 Weeks since they oh, I didn't realize it had Zelda That's a bigger discussion though because you know like Nintendo Has had hit or misses on you know misses on on the on the Wii U for sure and You know, I mean, it's not like people need it. It's nothing like you know what I mean, so I Don't know it'll be interesting to see I Like that one scene at article, which is like people are excited to once again play with Nintendo You know, which is which is good. Yeah, but I think the people work We might be doing the the discussion before the yeah. Oh, yeah, right, right, right. Yeah So speaking of we've only got four top stories We'll probably move through them fairly quickly too. They're Todd as we read them If you have anything that comes to mind to say in the discussion part of each of these little four top stories, let us know It's not necessary We might throw like a general opinion like reaction opinion question your way But nothing that expects you to have be an expert on any of these And then as soon as we're done with top stories Patrick and I are going to give our first impressions of the switch and They're Todd if you want to weigh in on someone who who wanted to get a switch, but didn't It's double the price of what your self is being sold in the US. Okay. Yeah No, that's that's a good good thing to talk about and then once we're done with that Then we'll go to talking about online shopping in Thailand and any other trends that we kind of find our way into then couple emails and we're done Wow, I would think that it would be it would be Comparable in price as opposed in Thailand then then Why is it so expensive? Why is it double the price? You know what? I'm not sure. I think it's I don't think it's supposed to be officially Yeah, yeah, yeah, the people that have it have not so far not commented on how they've gotten it So it's like black markets, which Even my friends It's officially released in a few countries, but if you're not them at least you need some Importers to actually buy it full price somewhere But again so quickly so I'm not sure what happened Do you think that people are going to want this after they see people play it? Sounds like you want to get one I'm just Here's why no, it's not that I switch MP. It's why it's I used to be a huge Nintendo fan boy And so I want to see Nintendo do well I just you know Yeah, yeah, I think that's it. It's like, you know, I mean I got so excited I actually sold all a bunch of stuff to get the Wii when it first came out like things that I probably should have held On to and I'm like, why did I do that? It's like fires from worse Welcome tablet. I sold it No, man, but I had like my Coleco vision. I had my oh, I know I know You bought it. You bought a little video game You sold your old video game console that was made by a company that used to make leather goods And calculators That was a Connecticut leather company or something. Oh, is that what Coleco stood for? It's like Tandy computers radio shack handy Tandy was a leather Company because they still you still had a store in Modesto and my parents first moved there It's like I wonder if that's related to the radio shack Tandy and it is And back back parent company Tandy bought radio shack if you think in the 60s or 70s All right, well, we are ready to get going you guys ready Here we go Daily Tech news show is powered by its audience to find out more head to daily tech news show comm slash support This is the Daily Tech news for Saturday March 4th 2017. I'm Tom Merritt joining me today Patrick Beja host of many fine podcasts at French spin calm I will not butcher your native language by trying to pronounce them all that the Phileas Club I could do How's it going Patrick? It's going okay. How are you doing Tom? I'm so glad that we can do this on a Saturday. Just you know After a couple of years, there's a routine that starts things aren't quite as exciting as it is In the beginning and now on a Saturday. It's so new and different It does it does have a kind of a cool feel of like oh, this is this is fresh. This is different. This is interesting Yeah, we're trying something out here Putting a little more flexibility in the DTS schedule We've got daily tech headlines if you just need the headlines every day And we do that Monday through Friday for you and that gives us a little flexibility to say have someone on from Thailand To talk to us a little bit about how particularly online shopping is different there, but lots of other things So please welcome Lertad Supadolok who I will from now on just call Lertad founder of Selsuki Lertad thanks for joining us. Oh, thanks for having me on Very interested to talk to Lertad today and we will get to that in a moment But we do have a few stories that may have sneaked in since you got the headlines in the feed yesterday So let's start with those For for her former Len I shoot it wasn't see if it's not written down in front of me Len Peralta, of course with us to illustrate because we didn't do a Friday show and he usually illustrates the Friday shows So Len, thank you But I'm like super psyched that you're here because I didn't want to make you get up on a Saturday morning But anyway, but this is really exciting. It is kind of keeping the relationship fresh so I'm excited about And and and drawing for you guys today on a Saturday morning It's gonna be terrific and we gave you lots of interesting things Yeah to work from so it's gonna be fun very very excited to see what Len comes up with Four former uber employees telling the New York Times is Mike Isaac about something called gray ball May or may not be what is illustrating right now But gray ball is I think of it like black ball, but not totally black balling you It's a part of a program called V toss that's meant to identify people violating uber's terms of service So if they think you're violating the terms of service, they'll give you sort of a false Uber that won't be able to get any rides and maybe even shows cars that aren't on the road Uber allegedly used gray ball to identify and circumvent officials who were trying to clamp down on the ride hailing service That's a quote from the New York Times article Uber told the Times the program is used to deny ride requests to users violating the terms of service including an Uber said this opponents who collude with officials on secret stings Meant to entrap drivers. So Patrick the