 Resistance bands are not just for beginners. If you're advanced and you don't use the variable resistance of resistance bands, you are not building as much muscle and strength as you could be. Look to bands to provide some tremendous value for everybody, especially advanced lifters. Bands will make her dance, huh, Justin? Oh yeah, big time. Wow. You know, it's interesting that this still is a thing with bands that people just think they're for beginners when strength athletes will power lifters in particular, I've been using bands now for a long time. It's the most successful ones ever. Is it Westside Barbell that really kind of popularized the variable resistance, yeah. They did. So here's the thing about bands that makes them so special. The type of resistance that they provide is so different from what you'll find with machines and free weights. So when I'm lifting a free weight, the resistance, it changes depending on, you know, its position to gravity. So if I do a lateral raise, it's light from here to here. It gets heavier. This is the heaviest point because it's fighting gravity directly with a cable that's consistent all the way through. Bands are easiest at the beginning, hardest at the end. So the more you stretch them out, the more challenging they are. Now why is this valuable? First off, it's different. So things that are different create tension differently in the muscle and that can always send a new stimulus. But second and I think most important is it very closely mirrors your natural strength curve on a lot of different lifts. So like if you did like a barbell squat, for example, most people are weakest at the bottom, strongest at the top, right? So that top, you know, two or three inches, you can lift the most weight. The bottom is probably where you can at least lift the least amount of weight. So if you were to add bands to your weights or even just do a banded squat, it's easiest where you're the weakest, it's hardest where you're the strongest. So you can literally create almost perfect tension along with your natural strength curve. And this again, is what Powerlifter's noticed and why it made them so strong so quickly. Do you have a theory on why bands are not popular with the general population? I think because they look the way they do, like these colorful rubber bands, just they're like easy to travel with. I have a theory. I think that, I think the thing that makes them so awesome is also the reason why a lot of people don't. And that's because you don't do as much damage and you don't get a sore. Oh, that's not on that point. And so many people measure these. Which is actually a valuable thing. I don't know, it's the same thing that makes them so valuable. And I think so good is why most people steer clear of it because it doesn't get them as sore. I mean, you can do all the banded squats you want. It ain't gonna feel like 400 pounds on your back on the barbell squat. Therefore, we assume that, oh, the free weights are so much better because they get me so much more sore. But in the context of what we're always trying to communicate to our audience is that most people, especially fitness enthusiasts, tend to overreach and over train and bands belong somewhere in your routine. I think there's a bit of truth in that. I remember when I used to train really hard for football and we would have a physical therapy clinic right next to us. I remember there'd be a lot of guys that would go in and do the rehab and then there was this disconnect between the only used bands as they were rehabbing, but then they would come in and do the free weights. And it was this association in terms of like, that's training wheels to get you back to the free weights when in fact, I remember going in between both and noticing quite a lot of benefits from using the bands myself. But it was, I didn't get quite a sore, so there was an association there too. Maybe it wasn't enough. No, if you want to do smart strength training, you look at a modality or a training technique or a tool and you look at its strength and its weaknesses and then you plug it in to maximize its strengths and minimize its weaknesses. So what are the strengths of bands is that you can train the hell out of yourself with them. You can add a lot of frequency. You can add them to your current routine and not compromise your recovery that much. In other words, let's say I'm training really hard, but I want to add something that's gonna really, amplify my results. Well, there's not much I can add if I'm kind of already at that limit, but if I add bands, I don't seem to require more recovery. In fact, I've noticed in the past, there's a bit of a recuperative aspect. And then frequency, you can train really hard with bands every single day and get really rapid results. You can't do that with free weights and you can't necessarily do that with machines. You have to really consider the damage and the recovery more than with bands. So it's a valuable tool. So you look at it and you say, okay, how can I use this tool and maximize its strength? And that's definitely one of them. You know, another benefit to it that I'd noticed was that it puts a lot more emphasis on eccentric portion of the lift because you have to be able to control that to get back to the original starting point. And I think that's such an overlooked and neglected part of lifting, especially with athletic train power lifting, you know, like the 111 kind of aggressive style lifts. And, you know, to be able to kind of really put emphasis on the other portion of muscle contraction, like is a lot of benefit. Here's the other thing too. Bands are so valuable for explosive training. Yeah, so valuable for explosive training. First off, the angles I can modify, right? So with free weights, free weights can be amazing for explosive training, but it's way more technical. And I can't pull and create resistance horizontally. Definitely can't pull it from up to down. So I remember like when I was doing like grappling, judo, jiu-jitsu, wrestling, wanting to add resistance to explosive techniques. I can't use a machine because a weight stack will go flying everywhere. Yeah. But I can use bands. And in fact, what I did is I had, it was similar to a free motion if it was called a da Vinci. And I attached bands to the weight stack. So I could do explosive twists and turns and the band kept the weight stack from flopping all over the place and gave me that good, that ability to explosively pull and that generate too much momentum where it changes the movement. You know what I've never done that would be a fun experiment. And maybe coming up here would be a good time. I'm back on my kick could be inconsistent lifting and I'm actually dieting and stuff I'm back on everything. And I've never ran like a pure, full cycle of like a mostly all band routine. You know, for a period of time. Like I've always used it as a tool and intermittently use it within my workout, but I've never like programmed like a band routine and like stuck with it for like- Like serious resistance. Yeah, yeah. Especially in where I'm at in my lifting career, it'd be really, and I would want to do it after I have good like momentum I've trained for a while. Like, I mean, Sal, you're in a good place because you've been very consistent for a while. It'd be fun to interrupt that and be like, I wonder what things I would notice if I committed to just for bands for an extended period of time and do that. I would, I'll tell you what, I'll stay on my consistency now and then I would love to do some of that. Switch over. Yeah, yeah. So I had experience with that. Well, I always incorporated it, not always. I'd say probably starting about 15 years ago, I started incorporating bands and added it to my routine and saw great results. But before that, when I grand opened the 24 fitness on San Atresa down in South San Jose, when they did a partial grand opening and the resistance training area wasn't open yet, it was just the cardio, the pool, the basketball court type of deal. And so, but then we still had personal trainers. So the trainer's like, what are we gonna do? We don't have equipment. So all the trainers did, body weight and bands, that's all they did. And we had meetings and talked about like how to make sure your members stick around and because everybody was like, oh, it's not gonna be as good. You know what happened after we put in the machines and free weights? A good chunk of those clients were like, I like working out better with the bands and with the body weights. So they had such good results. That was my first time being exposed to, oh, there's a lot of value in this. And then of course, then when you see like, West Side Barbell do it, like, come on, you can't get more hardcore than that. And these guys are the strongest, these people are the strongest, you know, men and women in the world in powerlifting. And they're the ones that, and by the way, they got it from, they got the idea from Soviet studies on weightlifting. Cause they, they would incorporate that with chains as well. And yeah, all those variable resistance ways. Didn't they do a really good documentary on them? I'm pretty sure. I don't know what it's called, but yeah, there is a good documentary out there. Yeah, I don't remember what streaming service is on, but I'm pretty sure a couple of years ago, I watched a really good documentary. Cause I knew a little bit, everybody, I think in the fitness community knows West Side Barbell, I would think. But I didn't know like the whole history and I didn't know until I watched that documentary about. They were the first ones that really bring to powerlifting. They were, and that's where they got it from like some like with the Russian Olympic teams and stuff like that. They were utilizing it and they started to implement into their training and saw huge results. And then it's obviously a staple there now. They're the ones I think that made it popular to the U.S. They did. And then it finally started to come over to the bodybuilding space, although bodybuilders still don't use bands much, but all it takes is, you know how bodybuilding is, all it takes is for one high ranking bodybuilders. Bodybuilders use it now. You know how it's used with bodybuilders. That's really common and I'm not the biggest fan of. Combo it with machines. And they put on machines and stuff. But what I mean is it's not really making it like, like a big part of the routine. You know what I mean? Like all it takes is a couple like champions. Yeah, no, they're not. They're definitely not doing that. But they are, you know, they're attaching them to hammer strength machines, which I'm like, you know, if all the ways you're going to utilize it, that's kind of the lamest way to do it. Yeah, I mean, it's, it adds something. Leave it up to my bodybuilder guys. Yeah, it's not nothing. What's up with bodybuilders? Like it's, this trend hasn't stopped where they get a machine and they invent and exercise using a machine that is completely, he gave me this meme. I reposted it. I posted a story. It's video. Justin blames Joey Swole. I did. I do. Justin claims Joey Swole. Who was it? Everybody defends him now, too, because he's on this like big, yeah, virtual signaling guy. We're like on TikTok. Don't be bullied. He bullies the bullies. That's who he is now, yeah. Hey, who was it? Smart pivot. Smart pivot. Sure. There was one that you showed me, Adam, where it was a preacher curl machine or something and the dude turned on his shoulder press. Oh God, yeah. We know that person. So I don't want to, I don't want to railroad it. Why? I will say the exercise. That was a tricep extension. That's what it was. He turned it to shoulder press. So if you know what a tricep extension machine is got, you know, it looks kind of like a preacher curl machine, right? You're walking like this and then you and the handles go over like this and homeboy was standing up facing this way and using it like a row. Oh, that's what it was a row. Yeah. Now the part of it, now people listening right now are like, way too stupid. What the fuck? The problem is though, like the dude has an incredible physique. And so, you know, you can't help but think like, there's going to be a ton of inspire. I already know next, you know, next time you go in the gym, I'm going to see some 17 year old kid rowing on the tricep extension machine. I'm trying to think of the stupidest thing I've ever seen. That's up there. That's up there. That's up there. I think the other one was the leg curl. I saw somebody doing neck extensions with the leg curl. I just wanted to slap them. Shoulder press. And by the way, you know, it kind of reminds me of the thing that you say about, you