 Meeting to order some regular scheduled meeting in the town of Berlin building your board. We have before us tonight three applications Before we start with the business of the evening and introduce ourselves Starting in the left here Tom badowski zoning administrator John Frigart member of the board Bob warning. I'm cheer the board Carl and we so Vice chair of work shame missville member of the board And we're missing one other member Who apparently had an important hockey game? And Christie don't forget and always by policy and Christie Thank you You know after about 65 you can't turn The so First application night is FL Bruce old stone products, Inc and Those of you that are interested in this application including the applicant I'm gonna swear you in fact, I'll swear everybody in tonight tends to give testimony on any one of the three Please raise your right hand Swear to tell the truth about truth the master for the board tonight under penalties of perjury. I do So I am Peter brucell from FL Bruce the stone products As you probably know Back a while ago the state of Vermont has decided to take out some ledge exit 63 Northbound Coming off into berry. I was at the last meeting to just listen to what they were proposing how much they were taking out We have been approached by probably three or four contractors who are looking to do the job And we're interested in whether we were interested in taking the material From 63 500 feet down the road right into our facility, which is the quarry Same material Would be stored on on site. This is a one-off situation We're not asking for Blanket permission to continue to take material in from everywhere We have never done it before But given the situation of location it just seemed to make sense to bring it right in and bring the same material We would stockpile it on site down in the quarry and crush it as we needed it So that's that's pretty much where we're at right now Just waiting to find out they have estimated Again state estimating somewhere about 43,000 yards roughly So we put in for 40 to 50 because we never know what they're gonna know what it's gonna actually gonna end up coming out They have estimated it would take approximately six weeks again probably six to eight weeks depending on how fast although Moving the material from right on that corner right into our quarry would probably Expeediate the process and get more vehicles back off the road and get the thing open quicker So that's what we were asking for permission to bring in that material and store it Just like we do our regular material crushed, you know would be blasted Shot rock it would be large chunks And just to store it on a facility until we have the ability to crush it and sell it as our normal product Did any of the contracts indicate to you what kind of vehicles they'd be using to move it? Nobody has yet They have there was one company do boys who has mentioned using Euclids or larger haul trucks Being that the route is going to be shut down Northbound getting off on 63 going to Southbury They intended on using that portion and conjunct with a state as a haul road to keep it off the other side and out Of all traffic and from that corner, I'm going to guesstimate until you turn into Williams Road It's probably about five to six hundred feet and then that is state land right there as you come in two-thirds of the way in to our gate and then we have a portion From the state line, which is approximately 250 feet of town road Way back into Williams Road till they turn up under our right away and come in You know one of the question is is Williams Road town road Well, there's there is but there was some question whether it was given up years ago, but it is town road, but we are required to Do all maintenance and we have for the last Since 96 done all the maintenance on the road all the watering all the upkeep all the plowing And I've confirmed that with Class 4 class 3 there's a piece of it's class 3 and then it turns to class 4 Right with that. I'm sorry The first 50 feet or so is class 3. That's actually that's actually state right away It comes in to where that there's that big turnaround area in there. You can drive by see a lot of cars parked You have a drawing here. Yeah Let's see if I have a small one here I'll pass this one This one here Yeah, that is correct As you can see back where we're East Road where our right away goes in off where East Road is That portion from the intersection back approximately two-thirds of the way is state right away where the fence is and Then what then Williams Road would be? that last To the gate right there where it turns to a class 4 where it goes into was nippling's land now It's Andrea Lettie's land One of those any class 3 or class 3. I believe a piece of it is class 3, but it quickly turns the class 4 Okay And you've worn this as a conditional use. I did and that is why This is over under the old regulations over my purview of 1500 cubic yards and the it The current regulations has some guidance on what the DRB can can do and it's over 1500 yards The proposed regulations is really silent on that So I took the worst case scenario under under the new regulations and called it a conditional use I just saw it as If it's over 1500 yards It had to be approved by the DRB didn't stand out under what criteria whether a site plan approval or correct And that's under the current regulations Doesn't speak to it at all So I That's okay. We'll review another condition. I'm not sure I'd need to be Conditional use This has addressed those criteria, so There's more having questions before we go through the criteria specifically And I do want to point out that the neighbor who couldn't be present here mr. Marple Has given us some some testimony here as well He hasn't requested party status necessarily, but he's I'm assuming by providing his testimony He'd sit on the phone. I and he's a buddy property. Yes. Yes Where's his property? It's on that back side. I believe You see a backside closer to the The town line wings down the town line He's not together Is that that little sliver of land that you and I I think it's this this that little people because the only other Unjoining landowner on that side is all the Andrea letty all the way around us. It says grease them. I Think that's his piece. Um, what's this here? I could pull it up on them David That sliver is the only one that I know of other than that's right next to our property The list of a butters Yeah Okay, I Did just didn't know where the property was. I think it's that's what we're concerned about Okay, anybody else here seeking party status Okay The This is criteria. This is this is awkward. I apologize. We're sort of doing this on two-second-sever regulations as you know It's gonna be shut down completely right from