 Yeah, welcome everyone. Good morning. Glad to have you all back this class on the local church. So we'll pray and we'll begin. I would like to request someone to please lead in prayer, please. Anyone who is able to. Yes, yes, please. Father, thank you for this class that you've blessed us with as we come together and study your word. Let it be your wisdom that quite says Father, we pray that let it be your spirit that helps us deeply interpret the word that we are reading and help us to draw closer to you to understand more of you, Lord. We pray for your presence as we read through and understand things, give us an open heart to truly understand and draw each one of us closer to your nature. Lord, we thank you and we ask this in Jesus name. Amen. Amen. Thank you. Thank you. Yes, so we will continue looking at some of the things that we have seen earlier. So we had spent some time on understanding the practice of the ordinances in the church. So we studied about the Lord's table. We studied about baptism. Now we are going to move on to other things here. So church discipline resolving conflicts. This is where we were and we said that, you know, depending on certain situations, we will have to look at what God's word instructs us and then, you know, accordingly, whether it is being correction, whether it is trying to restore a fallen minister, we go by what, you know, God's word prescribes. And then we also said that the response of individuals is it can be varied. You know, some can respond positively, whereas others may not necessarily like the instructions that are being given to them. So, you know, one needs to have God's wisdom to manage every situation. So that's what we said. And I think we are not able to recall if we have like, you know, come through everything. But the last section here also says that if we do not get a certain response that we were looking for, that we must not take things personally. There is a part that we have to play, but beyond that, you know, when it comes to correcting people resolving conflicts, don't take matters personally. Don't take offense and also allow people time. And if at all they make a decision to move forward and they don't no longer want to be a part of the ministry that, you know, you are running, then that's fine. We let them go so that they are able to continue to grow in God, but maybe in a different environment. So these are all the aspects that we had looked at. And then we, you know, said that we will briefly look at the order in church gatherings. So this chapter is fairly small here. And over here we see that, you know, everything needs to be done in an orderly manner. We've recently discussed about the Lord's table and we saw how, you know, Paul wanted people not to come and get drunk and dishonor the Lord's table instead. He instructed them and told them that, you know, if at all there is a possibility of getting drunk in the church gathering to avoid that. Why don't you have your meal at home and then you come here just to celebrate the Lord's table. So there are instructions that he gave in the matter of the Lord's table. And we also see, you know, Paul saying this in 1 Corinthians 14 and verse 33. He says that God is not the author of confusion, but of peace as in all the churches of the saints. So God's intention is peace in the way he ministers to our hearts. Okay. Charles, I am on page number 134. Okay. So that's where I'm at. God's intention is for there to be peace and that we order and we apply this to everything that concerns are coming together. Not just the just the Sunday services, but in everything. And Paul also writes, you know, 1 Corinthians 1440 by he says that let everything be done decently and in order. So that's what we are called to. We must ensure that we have good planning, good coordination and, you know, depending on what resources are available to us, you know, we have to manage that very well. So I think very briefly, we said that when we organize gathering, then we have to ensure that the timing is planned correctly. So if we have, let's say about two hours for a service, then we must make sure that the main aspects of the service, which would be the sharing of the word, worship, you know, those things take precedence over. Other, other things that can be, that can be done in a quicker way. So stuff like announcements, you know, other things like if you, if you have a really tight program and many things are happening, then you know, how are you going to, how are you going to coordinate and plan and line people up and stuff them, you know, to come quickly to the, to the stage and to finish their part. So that we are making more time for the main aspects of the worship so that the people who come in, right, to worship, they truly have the opportunity to do that and to go back strengthened in their spirit. Now use of tongues and corporate gatherings, this we haven't done in detail. So we can look at this. So basically, we get our instructions for the use of spiritual gifts from the passage 1 Corinthians 