know, you tolerate or because you can, doesn't mean it's optimal, right? Like just because you can, you know, activate your lats on them, it doesn't mean you should. It's a good idea. You know what I'm saying? So I get you could do those machines and try and make you feel it in a specific muscle group. Like I have that skill set. Like I get it. Like I could get under any machine. I can make any machine work. Yeah, I can make a leg press work my chest. If I get in there creatively enough, you know what I'm saying? I can make it. I can make any machine work any muscle I want. If I contort my body a certain way. It's like MacGyver. But it's, but it's, yeah. It's like, yeah. Stick a gum and safety pins of that. How about just unlock the door, bro? Yeah. Forget it's intended use. Right next to it was. That's what I'm going to do with hashtag. My next to it was a seat row, seated row. Yeah, yes. Right. Bro, I have old, you know what I'm saying? That was like when I was in charge of the mind pump. I used to post like those memes all the time of like people MacGyvering, literally. That's what we should do. Hashtag MacGyver. Yeah. So that'll be like the. That's so dated by the way. That's why it's good. It's a subtle, like most of the kids. But they brought it back with MacGyver for a minute. Remember that in SNL? That was a decent skit. MacGyver is old, man. That's been a while. Dude, I got to tell you guys. So Aurelius is like, he's talking so much, so much right now. And we're, it just is vocabulary exploding. So he's saying the funniest things. And we're also simultaneously talking about like body parts, right? So he's, he's in this big thing now. He's like, he goes up to someone and he goes, you have a penis, you have a vagina. Oh, no way. Really? Yeah. Cause we taught him, you know, boys have a penis. The kindergarten cop? Yeah. So he goes up to my daughter. Man, we're behind. I didn't teach him. He's like, papa's got a penis. Yes, papa's got a penis. Mama's got a, yes, mama's got a vagina. So he's his whole thing, right? So anyway, the other day, Jessica's changing his diaper. And he looks down and he goes, my penis is as big as papa's car. Like, what? What? And he comes out with his. Why? And he comes out with this hot wheel. Oh yeah. Why? I know. But what made him think my car, you know? Is it? Is it? Is it? Bro. That would make more sense. Yeah. To buy a car. That would be great. But I was, I was dying. He went up to Jessica too. Then he goes, mama, you have big boobs. Okay. All right, kid. Yeah. Nobody's teaching him this. We have to teach Max the difference between him, her. He, he calls everybody him. Which is, so it's totally insulting when I have like my, you know, knees over and they're talking. He, him, him, he keeps saying like, no, that's a her. That's a her. You know, okay. Like he's trying to figure it out. And then he's straight. Can't say it as well. So he'll try it like three times. Then he'll default back to him again. He also, he'll fake like he does fake expressions now, which is kind of cute. It's actually cool because it shows he's, he understands certain things. So I show up after work the other day, I walk in and he walks up to me. He totally fakes a yawn. It's not real. And he goes, hmm. I'm like, are you tired? Yeah. I'm tired. Okay, right. Total fake yawn. That's not even real. Anyway. I think that's the cutest when he actually decided, like when he says he's ready for bed, like that is, it happens. It's rare, but when it does, it's hilarious. I need a nap. Yeah. He's had like a busy day or something like that. It's just been long, a lot of play and we'll be sitting up and maybe we're letting them stay up a little bit later than usual and be like, mommy, it's time for bed. I'm tired. Yeah. I'm like, okay, let's go. Let's go to bed. All right. Today's program giveaway is maps and a Bollock advance, the newest maps program. Here's how you can win that program. Leave a comment below in the first 24 hours that we drop this video, subscribe to this channel and turn on notifications. Do all those things. And if you win, we'll let you know in the comment section. Also, we put together a brand new program bundle and discounted it. It's called the time crunch bundle. Here's what it has. Maps 15 minutes. Maps anywhere. Maps prime and the eat for performance e-book. It's all discounted $200 off. That means the entire bundle is only $99.99. If you're interested or you want to learn more, just click on the link at the top of the description below. All right. Here comes the show. Hey, I found some, some cool studies on red light therapy, but you know, red light therapy. I've talked about this before. There's a lot of applications. There's also mental health applications. So it's not just skin, hair, joint pain. Those are the ones that I've talked about in the past. They also show it helps with depression and anxiety. A little cognitive boost. I'll look that up. I don't know. But depression and anxiety, red light therapy, like the one you've had. Okay. So like that type of red light therapy actually has been shown to reduce depression in people, especially people who suffer from seasonal affective depression disorder. Yeah. So I got it. I actually did like a live questions yesterday and somebody asked me about juve, red light therapy. And I didn't answer because I actually wasn't a hundred percent sure. Do you know of any actually studies that show any sort, any sort of adverse effects? Was there any negative effects to potentially staying under the red light therapy for too long? Yeah. Too much exposure. Yeah. You can actually too long. You'll actually feel, you'll feel like the skin's a little tender or whatever. That's why they tell you they limit how much you. It's not damaging to the eyes, but I know if it's like direct to too close, it could be problematic. I don't know. I don't know. Actually it showed improved eyesight with that, but don't quote me. We'd have to look that up. Yeah. It's funny that, so UK, you bring that up. So I know the new models, like so the Park City house, we got all the new models in there and they sent, they shipped the like, like tanning goggles. Yeah. Yeah, that's why I think that. But then when I talked to my, my physician about, because I remember when we had max, I was curious if I could, like I wanted to make sure it was okay. Like, is he too young? Is he all right? If I, so I wanted to hold him and we could both be there, like sitting there and laying next to it or whatever. And he says, no, no, it's gray form. And so I thought, and I said, and what about the eyes? He goes, no, it's good for your eyes. So, you know, I was told that it was good. I think it's just because it's bright. Because it's bright, you know, regardless, a lot of people don't like to look into it. I don't like to look into a bright red light. So I tend to close my eyes. But I did, I know that the, our partners at Juve told us that it helps with eyesight. So remember it wouldn't, it's not tissue specific. It red light fuels and feeds the mitochondria or tech, or has the mitochondria produce more energy and become more efficient. Which is the engine of all cells, right? So it's like, I mean, if you can, if your skin's going to rejuvenate faster, if it gets down to the joints and help with joint pain, it's going to help with hair regrowth, you know, all those, all those things that the studies are showing. It's testosterone. Yeah. It's pretty cool. So what's up with, so Elon Musk is going to start a town or something. Oh, right out like 25 miles outside of Austin. I believe he bought, maybe Duncan double checked this, either 3000, I think 3000 something acres and wants to develop an entire little mini city out there. And the idea and the concept is, is to house his, his people. So if you work for Tesla, I think the, you know, and again, don't quote me on this, I believe he said that he's going to rent it to them for significantly less. So I think like the average cost around rental for the, you know, a three-bed, two-bed type of house out in the Austin area or right outside of Austin is like around $2,200. And he wants to like price it at like 800. So it'll be really, really inexpensive. So it'll be part of one of the perks of working there type of thing. What did you find there, Doug? Yeah, at least 3,500 acres. Okay, so it's close. Yeah. Well, so what do you guys think about that? I think that's such a great idea. I think that we already put our team on looking at property over there. I think it's a, I think it's a brilliant, I mean, look at Google, Google is doing it right here, right up the road. Are they doing housing? Yeah. Dude, this whole, this whole thing is bought by Google. Yeah, right down the street. Yeah, they're doing housing for the campus. All those, all that construction on the apartments, all that, that's all Google's tied to that. So they'll put employees in there. I mean, I don't, I don't, I don't know exactly if it's all employees or how the, I don't know the details, but I know that Google owns like all this real estate. So your theory that you had a long time ago would probably come true. Yeah, the campus thing. Remember when I said that, I keep their own money as long as I can. And look at you. They'll pay you in dollars, but then they'll add like Tesla bucks. I so believe that, I'm so glad you brought that up. And I'm so glad that you admitted that I was probably right again. I don't remember saying that you weren't. I think we're all on board. Where are you? Yeah, I think so. What's one of those ones you were arguing with me about? No, no, no. I thought you guys thought I was kind of crazy. I think, I think you thought I was crazy. I was just originally mine. Yeah, but you know. You could take some credit for it. You know, I do think for those that didn't hear that episode a long time ago, I really think that we're moving in this direction where, especially when you look at how polarizing the political landscape has been and how different like every state is becoming. So I think what you're going to start to see, especially these massive companies like Apple and Facebook and Google and Tesla that have a huge community of people that are probably a good similar ideology that start to create these mini towns and you'll get deals on the real estate. They'll get deals on the doctors and the, and I think. The grocery stores, doctors, banks. And I think they're going to make them, if they'll make them competitive as shit, they'll be better. I think they'll be better. This is just reinforcing. I mean, in Austin has been this big tech boom of all these companies that have like moved over to there. This is going to be like Silicon Valley Part 2 pretty much, you know, with him building that and everybody else, you know, in that area. But yeah, I think this would be interesting to watch to see how that all kind of develops where they're like new cities and they kind of create their own standards. Well, think about what you could do, right? You have your standard pay. So you pay an employee, you know, 150 grand a year. However, what's also included with that is 10,000 Tesla bucks every year. And here's what you can get with 10,000 Tesla bucks and then you live in this town. Your rent is, you know, 150 Tesla bucks. You can go to the grocery store here. You don't have to spend a single dollar. Well, I see it as a way of them actually reducing costs, right? That's 100%. Yeah, let's say the average engineer, you know, runs you a quarter million a year and now Tesla can pay that engineer 100K a year and that seems like a dramatic drop for them. But that's okay because his schooling, his doctor, his groceries, his car washes, his like dry cleaning, everything is in this community and he gets enough Tesla bucks a year that it covers all that, which it makes up for the... And it would obviously save money for Tesla because it wouldn't be a one-to-one. So, you know, 20 Tesla bucks would be worth like 40. Yeah, and plus then you can leverage that community on those professions, right? So you bring a doctor in there who's the best of the best. He gets free housing because he lives in the community. He gets to take advantage of all the resources that are in there and then he gets, now he provides a service for a reduced cost to the company and he's fully employed. What does that say there, Doug? It's not just Tesla. So the proposed municipality it says to be adjacent to the boring and spacex facilities that are also in construction. So all these companies that he's a part of... Bro, this is going to start looking interesting. They're going to have these like robots at the front, you know, like letting people in and out and I'm just like trying to... How