 Good evening everyone. My name is Natalie Nelson. I'm the director here at the Pence Gallery. Thank you so much for coming to our artist talk with our wonderful participating artists from the Bay Area Clay Show. We are not amplifying this, so we're going to try to speak up loud, but we are videoing it. So we're going to have a question and answer period at the end. So if everyone could step up to the mic and speak their question, we'll get to record you on video. So that would be great. So happy to see you guys all here. I know some of you came last night to our opening, which was really spectacular. I thought it was important that we have a talk with the artists to really hear directly from them. We don't have all the artists here, of course. But I did want to thank and welcome the following artists who are all participating artists. We have Lisa Reinertson, who's also going to talk about being the curator of the show, Monica Vanden Duel, Arthur Gonzales, Mark Lancet, and Aaron Toul. I am going to function more as the moderator, and we do have some questions for the artists, but we thought it was really important to hear from the artists themselves. So we're going to give them basically 10 minutes each to talk about kind of the socio-political critique of their work. What is their theme? What is something that is very important to them that they're delving into in their work? And how are they trying to convey that? So it's a big topic, art and politics, and we're also going to hear from Lisa Reinertson. How did this project come about? Because it's changed when she first conceived it. It was a very different time period, and so she's going to talk a little bit about pulling this show together, which is quite the amazing show if you've seen it. I do want to thank our sponsors quickly, the City of Davis, the Andreessen Fund, Jim and Sue Smith, and Tandon Properties helped us support all of the programming you see as well as the exhibit, which was no small feat. If you want to help support us, support the pens, buy a catalog. Thank you. Buy a piece without further ado. I'm going to turn it over to Lisa Reinertson, who's going to be talking about the evolution of the show. Thank you, Natalie. I do want to just say a brief thank you to all of the artists that have hung in there with me throughout. This is the third evolution of this show. It was first proposed at the National Ceramic Conference in Portland at ANSICA, which was wonderful, trucking all our stuff up there. And then again at Art's Benisha, and we've produced catalog about the show, and then so far this is our final show here at the PENTS. So anyway, the panelists that are here, I want to thank all of you guys for participating in this tonight, but all the artists that are here too. Hopefully if you have some questions about their work, some of us can answer. Oh, speak even louder. I'll try to speak louder. Anyway, this was a community effort and I really appreciate all of the artists. In the first place all the amazing work they've done and all the lugging of art back and forth. It's been really wonderful working with everybody here. A little bit about why did I do this show, what inspired me? Can you guys hear me well enough? Sorry, you want to move up? Yeah, but I want to come up closer. So I'm going to back up to when I was growing up in Sacramento. All the way back to my teenage years I've been immersed in this world of ceramics. I started working with Clay as a teenager and the Candy Store Gallery. How many of you have heard of the Candy Store Gallery in here? Okay, not that many. It was a little gallery up in the town of Folsom outside of Sacramento, east of Sacramento. And there was a woman at Eliza that started this little gallery and she brought in the funk artist. She brought in Robert Arneson was there and David Goholy was showing there, Clayton Bailey was showing there. And other artists also. So I was exposed to that work early on and thought it was really wonderful and there was really pretty exciting ceramic scene that was happening and that would have been in the late 60s for me. And with all of that work, through humor, a lot of the funk work, there was a side of that that was addressing social political issues in humorous ways. Or sometimes it wasn't necessarily social political but there was this content in the work. And so some of these early ceramic artists such as Bob Arneson, Viola Fry, Stephen Destabler, I saw them as all being artists that they decided to take on Clay as a fine art medium and to address some of the same concerns that fine art painters or sculptors were working with. Pop art was a big thing in the 60s and I think pop art influenced funk quite a bit. I mean I can even see with Richard Shaw's work here that tromploi work but he's also depicting objects from our daily lives and through that making commentary about the society we're in and what we have as objects or how we live our lives. So Viola Fry's work I think, especially some of the later work, there were gender issues especially when she started doing these giant figures and businessmen in giant suits and there were topics that she was addressing in that work. And then Stephen Destabler, very different side of things but there was more of sort of a spiritual aspect and looking, I guess all of the work I'd say in that time had a level of humanism and social consciousness to it that really did inspire everyone here at the table, I would guess and probably everyone in the show. And so there are a few things about this, the title Bay Area Clay, I do think this Northern California region and Bay Area I'm extending all the way to Davis and Sacramento, Folsom. There was this community of artists that influenced each other and inspired one another. A lot of people ended up at TB9, several of us in the show were students there with Bob Arneson, temporary building number nine here at UC Davis. So part of it the Bay Area region I think had its own thing happening and the social consciousness, the legacy of social consciousness I think that these early artists influenced their students or other people that just observed what they were doing and some of the people in the show, like Wanshing is in this show, his background as an artist was in China and he came out here and was incredibly influenced by Arneson's work and the freedom of the funk art that was happening and how that impacted the work he's doing now. So whether it was a direct influence with teacher or just by seeing the art, you know you learn by looking at the art that social consciousness permeated through this work and sorry I'm stumbling here, but the legacy part of it where I think these ideas have been passed on and again most everybody in this exhibition is connected as either sort of mentor or educator in some way themselves either as teachers or Arneson, well you've been a teacher too but you've been the tech at UC Berkeley. People after that. And you know Richard Knott, he does workshops all over the place, so in some way or another all these people for the last somewhere between 40 and 20 years or so have also been influencing the younger generation of students. So I sort of see us as sort of a second generation group of people and again why did I want to have this show? I don't want to be a curator and I really see myself as an artist part of this community but I felt like I wanted to tell this story of the social consciousness and the political aspect, political social aspect and a lot of the artists really keep it very subtle and didn't necessarily want me to talk about it. It's like well that's that subtle thing that people may or may not get in my work. Don't make me talk about it. But I wanted to bring it to the surface and I could talk about the fact that I came up with the idea about a year before this terrible election that happened and