 Senator McDonnell, why don't you give us a little overview on S276, because we'll get some of our thoughts. I want to get this in before 12 o'clock. So give us a little overview about your S276, please, about driver's elderly renewal operators license. The S276 would oblige people 75 and older when they go to renew their licenses to take a driver's test. It would be the same driver's test that we took when we were 15 or 16 back in those days. And if you pass the test, you get to renew your license. That's basically what the bill does. It was prompted for older, you'd have to day or 75, you have to take the written exam and the road exam. No, you would, you would take the driver's test on on the road behind the wheel drivers test when you went to renew a license when your renewal came up after you were 75 years old. For not the written test just the road test or not the road test road test. So it comes out. I'd be scared to do the written test today. Well, no, I'm just trying to get it clear. Okay, so good question, Mr. Chair, everybody would be the road test that you were obliged to do. I put the bill in because of an unfortunate case where someone who was friends and family suggested that they no longer drive drove and hit a neighbor. Didn't even know it went home and it was a death resulting. Just to stick to statistics prove that 75 is the number or 60 or 25 or 40. They know more than that. No more than the 18 or 16. It's an arbitrary number that is picked. So driver's license for a four year license for two years or every get when they have to at 75 go in or they wait to that license expires. And when they were up for a normal renewal, they would be obliged to take a road test. We had a similar bill that was introduced by Senator Clarkson, and we did get data at that time relative to the incidents of accidents. And so I can't read. I don't remember off the top of my head the details, but it did not indicate the that actually the number of accidents was relatively low and that was attributed to driving less not driving at night and probably not driving as fast but we did take testimony on a similar bill earlier. Okay. That's my been my understanding and my experience that older drivers are more cautious. I look twice to the right now and twice to the left they used to look once each way. I don't drive my skills aren't as good as they used to be. When we lose our skills were usually if there's no age in which they go, they go faster for some of us and they come later for others. So that's the idea behind the bill and I thank you very much for the opportunity to present. I appreciate that. Okay, and the year with us this morning but basically it's what the senator has said about the bill is anything different that you found. That's what I would have said. So I'm here if you have questions but there will be any for me. So we do have, I'd like to get that in this morning someone from ARP I believe with us this morning. They have asked to testify will will do some briefings here and we always get back to it but I just want to get some of these folks that we've scheduled so We'll leave the end be the last. Sorry about that but is Greg March on or from here and chairman I'm right here. Thank you. Okay, good. Yeah, why don't you give us your quick overview at this point before we go any further. Yeah, thank you. Thanks very much. Chairman Mazan members of the committee for the opportunity to testify before you this morning at ARP does support safety for all drivers on the road and we just want folks to know that age itself doesn't cause car crashes. ARP policy supports effective evidence based assessment models to identify at risk drivers of all agents. While staying local government should ensure that all drivers regardless of their age meet the minimum physical requirements and conditions to safely operate a vehicle. ARP wants all drivers to be treated equally renewal policy should be evidence based such as functional assessments for vision hearing and cognitive abilities and not age based many older drivers continue to be safe and responsible drivers at any age frankly can have physical and cognitive that would preclude them from safe driving and therefore ARP supports again this evidence based assessments for all drivers regardless of age. Testing is a highly imperfect litmus test where a driver would either pass or fail. Instead vision or on road and performance and other assessment tools should be used by the DMV to identify potentially at risk drivers and then put in place the appropriate set of restrictions and remediations to help older drivers compensate for functional impairment. Under Vermont's proposed legislation an older driver could fail a vision test and have to permanently retire from driving even if the solution were as simple as getting their car racks removed. Decisions about driving should be made on a case by case basis and not simply on chronological age. A recent study by the National Transportation Safety Board founded that speeding was the main factor and 31% of all traffic fatalities. That's nearly the same excuse me the same percentage of fatalities that are caused by intoxicated drivers. So now we're improving for drivers age 70 to 79 according to the study by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety. Drivers in this age range are now less likely to be involved in a fatal crash than drivers between 34 and 54. Drivers in their 70s also have fewer police reported crashes per mile traveled than middle age drivers. In 2019 the Institute for Highway Safety also reported that motor vehicle crashes accounted for less than 1% of fatalities among people 70 and older. People ages 70 and older are less likely to be licensed to drive compared to younger people and driver 70 and older also drive fewer miles. However, older drivers keeping their licenses longer and driving more miles than in the past. So, you know, per mile traveled fatal crash increases are noticeably starting at age 70 74 are highest amongst drivers 85 and older. The increased fatal crash risk risk amongst older drivers it's largely due to increase susceptibility to injury, particularly chest injuries and medical complications, rather than increase tendencies to get into crashes. In addition, requiring in person renewal or vision tests are are the only policies that are associated with lower fatality rates among older drivers and only among drivers 85 and older. The government should improve public safety by requiring all drivers to renew licenses in person at regular interviews. The licensing agencies should require assessment of functional impairments, such as reduced vision or cognitive skills, provide counseling to individuals that enable individuals to seek professional evaluation and remediation for functional impairment, require that individuals who exhibit a functional impairments be given a road test tailored to identify impediments to safe driving. And finally, take appropriate action, including issuing licenses tailored to the individual based on road test results. Thank you for your time this morning I appreciate it. Thank you very much for for coming questions from the gentleman this morning. Any questions I don't see everybody. You have a question just jump in any member. Okay, I don't hear any questions. Thank you very much for appearing this morning and we know the issue and we'll take it under consideration. At this time, anybody else would like to comment on the subject. Jim, I'm just happy to say that we would love to stay engaged with the committee and lawmakers on this particular issue. I think we all share the common goal of making sure that Vermont drivers are safe and good drivers, whether they're 17 or whether they're 90 and everyone in between, and look forward to engaging you and other members of the committee moving forward and again thank you so much for your time. Thank you for a good point. We've had this discussion over the years and it's pretty hard to pinpoint a particular age group because accidents. Maybe you're higher between 20 and 25. So it's pretty hard to pinpoint exactly because usually, usually under doctors advice. They're told to drive not drive if you get a handicap plate you have to have a physical naturally I think the doctor has to recommend that. So it's very difficult for some precautions in place now so it's very difficult to draw a line exactly where the age is going to be. So anyone else at this point. Again, thank you, and. Okay, I believe. Thank you very much. Thank you DMV would you like to comment on this we have a couple minutes or a later time or. We're not planning everybody but we're trying to have meetings at 1215 and some folks have to get moving. Yes, we were not, we weren't on the schedule to testify on it today but you know we do recognize that you know it is an issue, but we also recognize the age is not the determining factor, right there's all kinds of individuals that age is not where what determines it. Thank you. You heard a discussion on the fee bait. I know that's an evolved subject and like before we go, we're going to details at a later time. So, unless the committee wants to hear it now but I know people got other committees to go do at this point. Anybody from the committee have any questions. Okay. Okay, you can take us off live. Thank you very much.