what I understand for the last meeting with this with the v-trans They're gonna shut they're gonna do rolling stops from southbound on to exit six and But anything northbound on that corner coming off The northbound lane is going to be shut down for the duration Yeah, so there'd be nobody exiting that exit except the trucks that would go to your court. That's it And going down along the side of the road and then directly right into our property So our current regulations say that the board shall consider the contours the land before and after the fill And and you're not really filling per se. You're temporarily storing correct And I'm gathering you're gonna store it within the existing quarry area. Yes So it won't look a lot different than what you blast and crush. It'll be basically the same material. Yeah It's about to be brought in and you were specific about that you're asked for 50,000 if the state's Estimating 43, but we figured we'd go for 50. Yeah, just to make sure and that That we that's that's exclusively ledge. Yes. Is there any topsoil? There is some overburden on there when they strip it and trees No one has talked to us about that We we really don't want to get into that the tree portion of it if there is some overburden and that is offered at the time If we take it we certainly would work along these lines, but our intent does not to take it at this point I think the concern of mr. Marple here is the overburden and if it's but there's any contamination. I think he specifically we talked about a Toe petroleum hydrocarbon TPH, you know, if there's any spills or anything like that If if you're not going to take it, I think that would go a long way to addressing his concerns is say with that You're not going to take it. I haven't heard you say that you're going to take it. No, okay Turned in no one has brought it to our attention or even really offered that portion We really don't want to start storing all this other overburden material and stuff We just want the ledge to bring in and my senses of any any overburden that they do have probably stockpile and reuse it for Contours for addressing it off afterwards probably So for this for the purpose of this application, we're assuming you're not a survey overburden just a ledge correct That should simplify because I would not think that the conditions the concerns that the opportunity that the mr. Marble has Marple Marble Yeah, we'd only be in the overburden He he said he was not concerned with the over but the shot rock he was concerned with the the so Truck traffic including the need for road crews and traffic control I think again your understanding is there that that will be closed off correct There will be traffic coming in from Northbound I Southbound Yes From my my understanding what the state's talking about doing that's just the northbound exit the northbound ramp will be closed Correct, but Southbound will probably remain open. So somebody will be coming down There to you right they'll coming from the corner down into our court But they're talking about working with the state to some sort of haul road off the off to one side on the state property That hall would be literally on state property but if it's not the contractor would provide We you know if it's a the private you mentioned do boys if they're awarded that contract they would provide traffic control It's not nothing under purview that you're you're agreeing to do traffic controls, right? We are not right whoever does come to us if they get the contract and if they offer this material to us We want to do a contract with the contractor that does state that they are responsible for traffic control and dust control outside of our exact quarry and having written Specifications like this and work on projects specifically is like the state Economist guarantee that those would be conditions the contract They'll have to provide traffic control to deal with that northbound traffic and obviously any repairs to the interest the 63 would also be a problem That's why I was asking about the town road issue because if there are repairs necessary to the town road That's a concern to me And we would want to know who's going to be responsible for any repairs to the town road, right? Well that will be addressed as far as when they come in where that short portion of the town road is They would be responsible with that through us We would make sure that they're responsible for maintaining that portion as well as retain up fixing the portion from our gate Into our quarry whatever damage is done from all the truck traffic They'll be responsible to fix as well. I did speak to the road foreman And he said historically that these folks did all the maintenance the quarry did all the maintenance on on the road and Especially when when frost is coming out Tim left me the pressure that they do a fairly decent job We've been doing it since 96 ever since we opened up But I think in terms of this permit we'd have to place the responsibility on the applicant The applicant can delegate that responsibility to the contractor As far as the Williams Road portion the town portion of Williams Road because you're the applicant I think we'd have to allocate that I mean you're welcome to delegate it But the question that that now this brings up Town roads of the purview of the select board would they need to give some sort of Approval of these trucks over this town road. Yeah, you basically have a weight limit on town roads So the trucks would need to get a Low permit, yeah something so that's something else that well that would actually be up to whoever the contractor is to get The permission to go on town roads. I wouldn't be up to us It's Well, I'm kind of asking the question and wondering here. Yeah, I would If it was if it was me doing this I if I were you I would go get that that Approval from from the town and you know you have it and then you can go to these contracts and say I already have this approval Something else you have to worry about. I don't think it's I don't think it's going to be an issue But it's it is a select board decision not not this board's decision Although I think we can make it a condition. Yeah that the that you obtain approval from the select board For the use of the town road portion Again, it should not be a problem but it's just it's It's out of our purpose to say, you know, yes or no on the road I think what you do is you're going to seeking working in the town right away permit That's all it is for the duration of this project Okay, so whoever the cut whoever's got the job would have to do that Well, we'd have to get the permit since I mean, it's really not our job It's not our I mean our it's not our project. So I'm just curious how that's all going to transpire Where I would approach it from