presented it to MCCA and so then it just suddenly seemed really timely to everybody when the exhibition happened in February after that last election. But it's been really a wonderful trip with you guys and I think at this point I'll pass it along to let you guys talk about, you know, your own work. Your own work, yes. I guess that's me because I'm sitting next to you. Monica you're next. Can you guys hear me? Oh yeah because it's... Does it work? That's for the... Oh it's just for the camera. So it could be yelling into the camera. Okay well it's hard for me to just sort of start talking blankly. I'll start with question number one. But I'm also more than happy if you guys have questions or interjections or objections. Just please ask me questions just to kind of keep the conversation going a little bit. But of course I also want to thank Lisa and the pens for hosting this last, hopefully not last but last for now, version of the exhibition and for Lisa for putting all her love and energy and labor into keeping this party rolling to the third stop here. It's a lot of work but it's been a lot of fun as well so very happy to be here. And I was also happy to be included in the exhibition. I think I would put myself in the category of, I don't think of myself first as sort of artist with social consciousness. I think when Lisa and I were talking one day I responded to the idea of like humanism. As being kind of a constant in my work. So I think two of the three pieces, the like still life pieces are the work that sort of started. Can you guys really hear me? Yeah? Okay. Okay. Are you just pretending to? See they can't in the very back row. So I'm going to have to yell even a little louder. I'm just loud there. It's hard. Don't worry about that. Sorry you guys. I'll try to talk a little louder. So I would say like the two sort of still life pieces that are in the exhibition are what I started. Round one of this exhibition with. Sorry the mic's only for the camera. Oh yeah the mic doesn't work for the people. It's not for the people. It's just for the camera. You can move your chair over here. Sorry. It's tiring. That's what I'm saying. So the piece that I kind of snuck in that was I think more of kind of an environmental response that was more recent is that fire, the flame piece which that's kind of my newest series of work is a lot of things that are on fire. And the big flame was sort of the first most obvious version of that new series. So that one feels like a little bit more of a direct response to not just the actual fires and the environmental degradation that's become more and more obvious going on around us but just kind of a feeling of like panic and urgency I think that might be in the air. I think is kind of what got that series rolling for me. And another question that I responded to in this list there's we had sort of a series of questions to ponder was like the relationship between like the political or social concerns of our work and the aesthetic concerns of our work and sort of how you kind of toggle between those. Is it the concept? Is it the image? And for me honestly like without the image without it being like a strong sculpture or what I hope is a strong sculpture I'm not really interested in kind of pursuing the concept any farther than that. So I just really wanted to make a giant flame and even though it was rather obvious and not particularly subtle I just kind of went straight for that big flame first. And it relates to the colors and stuff and the still life work but that was kind of the beginning of that series. I don't know how I ended up in that place. It started off sounding more coherent. Ended up there. What else was I going to talk about? I guess the idea of teaching I think is another thing that is not obvious in the work but is also important to me as an artist. And mentors of mine and people, art historical influences. You know I think I share influences probably with a lot of people. Not just the ceramic artists but artists like Goya who you know you obviously can't compete with an artist like that. And then even people that might be a little less obvious like Phillip Guston who are just more kind of provocateurs and sort of cultural reporters in a less obvious way are people who have influenced me. And then you know all the hundreds of artists that I kind of communicate with on a daily basis are also kind of having their influence on me. And teaching itself is a big part of sort of how I think of myself and has become kind of a creative part of my personality as well. I put quite a bit of energy into maybe not as much as I should. Sorry, students back there. I try to put a lot of injury into that as well and kind of consider that as important and as creative as my time in the studio. And it's always a balance. I always want to be in my studio if I'm teaching. And I guess I wouldn't say I always want to be teaching when I'm in my studio. But if I didn't have that I don't think that I would have quite the connection to my work and sort of the connection to my community and to the world at large that I would have if I were simply a studio artist. Although I wouldn't mind giving it a try for a little while. That clearly wasn't 10 minutes but yeah. Yeah, I'm hoping for a lot of questions. Can I pass? Okay, back to questions later. You have a piece hanging on the wall in there and I was wondering how you have that hanging technically on the behind it. It's just like a French cleat like screws, wood. Yeah, it's just like a simple French cleat bolted in. There's like a frame on that one that I screwed into. But good question. Olds want to know how to hang something. I'm pretty bad at it. Hi. I wanted to first say thank you to Lisa Reinerston because this is something that's not just a little thing. This is a huge thing. The one thing that I often want in my exposure of my work is to be associated with people I care about and are I care about. Everything is association. So that if I'm in a show and everything is about honestly about superficiality then I'm not going to be taking too seriously when people look at my work. I mean not that the subject could be contemporary superficiality but sometimes I feel like that sometimes. Because I'm thinking why am I in this show? Is it just contemporary ceramics or is it not only a cup? Sometimes I have a show like that. And so it's really refreshing to be in a show where as you enter the room even though there's different degrees of what may be considered socio-political work because that's a big umbrella that at least you enter the room with a certain kind of understanding or a certain kind of posture of how to see when you look at everything. And so that's very, very important. And also the thing is I think that is important is the fact that we're not all just one kind of artist. I think if you are saying well that's a socio-political artist and that's actually kind of two dimensional if that's the whole sum total of who you are or what your art is. And so we're actually like every single one of us is like a goulash of possibly different themes, you know. At least I see that when I look at work. And also the thing is I really like, I'm really happy not only that these are my friends but that I really do respect their work too. So I'm just saying thank you Lisa for doing this. It's really a big deal. And I'm really super happy that it's gone three times. It's like it was too huge. And the fact that it has is an indication of how good the show is because it just needs to be seen more as opposed to just an in-seeker thing, you know. So that's why I need to throw that out first. I never thought of myself as a socio-political artist and I still don't. I mean that's really kind of, it's almost like my wife was here she'd like be rolling her eyes all the time. But... No. Emissary for my wife. The thing is