cool is it to have sports teams that represent them? Twitter versus Facebook and then it's like you get to meet on the hockey... Each house has a robot washing dishes for everybody. Before they fly to the floor they go up there. I don't know, you see that pole, you saw that pole in the forum, did you? Did it shift? Because it was definitely... It was way high up. Just like six months to a year ago it was all you and like none on me and now it's like... It's close, dude. Close the gap. A lot of people are losing faith. We'll see what happens. That's how long until you see entire towns and states become corporate owned, you know what I mean? They have their own army. Mine as well, our government. I don't know, I don't want to go down that route. Teslaville? So okay, are you guys... Are you a fan? I like it. Do you like it? It's all voluntary. That's what I mean. It gives you options. It's voluntary. You have the option to work and what a cool way for them to be competitive to recruit talent. So it's only going to... Reducing the cost of living. It's only going to force all of them to up what they provide and what they give inside the community so it's good for the consumer and the employee who's potentially going to work there. What will be interesting is through this competitive market, let's say this starts to become a thing with these big companies, is to see what they end up realizing brings the most value to the company. So in other words, is it... Let's promote a town and city with perks and stuff that tends to attract young, single, you know, people willing to work 80 hours a week or families. Do we seem to get better value when we promote, like when we put schools in there and we give good care? What's your guess in the family? What's your guess? I think the families produce more stability, more consistency. But I think the dynamic, the innovation... By the way, that's kind of counter to what most big companies want. They tend to like the single person who's willing to work 16-hour days and not take any days off. That's what they... I think that's the belief. But I think in reality, you want... I think married men with children are some of the highest-producing, most productive people because of the responsibility and stuff. That's the argument. Has the strategy then also... Is it still leaning more towards getting the highest performance in terms like a developer in tech companies? Because I forget what report that was, but basically they found out that they could basically replace like, you know, 50 to like 100 of these code developers. Yeah, who was it that told us that? Was it XCO of Netflix? Yeah, it was somebody... I don't remember what you were talking about. Somebody in the tech space brought that up. One high-performing engineer... Or like one... Without produce 20. And so it's worth it to hire one, pay him a shit ton of money, then hire 10 or 15. To actually save the money with that strategy. Yes, yes, yes. I mean, that philosophy was... I remember when I learned that lesson in the gym space. So I remember I was running... This is when I was running... Actually, this is my third club I've managed by this time. And back then, they used to have kind of a blueprint for the square footage of your gym and the amount of traffic you'd have, you should have X amount of trainers to support that. I remember that. And so as a manager, you had this quota that you wanted to get up. Like, oh, you're supposed to have 22 trainers for the size of this facility and this and that. And so they would push that. And so, you know, if I lost down to 18 trainers, so I'd be on this hiring spree and we'd try and hire these people. And same... So I get to my third... One of the last club I finished up at and it was one of the biggest ones. And that was... It was supposed to be around 20-something trainers. And I believe, Justin, you were a part of it when I went... I was all the way down to eight at one point. I was just gonna say... And I remember I decided, you know what? I don't believe this. Crazy. I don't believe this to be true. I believe if I had five to eight studs, just superstars, that we could carry this business. And I predicted that they would be happier because they would be more fed and taken care of. They'd be overwhelmed with their schedule. Plus it was a culture of success, a culture of... Everybody's a winner. Yeah, they were... Versus what the typical makeup of a team is 80-20 rule. You know, 80% of them weren't making very much money and then 20% were making all the money. You'd have 22 trainers and five of them were ripping or I'd say two of them are really ripping. Three of them are doing pretty good. And then the rest were like average or below average. And I flipped that model on its head and I remember them, like the company putting a lot of pressure on me for doing that. I said, you know, luckily we were... We continued to outperform the numbers and so they allowed me to. But I mean, yeah, we proved that we could run this place with a third of the trainers that I was supposed to have in there. And I think they were... The biggest numbers... Month to month. The gyms I ever produced and these are big box gyms where I would have four killer salespeople and a training staff that was between eight to 12. That was always... The numbers always fell right around there where everybody was a killer and crushed it. And when it got bigger than that, it tended to get bloated. You can't focus as much of your training development. But I'd have four killer salespeople which usually was assistant manager, senior sales counsel and two that were like up. If I had that, you know, you give me a 40,000 square foot gym with a $253,000 goal. And we're gonna... Well, it created this culture and it's funny that we wouldn't think this or that the company didn't think this because when you would onboard someone new, so I got this point and Justin was a part of this team. We had eight, just everyone's a master trainer. Everyone's crushing. Everyone's making great money. And then I hired number nine, brand new kid off the street or what like that coming into the... His bar is set so high because everybody on the team quickly they identify if they got what it takes to try and keep up with these guys or they quit and move on and then you go on to the next one. And so I think the power of that is incredible. Versus you got a team of 80% of them are, you know, average or below average. And then they kind of go like, oh, I'm doing all right. I just got here. I've only been here for a couple of months and I'm already doing almost as good as, you know, Mark and Sandy and Richard, you know what I'm saying? So they let off the throttle versus looking up at these eight trainers that are killing it all the time. So it's interesting that there's companies and people that still live, which also example of what we're seeing with Elon Musk and Twitter and you're starting to see all these companies starting... You cut like half or a third of the workforce of Twitter and they're performing better. Yeah. And now you have all these other companies that are starting to reevaluate that. The tech market was so bloated. It was so competitive, so much money was just flying around. Do you know what... Speaking of that, this blew me away. I didn't know how this worked until I was listening in credit the All In podcast. They were dropping some knowledge on this and I didn't know that you could do this. So a lot of what factored into the bloat in the tech, you know, in Silicon Valley is this ability to hand out shares and it not come off the balance sheet. Oh, yeah. Meaning, and I'll just use some random numbers. Let's say the company makes $100 million a year. If you go out and you spend $50 million on employees and stuff, to keep the business running, you only made $50 million, right? So you have to deduct that. But if you handed out $50 million worth of shares to employees, then that doesn't come off the balance sheet. You still are $100 million in the green. So they could appear to their investors as being, you know, not the red. Yeah, super profitable. But you're, I mean, you're still... But not leaving the shed. Because all those people could technically go and cash in and then it was just a factored balance. But it doesn't. So it comes, it's in a different category. And so you have a lot of these tech companies and that's why they were going on these crazy hiring sprees. That's why people love switching from Facebook to Google or hop around these because they get these great packages. Oh, we'll sign you for $100,000 a year but then we're going to give you $300,000 in shares or what that. So it's like, oh, it's a $400,000 come up. And so people are hopping. And then meanwhile, they don't have to show that $300,000 loss or hit to the business because it's not a hard cost like, you know, buying... Like dollars. Yeah, dollars. So now it's getting exposed to investors. So it's getting... So all this, everything that's happening right now with the recession, the pullback, is this is, they're all getting exposed by that. So I didn't know that. I didn't even know that was a thing. Yeah, I know. Cause getting investment money was real crazy. There was a mad hustle for that. And it was like happening everywhere, investing in like all these companies around incubators, popping it up everywhere. So that's all kind of stalling. And you know what, cause obviously we live here and I have a lot of family that works in that space. You hear a lot of these success stories like, oh, so-and-so retired, got crazy cashed out, crazy amounts of shares, so-and-so do. That's the small minority. The vast majority of people that get shares, especially with startups, they end up making nothing. They end up coming out and not making nothing. A lot of sweat equity with no return. Yeah, so it's like, you hear those success stories, which makes you think like this is the way to do it. Well, that's the dream they're selling. Yeah. Well, that was always a dream. Especially the last 10 years. I mean, there's been more success stories of startups. Ann Falls. My sister went to work at Zoom, was a millionaire on paper for a second there during the pandemic. And then it... How much that hurt her stomach that she gets? Oh yeah, she lost it. She lost it. I had to leave the company. I mean, because you saw this, you know, and you couldn't catch out. I remember that when you said... You couldn't catch out? No, you have to keep it for a certain period of time. Oh, because she was new. New. She was a vestigate. I thought she'd already been there for a long time. She was a millionaire on paper at one point, and then all of a sudden to do it, everything went down. Oh. Yeah. I mean, that's what happens all the time to people in that space. Typical. Yeah, it's pretty cool. Well, I mean, sometimes you get lucky. My niece was on the better side of that. So she wrote... She was with Facebook early on. Yeah. She got a bunch of shares on it. Four years ago now, three or four years ago now, like right before the pandemic, so that she bought her first house, she pulled out all... She cashed out her shares to put the down payment on the house. Those same shares today now would be worth one-third. So she basically got it. She timed it right. Oh, yeah. I mean, she wasn't even trying. It was just like she wanted to buy a house at that time. I actually think I remember advising her like, ooh, maybe not a good time to buy a place right now. But looking back now, that was a brilliant move on her part to cash her stock out. Yeah, I have a cousin. And then I have a cousin who's a millionaire from doing that, working in a company to start up with shares. But I know way more people that did that and ended up with nothing. But that's the promise, right? That's why I'm so excited. Anyway, I wanted to bring this up, Justin, because I know you wrote this in your notes. We have to talk about... Which one? Sea Monsters and Whales. Oh, yeah. Okay, yes. Because I know this. What is it? I know this. I want monsters and whales. So there's this interesting correlation here. So Sea Monsters of the past, like they've spotted them a lot of times, they're described as almost like prehistoric, right? Like a serpent. Like a serpent or some kind of head at the top that is poking out of the water. Like Nessie. Yeah, yeah. Blocked next month. One of those things. Yeah, exactly. And so they've noticed this phenomenon in the deep ocean somewhere. And it's been written about for hundreds of years in nautical books from the 1300s or 1800s. Right. And we see in a survey, it was like there has to be sea monsters out there. Many people have written about these and they all sound the same. It's been happening