the DRB point of view is that a permit it will be required Okay, okay, and then who gets it. Okay, that's what I wanted But they can't start hauling to your right to that permits have been acquired by either yourself or the contractor, okay? My sense is it would be the contractor because I think anytime they use Overway trucks like that they're they're accustomed to doing that They're trucks their registrations that could be on the permits We can't grant that permit that's like what has So that speaks to the condition before and after of the road to be used And And the days the week and hours of operation No one's gotten into that yet I'm assuming at this point in time it'd be probably a Monday through Friday or Monday through Saturday I don't assume they're gonna work on a Sunday. I Don't know what the state's really working out with what they're gonna allow them to do We only are open Monday through Friday, so that's my intent is nothing on Saturdays My sense is they'll want to the halls Contract will specify they don't have that exit only closed so long, right? They go smoothly Five days a week. It does go smoothly. They'll do it seven days a week It's not a So and the hours would be 10-hour days so or do you want to Reconsider the hours for this or you saying it's Monday through Friday, and that's what our permit. Oh, I hate to sound stupor But that's what my brother said. He's gonna be there Monday to Friday But we can we can reconsider the hours and extend it if needs be I'd rather If that's a possibility to extend it What what what you think you think you may possibly need because it's just come back. Yeah, so let's let's I Let's call it six to six Six days a week Monday through Saturday It's you know when you get there down to it's not that many truck loads For day it's about a hundred a day But it'd be more than that because the effort we concentrated toward the latter part of the six weeks That are yeah part, but it's it's you're talking about a hundred trucks a day sounds like a lot a lot Compared to what you're hauling now, but It's a short haul. Oh, yeah. Yeah, there's they'll be back around in, you know, another 15 minutes Today they don't Typically not you're basically working with ledge and you're working with ledge on an elevation Scaling it off. It's I don't you could do night work, but they From my brother six o'clock and nothing after six I guarantee that Okay, I Would suggest we terms of the day as the week we say six days a week and we'd say The emphasis will be I'm not keeping that I think they were estimating six weeks, which I think is pretty aggressive, but Those are the criteria. We have one of the old regulations And the new criteria are less specific to the field and they're just general criteria And I believe you addressed those in your application to Junot. Yes The first criteria is the capacity of community and facility utilities And it really talks about schools. It's the public works type of thing. I spoke to To Chief Wolf, he didn't have any concerns. I spoke at length to to Tim Davis the road foreman That's when he mentioned that they the town really doesn't doesn't do any maintenance on that road he really Leaves it up to the quarry to do and he's he's been satisfied with that So he said he was okay with it and I spoke to a fire chief to frame His all they concerned was was traffic and I think you guys may have addressed that already Well, this is the applicant points out as the We're all better off if all the traffic terminates right by the quarry as opposed to going elsewhere Anywhere else in town Terms of traffic impacts all over the traffic impacts would presumably be on state highway system State to deal with the portion where it's the opposite portion impacts the town roads and and and there's no other uses on that town road Other than yourself, right the Anybody stop me if they have additional questions or want to pursue this further the Traffic Can we talk about that? Traffic being generated will be basically 3,000 truck trips and that's assuming the 15-yard truck I was gonna say depending on what they use for vehicles. Yeah, that's why I asked that question earlier They use you let's say he says you still be more now. Yeah. Yeah, so it could be less trucks large roads which With short trips like that you can make a lot of sense And one of the contractors have mentioned come in with all trucks So the traffic will be restricted traffic impacts would be restricted to the short stretch of road Maybe other questions on traffic And there's other criteria into traffic, but I think that addresses pretty much all of it The mitigation of traffic Impacts that's really the requirement to for traffic control and And I'm confident the state will require that Any permit that they issue ready contract the issue All traffic control issues would be restricted to state highway system character the area and obviously character the areas Pardon me Yeah, I mean it's it's it's a quarry now that we have that we've opened in 96 Looks like the all the setbacks are fine. There's no no problem there The storage is completely on the site out of public view No change of the use actually others far as type of material it's 100 feet away of what they're taking down as opposed to what we already have Natural resource protection We have any sensitive natural resources that might be adversely impacted by this They're using the existing all-hall roads. They're using Existing for each space to to temporarily store this material. I don't I haven't found any Impacts And it's your testimony that you're not accepting topsoil or Overburden correct Energy conservation Apricot must demonstrate the proposed development will not reduce solar access and I think you basically Said that For an energy conservation point of view from my perspective is short truck trips are a much better than small truck and And it's really Get for the standards here that are applicable The comments by the applicant we do have this figure 4.04 Yeah I want to talk to you have the planning commission about that But we do have this figure That's that's the one that says you must hear this criteria which we interface the same criteria as earlier That's what I mentioned It's page of 14 4-13 It's really is is the administrative proceed. It's in administrative procedures and I want to take a hard look at that Because I think having standards in administrative procedures and it is inappropriate Especially since they're redundant with the standards we have elsewhere and so What we discovered last time Carla was that This is this table here it says basically the process for reviewing issuing a decision must be the same for the original we limited to the Yeah, this is just a this would just be a Visual right because the same which which standards apply