idea here is that uber kind of skating the line of legality by saying You know what? We're gonna identify people who are trying to enforce Laws against ride hailing that we might be in opposition to and stop them from being able to spy on us How is that? I'm sure there are some ways to defend it in its legality, but I'm also certain that there are ways to You know, huh action on it to do action on it on its legality It seems like the same kind of reckless behavior that uber had You know kind of left behind Year ago, and I don't know how old this one is but it sounds outrageous I mean maybe it can be explained away, but it does sound really bad And when it comes on the heels of all of the other issues that We've heard from uber in the past few days and weeks. It's like What is this? 2014 again like what's happening to uber again if I can give my my insight into why uber thinks this might be Okay, and uber says its lawyers have reviewed it and say it's okay It's that word in trap that they used in their quote to the New York Times In other words, this could be considered entrapment if an official gets in to log What's happening without telling them they are an official of the government in which case that might be illegal You you can't lie about who you are if you're a law enforcement official or an official of the government enforcing the law Well, first of all sure, but are we certain that that? Program correctly identifies all of those people and only denies them the service Well, and that's the interesting about this article if you read into it They were doing things like geofencing capital buildings and looking at people who are opening and closing the app a lot They were identifying officials by name by looking at them on social media and on websites So it's actually a pretty sophisticated system at identifying the people that is probably the scariest thing of all about this Sure, and you know, even if it let's say it's all above board. It's all legal everything When it's the fifth thing that happens in you know a week It's like it doesn't look good anyway, and it isn't gonna help because uber's main issue isn't really Go down to the bottom of it. It's not exactly what they're doing They're doing questionable things, but their image deficit is again being Deepened with this with this. Oh, at least that's the way I Yeah, I mean, and it's not like this is something they did this week Like some of the other revelations and apologies and investigations, but it certainly breaks it an opportune time for them And I don't know how long it's gonna be able to keep It's had meaning it's CEO in place after this it seems like now, you know, he apologized There were systemic issues and at some point something's gonna give I would I mean I Think his position has to be really hard to maintain now at this point. Let's add. I'm curious if uber has any Profile in Thailand right now Yeah, we're in the romantic face of uber right now Everyone loves it. They're competing with a local well regional compare. They're called grab taxi. So it's basically grab taxis approaches to Better and uber is just you know, like uber. Yeah. So, yeah Yeah, anyway, you make those taxis better Just to be clear, I still use uber and I like it very much because it's super handy, you know, it's very very convenient but Yeah, I don't want to make it seem like a hypocritical like well What I mean my alternative here is Lyft in Thailand. It's grab taxi. Is there an alternative in France that has any traction? There are a few but they don't have as many it's just so easy you everyone knows uber Yeah, possibly because of the issues as well and you just fire up the app and you're gone there are others but there are issues of you know, they don't work quite the same way because Legally, they're in a gray area because you can't have You know exactly the way they work. So you have people who are gonna create apps that are just for actual hailing, you know, like ride-sharing but then can you really trust that they're gonna go the way you want and how long it's at that? All right, I just look use uber. So I don't know. It's still a very You know good position to be in for uber, but I think and all of those Issues that they've been having aren't impossible to remedy. It's just that there there they there has to be a signal at some point that they need an adult at the helm and I don't know. We'll see but this is just one there. Yeah, this ends ubers. No good very bad week essentially Well, let's hope that we still have Sunday. I guess in some parts of the world Sunday is part of the same week So same week. Yeah, good point Microsoft reports changing windows to differential updates only sending the code that has changed in Windows 10 has reduced the size of downloads 65% for windows insiders who do frequent updates and should reduce it 35% for everyone else. Yeah, this is just a nice thing to note when you get your next windows 10 creators update If you're not in the insiders program It won't be as huge of a download because it's only gonna replace the code that needs to be replaced And if you're in the insiders program because you're frequently replacing code that that's less code each time so This this is a good thing, especially if you're you're in bandwidth constrained situations It seems like differential updates should be the standard for everything everywhere, right? So it sounds outrageous that to this day when you have a download You know when you have a piece of code that changes 10% you have to redownload the whole thing everything Yeah Line announced at Mobile World Congress Thursday that it will bring its own voice assistant platform called Clova, that's short for cloud virtual assistant get it clovey Clova it will also come out with a smart speaker kind of like an Amazon echo called wave that will use Clova You'll be able to talk to Clova on it both will come to Japan and South Korea in early summer Line also announced that it has acquired a controlling stake in Vinclu. They're the makers of the gate box holographic anime bot that helps keep lonely salary men company that sells for $2,700 in US dollars So it ain't cheap, but yeah line line diversifying here. This is smart Yeah, I feel like let's add that I think you guys use line a little bit more than we do in the West, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, we're one of their major markets We're I