my own personal interpretation and joke of it but you were talking about how women how like disgusted you are that women may have an abortion in the ninth month right or even a viable baby of a viable baby that could and I wanted to scream at that time being like women who have abortions in the ninth month they're not doing that because they got bored or all of a sudden they're like oh I don't care anymore they do that because it's a fucking tragedy like statistically women who are getting abortions in the ninth month it's because there's a medical complication that could kill them that's why they have to do it I already said viable try again what are you talking about? I already said abortion of viable fetuses at nine months oh my god this is ridiculous do you know viable means? yes yes it means the baby can survive without medical complications absolutely why legalize abortion of viable fetuses at nine months when the baby could just so I looked up the all sides tim pool rating and I want people to know that he's acting like this is some sort of unbiased resource where they look at his material I guess and they determine no it's based on user ratings he's just had his audience go there and so everyone should go to all sides it's a long URL so I'm just gonna say Google search tim pool all sides all sides is one word tim pool all sides and you could I'm not gonna tell you how to vote because that's I wanna be fair here and check out the ratings that you can give tim pool and if you think he's a centrist give him that rating if you think he leans left give him that rating if you think he leans right give him that rating but everyone regardless of whether they watch tim pool show or not regularly should have a vote on this so we get an accurate portrayal of what this show is so all sides tim pool let the people's voice be heard there yes I would say they probably choose the mother first right why and then how often do you think this happens and also it's the exact same thing the exact same argument it's like the exact same way of getting out of a certain conversation a woman is on her way to give birth so it's like it's the worst possible fucking that's not again I said I didn't want a dog pile I mean that's statistically not true there have been surveys done on women who had later abortions and for a pretty large sum of them it's because they were not sure whether the father of the child was willing to commit and then when they found out he wasn't willing to commit they would have the abortion and so there are different stats you're gonna find for different points in pregnancy when it comes all the way along to nine months I don't have the statistical data on that however I do know for later term abortions there are reasons other than what is traditionally considered to be a medically necessary reason for example some people will say that a negative mental health outcome is a reason to abort a child later in pregnancy so if the woman is depressed they will list that as a reason for why the child had to be terminated to save the life of the mother which is certainly not the case very obviously and to the point of what Tim is saying when we say there's no such thing as a medically necessary abortion the principle behind that is if there is an operation which is necessary to save the life of the mother and then she miscarries the child as a result of that operation which was necessary to save her life that's not an abortion because nobody's intent was to go in there and end the life of the unborn child and so if a woman's having complications where she has to deliver early you deliver the child early of course and if you're at a point in pregnancy where the child isn't viable that's a horrible tragedy you still do what you can to save the child but you can't always save the child and we understand that but to go in and rip the child apart to end their life is never something which is medically required even though an early delivery maybe but are there situations where this is not a doctor by the way folks so harsh yeah the doctors are just doing these procedures because it's fucking fun even trying to induce early pregnancy could kill the mother yeah oh you want to kill your baby well okay here's a gun ma'am come on there are letters by the way signed by literally thousands of doctors let me ask let me ask just to say one thing so 88% of abortions are in the first 12 weeks 88% of abortions less than 1.3% of abortions take place near the 8th or 9th how many abortions is that is that good marker how many is that i don't know the actual numbers 13,000 okay but we're talking about less than 1.3% hold on 13,000 this is a lot this is also a million oh so i'm sorry i'm sorry i'm sorry i'm sorry 15.000 uključnog oborcačnega sada je još? Ne, jer je to nje... Iko je taj da je lišnog odlada, i da ješ njiš smak. Uključnog oborcačnega je preti da se sada vrši možda i da je Fidas što se znači. Pogleda je... Ovrši, da. I kako je uključnog oborcačnega, nekako nekako, uključnog sad sada. Uključnog sada se priču, to je, da je lišnog, je da je to medike rašte, da je možda i odlada. Čavama, i sama svakšte, potrebuješ da se jako svoje ljube. Svoje ljube ljube are, kur je... Moralići ih poslice. Prleto se nekako teroidi povrpo. Kalaurado samo cora, ti dodaš nekakog medicušnja pokeúnitva, iskio, iskio dobro, da je odmogı. Sreći, listedi vas po wizkvom. Zavil, to samo sve egentali prezerviti svakom životu. Zno, nije otvoriti medlemiskom, neoooo. Taj sam i svakaj? Da, od 9 mnogu. Na ovdje... od 9 mnogu, dozirno je skupnove po dvijek u hodog stacu, kada je stac za mnog nekada vrat, to je znavo. Tko neću se traje, kažem na 30 dana u mnog uvijet. Protoči. Pobijete! Pobijete naše javne. Da boje mogu služiti na jezav i taj moj mom je biljena pozdravit da počcuje se odmivaju. Znašlja je ti je odmijaju. Znašlja tko nije koloraja... Za biloj, ta je uvijek! Ja se, tko sam znašlja. Znašlja ti je tu na nis snake- To je sama kromors Zion. A prosli, da je iz koloraja, da se ona pevno gonjima. To je počke poču počke počkv. Kako još pokazali... I ovaj bilo, da je ovalna čijera na oboraja. da se je našta živom. Sve nešta je to, da je zašta. Znašte gleda i nešta je ljuba. Da, je ništa. To je sve ljuba, da je. Tako, da je. A kad bila babu se od glasba u učinu, nije pridon, sve nečo se da je odprut. Kaj da li? Kaj da li? Če nešto se očinu i dobiti za vratu učinu? Znam ti, da ne da se dvije. To je. Gleda. Če se da je dvije, da je dobiti začinu. Zdaj, da je. Gleda, da je. Uživam, odličite, odličite, odličit. Što ih poćete se tjene? Ti sve našto ne začinit? To možete ispanjaći? Dodajte to? Galiko te sve areduješ? Ite sam što sve rankio, da to moraš sve uživati? Ja sam da, nisuš da ima uživadni vladi, što se sreća i odlijao sitso u надо i Adhomiru. Hoda! Što se sreća i Adhomiru? Uživaj, kako se je vrata lor? Kako se se sreća? Kako je skup Oko tim, Protože li da ješo se učinati na karti, kako se svećeš, da ješo se počutila, da ješo se počutila, da je Lentz da je moračnice nekako došlično, da ješo se nekako došlično. Ovo je našta se se našta se ovoj diskut i našta. Lentz nešto se nekako beli da ješo personalne moračne. Ješo personalne moračne moračne, da ješo da ješo učinati, kako se ovoj da ješo svoj. da ima tim i svoje učinje, da se operači u toj stand-pointu. To je stojevana počada u češtje učinje u češtje, u češtje učinje u češtje učinje. Moje moralići se padljati u kao kao kako zbijajte... Hvalašo je kao, da se učinje, da je neko je nekoštje, da se možete prijevaći u vršenu na nještje, a da se načinje, da se učinje u učinje u češtje, da se učinje dobro da je dobro. Ne, ne, ne. If you were to ask me, Tim, hey Lance, do you think it's a good idea if this woman who's nine months pregnant suddenly she got bored with the pregnancy, she doesn't want to have it anymore, but the baby's viable? Do you think that's a good thing to do? Or would you be like, no, of course not. Then why should it be allowed? Because it's still her right, it's still her body, bodily autonomy doesn't stop at my morality. Tim, it's not my choice. Yes, but that's not my choice. Why kill it? Why kill it? That's her choice, not mine. Why kill the baby? Ask her. I think to be shocked by it. You're allowed to have that moral position. I think most people in America would prescribe evil to that. Sure, but that's your idea. You can prescribe evil to whatever you want. That's up to you. That's your choice. The idea that you would say. The woman wants the baby removed, and then in the process, instead of letting the baby live, remove it but kill it. There's no reason to do that. You can give the baby up for adoption. You can drop the baby up on the doorstep of a post office. I agree with you. So, why legalize? Even if it's one, one, why legalize? You see, this is the craziest thing. Because her autonomy should not be cut off based on your morality. Because you don't think... There you go. Well, that's if it was removed from her body and it was still viable. And that's where the baby guillotine is coming, because I don't think this happens. I don't think women on the ninth month get abortions with viable living children and then be like, I don't want it, kill it. Shoot the shit down, Lance. I mean, you don't have to think it happens, but statistically it does. Because your entire argument is this only happens for reasons of the health of the mother or the health of your child. I said the statistic show that at the ninth month, if a woman is going to have an abortion, it's typically because it's a medical complication that could either endanger her or the child's life. And what I'm saying is there are doctors who will justify that by saying the medical complication is she is depressed. That is literally one of the reasons given in surveys. And another reason that is given is the man who I was going to be with. Okay, okay, but Seamus, I got to stop you because this is a nebulous argument that doesn't get anywhere. And I can respect the point that if you go to a left, if you try to look this up, you're going to find left wing sources. How does this even turn into an abortion debate? So my question is... I think actually Lance brought it up, actually. Okay. Oh, hey, here's one. This is the one topic I would not bring up because I've already done it for two hours. Yeah. There's just no convincing them, no winning in it. Your argument is that they do. No, it's not. No, no, no. Your argument is that women have a right to terminate a baby for any reason at any point. Yes, they should have the bodily autonomy to make that decision. So what I'm saying is in the circumstance of Down syndrome, I think it is wrong to terminate a baby's life at nine months simply for having Down syndrome, but you would agree she is legally allowed to do so. There's the clarification. I think it should be illegal. Okay. So there are limits to how much bodily autonomy women should have. So, yes. Ah, that was good, Lance. That was very good. Pro-choice, traditionally in this country put limits at around 15-16 weeks. Meaning, if the baby is dependent upon the body of the mother, then it is the body of the mother and she has final say. If the baby is viable, it can be removed in a process that ends the pregnancy but doesn't end the life of the baby. That's kind of like the compromise where the baby gets to live and the woman no longer has to be pregnant. There seems to be this amoral argument where, well, but it just killed the baby anyway which doesn't make any logical sense. That's the pro-abortion side. So if you go back to the 90s, if you go back to safe, legal, rare, etc., if you even look at Tulsi Gabbard in 2020, that's where I'm at. Conservatives are pro-life outright. They should be banned entirely. I'm in the traditional Democrat position but you see, there is a tribal, amoral, a logical position of just let them kill the baby regardless. I don't see any logic there. I don't see how that makes sense morally or ethically or just mathematically. Right, so you said I'm pro-abortion. What I'm against is forced birth and I don't think the state should be forcing women to give birth against their will which is what your position and your position is as well. So I'm against that. So it's not going to be forcing them and turning them into... This is how you argue. Yeah, he's killing me right now. Except my difference is that if the babies at 8 months and can survive, they can take the baby out as if they would have an abortion but not kill it in the process. If it's viable at 8 months, is it viable? Yes, it is viable at 8 months. Dude, there have been babies after 20 weeks. Your position is that women have a right to kill the baby even if they end the pregnancy and agree with forced birth at a point. How? At 8 months simple things forced birth is fucking cool and pogi. Stop making stupid bullshit. See, they can't handle it when you confront them with what the reality of their viewpoint is. He freaks out when he calls it forced birth because that's the reality of it but he can't sell that because that makes it look bad. That makes him look like a controlling fucking freak which he is but he knows that he can't sell that to people because it's not marketable. I think that was really good as well because he said his audience is libertarians. Oh, he's getting pissed. Oh, this happens, yes. He caught him with his pants. I'm having deja vu right now. This is the same. I'm hearing the same thing. Oh my god. Are you traumatized, man? I'm triggered. I'm imagining myself back in that chair. The baby comes out of her. So you literally want forced birth. You literally want to force him to give birth to get real. Can I just interject here? They should use the tools to rip apart the body and pull that out whereas I'm saying they should just take the baby out. She should have the right to decide what happens to her body. That's it. Either way, the child is coming out. You're making this argument about forced birth. Either way, what is in her body the question is, is it okay to shove forceps into the skull of the small person who's inside of her and then tear them apart limb by limb to get them out or should we say, no, that's not an acceptable way of delivering a baby. You shouldn't kill that unborn child. How is that for either way it comes out of her body? Either way, the child comes out of her body. She's choosing, she's literally choosing what she wants to do. He can phrase it every once. She gets to choose to go through with a birth, pregnancy and give birth or have an abortion. That's the difference. Mm-hmm. I did. There's no such thing as forced birth. Let me tell you how fascinating this is because the last is so perfect about legalizing the killing of a baby at nine months that I can sit here and say, I think women should be able to terminate their pregnancy whenever they want, but if the baby is viable there's no reason to do it. She has to be forced to give birth define. Yes, okay, so that is forced birth, right? So she can't decide to terminate it at eight or nine months. You just said at eight months if the baby is viable. I say eight months, define, give birth. I'm trying to understand what you're saying by forced birth. What does birth mean? You just said when she is at eight or nine months. Okay, so she's at eight or nine months. Okay, so it's viable. The baby is viable. She should have to. Is Tim Poole about to learn how a baby comes out of a woman's body? The section argument is way more horrifying than even forced birth. Like you are going to perform forced surgery on these women? So then what would you call an abortion at eight months? Is the woman pushing the baby out? No, it's most likely a medical procedure done by a doctor. And what is that medical procedure? An abortion. But what is that? What is an abortion? How is it done? I'm not entirely sure it's done at eight months. It's usually done with a series of tools. I don't know how it's done at eight months. Okay, so your moral argument is forced birth. I'm trying to understand what your position is. If you don't know how an abortion is done, then are you in favor of forced birth? Am I in favor of forced birth? No, I'm getting forced birth. But you think that women should have to expel the baby, right? It's completely fine for me not to know the medical procedure. Lance isn't saying women have to do anything. He's saying the choice is up to them. I don't need to know how people perform abortions. Removing a baby from women's body is birth. Oh, so you're saying it doesn't count? No, I'm trying to... It's birth of a different nature. I don't think you have a definition, and I'm trying to understand what you mean by forced birth, but if you can't define the removal of the baby in a different way, I don't know what you're saying. I don't know what the medical terminology is, but birth is the process of a living... Well, I guess you could give birth to a child. I don't know actually how to describe birth in a medical way, but the way I would describe it without those complications where a baby is born dead, it's the birth of a child. A child coming out of a woman alive. Yep, yep. By the way, we have 2,400 people watching across all platforms. Hit that like button, folks. And make a child, a viable child, live in the real world. Right, stillbirth, stillborn is stillbirth technically. Thank you, someone in the chat for... I think what's the terminology for that. I forgot it was called stillborn. There's no being in favor of that or not. It happens, period. Yes. Okay, so what's your point? What's my point? Am I in favor of a natural process by which a woman has to have a baby removed from her no matter what anyone says or does? Your point is that at 8 or 9 months, and correct me if I'm wrong on this, Tim. You are wrong. Yes, I'll stop you right there. But you're also wrong. It's not 6 months. It's not 6 months. As soon as the baby is viable, then it's okay for the woman, even if she doesn't want to have it anymore for whatever reason, she should have to be forced to have it extracted from her and then live. Is that correct? Is that your position? It's not forcing the woman to have a baby live if the baby is already alive. You see what I'm saying? I got to compromise for you. We'll tell the mother we killed it, but we'll sneak it off and give it to someone else. Does that work for you? No, because I still think she should have autonomy. Well, that's extremely weird and creepy. She should kill the baby out. I don't want her to kill a baby. I want her to have the ability to choose. That's different, and that is a fundamental part of this. You just, the baby's out of her body, right? Forcibly. No, no, no. Let's say 24 weeks. The woman goes to the doctor and says, I don't want to have this baby. And the doctor says, I will remove it. Oh, the baby is alive, what do we do? So you forced her to give birth? This is also a fake situation. This honestly reminds me so much of 2016 aeroplastic. Once a baby is born, meaning out of a woman's body, out of the womb, out of a woman's body, and something goes wrong in Timstinio and the baby is alive outside of a woman's body, then that baby is now a person. It's a fundamental difference. And killing it once that baby is out of the woman's body and is alive, would be murder. Would be the death of a person. Which a baby is a baby in his terms, which not my terminology, it's a fetus one into the woman's body. In this same show, by the way, at the beginning of the show he described gun ownership as a human right, but bodily autonomy is not a human right according to temple. These people are the pro-life people, by the way. To kill or before that procedure takes place. So, she has a choice to choose what she wants to have done with her body. If she goes to a doctor and the doctor is like, I'm going to perform an abortion, which the assumption would be that I'm about to terminate the child, but then he just secretly sneaks the child out of there, that's not performing an abortion. You're just being deceptive. Yeah, and the doctor should go to prison if they did something like that, in my opinion. I think you should go to prison Okay, but you can kill a guy on the fucking subway and walk away like this is the level of analysis. No, because I don't think any of us is medical doctors. The difference on the physiology of the female body giving a nine month abortion, having that or the actual birthing process, whether by c-section or natural birth, it might have vastly different consequences on the female body, so that's something to take into account. Wait, wait, remember the Born Alive Act? Yes. That was a Republican position, wasn't it? Yeah, so