14, where, you know, Paul, not just about tongues, but he has instructions about prophecy. And I mean, mainly these two and the order in which people must actually go about, you know, ministering these spiritual gifts. Here we find that Paul instructs when it comes to speaking in tongues he instructs that we are okay or permitted to speak in an unknown tongue in a congregation setting provided there is interpretation. So he says as long as there is interpretation of the message, one is allowed to give the message. But if there is no interpretation, then he instructs and he says keep silent. So I won't be going through the scriptures, but the scripture numbers are given here. So that is 1 Corinthians 14 versus 16 to 19 and then again, you know, 27 to 32. So the reason why Paul says this is because tongues primarily is the main form of tongues, which we all are familiar with that is for personal edification. So when Paul talks about him speaking in tongues, you know, in the same passage 1 Corinthians 14, he says that I speak in tongues much more than all of you. So that tongues is the personal edification tongues. But when it comes to ministering in the church gathering or ministering in a setting when there are other believers, he insists that there be interpretation. So this form of tongues is a tongues which is a message to the body and a message to the body will be of no use if people are not able to understand it and they are not able to receive it. And that is the reason a message should have interpretation. So when it comes to the use of tongues in a gathering, it is best that a message has an interpretation. And Paul writes, he says if you don't have an interpretation, then it is better for you to be silent. So it's all about edifying the church body. So that is how tongues is supposed to be used in the corporate gatherings. Now we just want to add here that while we are so keen on maintaining order in our gatherings because scriptures tell us that Paul wrote back to the local churches. But at the same time, we do understand that the work of the spirit sometimes is such that though we have a structure, though we have a plan, the Holy Spirit might lead in a slightly different manner. Of course in conformity to the word of God because the spirit and the word agree in 1 John 5.7. So the Holy Spirit is not going to cause something to happen which the father or the son or the word of God disagrees with. But we can find that the Holy Spirit moves in a slightly different way than what we had originally planned out for that service or for that gathering. So we must be open to God's working amidst us. Some 115 and verse 3 it says, but our God is in heaven. He does whatever he pleases. So God has his own way of doing things. So at this point, I just want to say that like example, if we have planned our church service thoroughly and the coordination is happening in an excellent way. Everything is sort of set. It could so happen that in one church service, your message is prepared, the pastor or the preacher is ready to deliver the sermon. But what if the Holy Spirit just leads us into extended times of worship? And you just sense that anointing for God's presence to minister to the hearts of the people, prophetic words are coming through as the worship team is leading. And so you just sense that this is the direction in which the Holy Spirit would want us to go this particular Sunday. So it is possible that that service ends up being a worship of adoration and singing songs of worship unto the Lord. Whoever is overseeing that particular service must be open and must be sensitive to the leading of the Holy Spirit. So it's a very fine balance. We want to maintain order but at the same time there is a way in which the Holy Spirit leads. Now what if in that service God wants to focus in on the baptism in the Holy Spirit? What if God wants to focus in on healings and some form of restoration in the lives of people, in families, in relationships. So though we may have planned that we are going to spend 50 minutes sermon and wrapping up the sermon and all of that, we just sense that God wants to move us in that direction. So maybe we want to wrap up the sermon in 30 minutes and then spend additional time on the ministry part of the service. So basically it's about being sensitive. Though we have a set format and a structure, we must be sensitive to the leading of the Holy Spirit. And then again in church gatherings it is possible that we find fleshly manifestations. What are fleshly manifestations? Sometimes when we are very familiar with church and the church culture, somewhere in our mind, somewhere in our natural self, certain things get programmed. The way we, let's say you might find people behaving as if they are filled with the Holy Spirit and shaking and all of that. But that may not necessarily be the outpouring of the Holy Spirit. Because sometimes we get so familiar that subconsciously we tend to just do things that we have seen earlier. All kinds of other manifestations may be people with their fleshly