to which application? Yes So it's not really It's different order and wording So that it's not clear which one Findings If we went by this It would be in a different order and wording would be different than if you went by this So I think we go by that That's that was my thought And I think this these were designed more to be Considerations to be For ease of use So those are inaccurate that we have to go with what's in the actual Standards they don't actually contradict each other. They just say it differently, right? I Think this is more like for Because we try to make it user-friendly So for an applicant to be able to see what applies to what criteria is and that certain things I think then the disadvantages their application will be in this order where we're viewing in the other order Yeah, we'll have to clarify it Does say the development work shit may issue separate it basically says we have to find these you know, but Really if I read it wouldn't it's correct. I think this is what we're guided by so I'm not gonna go through these additional We are setting probably wrong. They're setting precedent here. That's all we need to do I think so and I think It's one of those things we may want to tweak later on one of the difficulties and always having covered in the same area So same territory twice in the same ordinance is even if you have identical to begin with later on a shift That precedent will help to other applications tonight. Yes Okay, so If there are no other comments we made with regard to this I would entertain motion to adjourn Summits, yeah during the hearing portion of this here Most been made in a second. It's a discussion on motion Hearing none. All those in favor of that motion please please signify by saying aye. Thank you very much Thank you. Thank you As you know probably our procedure will be to issue written findings After that chance to review the materials, so it won't be necessary Okay, I would encourage you to probably proceed to get on this whiteboards agenda. Okay They meet the first and third Thursdays of the month first and third Thursdays of the month. Yes The agenda is not that full this Thursday. All they have to do is pick a school board member How do we That's just to get the approval I'll say honestly Thank you very much Okay, the next application we have I don't understand this one at all We will start I understand why it's conditional use What if I ask you? Yes, hello by yourself My name is a manual diamant and I recently moved to Vermont And I am trying to establish This parcel that I purchased from Sandy vitz tomb when she's subdivided Bartlett Hill and Trying to you know, eventually hopefully make it into a single family dwelling and the conditional use would be just part of my incremental plan to eventually get the property to a Single family dwelling so this would just be kind of a stepping stone. I don't intend to it for it to be The end goal I intend for it just to be a short-term Condition until I Get the septic system and also the well. There's already electricity on site And just and just really trying to get those other two pieces And my hope is that this summer would be the time to complete that according to Craig Chase's plan for the septic and also Benadini Quoted me 8,000 for the well and I think total, you know to get everything Needed for zoning for a single family dwelling. It would probably take an extra $28,000 at this point and that's that's what I'm planning on doing this summer And then I would come to hopefully again to the zoning to have another application submitted and then update from a camp to The dwelling so this is this is really just your your goal is to put a single family dwelling on this Absolutely. Yeah, and I really want to You know use this parcel just as I mean this lands been practically untouched for quite some time So I really want to make it reflect the other dwellings in the area I know that's around me that there's a lot of other single family dwelling So I don't want to have this be like the one camp, you know for a long period of time this would be short-term and Again, I just you know, I want to be very transparent and honest When I was first looking at the zoning laws last year the camping Designation and timeline was a little bit different when I was talking with Tom And it made a little bit more sense to have that six months out of the year to you know Work on the property sleep there get the you know, get the kitchen all done Get the get the bathroom all finished, you know until the property was up to snow So I I'm trying to save money and I'm trying to do the work myself So that's part of the reason I would like to have it as a camp as well as I want to not I don't want to Dwell there and not have it be You know under under some type of like permit at this point in time is for a primitive camp Yeah, it can't primitive. Yeah, okay Primitive or otherwise most people There's a difference. Yeah, the so I'm gonna ask you Tom. I mean camps are permitted In this zone, it's a real residential zone In the new regulations in the new regulations that are listed permitted in in In the current regulations, there's listed places for camps. I think it's only in Highland conservation In the current in the current regulations, yeah, I think there was a I think that was a change from last year Yeah, potentially, so that's why I was my actually had my application drafted for September of last year And then like between, you know winter and everything. I mean it kind of got around to it now And so and these new regulations talk about Camp site camp grounds primitive camp camps and It's listed neither as a as a permit or a conditional use in Rl 40, I think it is Yeah, the residential district It basically Not residential. It's it's Rl 40. Well, I'll 40. Yeah, I'll 40 Obviously single-family dwellings are permitted uses Why only permission from a zoning? Yeah, I find nothing that says a Camp requires conditional use. It's a temporary single-family dwelling Did this camp to find elsewhere in this they talk about primitive camps. Let me find it here is page 351 let's see So the issue is living there well being built correct without any without any approved safety system But we don't have a certificate of occupancy. Do we? So, how would we know if someone was because someone called me and said he was That's why well, and you know, I there's nothing in here that precludes out If I mean you could grant it just could you not grant him a single-family permit? Correct without without living there Nothing says you can't live there. You can tend to out on the property for you know while we care, right? I'm just hold on. Let me find it here camping units a resident may locate. This is page 3-2. I'm sorry Resident may locate not more than three camping units