there have been a couple of different Born Alive Acts in different years, but what they basically say is that if the abortion fails, it is not legal to kill the child. Wasn't that Republicans were trying to pass the law? Republicans were trying to pass that. That was one of the only things Obama voted on in the Senate. That was a big Carly Fee arena. In favor of what? The Born Alive Act. If an infant is born alive after the abortion, it has the same protection of law and degree as a newborn. Yeah, I would be okay with that, because at that point it's a human. If you're killing a person that is alive outside of a womb, then that's murder, right? Yeah, I agree. Can I ask you, this is not a gacha. I want to ask in good faith. You believe that the moment after the child is outside of the birth canal that they are now endowed with human rights. However, when they are inside of the mother, I don't think anything is acceptable, but I think the mother should still have the choice ultimate authority over what happens to her body. But there's a child inside her body not her meth. Like, should she be allowed to do meth? I think if someone is doing meth while they're pregnant, that it is completely acceptable for something like... I don't know what the name of the services in the United States. It's her body, though. Yeah, it's her body. Yes, if the child's born and they find meth in the child's body, that child is now a person and the mother is endangering that child. That's a whole different scenario. It's her body. If she wants to do meth, what's the problem? Well, first off, doing meth is a legal period. Doesn't matter if you're doing it without a child. Not in Oregon. Maybe it's alcohol then. Not crystal meth. Crystal meth is legal in Oregon. We do not legalize drugs in Oregon. We do not legalize them. That means ecstasy, that's a kind of meth. But we should legalize them. MDMA is legal in some ways. I was going to say, what's taking you so long. Come on, guys. Oregon decriminalized possession in 2021. Base! OK, duke. Decriminalizing possession is different than legalizing crystal meth. You know those two things are completely different, right? What's your question? So will you decriminalize? Doesn't understand what decriminalization you mean. That means if you're arrested? OK, the difference is marijuana is legalized. I can walk into a store and buy it. Meth is not legalized. It's decriminalized so that way if I buy it from someone, it's not going to be a crime technically. But you can't walk into a fucking store and buy meth. Yeah, because it's actually a crime for the guy that sold it to you still. Right, exactly. I mean, what's the difference? Well, two very different things. You can be legally allowed to possess drugs and not be legally allowed to take drugs, for example. Alcohol. Can a woman shug a fifth of vodka while pregnant? Yeah, she can legally. Do you think she has a right to do so? I think she has a right to do it. I don't agree with it. OK, and heroin? It's illegal. He just wants to control every single element. I think it's controlled. I'm looking this up. He's completely off base because they would get arrested whether or not I agree. They would get arrested for the drug use, not for being pregnant while using drugs. Right? It's just they're going to circle around every single possible hypothetical until they find some type of justification for forced birth. Now, there is a penalties civil penalties for prenatal illegal drug use if you actually give birth to the child they lose the parental rights because it's considered civil child abuse. Which doesn't play into Tim's scenario, I'm assuming this is part of the abortion conversation. And those are two very different things. Losing the right to your parental rights over a living, breathing, human being is much different than going to jail for doing drugs while you're pregnant. The question was if an abortion happens with the baby survives, can you kill it? Lance already said no. We're done with that. Any other political arguments, anyone left or right or otherwise trying to change that? No, it's irrelevant. Once the baby is born it's made. It has the same rights as every other human at that point. This is an interesting I think this falls in line with the idea of anarcho tyranny that we were talking about. My view of the modern left is that their positions are nothing but chaos. There's no logical pathway towards preserving life, improving people's lives. It seems to be only, it's like yin yang. There's one side that's talking about long term planning, logical thinking and improving the world and one side that takes the inverse position no matter what. There's no push in front of a subway, nobody bats an eye. One guy, three guys try to subdue a man and now they want prison. That's like a weird inversion of what the law is supposed to do. The law should stop the people who are pushing people on the trains and protect the people on the train who are being victimized. But the left's position is the inverse of it. Are you asking me for an affirmation of that? No, I'm just saying that's my view. When you say the left's idea are all chaos, if you really wanted to boil down what the left is fighting for, especially myself, it's expanding freedom. I believe in freedom. I love freedom. I'm sure everyone here likes freedom too, right? How do you define freedom exactly? For me, I believe in a democratic process where we don't have tyrants, we don't have dictators, we don't have kings or queens, we have the ability as a democracy to be able to vote for who we work for. Sorry, who our leaders are, right? Like we want to be able to vote for our president, our prime minister. I believe in that fundamentally. But my other thing is I want to expand that freedom in the space, because we spend about eight hours a day every single day in our works, our jobs. I want to expand freedom there. So people who work at their jobs for eight hours a day have the ability to vote for things in their lives, better health care, better working conditions, whether or not their boss is corrupt and stealing from all of them. I want to expand that. I want to expand freedom into other parts of life. That's a fundamental belief for me. So what do you mean by stealing from them? Stealing wages, for example. Like actually shorting someone's check. What happened to me? I sued. I went to the National Labor Board and we won. How does it happen? So there's a ton of ways. Not paying overtime bosses simply just garnishing checks or garnishing wages, stealing tips or thinking that tips are justification to pay them lower salaries and stuff like that. All of it, bullshit. And when you look at the stats, cars being stolen, jewelry, all that, wage theft, blows, everything. They're not even comparable. It's one down here and then it's like a conversation that they're not going to be able to twist for their audience. I don't see how they're going to do it with my paycheck. No, it's going to be a problem with my paycheck. Fix it. And very quickly it was like $67 missing. I want it fixed. I want it fixed now. And they went, give us a few minutes. Came back 15 minutes later, handed me a check. I looked at it and said, are you joking? And they were like, Han, I was like, this is wrong. I'm not an idiot. Fix my paycheck. Went to a couple other employees. They said, let me see your paychecks. I said, come with me. Walked right to the national labor board in Chicago and said, this is what they did. They took our statements. We went to the company and we told them we were going to form a union because of what they had done. They fired us on the spot for doing it. We sued them and then I'll give you air quotes and saying we won. What actually happened was after six months of being out of work, they said you can get retro pay which will be $7,000 each or we can go to fight and then I'll give you your job back. And I'm like, if they give us our job back they're going to retaliate against us. No, no, that's illegal. And I was like, oh, come on. So we won the fight. But it really means they were able to fight. He doesn't understand he's making lenses point perfect. So we'll give you this example. I just want to make the point. I haven't seen the stats on wage theft causing more in losses than all other forms of theft combined. I'll just have to take your word for that and I'm willing to grant that for the sake of this discussion. True. Like I said, I'm willing to grant it if that is the case. And at the very least for the sake of argument I certainly don't agree in involuntarily democratizing all workplaces. That's probably a much longer interesting economic discussion. Happy to engage in it with you guys, too. And I suspect we would all have different views on it. I don't know if you want to go to other issues. I would like to talk about that. Budweiser. Budweiser opens that door. Ladies and gentlemen, the Anheuser-Busch CEO has finally disavowed the Dylan Mulvaney ad in privates to investors though he's not made a public statement. Sales are down 26%. They're going to be giving out free cases of beer to distributors and they vowed to spend millions of dollars in marketing. But the boycott is particularly effective I would say. And there's videos now coming out of people at sporting events where the Bud Light is just behind the counter totally full and everyone's buying other brands. So Ian and Sheamus both just leave at the same time. Yeah, I don't know where they went. So yeah, let's jump into this. What are your thoughts on the Budweiser thing? My thoughts are keep going. You're doing awesome, all of you. I mean this, to every single person protesting Bud Light fuck yes, I am so here for this. It's fucking amazing. Budweiser sucks and Anheuser-Busch sucks. It's a massive multinational corporation. They're super anti-LGBTQ plus beautiful to see. I love it. Oh, they donate so much to right wing Republicans to push anti-LGBTQ laws. So Anheuser-Busch getting taken down. Oh man, I'm so here for, keep going. Me too, absolutely. Yeah, they think that they can pay off Republicans, they can hire GOP aides and that is going to be satisfactory for their customers who are upset with them as a brand. So clearly what we can see. Let's do this one. See, I told you, it takes about that first segment, that first 20-30 minutes and it pulls away at doing things and then you immediately reconfigure how you go about it. That's exactly what happened to me. Yeah, the way that he's approaching this is perfect. Absolutely. Take Disney down. I'm all for the right wing, taking on Disney, all for the right wing, taking on Anheuser-Busch. Yes, of course, these are terrible fucking corporations. Yes, Lance. By the way, the Daily Mail is the number one source on the show, right? Like every single time you've shown me all sides media bias, it has the Daily Mail on right wing and you yourself... Yeah, you're actually fantastic, the Daily Mail. But if you use them as a primary source, you understand why I'd say that... We don't use them as a primary source. What happens is when we pull up stories, I'll go to CNN, Fox News, ABC and they'll each have 300 words. And then you go to the Daily Mail after doing a search on key elements of the story and the Daily Mail will have seven different versions of breaking down different components. Like, if you scroll down the Daily Mail, they often do these special sections where they have an entirely different story providing more context. Like, for instance, this story from the Daily Mail not only talks about the current story with the CEO, but it even goes all the way into all of the context going back to the commercial that was released, the sale drop at 6% in the first week to the video. It covers literally every... Even as a photo of the VP and her husband so in-depth this story is. So it's like, if I'm gonna pull up a single article, I can pull up five ABCCBS New York Times or I can just pull up this one that has seemingly everything in it, including Kid Rock, including John Rich, including Bud Light being poured into a dumpster. So it's a massive aggregator. Massive aggregator of right-wing talking point. Exactly. Bud Light, have a time, go nuts. I have a really big problem with what I feel on this show is a lot of anti-trans hysteria and fearmongering that takes place. You wanna open that book? I have that book at home. We can talk about that in a second. And I'm totally comfortable talking about that book. I've read it. Should it be in schools? I wanna talk to you about the trans issue though. That's why I ask about the book. We can get to the books in the schools, the curriculums and everything that the Florida's taken away. But you profess to be kind of fact-based, science-based, right? I've noticed you wanna pull up stats when it comes to trans people. That is so far beyond the pale. Let's start with gender-affirming care. Gender-affirming care, you're very, very against. I've heard you call it the mutilized mutilation. I don't call it mutilation. I've never said that. I don't know if he does. I call it child sex change. When you were talking about Dwayne Wade moving his family. Someone in the crowd said, why are you mutilating your son? That was a quote from someone else. I've explicitly said, I don't take the right agitator approach of calling it mutilation because that's not effective in having a conversation. I will plainly call it a child sex change as what it is. I'm not gonna call it gender-affirming or mutilation because I don't think those things accurately explain what it is. What a sex change does? A boy putting on dressing as the opposite gender is not a sex change. No matter how he tries to claim that's the wording he's gonna use but that's clearly why he's doing it. Yeah, yeah. Gender-affirming care would be in the form of you using different pronouns, preferred pronouns and allowing them to dress differently. Yeah, I don't care about that. Yes, I do. Okay, so both of you don't. Do you accept that there is no surgery being performed on children at that age from zero to about ten? There is hormone blockers. I don't think surgery is happening on kids under 12. So hormone blockers aren't given to children until they go through puberty. That's not true. We actually pulled this up with Destiny. He actually called me and I was wrong about a stat. What we found was 47,000 cross-sex hormones. I think it was something like 17,000 puberty blockers and like 2,000 double mastectomies for girls after the age of 13 or whatever. Puberty blockers were preteen. Puberty blockers. Yes, that's when people go to puberty. Yes, that's when people go to puberty. Okay, so you're just reaffirming what you're about to go puberty. You're about to go puberty. You're only coming to the form of using different pronouns, using different names, allowing them to dress differently and that's it. And you don't have a problem with that. Okay, so we'll get to Lupron, but up to that point, you don't have a problem with any of this yet, right? And you agree that there is no surgery on children at that age? Zero to ten? Let me just start from the beginning so I can make sure I'm getting what you're saying right. I don't care if parents call their kids names or whatever. I care about medical or surgical intervention. Okay, so that doesn't happen until about the age of about 16. That's the average age 4. But you're wrong. Look, we had destiny on the show. We went into great detail about it. There are girls who are 13 who are getting this done because Canadian, I believe, 12 to 17. He said the average age. He didn't say there was no one under the age of 16. I said the average age, but if you want to say that there are people who get this at 12, there could be the case. Let's start with puberty blockers, Tim. Lupron, you both have a big problem with Lupron? I don't know a lot about it, but I consider it a medical treatment. Yeah, we shouldn't be giving Lupron to kids. So you don't think you should give Lupron to kids? Why don't you want Lupron being given to trans kids? Because it's a puberty blocker that inhibits the natural function and development of their body. And more importantly, I think my view is built upon what we've seen out of Europe already, right? So earlier on, maybe a few years ago, I was more agnostic on the issue until Sweden, Denmark, Finland abandoned this and the Tavistak Center got shut down and the data they released said this actually caused more harm than good. And then I was like, well, okay, hey, how about that? And for some reason in the United States we're still bent on moving forward with what we can already see from countries of better healthcare systems saying no to this, right? Okay, so I can address those individually because I have the explanation as to why that happened. When it comes to Lupron, 0 to 10 is about the age where gender-affirming care only comes in the form of different names, pronouns, stuff like that. We can all agree that's completely fine. We can't. You three can agree that I don't. Fine, okay, fine. My position is more just like, oh, man, like social therapy stuff. They say that after puberty, desistence rates are between 60, 65 and like 92%. So that's completely false. We have to do this piece by piece first, okay? Oh, let's get through Lupron first. Hey, I just proved you're wrong. Studies show 10 fall-up studies found desistence of 61 to 98%. Can you click on the Wikipedia article? It's the Wikipedia article for detransition. What are the studies? What are we talking about? I would like to know if you are taking these studies specific. Well, because I have each one of them written down here, and I'm quite curious. Is the Drumming study one of them? Is the Wallen study is Stensma? The Swedish study a part of this? The 2011 study? Probably, I don't know. We should know. When they could show the stats, they bring it up as a boom, gotcha! I don't know. I'll get the mic again. You can carry it around. I gotta get used to this. I know, scroll down to the conclusion of the study. I wanna at least skim what the number is in reference. You're not skimming nothing when you're doing a live show, buddy. It's simply impossible. It's simply impossible. I'm a girl, the parent. I would hope that the parent would be like, you can pretend to be whatever you want. Or you can play a girl. But I get afraid when a mom's like, he said he's a girl, that means he's trans. For this, it's not a process. It doesn't exist in which someone can say, hey, I'm a boy, I'm a girl. And then they go into a doctor's office and take some Lupron. You do years and years consultation between a doctor and between a therapist and between the patient itself. I'm just gonna read this. Adolescence is a crucial time for identity and concerns. The outcomes of GDC have been discussed in terms of its persistence and desistence. For most children with GDC, whether GD will persist or desist will probably be determined between the ages of 10 and 13 years. Although some may need more time. Evidence from the 10 available prospective follow-up studies from childhood to adolescence reviewed in the study by Restory and Steensma indicate that for around 80... Oh, it is Steensma. I was right. I asked if this was Steensma. But you said 2011. Oh, so there's multiple Steensma studies. They've actually built upon each other. And the problem with the Steensma study, unfortunately, is that they actually characterized people who were not trans in that study. They didn't compare people who were trans to people who were trans and then detransitioned. They compare people in the general population. What's your source for that? The actual author of the study has come out since and said that the stone... What can I pull up to confirm that? Because look, I pulled up a study and made a counterclaim. I will pull it up. See, this is also why... This is an issue I have with how he does this. Because I don't think this is good for pulling up studies and throwing studies at each other. I think Lance is on to something here with this particular study. But the audience has already moved on from this. And again, the whole point of talking to Tim Poole is to reach those outlierers and his audience who would be open to this. I think we're already losing them, you know what I mean? It kind of reminds me of the vaccine or COVID debates, whatever. We're just going to start bringing up different studies to prove each other wrong. And it's like, what does this really prove? You're not going to really change anyone's mind, necessarily. And that's my issue with Tim doing that. I think Lance is on to something here. I do think Lance is on to something