that what I do in my, and actually it's interesting that I'm seeing this quote, the second question about Bob Arneson saying the personal is political and actually maybe that was subconscious or something because I've always thought that myself, I'm my teacher so maybe that's where it came from, you know. But I think that one thing I realized is, if personally speaking, me, if I went out to pursue a piece of art that was going to be talking about how I feel about a certain subject or certain aspects or politics or social phenomenons of today, I'd fall flat on my face. It'd be so dumb. I wouldn't even know how to begin, you know. But the thing is that what I realized in terms of subject matter, if I go into things that are interesting to me on a personal level on a almost like a aha moment, like not that I have any answers, but if there's certain questions I might see or think about or I'm pondering and if I'm pondering something then that's probably worth making art about, you know. Maybe it's a series of pondrances, you know. But if I make something and it satisfies like that and then you throw it, put it out there and somebody comes up and you get, that's why I like Kaka because people will approach you and talk about the work. But the thing is that they approach you and they say, you know, I know nobody understands your work but I do. Sometimes I get, you know, I know nobody understands that piece but I understand it. And if like eight people come up to you that day and say the same thing, then you're hitting a social level on a personal level. It's like these are our personal stories, right? These aren't umbrella terms. These are aspects of how you feel about how this affects you. When you're seeing art out there, you're seeing a person's opinion about what they think about something. It's not generic. And if it's generic then you kind of like, we'll walk by it, you know. But it's when it hits you on a personal level, I get that, that's interesting. You know, with me it's funny too because I actually intentionally don't want to have to answer it. I don't have answers but I have a lot of questions. And so sometimes I'll put something, or a lot of times a real MO of my work will be, you understand every part of it but there's some things that you don't get. And then they will say, why did you put that in there? And honestly a lot of times because I don't know, I don't have an answer. It's frustrating to come to me and ask me what that meant. A good indication of that piece is called Stink Eye which actually is the newest piece. The other two are really old pieces. The Stink Eye is the boy with the trees, with the pocket knives. And that was actually something I actually pursued. I don't usually go for an actual theme or a character study and that's more like the tough kid who the nice boy that ends up all of a sudden maybe due to puberty or something, now he thinks he's a badass. And he's got his pocket knife collection and he's got this rose bush. Well, rose bush is our thorny, right? It's a rose bush that's upside down. That's a root system. It's his umbrella. And then there's this book, it's making these two stamps. The book with the two red dots, and that one, that's pretty bloody. But sometimes they're not. And it's like this thing, it's like motif. This book, open book with two red dots. And people want to know, what are those two red dots? And I go, well, what do you think they are? And I'll get really interesting answers. Like, wow. So that's a place where the artist comes to a certain point and then the viewer finishes it up and coming together there's meaning. And the meaning has nothing to do with my intention. My intention actually is often not as deep as the viewer's. But the thing is that the idea that if you put together a sculpture in a certain manner where the viewer will approach it in a certain way and as an act of approaching will be coming together. That's what I like about Aaron Tool's work, for example, is that the actual grasping of an object that you might be, later on, you can't wait to fill up and what happens when you actually drink out of this object that has that kind of imagery on it and are you claiming something by using a cup like that and what's happening with that? Is it subconscious or is it conscious? That kind of thing. And I think those are the things that are really exciting about when you work work. A lot of times people will say that the work is very layered and it's intentionally layered in that I'm thinking about the brand new piece that's in the Natula's show, for example, and also the piece called Acid Rain here, there's really a lot of connection even though Acid Rain is extremely old. I made that piece in 1986. And a bit of DNA, that animal, they're both 1986 or so. No, one's 86 and the other one's 1988. I remember actually making those. But it's all about... Sometimes you make them, you don't remember anything about them but I remember actually... I can remember back in the day I was cutting that wood. I had to get a new blade for the night. The thing is that... One thing I wanted to also share with y'all about a funny thing about the whole socio-political idea is how my intentions in one piece was not at all interested in talking about those kind of things. And that piece is the earliest one called a bit of DNA. Now that piece has actually traveled a lot around the country a few times. And as being an indication of politically interesting work, DNA and what we think about when we hear there were DNA and before OJ trial nobody knew what DNA was. Now it's in your lexicon, right? But before that people... What is DNA? And when I went to high school, I went to Christian Brothers High School in Sacramento and I had an excellent education. I took all these science classes. As a matter of fact they didn't have any art. You just had science and math. Not very fun, but I got a good education. The thing is that I learned a lot of stuff that I knew I was never going to use. When are you going to use that? And I learned about the DNA molecule and the parts of an atom and the parts of a cell and that kind of stuff. DNA, deoxyribonucleic acid, what am I going to use that? And so I thought, well, I'm going to put it in my art. I'm going to call it a bit of DNA and that way I can say, well at least I used it. You know? And so I had fun with it because it's a DNA molecule on this thing and I always was making kind of a morphish kind of shapes, animalistic things. So that was a natural go-to and then the antlers or whatever this thing was was kind of a the plastic thing is a take-off on the DNA molecule as well. And that was the long and short of it, you know? And so the thing is that and then people would come out and say, what's DNA? And I said, well, you know, when I was in high school I'd tell the story, right? And then time has gone by and now it's considered like a very important piece. Who knew? Now you guys know. The reason is that acid rain is more of an idea of just more of a really innocent, I mean these are two figures that are very innocent looking, right? Kind of young kids. And one's a little animal guy and they're both like, and I thought it's just like a passing kind of like scary idea was like what if acid rain really was acid? What if it was really raining acid? That's the scary thought, right? And so this piece is more about, you know, that's why the boat is skeletal and the water, even the water has holes in it, you know? But also when I think about it I'm thinking about the composition so that from across the room you'll see you don't see all that stuff on a cross room. I mean, across the room you'll see this shape this shape and this shape. And that, I think the composition interesting composition is what brings you across the room to look closer. And it's when you look closer that hopefully you're sharing