zeal, people being filled with the Holy Spirit, there are people crying. But it may not be the Holy Spirit manifesting. So sometimes these kind of things happen and it's hard to tell whether it's the Holy Spirit at work or what's happening, people manifesting some sort of demon spirits. But whatever we observe around us, we can bring order in those situations as well. And if we do recognize that something is a manifestation of the flesh, then we could address that in a loving manner with the people concerned. But the ultimate fruit, sometimes when we have these manifestations and we are wondering whether it is from God or whether it is something that people are creating, the best thing to do is to see the fruit. The fruit will tell us whether a certain move of God or a certain manifestation was from God or not. Because at the time when the fleshly manifestation is taking place, it's really hard to tell sometimes, whether it's the Holy Spirit or something else is going on. So we who are open to the working of God's Spirit must also be aware that there can be fleshly manifestations which are an imitation of the work of the Spirit and sometimes people try to get into these things. But I guess it just comes with the territory. If we are open to the prophetic, if we are open to the work of the Holy Spirit, there will naturally be some imitations. But one must be discerning in the Spirit and guide the service accordingly. And address it in the right manner. So this is a little bit about having order in church, maintaining that decency and order that Paul was talking about. So we can move on to the next section here which is about women and ministry. I think we have already discussed a little bit in Kingdom Builders, but this will also add to whatever we have learned earlier. So any thoughts, any comments, questions about order in church gatherings? Some key aspects were discussed, but I'm sure there are a lot of other things also which can be talked under order in church gatherings. So yeah. Any questions? Yes, sir. Yes. Pastor, maybe just kind of to discuss, where do you kind of draw the line? God is the God of order. I agree very well, but I find that sometimes we could be so structured that we might just think, we might just forget the Holy Spirit. Where do we draw the line whereby we can still be flexible? And at the same time, everything is done in order. Because sometimes we can just have a program and even for a year, you keep repeating the same thing every time and you think, oh, you're just being orderly, but that's not what the Spirit of God wants to do. So I'm just kind of bringing this up. It's actually been on my mind because sometimes we kind of want to just repeat the same thing year in, year out, month in, month in. And I think sometimes we could be just too structured and the Holy Spirit is just waiting on us to be sensitive to Him to know, okay, you could do it this way. This is what I want to accomplish in the church. You know, in your group and all that. So just maybe to buttress through more light, you know. Yeah, sure. So what I would say for this is, it's about being sensitive throughout and that's what I believe. So even while we are planning, let's say a format, a service format or we're heading a ministry and we are planning. Okay, what are all the activities of the programs that we need to have for this ministry? Be sensitive throughout, okay. And we see that example, you know, in the life of Apostle Paul. He's a great example. He was led by the Spirit. There are places where he wanted to go, but the Spirit didn't allow him to go. There are places from where he wanted to quit, but the Spirit didn't allow him to quit. So he was sensitive and even when he was moving towards Jerusalem, you know, Holy Spirit gave him the impression that it's going to be difficult for you. They're going to bind you there and yet, you know, he knew this is in God's plan for me. So yeah, I'm going, I'm going in that direction, even though it's going to be hard. So the point is, be sensitive always, even when we are planning programs. So once we plan the program and, you know, again the question, how can we plan the program? What if the Holy Spirit leads us in a different way, you know, during the program? Well, I think we touched on the scripture earlier. Say this is Isaiah 46 and verse 10 where it says that God knows the end from the beginning. So he knows if he's going to move by the Spirit in a different way, he is able to give me an impression of that even well ahead in time so that I can be prepared. So I'm not saying that, you know, we would know every move that God is going to make. No, not at all. Even the people in the upper room, it says and suddenly they knew that it's going to be an outpouring of the Spirit. They didn't know when they didn't know what fashion or form. They just knew Joel's prophecy, but God gave Peter the discernment because it says dreams and visions. But here are people talking in tongues and still Peter looks at it and he says, this is that. So it's all about being