for hundreds and hundreds of years. Maybe even in some paintings that are thousands of years old, you'll see stuff like this. Yeah. But they think they know what the answer is. Yeah. So there's this interesting ritual, I guess I should say, with whales. So is they breed? And so they... I'm not too sure whether or not they stick with one part. Basically, they have multiple partners. So as they breed, sometimes while one of the whale... So if they're having like a threesome, let's just say, there's whale threesomes. I just found this out. One of them, as it waits, flips itself up. And so basically what you're seeing is the whale's penis at the top of the surface. It's a whale dick. It's a whale dick. Really? Yeah. So it's waiting there. Show me what some whale dick looks like. It's waiting. Show me here. Whale dick. Okay. This is really just a message. Whale penis looks like sea monster. We should go on like a week where we like intentionally like talk about things that like... That he has to look up. Yeah. So this is... So for example, the Loctus monster obviously... That can't be a whale. It's a lake. So that cannot be a whale. But I use that as an example. That's not the... Yeah, exactly. So it just looks like that because of... It looks like the head of a... something popping out of the water. It's pretty big. But it's... Yeah. I mean, it's impressive. Yeah, there it is. It is a whale at the end of the day. Well, bro, that looks very much so like that. Yeah. Meanwhile, it's a freaking... It's a whale flashing you. Yeah. It's showing... It's Johnson. It's a whale dick. That is as big as Sal's car. Yeah. Tying it in. I like it. Full circle. Full circle. Full circle. So he... Okay, so if you... That's the whale that's waiting. Right. Okay. There's some freaky stuff going on. That means there's probably a threesome going on. Underneath there. And he's waiting his turn. Yeah, exactly. He's waiting his turn to get in. He's pulling it off a little quick. Let me put this up here real quick while I... Interesting. Well, Fred... Yeah, Fred. Remember when I thought that? I thought chapstick was made out of whale dick. Remember that? What? Remember when I brought that up? What? I thought that was... Chapstick? No, the perfume is... Whale semen. Whale semen. So... Yeah, well, that's what you got. I remember you guys corrected me. I was like, isn't... This is not the first time Justin's brought whale dick up. I'm here for the facts. This is not the first time. Do you know what one of the most expensive... One of the most expensive things you can find from the ocean is, I think, whale vomit? Whale vomit. Whale vomit. Yep. Why? Look it up, Doug. Whale vomit. When it eats a certain type of jellyfish... Ambergris. What's it called? Ambergris. Used for medicine and potions and as a spice. They use it for a bunch of stuff. They use it to stabilize the scent of fine perfumes. Yes. What's the cost of it per pound or whatever? It's ridiculous, dude. Yeah, if you found a huge goop of it on the beach, like you're balling. Yeah. That's like gold. Whales are weird. It's really weird. They have all kinds of interesting traits. Around 10,000 bucks per pound. $10,000 a pound, bro. Whoa. Right? Look at Adam all of a sudden become a whale. Whoa. Adam's going to be collecting that vomit. It's illegal in the U.S. It's illegal? It's illegal to collect, keep or sell, because it's part of an endangered marine mammal. It throws it up. Is it just from sperm whale or like what's... Is it a specific kind of whale? Yeah, it is sperm whale, Justin. Very good. He knows his whales. Justin's on fire. Yeah. Whale. Wait, why would they make that illegal? Doesn't the whale get rid of it? Or are they afraid that we're going to like, that people will capture them? Yeah, it's probably make them puke. I mean, that would make sense. Come on, guys, party. Yeah. That's hilarious. So, all right, more stuff, Justin, that you wrote down that you failed to bring up. But I want to hear... Aw, man. I want to hear... Your tories were bringing notes. He puts notes up there. I'm always like... Well, we go on these tangents and then it's like such an abrupt... You got to wedge yourself in there with Sal, dude. Okay, well... He says, we, he's talking about me. You. Yeah. Challenger. So, yeah, you know the... Challenger, right, that blew up the rocket with a head that brought the... Was that 1984? I think it was 1984. That sounds about right. Things I remember watching as a kid. Did you guys watch that as kids? Yes, I watched it live. And I remember crying with... Did you? With my friend's mom. Like, we were watching it together and I was just like, oh my... Because it crashed and blew up. Dude, we're going to get to the conspiracy, but this was a vivid... This was a huge... Well, it wasn't a mistake from the school. I guess they didn't know this was going to happen. But they gathered all the kids in the classroom. Now, why did they do this? It was one of the first teachers to go up to space. Yeah, we were on the school teacher. That was on the challenger. So they had all the... All these kids... I remember we were sitting in the classroom and then they do the countdown. The whole class is doing the countdown. So it's 1984. So I got to be in second grade maybe. And we're like, ten, nine, eight. And then it takes off and we're like, yay! And then it goes up and it blows up. Yeah. And I'll never forget the teachers turned off the TV and then I saw the teacher go out the door and they were crying. And we were so confused. Yeah, silence of the kids. Yeah, we were like, what's going on here? It was such a bummer. What happened? But anyway, I want to hear this. Yeah, so apparently there's this sort of conspiracy that's working its way around. That's a funny one. I don't know if there's any truth to it or anything, but it's basically that there's been signs of some of the astronauts that were on there that are still alive. That what they would look like when they're older, even with a very similar name or the same exact name they're using and they're a professor somewhere else at a college and there's some examples of... So what's the motive? Why would they pretend to kill them then? I have no idea. There's nothing around that. It's just weird that it blew up. We all saw it blow up. But now you can see later on, and hopefully you can find Doug, some of the astronauts, they showed what they would look like today and then you see these people that they brought up as examples like it's trippy, that they look exactly like it could be them. But why would they fake it exploding? One of them apparently is his brother, the bottom right, and then these are all just older people that have the same name as the astronaut and look like them. So it's like two factors. They use the same name and they look just like them, but a really older version of them. And you're like, what? Why would they do that? Maybe because they were going to... Are they still alive? They were going to reveal the secret. The Earth is actually flat. Is that what it was? Oh, God. I'm telling it flat. Get out of here, dude. Anytime anybody goes to the flat Earth, it's like, done, dude. Conspiracy is over. The best conspiracy theories link together several conspiracy theories. This is true. You have to connect all of them. This is true. I have no idea why. That is not a conspiracy theory, but I love when I see really interesting or smart potential business ideas. It's a whale vomit. Hear me out. Yes. Hear me out. This is our new side venture for Mind Pump. So Doug, go out to search this because I don't know the names of these pods, what they're called now, but I just, I think it's brilliant. They're starting to pop up in airports. I foresee these being lined. Are these the sleep pods? Yes. Where there's like a credit card thing. I love that. I think that's brilliant. Hell yeah. And I think that you're going to see those just lined up. I 100% use that. How many people are going to get caught having sex in those? I mean, probably. You haven't seen all the above. You probably have sex in there, sleep in there, read in there, do all the above in there. You know what I'm saying? You got to always be there right there. I think you just fit one. Misusing it. Yeah, looks like one person. I love that because you have a layover for four hours. Oh yeah. I was taking a nap. Can I go take a nap? Yeah. I told you guys when I had to stay in, when Jessica and I flew to Thailand, we had really cheap tickets. And then we realized why they were cheap. We didn't notice that the, it looked like we only had a two hour layover, but we didn't notice the date was a day later. So we had a 26 hour layover. And I had to, and I was in China and I couldn't leave the airport. Like all those hours you had to be in the airport. In the airport. Look at the ones that are in Japan. Yeah. They've had these for years. In Japan. capsule hotels. You can just rent them for a night. It's a little capsule you stay in. I thought that's a brilliant idea. Super smooth. It is. The person who shared it with me, the reason why they actually, so I was like, oh, this is a brilliant business. But that's not why they were sharing it with me because of our point of moving in this direction of being isolated and not being social. They're like, look at where this, and I could totally see this being normalized where you go to the airport and there's no moral, all this crazy congestion or everybody's in their pods. It's like silent. Can you imagine going to the airport and like the only people that are. The food going inside the little pod. That's right. And then you're in there and you're isolated and it's silent because there's sound proof little pods and stuff like that. And then think of all the other things where you're in these crowded areas, we get a wait in line or do things like that if they start adopting this kind of concept of where you'd like isolate from everybody. So you have privacy and you pay a small fee. So you have that privacy. That's awesome. I'm all for it. I can't stand here. Well, that's why I know it's going to work because it's like, even though I'm not a fan of moving in this direction where we're all less and less social, but the truth is, boy, that's an area where I don't want to be bugged and I could see myself utilized. It's interesting though, if you think of places like I preferred, I don't mind being social and I like being social if I'm out like in the town and I'm going checking out stores and whatever. But like at the airport, like get away from me. Like I don't know what it is. Maybe it's the stress. Yeah. It's already a stressful place. That's why you're already knowing. And then everybody's just all up on top. I hate it. And I hate when you go through when they have to, you got to do the take your shoes off or what is that area called? Security. Security. I hate that. You know what? Even if it's a short line, I feel like I'm being rushed like crazy. Well, there's so much urgency over nothing. Yeah. Like people getting up and trying to like push their way through and get in your bag. I can't help but think that stupid thing that scans me. You got to put your arms like this and they scan you and they always think I have those. You have to check me afterwards. I can't help but think I'm getting like hella radiation or some good shit. Something. So another thing I have for Justin because Sal's already aware of this. So I saw a post on Instagram and it was showing basically how some people can speed read or maybe even how they're going to like write stuff in the future. I don't even know what the whole post concept was, but it like the minute I looked at it. So it was like a whole paragraph. Like I read it like in two seconds and I'm a terrible reader. You did? Yeah. Bro. Sorry. Act a little less surprise asshole. I know. I'm so proud of you. You just didn't get it. So what it so what it is is this paragraph and the first three letters of every word were in bold and the rest were just regular and then your brain predicts it and even as slow as I am at reading I read that shit hella fast. I was like oh and right away I showed Sal I'm like is this how you read? You must have this ability to just see the first three letters really quick and do that. But because it was done in bold my brain picked it up right away and I was able to read it super fast. That's exactly what it was. So why would they not do all books like this? Like it wouldn't the future of printing books would make sense. Jim Quicks hacks? Right. I don't even know where. You know they can also take the first two letters and the last letter and then the ones in the middle jumble them up and you'll still know what the word is because real reading or fast