something more in whatever manner. Now that I have your attention what is the piece saying? Anyways, so I just wanted to end up with that. Okay, thanks. You may have noticed that a lot of us are starting by thanking Lisa. And that's because we have watched her on a hero's journey. She has worked with three different bureaucratic structures and doing things that a lot of artists work very hard not to get involved with. And we have all been the beneficiary. I do want to say Lisa that please at some point on this panel talk about your work because it has been a great guiding inspiration for me for decades. And so we need to hear about that. So let me just kind of start I'm going to go talk briefly about graduate school because of that chances are you're going to be strong. I had a pretty tough graduate school experience and I remember one party where all the professors were sitting around and the students and somebody kind of artificially came up with the idea what is the purpose of art? And we all began our you know we were kind of it was just literally down the couch and everybody had an explanation which remarkably reflected their own work so somebody who was doing non-objective one color field painting would talk about flatness and how significant that was. It got to me and I just simply said to save the world and they all moved away from me and continue to do so. And so I just realized this has brought that memory back to me but I do want to say I am so honored to be in this company these people have been so inspirational to me and it reminds me of a fabulous essay by T.S. Elliot who talked about the role of a masterpiece and he's really writing to writers about how to become a great writer and he says start by identifying your masterpieces, the things that you admire and love and Arthur does something with his students that I've stolen with my students you make them all do like a notebook and you did it for yourselves right? All the pieces that you admire and you think about you want, you don't want to copy these things but you want your piece to fit comfortably in that company and that's what T.S. Elliot said is that you want to make work so that it'll be strong enough to move up into that realm of masterpiece and push everybody kind of make more room for you and then there's a family of these and you're part of the family and Lisa by including me in this has put me I've admired and been inspired by my friend and mentor Dick Notkin for decades and Lisa and Arthur. I think I think Arthur's work I can't I think there could be a novel written about every one of his pieces and I would so love to read that entire series right? And and Aaron has inspired me in so many ways that I don't even know how to speak of so anyway it's so great to actually have my work put into the company of the people I admire so let's see I was gonna oh that's right so let me tell you I've got some pieces in the show I gotta tell you the thing that is most animating to me is getting myself out of control in the studio I have learned this post graduate school that it is really important for me not to know what's going on and I get the role of mystery how do you surprise yourself in the studio because I learned through a number of mishaps that when I don't know what's going on in my work it gets a lot better when my work looks like something I intended it's not nearly as strong as when it emerges and I'm kind of participating in something bigger than me and so I have developed all these tactics to surprise myself as I work and the large piece Dave and the little piece Tiz of V come from my most recent series of figures that emerge from this idea so I start I just start with all kinds of textured slabs and I throw I have trays of forms that I throw on the wheel and I have extruded trays of extruded forms and I just clean them all up and then I start building and I build and I coil and I build and I kind of create these kind of rotting pieces of architecture that kind of just emerge and develop and grow and then at some time I know it's going to be figure because I love I've got to do figure so I'm working to get this this figure starts to emerge and when I get to the figure I know where I'm going and that's a problem so I grab a hunk of extrusion and I just slam it in there and I don't know anymore and I have to make sense of it and so I struggle and I make sense of it and then oh I know what's going on again so I grab a slab and I throw it up there and I see that's the wrong way to say that but I put it up there and I'm out of control again and I have to make sense of it and that kind of that's one of the techniques I've come up with to surprise myself so how does that become social conscious because that's really how those pieces and in the fact is you all are socially conscious and when I allow myself to surprise myself it also allows in order to do that you have to trust yourself in the studio and graduate school teaches you so many things that I'm not dissing graduate school is a very important right of passage and growth for me but or however and the reality is it took me about five to ten years after graduate school to begin to trust myself in the studio and when I could all the things that I feel about the world around me were invited into the work and they emerged in a so much more humorous and meaningful and powerful way than they had when I was intending to say something and that's where Dave and Tiz of V they come about they kind of taught me what they were about and I think what their central feeling for me is is that we all are made up of all the things we do in the world right so the things and I don't know how the things that like I would guarantee you that each one of us is carrying just a little piece of Dow chemical in us right now a little bit of Monsanto we got it in us right and boy if you weren't socially conscious before November 16 you've got to be now and if you're not you are really not paying attention right so if you're trusting yourself in the studio this kind of work for me has always naturally emerged and I've always been since a child and this is something I share with Dick Notkin he and I talked about this extensively that is I was raised in a Jewish tradition and for reasons that I think are probably deeply wrong at about third grade I was exposed to the ideas of the holocaust I mean I was shown those pictures of the piles of shoes and the emaciated figures I was in third grade and I think my questioning of authority and my deep profound understanding of the Goethe quote which says by the slightest alteration of my character I would be capable of any act that has always informed my artwork ever since this kind of investigation of who we are as human beings and what we do so perhaps I can find something uplifting to say at some point here I'll just kind of finish up with the concept of legacy because I really think as artists we're the last ones to consult on what our legacy is right but I'm very proud of something I teach in school and I learned it by teaching which is appreciation is the vital component I teach creative strategy and process but I really teach appreciation as well because I tell my students and some of you are here and you'll this will sound familiar we are only capable of creating we're only capable of creating to the depth that we can appreciate that's so true for me and that teaching has been such a privilege because it has taught me to appreciate deeply and as I look around this audience I mean I'm very confused about you know who's on the panel here because I look and I see these magnificent people who have inspired me we got John Toki and Ryan Hurst and Lisa Clegg and Bill and Claudia and I could go on I could name a lot I know you're out and you have been so profoundly moving to me and I have learned I mean I literally feel sometimes