here. But this is my issue because Tim does this in every time he has a debate with some sort of individual who he doesn't agree with. He's got to throw the studies out and get him counterclaiming. It's just not a productive way to have these sort of debates. Yeah. I pulled up a scientific study for you. I'm not pulling up a nonprofit. So this is an interview with the person who did the study in this article. I have pulled up a scientific study for you. See what I mean? He's going to find a way to get out of it. He's very weasel-y. He weasels out of everything. He's saying this is not correct. Yes. Let me pull that up. Even if Lance is able to prove what he's saying, then Tim Pool will just introduce a hypothetical. So should a kid be able to transition if X and Y, that's just what he does. He's a weasel. Cornell University did a meta-study. Cornell University did a meta-study. On 55 different studies, start looking up Cornell University meta-study Cornell University did a meta-study. On 55 different studies on de-transitioning. Of those 55 they found 52 of the studies showed that people de-transitioned at a rate of less than 4%. And of those people who did it the reason they de-transitioned was social stigma. That's 52 of the 55. The other three of those 55 they didn't show a net negative effect. There was not a single study of the 55 that Cornell University looked at or gender-affirming care being a bad thing for trans people. If anything it was a net positive. This is a meta-study. I have another meta-study. I'm trying to pull up a scientific study to confirm what you're saying. So you're mentioning that this is a meta-analysis of studies on people who have de-transitioned. By definition this is taking into account people who went through puberty blockers, hormone replacement therapy, physical surgeries. In the studies it was people who were going through puberty blockers, some had hormone therapy but a lot of them in one form or another had received gender-affirming care. They were trans when the study first tried to identify these people and then it looked at them years later. And how is this sample collected? Because almost every single issue or almost every single study I've seen from trans advocates on this issue use a convenient sample rather than doing some kind of controlled randomized test for treatment. I don't want to fall in this trap where each of us starts saying you have a study. That's what I just said! We should look at the compromising data that looks over a whole bunch of studies. A second meta-study that I want you to look at regret after gender-affirming surgery, a systematic review and meta-analysis of prevalence. This went to Canada, the Netherlands, Belgium, UK, Italy, USA, Brazil, Sweden, Singapore, Germany, Norway, Ireland, Serbia. Well, I've got to tell you guys that I'm actually speaking to Lance I'm letting him know. That explains a lot. Good job, Matt. I have another meta-study. I've got to address this right now. There is a problem we are facing in that you are saying a lot of things and I can't pull up any sources. At the very least all I did was Google searched it. I pulled up the two studies that were associated with it and said, here's what it says. I have not given you my personal perspective on it. You've now given me your personal view on it. Tim doesn't seem to know how things rank on Google. Let me please pull them up. I can't find what you're talking about. The first one is Cornell University. It's Cornell University's meta-study of 72 studies on gender-affirming care. Of that, 55 of the studies were directly related to each other. Is Lance looking at a computer? He just literally airdropped him the link. Cornell University, what does scholarly research say about the effect of gender transition and trans-well-being? Oh, here we go. I found it. Nice. And the third one, the third meta-study that I want to bring up is a U.S. study. It's a 2015 U.S. transgender study. But this isn't a scientific research paper that's peer-reviewed. No, this is a meta-analysis of scientifically. See, they don't even know what the fuck they're talking about. But this is the problem with doing this, because even when they get it, they're not going to be able to go through this live on a two-hour live stream because it's not possible. It's pointless. It's just self-flating bullshit. Like, I got a study. I'm looking at the facts from a real scientist. No, you're not looking at shit because you didn't have time to read it. Yeah, a meta-analysis is going to be very long. Sorry, go ahead, Gavin. Oh, no, I was just going to say, also it's just boring to watch two people Google studies. This is YouTube pro-debate. It's not too scientists to do own analyses or whatever. Like, it's just so boring and pointless to do. Also, I don't think those two scientists that would have a scientific debate are throwing Google searches. Let me look it up. What is it called? It really does feel like they're doing street fighter moves in the form of Google searches and scientific. It's like... No, this is a slow, turn-based RPG battle that we're seeing here. Right. 2022. Let me type it and pull it up. We're still doing it. I need you to type it. Mental health outcomes. Transgender and non-binary youth receiving gender-affirming care February 25, 2022, peer-reviewed study. The findings, kids who were seeing puberty blockers in hormone therapy had 60% lower odds of moderate or severe depression and 73% lower odds of suicidality. Here's another individual study for you. Do you want to go back to the distance studies? That's what I was asking you about. I Google search distance. Wikipedia has two studies that say it's 61% to 98%. You said that's wrong. I said pure source. Didn't give me one. We're on camera. It's not a peer-reviewed source. If you want to go back and forth to single studies, like I said, this can take forever. Do you not have a single study? I've named you tons of studies. No, no, no. You've given me a meta-analysis. Not a single study. A meta-analysis combines other studies. Do you understand what that works? So what your argument is is that you've got 72 studies that have done a conclusion. You're saying that out of 72 studies that found a conclusion. No, 55. It was a hypothetical number. 51. He's trying to get Lance to argue on his terms of detransition. That are peer-reviewed. Lance shouldn't take the bait. Someone analyzed those. Cornell University. Who from Cornell? This is going nowhere. It's not a study. It's a meta-analysis of studies. These are different things. The problem is these studies have their own conclusions you're ignoring. They combine their conclusions to reach their findings. That's how they do this. During COVID there were a whole bunch of studies that individual studies peer-reviewed that found ivermectin did not work. The right kept bringing up meta-analysis that said actually it does. I said, and I said this to Joe Rogan, I reject that. Show me the actual study. I do not believe this is correct. I will not afford you some benefit to come in and make the same argument to me. If you do not have a study to entertain your opinions. When I bring up the Cornell University study it's a meta-analysis. Of 55 peer-reviewed studies. Whose conclusion of 52 came to the fact that there is a less than 4% detransition rate. If you go to r slash science, Tim, you can find out. You just pulled up Wikipedia. Why are you laughing? I'm pulling up Reddit. Jin explains and downplays why you're wrong about that 80-85% She's the one who actually did that study. She's the one who did the study you cited. So she explains why it's being misused. It is not true. I can say this. There are arguments about what is true all day every day. There's arguments that M-theory is wrong and that science is unwilling to give up because too many scientists have dedicated their lives to it. So they argue that M-theory is the theory while others are coming up with like E8 lie group theory or whatever. I totally understand that people will decide what they think is true or not. Hence, I have a bottom-line standard. If the right comes at me and says, Ivermectin meta-analyses prove it works, I say, don't know, don't care. We have rejected the concept of someone analyzing a collection of studies and making determination. What our standard is, if we're going to have any basic agreement on what is or isn't, there has to be a unified standard there, and a reviewed study, which is not absolute. I think Lance won this one, obviously. He needs to just at this point push it aside and move on to the next thing. You didn't give me one study. You gave me 55. Is not the fucking winner. I think that Tim thinks it is. I don't want to interrupt too much here, but I'm probably going to have to duck out for the rest of the show. Thank you guys so much for having us on today. It was a great chat with you guys. Sorry, I tried to put something in the private chat. I don't know if you guys were able to see it. I got to get to AutoZone to fix something for my girlfriend, unfortunately, before they close. But thank you guys so much for having us on. I know Gavin can hold down the fort for the both of us. Take care, it's nice talking to you. Take care, Zach, nice meeting you. For sure, cheers guys, thank you so much. That meta-analysis also found a lesson. Then there were three. We're dwindling down here. Globally, for so long, we've ignored the science and data on this. It's too flagrantly. There's not been a single large-scale randomized clinical trial for puberty blockers to treat gender dysphoria. There's not been one. You all are very against Lupron, right? Well, I don't know much about it. Just being very against is pretty strong. I'm saying there hasn't been one large-scale randomized clinical trial for these treatments. Lupron for when children go through the early onset puberty and it's an actual medical issue. That's why I sang very against something. Are we going to a kid who... Are we dealing with an actual case of say, endocrine disruption caused by phthalates and PCBs? Or are we dealing with a kid who's just playing with dolls and the parents are incorrect, right? And in that case, you would have a long process where they would have to do interviews with professionals who would determine whether or not it's appropriate. And people who go on puberty blockers, I want to add this, if it's for a limited amount of time, they want to do it only to be able to hold that off. No, it's only two years, Lance is right. Is it the actual doctors on this? You only take it... No, no, Tim, let me finish this sentence. Come on, you brought me on your show. Let me finish this. You only go on puberty blockers for a short amount of time before you can be put onto HRT. They do not want to keep them on puberty blockers. And that way you avoid a lot of the potential negative side effects from that. We had Helena Kirschner on the show who walked into a planned parenthood and within minutes was given the maximum dose of testosterone. Anecdo. Absolutely. So when I say lived experience happens, you say it doesn't happen. I'm saying it did happen. I'm saying you have to look at broader data. You have to look at broader trends. That's the issue I take, right? Yeah, and it wouldn't make sense if I brought up a single horror story to you and said this is fact. It can happen. I said we don't want that to happen, right? Of course, no one wants that to happen. But then if we want to understand how this is actually taking place around the world from an actual perspective of science, we have to look at the data. We have to look at meta studies. We have to look at and analyze global understanding of this. When it comes to Lupron by example, yes, it's true that Lupron is not FDA approved for the use of ongoing system of the children. There is a product that is FDA approved for use with children that is a puberty blocker and it has been used for a long time for generations and decades. It's Lupron. It was just being done. No, but that's... Hey, where'd Matt go? He ducked out. He might be refreshing. To say we want to prepare for someone early onset puberty so that they can develop any normal... I clicked the wrong button. I clicked the wrong button. I clicked the wrong button. I clicked the wrong button. It's entirely different from saying we're going to administer puberty blockers because this child feels they're a member of the opposite sex. That's an entirely different reason because you're looking for a different... It's going to be the problem, right? You want to know whether or not it's use is going to be dangerous on the children. And the reason for administering a certain treatment can render it dangerous. So for example, if we have been... That doesn't make any sense. Lims for hundreds of years. If I go into a doctor and say please cut my arm off because I don't want it anymore and he cuts my arm off, that's medical malpractice. For you to jump in and go, we've been cutting people's arms off for hundreds of years. Oh, my God. This is the Joe Rogan example. Come on, bro. I've heard Joe Rogan make this exact same argument before. What a fucking echo chamber. All these people just repeating Joe Rogan's shitty anti-trans arguments. Yeah. It's extremely rare. What if you just wanted your arm to get cut off with the doctor to do that too? Shut the fuck up, bro. Operations on the black market if they have VIID. And what we found when people do that and go into the black market to have the limb removed is that it only provides a temporary amount of relief for the condition and then it returns and they have further complications from the fact that they now have a disability and or medical complications that come from all that. My point is not about any kind of body dysmorphia about losing a limb. My point is about... Wait, so Lance just actually refuted his body dysmorphia claim with actually talking about people who have body dysmorphia, like a disability like that. And then Sheamus really goes, my point is to not be serious with my example. They can never take the L ever. I just Google search real quick, stat in 2017, 100 out of 100 with a news guard, drug used to halt puberty may cause lasting health problems. More than 10,000 adverse event reports were filed with the FDA, reflecting the experience of women who've taken Lupron, describing everything from brittle bones... I will say, I am amazed by how much Lance knows on this topic. I gotta say, I don't know as much as he does on this. Not even close. I don't know if I can cite any about anything, to be honest. This is not my field of expertise. It's very impressive to see Lance knows a lot about what trans people go through. I'm very impressed. Not only did he do his homework, but keep in mind, he's debating like four or five people. I actually don't think Lance did his homework. I think this is just an issue that he just regularly, naturally, is very interested and knows a lot about. I've heard him pull out information on this topic on his own stream. Yeah, that's true. It really does not feel like he prepared this just for Tim Pool's show. This is stuff he just knows. This is one of his beats, I think. That's possible. He knows a shit. One of the young boys, he was actually a girl and then forced him to live as a girl, ultimately resulting in his suicide. And then the death of the brother as well. We don't want that to happen. And so that did happen already and we know that happened. So we have to be careful about taking a three-year-old and then raising them and telling them they're female because then if they start exhibiting traditional gender behaviors, there may be some concern. For instance, jazz stopped dilating and that was the big controversy over the past few weeks. The mother going on TV saying she would force jazz to do it. If jazz is saying, I'm not gonna, and the mother saying, and then jazz is updating women, we're starting to see a pattern that may be concerning because it follows the John Money situation. I don't even know and that means there may be children who are pushed on a path that ultimately leads to their suicide because their parent... So rather than addressing the reality of the situation, which is that if you don't give children gender for men care who need it, they'll commit suicide, he's saying that a parent is pushing this on their kid and that anecdote led to a kid committing suicide, I guess, he's trying to flip it on its script or on his head, like flip the script on its head is what I'm trying to say. More often than not these are children who are approaching their parents saying they think this is something happening to them and parents pushing back and being like, no, this is wrong. You're just a tomboy. Oh, this is, this is not you. And you don't go into a doctor and all of a sudden they're like, here's Lupron. They do. No, but they don't. The average amount of time... The average amount of time... You can't say they don't when we've had the anecdotes that they do. Call it an anecdote. It's an anecdote. I'm telling you it does happen. Of course, but that's an anecdote. We have to look at... So don't say it doesn't happen. Well, it happens, but if that doesn't mean it, it's a broad trend. Then say it should not happen. Right, but that's, okay, this is ask me. We have to talk about what actually occurs via the numbers, right? That's what matters. Like, I have here the largest U.S. transgender survey ever done. It's in 2015 to 21,598 participants and this covers people in childhood, adolescence and it has all the results you're looking for. So let me ask you a question. Why do you think we're seeing the rapid increase in the past few years of young people identifying as trans? Okay, can I answer that? Can you read this? Yeah, yeah, of course. So it shows the 2015 U.S. transgender survey of 21,598 participants that with hormone therapy, psychological distress for children reduces by 222%, late adolescence 153%, adulthood 81%, suicidal ideation for children goes down 135% for adolescents, 62% and for adults, 21%. That is dramatic. Is this the Stanford Medical School Survey analysis done by Jack Turbin? I don't know the person who did it. Okay. But in terms of the increase, Tim, of people. Because there was a study done by Stanford Medical School that very closely fits the description of what you've just read out there, which is very ascientific and what that is collected for. Yeah, so just please find the source of that. Because I want to pull that apart, but I want to be sure that I know you're talking about that study. I'm curious as to why you think it's increasing so much. What's that? Yes! The history of left-handedness. This is the history of left-handedness in the United States. Do you see what happens here? It levels out. It goes up and levels out. We used to treat people who were left-handed as satanic, as the devil, all that kind of shit. And that's why there was a lot of people who didn't record themselves as being left-handed. And then, boom, when we stopped doing that after the 1880s and in the 1900s, it spiked. Now, this spike isn't because there was a whole bunch of indoctrination or Alex Jones was like, oh, left-handed ideology, everyone has nothing to do with that. This is naturally how many left-handed people there were and then a plateaued. We are in a situation right now where it is safer than ever for people to come out and if they're queer, bisexual, whatever it is, and because of that they feel safer and the genzija of all generations. I was certain there was a transgenocide. Yeah, so here's... Oh, shut the fuck up, Tim. Wow, that's how you respond. That is genzija. That is the amount of people who in genzija it's skyrocketing. It looks like they're identifying more than ever because their generation feels more comfortable talking about this kind of stuff. So you don't think that there's like a transgenocide or anything like that? I don't think that there's a trans indoctrination that is coming through media. Geneside, I said. Yes, and I'm saying that I don't think there's a trans indoctrination that's ridiculous. And if you want to change topics to talk about transgenocide we can move on to that. But you asked me specifically why is there a spike? That is why. Okay, so my follow-up is you think trans people feel safer than ever. No, right now there's over 400 different bills being pushed in the United States that is directly targeting trans people. So they don't feel safe? Of course they don't. So then why are they coming out if they don't feel safe? They have more access because that generation, Generation Z has a lot more acceptance towards