think we're there a second biggest market actually aside from Japan So are you looking forward? Yeah, yeah, I can have I can get some insight online. It's a very different approach in Western companies. So Here's Japanese and they usually like to develop things in health. They have there. They don't Been API's and stuff as a default So they usually have a lot of products that are similar to what you have in the US, but they're usually like You know, maybe 50% of the development Just the progress is a bit more slow and it's a closed system And so it's a little lot a little harder to break into then It's a little locked in. Yeah, and I think everyone launched message about so they launched messaging boss as well But I mean the except for the fact that if you use your app as a messaging bot, then you can no longer chat through it humanly It turns into 100% bot. I know this isn't the this is the most important part of this But how does the name clover sound because it's a little weird in English It does not sound great entirely, okay Japanese. Yeah, I don't I don't think it sounds good. It's correct in any language In Japanese it would be like kuroba, which I mean One of the most difficult combination of Roman letters Transliterate in Japanese so but you know, they're used to it. Yeah, it just makes me think of cloven hooves Which makes me think of cows Silly a bad thing I guess Cows are people too Tom wait Yeah, this is this is interesting and an interesting insight from their Todd there. Thank you for that Yeah, another thing about all these voice systems is you know, all you guys get excited about it But they rarely ever support like you send languages Mm-hmm. Yeah, we never get excited about these voice activated things Well, and because they're launching Japan in South Korea that who knows if they'll ever bring it to Thailand, right? Good one. Well, you'll just have to enjoy your gate box holographic anime bot That you will have you know, shelled out $3,000 For I guess, you know, it sounds expensive, but if it can actually help you feel less lonely I'm sure there's that is actually a big problem in Japan right now. There are a lot of You know 30-something people who are just single and it's becoming a societal an actual societal issue Now it seems gate box is driving the that is riding that wave on the Wrong side of it helping people Stay alone. I suppose but yeah, it helps. It's like a it's like gateway to Meeting other people you get practice it. Well, my my knowledge of Anime companionship. Let's meet meet me to believe that it deepens the Divide more than it because the anime companion is usually not behaving like regular Sure, not a training system. Got it All right Facebook added an option for makers of bots on the messenger platform to replace the text entry box with a menu of Items messenger also added customizable share messages a share in messenger button for websites and apps and the ability for bots to upload attachments I Get why this is here because there's a lot of companies out there who want to get on this messenger platform But their interface requires a lot more work if they have to translate it into Natural language and the natural language on the bots isn't as good as it will be eventually someday Also, there's the like on the Domino's pizza bot There's just pre-populated potential answers And so if you've already got a menu system, how different is that from pre-populated answers? But doesn't this kind of undermine the whole point of having bots? Which is that you don't need to develop an interface and you just talk in natural language? I Guess it's useful sometimes. But again, let's add maybe has more insight on this on this point Yeah, I mean I actually just saw this news, but I was just Briefly mentioning this. Um, yeah, don't know the box. We have some bots here But I think I've always thought of the messaging bosses kind of like call centers except in chat Tenors where you have to you know listen to the automated voice and then you press the button Yeah, I think this is not too surprising. This is the way the box in line work around here. Yeah I guess it's not gonna help the bot get better at conversing One of the things you can do when you have natural language is identify where Conversations broke down and then and then train the bot to recognize that and get better in the future But I think it can be helpful to have that as an additional tool when you need it during the conversation flow You know, it's not all of a sudden gonna make all bots conversations. You know Text entry boxes only But when you get to a point where you need someone to decide between two or three things it makes things a little bit easier I think it's it's useful my you know the way I would imagine it working would be this is an additional option in the Interaction rather than going to replace. So yeah, I think it's it's useful to have so the way the way other companies. Yeah, the way I'm sorry. Yeah, and the way it works here is that the menu appears and once you press the menu it kind of auto types Hmm. So yeah, so I mean the typing is just kind of like triggering the command of the bot You know, it's like you're supposed to try to understand how that works. Yeah. Yeah Let's say you're supposed to type chat, you know, for example or buy the keyword buy But then like since people has have so much trouble understanding what you're supposed to type they insert a menu So once you press first time a button a then it types buy for you. So it's auto. It's like an auto suggest Feature second. I'll suggest You're saying that's the way bots work in Thailand not the way this messenger bots. Yeah I'm wondering if they're targeting markets around here because I mean the way the recent people do this is because For many people that have just used the internet these messaging and social platforms are actually the internet Yeah, and we'll talk about that Yeah, and the ability to upload attachments Could be convenient in that situation for bots as well. I can see you Well folks if you want to get all the headlines each day in less than 10 minutes subscribe to daily tech headlines calm Let's move on briefly to talk about the Nintendo switch console went on sale Friday for two hundred ninety nine dollars Legends of Zelda Breath of the Wild also began shipping the e-store opened And I got mine and started playing around with that. I've got