so united with the Spirit throughout and we do our part to discern the leading of the Spirit to plan the structure even. And then even though we plan it by being sensitive to the Holy Spirit, let's say, yeah, we have heard from God and we plan the structure. But one Sunday service, you know, as I said, maybe even the worship team is not able to worship everyone's just on their knees. Everyone's just, you know, adoring God and just spending time, you know, praying and crying and whatever. We allow that to happen. But the point is predominantly when we plan something led by the Spirit, it kind of remains. And then there are always exceptions. There's always the fine-tuning that happens here and there. And if we are really depending on the Spirit throughout, God is okay for God to say, hey, pack this up. So if we have an impression where God says, I really don't want you to do this, you know, close this activity. We are okay to course correct. So you wrap it up, you maybe introduce something else or you don't introduce anything at all. You know, so the thing is, say, even though you asked about being sensitive in a structured format and saying throughout the planning, if we are sensitive, it really helps. That way, we can have the norm and then yes, you know, some portions here and there, the exception will happen because the Spirit will lead very differently. But otherwise, I think we kind of can maintain that norm, you know, for a while. So I hope I'm making sense. Thank you, Pastor. Thank you. Yeah, sure, sure. Yes, thank you. Good question there. Yeah. Anything else? Any other comments? Yeah. So, you know, it's a beautiful balance. We can be structured and at the same time we can be very booklet. So if we can maintain that, I think that is very helpful and especially in things that involve, you know, more people and large numbers. So just imagine, you know, for a church service, let's say 5000 people are showing up. If there's no order, we don't know what time it's starting, we don't know what time it's ending, we don't know what's going to happen, you know, it's like the teams don't know, nobody knows. It's very difficult. It becomes very difficult for everybody involved, whether it is the organizing team or the people who are attending. But if, primarily, there is one, some sort of an order that we subscribe to, it's helpful. Yes, of course, there will be some times where we go over time or we finish before that. Things are different, but those would be exceptions. Yeah. Okay. All right. So that's about order. If there are no more questions, yeah, I think there are no more questions. So okay, let's move on. This is chapter 22, page 137, where we are going to talk about women in ministry. Since we're talking about the local church, there's always a question of whether women can be part of the ministry in the local church at various capacities. This could be at, you know, just serving volunteers or somebody who is heading up, leading a ministry. Is that possible? Is that scriptural? So we'll spend some time looking at it. So when we consider women in the Word of God, even from the Old Testament, you know, we find that there were women who were ministering unto the Lord, who had called to serve the people. So there are some examples here. Miriam, you know, Miriam is called a prophetess. She was the sister of Erin and we know how she danced with a timbre in her hands. So, you know, she was very much in the forefront of things in the Old Testament. Then of course there is Deborah. Deborah, you cannot say that she was a leader in her own right and she was leading even the generals at that time, the army general at that time. So she was a woman with authority and gifted with leadership. Deborah is somebody that we see in scripture. Haldah is the wife of Isaiah. She's also called a, oh sorry, Haldah here is a prophetess. Yeah, correct. And then, you know, we see that as the wife of Isaiah, she doesn't really, we don't see too much of ministry regarding her. But then we know that there was some role that she had. And it was a ministry role. Okay, then Esther. Esther is also a leader. We see her becoming a sort of a deliverer for an entire nation. Then in the New Testament, we can look at the lack of Anna. Now Anna's ministry is different. We may not see her, you know, serving out there in the local church. But hers was more of an intercession, you know, fasting sort of a ministry. Nonetheless, you know, we've studied about this when we studied about prayer and intercession. But that is also ministry and God places a high value on that. So Anna was engaged in ministry. She's also called as a prophetess. Okay, then Philip's daughters. Philip's daughters, he had four virgin daughters and the scriptures tell us that they prophesied. So they were moving in the New Testament, women were moving in the gifts of the spirit. So that much we can agree on. So now coming to other questions here. Can a woman be a minister? Minister is service. So service in the house of God, is it possible for a woman to be serving