trans people than older people who pass laws, draconian people who pass laws. The boomers are the ones running the show right now. There's still the ones in government. There's still the ones passing laws. There's very few Generation Z in government or parliament. Lance is killing it right here. I think there is a transgenocide. Okay. And I think it's you. Okay. Because you're sterilizing a lot of these people. Oh my fucking god. They're literally sterilizing them. This man just lost. This is Coke. He knows he's back to dual corner. He didn't even address Lance's very good argument. Removal of the gonads at all. And then puberty blockers have a very high rate and cross-exformants have it. I'm sorry, but when your argument is no you, that's when you've lost. Like Lance, Lance clapped the cheeks here. There's no coming back from this. So this is why he's changing the subject and attacking. You are removing these people's ability to reproduce. And if they're a young age and they haven't had the ability, for instance, jazz gennings can never have kids. Jazz gennings also, and this is probably part of your studies, can't actually feel any sexual feeling of any kind. Do you have any idea how weird this sounds right now? Like, why are you a stranger's genital pleasure? That's so weird. That's so bizarre. That was very weird yourself. You guys are all... No, you did it again! You did it again! Who engage in activities which is a large portion of the global economy, whether you like it or not, sex cells they say. And when I say this person will never have this ability to go, how weird is that? It's weird for you to fixate on a stranger's genital pleasure. That's strange. That's so bizarre. She's quite public about it. See, you're not making an argument right now, is my point. I'm not. I'm saying this weird. It's not an argument. That's an observation. So you're trying to make an appeal to emotion and an appeal to shame. No, I'm just giving you my genuine thought when you say something like that. Tim is definitely feeling embarrassed. Yeah. You're trying to shame me? You're not. She has a genital feeling. That's not important. It's not... It's not in my business. So let's focus then on the sterilizing of the individual. Are you okay with that? When... Who's sterilizing people? I don't know anything about her. Because jazz is a famous individual on cable television. So if she is sterile for whatever reason, what does that have to do with me? Why does that concern me? Do you support the sterilization of teenagers? This is such a weird way to frame this. You are removing teenagers' ability to have children. I'm not doing anything. I'm not a doctor, Tim. You support it. I don't have the ability to do this. I support people having access to health care. Of course. Why would I want to prevent that just because some people have big children? Let's try again. You seem scared of this. Do you believe that parents and doctors should have the ability to remove the ability of a child for future reproduction? They should have the ability to give them access to health care. Of course they should. So why do you care sterilization? You're implying that every single gender-affirming care results in sterilization. I didn't say that. That is not true at all. I said the removal of the... There's also people who are trans that never get bottoms up. Yeah. You can see in his face he's getting flustered as well. Cause Lance is winning in this area. Oh yeah. Nice try. Nice try. Nice try. Your appeal to emotion is not gonna work on me. I've got no emotion. Your appeal... I've got no empathy. I've got no... There's nothing to appeal to. On genociding autistic individuals, I genuinely believe that. Whose autistic is this? A large portion of trans kids are autistic, namely females. So, this is an issue. Where's your study, bitch? Young lesbian autistic females are a large portion of those who are transgender. Do you have data on this? I mean, come on bro, do you have data on what you've brought up? Oh, come on bro. He had lots of data, actually. I've given you multiple meta studies on this. I've given you a surplus of information on this topic. Yeah. Keep shifting the goal post. More likely to have autism according to npr.org. So I think you're trying to genocide autistic people. Oh my God. I literally... Six times more. I'm not even trying to have an honest debate. Yeah. Are you like trans rights? Well, then you support the genocide of autistic people. I'm sorry. Yeah, yeah. You're saying, like how much... What does it mean to trans people happen to be autistic lesbians? That was your claim, but a large portion of what I've seen, I don't know any statistics on that. I've never heard that before. So, the first thing I pulled up was that transgender and non-binary people... 136... More likely to have autism. According to the CDC, 136 čildren in the United States have been identified with autism in the U.S. Those numbers do not overlap with the minute number of trans people, and even going by Tim's weird argument there. Yeah, this is a weird area to go into. So, what I think is, I think that there are people who hate people with Down syndrome and in Iceland they've... I'm not transphobic. You're ableist. There is eradication of people with Down syndrome. I think that's horrifying. Like, you can be okay with it. I'm not saying you're not allowed to believe that, right? You don't have to have the same morals as me. I just think it's wrong to genocide like people with Down syndrome. Every argument he has is about forcing people to have the same morals as him. You're saying that I'm pro people having abortions for people who have Down syndrome when we're talking about... I'm not saying you do. I'm saying in Iceland they've... What does this have to do with trans rights? Right, autistic people, autism and trans kids. You said... You said it makes up the majority. It does not even based on the source you pulled up. Okay. 24%. Okay. I still believe that this is very much an effort. I think the left is intent on genociding trans people. In what way? Removing their... Very, very good faith here. How are they removing their ability... By cutting off their testicles and removing their... That is not the only operation that is done. There are trans people who maintain their same genitals and have to decide to get bottom surgery. That's a choice they should make. And cross-ex hormones. And even if they want bottom surgery, we don't have the universal healthcare system. It's very, very cost prohibitive for trans people who want it. Also, trans genderism is not... It doesn't pass through your genes. If two transgender people have a child the kid's not going to be transgender guaranteed. It's how it works. That doesn't make any sense. I don't think it's ridiculous on that part. He's talking as if... Oh, if you don't let transgender people reproduce, you have no more transgender people. Completely cisgender... Most trans people come from cisgender parents. Yeah. Plus... Hildebis pointed out, is he okay with circumcision? Right. Yeah. Plus, even if they are being sterilized then maybe they can adopt all those kids that Tim Pool and his ilk forced women to, you know, give birth to. I'm gonna... I'm gonna... I'm gonna... Yeah, tell him about the circumcision point. It's... He's gotta... He's gotta bring it up. Exactly. So why is it our business? Because it's been removed before jazz could have the ability to... But again, that has nothing to do with us. She could decide to never want to have kids and that's fine and valid. So my morals would be that a society protects the children because there's certain things you can't know until you're at least 24 or older when your brain is fully developed. Which is why we don't allow people to drink and do certain drugs, whatever drugs are legal, until they're 21. So for me, I'm like, if you can't drink till you're 21, if there's, like, you can't smoke till you're 18, this society absolutely recognizes. You can't drive till a certain age. That the reason that the driving age is what it is, one of the arguments made, I think it was in Illinois, is that risk taking is a lot higher in youth than it is in older people. So the argument is once you're past 16, you go through driver Z, that helps control for the higher risk taking of younger people. So we said an age limit. For someone who's 10 years old to be put on Lupron and then cross-ex hormones, they will never develop the ability to reproduce. So in the instance of jazz, again, a famous individual who's very influential with millions of followers, there was never the ability to reproduce and develop, which caused complications. Complications aside, that's jazz's personal business. But the puberty blockers and cross-ex hormones did sterilize jazz. 100% sterilization. Jazz was not phone number text and the check is the end. I have concerns about having children, whether they choose or their parents choose to. I think that's genocide. I can kind of see your argument because if a kid was straight, a straight kid, just a kid and they were like a 12-year-old girl and she was like, I don't want to have babies when I'm older. And the mom was like, okay, then we'll sterilize you right now. And they went and had the kid had a hysterectomy. That's, I think that's illegal. I don't know, but I would imagine society needs to protect little kids from crazy parents just because of 12-year-old. You want me to just tell them to check his DMs? He's sterilizing as a byproduct. I think should be on Twitter. Should be taken into account with the whole procedure. I think that's still something that comes down to the individual and what they choose to do. I just text them. I want to have gender-affirming care. Knowing the risks, then why is that my business? It's the same thing with someone who wants to have a surgery that can have other complications. That's not my business. If someone had an appendix aflame and they had to have their appendix out, there are potential complications that come from that, from having healthcare and saying that you can't have a right to get your appendix out because every major medical association in the United States agrees that that is the best way to treat appendicitis. And in this case when we're talking about trans people, every single medical association in the United States agrees on gender-affirming care. Every single one. You know what they should do? They should produce one single randomized controlled trial for puberty blockers and cross sex hormones to show that it's effective. But they have not. There needs to be one randomized trial. Says the motherfucker who doesn't know what a meta-analysis is. Shut the fuck up. That's not healthcare. Healthcare repairs something which is broken. You use the example of somebody's appendix not functioning properly. So what you have to do in that instance is intervene so that the body can function as it is intended to. Destroing somebody's ability to procreate is demolishing the organ that you're claiming to treat, right? You're destroying rather than helping to improve it. That's not healthcare. I want to pull this up to this from University of Utah because I was reading about this recently. Oh, please bring up circumcision lands. It goes on to mention that hormone replacement therapy can make you sterile and that it's important. It can. It's important to preserve your sperm. It says, if you're trans feminine, otherwise the hormone therapy may make you make it impossible for you to have biological children. If someone is put on puberty blockers and then cross sex hormones as a child, they will never have the ability to preserve biological children. So if you're put on puberty blockers, they are reversible. You can stop being on puberty blockers and you can still maintain a lot of things that you were worried about being taken away when it comes to jazz Jennings specifically. She's actually made statements about this because, you know, I was just looking this up. Jazz Jennings says, I don't regret my transition at all. When I was 11, I started male puberty and I was put on hormone blockers. Those blockers saved my life and continued to save the lives of so many out there. If I was forced to go through male puberty, replacement allowed my body to develop how I wanted. I blossomed into a young woman and eventually got bottom surgery and now living as a proud woman today. What does that have to do with me? Why would I want to take that away from someone else? What year did she make that statement? What year did she make that statement? She made it recently because that video came out where the mom said she was going to force the dialier. Matt Walsh went hard on jazz. He was like, hey, Matt. Matt was like, sorry, jazz. Matt Walsh is a man who has a low purity rating when it comes to moral foundations. For example, when you say it's really weird talking about someone's genitals, it's a purity argument which the left typically never makes. That's why I said it's a very weird thing for you to do. Approaching this from an academic perspective, we would make a few arguments about whether or not a person can truly understand they've lost the ability to reproduce if they've never had it in the first place, the psychological and the philosophical on this stream, leftist mafia who are watching right now. Actually, all have left this. Well, now there's David Dole. But I have all the people watching on this stream right now and all the people in Tim Pool's room right now. I'm the only person who actually reproduced. So these guys were so obsessed with reproducing and reproduction and having kids and no abortions. Not a single one of them have contributed. Not a single one of them have had a kid, adopted a kid and here they are waxing poetic about it. Mm-hmm. So in making an academic argument we would say jazz Jennings does not understand and that's fine if jazz is happy. That's great. The argument into the greater is jazz will never have kids. Fact statement. I think it's wrong to take away to understand what it is. Still trying to use jazz if they don't want kids. They will decide that when they're an adult and have assessed the circumstances. But jazz can't actually feel any of this. Jazz can't feel some people who want kids, can't have kids already. Like he's tried to like hung up on this and it's so weird. Adult satisfaction or desire. And so the question then becomes why did jazz get bottom surgery? My question why do you think jazz got bottom surgery? She wanted to. And why? She said that she's satisfied with it. That should be the extent of it. What did she say? He just read it. I regret my transition at all when I was 11 I started male puberty and I was put on hormone blockers. Those blockers saved my life and saved lives of so many youth out there. If I was forced to go through male puberty it would have been devastating. Even more taking estrogen through hormone replacement allowed my body to develop how I wanted. I blossomed into a young woman eventually got bottom surgery and I'm living as a proud woman today. Yes, I do struggle with mental health and always have but it's not because I transitioned and it's unfortunately something many LGBTQ plus people face. Why? Because that has a lot to do with hate and a lack of acceptance that we receive in society like I was saying before. So to all of you speaking about our mental health for views and calling our families abusers for supporting our transition you are the only abusers. That's good. The bottom surgery. It affirmed her gender. I'll buy another one. It affirmed her gender. What does that mean? Affirm the gender. So you have and all of us have a gender identity that we want to express in one way or another and with hers she affirmed her gender through the process of getting bottom surgery to look more and feel more like a woman. Why do you think jazz stopped dilating? I don't know. Probably because it hurt. But if this was an important part of affirmation you'd think jazz would maintain it. That's not for me to decide because I don't know who she is but that's a decision between her and her doctor has nothing to do with me. Why would any trans child get a bottom surgery? Again, to affirm their gender as part of gender if i mean care and children don't get bottom surgery by the way. It's usually over. That doesn't happen. So there are exceptions to affirmation to affirmation to affirmation to affirmation to affirmation to affirmation to affirmation So there are exceptions? Children getting bottom surgery? That's just something that literally statistically never happens, right? Yeah. And it's just so weird that we're literally talking about the maintenance of another woman's vagina. That's what Tim is using to bolster his argument. It is deeply creepy. I don't know what it's called because jazz didn't have a penis. What's the purpose of making the whole, the space? Oh, my God. I mean, Tim, do you wash your balls? Like, why are we talking about people's genitals? This is so insane. And the answer to that is no, he does not probably. So the purpose of it is just feeling, just emotion. Oh, the purpose of it is part of affirming who they are through a surgery that makes them look and feel more like a version of a woman that they want to be. You don't have to. There's not a template. That's not the only version of a woman. It's why you wear a beanie all the time, Tim. So what I'm trying to understand is... This is so disgusting. Why create a permanent wound for the purpose of a man to have sex with in order to affirm the identity of someone who can't feel any of that? Well, first off, I have no idea about the actual sensations that people experience after these kind of surgeries, but that's not my business. And the second thing would be, I don't believe it's a wound. I believe it's an operation to have a general change. That's it. To describe it as a wound is just very crude. But it's factually a wound, right? I'm trying to avoid the right cause of mutilation or an abomination. I'm not saying that. It's still crude to just call it a wound. After it's healed, I'm sure there's no more wounds or scars or anything. No, they're dilate for the rest of their lives because it is a wound. Like, I'm being academic. I'm not trying to be insulting. Oh, I'm being... Hang on. I'm being academic by talking about this woman's vagina. Like, shut the fuck up, Tim. You are disgusting, okay? That fucking hole in his face is a wound. I'm cis and I don't experience these kind of things. But if someone wants to... And that's great. But, Tim, if someone wants to and it makes them feel better and improves their quality of life, then why do we have to get in the way of that? Right, so my position is for adults, I agree. And I had the argument with Tom Fit and he said it should be banned outright, so I disagree. But overwhelmingly when you look at the data, when it happens to children, it improves their psychological distress. It removes and lowers suicidal aviation. It shows in the data that it helps them. That's not true, man. So the studies you have here, the study you have So first of all, as I mentioned, there have been no controlled randomized trial. But the largest study you cited there the largest study that you cited there does not say what you think it says. The Stanford University wanted with 27,000 people who were surveyed in 2015 and then there were two analyses done of these studies by Jack Turbin. And he lumped data together and did a few manipulative things to get the results he wanted. But there's two very important things to mention, which is firstly, this study based on convenience sampling. So they were speaking with people who were sent to them by... It's important to cite studies, but the one you cited that proves you correct, I'm going to say is manipulative and sneaky. And why a population sample there. And then they were determining whether that person received puberty blockers and other such treatments or hadn't. But they didn't go over the reasons. In fact, the people who hadn't received puberty blockers or those kinds of treatments didn't receive them because they weren't allowed to in one of the requirements for being able to receive that kind of treatment is some level of psychological stability, which means the people who weren't on puberty blockers in that study were more likely to be psychologically unstable, which we would expect to produce a higher suicide rate, but that wasn't controlled for. On top of that, the data actually shows that the men who were on estrogen were more likely to become suicidal. But what he ended up doing, that's true, what he ended up doing was lumping them together. So he said people on cross sex hormones are less likely to commit suicide because according to the sample he had of women, that was true enough to overcompensate for the increased likelihood of suicidality in the men and he just threw them all together as if a man taking estrogen is the same thing as a woman taking testosterone and we could expect the same medical outcomes. And I'm saying that's bullshit. So to respond to you, I do have a number of peer reviewed studies related to this. And if they're as good as that one, I'm telling you they're trash. Mental health outcomes and transgender non-binary youth receive... Again, peer reviewed studies on this show is the essence of what you need to prove your point. You provide them to me, though, your studies are trash. Yeah. I really want to point that out. And this academic here who just explained that is, he believes in talking snakes in the Bible, so just want to point that out there. Hey guys, I am probably going to have to get out of here in a sec. Zach and I are flying to D.C. in the morning tomorrow, so... Oh, very cool. What are you doing there? Anything that we should know about or just the future? Oh yeah, we're going to Kyle Kalinski's wedding. Oh, very cool. Nice. Yeah, send them my regards. Absolutely, I will. It's on Saturday, so let them know you guys said hello, but yeah, I just got to get up a little early and I don't know how long this is going to go on. I know. It doesn't seem like there's any end in sight, but shout out to Lance. He's killing it. At first, I was like, oh, you're kind of faltering. Let's bring some confidence, but now he's completely owning these fools. He picks it up. It is very flustering and he experiences the compound. It does take that first 20, 30 minute segment to really get your bearings and realize how they do things. And then you go, oh, okay, this is how I have to go about it. Same thing happened to me. Yeah, I could totally see that. Yeah, I mean, who knows how I would do. I would be terrified in someone else's turf like that. I mean, that's why he makes people go. Without a doubt, he experienced what it's like to debate Sam Cedar over Skype or video, whatever. I don't know what he's done for him, at least when the person's there, he could control how it looks at the very least. Even if he's losing the actual substance, he gets to control how it looks. Yeah. Yeah, 100%. But really appreciate you guys inviting Zach and I on today or tonight. It was such a fun time. It was great to meet you in person or over stream, Matt. And it was great to catch up, Mike. Yeah, it was nice seeing you. Just real quick, when we end the stream on our end, that's when it will end on your end as well. I don't know if you can stop yourself, but just FYI in case you're wondering. Okay, it was really nice hanging out, though. Absolutely. Yeah, definitely nice meeting. Yeah, let's stream some more together. 