a few thoughts and impressions on it and Largely I have a more positive feeling than I expected about it. I have a few complaints, but The portability in particular I have found to be pretty impressive Patrick You know, I both of us have only played with it for a short period of time at this point But what's your first impression? um, you know, I've been reading about it and Watching about it for so many weeks that I feel I already knew it before I had it in my hands The the screen is definitely good quality. That's a positive impression. The device is portable. I mean, it's not It's not phone portable, but it's you can put it in your bag portable The finish the quality is good Everything is Is looking in, you know, the way people describe it. It's the way it is like the best the the best aspects of the description Are usually accurate The kickstand is definitely flimsy and it will not support it if there's anything, you know, if the table is not Perfectly horizontal then it's gonna fall over. It's super flimsy But aside from that It works. It's good the game I'm saying the game because there's basically one that people really care about the others are kind of bonuses the Legend of Zelda was some which Tom is showing here. It's looking pretty good. I've only played a couple couple of hours so I'll refrain from Passing final judgment, but everyone I mean It's one of the best reviewed games ever like in the history of the world I don't know if it holds up to that hype, but that's definitely a system seller and on the other hand There's definitely not a lot So that's it feels like everything we've been talking about for the past I don't know a couple of months is what we got so Yeah, if you thought that was good, then it's good if you thought it wasn't great Then you won't be your mind won't be changed now that itself. Yeah, that's fairly close to my my impressions Nothing surprised me about it But certain things that I'm like, okay, they say this or that or it looks like it does this or that How's it gonna at work in practice? One is putting the SD card slot behind the kickstand confused the heck out of me I couldn't find it at first and the SD card slot the mini SD card slot is essential For this because you only have 32 gigabytes of onboard storage and if we're going to be downloading from the e-store You're you might need that SD card slot For for things at some point. So I haven't needed it yet, but I think that's gonna be important That that's not my headline though. My headline is wow I really really can be playing Zelda on the television and then when Eileen says oh We need to take the dog outside. I can pop that thing out and keep playing it now It's a little awkward putting the joy cons on the side. I keep hitting buttons I can't figure out where I'm supposed to hold it while I'm attaching it So I'm sure I'll figure it out eventually, but then I'm just standing at the back door playing the same game I just was I didn't I didn't lose anything. It didn't have any weird, you know transfer time and it's the same game It's not a minimized version of it and then I go and I put it back in the dock And I'm playing the game again on the big screen and the way that works is really impressive I did have what a lot of people have reported with lag between the controller went and the docked console Because of distance and basically I just had to lean back forward and it came back Into connection some people have said if you have the joy cons docked when you do the first system updated avoids that I didn't know that by the time I had done the system. So I'm not sure if that would have changed anything for me Yeah, I mean there are a few, you know, nitpicky things we can talk about definitely the connection issue is a problem Some people are experiencing The the SD card is I mean that that's fine But most people are not gonna need it now because they're gonna buy the physical Cartridge for Zelda and the other games are usually gonna fit in the internal in the tiny internal memory of the console Down the line, you're gonna need one for sure It's it is, you know Zelda is looks like a Design-wise impressive game artistically. It's good, but I don't think it's gonna make anyone who's not a nintendo fine boy You know, I've been reading the reddit the subreddit for the Nintendo switch and it's very cute and Very fun to look at everyone Gushing over how every single aspect of the console is amazing I think down the line what's gonna interest the audience in this of this show it's is this gonna be a successful successful console long run and It's it's really hard to say we've seen analysts predicting anything from like Four million units at the end of the year to eight or nine One being relatively low the other being really high It's it's the good. I think it's a good For the new console. They have a strong launch title It doesn't matter that it's just one because they have more coming down the line They have a lot of support from indie developers Which again are not gonna please everyone in the world, but some people will find stuff to do on the on the console And they have other titles coming with some they've hinted at some they've announced The real battle is gonna start happening at the end of the year once the Library of titles is gonna be big enough that it's justifiable as a As a holiday season purchase and maybe the price is gonna go down a little bit or we're gonna see some pack-ins pack-in games so All in all, this is not a bad launch. I think it's a good launch They're gonna sell out those two million units that they wanted to sell by the end of March And it's looking cautiously positive for the remainder of the year I would say M. Bezdel at our chat room says one thing I haven't seen mentioned about the dock is how does the switch line up with it? Is there any play as it goes in or does it follow a track? It does not follow a track So I'm constantly putting it in at a little bit of the wrong angle It's really easy to recover from that and find the USBC plug So I haven't had problems docking at it, but it's not super simple And and there are some reports of bezels getting scratched up as people sort of find their way Yeah, but it works. It works. Okay. I it's it's not a big complaint of mine My impression of this thing is that it really is a mobile gaming platform that you can easily Play on your television. Yeah Yeah, I mean, this