looking at your work that I am lifted and I think here's one thing I also tell my students that when they make art even if I never see it if they go off somewhere and they make art my world is improved and all of your worlds are improved by everything we see here I'll leave it for there for now and thanks for being here I make cups I hear from the we have a thank you Todd alright that was the first that's the last that's all the rest of this is kind of extra I just make cups we're thanking Lisa and the audience and everybody here but also the audience there's no difference between my cups and the plastic cups unless somebody picks it up and is like oh my god I think one of the most can we swear anyway one of the most there's a four letter word that rhymes with truck and I was talking to this he was a corpsman the Marine Corps doesn't have medics the Korean War and I said oh four letter word that rhymes with truck and he said yeah four letter word that rhymes with truck and that was the most articulate conversation I've ever had about war that like we understood you know and so that's the thing with the cups a lot of people with the cups they look at them they're like yeah whatever it's a cup there's no difference but some people pick them up and are like four letter word that rhymes with truck the generosity of the audience that listens, that looks that takes the time in this digital click bait world that somebody looks at it and cares enough to think about it is the generosity and if there is any magic in what I make that's where it comes from is the audience I joined the Marine Corps and it was an intention it used to be called the military it used to be called the service and so I still have that desire to serve something the Marine Corps locate close with and destroy the enemy by fire and maneuver but now as an artist locate close with and destroy the enemy through empathy and education and understanding and sharing and just being part of this community is just amazing I tell students if you don't have to make art don't go get a day job but if you do have to make art then suck it up take your lumps and it's going to be a great the community you know my paycheck or my bank account is kind of pathetic but like I live a rich there isn't anything more I want in the world except security and money won't buy that either you know I just make cups got out of the Marine Corps my first instructor Japanese American raised an internment camp said all arts political I went to Alfred I checked out Alfred and a woman there said you're not making art you're doing journalism so I don't know I just make you know if you're a painter and paintings did it sucks to be you but it doesn't mean you should be making crappy videos you know I think your obligation as a human is to do what you're called to do if that's you know orthodontia orthodontia or cups or whatever is that enough I'm done right yeah responding to some things for me the idea of personal as political I didn't mean that to be an Arneson quote it's just a quote I've heard but also the idea that if you express your personal truth then it's your best chance at expressing something that's also universal truth you can't guess you can't say well I think there's this truth out here it's not personal to me but I'm going to guess what this is and try to express it and people aren't going to you know it's not going to resonate so for me that those of you that think it's a mystery that I invited you into this show you know I love the work of all the artists in this show deeply and it's moved me and you know I'm sure I could tell you Arthur things that you reflect if you're speaking to your experience and the things that intrigue you in this world and you're responding to it it's you know maybe well that's why I said social consciousness a little more than political as the definition because I think people do resonate and they have their own responses and yeah your intention may not be at all to be political and the same with Richard Shaw when I met with him before the first exhibition and we went out to lunch with him and his wife and his grandson and Mary Shaw looks at me and says so what is this show about Lisa and I said well it's the legacy of social consciousness and she said Richard doesn't have social consciousness and I'm sure that he doesn't see himself that way and he certainly didn't but to me when I look at the trompe ploy work that he does and there's just this undercurrent of humor of observation of sort of the human condition and that's reflects upon our social you know cultural world that we live in and you know I look at that piece with the boat you know there's these books that's actually why I put it on the cover of the book because I thought people maybe it's a more subtle piece about social consciousness but and you can go see it in there but you know there's this boat that's made out of folded money and you know there's that lovely blue sort of an Italian covering from an old book but that becomes the sea and this boat is sinking and you know so there's layers of meaning there that you can read into what you want but there's definitely some sort of comment he's making you know about our world with that piece and so to me and I think in some ways that's the beauty of of pulling people into the show under this umbrella of this theme because a lot of it is very subtle and some of it like Notkins is really in your face he's always been very very political with his work and wants to speak to issues of war and you know and Erin your work too you know it's very clearly you know speaking to that is as protest really but anyway and Michelle Gregor's work also you know there's that question it's so subtle and so beautiful but the empowerment of the scout figure and the name scout I mean there's this very strong powerful woman that's leading and moving forward the two women lovers piece so elegant and powerful so in again in a really subtle way there's something she's saying about women and that I think you feel it and I think that's how a lot of this work is is that it it's kind of subversive because it doesn't just literally say this is what we believe I've often said I I make this art I can back back up a little and say I grew up with the family activists my dad March with Martin Luther King my parents were on the board of the Sacramento Peace Center for ten years so that activism is really in my back of my mind as an artist oh I got off on what I was I had this great point I was going to make um oh it's the oh the just the subversive nature I don't even though I grew up around that I hate verbal confrontation it it stresses me you know and so I don't really want to get an argument with people about politics or about environmental justice or about women's issues um but if I make this art and I just put out how it feels to me out there and and like you guys I don't necessarily think I have this end goal I want to say this message at all you know I I have this feeling I do sketches I kind of say oh this this sketch and this idea is kind of resonating with me I'm not sure why I'm going to follow that for a while and see where it goes and often it's as I'm working on it I start thinking oh and this kind of is making me think about this and you know it starts to kind of gel what it what I think it's about um and then someone will come along and think it's about something completely different it's like oh that that's really interesting but but I do think that through art yeah you can pull people in with the beauty the composition and then there's this sort of subversive and which is why I think most of the artists in the show like why are you do I don't want to talk about what there might be as a meaning behind this you know just let that be a subtle thing that people will gather they won't get or you know whatever the feeling