God? So as we look at, you know, passages on men and women, it's very clear that the grace of God is given equally to a man and woman. So Galatians 3 verse 28, could somebody please read it? These verses are in our notes. I'm on page 138. So Galatians 3 verse 28, one person can read. First Peter 3 verse 7, another person can read, please. Shall I read, ma'am? Yes, yes, please. Galatians 3 verse 28 says, there is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female. For you all are one in Christ Jesus. Yes, thank you. Let's look at the other verse also. Anyone else ready to read it? One Peter 3 verse 7. Husbands likewise, well with them with understanding, giving honor to the wife as to the weaker vessel. And as being as together of the grace of life, that your prayers may not be hindered. Yes, thank you, Christopher. Thank you. So you know, these passages are quite self-explanatory. It just says, you know, there's equality, neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female. For you are all one in Christ Jesus. So as we stand before God as the recipients of his work of salvation, we're all the same. We're all on level ground. So that is a clear cut. Even here in verse Peter 3 verse 7, Peter writes, as being heirs together of the grace of life. So God does not, he, you know, doesn't give a larger measure to one gender as compared to the other gender. There's equal grace given to both man and woman. So that is clear before the eyes of God when it comes to salvation and the grace of God, we are all the same. So now let's continue to look at some of those passages which are unclear. So we're talking about ministry. Can women be ministers of God? The passage, okay, where that people read and they feel like, hey, only men should do ministry. And especially when it comes to the five-fold ministry offices. That passage in Ephesians 4, okay, verses 8 and 11. Again, this is there in our notes. This is on page 139. So here it reads this way. He gave gifts unto men, okay. And then again it says, and he gave some, some, so, you know, gifts unto men. Then it goes on to explain, you know, some pastors, teachers, evangelists, prophets and apostles. So gifts unto men is what brings the contention. However, if you, it's in English in other languages, it is translated as men. But if you go back to the original Greek, the word that is used there is anthropos, okay, anthropos. Now if we study that word a little more, we would understand that it is a gender neutral word. So whenever anthropos is used, it could mean a man or it could mean a woman. For example, you know, Matthew 4-4 is another passage where the same term anthropos is used. Where it says, man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word, you know, every word of God. So does it mean that, okay, man shall not live by bread alone, but woman can live by bread alone? No, because the interpretation there is, it is applicable to both genders. And similarly, now, and again, you can look at several other passages that also use this term anthropos, where it is actually referring to man and woman. So let me, let me read another passage, 2 Timothy 2-2, where Paul instructs Timothy and says, and the things that you have heard from me among many witnesses come with these two faithful men who will be able to teach others also. The faithful men over there is anthropos. So that is gender neutral. If we want to use a Greek word that specifically refers to the male gender, it would be Amer, okay, I don't know how to pronounce it, but A-N-E-R. But that's not what is used, you know, where these terms men are used in English. So our understanding is that God has called even women to the work of the ministry in the house of God. So when Paul told Timothy, come at it to faithful men, he meant women as well. And similarly to the Ephesians when Paul wrote and said that he gave gifts unto men. It means that even women can be part of the five-fold ministry offices. Now, when it comes to the way God empowers men and women, he didn't make a distinction. If we go back to Acts chapter 2, there the outpouring of the Holy Spirit. And then there it's quite clear the Holy Spirit poured out on all flesh, your sons and daughters, sons and daughters included. So God is pouring out the Spirit and he hasn't limited this gift only to men or, you know, some other gifts only to women, so on and so forth. So we are all, both men and women are recipients of the outpouring of the Holy Spirit, the ministry gifts of God. And also through the receiving of this power, they can be witnesses for the name of Jesus and they can go ahead and proclaim about what Christ has done. So, you know, women should not be, we shouldn't be forbidding them from sharing about Christ or moving in the spirit, moving in the gifts of the spirit or even ministering in the local church. So there is no such limitations which we observe. And when it comes to the exercise of ministry gifts, the one thing that we see in the ministry of Paul is that Paul encouraged women to be a part of his