campers trailers trailers RVs cabins lean twos on his or her residential properties be used for non-commercial Recreational purpose such units must not be occupied more than 90 days in any calendar year. That's what I'm putting this under See, I don't I disagree with that. It's not a camping unit. He's building a house. He's gonna live in He's living in a well. Is there do you have a party there now? No, so the intention would be to use gender on Building for the concrete Jean Bowen has agreed to do the excavation The builders are from Derby, Vermont They're up north and they're gonna be helping me with the structure and they're gonna source the wood and It's a you know the the building plan the site is for 500 square foot Cabin, it's it's a really small modest structure and I hope to grow it and put it You know do an additional zoning application for a deck and a mud room and The one that's approved right now is for the shed. So that's the only thing that's really You know been approved as the shed right now and and it's a 10 by 14 And then the thing that's I'm trying to get approved is a 14 by 40 cabin with a full Foundation basement and it's a full full concrete base Well, that's the that's the overall schedule I would hope for to follow Craig chases When would you intend to have this structure in a position where you'd actually stay in it? I would hope you know if if if this conditional use and I really wanted to you know follow I Didn't know that there was a possibility of having the two years maybe like with the single family dwelling the reason I'm asking the question is Are you gonna be living there longer than 90 days before you have septic in a well? So I have other places that I can stay You know within Montpellier within Barry and I you know again, I've moved here since last year I've been working for the state of Vermont and You know I this is I came all the way from Pennsylvania and this has been like kind of my dream is to build a home in You know in Vermont and we discussed that and so our conversation was he thought that he would live He could eat 90 days was was livable for him So the reason I I mean the intent of that obviously is that people don't put Multiple I mean I just I don't view this as the intent if you're building a home. I agree with you Carla I think if you start putting up campers and campers But it but it's but it limits this is just three campers So one is less than well that's because then it becomes a campground I think or something if there's more than three But one is permitted under this criteria. The only thing is that that may be shaky is 90 days And so for 2018 you can argue my interpretation 90 consecutive days It's calendar days 90 days in an Could he stay at a friend's house on day 89? No, it's not get second. It's 90 calendar. Well 90 calendar No, it's in any calendar Yeah It's raised the concern of a neighbor for whatever it's worth I like I personally don't think this is necessary But we warned it. We're here Let's do it Okay That's all right Would it be better if I did another application just for the single family and then I had the two years to build because I mean I don't want to make things harder for myself if I'm already trying to you know get everything up to snuff and I don't think you could live on the property without a septic system functioning septic system. He's got water and he's got a composting He doesn't have it yet Well, there's already composting. There's already a composting toilet on site. There's already electricity on site It's really it's really a matter of you know, I don't there's no water there And there's no septic system and that's going to be the $28,000 investment that's scheduled for this summer So that's kind of like the missing piece and why I really thought the camp was the most appropriate designation right now as it stands Because those things are just you know the way we can calm the neighbors town and yeah But what what's what we're in? does a conditional use allow for more than 90 days it doesn't In other words, I don't see a procedure it does not it this primitive camp is is a This section 3003a page 3.2 90 days in any calendar year So if he had desert or if his application was for a single family dwelling that he had two years to make Is the 90 days still apply Not you you can take two years to build it. You can't live on the property and not have a septic system That's that's what it says to me. Maybe I'm wrong here. You've got to convince me that I guess I'm wrong here I honestly don't think our regulations speak to that It clearly says you can't stay in a in an RV or cabin or lean to uh More than 90 days in any calendar year After that it but it doesn't say what you need to do to do more than that Correct. You just don't you you then become you come into violation and we and we're trying to avoid that That's what this whole thing is I don't see where Something other than this is permittable Under as a conditional use in other words, we're in conditional use criteria I don't think you're asking for anything other than that. You're you're you're at You're approving this primitive camp in this in this district, which doesn't allow camps That's what you're doing doesn't allow camps or doesn't Do any of them say camps the Current regulations do in highland conservation So is it just considered a the current ones say in highland conservation? Oh, we don't have I mean the I mean the new ones I'm sorry. Oh, yeah, there's nothing I don't believe they talk about camp rounds and such So there's no if it's not listed wouldn't it simply be It's it's it and under our regulations if it's not listed and the applicant can come to the to the to this board and make the argument that what his use is is is Uh Of the same general character of those permitted or allowed as conditional uses in in the zoning district And will not be detrimental to other uses within the district and the adjoining land uses this drb may Grant a conditional use to that effect I'm applying to proceed okay, sorry And administratively I think I think we're we've got ourselves a weird one I did And so the real question is is there any harm in in granting it as a conditional use It is similar to the other uses permitted And I think the only issue really is is is how long will It stay this way before it becomes A primary residence correct and he makes an application and gets a permit for a primary residence right So let me ask you that question. How long before you tend to have a primary residence up there I would hope by the end of summer that's um part of With the questions in the application that you know, I tried to address that is You know by the end of summer, I would hope that the septic system and the well are completed You know again, I'm putting the money that I'm