reading or efficient reading is predictive. It's not sounding out. Of course not. Your brain is always doing that. It's impossible. Connect. Yeah. I mean that's how I read is sounding it out in my head as I go and I know that you read way get it done way faster and that has to be because you're predicting what the word is. I just and of course all the books I read I try but I can't seem to wrap my brain around it. Yeah I always scan. I'll scan but then I miss a lot of the meat of it. Well when I saw that it completely like unlocked it for me. Yeah you don't. No. So I told Jessica the same thing and she goes well think about how much more you absorb if you read slower and I said no. No. You guys know this about me. Focus more. When I'm into something and I read real fast I remember everything. No. It's not like I'm like I actually think you I mean remember when I told you guys that hack when Tom Bill you got me to listen at a faster speed I do that too. It does. I actually I take in more than if I'm listening to it slow if I'm slow it's so easy I can be distracted thinking out of the things and then I trail off whereas if it's super fast I have to focus as like what you're doing if you're only reading the first three letters your brain has to be working to predict so you're consuming everything that way it just it kind of completely blew my mind like I did not and then I was like why wouldn't everything be written why would you not write everything? Adam I got your business idea for you. Convert all books to that. An app that does that. All you do is you put your you download your book and just highlights the it just bolds the first three letters first three. Speed reading app. Are you looking that up Doug? Yeah I am. I'm not getting a lot of details yet maybe Andrew has something over there but so there's a three first three letters or first three words? Three letters of every word. Oh of every word? Okay. Yeah first three letters of every word were bold and the whole word was there but it was bold and then the rest of the word was like really light and so my brain just focused on the first three letters and it's crazy because as you're reading it you're not only you start predicting but it's you you sort of put what they're trying to communicate and so I can get I saw myself getting ahead real quick it was wild so wild it's called bionic reading that's what it's called? Yeah I just it's a it's called bionic bionic or bionic reading yeah so a swiss topography designer has a low tech solution this helps people read fast he discovered that bolding the initial parts of words allows the eyes to focus only on them allowing the brain to quickly fill in the rest of the word it's something that could be very welcome for anyone who's availed themselves of one of the best Kindle deals to get themselves a new e-reader so it's called bionic reading so the Kindle does it already? I don't know but I think it's got to exist as an app or something somebody has to have that up look that up because I'm going to for sure going to do that and I would love to try and read a book like that and see what I because you just apply it right it would take the yeah bionic reading look at that interesting it was it was super wild to see that and just without trying yeah I mean it just I would try it out dude I went down a rabbit hole of reading about the training I thought to myself I said this is an athlete that might be interesting to read about because their performance is actually quite remarkable and I've never really truly studied them before so I went down a rabbit hole of sumo wrestlers I did well look I'll tell you what there's super high performance athletes sumo wrestlers are for all intents and purposes the big guys are obese but they have tremendous flexibility and strength and dexterity and stamina go ahead Doug there's an app in the app store called bionic reading bionic reading getting it right getting it right now and you see it Justin just like that one right there yeah very cool so is it all sometimes it's not three letters sometimes it's only two sometimes one right is that right yeah it depends on how many words the longer word letters are in the word can you drop a book in there that's what it says okay yep oh I'm downloading it right bionic reading so sumo wrestlers alright back to that so big people big dudes many of them will be at the higher weight classes crazy flexibility they could do the splits they're strong as hell mobile fast super fast twitch how do they like train like what do they do what do they eat so their diet is really interesting so you know what they do they train fasted hard to exhaustion and around noon they eat a meal and if they say basically you train until you're starving and then you eat so much food you feel like you can't eat anymore and the meal that they eat is an additional dish called chankonabe I think it's called that it does it's the soup that's like no it's like meat there's different kinds there it is meat, vegetables there's could be ramen in there it's this big pot of stew it's a very digestible that way in the soup it's a very high calorie high protein dish have you ever had it I have a couple times it looks like pho no it's not so it's it's meat it's vegetables it's a broth they eat that after they've done that then they'll put rice or noodles in there and then eat the rest then they eat a tub of Ben and Jerry's they do have apparently they drink beer that's it and other things so I thought do they do anything unhealthy because they don't eat fast food the traditional sumo restaurants don't eat a ton of fast food or garbage they drink a lot of beer and sake so apparently that's another thing that they include in their diet for the way lots of rice though too interest but the tradition around sumo that I've been reading about is so fascinating to me so when you start this isn't a traditional sumo right when you start as a kid oftentimes they go into the kid it's very technical sumo's got techniques and skills like judo or any other grappling art they go in and you are basically like like you have to clean you have to wash other sumo wrestlers you do what they tell you like you are nothing until you work your way up and then become a recognized wrestler yourself but when you go into train like it's all about like those diapers that they put yes I swear I was reading about this like they help wash the big sumo wrestlers they feed them their food they help massage them they take care of them for the train so it's like you are working with these senseis until you yourself become at this high level the team manager who used to throw jockstraps like it look at this side oh that's what's his name that's Konishiki Konishiki is he one of the biggest guys or what he's one of the biggest he's Hawaiian yeah he was one of the but I mean you see these guys I think Konishiki was he's huge something like that yeah so he's a 600 pound man okay the way he would move for a 600 pound guy is just it would trip you out I mean imagine that what's the life expectancy on you know one of the biggest celebrations for a sumo wrestler is their 40th is it 40th birthday Doug I'm not sure maybe look it up it's like a big deal they make it that far if they when they turn 40 it's like a big deal so they're regarded as in Japan they're like big time superstars yeah over there that's so wild if we ever go to Japan oh wait I definitely would like to see one of those matches it'd be crazy oh yeah they'll smack each other in the face some of them are fast some of them are very important the average Japanese male lives to 85 oh yeah they have one of the highest life expectancy yeah I didn't know that yeah wow because I was like 65 ain't bad for I mean that's longer 60 to 65 that's better than our NFL players well so think about this you're obese you're this massive person but you still live to 60 to 65 that just goes to show you I know that their traditional way of being massive is healthier yeah I mean they're still American style I'm sure they have some pretty decent cardio they gotta have some decent cardio to be a sumo match they train really hard yeah they do lots of flexibility training lots of foot stomping lots of pounding on the ground I guess it helps them with their speed and dexterity so I'm looking more into cause I'm like I wonder if there's something I could learn from the new map sumo yeah who wants to be 600 pounds in that job bulk like a sumo by the way so here's you want to talk about you want to talk about shitty right so this is I did know about sumo wrestlers that they ate very infrequently cause they do they train for a long time and they eat like two or three massive meals I used to use that intermittent bulking I used to use that as a selling point when I was a trainer and I didn't know any better and I thought encourage frequency I said there's only one athlete in the world that doesn't eat small meals do you know which one cause it slows down your metabolism that's not why oh man that's not why did you guys see spin I know I thought it sounded so right you know I need Doug to fact check me cause I can't I mean my information is coming from tiktok so you can't you can't it's it's pretty reliable Ben and Jerry's ice cream locks locks yeah like a lock for your ice cream so nobody else can eat it so no one else can eat it look it up look it up Ben and Jerry's ice cream lock see if they it's real it is real right Walmart, Amazon yeah so it has a three digit code so it locks the top so people can that's such a dad invention right there so okay so I shared that's you're so not creative though if you use that you gotta do what my dad did put it in containers of stuff that wasn't ice cream hey so are you pulling it up for the guys yeah I'm pulling up right now so I did I shared a tiktok yesterday cause I one I didn't even know this thing existed which I thought that was hilarious it existed and then I saw this girl wow it's a legit lock the top of it right and so this tiktok is this someone's just someone's talking about it like oh yeah someone keeps stealing my ice cream so I got the new Ben and Jerry it's one of those split screens where someone's watching them and so this girl's like talking about how she got the Ben and Jerry thing cause someone in the family stealing it and she's showing how it works with that and there's the other girl who's watching the video and all of a sudden she picks her hand up she got the ice cream and it's flipped upside down she just cut the bottom out I died I'm like what is it's crazy if you buy that for like 30 bucks you know what I'm saying I guess though then there's definitely a culprit right cause how many houses have somebody who's like who ate my ice cream I don't know it was half full my dad used to get so pissed I knew my brother and we would just like take bites and then you know when you take one little bite you sneak and go back and then see how much you can get away you know what made my dad so mad once is that he would buy Neapolitan I think it is it's like chocolate strawberry and vanilla and we would eat we would just we would just scoop out the chocolate vanilla just leave the strawberry just leave the strawberry in the middle just leave the strawberry in the middle we used to get so pissed dude yeah we would do that with like the cookie dough we would just eat the cookie dough balls so it's just chocolate chip ice cream you're like I thought this was cookie dough ice cream you know what yeah you know what I used to piss me off my mom would never buy like the expensive cereals it was always like a malto meal whatever but every once in a while she'd be like no marshmallows I'd go pour it out no marshmallows my brother was like that he's a psychopath leave me with like who in their right mind is just going to eat the the oats well the funny part of that is they poured it out then they picked it and ate it and then they poured it back yeah just thrown away at this point you ruined it yeah so anyway my other then I would get them back because then my mom would buy smacks remember smacks yeah with the frog on it I used to love it that's like one of those they like exactly know like this is like crack yeah this is like a drug smacks here you go what would happen to you now if you ate a bowl of one of them cereals oh yeah explosively running for the bathroom where was the last time any of you had actual like a traditional bowl not magic spoon a traditional bowl of ice cream cereal yeah I had didn't you I had cereals here remember I came in here one day and I'm like I need some carbs I'm trying to bulk a little bit I ran out I forgot to bring some so I stopped the grocery store and I bought honey nut cereals I had these