100%. I was about to say let's do another collab in the future of some sort. We'd love to have you guys on the vanguard. We need to catch up with you again, Mike, on the show and we'd love to interview you at some point, Matt, if you ever be interested. Oh, yeah, cool. Well, you guys have a great night. Peace out to everyone that's watching. Really appreciate you guys. Yeah, see you around. Yeah, take care. Save troubles. Is he gone? All right. Hello, vanguard audience. We're the vanguard now. Yeah, yeah. They're going to tune in and be like, who are these two motherfuckers? We're the vanguard now. I'm going to run to the bathroom. I'll be right back. I'm the vanguard now. It's just me. I'm also the human support. Hi, I'm Mike Figueredo with the original national. I'm David Dole with the rational national. I'm everybody now. You're holding it down. This is the longest term data available on this. And what they found is that transitioning has no effect on suicidality. That's part of the studies that I'm interested in is the suicide stuff. In 2022 they measured a bunch of people that transitioned. They were suicidal. They transitioned now. They're not, but it's like, hey, we need a long-term study. We do need to go to super chats because we're a past. But I do want to ask another question. Do you think the earth overpopulated? No, I don't. You don't think so? No. I want more people. I love people. I want more birth. I want more humans. I love everybody, man. I want more people on this planet. But what about climate change? Climate change is coming. It's real. It's happening right now. But I don't know what it is. I don't know what it is. I don't know but I mean But you're not Malthusian, then. No, I'm not. But more people means more climate change. You got more mouths to feed. You got more fuels to burn. But more orgasms. It would also mean more scientists to figure out how to cure the carbons. That was kind of weird, right? But more humans doesn't necessarily mean more climate change because more humans might figure out better ways to balance out the climate. I'll just say one last thing and we'll go to super chats and then I guess I want to try to The cause of climate, the main cause of climate change had nothing related to individual people. It's large companies, corporations the main issues of climate change. We could have as many people as we want and still curb climate change by, for example, getting rid of fossil fuels, curbing emissions. I mean, there's a lot of things we can do. That leftists are sterilizing and aborting their children. I thought you did care. From a moral position but like I'm not a conservative like Seamus where Seamus is very much like we have to end this because, you know, it's wrong. I'm I'm not a conservative. If a woman is going to get an abortion at a certain age I'm like, I disagree with it but I'm more libertarian in the respect of like people can choose to do what they want to do. I think it's certainly wrong to sterilize kids but the end result is the future is going to be a bunch of Christian conservatives and Muslims and so like it's a self if you Yes, but the Jewish population we have a third person jumping on soon. We do. Who's coming on? It is Mr. Jeff Waldorf. Oh, cool. The surprise guest. Yeah. It took me a second to recall not to be mean but I was like, who? Jeff. All right, Jeff Waldorf. No, I know exactly what you're talking about. It was just out of left field, right field, which field? Out of a field. Looking forward to it. We're probably going to be streaming you and me for another hour because they're not going to finish up for at least another 30 minutes. When I was when I was with Tim they didn't do because usually he does 8 to 10 and then 10 to 11 is a private show just for his paying subscribers. When I was on the show we never got to do the private show for the paying subscribers. We went 8 to 11, even a little bit past 11 just because we couldn't stop. This might happen here but I think he has extra lefty viewers so he's not going to stop the gravy train. He's getting a lot of views. The middle and the right will supplant it and then the middle will become the left and the right will stay the right. Here's what I'll say is that LGBTQ plus people were heavily persecuted by a lot of different groups including the Nazis at one point or another in history and you just can't get in the communists and the communists and if you were to get rid of every single queer if you got rid of every single gay, every single lesbian, every single bisexual, every single trans person if you got rid of all of them in a generation or two they would reappear because they're a part of us. They're a part of humanity. They're a part of all of us. They just exist. They are part of the human experience. Yeah, but I think that chart you showed with the left-handed thing. Yeah. If Christians and Muslims start dominating they're going to be repressed. Right? So the idea is it's like basic math. Right. We saw this in 2000. But the left-handed people still exist. That was basic thing there is. The left-handed people will still exist. They just won't be open about it. And it took him an hour to respond to the left-handed chart. He doesn't understand the left-handed chart. He doesn't get the point to the left-handed chart. That's his response. I love this. In some areas a little bit you can tell he's never seen that. He's a little bit more conservative, which is shocking because every generation was skewing more progressive. This is likely due to the fact not like I said not that children were like I'm conservative now but conservatives had more kids. It really doesn't matter what your position is. Gen Z is the most progressive generation there. What is he talking about? So you think transgender people should have more kids? I would love it if trans people and LGBT people have children and families. It doesn't matter if they have kids. Transgenderism isn't past that way. If two transgender transgender people have a baby that baby's not going to be born transgender, guaranteed. They can be. But odds are actually they won't be. So me and my husband have a baby. The baby's going to be gay. It doesn't make any sense. I love this logic. The vast majority of LGBTQ people come from two cisgender parents. Why do all these two straight cisgender parents? Carly says as a woman who's had an abortion and given birth later in life this man needs to do some research but he sure has some balls for having this conversation on Tim Kest. Well I respect it absolutely. I thought it was a good search TV. Lance. Yeah, what is it? youtube.slash to search TV. Everywhere social media is sold at the search TV if you want to hear my musines and I will add that while I do distinctly disagree with most of the takes of the people on this panel they've been very friendly and very nice to me and they put me in a nice hotel and Ian's is just as friendly in real life as everyone led him to believe. I'm going to the movie. Here's one for Marby Dog. He says please ask if he feels the same about bodily autonomy bodily autonomy with regards to the vaccines. Yeah, I think you should have the right whether or not you want to take the vaccine. So you would disagree with the vaccine mandate. A forcible vaccine mandate. I mean for the purposes of freedom yes, but it sucks. That's one of those like it sucks but of course I don't think people should be forced to have to take a job against their will. Like if the government said in order to go to school a government mandated a government mandated vaccine program I disagree with No, I support that l legs strap them down. Oh, when there was a vaccination like what was the word for it? But also no one's forced to get the vaccine. They're free to not get the vaccine, which I actually agree with. But you're not allowed to participate in any in everything that society offers if you don't get the vaccine. That's the thing. No one has been forced to get a vaccine. There's just certain things they're not allowed to participate in without the vaccine. Yeah, that's freedom both ways. That's the way we do it as well. But I support just for the record strapping people down to a table and forcially vaccinating them. And I want to be the person who gives them the vaccine but not participation in society. Well, you can choose whether or not to be a doctor. I'm memeing folks. Well, I mean like going to a cafe or a movie or something, right? Well, yeah, but I say that there are certain private businesses. They are allowed to do whatever the hell they want. It depends if that is directly going to have an impact on the broader society. Oh, no, this is getting into a vaccine today. No, he should just say anti-vaxers is not a protected group people. It's not a protected identity. It's not a protected identity. So that's my point, right? You don't agree with the government holding you down, but you do agree with the government excizing you from society. Being anti-vax is not an immutable characteristic. It's stupidity. But that's a choice. Madison Square Garden, for instance, had a vaccine requirement and I think Joe Rogan had to refund tickets for the show before the requirement. And it was the government that imposed the requirement on all the businesses. So the vaccine mandate, there's two ways to look at it. I think what they're asking is ostracizing or excizing someone from society is a vaccine mandate, right? Restricting someone's ability to... You have a choice to do it whether you want to or not. It's whether or not you can have convenience and pleasure in society. And it's obviously a big inconvenience if you don't get to go to see Madison Square Garden, of course. The government can pressure you to do it. They can take away privileges and access until you do it. As a matter of... Right. The government also pressures you not to kill and murder people by having laws that make that illegal. You go to jail if you do that. They pressure you to do a lot of... Literally, that is part of what laws are. That is why we have laws. They're not studying properly. So maybe that's another conversation to have. I think it's very important what the medical industry govern us. That's why we have a government. Also, this isn't all axiomatic, right? So you could have the position that under no circumstances would you ever support the government mandating vaccines. You could be of the position that you would be in favor of it, but just not for a disease with the infection and mortality rate that COVID has. There's a lot of different approaches. So, Admar says, this guest looks like the kid of Brendan Frazier and Justin Long. Did you get that Brendan Frazier? Oh, my life. My life. Those are two very good-looking people. So, good for life. Yeah. Jeff. Hey, Jeff. I got it. Hey, what's up? We're suffering, but it's almost over. Lance is doing great, though. Yeah, I've been watching. Oh, nice. It's been doing a good job. Yeah. Jeff Waldorf joining us here on the vanguard, folks. Glad to be in the vanguard. First time. First time. All right. Thanks for joining us, Jeff, here on the vanguard. Oh, yes. Glad to be here. What is the vanguard? The woman is hot. Trans woman. And the rational national. So, they have female gametes. Yes. Great to be with you and the human. Oh, this is actually very nice. You are here. Do you want to talk about gametes? So, in embryonic development, we need to have two gametes, obviously. No, we're not on the serps. We should have, though. We should have chromosome. We should have stream and all the differences of sexual development. I'm Hasan Piker, folks. Welcome to my Twitch channel. On a conservative estimate, 0.6% to 2% of the population. There is more intersex people in America than there are redheads. So, there's a lot of intersex people. I didn't know that. That's if you go with the 2%. Sheamus is completely right, but I do want to add one really interesting thing about this. How does that mean of females and males? So, here's the neatest part. There are individuals who have XY chromosomes, which is normally what is going to be a male, right? And, by the way, it's a push-and-pull with hormones and other stuff like that. But, there are people who have XY chromosomes. So, if you looked at their bones years into the future and you analyzed them, they would be genetically male, but they have a specific condition that suppresses testosterone, which makes them develop 100% like women. We are all templates. We are all templates and based on hormones, the expression of gender and different factors, we turn in one direction or the other towards more male or more female. Certain males don't affect men and women the same way. We hijack this entire process. If we take hormones so we think testosterone or estrogen, we suddenly can have traits that are more feminine or masculine to redistribute fat to the growth of breasts, the length of hair, all that kind of stuff. The socialist wants to redistribute the fat. So, here's what I'm getting to. I think it was in 1993, they passed along in the United States that required clinical testing to be done on men and women separately because women are affected by drugs differently. And they found that painkillers, for instance, didn't work on women when the doctors were all like, these women are sissies. They can't take the pain. When in reality it's like painkillers weren't working. And they also, in these studies, found that, no, the differences between males and females, you can't change through hormones. For instance, fast twitch, muscle fiber, collagen in the skin, prenatal testosterone, the impact, that won't change from later in life taking hormones. So, a male's not a female, a female's not a male. Sex is bimodal. I think if you ask... Total is. Total is. We've gone, we've gone from the left saying that sex is bimodal to not rejecting it or are you just incorrect? I think I'm incorrect. Hold on. Do you know what bimodal means? I don't know. It means that intersex people exist and that there's an overlap between the two bell curves. Oh, sorry. Yes, you're totally right. This is... I'll take a big L right there. That means that 97% of females will have statistically average female traits. Yes, you're correct. The reason I wanted to jump on that, though, is because you're saying that just because you have XY chromosomes, that means by definition of male, that's not true. I didn't. Okay. Do you know about the South African beauty queen where she is... Yes. By all... There's a documentary on her. By all accounts, if you saw her, you'd be like, this is just a gorgeous, beautiful woman. She has all the parts of a woman. She has breasts. She has vagina, all that stuff. But she is intersex and her chromosomes are XY. So, if you looked at her genetics, she's genetically male. So, this isn't... But accepting that we want rights for all people, including intersex people, doesn't change the fact that they make up a relatively small portion of society. 0.6% to 2%. So, why focus on them so much, Tim? And not become a biological female. Yeah, exactly. No, no, no. Why pass so many laws against them? No, no, no. No, no. No, no. Trans kids and sports in high school... Yes, and adult human people. When you have very few... In some cases, no cases of transgender people in high school sports. And you're still going to ban it throughout the state. This is making sense. Except when you look at it from the fact that they just want to be hateful bigots. Yeah, exactly. There was... I can't remember who did the study, but, like, most of the attorney general or Republicans who introduced sports bands couldn't name a single instance where a trans high schooler was creating a disruption at their school by playing sports. So, yeah, you're absolutely spot on there. Yeah, or even a trans person at the school. Right, right. A sign. A sign. Yeah, your sign to gender at birth. So, we're only... Gender is observed. We're two, right? We're two super chets. I feel like a trans woman is a man and a trans man is a woman. And they're both. You're both a trans woman and a man together. They never stop becoming one. You always are both. I think the point about, like, intersex or some people having chromosomes that don't exactly match up with their sex is not the problem for... or is not a problem for what is termed the gender binary by the left. So, I think the best way to define sex is based on a gametes, you know, the role a person plays in reproduction. And Tim mentioned gametes and not chromosomes. So, I would define a female as someone whose reproductive anatomy is ordered towards gestation. And then a male is someone whose reproductive anatomy is ordered towards insemination. And the operating phrase there is ordered towards, right? Because someone can have an issue with their reproductive anatomy, but it's still ordered towards something. ... Meaning that overwhelmingly there's two big trees with a slight overlap in the middle. Well, even that overlap in the middle, the vast majority of people who are intersex are basically clearly a member of one sex, but with some feature that appears differently. Yeah-yeah. But with one or two features that appear bit differently. It's parents to decide that, and that's a huge problem. But that's a massive point. But people who you genuinely can't tell are extremely rare. I don't like the argument that we should reform society Umbelji, svaku i svore minoriti izgleda pokraviću. Učinavno, nešta oto ovu, učinavno, koje u vrlovi krimi, u poprstočniju svih biljavnog svakom svog biljavna, vs. poči u prid globu i četiljna, učinavno, koje u svog biljava. Io, a u svog biljava, da je je to pravda o d insistiraciju. Pogodniju je, da je to oprej, prid lova u baseru. U vrlovi svakom svakom svakom svakom svakom, Brošli će se učiniti. Vom se je izgledati, učiniti se njegiyeon i jel ti ne učiniti učiniti očini.voj glasnih. Još Ramo. Sve je srećo. I ma za toga, da se što opato. Pa da nije izgledat. Hvala li je srednico. Jer možete raditi. Sve je ljube. Di dan. I dovo je sreća ideologicalno učiniti. Spor tipi učiniti takve napravkeom, počuće se učiniti. tvoja vratiljama, a u zemljama ako je izgledo. I moja nešta se, da je k толькоma vratiljama, je tvoja vratiljija na uključari u ukljčari u ukljčari da u kljukom s meni, da stavimo, da ide paprativađiti i opravići se u ukljčari, povijedno s njim ukljuti o ukljčari s meni i batterijani. Moje kval條i je to? Ukljčari u ukljčari u ukljčari, ako moram, da su pošku ukljčari na ukljčari, to oni malo sveOfi se mora ukljčari u vratiljem, i fizikljne objevce, znači je to pripotravitva. Znači je bilo učinit, ne? Femilje i transnjevje, koji je zaplantovanje? If females say, we want a space free for males period, then should they have their rights protected and have a space for men. No, I love how they're trying to frame both against each other. That's not the issue here. He wants to make this binary in a zero sum game, when it's not. Exactly, it's not. It's rights for everyone. Trans rights are women's rights, trans rights are human rights. Lantz is doing really good here. He's holding his own. We do not want biological males in our space. So should Blair White be allowed to go in that bathroom? I think Blair White should go in the bathroom, where Blair White appears to fit in most. So why does she get a pass? Because she's very passing, is that why? I'm not talking about... My view is Buck Angel should go in the men's room and Blair White should go in the women's room. But they disagree with that. She's technically a biological male. Blair White agrees with what I just said. Yes, but you're taking my position. And good for you, that's woke as fuck, hell yeah. I don't know if you watch the show, it's not progress. I've always had that opinion. It's based as fuck, hell yeah. But I've always had that opinion. So trans women can go into women's bathrooms. Awesome. Right. Awesome. I don't know. So my issue is, Sheamus doesn't agree with that. Yeah, yeah. And Buck Angel is a dipp shit. But you think Blair White should have to go into a man's bathroom? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Because, well, I don't want to say anything that's going to get Tim's YouTube channel taken down. Let's go to the members only show. And Sheamus can then say all of his nasty Catholic things. Well, yeah. All right, everybody, here's what's going to happen. Sorry, we didn't get to the super chats. I genuinely apologize. This is what happens. Same thing happens. We're going to go to the members only chat. We're going to do audience questions. Smash the like button if you would like. And head over to timcast.com, become a member. We're going to do the members only so that Sheamus can say naughty words or whatever. Yeah. But before we go. That's what they call the truth. You follow the show at Timcast IRL on Instagram. You can follow me personally at Timcast Lance. Do you want to shout anything out? Thank you so much for watching me and listening to my radical leftist Marxist agenda. If you want to see me anywhere else on the internet, go to everywhere social media is sold at the Serfs TV. That's at the Serfs TV. And also shout out to the leftist mafia who's watching us right now. Love all of you. Love you too, brother. My name is Sheamus Coglan. What I'm shouting out is the same. We got a shout out. Suck my dick, Sheamus. Sorry, that's inappropriate. I just hate him. This motherfucker is so ridiculous. OK, well, you know what? I think that it's over. Let's discuss a little bit. Yeah, I think Lance killed it. I think, you know, that I was expecting exactly how it went down in terms of those first 20, 30 minutes would take him some time to reconfigurate his usual way of discussing and debating with people because Tim has a very specific way of doing it as you all saw. And it is very different when you're sitting there. I'll tell you, it doesn't matter how many times you've watched him pool. You're not ready for it until you're sitting there and you're on the other end of it. Once he got past that opening, it was smooth sailing from there. He did great. He killed it. I thought he did really great. Yeah, I agree with that. I think that, like you said, it was a little bit... There was an adjustment period. He was kind of out of place at first, but you can tell towards the end he got really comfortable. He found his own. And when he adjusted to their bullshit tactics in the way that they tried to corner him, yeah, he knew what to say. And he came fucking ready. Like, he knew all the talking points. He knew how to combat what they were saying, specifically the left-handed chart moment. Just highlight. He crushed it. He should be proud. I think he did really, really great. Yeah, when it comes to the trans issue, Lance, he knows the shit. He's got it. Look, they went round and round on abortion and they did the same thing to you, Matt, as you were saying before. And it's really hard to get out of that trap. So I think they spent a little too much time focusing and going round and round in circles. Even though, again, Lance had his shit together, he knew what he was talking about. And I think it just went more smoothly in the trans discussion afterwards after he got out of that trap. Because eventually you have to break out. They really don't know that. They don't know anything about that issue. It's all about trans people being freaks, especially with someone like Sheamus. That was his position. Tim plays that game where he's supportive of trans rights in certain ways. And he'll do that for every issue. And whether he believes that in his heart of hearts, it doesn't matter because at the end of the day he runs a show that doesn't push that narrative. Let's take what he said at the end about Blair. He thinks Blair White should be able to... Blair White, if people don't know, is a trans right wing woman. A right wing trans woman, I should say. He believes that Blair White should use... be able to use the woman's bathroom. We could even go with... Tim actually does believe that's the case. But if you watch his show, do you walk away with also feeling that belief after listening to them? If you were on the fence and weren't sure, if you walk away sharing Tim's belief, absolutely not, you don't walk away with that. You walk away believing that the trans woman shouldn't be able to use the woman's bathroom. Mm-hmm. Right. And that they're all coming after cis-gendered women. And that they're the ones that are doing the rapes and the assaults. And you gotta keep them out of the bathrooms and protect your children against the people who are going to wait. He made the argument, oh, it's mutilation, genital mutilation, right? But then those are the same people also doing the raping and the assaults of cis-women in bathrooms. That doesn't make any sense. Mm-hmm. They're not even consistent on their own positions. They're not even consistent on their own arguments. Mm-hmm. And so, look, in hindsight, to go back to what you were talking about, like being in the belly of the bees, being in the den. Like, yeah, it's easy to catch them afterwards. But when you're in it, it is a lot more difficult to be able to react to that, especially when you don't have the resources to pull up, studies, because they don't believe your meta-studies, which is actually just a collection of already peer-reviewed studies collected together. That thing, that drove me insane. I know, yeah. I don't know if you were watching this stream, Jeff, but I said how, I think the whole study thing is pointless when you're having a debate like this. If you're doing a written argument, if you're going back and forth with essays or blogs or newsletters, substacks, or whatever, sure, cite your studies, whatever, but in a conversation, it does not work to be throwing studies at each other, because it doesn't matter if you throw a study at me, I cannot read and understand the analysis and cross-reference a study in the one minute I'm able to browse through it live on a televised or live stream debate. It does not work in this setting. And that's why Lance was good at hitting him with the other stuff. He was going and hitting him with the freedom argument, for example, hey, I believe in freedom. I believe in liberty. What about you? Do you believe in freedom? Do you believe in people being able to make their own choices and live their own lives and do the things that they want to do? And there's no argument to that. They have no argument to that. And so it really shows how I believe, and I say this all the time, they want to run your life. They're just trying to figure out ways, sneaky ways to do it using moral arguments or what they consider to be more arguments. Suda religious arguments, sometimes thinly veiled arguments of a moral nature to try to make their case that they should control your life and control your body and control what you do and say and who you love and what you do to your own body. Ja, I also want to point out that I thought that it was really clever of Lance to just really quickly pull up the quote from jazz because they kept using jazz, but all Lance did was pull up a really quick quote and that entire analogy just went nowhere after that because you saw that he was trying to use her for a point that she wouldn't want him to make. So I thought that was really, really clever. But when was it? But when did she say that? Right. When did she say that? It's never going to satisfy them completely, but you know, he could see it on his face when he realizes that he's losing, he won't take the L, but you can tell that he knows that he's kind of back into a corner. And I thought that was really clever of Lance. So Lance, like, I think he crushed it. I think he did a really, really great job. That amount of pressure with a lot of people, probably hundreds of thousands of people, right wingers watching already that jumped down your throat, it's really difficult to deal with that and I think that he was very savvy in basically meeting them where they are, like saying, okay, I like that you're going after Disney. I like that you're going after Bud Light. That's really smart because it probably surprises some of these right wing ten poor poll viewers and they're like, oh, wait, you actually agree with us there, so they might check out his content and that's how you can maybe convince a couple of people. I'm not saying, like, this is going to lead to, like, some mass enlightenment, but that's really how you do it. You plant these seeds and you get them to think that you're not as unreasonable as your portray. That's, like, the whole first fucking 30 minutes of the show. And I think that that really works. It's savvy. So, yeah, Lance, Lance, he should be proud of himself. That was really good because that can't be easy. Another thing that makes it very difficult is obviously your one person and they could pretend there's a gaggle of people that have all different opinions, but at the end of the day, they're all arguing Tim's position or one even further to the right. Yeah, it's like, do you want right, far right, or fascist, or theocratic? Like, it's all different flavors of the same shit. And listen, Ian wasn't there when I was there, so I don't know how it would have been with me. Which one is Ian's? Ian's the guy with the long hair who people like to peg as the liberal in the room even though, I don't think he is. He's definitely more, I guess, empathetic to the guest's viewpoint. He was the least hateable person there for sure, compared to juxtaposing him with Seamus. Like, that dude is a saint. Seamus, it just isn't sufferable. I do wish Ian was there when I was there He's usually, he didn't do it on this episode, but he also usually pulls out the most random bazaar out there shit you could imagine. And it's just like, I wish I was there to see, see the, I wish I was in the kitchen watching the, what is it called, the meatballs being made? The sausage. Right, the sausage being made, right. No, I got a question on that. Do you think that it's like a good cop, bad cop routine? Do you think that's maybe something to like, try to disarm you a little bit if you're there? Maybe I'm reading too much into it. I legit think all these guys hold the exact beliefs they have. I don't think, but maybe that's why Tim has pulled those specific people. I don't know, I know Seamus isn't on there all the time. I don't know when he decides to be on or how they decide to put him on. He was there when I was there. Ian is usually on, but again, Ian wasn't there when I was there. So I don't know how they, I mean, obviously, I don't think he was like, oh, Matt Binder's gonna be on. Let's not put Ian on. But it's, I don't know why Tim picks who he picks. It's that simple. Also, sometimes that conspiracy theorist, Luke Rokowski or whatever's name is on the show. And he wasn't there today. So I don't know. I don't know. Luke, we are changed. That used to be a supposed leftist, right? Another supposed leftist. I don't think he ever, I think these guys showed up at Occupy and people pegged them is that because they were at Occupy and supported Occupy. I don't think, looking back, I don't think we ever really looked into what these guys believed outside of Occupy. I mean, for me, Tim's position was always a little bit bizarre because I recall back in the Occupy days, him purposely going out of his way to get in the face of Antifa people, causing civil disobedience, trying to legit, not just record what they're doing, but get in their face in terms of trying to identify them or out them. I know they very much, a lot of Antifa people did not like, or BlackBlock, however you want to consider who is down there. They did not like Tim's presence. They would awfully try to run him out of if they were in a space, they would try to get him out of there. I don't know exactly if there was any bigger tell then for me, but that was definitely a position where I was like, something's off about that. Real quick, I forgot to give Jeff the opportunity when he jumped on because we were watching, but can you plug your channels and stuff and tell people who you are just because I want to make sure while we still have a lot of people watching, they know who you are. Oh wow, yeah, I didn't even think about that. It's actually the first time I've ever met you, Matt, too. Oh, yeah, I think so, too. I was actually quite surprised. You're like, oh, oh, that, yeah, okay, yeah, I know who you are. I'm like, no, you know. You've never heard of me, but I am going to tell you. So I run a YouTube channel, Waldorf Nation, check it out. We're 173,000 subscribers now, so we're getting close to 200,000. So yeah, do a show, live show every day, 4 p.m. Eastern, where I just talk about January, like a lot of different topics, mainly like, fighting against right wing ghouls, talk about, you know, fighting against the religious right, the dominionist, the Christian nationalist, making fun of, you know, all that kind of stuff, and yeah, occasionally I'll tweet the Democrats as well for when they, when they suck. Yeah, yeah, everybody go check out Jeff. Jeff is based, we love Jeff, and yeah. So anything else with regard to the Tim Pool debate, I should just check to make sure that they really did go to members only, but I kind of feel like there's not really much left for myself that I want to say, because I think that, yeah, I was scared at first, but Lance really did great. I'm scared. I was scared, I was scared man, that first couple of, like when, when Tim Pool started busting out different hypotheticals to justify vigilante murderism, murders, like how do you even, you're arguing with hypotheticals, you're not in reality, it's so hard to dispute that. So the only way that you can counter that is to make up things yourself. So when you're not arguing with actual reality, for example, if Seamus was about to talk about evangelical stuff, how do you respond to that, somebody who's operating on a different plane, where he's talking about metaphysical shit and you're trying to talk about fucking data and statistics or healthcare, like it's difficult, right? Well, I mean, for me, like you look at and see what they're trying to do and what are you trying to do throughout the whole thing was to create a justification for murder, the justification for the death of a person who did not deserve to die. Regardless of whatever else that person had, may or may not had done, it was not deserving of a death sentence, it was not deserving, even though it, I would concede that he probably didn't mean to kill him, doesn't matter, that's the end result and there needs to be, there needs to be a form of justice in that. And that's a fact. Yeah, as Matt was saying too, it's like the left probably wouldn't be talking about this if the individual who committed that was brought to justice, was arrested and like he kept bringing up the 25 people that were pushing in front of trains. I mean Ole made the comment, right, they should be brought to justice as this guy too, like it just, all of this is so simple that it's like brain breaking, like you can tell like he's just trying to hide the ball, he doesn't want to say, I think that people should be allowed to commit murder, like vigilante-ism is good, like he doesn't want to say that, so he's got to kind of skirt around it and obfuscate and it gets to really weird places, that's why you have to use analogies and hypotheticals. Right, and it's only a certain type of vigilante-ism, kind that we, you know, if I'm a person on the right wing, for example, only the kind of vigilante-ism we like. Right, if we're left wing like an antifa person, like going and killing a Nazi, do you think that he would be in favor of vigilante-ism? Oh, well that Nazi was trying to, wanted to kill marginalized people, no, of course not, so yeah, you're right, that's a good caveat there, Jeff, it is a specific form, a very narrow kind of vigilante-ism. But that's what you get with Tim Pool to get these very, very niche, very, you know, edge-casey, bullshit examples, but all in service to the greater point that they're trying to, that he's trying to push, the greater narrative. And it's always the justification for whatever he wants to do, you know, for a specific topic. Yeah, he works, he works backwards from the conclusion he already wants to make. Like he's not trying to base his opinion on statistics or data or details. It's just, no, this is my position and I'm going to work backwards to justify that. And if I don't have facts, then I'm going to use a hypothetical or some other Weasley method to get from A to B. And that's what he does the whole time. Like, I don't watch Tim Pool very frequently, as I said, the last time I watched was with Matt Binder and that was also very painful, I thought that Matt Binder killed it, of course. But like, it's just listening to their bullshittery is so difficult. Like Ole could have killed their, like it's just, it's so hard because there's so disingenuous. But you know that's the case. And so, I mean, you have to, you can't look at it as if they're people that are acting in good faith. You know they're not. You know it's a game to them. You know it's a way to grab clicks and views. It's a way and not only that, of course, but to give the audience what they want. So basically, I guess what I'm saying is that who has no real opinions, no real beliefs, at least nothing that we know, we can't be sure, he's dishonest. He's a dishonest actor and he will not have ever have a good faith debate with someone. Right. Yeah. Yeah, well said. I'm not sure if you wanted to get to super chats yet. Yeah, let's, we might as well start doing them, right? Because we probably have quite a bit. I want to give their viewers shoutouts, but it's kind of it's going to be hard. I don't know. Yeah, because I don't have access. You have more access. I mean, if you actually scroll through all the freaking comments which would be impossible because it's every channel's comment in one, you could write them, but I can't, there's, I wish they gave a way to just see super chats. You know what I mean? Do you see that as the host? I mean, I could read I know you don't demonetized, right? Yeah, I don't, I don't see that. All right. Well, let me, let me read my super chats that you're not going to be able to go back and it's just too much. Yeah, here's