is so um and I will also say because I share the the same feeling that there are definitely people here in this audience the first round of this show I proposed to the MCCA and Portland and they said the group shows can have 10 people in them and it was like oh my god I don't know how to do this you know because but and and as you said like all of us have social consciousness and we bring whatever you know I mean um we bring ourselves to our work and sometimes that's going to come into it and sometimes it's not um but certainly um there's you know a lot of amazing artists in this room that bring you know so much meaning to their work and I wish you guys could all be in the show too so I guess my apologies apologies to the no to those who didn't who could be in this show anyway so I just wanted to kind of give some response to that question about how literal you know I didn't um I'm glad that it's not all literal okay there you go because I know people want to hear her talk a little bit about her own work I just want to turn it back to you we did a whole show four years ago about Lisa's passion for for animals and our responsibility for um caretaking for different animals and you can see her newest work um it's it's a theme that really resonates with you so could you talk a little bit about what your passion is I will start with saying I um I've been working with images of animals and humans probably since I was a kid because I would draw my own animals and my own family members and um um so it's in some ways you kind of rehash a lot of the same ideas um the show I did at the pence really you know it's funny because when I was in graduate school there really was this sense that you can't do you know really obvious political work because that's just propaganda that's like you know Russian socialism or you know Soviet Union socialism sorry um and and there was really you know pushback and because I was you know wanting to do stuff that was a little more obvious um and so there was probably a lot more subtlety um to what I was kind of putting into my work in my earlier work but I came to the point where you know I really um I'm personally extremely uh horrified and disturbed by what's happening to our environment and I feel like it's it's urgent it's a crisis and I'm aware of the threat of extinction to so many animals and so you know I mean I can send money to different causes and I do some of that but um I just you know for this show I decided to kind of focus more directly on how that what that feels to me um and each piece is maybe a little different um take on that and again not necessarily so literal but maybe more emotional like I want I want people to feel the grief of that um and maybe that's uh really what was coming through with the recent work for that show so I'll leave it at that right and I think with that we're gonna open it up for questions and I'm wondering maybe if we could form a line behind the microphone just so we can get your questions um on the mic um well hopefully we'll hear them do we have anyone who would love to ask a question of a particular artist or to the whole group and then we'll see who is going to respond anyone you must have burning questions smoldering come on some of the students oh good yay first person how you guys doing so my question is to everyone as artists we get a lot of conflicting ideas on maybe what's working what's not working and then as the creator you have your own idea on what maybe you're going for how do you reconcile that outside influence uh take part of it and then you know what do you leave behind which one of us okay consider yourself lucky that people are giving you feedback about your work that's one of the uh that's one of the joys of being a student is that people are are gonna engage with you on that level and you're with a peer group that whose real mission is to kind of engage with those issues and kind of battle through like what's important and what's not important and what's yours and what's not yours and um as you kind of move past that experience you just don't you have less of that experience you know I'll have sometimes similar conversations with friends and peers but it's much rarer so um I would say you know I'm not directly responding to your question but just to say you're lucky and to kind of value that experience and it'll edit itself out it might seem like you don't know what to make one month it doesn't matter this is a long long game that you're in and what makes sense one year might not make sense two years later um so you just have to take that all in and kind of filter through it and edit it out and find your own way so it'll if as long as you're making work your it'll resolve itself you'll you'll figure it out but you just have to keep making stuff um and it'll it'll work its own way through I don't know if that was uh fairly direct great question and I really want to agree with working and working and then when you're done with that keep working uh rilke the the great poet uh Rainier Marie rilke said consider yourself right in all things just kind of just start with that and he goes on fortunately you know don't stop reading there keep going because what he says is if you work with charity if you're wrong you'll figure it out but just like you heard in Monica's comments you have you're the core and you're lucky that people are giving you input and advice and guidance but like I do a lot of assemblage and I jump into the dumpster and I get stuff really good stuff but I don't take it all because there's a lot of stuff in there I don't want but I get the good stuff and when people give you comments there will be stuff that you know there's stuff that is really loving and wonderful and there's stuff that's not so good um and some of the stuff that's hard to hear you know in your heart is you need to listen but at the same time it's all you you're in charge you don't have to take you leave a lot of stuff in the dumpster right um I my response to that is that um aside take everything take everything under advisement no matter how highly the respected voice that's commenting on your work take that under advisement don't take it as what you need or need to do or not to do you know because you're the you're the artist you're the person that's going to be assessed by another opinion and it's also it's all important to you know you and you're the person who's using your time making things so you know what feels good and what doesn't feel good and I think one thing is that one way that we're all different is that we have a different process we have a different procedure and how we think art practice is so I think it's the sometimes the hardest thing is to understand what art practice means you know what does it mean to go into your studio and then once you're in studio what are you actually doing you know what are you doing like how do you what's your first physical step towards doing something you know in your and what's your procedure and your procedure is probably I don't know maybe I could go as far say our procedures are unique you know you know and I think the thing is that we're trying to figure it out I go in a studio I'm trying to figure it out I think I need to figure it out every single time I think if I have a set way of being if it's too calcified to concretize to the same and it's just going to be I'm going to make things by rote and I like to think of myself as an explorer you know somebody who's investigating you know when you read artist statements the first almost cliché statement to the first sentence that all artists statements is like my investigation is you know we're all investigators right so the thing is that I think you have to find out what it is what does that mean that you're trying to go for and also one thing I think about too what I'm thinking about my work