is something that Nintendo is insistent adamant that it's not they're saying it's a home console You can take on the go if you look at it like that. I think it's I mean it's semantics But it definitely feels like a great portable console and an average home console So if you look at it like that It's it's probably best to think yeah, it's it's a portable device But I love that I could be playing it on my TV and then take it downstairs You take it outside. I mean that that is the the big selling point for this If if if that's the thing that gets your you're you excited then you're probably gonna be pretty happy with it And I think the other thing to keep in mind lastly is that For the price which I know I would have liked it to be cheaper but The screen quality, you know, this is not a thousand dollars phone that we're talking about It's a three hundred dollars piece of hardware that has decent GPU capabilities for that type of device it's got an incredible amount of technology in the controllers and They can be used for many different things and the screen is really good quality the it's you know 720p But it's good 720p So The battery life is a little bit wonky, you know, it's about three hours in on Zelda There are other issues like it's not easy to charge you you're probably gonna see some Nintendo switch compatible battery pack coming here and there Yeah, it's easy to charge in the dock obviously because the dock is plugged into power But then when you want to charge it on the go You can't have it in the kickstand because the charging dock is there and that and also it sucks in so much power That for example if it's turned on and you plug it into a MacBook Pro It's gonna charge the MacBook Pro and not the other way around So it's hard to find a battery pack that is gonna you can if it's turned off You can charge it off a laptop, but if it's not it's probably gonna be a little bit difficult But so there are little kinks here and there but overall for a 300 for 300 bucks It does what it needs to do really well So overall I think it's a pass to good on on most of its characteristics And within a year, it's gonna be the kind of device that you just buy Not as an impulse by it's not quite there, but people are gonna think well There are enough games there that I didn't get on the Wii U Hopefully the virtual console is gonna bring back some older games that people have nostalgia for and it's gonna make a Convincing enough a compelling enough package that people are gonna think alright I'll I'll put you know 250 bucks in this and I can play play it on the train on in the hotel and stuff like that because it is to this day in My opinion the only real gamers Portable system aside from you know current generation gamers portable system because even now the phones and tablets are Great for gaming for some people, but the gamers who love Actual console games or PC games don't have a platform that will give them satisfaction and the switch is the closest to that that I've seen now $300 for a Portable gaming device with bundled and controllers and a dock that can output 1080 seems like a good deal. However in Thailand Lurtide you're saying you can't get one is six hundred dollars Six hundred dollars and people are not saying where they're getting it I have a personal friend that ended up calling a Sony distributor that sells Sony products, but got Nintendo Swiss from there Really? So it's not officially released in Thailand, right? It's not officially released. It's a bit of a scavenger hunt and on the Excessive, you know, I think it's a great market black market because we saw people can't really don't really advertise if they have it for sale Yeah, interesting so you have to try and call a lot of different like game shops or electronics shops and Yeah Now finally before we move on Sunburn says how does Zelda taste? I need a real journalistic take on this course We reported previously about that should I should I? Are you sure? All right, go ahead It's actually not that bad. It's it's bitter. It's bitter, but it's not it's it's got a little afterburn That's about that's about it with your normal Responsible journalism Tom. This is so unnerving. I was so hoping you would scream and yell Hey, man, if it had been bad, I would have I do like spicy foods. So maybe it's Dead, I don't know But I can't believe that this actually became a story and even beyond this that it was an actual story Since it is coded in something. Yeah, to make it less appealing to the youngsters. It's amazing All right, well, let's talk with Lertaud a little bit He was on the Phileas Club Patrick Beja's other podcast one of his other fine podcasts talking about living in Thailand in general One of the stories he told the cop my ear was how people in Thailand And this is from the Phileas Club. Don't know what a web browser or the internet is they know what Facebook and Instagram and line is and then Lertaud you talked about how you don't use shopping carts people in Thailand generally buy through chat If you if you don't mind, can you explain again what you meant by that? Yeah, I mean just Just to be clear, I don't think I don't believe it's just Thailand I know for a fact it's like yeah as developing countries So like Vietnam us we also think a lot of South American countries the thing we have in common Like what we call it on mobile people like to call mobile first Users so what we mean by that is Countries internet connectivity when it was on the desktop was not very distributed throughout the country Because we just simply didn't have the networks We only really started using the internet when it's not current days when it's mobile So my mom never really use a computer But she's now, you know, she texts her friends and everything so when you put it in that perspective Skip the web browser Because they don't you don't if you think about you don't really use a browser on your phone that much The way that my mom started using the phone was she she was aware that her friends could be contacted through line So she needed a phone to talk to her friends. Yeah Yes, yeah, so so the market only developed once people started using these social networks through their smartphones and When I say people don't know what a web browser is You know, if you ask my mom if she knows how to use internet, she's like she's But you text me online and she's like yes And then like so