earning right now towards towards the 20,000 That would be needed to get the property, you know, right where it needs to be Again electricity on site, you know, the guy From a efficiency brahman is going to do the blower door test Next week. So again trying to make sure it's energy efficient things like that. So Yeah, so Okay, um, well Unless the board disagrees with me, I'm going to go through the conditional use criteria And And so my understanding is your your your your intent before next next winter To basically have a residence there. Exactly. Yeah, so I would owe a limitation of 90 days limitation of Six months would not be a problem That would not be an issue. No, I'm confused. Is this their structure there now? So Right now somebody do a blower test So so trying to get the property, you know, and the structure that's, you know, up to up to A code. I don't want anything that's on there not to be so you mean the shed We're not the shed. This would be for trying. It's like a modular structure that again that this camp is trying to really get Approved right now for so it's there already. It's just it's just a little cabin. Yep. Okay What what the structure he's he's that's different than what I know then because that's Anyways that structure was never permitted, but There's a shed there now that was there the shed is permitted. Yep. And there's a second Structure there now That's What that's what I'm trying to get approved right now. Yeah, so but if that's and if that's if that's an issue I mean again, I can Yeah, we just need to know what's the foundation is here now. Yeah foundation you're asking for a permit to build this structure this camp as a temporary Living residence at this time as you get your permit for for residence. Exactly. Yes I think the the the issue really then Comes the judgment call comes on the board. How long do we allow it to exist Without having a permit as a primary residence? I think it can go into perpetuity as long as it's he doesn't occupy it more than 90 days in any calendar year I think what you're if he doesn't He doesn't like to buy more 90 days doesn't even need to be there every year. He does. It's a camp. It's a camp It's not approved in this In this zoning district. So you guys are approving this camp that he can use for 90 days Whenever he comes in for his single family home, it's really I don't think it's it's germane because that's because it's under the current Regulations under the new regulations. I don't think he needs this approval I do but you do. Yeah. Yeah, because it's not specifically permitted. Is that what you're saying? It's It's this I read it before it's 90 days without having a septic and A permit it's an active septic septic system I see both. Yeah, I see it under both regulations 90 days it's gonna be June It's but yeah, but he it's that's an occupation if he if he's staying with a friend Four days out of the week and only staying up there two days only two days have counted towards his 90 days Well, that's what I was getting at earlier the consecutive days thing In a year calendar year, okay Where I was going with that makes sense. So so you're saying it's conditional use because It's permitted but it's necessary permitted in this district I believe this the RV this board has the ability to grant a conditional use for things that are Are of the genes the same general character that was permitted and not detrimental to other uses page 2.2 It's the exact same language in the in the current regulations as it is in the new New regulations the exact same language So I think you have the ability to grant a conditional use of a camp a primitive camp Here with these restrictions that have not occupied For more than 90 days in any calendar year Rather than the study the technical calendar is this good I think we beat it And and and you because it is condition use we have to actually condition use criteria That's what the application is for yes to basically have primitive camp. Yes in this zone. Yes And The only thing it isn't mentioned in your application is a period for what period of time And you're saying it's indebted as long as he never never never exceeds 90 days in the year I believe he would be in Compliance with the town of berlin regulations under that that could be indebted camp As long as in any calendar year doesn't occupy it for more than 90 days. Okay The capacity of the community facilities and utilities I spoke to Chief wolf. He didn't have a problem. I spoke to the foreman Um Tim davis he had no issue with that and chief deframing had no calling on This lot already has a curb cut permit. It does So impact on schools, please transportation It was obviously anticipated for in the subdivision We the red text here That's his that's the application response Anybody have any problem with capacity of the community facilities? No, because that is a different issue. Yeah, it really is Municipal services impact evaluation. I don't think we need a municipal service impact evaluation. You have spoken to those two authorities The traffic I I it's not applicable in a single family dwelling type traffic Traffic impacts to you know Mitigation I don't believe any mitigation is required In this case There will be equipment Working there, but that's that's just typical that's typical residential. Yeah Okay, the impact on the character of the area It's residential Yeah before sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt All right I was just going to say yeah That was one of the big things before I had purchased the property again I before I even purchased this piece of property I was looking at other pieces of property and I found out what was 95 wetlands So I made sure to get a certified person from the conservation Or you know just to that's a certified I guess wetlands Surveyor his name is Alan quack and bush and then DeWolf engineers Brian link harness They did, you know, they went over to make sure that the land use and that's not going to infringe on any sort of You know like environmental Restrictions within the parcel or within the property. So it's probably more appropriate than an actual resource protection section the Concern I think in this case here is it's really speaking to other uses in the area With with your your proposed use have an adverse impact on other uses in the area In and I would find that probably it's a simple use It's it's ultimately it tends to be residential full-time residential temporary residential in the short term The natural resource protection and this this site has already been approved for subdivision. It's already been subdivided It is you point out there are wet soils there that will be addressed in your design of your Your system. Yeah, there's no wetlands on the area. It's not designated within the the current