for a while it's gluten free I mean it's not that bad I always hate how he smells bro I honey nut cereals oh oh their cereals are awful you don't like cereals I'm talking about honey nut cereals all of them okay it has a smell to them yeah okay well anyway I ate a whole big bowl remember I ate in here I crashed I think I didn't eat anything like a real like lucky charm no I had I had a whole lot of crunch yeah this was like couple years ago where we were camping and it was like for some reason there's association with like camping you just eat like shitty food cause you're just like oh hot dogs and you know sugar cereal it was a thing so yeah that was the first time I had it with like my kids and they were like oh my God I was giving them like heroine Shout out for today. You did, you had two. Oh, I did. This guy. Sente sent two in and then he forgets his shot. I have one if you can't find it, dude. Well, I gotta go look for it now. Good, Jerry, two slams. I just saw the text before we started the podcast. Jerry sent over two people that said, Sal asked me to remind him. Oh, here we go. Instagram, get mom strong. This is a pregnancy and postpartum fitness specialist on Instagram. Yeah, get mom strong. Good stuff. Check it out. That's a little more relevant than mine. Hey, look, check this out. There's a company called Paleo Valley that makes grass-fed meat sticks that are delicious. They're not dry, like most beef jerkeys. They're high protein, quality snacks on the go. By the way, Paleo Valley makes lots of Paleo-inspired products. Go check them out and get a discount. Go to paleovali.com forward slash mine pump. Use the code MINEPUMP15 for 15% off your first order. All right, here comes the rest of the show. Our first caller is Russ from Florida. Russ, what's happening, man? How can we help you? It is a great day out here. All righty, so a couple of questions, but one of the big ones is satiety when it comes to hunger in bulking and cutting phases. I don't know if it's specifically me, but I follow like a high protein, high carb, high fat diet, but I'm never satiated when it comes to like all my food. Are we trying to bulk? Are we trying? What are you trying to do right now? Yeah, what's the problem? Right now I'm trying to bulk, but I'm some more size and more muscle. So right now when I'm cutting, it's even more kind of painful. I stayed with 1.1, 1.4 range of protein per pound and I never full ever. Okay, so I'm looking at you. You look pretty fit. I see your stats here. You're a muscular dude, 511, 208, 15% body fat. That's a good body fat percentage. Not really in your 22s, you're young. Not really an issue if you're trying to bulk, right? If you're trying to bulk, well, then that just helps. It helps you eat, but this is probably more of a challenge when you're trying to cut. Does this feel like a big deal to you? Like what is wrong with me? Or is it just, hey, I keep eating and I feel like I want to eat more? Hunger pains. Got to explain this because there's actual like medical conditions that can cause insatiable hunger, where you would want to get checked by a professional. And then there's like the typical, I'm a young dude, lift weights, got a lot of muscle, fast metabolism. I like to eat more type of issues. So, and is this out of the ordinary? In other words, have you experienced a dramatic change in your appetite versus how you maybe used to be? I guess the problem is when I'm cutting specifically, I eat 2,300 calories. I can't keep focused on any of my activities when it comes to just normal activities. I'm always thinking about the next meal. And I have it all, you know, I have meal prep and everything like that, but it's kind of an overbearing feeling of, I want more food. That's cause 2,300 calories is low for a dude your size. Especially if you're eating, then you have another, it says 3,800 calories. So, assuming it's 3,800 calories, the bulk, and yeah, that's what I'm trying to put on like a little bit more, like 2,214 right now. Yeah, bro, that's a big gap. Yeah, I would not. 3,800 to cut to 2,300. Yeah, you're gonna feel that way. That's a big drop. You're gonna feel that way. You're cut should, I wouldn't, I wouldn't have you cut. 3,000. Yeah, 3,000. That's where I'd have you go. And 2,300 is way too low of a cut. I mean, maybe a day or two, but it's just too big of a gap. And you're gonna feel really strong cravings from that. I also want to point out this, you know, interesting phenomenon when it comes to bulking and cutting. It's the, I think it's such a, it's so interesting how our bodies want homeostasis so bad that anything just outside of that is uncomfortable, right? So like my entire life of bulking was hard because I had a hard time hitting that calorie threshold in order to put me in like a bulk. And then when it was time to cut, it felt like I was hungry all the time. It's just, it's actually very normal to be that way. But this is extreme to go from 3,800 all the way down to 2,300, it's too much. You don't need to do that. Russ, to give you an example, let's say you were to compete on a bodybuilding stage. So you're gonna get down to a unhealthy body fat percentage, right? Cause when you get on bodybuilding stage, you're gonna walk on their 2% body fat, 3% body fat, just shredded and it's not a healthy body fat percentage. The, you would end at 2,300 calories or maybe even more. In other words, if you did a bodybuilding cut, which I would not recommend to anybody, unless you're trying to compete, you would probably end at 2,300. So for you to go from 38 to 2,300, that's extreme. I would have you at 3,000 calories and that will give you some nice consistent fat loss and it's gonna be way more manageable. But to cut from, you know, that's, you're cutting a tremendous, I suppose at 1,500 calories. Over 1,000. Yeah, that's out of your diet, just to bring you down to 2,300. You're gonna feel, you're gonna feel terrible. You're gonna probably feel fatigued performance issues, sleep issues, libido may change. You'll notice lots of cravings to, you know, to supplement that. So your cuts just too, too big. Part of this challenge too is like the desire. I did. Go ahead. So this is my 3,800, what I put in was what I'm at right now. I just got maybe four months ago, I've been working my way up to 3,800 and I worked my way down from 3,500 on my last cut. So I did it in slow progression, but I wasn't losing more weight and that's where I ended because I didn't wanna go any lower than 23. But in the bulk right now, I'm always hungry. I'm more hungry, bulking, no matter how much I eat. Ooh, let me ask you this, Russ. How are your strength gains right now in the gym? Strength gains are out of the roof. I'm getting much stronger than ever. Yeah, you know what's happening? You're in Russell, bro. Yeah, you're in like a really anabolic state. One of the number one signs that I get for me and for clients when we're building and everything's going right besides strength gains is hunger. They're just like, man, I wanna eat more and then we go to the gym and they get stronger, they eat more and they get stronger. You're really anabolic right now. So it's not a bad sign that you're eating 3,800 calories, you're still hungry and your strength is, you know, according to you doing really, are you hitting PRs? Are you stronger than you've ever been? Yes, yeah, I hit, I don't do one rep max. I do more like boxed four by four type maxes and I just hit 285 for six on incline. So yeah. Yeah, you're a strong kid, dude. You're doing pretty good. Honestly, if you're at 3,800 and you still feel hungry, you could probably hover right around there and you'll slowly build and lean out. Yeah, good point. It's just a slow, I mean, this is the hard part, right? Like, and I get it, you know, you want things faster and so you're like, oh, I should show you aggressively bulk or you aggressively cut, but it's like you're eating a good amount of calories. You're getting stronger inside the gym. You're still hungry. So your body's probably telling you you could handle more calories, but you keep it right around 3,800. I bet you would, you'd slowly, and I tell you what. Composition change. Yeah, just stay at 3,800, trust the process for like three weeks, chest your body fat again, and I bet you your body fat percentage goes down, even if the scale doesn't move. And honestly, that means you're in a beautiful sweet spot. I bet you drop a percent. In the Goldilocks zone. Yeah, probably a percent to a percent and a half every three weeks, which is slow, but you're gonna be building muscle at the same time. That's a nice place to be. By the way, 15% is a good, healthy athletic body fat percentage. It's not like shredded, but it's good. It's a great body fat percentage to be at to build. And if you cut, you can get down to 10%. I think we'd be able to get you down to 10% pretty well, but I love what Adam just said. I think he's 100% right. If you kept, if you stayed at 3,800 calories, kept training properly, kept getting stronger, you'd probably slowly lean out. Okay. Yeah, I've been trying to keep it and not worry about the cutting phase because I'm just kind of enjoying the food right now because it was a long cut. It was too long. Like six months. So it was almost a problem of like that lower calorie range. Yeah, I think you're in a very sweet spot, bro. I think you would just be patient with it. Just stick with the 3,800 calories and give it some time because I think you're gonna, I think you're gonna naturally lean out. And this is where I wanna be. Like I wanna be at a place where I'm eating good amount of calories. I still feel hungry and my weight is kind of hovering around the same. And I bet you if you test your body fat in two to three weeks, you're already going down. Awesome. Yeah. So it's not a normal to be excessively hungry. Eating is 310 grams of protein too much because I'm not feeling like, I feel the rest of the fats and carbs. For your size, so long as you feel your digestion is fine and you're not having issues. If you're not having any issues with your gut or your stool, that's fine, bro. You're a big deal with a lot of muscle. And dude, you're in a really good, you're getting stronger and you feel good. Like you're in a really good place right now. Just gotta be patient. Yeah. Gotta be patient. You're not even really doing any cardio now. 15 minutes of cardio, that's it. So I would just, I would stay the course. And if you want to speed up maybe a little bit of the leaning out process, walk a couple of times a day. So add some movement, not cardio, not hard intense stuff. Just move more, a little bit more throughout your day. You know, week over week, try and increase, I love to increase steps by like 2000 a day for every week I go up a little bit like on a client. And between that, hanging your calories right around the 3800 and continue to get stronger, you're gonna lean out. Yep. Cool. Yep. Alrighty. Yeah, you got it. Good job, Russ. Yeah, no problem, thank you. I just had that quick question. Yeah, you got it, man. Keep it up, bro. I have one more quick question. Oh yeah, sure. When it comes to jobs with people that are away from the gym and your normal diet, what's the best program you recommend? I'm out for context, I'm a pilot and I'm going to school to be a pilot. And I know that the lifestyle is gonna be completely different than how I have it set up now. And I would like to figure out and plan and get ahead of the game to program it so I can still remain healthy. Well, there's two ways. If you don't have maps 15, I'll send that to you because that's very accessible. And you'll be surprised at the results you get. The other option, which would be good too, is when you do have access to a gym, a full body workout, even a couple of days a week, is enough to at least maintain muscle and strength for someone like yourself. So it's like, okay, I can make it to the gym, let me just train my whole body. Maybe do one or two exercises per body part type of deal. Like those two options right there, I think, do you have maps 15? Because if you don't, I'll send that to you. I do not. Okay, Russ. Those are, that's like good generic advice to you. The best advice would be to hit us back when you're in it, right? So we can hear you tell us like how your sleep and stress is and when you do have days off and when you don't, and then we can give you more specifics. So like, stay the course, you're doing good right now. As you, when you start to transition into being a pilot and your schedule gets flipped upside down, hit us back up, hit us back up and then we can talk about how you feel and what's going on. Then we can be a little more specific about what I think because it's, right