what I will say though real quick is that I'm sure that the next time that the Vanguard and David Dole do a stream, they'll go back through and read all the super chats that they missed because you can do that like YouTube does save a log of them. Because I'm sure that they will get to it at some point. But yeah, we'll get to Matt's at least. Oh, I want to mention Scarlet Red, who's been on this show before. It seems like she has confirmed the individual who killed, the identity of the individual who killed Neely on the subway. Oh. It's on her Twitter Scarlet Red with an X for Scarlet SX Scarlet Red. She really lays out that she has a confirmation from former classmates. I'm not going to let's check it out. I don't want to take everyone should give credit to where to do and go read it there. All right, let's go to Super Chats here. I'll pull them up as they come up on the screen. Someone asked me, she's been on Leftist Mafia, not my show or any individual. I mean, she could have, but she hasn't been on my, she hasn't been on Doomed. She's been on Leftist Mafia before though. All right, let's read some Super Chats. Oh, what are you pulling up on the? I can pull them up as they come. Oh, OK. So maybe I'll want to just prioritize those, then we'll go through your backlog, Matt. OK, sure. So go ahead. OK, so here's one that I can see. This is from DurDevil. I don't know where these are coming from, by the way. This is for me. For Tony Rizzo. Matt, can you please check your Discord DMs? Oh, OK, I will. I'll do that. Yes. OK, and Foresto Mintero literally all ants had to say was pick anyone from the meta study when they were demanding, he provide individual studies. Yeah. Good point. I think that they didn't grasp that a meta study is a bunch of studies, like an overview of all the studies collectively and what the conclusion is. So just getting them to understand what a meta study was was very hard, but I think he did educate them at the end. We have Matt check your Discord DMs, friend. You better get to your DMs. I'm juicy. I'm really bad. I'm really bad. Tony Rizzo says to check your Discord DMs, Matt. Directive 4. Matt, go check your fucking DMs immediately. You know what? You know what? Why would I check my DMs when clearly it's monetizable to not check them? OK, that's all that I see coming through in the chat. So go ahead and and take it away. Here we go. Going through the ones telling me to check my DMs. That farstow mentor, one that you read was from my chat Daredevil with the DMs. Honeycat. Ian once said that he thought Kanye was bringing Jews to Jesus. So he definitely fits right in right. That's what I mean though. He says completely outlandish things. Like, I don't think he holds that. I don't think he holds any ideological position there. I think he just believes this one really bizarre thing, honestly. The Matt Mercy with the super chat abortion part could have been better, but Lance killed it. I mean, it's what it's it's, you know, it's it's you're running circles around these guys. It's going in just circles. It's just like it's almost there's certain topics that you're not going to break through. This one. It's Star Wars Day. It's Star Wars Day, right? It's a trap. Right. Right. This one. This one with a super chat 10 dollar super chat. Thank you. Lance went in there like a young undertaker in a Hell in a Cell match. Dude crushed it once he got momentum going. Right. Alan Hill with a super chat. Matt, love you. Just wanted to say that it's disgusting the way Tim frames his subscriber section as a cesspool of slurs. Is it that bad in reality? I mean, let's put it this way. Well, and I want when I want on Tim's pool Tim pool show at one point it came up that that what my ethnicity was and his and I was fine but I don't think Tim meant anything by it honestly and it came up and I said, well, I'm white. I'm Caucasian and people were legitimately surprised in the chat because they assumed I wasn't and then I don't know if I said something later on or someone looked into like tweets from me and they brought up then once it was found out though the chat immediately broke out into outbursts about how how I lied and was being disingenuous because they found out that I was a Jew which means I'm not white or Caucasian which tells you everything about what that audience is because only a very particular type of people ideological belief believes that Jews aren't Caucasian and can't be white. Yes. Can I say it? A wretched hive of scum and villainy? Sure, yeah. Again, with the Star Wars references. I'm not even a Jewish religiously because I was baptized because my mom is Catholic and my dad is Jewish but I am ethnically Jewish like I'm Ashkenazi Jew ethnically ethnicity wise but that's I got the blood of the blood of a Jew so that immediately means that I'm white supremacist target numero uno numero uno That's yeah. I mean if he knows that this is his audience he's got to at some point realize maybe you're attracting them maybe the arguments that you're using is appealing to these types of folks maybe I don't know do better but I mean they make him money that's if he turned away all the white supremacists like how much of his audience would be left you know what I mean he was talking about how his audience is like oh they're libertarians and stuff I don't know if they're tuning in for the libertarianism buddy right people often don't know that people I guess I do have dark skin color you know I have olive skin color cause I'm half Italian people usually think I'm either Indian cause I guess my last name that's the Prussian slash German side that's where that last name comes from I've heard people think I'm Latino which I've got a mistake and for a lot which is I don't care a mistake me for I'm Queens bring it I am pour it on me whatever you want to believe but you know it was interesting to see how the audience reacted it wasn't like oh I thought he was Hispanic or Latino or Indian it was Liar you're a Jew that's actually really scary though like that it is and it plays into those stereotypes as well that they use so that's probably why they kept bringing it up you know those any cinematic tropes I've got a Middle Eastern too I see people in the chat saying I thought he was Middle Eastern I've gotten that too I've had people say that I look like Prince I've had people say that I look like Mick Jagger I've had people say you know what I just I think you look like Matt Bender yeah thank you yeah thank you it's not a bad look not a bad look Lance is asking how'd I do on Twitter so it's over let's let him know I said you did terrible you're a disappointment to your entire family and all of your friends no I just said you fucking crushed it Lance I don't know where you are he's probably traveling he can't jump on but yeah I think that yeah you should all send him a lot of love because that's gotta be difficult man I can't imagine like I my brain was melting as I was listening so to be in there in that space with them in the compound where they could kidnap you if you wanted to like I told Lance before the stream I'm like yo man if you need help do SOS in morse code and that is three quick blinks three longer blinks three quick blinks SOS so we can send a rescue team to help them in case they decide to keep them there I'm just kidding but so you know the compound like we're calling it a compound first because that just immediately makes me think there's a 90% chances there's a sex dungeon somewhere and normally it'd be like oh yeah sex dungeon no not with those guys yeah that's such a great point because like that would imply that they have had sex yeah yeah no that's that's not happening and I just got at like the first question that I've got to ask Lance is like what did that room smell like like I don't know if I want to know but I'm curious at the same time like like can you smell the beanie the beanie has the beanie been washed like did he get close enough to realize it because I don't think it has so he probably smelt the beanie either that is there's I would like I wonder about the weirdest shit okay is there like a closet full of beanies or is there like because he's probably rich enough to afford something like this right is there like a robot that picks out a beanie every day and just places it on his head in the same in the same way every single day I don't think he ever takes off the beanie or yeah that's the other thing could he ever does he ever take off the beanie let's see here we got a super chat from Evan Christensen Lance made a strategic error not taking a laptop or iPad with him didn't have all the facts on oh no Lance did have his laptop with him yeah I thought he did yeah I wish I had mine because they didn't tell me I told Lance to bring it they'd never told me you could do that I never assumed that was a thing I think that listen I really do think that's a terrible way to have these discussions just throwing these the shit out at people when they can't even fucking read these are peer reviewed studies this is long ass shit you gotta read it's a very intricate you can't just bravo Tim was like let me skim you're gonna miss out miss out on things you're gonna miss out on details which are important in these it's just not the way to do these things it's just nonsensical and then they just outright throw away any sort of meaning they give to it by just saying that your study is bunk bullshit because they don't like the details that come in it's just pointless what's the point like yeah exactly if they're just going to reject the factual information studies that contradict theirs and why even bring it find another avenue to attack them tell Lance that this trans lady things he nailed it we will thank you see uh dj inmer inmyer i'm probably butcher in your name i'm sorry about that maybe shinmyer possibly possibly i'm the worst with names oh me too i'm terrible i butcher every i butcher every single name i see for me like since i have a difficult name to pronounce i just automatically can't pronounce other people's names like maybe it's a spell or something and i have to break it i got yours that's that's not too bad i got that one okay you kind of crushed that that was good any more super chats oh liya let me get back to that sorry i got distracted by these this tangent we went on awanda with a super chat i had to follow ole's lead applaud you and mike left this mafia parker with a super chat strap him down give the jab and mandatory CRT kowalski with a few super chats you can pry my pencil for my cold dead left hand where are my fellow left handed survivors lance walked in yelled world star and took him out balthazar 228 with a ten dollar super chat ultimately lance is treating this way too honestly this is tim pools audience we're talking to you have to talk to talk at a lower level confidently rather than eloquently try to explain to tim i mean i think lance did really good but you know i do think that's again one of the things with the studies it's just it's just you know they keep bringing it up i would i would if i went on next time i wouldn't try to go let me check that i'll be like i'll be like fine let's take that study fine let's work on it from there it's just pointless to cause they're just gonna shout down whatever study you throw at them aw but i you know lance was really prepared though so i don't know you know wanna get to this one really quick since we can see it wolf heart 1136 i think this is from the rational national tim puts the beanie on like vader with his helmet oh yes i love that yeah that's absolutely appropriate especially cause it's made a fourth good observation you know he does force is strong with that one yes and by force we mean smell well i met with a force strong with that super chat but yeah the beanie probably smells like the dark side alright that's an understate sorry go ahead matt no it's all good aw with the super chat if this was a street fighter match then lance is the grand master grand master of the parry move so far in this debate sick tim's moves are predictable yeah i mean once you get once you get once you get once you get a handle on on his style it is predictable but it does take reconfigurating i mean it's impossible to cause i've never i've had debates before when i went with on tim's show it was a jarring style it's no doubt about it it takes you a second to get ready for it and then change how you go about it to match michel harris with a ten dollar super chat it feels like i've come full circle i found out about binder when lance watched him on tim pool and now i'm watching matt watch lance on tim pool and tim's just as ridiculous as ever miss siren that's cool twenty dollar that is really cool can we get to this one really quick on the screen yeah go ahead if you have one cause i'm not looking at the screen right now cause i have another window open oh okay just let me know when you bring something up and i'll stop okay with regard to the super street fighter i just want to say that tim pool is chan li spamming the kick attack in the corner that's my take on that but this one colts fan three five four still running away is behind but god damn he always derails himself with a billion useless anecdotes yeah that's all we were complaining about it was very difficult to get through for sure he does that every time actually one we didn't get was the trolley what is it called the fucking trolley conundrum or whatever the hell it is trolley problem the trolley problem i like the trolley conundrum but it fits their style much better i feel like you'll hear like someone go that's a straw man it's the trolley conundrum that's the type of wording they like to use miss siren with a twenty dollar super chat just giving me twenty bucks thank you miss siren no comment added e-j with a super chat tim pool reminds me of my sister's husband he walks around with knives and guns strapped all over his body parroting, crowder and pool, posers wait he walks around knives and guns that's really unhinged i want you and i hope your sister's alright that's very weird i have another one here man come ahead, yep so this is from joann winahan it's ten dollars i don't know who it's to probably the vanguard the kind of study shamus was demanding would involve assigning treatments to cis and trans folks i.e. some cis folks would be assigned to do trans treatments okay thank you very much my brain is too fried to process im processing it now right, yes, yes some cis folks to be assigned yes, that's right joan, yes samuel with a twenty seven ninety nine dollar canadian super chat thank you, wow nailed it binder unfortunately i don't know the context of what i nailed but i'm sure i nailed plenty so i appreciate it im got a two dollar here go ahead matt mercy who's more vagely ethnic binder or bad empanada i don't know what bad empanada looks like i don't know who that is is it because his name is bad empanada is that the joke i know the name but i don't think i've ever seen what he looks like so i can't answer that unfortunately i just wanna say i've never claimed to be anything so you know you could say that maybe if maybe what you're saying is bad empanada has the name empanada in his name and that's why people would assume my name is matt binder that's my real name i don't think it sounds i think it sounds pretty like basic i guess i don't think it sounds very latino or indian even i think i think it actually does sound rather german honestly because it's not binder or bindi i guess it's binder i think i thought of binders full of women and then it made me think of Mitt Romney all right well it is spelled the same row back yeah it is right crew herks with two super chats all total of 15 bucks let me read both not an MMA fighter but i don't need to be to know stopping blood flow to a person's brain for three minutes is gonna kill them or cause permit damage also as someone who actually lives in NYC it's an unspoken rule that we monitor own business when someone is having an episode if they aren't in danger we don't go Batman on them right parka with a super chat it's so funny seeing Ole and Nia joking and laughing while they're on mute i wish i knew yeah i understand Ole's feelings on this she doesn't you know i do think the hill is a different beast than this i know that there is overlap but i don't think it's quite the same i think hill the hill tries to position themselves as a more serious newscast even though the material might not be but they do try to come across more am i wrong for throwing that out there i don't want you that much i can't even speak to the hill because i only see clips if they go viral or whatnot so i honestly don't know but i know that she has put up with some just birdbrained shit on there and she gets attacked by the audience so i a thousand percent understand her decision to bow out although we haven't gotten our sufficient fix of Ole for the week so next week is gonna be very very we're all gonna have so much more energy next week and like be excited i do have a 199 for being a lefty ai chatbot Lance did well yeah i think so too it's funny because on his twitter thread where he's asking that he's getting attacked by a bunch of brightwingers who watched it and they're like you did terrible just like clown emojis and like i said he killed it and they're responding is this a real account and Ben Shapiro is hot responded saying oh by it do you mean yourself like oh they're they're celebrating this as a dub i mean look i think that regardless of who's debating my comment my comment to Lance because i have to obviously do the binder way of course i said not as good as me that was a good response i actually think i think Lance personally i think Lance did better seriously not even joking i think he did i think we both did good i think he had i think he went on and was able to speak to topics that he is an expert on and i was on a show that which just happened that the main topic was abortion and i believe that women have the right to choose what to do with their own body no if ends but no addendums no it's very simple for me and i don't care to go i don't need to look any further into that and it's just that simple for me i it's not an area i particularly i'm interested in because of that i mean i don't need to be affirmed or let me look at the data and see if my position is right no it's a very easy position for me to hold without having to look at a single fucking thing you cannot force someone to do something with their own body it's just that simple yes all the data in the world all the argument in the world is not going to change um i have a another super chat by the way from Jededaya oh yeah yummy i think this is from Rational National Kowalski is everywhere even on wisecrack yeah shout out to Kowalski and by the way there is an Aaron bell on the facebook chat with some really wild takes so you want our attention hi Aaron we see you you're silly you're stupid congratulations so also we have Prairie fire a little better but Matt you have legs that is true Matt does have legs no i mean i think i don't i don't care to prepare like he did honestly did you what was your level of preparation beforehand did you do any of these the reason the reason he invited me on though we never even got to on the show and it was the only actual documentation i brought we had an argument over this was when Libs of Tiktok post got unveiled and Tim claimed that Taylor Lorenz of the Washington Post actually doxed her address but she never did that and so actually brought full blown documentation i had all of higher right check of Libs of Tiktok's actual records of where she lived because i got i went public records and i got all of her voting records and where she was registered to vote every single year for the past like ten years and her address is matched up with the address that Taylor Lorenz posted which was the address of the real estate license she didn't even post an address she posted the documentation of the real estate license to prove that it was higher right check and the real estate license had an address on there but the address was the same of every other real estate license connected to that real estate firm because it was the actual place of business there for months anymore she had moved to Los Angeles so it wasn't even her current workplace it was just an address connected to a former employee employer just to prove that she had the right individual and so i had all this documentation we got sidetracked by these other issues and then when i brought it up at the very end Tim was like hey we don't have time doesn't matter and we never got