map as a wetlands Restricted area. It's just something I really took an interest in before I purchased the property because I didn't want to get something that couldn't be used for a single family dwelling because That was one of my concerns You know when when you're getting a deal on a piece of property that's vacant. I was wondering if there was any catch you know, so The um And you looked at the natural resources atlas to see if there are any Rare and dangerous species there and yeah, there's none of that as far as the designation of the property the closest Hazard would be on dog river road just the flood plain Coming up that coming up towards the hill and that's the closest thing is just In previous years there's been water that's come off Um from dog river road that you know, I'm sorry. I'm not good at geography What's the river right that goes through Montpellier? I should know this Yeah, when the screw river so when you screw river sometimes would overflow, but that was the closest thing as far as Um, anything close to the property. There's no endangered species or Flood plain or anything like that Inflammable regulations And that's really It's your decision. Yeah, yeah You have the ability to And conditions of I um I see no problem in terms of the uh, I can just use standards. I think uh Do you have any questions about So is this primitive camp thing? Is this a state wastewater designation thing or something? Is this a state statute? That's re-referencing here by chase chase. Yes. Yeah It basically says that Composting toiletry state doesn't have any of you are It does they accept the technology it does reduce the so the septic is actually pretty generous It's a four bedroom two bath. I mean again, this is like a 500 square foot cabin with a basement underneath So, you know You know, I don't have any kids right now. So this would be You know just me and my wife just trying to Get this property for us and it's pretty modest so The what but what the um compost can do is it says in I printed out the uh guidelines that apparently can it can reduce the septic System up to 25 percent So I don't know how much that would impact the property, but I mean it just yeah, maybe unless you have to build. Yeah You know Your intent to ultimately get an approved on-site war and wastewater. Yeah, absolutely And your intent is to to conference that sometime Before this stifle lies next winter. I would hope absolutely. Yeah Um There are hearing no other questions No other comments Motion made it to close the hearing Seconded discussion Overfair that motion, please Hi Thank you You're welcome. Thank you very much. Appreciate your time Please You bring your uproach to I almost would have liked that but it was I was really nervous coming in so to like kind of see everybody else go through it Okay You don't have to be nervous Well, if anybody's nervous as us because we're trying to copy with new regulations, which we haven't really fanned through here yet And as we're going we're already finding. Yeah Colleges or parent glitches We haven't worked through You know several people see the stable were instrumental in putting all together So So, um, we have uh, once you do us a favor and um and explain your application I looked at it. I think I understand it. But why don't you tell us what you're proposing to do here? Um, I'm proposing uh, dog daycare slash boarding or a kennel Yeah I think of housing um up to 10 including my own so There'd be a fenced in area. Yep. A fenced in area in the back. Do you have uh Structure for the dogs to stay in Just in the house So they would not stay out in the kennel area. No, it was just to be a fenced in Dog run dog run. Yeah Actual pets will be kept inside it. Yes Well, are you keeping them overnight or is it just during the day? Both both. So it will be boarding and daycare. Yep Is there any behind this anywhere? Just from our country animal hospital off the uh, south world tonight You know nice little niche business I mean there used to be a place in Northfield. We used to be a place in in my payer and I feel that's what the place in Northfield might still be there Think driving to norwich. I see something that says kennel Oh, okay. Yeah, I think the sign's just there You're someone in the northeast king too But a lot of people now, uh, uh, that's it. So It's what we do Yeah So the only thing you're proposing to construct here really is the fenced in the area to run The use use two additional parking spaces Of she's got a letter of intent from the trans they're going to require to widen the Driveway really? They didn't want They they didn't want To a car coming out of a car turning in to to to hold up traffic on group two So they wanted enough so one could get in one get out That's on route two or route 12 route 12 Okay, well, it's uh I guess Basically, there's going to be parking for a couple of people to come and stop and two and two additional parking spaces widening of the entrance And the fence run which you said is what dimension 30 by 40 And that fence run will be behind the house. Yep existing house and And you also mentioned screening that you want to build some put some shrubs bushes things like that just to kind of Be a buffer on the north side on the north side. Yeah, I mean I'm south side Well, the south side faces the river. I mean there's nothing really over there. She has a drawing here If you want to open up for that there's the rogers farm is on the other side of the river, but I think you were talking on either end of this Yeah, more so on this side. I think that's the north side just because we have neighbors right here and there Yeah, that's the worst side Yeah, the south side faces the river. Yeah, but that's I still could it's also very visible from the route 12 Would that be a reason to put some sort of It's a candle. Yeah Where were you thinking about putting the screen just on the Just on the north side, but I could do both. I mean I love to do that Yeah And kennel is mentioned as a conditional use correct specifically identify the conditioners in the in the Appending in appending correct. Yeah, which I I'm assuming by now they're worried about Oh, well, you never know um the uh so this is a conditional use So going through the conditional use criteria which You addressed the old criteria But they're not that dissimilar. No um, so let me ask You've you've got your written test on that Let me go through the new criteria. They are they're very similar in nature. There's a few different order stuff like that so Capacity of the community facility and utilities and impacts on police fire schools I chief wolf. I said there was no issue. You got the v-trans letter of intent. So they didn't have an issue uh Chief to frayne commented that About traffic and I told him that he wasn't