now we're just guessing, right? We're guessing that, oh, this would probably help you. But it's like, who knows, maybe you feel great training the way you are. You know, I do understand that like, we just had a pilot actually do question, what, last week? Was it last week? Yeah, he was in the Air Force. Yeah, we had a pilot on there and he had fly for 12 hours straight and so we were helping him. So if you haven't heard that, go back to the questions I think we just did last week, Doug. Yeah, I'm not sure which episode it is, but yeah, just go back a couple. Look at the show notes. Yeah. We'll do. Does that be a big, it's like a problem right about, but I know there's other like working out. I was reading on maps 15. So I'd like that one. Appreciate it. Yeah, we'll send that and then listen to that. You'll listen to that question when he called in, because you can hear us go back and forth with him and kind of troubleshoot like what his schedule looks like and you can hear all the suggestions that we gave him. Appreciate it. Thank you guys. All right, Ross. You know what? It's funny is like, what he just explained is an excellent place to be. And he's worried about it. This is where I'm at right now, or I feel like I'm at, I'm literally eating so much food and all that's happening is I'm just building muscle and I feel lean and I feel good. And my appetite's roaring. And I've been here before. I know what, I know what this means. It means I'm super anabolic. It means I'm building muscle. I'm in a place, a really good place when it comes to muscle building and strength. And I know Adam, when you were competing you were saying you were eating like 40 something hundred dollars. I'm so, I've been, how long have I been saying that to you? I'm so envious of where you're at right now. Cause I remember what it's like to just have that roaring metabolism when you've been training hard and consistent and you've put on all kinds of more muscle than you've ever put on in your life. So it's a great place to be metabolically because you can get away with eating out here and there. So long as you stick consistently to training you hit your macro targets. You really get a lot of flexibility and it's a really great place to be. And I mean, I'm on a mission to try and get back there again. And I've been watching you for a while. I'm going like, God damn I wish I could eat like that right now cause that's a, it's a fun place to be. What it is is you're 22 and you're impatient. And I get it cause I'm 40 something and I'm still learning to be more patient, right? So it's really just that. Like you're in a really good place. If you're eating 3,800 calories, you're 15% body fat, you're fucking strong as an ox. Like, and you're getting stronger. Like that means you're building muscle. And the reason why he's so hungry is cause his body's building more muscle and it wants more calories to support it. And by him not bumping his calories, what he'll probably do is just slowly burn body fat and maintain his lean mass. That was great advice. Yeah, so I mean, stay the course, bro. All right, our next caller is Ryan from Ireland. Ryan, what's happening? How can we help you? Oh yeah, lads. What up, man? First of all, I suppose I'll thank you for having me on. And it's a bit, it's a bit surreal actually seeing you on the screen there rather than I'll always see you on screen. Anyway, it's a, it's, it's a bit weird actually talking to you in person. And we've been listening for about five years now. So yeah, love everything you guys put out. It's, it's, it's absolutely amazing. Thank you. Appreciate that, Ryan. Thanks for that. I get into me question. So currently I'm, I'm running maps performance and I'm actually just after starting me toward week, just complete the fourth foundational day on Monday. And during the workouts, I'm finding me energy is just kind of dropping off towards the end. And I suppose my question is, is there any tips you could give me in order to like, maybe reserve energy, last, last, last longer throughout the workout and that sort of stuff or even increase overall energy. I've been, I've been kind of a resistance trainer for about eight or nine years now. And never really trying to find a goal or that I just enjoyed it. Wanted to keep strong, keep healthy. And stuck to more bodybuilding style training throughout the time, but also wanted to get strong at the same time. So allow a volume, compound lifts and then more volume in the, in the exercises. And so yeah, any help, I'd appreciate any help you guys could give me. Yeah, there's a normal, there's a normal drop off and energy towards the end of the workout, but it sounds like you're explaining kind of like a, like I'm really getting fatigued and it kind of, you know, dragging through the rest of the workout. Is that what you're explaining? It's taxing you a lot. Yeah, like, I would say coming towards maybe the, the last second or toward exercises, like I'm feeling like I have to extend me rest period because I'm, I'm absolutely full, to be honest. Yeah, so use creatine at all? I do, I've supplemented with creatine for as long as I've been trying. So eight, nine years. I also eat a lot of red meat, especially at the minute, because I've kind of switched the diet around of last level. There's going to be the answers probably in one of the following categories. Well, the first one would be, you know, sleep. So if your sleep is not optimal, if you're not getting great sleep, that can have a massive impact. The second one would be nutrition and in particular pre-workout nutrition or even for some people, intra-workout nutrition. So he, did you hear what he said? He said he just switched to the diet. So I'd actually like to hear what you did. Did you like go to like a low carb and a high protein or high fat type of diet? What'd you do? Yeah, yeah, that's exactly it. So like, over the last little while, I felt like I was, I was just, I was bored of the way I was eating, to be honest. So I recently, around the same time I started a performance, I switched to like a higher fat diet, which I'd never done before. Now I'm still taking in carbs around the workout. So I'm taking about 60 grams beforehand, about an hour and a half beforehand, about 60 grams after just going to help replenish. I got an idea for it. I got an idea for you, Ryan. Why don't you do, go for 80 to 100 grams before and then have like 20 grams after. So move some of the after carbs to before, that's probably gonna make the biggest impact or go 62 hours before and then drink 20 grams of carbs during the workout. That's the other option. What time are you lifting at? Depends on the day, to be honest. So I work, tends to be like an eight to four type job. If I get an hour off in between, I would, or a couple of hours off during the day, I would kind of head to the gym or the gym five minutes away. So I'd get to the gym. I try to plan ahead though. So like it could be 12 o'clock in the day, but it also could be a rush hour, at six o'clock in the evening when... Okay. Well, I was asking because I wanted to make sure you were like in the afternoon or evening. So I don't know if you've heard me talk about this on the show, but I kind of figured this out for myself. So Sal's advice of like front loading the carbs before the workout is, so I used to have to have two good sized meals with 60 to 70 grams of carbs before my workout to really fuel that workout. And those were my best workouts. If I had half of that, they were kind of, I kind of were, and if I had none of that and I went no carb and I went in like fasted, I just could not train. I would fatigue at the end of it. So I felt I needed that. So I would do what he said. You could either put it in a single meal or you could put it in like two meals before. So like your breakfast, give it 60 grams of carbs, then like your lunch, that's an hour and a half or whatever before your workout, another 60 or so grams of carbs and see how you feel. I bet you'd feel better by doing that. Okay. Yeah, sounds good. Just a quick follow-on question. You mentioned sleep there. I get about seven, seven and a half hours of sleep but I can't not know about quality of sleep. Like, is there any kind of markers there or any, I suppose, symptoms of like how well to judge your sleep, like that you would be familiar with or anything like that? Yeah. This is where like an aura ring would be awesome. Well, you know, you do wake up, do you wake up feeling tired still? Do you just hit the sack exhausted? Here's the other thing too, seven and a half hours, you're probably timing the time you go to bed to the time you wake up, which means you're probably getting close to six and a half to seven because there's a period of time that you're not asleep when you go to bed. So what I would do is I would try to increase that time by an hour. So try to go to bed an hour early or wake up an hour later or half hour each or whatever and that will increase the quality sleep number by the same amount it should. That makes a huge difference for a lot of people like a massive difference. In fact, we just had some of the podcast who tracks these things quite a bit with the athletes that he trains. He tells people to get nine hours because that usually results in seven and a half hours to eight hours of good sleep. Yeah, there's a few things you could do too. One, I have to personally, I have to cut back on my water. So I try not to drink too much water past 6 p.m. or else I'm getting up to pee all the time. I know that I'm magnesium deficient. 60% of the population is magnesium deficient. So mellow before bed is like a game changer for me. Also trying to make your last meal at least a few hours, two, three or more hours before you go to bed. And then what you do with your lights, like in your house, dimming the lights or turning them off, going by candlelight. If you have blue blockers and you're on screens or watching TV to limit that, but really start to put a little bit of a sleep routine together that you're consistent with those types of steps and see how much that potentially improves how you feel. And you'll know, you'll know by the way you wake up in the morning, you'll feel more refreshed when you get up versus like groggy or dragging your feet if it's something that you needed. Now too, you said you're doing mainly like hypertrophy kind of training before this bodybuilder style and then you switched it over towards more of the performance. I'm just wondering because I've had quite a few clients that have never trained that way before and it was a lot more demanding, even just neurologically, like just, to be able to get yourself in all these positions and learn how to kind of go through that and your body got taxed a bit more. So that's a bit normal, if that's the case. And you'll kind of work through. Yeah, and you just lower the intensity throughout the workout to be able to do it all completely. That's a really good point, Justin. If you're used to training more bodybuilder, strong type man, and then you go into performance, performance is a lot. It's totally different. Performance kicks the shit out of me because I don't train that way regularly. So anytime I train like performance, it tax me like a different level than training like strong or like power lift or maps, anabolic. All those, like that's in my wheelhouse, performance kicks my ass. So that's actually kind of normal too. That's a good point. I actually couldn't agree more to it because the reason why I chose performance is because I want to be a bit more functional and get all the rotation in there. So the fourth week, the fourth week I never felt me oblique so much of my life. It was, it was bent over and pain some of the days, especially on the mobility days like me hips, me hips whenever it's sore during the fourth couple of mobility days. Yeah, I think Justin's getting closer to probably what we're, you know, Ryan, honestly, as much as it doesn't sound like fun, you probably would benefit from running through it again. Because this is so foreign to you and it's an area you're trying to focus on as much as you probably want to move on from that program and do a different one, you probably would benefit. He's also 270 pounds, six foot tall. He's a big dude, a big, strong dude. That's going to be an exhausting way of exercising. For sure. But beneficial though. And when you say you're going to run it through it again, Adam, would you say, would you say run through phase one again or run through the whole program? The whole, the whole program again. Yeah, go through the whole, I think you'd benefit running through a whole another. And then also see how much better you ride it, right? Hopefully you