and how do you watch like the latest TV show is like on YouTube, you know And then and then and then it's like but that's internet Okay If you say so Yeah, it's like, you know what chrome is, you know, it's not she doesn't really know she Aligned she doesn't know she goes to a separate web browser No, she's she thinks she's still in line So so yeah, I mean that that's what I mean by the that's how the internet works around here And once you talk about e-commerce Comes in the issue of the user interface so Since there's no really no standard I know there's no big Amazon.com everyone knows how to buy from Every website has a different interface for how the shopping cart works so it's really and The metaphor doesn't really transfer to ask users if they were to tell my mom to you know go to a website and then put this product into this She doesn't really know like what the shopping cart is for in the first place. You know if you think about it It doesn't really make sense Because another factor for us developing countries is we don't really have that many credit cards So why do you need a shopping cart to process a to process payment when you're not paying my credit card? So what happens is? Instead of telling people to go to a website people say, okay, why don't you just tell me the money and then give me the paying slip So this becomes I think the origin of what? Caused the boom in bots and chat commerce and conversation of commerce for us It was just a natural thing to do if I were to teach my mom to how to use a website and a shopping cart versus telling my mom, okay Why don't you just talk to this salesperson's like when you what you do when you go to a market? I'll tell her to chat. No, it's a more natural user interface Well, and she's already talking to her friends online. So she knows how to use line And and she knows how to talk to someone at a market to buy something. So it's yeah, that makes sense Yeah, culturally, I think it's also important to understand that for us especially in Asia We we like to buy from markets. We like to talk to the merchants and then And we don't have such a self-service culture They think the the salary rates here are not that high Oftentimes it's easier to just you know hire someone and give up more personalized service. They actually do yeah Do some complicated systems? Yeah, and I think that's that's a key thing to understand this because we think well, okay this idea of just talking to someone on messenger and and Getting their bank account right not using a credit card, but just sending money to their bank account number how can I trust them but I I'm curious if the shopping cart idea also sounds untrustworthy from your side, which is you're not talking to someone You're just putting this number in a shopping cart. How do you know? It's actually going to get you the thing you're going to get Yeah, exactly from our side. I'm like who made this website, you know, who have how do I know? Who's behind this website? Is it trustworthy and another thing that happened often? It's like it's actually even in stock Right, I can't ask someone. Yeah, and you've you might have already paid So so for us where the ecosystem is only really developing, you know, if you think about it the only real factor that of buying online is trust and You do Amazon does it to reviews a lot of content, you know testimonials for us, you know, if you get to talk to someone you build that trust There's someone behind that that this store Does a does a bot like system Threaten that model though where you could be talking to a bot instead of an actual person or does it matter? Yeah, but yeah, but it's like interesting for us because I think I Think our approach to Conversational commerce is that okay? Everyone is using the internet through these social networks and messaging We kind of skip the browser age So since everyone's on the messaging systems, let's sell through this natural for us to just you know, simply chat Service people like this. I always will box as a way to make that kind of scale so I don't think Doing bot versus actually like the right way to approach it. I think it was you kind of have to create that called behavior of you know, learning to talk to people via this chat system and buy through it first actual length if less if you natural language never Actually really works, you know, especially for us who we should have complicated language systems, you know, all our words are We don't have spaces between our words, for example So it's really hard for our computers to learn about Our our types of languages, so we never really trust those kinds of automated systems and your language is in prior to prioritized For development either which makes it even slower. No, it's not. Yeah. No, it's not so we actually don't trust bot You know when bots came some people started trying it and once they realized that hey I'm talking to a bot then, you know, they it's not as interesting, you know, you don't get that trust anymore Hmm, so I think that is actually a huge advantage for Thailand and other similar countries for when the Bots become self-aware and start murdering Get to Thailand Yeah, yeah, they don't understand what we're saying I Think there's a real lesson in Development here too for for people that may not realize if you're trying to bring say your app or or or anything To a market outside of the one you're familiar with you need to figure out how people perceive things because it's going to change How you develop any kind of interface not just e-commerce Yeah, yeah Yeah, every time we see these new innovations. We always never really expected to work here You know, even if we speak English the accent is off Yeah, it's also, you know, you you as you explained when you do conclude the purchase or a transaction you'd send, you know, you do the the money transfer and then you send a An image of the receipts Yeah, a screenshot which I guess, you know makes that ability to send to upload attachments on messenger on Facebook messenger It makes it really interesting for you guys, I suppose Yeah, I think it's really interesting. Yeah, but when we were talking about the Facebook, you know changing their Their sorry to two menus I was starting to think maybe they were targeting our Type of markets first because actually a lot of Facebook Facebook has actually released a lot of products in you know In Thai markets