ministry. Now, we're going to look at a couple of other passages that Paul wrote, which again appear like those problem passages that seem to say that women should not be in ministry. However, you know, it's the same Paul who had women in his ministry team. So you have an Aquila and his wife Priscilla, who helped him in the teaching of God's Word. And you know, there are some commentators who also say that the name of Priscilla is written before Aquila, which means that she was probably a more well-versed teacher as compared to her husband. So, you know, it's possible. However, we'll just settle with the fact that she was engaging in teaching of God's Word. So that in itself shows that, hey, a woman was teaching under Paul's leadership. Then there were other women that he wrote about as a Phoebe in Romans. He says she's a deaconess. So she's one of those leaders, an overseer in capacity over a body of believers. Then he praises a woman by the name of Junior, who is known as an outstanding apostle. So there were women in Paul's team. So it's a little contradictory if the same Paul tells women not to preach and teach. So let's just, you know, continue on in our notes. I'll just look at those passages first and then come back to the other sections here. So those problem passages are one is 1 Timothy 2 verses 11-15. A lot of people quote this where, okay, sorry, let's go back to the other section here, page 140, where the statement is, let your women keep silent. Okay. So this is in 1 Corinthians chapter 14. He says that, let your women keep silent in the church because it is shameful for women to speak in church. So that's what Paul says in 1 Corinthians 14. And based on this, based on this, a lot of people say, hey, how can a woman preach? How can you let a woman preach? It's not correct. But if we study this entire passage, as I pointed out earlier when we talked about order in a church setting, there are three times Paul says keep silent. Okay, first time he says keep silent is speaking tongues to the church audience if there is something, if there is an interpretation, if there is no interpretation, he says keep silent. While prophesying, he says, if it is your turn, you prophesy. Otherwise, keep silent. And the third thing is, he says, a woman should keep silent. And if they want to learn something, let them ask their own husband at home for it is shameful for a woman to speak in church. So that is the third time where he says women should keep silent. So just going by the context here, Paul is establishing order in the church gathering. So we must not have disorder because of speaking in tongues. We must not have disorder because of prophesying. We must not have disorder because of women speaking. So would we tell people to stop speaking in tongues? We would never do that. Would we tell people to stop prophesying? We would never do that. So why would we tell women to keep silent? Just take one of the keep silence and use that as, hey, this stands permanently. But you have to look at the context in which Paul was actually saying this. He was saying, in the church, it's likely that women were asking questions to their husbands in the public gathering which he did not want. He said, hey, there is no order in this. Just keep silent, ask the questions at home. So in that context, Paul said, let your women keep silent. So this is one problem passage that a lot of people get stuck on and that is used to tell women not to engage in ministry. Another problem passage here is from 1 Timothy chapter 2 verses 11 through 15 where Paul says, I do not permit a woman to teach. So this is how it goes. Let a woman learn in silence with all submission and I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man but to be in silence. For Adam was formed first, then Eve and Adam was not deceived but the woman being deceived fell into transgression. Nevertheless, she will be saved in childbearing if they continue in faith, love and holiness with self-control. So again, here it appears as if he's saying I do not permit a woman to teach. But going back to the context of the Ephesian church that Timothy was pastoring, there were a lot of cultic teachings in that setting, in Ephesus. So people who were getting saved out of these cults and these practices, once they came into the church they sort of carried on that same mindset. So apparently in the city of Ephesus they taught about women being superior to men and women would use up power and they would treat men poorly. So in that context, Paul is saying that all those cultic teachings, all those practices that you are familiar with, I don't want you to teach that. I don't permit a woman to teach and in the same breath he says hand to authority over a man because that was what was going on in the Ephesian context. If you continue further, he talks about for Adam was formed first, then Eve it sort of makes itself clear because now he's talking about God's government in marriage. So in marriage, he says, Adam was formed first and then Eve. That we already agreed, we discussed it