 Joining me now is Aegon Vermae from Aurora and Aegon Aurora has recently joined the UPU Consultative Committee. Here tell us a bit about that. What led Aurora to take this step? Thank you Ia. Good to be here. Aurora we are developing software for compliance and customs so basically and we are already working with some of postal operators already and we are building up our solutions based on data and data standardisation and I think this is a key. We put our knowledge, tech knowledge, customs knowledge, machine learning knowledge and also IT knowledge into one and we help companies, postal companies to get rid of this burden how to build up IT systems so and this is what we are doing and we see it's a great opportunity for us especially because we are getting more closer to understand postal better, to understand the standards better and help them to go through this change of their business processes when we provide our solutions for them. So you've just talked about these challenges in cross-border especially when it comes to custom codes and all the new laws and regulations that are coming into place. What are some of the pain points or some of the challenges that you're seeing in the postal world in relation to all these things? I think the difficulty is actually that there are coming new regulations all the time and to keep up your organization it's quite difficult and also complex when we talk about cross-border and especially when there are different solutions like DDP, DDU, how you manage it so and we are here to help the postal companies to provide their our solutions and hopefully we can build our solutions even better for the postal community. One of the challenges in the postal world is that posts deal with everyone from large e-commerce players through to grandparents sending presents to grandchildren in another country. So can posts access all of these sorts of technologies or how can they easily access these sorts of technologies? Actually it all comes down to standardization actually because the data flow is more or less the same but the products or the processes behind it are different so this is where we come and help you. Returning to the theme of the UPU and the UPU Consultative Committee what do you see as maybe the role of your aura and the other new members of the committee or even what do you think that you can provide the organization as a whole as part of your involvement in the UPU Consultative Committee? I think it's a great and brave move that UPU has done that they are opening the doors actually and what you are getting is you're getting different IT companies some of them are competition to us anyway but you have the choice now and you can choose and these IT companies can ease you with your business processes we can build up because we are mainly focused on developing IT software so and I think this is and we are moving quite fast so this is what we can put on the table and deliver to the postal world. You just mentioned moving quite fast that's a challenge that's thrown up by the e-commerce world now isn't it and you mentioned the changing regulation so just in closing is there one thing that you could say well here's how a postal operator or even a postal regulator who wants to understand the postal world how we can react quickly to this changing environment. I can give you some examples we have just finished this one postal we have built some collection tax collection solution so from beginning from the first meeting to deliver it took us three months so the product is there and they are using it as a white label or we have another partner we have built for them export control for dual use goods so and we are covering now US UK and Europe so and the whole process with them took four months so basically so this is what I talked about it's it's fast what it means it's not only understanding that the requirements and standardization but also the development codes are and this is what we can really deliver because as I mentioned we have the competence who understands the compliance side we have the competence who understands the IT side and also we are using as I mentioned a lot of data that we are using machine learning that actually can take care of this huge amounts of data also the different languages and and different areas of the world. Egon Vermaer from Aurora thank you very much for joining us today thank you very much