and markets around here before in the US Recently, so for example a bit Having products within the Facebook pages. No, so getting sending payments and invoices Because I think we just have a lot of usage and buying and selling through these chat interfaces And Facebook is working very hard to be successful in multiple markets, not just US and Europe Yeah, and I think my other thing people kind of misunderstand about conversational commerce From from the news I read through, you know, Western media is that When I say that we buy and sell through chat I think that's usually the most important phase is when you're getting to know a store and You know if you're getting to that trust and the salesperson and you think about it like Fasten products, for example, you know, you can't really understand the material or what it feels like with the origin or especially sizing Which is a huge issue And it's almost impossible to solve when you do it by statically on the web But it's not that difficult if you can do it through chat But once you have that trust in the band usually People will be willing to learn about you know automated systems like shopping carts So I think in apps like we chat in China people think people say, oh, you're buying selling everything through chat It's not necessarily through chat But it's actually through the through the app which happens to have apps and more apps within the chat within we chat So that's happening. It's interesting in that, you know, these line line has, you know Always and we chat has become kind of like their own operating systems within iOS within Android Certainly platform. Yeah, very platform like Yeah, you know, it's it's interesting as we're talking and I understand we bring this to a close soon But I'm starting to wonder why couldn't this work in the West as well For some products, you know, what you're describing basically maybe, you know fashion products or I don't know footwear or Apparel and beauty masks. Yeah, for example, you know, it's it's impossible To get a good feel of what you what you want on An Amazon page for these things whereas if you had the opportunity to chat with someone. Yes It it feels a little bit Call center II which we don't like as much. I suppose but I think in some cases It might drive sales for a company like Name anyone but any company could in those areas Create purchases with in is free. Yeah. Yeah, especially, you know small business I think it provides a personal touch I think if you think about it what Amazon has been doing with for example, the one cut the one click to purchase With Amazon echo with the dash button, you know, they're not really using their website anymore You know, they're taking out the funnel of having to go to a website and clicking checking out So if you're just saying through chat and you tell you start doing customer service and then you tell them to go to a website You know, that's just another step in the funnel, you know I think e-commerce has become about how do you make the purchase as quickly as possible when the customer wants it the most? Merchants here and learn to understand that if the customer comes in you have to chat right away Otherwise, it might not you might not get that sale Yeah, I think Instinctively when we think about this we sort of our mind Drives back to the website, you know for Amazon or anything, but you have to remember these happen like on Facebook Messenger or whatever Messaging app you're using We chat whatever And so as people are spending their lives in Facebook or Twitter or snapchat or God knows what well, maybe not snapchat It's a little bit of a different beast But then you you find a page that someone recommended to you and you're Texting back and forth with your friends and one of your contacts happens to be that Korean beauty products I don't know why we settled on Korean beauty products, but And you're looking at their products and someone is like hey, can you need help with this? I mean, I know this happens in Web pages and it's annoying when it does but I think there's a place for it That might be super natural and super and fluidify the purchasing act quite a bit for us as well, maybe Yeah Yeah, just the final note I think Thailand used to be a country where we people always say that we would never buy our own products We only buy Western products, but I'm ever since I think this chat commerce has grown a lot of local Local brands have been born through the internet So I think there's an opportunity there. It's just a way to get you know Eliminate that mistrust from not having an opportunity to make that personal connection with someone Well, our Todd, thank you so much for sharing these insights I know we could probably go on all day because it's fascinating to me to go in the differences So maybe we can get you back on again one of these days I would love to thank you Thanks everybody who participates in our subreddit to you could submit stories and vote on them at daily tech news show If you see something that interests you out there go post it Real quickly an email from Paul in Michigan said Thursday night I was listening to your report on Microsoft opening up the Xbox live creators program to the muggles as a developer I was a bit surprised that I had not heard of it already ran home to do a bit of research quick correction This program does not let you develop on the Xbox itself and we may have given that impression In fact, I'm pretty sure we did it lets developers use the Xbox one as its dev kit Without having to get a special developers version You still have to use the universal Windows platform as we mentioned and that if you didn't quite catch it requires you to use Visual Studio to do the actual development, which is still done in a traditional programming language like C++ or C sharp Thank you Paul for pointing that out because I think we started to imply that you didn't need anything But the Xbox to do that and that's an important thing to note All right before we get out of here. Let's see what Len has been drawing Len Yes, it is me, you know, I chose to to go the easy route here and draw the the Nintendo switch Something that is really popular right now to keep in mind that I am I am I was a huge Nintendo fanboy in the past, so I'm really excited For this to do well for Nintendo hearing what you have to say. It sounds like it has some It has some, you know merits but