privy to the v-trans letter of intent. I I explained them how They were going to have to be required to uh widen their their driveway Entrance and he thought that was a fight. Your brain was concerned about traffic. Yeah He's a fire chief. Yeah Yeah Accidents accidents, yeah People do move right along there The um, uh traffic We're not talking a reasonable number. You're talking about uh, the maximum of 10 dogs By the way, I want before I lose this observation. I noticed that permitted our horse But frogs aren't permitted I was going to ask the planning commission why were horses okay and dogs were Trust me we had some people that did not want us to allow dog kennels. Really We um We didn't send out notices to all the neighbors we did. Yeah And did you get any feedback? None. And we have nobody here interested in this Couple of children Ready to go home Okay, uh, so we're talking to very minimal traffic increase Um character the area There is largely agriculture in nature Residential agriculture in nature. I don't necessarily see this as a problem They butt up against the river. Yeah Actually butts up on the river against the river in three sides. Yes Two sides anyway The um Natural resources As you point out this floodplain, but you're not putting this in the floodplain, right the uh So I don't I don't see that that's an issue The character the area we just covered that. Um energy conservation We're going to have tread melt for the Swimming lessons Okay, um So energy conservation you will not reduce solar access to anyone So they use of energy efficiency motor transportation. I can read that in there. Okay walking biking transit you do point out that The delivery and pickup of the animals probably won't involve pedestrians and it probably won't involve bicycles Great That would be a fun sight. That led to you Well, there is there is There is some some bicycle traffic on route 12 despite the fact you've got no shoulder No, but with a dog You haven't seen anybody Bicycling basically with a dog I guess they don't need a bikepack Uh So just looking for overlap between the two sets of criteria I don't see any additional Uh, except for the landscaping that's not mentioned is that mentioned in ours New ones and then one tight in 10 No, isn't about any about landscape interesting other than the character of the area It is on that Figure yeah for see that that figure four is applicable to both site plan and Some are some are you have to they're checked. Yes, it depends on which one's correct. Yeah, you know And but uh, so let's let's The only thing I think I'm a little bit loose on is Whatever you say is what it is. Uh, you landscape you're gonna put up shrubs. Where? Well on this north What is that? The north end of the kennel. Yeah, yeah anywhere that you know, like it could be facing Neighbors, that's not north. That's south This way. No, it's north. You were pointing to the south end top Which the side toward me is the way the photo is presented the north. The north is the side toward me Okay, that's where that's with that. Okay, and that's where you're proposing. Yeah, and you're proposing putting plant shrubs here Yeah, okay There is already a tree there. Um, I'm able to treat but just on the corner so we could do a lot more Does anybody feel any more landscaping is required than that? What kind of fancy are you going to use? Metal chain link No wire Chicken well stronger than that Turkey. Yeah What is that double layered? So it'll be a fence post and line We have an application I have a question that isn't really talked about in here. Are you actually creating a business? To run out of here. Yeah, okay. So does that require you to? Maintain like the criteria on the dogs themselves their shots rabies vaccines all these things that you're having it can yeah So you wouldn't I would eat insurance necessarily know Whether they were up the date or not or registered or any of that I would know Yeah, because you know ahead of time, you know, they provide it when they drop the dog off I work at a doggie daycare as well. So that's kind of what I'm basing things off So you'd have the same criteria at your place. Yeah Yeah, all the ones I've done to you have to provide evidence of certain vaccines and etc before like Taking these up the dog I was just asking They're too expensive I have two of them it's too much per day On route 12 Yes, because one thing you might want the hours if you're actually going to take dogs overnight That's 24 hours. So you might want to change your hours to well, I wouldn't be accepting people Past 8 p.m. But the dogs will be there. Right. So the business is really going to operate 24 and 67. That's what I would just change that Okay And I guess I guess the I'm not sure we would actually keep the dogs inside the night This is probably won't keep 10 all night But yeah Yeah Anything else No, I have nothing else So I'll move to close this hearing as well. So yeah most have been made in a second to close the hearing Discussion that motion Oh, isn't fair that motion. He's going to probably say hi. Hi Well, we would explain to best just the process. Okay. Yeah This is recorded Actually two ways on orca you can watch this yourself at home later on With the boys I try not to it seems embarrassing I forget the camera's there. That's really good. Yeah, yeah The um, but it normally that'll normally take the better part of two months a month and a half So, uh, because minutes have to be approved That won't they won't be approved till the next meeting I invest and then the the actual findings have to be redrafted and reviewed and so forth That takes some time, but we will issue written findings. Those written findings will be our decision Um So from our from your perspective, it's only a matter of time because they'll be here is really setting the negative about your project Is that in the mail that it's sent or it'd be sent to mail, but actually do it electronically to you and I'll send you Um, a little yellow poster that you put up when you're going to start this this stuff. Okay, so the um And from here on in if you have any questions, just just go back to tom. He'll help how we're progressing if there's some issues here Yeah But uh There's one where you will take a little bit of time. Okay We're all apart sort of part time Yeah, no I wasn't sure how long it would take. I wasn't sure if it was like immediately or if it's A process. No, it doesn't happen. Yeah, that's what I was It'll be findings. There may be some conditions in the findings Um, they'll probably mention the the landscaping that you want in the hours of the day Those will be a part of the application. Therefore, they'll be part of the permit. Okay Which is why carla pointed out 24 7 on the uh dogs Thank you Hope you had fun mom did good didn't she