several times over that in the household, in marriage God is called the man as the spiritual head and God is called the man as the leader of the family. So that's how those passages are interpreted and definitely they don't know that a woman cannot teach or preach and that's not what Paul is talking about because he had women in his team. So that's about women being permitted to be in ministry. How about women in leadership? In the Old Testament we've already seen people like Deborah, they were in leadership not just doing some work for God but literally like leadership. In Romans 12, we see that God has given gifts, we call these grace gifts. Romans 12, there are various gifts that are given to people and we're all supposed to use those gifts. If you have prophecy, then prophesy in proportion to our faith, ministry, let us use it in our ministry. He who teaches in teaching, he who exalts in exaltation, he who gives with liberality, he who leads, you see, leading is also a grace gift that comes from performance. He leads with diligence, he who shows mercy with cheerfulness. God does not discriminate. So we've already seen the gifts of the spirit he has given to both genders. Similarly, the grace gifts, we don't see any contention about one being able to encourage. He who exalts, let him exalt. There's no question about, oh, can a man encourage or should it only be a woman who's encouraging? There's no distinction there. Similarly, why should there be a distinction when one is talking about leading? So if God enables, empowers a woman to lead a ministry or something that is calling her to do, then why not? God can grace women as well and even as we look back at history, I don't know if you have read that book, or God's generals, but it has the names of women in it. Some of the women are Catherine Gullman, maybe you can just go and read up a little bit about them. Amy Semple, MacPherson, who was an evangelist and a founder of the Four Square Church, then there is Maria Woodworth. These are all some of the women who who did some wonderful ministry for God. And of course, in our contemporary times now, there are other women that we can look at and say, hey, God has worked through them, God has ministered through their lives. So women can be in ministry, they can also be leadership. Now when it comes to the government of God, which is the family, again, there is no contention on this. The scriptures are very clear. 1 Corinthians 11-3 it says, but I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man and the head of Christ is God. The head of woman is man. So in the context of the family, yes. And again, this is like we've discussed this in our last discussion. Like the Trinity, they're all co-equal, but they live in harmony, they work in harmony with one another. Similarly, man and woman can be co-equal, but they can still play their roles in harmony with respect and dignity. So that can happen. It can very much happen. Alright, so some of the practical challenges that happen are, you know, people read these passages again where it says the head of woman is man. And they say that if there is a woman who is a minister of God and there is no man above her. Let's say she is leading the ministry. A lot of people would suggest that she come under the authority of a male minister. So something like a covering or something like a father figure who will be above the woman. Some man has got to be above that woman. So that's the understanding. However, we are quite clear that what Paul is writing here to the Corinthians it has to do with marriage. It does not have to do like if there is a woman it doesn't mean that she has to come under any man and that is how God wants it. So the women being forced to come under if they are single or let's say if they are widowed. Then being forced to follow and not to lead. These kind of things have no biblical basis. So I think we have touched on some of the key points in this chapter. So there are any thoughts, comments. We can discuss that and then we can move on to the next chapter here. So I am looking at the comments here. Say he says the calling of God does not recognize gender but a willing spirit ready to carry out God's assignment to the body of Christ. Charles, so how do we translate the culture of silence for women? How do we explain to a person who says women should not preach? Charles, I think I just talked about that. It's about the interpretation of that statement that Paul made over there and we are quite clear that he did not doesn't mean that women can't minister. In that context of the Efficient Church he told the women to be silent. The Efficient context and also the Quarantine context he tells them to be silent. So is that fine Charles? There is clarity on that? Okay, wonderful. So what we'll do is it's 9.50 already we can take a break. Let's come back. If we have anything to discuss on this subject we can discuss and then we can proceed on to our next topic. Okay, so okay everyone let's go for a break. 10 minutes. We are back at 10 a.m. Thank you.