also It's not I don't it doesn't sound like it's going to light the world on fire But who knows so the images of Mario a little bit disheveled a little bit crazy who's saying yeah, you want to come out and play with me again It's funny because this is a sentiment that I see mirrored in Nintendo fans across the world There are a lot of people looking at this and saying and thinking I want to love Nintendo again Yes, and this is their opportunity and so far. It's not You know, it's not they're not being turned down. I guess Well, I'm rooting for them. I'm a big Nintendo fanboy. So hopefully it'll do well for them. So go check out disheveled Mario and you know Give him a give him a little love at Len Peralta store.com You can see the picture and even order a digital or printed version for your own absolutely Thank you Lertaud again for joining us if people want to find out more about what you do or your company. Where should they go? Yeah, I am on Twitter and Lertaud LERTAD. My company is sales Yuki is EWL LL SQKI It just means, you know, it's a mix of Japanese and English. It means it's an it handles chat commerce they plug into Facebook line that and Websites and all that but it is mostly very localized I'm I'm I'm scared to go in and see what the English interface looks like Well, go follow Lertaud on Twitter once again, that's LERTAD Patrick anything from you before we get out of here Sure, not Patrick on Twitter and Facebook and of course, you know my website French spin Dotcom and if you want to hear more from Lertaud We did as you mentioned Tom a few a month and a half ago an episode of the Philly is Club called a quick panorama of Thailand where he talks we have a Semi-long conversation about a lot of the things happening in Thailand not it's not quite News it's more. How is life in Thailand if you've never been there and you want to hear from someone there explain the Social political climate and with a lot of small fun anecdotes including the ones about tech So go check that out at frenchspin.com. It's the Philly's Club episode 80 Thanks to everybody who supports the show like Christian Cantrell, Sandra Buchanan, Brian Katarski and big thanks to Mike Piznick and Chris Johnson and Chris Larson who all Just raised their pledge. Why don't you join them patreon.com DTNS our email address is feedback at daily tech news show calm We're live Monday through Friday usually at 4 30 p.m. Eastern at alpha geek radio calm and diamond club TV and our website It's daily tech news show calm back at the normal time on Monday with Veronica Belmont talk to you then Get more at frogpants.com That was a fun show, thanks you guys Thank you. Yeah, big. Thanks everyone for making logistics work. Oh, yeah No, this was a this was a bit of a struggle if people didn't realize to figure out Bangkok Paris Like the perfect storm of time zones, but yeah, it worked out great Yeah, yeah, thanks. That's good. Thanks for staying up late for us My pleasure, I've actually been listening to all of you for a long time. Oh good very good I'm happy to hear that and it was great having you on you were fantastic All right, I'm going to log off. All right. Thanks, Len. All right. Take care guys. See you have a good Saturday Todd if you need to head please do yeah Thanks again for the cake work. Yeah. All right. Take care. I'll tell you again everyone my rather And Patrick, I don't know if you need to go as well. That's fine Fairly soon. Can you tell me when we're not live anymore? Sure? Yeah Yeah, let's pick a quick title and we'll say popsicles and inks That is followed up with how does Zelda taste nice? Rastlin stuff mm-hmm false uber cows are people to for DTNS, please press one Skynet is in here, man Validating idiots Nintendo scavenger hunt trust no bot she calls me poppy You have to tell me if you're a cop Makes me think of cows welcome the movie phone for no that's that's For DTNS press room for French been pressed to she pissed Mario give Mario a little love I think I was how does Zelda taste? Yeah, and we did spend a good amount of time talking about the switch. So Sure Patrick, do you have a thought on the title? Give Mario a little love is cute, but yeah, how does Zelda taste everyone's been doing there How does it tell you think it's almost a me now, which I you know the the one thing that I did wrong is I pop this out To taste it without closing the game, and I got the little hey You didn't close your game. So you lose to any progress since the last time you saved just so you know Crap. I'm sure it's fine. Yeah, I'm sure I didn't lose much but Still kids don't forget. It is really a cartridge. So if you don't say I still don't understand that but sure like Yeah, let's get let's them only have 32 gigabytes inside. I think Patrick. I right point there No, I mean, I know why they did it, but I don't know why they did it Like it's just you I mean, it's cheap. It's cheap. They could have I think they they struggled to bring the price Under 300 I think that's the main issue. We're just used to seeing all of those devices You know that are super powerful and perform great, but they're all for 500 bucks right the phones and yeah, I'm just thinking like you know I can understand if you needed to add more storage to it, but just like just going to a fully Fully a full e-store or whatever deliver the games. I mean you you can still download. Yeah, it's not like they didn't do any store That'd be even weirder So how does Zelda taste is that good? Yeah, I think so That works for me friends. Don't let friends taste all that That might be even well that would imply that you aren't my friends though because you let me do it. I Wasn't sure what you were doing It was too late. I realized my horrible plan And I actually I mean it definitely tastes bad. I don't want to keep it in my mouth, but it was not It was not as bad as I expected I expected to be like, you know, maybe maybe because I knew it was gonna taste bad That's the episode title. I don't want to keep it That's some somebody's episode All right Almost done there. Thanks everybody for getting up on a Saturday morning with us all you guys in the chat room and watch it live It's not that late on the East Coast. I know but Fantastic, I see some Pacific Coast people in there. So All right, thanks everybody, we'll be back again on the normal time Monday. Have a great rest of your weekend. We'll talk to you then