is that I think okay my work is all about these things and oh those are good I'm thinking myself as a symbolist so oh that's a good thing to use that'll mean this to me and that'll mean that to me but if I don't enjoy making those things if I don't go to the studio and it's like have fun making those things then it's another job and it's like I may as well be mowing the lawn because it's just not fun and not exploring so I think basically what you should do is just pay attention as you're making your art pay attention to how how you're proceeding it's almost like you have to watch yourself you know be objective and subjective back and forth you know so and then you just and then you do you weed it out and you figure it out you kind of say oh that I'm not really interested in doing that anymore you know you come to those points where you kind of say that's I'm done with that and it'll go and it'll be replaced by why am I gonna replace it with what's then you go out and hit the pavement you know check it out you know like I think it's all process there's no real answer it's just just finding out what you know what who you are you know and that's not even a deep thing to say it's like we're all trying to just try to get ourselves you know and then hopefully somebody else will say oh you know my doppelganger you you know it's like you'll find your plan you know that's the cool thing my question is why are you picking on me so my question is for you Lisa I think a lot about like exemplars of work sharing that with students and when I look around the gallery I try to I see them all as exemplars but when you're choosing pieces are you making decisions about what to include in a show are there any sort of criteria or sort of mystical content or things that you are drawn to that maybe make you select what you select well first I want to say that I don't really see myself as a curator I'm an artist that you know wanted to organize this exhibition and make it happen and then once I show up to galleries they say you're the curator Lisa and it's like oh I guess I am you know so I first I want to say it was really just this is a story I wanted to tell and share so under the umbrella of the topic that I and the story of the community of the history of the legacy of the social consciousness then when I went to talk I think in some ways I asked the artists what they thought they would like to put in the show I started to even remember exactly the process and then I also had pieces that I'd said I'd seen that made me want to bring their work into the show so it was really just kind of a dialogue there was a little back and forth about what pieces were coming into the show but I think mostly you guys can correct me if I'm wrong but I think I mostly let you guys guide what you put in the show I just I selected them as the artists and gave them sort of the idea of under this theme I mean actually with Monica I'd seen the series of your wall pieces with all the animals of course I had a reaction that may not have been her intention of the meaning of the work I saw more environmental kind of thing there and and then she said I'll have all this new work well yeah we can put one of those in but can I please put some new work in so it's like okay let me come to your house and see your work and I did studio visits with several of the artists too some of you guys already knew you've worked for a long time Won-Shing I went to his studio and he's a little tricky because he's got galleries that sell his work in San Francisco and will it still be here he's changed out his pieces because things have sold so there's some new pieces in the show this time actually this third incarnation has Monica has a new piece I have a new piece Mark has a new piece I'm not sure if there's any others but well actually Aaron has made new pieces for every single time he has thrown new cups for these shows which is really wonderful I think that's a good point of you pick the artists and trust them and again it was just this show and I don't intend to continue curating I like to be an artist thank you very much Aaron my questions for you I hear you like to make coffee mugs cups cups whiskey and beer I've heard about you for a while could you please explain me why you make cups and your purpose I've heard some interesting things about you but I've never had the opportunity to talk to you before so please it's a mental illness the desire to make cups watch the news and start getting all fidgety are you a veteran do you always I mean is that what caused you I mean I heard something about I mean I heard just bits and pieces you're not comfortable talking about it I mean I was in the 91 go for I was a Marine for five years or I guess once in whatever yeah that's what started and it was that person was political my first Ben Sakaguchi Japanese American said all arts political and you know if it fits in a bank lobby it's not a neutral space it's like propping up the bank it's not it doesn't fight the bank it supports the bank part of the thing maybe is I'm just a straight up coward going to art school putting the same images on a six by six canvas would be like a lot to try to defend what are you doing and yeah that same thing with like what you know this is propaganda this is too didactic it's too political but my thing is is like if you're making a gas mask for kids like a toy GI Joe gas mask for kids ages six and up you have no idea what that is about you have no idea what mustard you know you're making war toys toys for kids you don't that's as abstract as an ink block it means nothing to you if you would give that to a six year old kid so whatever putting that on a canvas for me is too much putting it on a cup you know nobody cares about a cup it's not and even the cups in the show like there's the other side to the cup that you don't see I'm just more comfortable with that scale like even this is really awkward for me like being on this side of the table we should be sitting at the table drinking that's where the good conversations come up and it's like anyway so the cup again it's not my story it's like you take those cups back into your life and somebody that you already love and trust you know they recognize a refugee or a veteran they recognize what those images are and they share a story with you that maybe doesn't come up otherwise I hear you give them away free is that true yeah I'm coming up on well I'm over 20,000 yeah hey thank you gotta do something with you Dave I want to actually respond to that you know I have a couple of a couple of his cups and I find that the whole idea of when you have us work in a gallery you know again you have a certain kind of behavior and also people you know people go into galleries who choose to go into galleries because they know they're going to see art and you're of a certain ilk but if you have these cups they're outside into the real world and other people who don't know anything about art will be if they come to my house they'll grab one and they'll go what the hell is this maybe or they'll say whoa that kind of thing and they're out of the gallery situation and they're in the real world and they have a certain kind of honesty that's when honesty takes a huge leap from being up in there and going into the prosaic world that becomes profound actually so I think that that's a device that is there that is between the table and the wall perhaps right so be patient could I ask Mark to step up to the mic because I'd like to ask him a question if that's possible folks so Mark messenger is the creator of that the intimate piece in the tower glass tower there and I really quite sincerely every time I see that piece I have two reactions one is oh my god I mean that's like a two year journey and the courage the commitment the respect for Lisa's project the I've known Mark's work