feel better the second time around. And if you still don't, it is potential, you know, Sal talked about breaking, bringing down some of the volume so it wouldn't hurt if there's like, so like for example, Oh wait, I go lighter. I bet the, the, the lunge matrix was just a mother fucker. Phase two kills her. Yeah, phase two. Right, right, right. So something like that, like you could probably, you know, take a set off of that or cut or go, like Sal just suggested, really go light, you know, even body weight crushes people on that sometimes. So, so yeah, run it again. And hopefully you feel even better the second time around and or potentially scale back on some of the volume. But it sounds like you had the self-awareness to know that your body probably needed this and you're doing it and you're feeling it a lot. And that's a good sign. That means the body's adapting. And I think you have an opportunity to go through it again. See tremendous benefit still. Totally. Yeah, definitely. I mean, I've dropped, I've dropped weight. I'm still eating the same amount of calories and that sort of stuff. But it's like the new stimulus that's done me the world ago. And so that's perfect. I'll keep running through it. I'll keep going and get more sleep. And yeah, thanks very much. Thanks, thanks for calling in. Yeah, keep us updated. No problem. All right. Yeah, when you train like a bodybuilder for a long time and you're a big dude. That was a great point, Jessamane. You know what it is that you go, you think you know how much weight you use on certain exercises and you try to apply it towards a functional workout like performance is not going to be the same. Performance is just a bitch, bro. If you've never trained, if you don't train functional training like that, like you saw it too, since we brought Lunge Richie, like, oh, they still have nightmares about that. PTSD, like for half the people. Yeah, I know. Different style of training. Sounds like he's doing great though. I mean, he's eating the same amount of calories and he's dropping weight. So I mean, yeah, I think he would benefit from running it a second time, for sure. All right, our next caller is Kerry from California. Hey, Kerry, how can we help you? Hey, guys. First, I just wanted to say thanks for all the great information you guys put out. I find you guys hilarious. So sometimes I'll go to listen to something else. I'm like, no, I just want to listen to those guys. Yeah. Thank you. Forget all that other stuff. Yeah. So just as a background, I'm seven months postpartum with my third child and I'm just kind of trying to set myself up for success in the future. In the past, I've always been someone that worked out, but I kind of was doing the diet my whole life, very restrictive during the week. And on the weekends, it would be more off track and then starting all over on Mondays. And when I found your podcast a few months back and heard like, oh, there's women eating like 2,200 calories at maintenance, I was like, what? That's not possible. And just listening more and more to you guys, I'm like, wow, I don't have to do cardio and eat at 1,300 calories to lose weight. So now I'm at a point where I have maybe like the last 10, 12 pounds to lose and I'm still breastfeeding and I just don't know what direction to head because I've never done, I guess a bulk, although I feel like that's kind of what I've been doing the past several months because I'm not really losing weight. I'm just sort of lifting weights and wanting to lose weight but sort of just staying at the same place. I'm probably at about like 22 to 2,400 calories a day and I just don't know where to go from here. I kind of want to be at a good position after I'm done breastfeeding to keep the weight off but not having to live at 1,400 calories. Are you following a mass program? So I had started doing the 15 minutes program and it was really liking that but then I kind of feel like I would like to do a little bit longer of sessions, fewer days a week. So my husband has aesthetics so I was considering doing that or maybe I listened to your podcast salad day where you were describing like how you came up with anabolic and I swear I listened to it like three times because I was like, wow, the science behind this is amazing and I love the idea of the trigger sessions. So I was thinking, should I go for that or should I just do the aesthetics? Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, go maps anabolic, maps anabolic. Aesthetic is way too much volume and it's just not gonna produce the results you're looking for. And while you're nursing your baby, while you're still breastfeeding I would not try to go into a cut. Definitely not. That's a bad, just a bad approach. It typically doesn't result in great results. So I would try to maintain or just build strength throughout the process and then when you stop breastfeeding you'll be in a good position to cut a little bit but the body fat percentage right now, you're doing great. If you were my client, I would say, we're not gonna cut. Let's just feed your body, switch programs, build some muscle, you'll probably naturally lean out slowly through this process but I wouldn't want you to aggressively try to lean out. I'd actually want you to bulk right now. I think you're in a good position. The fact that you're eating 22 to 2400 calories, you're not really gaining, you're not really losing at that pace. Doug's gonna send you maps anabolic, we're gonna send that over to you for free and then I also want him to send you the reverse diet guide and I actually think that a good goal would be to slowly increase your calories kind of week over week and if you can, get some walking in. So what I would do is like, if I was training you, you're at, say you're at 2300, just so we'll take the middle there, where you're at 2300 calories, we'd stay there for a week or two and as you're running through maps in a bulk then I'd bump you up to say 24 to 2500 calories. When I bumped you up, I'd say, okay, now I want you to go and walk an extra 2000 steps a day which is about a 30 minute walk or so. I'd say I want you to add that every day and then just let's see where your body goes for the next two weeks, hopefully in the next two weeks I don't see any gain, weight gain on the scale and then I'd bump your calories again and I would just keep doing that until we get you to a place you've never seen before like 27, 2800 plus calories and you're not gaining any weight and now we've really set yourself up for when eventually you're off breastfeeding and then we go the other direction. That would be ideal. Yeah, so maybe by like 100 calories each time I bump or- Yeah, that's about right. Yeah, that sounds amazing. I love that. And then I just have two kind of like quick questions for you guys. One, I find with like my deadlifts, my lower body feels like it wants to go heavier but my grip and is like for like maybe eight reps I'm feeling like, man by the eighth rep, like I'm gonna drop this but my legs are heavier. So what do you do when it feels like your upper body isn't quite matching your lower? Well, the weakest link is what's gonna determine the weight. So you're gonna lift the weight that you can handle and it really doesn't matter if it's your legs or your hands or your back that can't help. So you're gonna train within that range. The other thing too is are you using an alternate grip or double overhand grip? I'm using, I guess, I'm using not, no, I guess when I'm doing my deadlifts I'm doing overhand. Okay, so try using an alternate grip. So one set, we'll have one hand facing forward one hand back on the next set. Switch and you'll be able to hold onto a lot more weight that way. You can also do this when I'm heavy deadlifting with some of my, I have a client who is like who battles with carpal tunnel and we're always in like her grip is her limiting factor. And so let's say we're doing a heavy day where we're doing five reps and I wanna really push her strength and it's her grip that gives. We'll do two reps and then I'll let her set it down for a second and then pick it right back up as soon as she can. So you don't have to hang on and do the say eight reps consecutively with like not a breather for your hands for a little bit. I'll let her do that. She'll do a rep, set it down, relax her grip for something. Grip it again, pick it back up, relax her grip. But if you're not using the alternate grip though, the alternate grip, you'll be able to handle like a lot more weight with that. Oh, okay, yeah, I've never tried that. That sounds really cool. And then final question. I was looking at your no BS abs and I was like, oh, I love training abs. And I was like, I had heard people say oh, women shouldn't really use weighted abs workouts because you're gonna like bulk up your midsection. So I'd love to hear your thoughts on that. Kerry, how do you feel whenever you hear anybody say women shouldn't and then blank? Yeah, exactly. That's a red flag. That's a huge, anytime you hear women on mute, right away, women shouldn't and that's a red flag. No, no, no, yeah, your resistance on, as long as your forms gotta be good, okay? You have to have good form and technique but training with resistance is like any other body part. It's just gonna develop it better, sculpt it better. You're gonna get stronger as a result but your form has to be good. So make sure your form and technique are good. You can slow your form and technique down so that you have more resistance by slowing the weight down or by slowing the movement down or you can add resistance. But so long as it's appropriate, it's just like any other body part. In the day, yeah, it's a muscle like all the rest. So you just gotta treat it that way and have appropriate weight and resistance to progressively overload. So you just gotta do it real gradually. Lifting heavy for your abs will make your abs more visible at a higher body fat percentage. That's the perk of doing that. So if you wanna see your abs and not have to be as lean as maybe you had to in the past to see them by you lifting heavy will allow you to do that. It's just like when you work, you've been working out for a while, you look like you're pretty fit. You know that when you build muscle in your arms, they look more sculpted. They look leaner even at higher body fat percentages, right? So it's the same thing with your core, no difference. Cool. Oh man, thank you guys. That was awesome and keep up the great work. Yeah, thanks for calling in. Thanks, Kari. Yeah, I got any time and anybody in the fitness space, women shouldn't, oh, shut up. Your tits the hell out of me. Oh, it's so annoying. Cause women have really been, I mean we're all sold false information in the space, but women are sold the most false information in our space. It's terrible. I hope she reaches back out to us. I'd love to hear her progress. I think she's in a really good place right now. I mean, she's, what, 1,300 calories is what she'd end up doing to diet in the past. She's at 22, 24 right now. I train a lot of postpartum women and all we would do is I would say eat while you're, you know, eat when you're hungry, eat to your satisfied, just focus on healthy food. And what would naturally happen is it would naturally lean out. It's typically a bad idea when you're, especially when you're breastfeeding, especially when you're within, you know, 10 months postpartum and, you know, breastfeeding and 10 months postpartum to try to cut, to try to actively cut. It's really fighting an uphill battle. It's not setting you up for long-term success. Yeah, just eat healthy, eat when you're hungry, eat to your satisfied, lift weights, and what'll happen is it'll naturally lean out and you'll end up with a really great metabolism which will put you in a good position, you know, when you're ready to start the cut later on. Look, if you like Mind Pump, head over to mindpumpfree.com and check out some of our guides. We have guides that can help you with many health and fitness goals, almost all of them. You can also find all of us on social media, Instagram. You can find Justin on Instagram, Mind Pump Justin. You can find me on Instagram at Mind Pump DeStefano and you can find Adam on Instagram at Mind Pump Adam. Today, we're gonna teach you everything you need to know to build a strong, well-developed chest. When I think of weak points and areas that I struggled with developing for a really long time, chest was up there with the work part. Yeah, it was for me, it was for me for sure. I got more caught up in the weight I could lift versus how I was developing my body. I think it's one of the most challenging muscles to develop for most people because the form and technique.