a chance to approach it but in terms of studies and stuff i really don't think it's helpful i do see how it would help without Lance on an issue that he's really you know was prepared for to discuss like he brought the conversation there which was very smart for him i just didn't it's not it's not it wasn't necessary for me like for example when i spoke at Michael Tracy we had a debate when he went to that school in Connecticut to discuss covid policies on the college Michael Tracy wanted to discuss like the covid policy and i was like i don't care i don't care about the covid policy at this one fucking school in Connecticut it doesn't matter what matters is your reporting on this school you're talking from a place of expertise on this covid policy fine who did you speak to about the covid policies being you know too draconian not necessary like what health expert did you speak to and Michael Tracy was like i didn't speak to a single one and i was like what you wrote an article about covid and didn't speak to a single expert source this is a health this is health reporting what are you talking about he was like i didn't think it was necessary and i was like you didn't think it was necessary to speak to a doctor or a health professional to talk to write an article about covid policy that's all i needed to do i didn't need to throw stats and statistics his his whole framing his whole position is bunk when he didn't he didn't even go out of his way to find the specific one that even agreed with him which he certainly could have even found he didn't even do that to me that's all i need to do for these things i think that you Matt you and Sam Cedar have the same really good like off the cuff style to where you're really quick on your toes so like i don't think that you need to prepare and if anything if you like getting something and having a good response to it so yeah i think you still you still crushed it too don't don't undersell yourself but i want to get to a superchat from Loic i was still on the screen Lance said pegging and it's solicited a very peaked reaction sexual anarchy yes also pluvis with a $5 superchat whenever i hear anyone bring up the dilation reality TV girl i want to shout about their retainer oh my god yes that's a really great way to respond to that because yeah it's so weird like why isn't she keeping up proper maintenance of her vagina like we're talking you're talking about this why are you talking about this that was such a weird moment and i'm glad that Lance just straight up was like do you know that this is really weird because it was like there's no justification to be talking about this you can't make a pro trans argument or anti trans argument you don't need to invoke that to make any kind of an argument it's just it's so bizarre and inappropriate that it's just i can't it was awful they keep bringing up bizarre and inappropriate stuff i mean it's all about the focus on womes and a reproduction and tim literally called Lance the supporter of the genocide of transgender i'm like what the fuck a very powerful no you it just blew my mind i was like you're seriously gonna make that argument how do you think this works how do you think people trans how do you think trans people are made how do you think trans people are created they come from look Matt you made the point i don't have to make it again all the points were made it just blew my mind all these damn cis people cis straight people keep having all these gay and trans babies i mean god damn you're pumping up our numbers get better what's a rookie number so yeah yeah we can we can up it by 20% okay matt do you have any more super chats i do one second let me pull it up okay they're coming in man they're coming in i can't complain but they're coming in if you guys gotta jump i'll just keep oh you can't jump because you're the host that's okay i'm good pluvius with a super chat whenever i hear anyone bring up the dilation reality tv girl i wanna shout have you never seen a mom freak out at their kid about their retainer oh did you read that one i did yeah that was a great one also why it's very bizarre for them to use what is her name jazz jennings as an example when she seems to be a completely well adjusted very happy trans woman like that's your example someone who is really happy to have transitioned like very bad example on their part like they could actually pull like an actual example of and it would be disingenuous but at least it would fit their framing because everyone anyone could suffer from depression whether you're trans or not the trans person would still be depressed after the transition well there's plenty of straight cisgender people who suffer from depression and continually suffer from it what is your point they could get all the help and the dedication they need and they could still suffer from it and the depression isn't necessarily due to them being trans or whatever it's due to discrimination I mean Jesus Christ dapperize I can't take super chat oh wrong one I can't take super chats currently so feel free to direct them to Matt Binder or the vanguard or rational national my channel doesn't have monetization currently it'll be turned on hopefully soon do you have a patreon or something they can donate to oh yeah yeah but I won't be able to see like the messages or anything like that at least like right now so yeah just I appreciate the kind thought kind thought though Loic with a super chat oh wait that's the pegging one all right Jesus Matt Mercy read that one the Joan one you read oh Colts fan still running a ways behind but god damn he always derails himself with a billion useless I did read that one too oh here we go see the Jinmyer tell Lance this trans lady thinks he nailed it I will already read that one really yeah I'm tired man you're the freshest person in here help us out dear devil Binder is a person of cola Coca Cola POC that's a good one that's a good one I am a soda man all right I think that's everybody I think I hit up everybody that's it hey hey we did it folks oh man this this has been njerli a 4 hour stream here so I what time is it on the east coast it's like what 11 yeah it's it's 11 yep we did a long stream but it was worth it one of our buddies was having a big moment I think he killed it I think so too what he needed to do that this was an important I don't know it might be too late I guess but what I did was I made sure to let them know that I take calls on my stream and that there's it's something that none of these shows they watch too you can't call Tim Pool he'll read your super jazz but that's not a discussion I let them know that anyone and it's open to them especially can call into my show and quite a few of them did and we had long discussions and at the end a lot of them walked away like I don't know if I changed their minds but they walked away you know saying I agree with some things you said you know it's I think that's an important part but I was watching a couple of those actually but what if you want to take calls like me but like it doesn't work when you try to do it I try to I try to take calls on on Twitch streams and the only thing that I could get to work was Skype but everybody had did not have Skype so I tried Discord and I couldn't figure it out because I'm a boomer so yeah oh no I have a more sad story like I used to try to take calls on my show like way back and there's like nobody that would call in so sad sad face I mean it'd probably work out better if I did it now but you know yeah it's like it's the difficulty of being a streamer either something doesn't work or when you get it to work nobody cares yeah yeah it's a sad life well so we still have quite a bit of people watching do you guys want to give shoutouts plug anything that you're doing because I actually have a shoutout and a plug oh yeah let me let people ask if I'm going to take calls now I am exhausted guys I've been we started this we started this an hour earlier than usual we've been streaming since 7.30 so we're and we listen to hours of Tim Pool that does a lot to you we're about to hit hour four we're about to hit hour four and listen I'm not I'm not one of those streamers that just streams what I'm doing and you guys are watching and I'm doing playing video games or we're doing something else I respect people who do that but I don't do that you watched four hours of me actively engaging with very political and serious content and stupid boys with you guys I can't my brain is fried I can't give you guys any sort of you know if I took calls right now you'd be going you'd be asking me some really smart questions and I'd be going what did you just repeat that again I can't what like I've got to say like I've done long streams before and they've been exhausting but when you have to endure hours of Tim Pool it really it's just exponentially more like draining mentally oops I've cooked the wrong one there's another super chat that just popped up I want to get to that Prairie Fire 199 take calls or I'll drown a fish you can't drown a fish so haha jokes on you thank you though for that I believe that was to that might be to bender actually I'm not sure though well let me real quick I will be on unbossed with Nina Turner tomorrow at 1 p.m. p.t. so tune into that that's going to be super duper fun I always love oh that's on the TYT Network right yeah so you guys have not been banished right I have not haha no we have not been banished I'm not far Wait, Jeff, are you on the TYT Network? Yeah hahaha are you afraid okay I'm kind of like you were afraid I was going to get you in trouble no no no you were like Jeff I'm technically not on they I'm unplugged from the network it's a mutual thing which is why I can't do monetization currently because YouTube has to re-approve me so TYT is not my network partner anymore no drama no nothing there it's not like I was kicked out or anything like that just a demonetization BS yeah yeah so TYT is trying to help me currently get monetization back even though I'm not their network partner shout out to Aaron he's really really great oh yeah yeah yeah so yeah that's why I can't do monetization but no no I'm what did you do you were naughty weren't you no we criticize the Anna K's no no no I meant on the demonetization oh so what happens is if you leave your multi-channel multi-channel network which is what TY was to me it is the same to you oh ok it resets your monetization status so they have to re-review you and make sure that you're approvable because I was approvable under the banner of TYT but on my own they're like hmm so it could take 30 days so I'm flying demonetization for basically Mike's been riding on TYT's coat tails this entire time it hasn't well you know what William is frustrating is that he's never been monetized on his own merits no I will that's the thing it's like YouTube already did this process they approved me for monetization and then I joined TYT and then I was just automatically monetized through them that wasn't an issue but like if they were if I was monetized by myself before then why do you have to re-approve it and I talked to Y2 about this and they're like it's gonna take two to four weeks sorry so it's like ok that's ok yeah I would take a two to four week vacation no lot yeah yeah I mean it's a little bit you still gotta feed the algorithm probably so that way when you get monetization back you can hit the ground running but look I'm not gonna complain because you know thankfully I can absorb the blow it's painful oh yeah but I can absorb the blow so I'm not gonna like I'm not gonna freak out about it you know just it's part of the process you know if you're a YouTuber and you have an MCN just don't sign up for an MCN because when you leave an MCN it doesn't matter who it is you're gonna end up having to reapply for monetization and thankfully TYT is really great and they're like trying to help still like to get monetization back so you know it's nice because there's still a good resource you know by the way we have another superchat from 0PE David was on TYT main show Friday and killed it ok very cool I did not see that actually I haven't been watching any political content because my brain is mush and I just need like a mental break but yeah I'll have to off to check that out ok do you all have any any channels I've already plugged so yeah let me plug folks youtube.com slash Matt Binder please subscribe I don't have a YouTube channel as big as Mike and David Dole's how many subscribers you got Jeff 173,000 I don't even got as many as Jeff jeze I really am really lacking it on the YouTube channel front I'm very close to 30,000 subs though so help me get that so there you go everyone go sub to Matt that's right also you're beating us on twitch right now yeah Matt am I that's what was it Joe Spinner Joe Spinner says you're beating beating us on twitch there you go I guess I'm the I'm the king of twitch I'm beating you guys on blue sky you are and twitter and twitter got any of the blue sky codes for me I don't I'm sorry I really don't I will say I will say really funny someone looked into like the blue sky data and like found what the major groupings were and like there's like crypto grouping art grouping grouping and I'm in a I'm in the mainstream slash politics grouping and they pulled the top 10 accounts in that grouping and it was like AOC Jake Tapper Parker Malloy Ben Collins of NBC and hell yeah look at you so I gotta really I gotta focus on the blue sky front once again Matt Binder flox to the one platform that does not pay you and besides this is where I'm gonna stake my my reputation I got I got I got the the twitter followers and everything twitter doesn't pay you now I'm doing blue sky blue sky doesn't pay you could have done YouTube get paid could have done Facebook get paid could have done tiktok get paid but why are we not on Facebook why would I do that I mean I don't have a bit I just have a personal Facebook account I don't have any like see I upload every single video to Facebook I just don't have I've got a very large right wing audience on Facebook you do really oh yeah oh yeah I get lots of really interesting messages DMs in particular one more super chat here from patrice hubbard 999 this is to it's not rational national it's either Binder or vanguard they say hey I don't know how politicon goes but I would definitely go if the leftist mafia or whatever still waiting on tour dates hey well that's that's good to know they got they're already doing it it's coming up in like two weeks there's no way that oh is it okay so we are we're too late maybe the following year though it depends on where it is because I wouldn't want to go to Florida for example they're doing a tour this year they're doing May 12 then Portland, Oregon May 19 oh no shit I didn't get an invite fuck you politicon it's actually doesn't look like it's an official politicon it's a politicon presents sisters in law maybe that's why you're not invited oh okay that's okay sorry I left out that bit of information it's a it's a tour of it looks like various women in the political space that would I get the lack of invite okay but they're also they're also promoting their podcasts on their page now I guess they have a politicon podcast network and two of the podcasts are one with James Carville and another one with Mary Trump oh that sounds amazing god we're missing out I don't think we're their target audience for that I don't know if they're still doing the broader sort of political gatherings political influencer gatherings whatever although I've got to say if leftist mafia showed up to politicon we would crush it because the family is very very very enthusiastic and vocal we have the best viewers and I think we I think we would be probably more popular than James Carville I'll say that without a doubt yeah James Crypt Keeper Carville that's a good I was just thinking about that Lance just got back to me after seeing the DMs apparently he was oh that's why they said ok ok that makes sense ok ok tell Lance to jump on let's go another hour and a half two hours three hours I'm so fresh fresh as da oh one more super chat this is from Pluvius five dollars speaking of blue sky has anyone else noticed that the right wingers seem to be calling it blue ski like it's a Russian conspiracy I know right wingers like Mike Figurato of the humanist I noticed I did it on accident when I was talking about it too and I don't know which video was but I called it blue ski and then blue sky again someone pointed out that if you have the if you if you're cause someone was reading a tech dirt article on blue sky and they were reading it via like one of those a text of voice things like maybe it was even Siri but the text of voice generator is even say blue ski so oh ok so you just you just have AI brain you just have machine AI brain Mike I'm an NPC you're no better yeah you're no better than an AI alright folks so what you say should we call it a night is that it anymore or should we try to should we try to goat lance at the jumping on yeah let's get him see if he can do it really no he's probably there still that yeah he's probably traveling to it would be really cool to talk to him but I don't think I will say when I no he definitely can't cause when I finished I don't know if it's different cause they were doing after hours thing on the Tim pool network off YouTube but when I was done Tim got it was very cordial they treated me very nice when I was there his crew is very nice which is you know very basic you should be able to do that to people I would treat if someone came to my home after I invited them I would certainly treat them very nice regardless of who they were just basic human level and but after Tim was really like combated with me even off air I was very weird it was bizarre that is weird yes which he wasn't like he did the weird things like the cleaning of the gun before to the show but it wasn't like outright but afterwards he was oh you didn't hear this I told the story my first time meeting Tim pool sitting in the studio waiting for his arrival he comes in he goes right to his wall takes a gun off the wall and starts cleaning it right in front of me like a real gun like the one he has on the wall just that's his hello to me like he just says hey and he's talking to me while he's cleaning his gun and then you know that civil war relic he mentioned at the very beginning before the show he actually told me to come over to it he asked me if I wanted to pick it up I had no idea what would happen to this civil war relic it was really that old so I declined to pick it up and it crumbled in my hands so I just said no and that's fine I'm looking at it it's cool and so apparently later on on a future stream he was like I had a guy on the left on my show and he was afraid to touch the gun if Tim asked me to touch one of his non-old ass relic guns sure I would have obliged and said yeah I'll hold it but I wasn't gonna I wouldn't touch it up I didn't want to be I don't know if it was you just broke my gunman when it was an already broken gun I didn't want to you pick it up and you're like pew pew pew no no if it falls apart in my hand it's just like what are you gonna do you gave it to me yep by the way, 199 I learned again, I'm a New Yorker you just mind your own business you don't touch something that's not yours it's a good policy overall for sure okay, 199 Super Chat from Prairie Fire shout out to him you all are far left Tim, far right I'm far Ming and for those of you who don't know Prairie Fire is an IRL farmer so nice yes, yes alright folks well, I think that we'll call it there a lot of commenters are saying let Rance let Lance rest Rance sounds like a Game of Thrones character Rance Rance of the Serfs Rance of Prebis Rance of Prebis we will let Rance left no, we'll let Lance rest and yeah, we'll see you all next week for a normal episode of the leftist mafia at our normal time there really is no such thing as a normal episode that's true that's true that's true that's true oh, thanks for letting me jump in by the way we'll have to bring you on proper you gotta come on and no, I think you've you've made your appearance that's it go to the back of the line, Jeff get back there you'll be on there's like a hundred other leftists now that'll come on and you'll come on in two years no, you'll come on let's get you on let's get you on an actual episode all right, let's get you on an actual full bonus yeah, yeah for sure it'll be great it'll be a lot of fun all right, folks we'll see you next week take care, everyone you can't see my arm but I'm waving