for years and that is literally about four times more than any piece I've ever seen in terms of just the heroic effort that he put in and I want to talk about what that experience was the other thing that comes through is some of those images on there are really hard and working that hard for two years and the courage to put some of those images down on that space any of that strikes commentary from you I'd love to hear it I talk with all of you guys different times and can you hear can you hear me he's hearing you but you have to speak louder okay so it'll be really screechy there and you'll hear me alright I talk with all of you and have formally and formally and all the rest it was a big how do you say it it helped me keep energy and focus because of talking with Lisa and the show was coming up it was coming up for a long time remember and so and I didn't even make the first go of the show because I just I can do it which surprised me it was the biggest underestimation of my overestimation of my life you know but anyways with that said knowing everybody's work how do you like say I'm part of this group and not forward it's a profound group anyways yeah I plead guilty to that I'm just electronically impaired Carl my teaching partner said all the images came out really fast and easy it was almost like flow of consciousness it was the two years that took putting them down and making them right yeah I do great sketchbooks and I'm pretty sure about certain things but then it takes a long time to put it on the most exciting thing I just heard was I see a series of canvases are like 8 by 10 with Aaron Tull making images on canvas I will volunteer to do the canvases for Aaron Tull that would be amazing would that be amazing show to see all canvases of Aaron Tull like cups like just blow them up man make them huge and two dimensional blow them up I've shot them yeah you can do that too the things that are all our contents are so intimate and it's almost the stuff you can't bring up in public you can't talk about you know it's like politics you know art and this and that you know whatever there are things that mean a lot to everyone but you can't even talk about it to some friends I have a lot of really cool things about certain things just can't because they lost a son in a war and I can't talk about political stuff with them or something like that thank you for talking to him last night Aaron and some of those things none of us can really talk about they come out in our art and down the torpedoes right you know that's the one place where you can actually say some stuff and that's my two cents thank you sorry thanks the gallery and I got the most questions about Mark's piece I mean it's huge it's really impressive but there's so much narrative going on in there and there's so much symbolism and people really wanted to know the answers what are the numbers mean or what are the gold dots mean and when you were there you often would just try to ask what do you think what does it mean to you but anyway it's a really powerful piece in many ways not just the scale and we all know the daunting undertaking of physically making that happen the engineering of that it was amazing but in the end it's the piece itself and the images I don't know how many people realize that but it's two hands that big giant piece in there some people would see it because there's so much imagery some people didn't see the overall form and it's titled Cliffhanger so one hand is grasping the other hand from sorry I'm literally describing this but sorry but I think so if you didn't catch all of the layers of that piece it's really amazing tour de force and I'm really appreciative that you pulled that off to be in this exhibition twice now so thank you hi Gail I was thinking about protest art and murals like Diego Rivera things like that and art in the 60s similar types of murals and I was wondering what do you think will be what do you think will be the kind of the protest art of this Trump era what do you see as kind of if you can forecast it what would you see as that what do you think will come out of this context and what art would be made I of course I have no idea but the thing is that one thing that kind of like irks me about the whole thing and then as it irks me I kind of understand it at the same time is that how much art has been used with his image I mean his image is so pervasive that I don't think he deserves it you want to protest him don't include him in any of your art talk about something else that is perhaps a consequence of his actions but not just making fun of his hair and that kind of stuff I think that's very superficial and makes it easy to excuse the work but I also at the same time I see it as a catharsis how you want to say I hate the guy I hate what his behavior or whatever it is that your comments about him is that you need to talk about the things he would rather not you talk about not making cartoons of his appearance I think that's I think that's a waste of time honestly and yeah Donald I have a clear idea about this because Donald is the death of all civility he's an exemplar of why we have the values we have why we hold the convictions we have and I would say that every work of art is an effective protest it's an act of civility and grace and beauty Claudia Carrar's art is going to be a long lasting protest of Donald Bill A. Brights, John Toki's art is going to be deeply moving and meaningful in the wake of the blip that was this monster Jack Russell's art will always stand as a commentary and civility of those of us who care enough about humanity to create boy listen to me years ago there was an Sika event in which you were an emerging artist and you had a display of cups on the wall and I was checking it out and there was a video that went along with it and so I'm looking at these cups on the wall and I realized a lot of the cups have been shot and they're broken cups and along with the description of what they were all about and please help me remember this Aaron four cups or six cups were like a squad and then 40 cups were something else some other measure of men that would go out on and then you got to the platoon and then the video is shooting the cups so each one of these cups on the wall that were set up either as a squad or a company or a platoon were enhanced by a gun going off and the cup being shattered and broken and so when you say you just make cups you make cups that are about people about people that have been lost about people that serve about cups that have been broken or at least that's what you've conveyed to me about it and so more than when I know all of these artists for a long time and I've seen Arthur's work and Monica's and so on but I've never been impacted so much sociopolitically by an anti-war statement as your cups at that event and your continuance of making cups and you say oh I just make cups which simplify things too much and so on your behalf I think that you make cups about people about loss about love and about war and activity and action and anti-war in one of the most profound ways I've ever seen so I just wanted to add that to the event that was generous I think part of the thing for me when I say I just make cups is the self-protection thing I joined the Marine Corps for all kinds of good and noble intentions but the gap between the stated goal and the outcome was kind of vast and tragic and so saying I just make cups is kind of just like for my own mental health I want it to be all the things you said but I can't invest in that just out of cowardice or something I'm afraid that maybe it's not true anyway so I just make cups and yeah I want to talk about all those things but it's I can't talk without crying I have to sort of toot the wrong horn or spell out this is why I do this or this is what this means and so I'm really grateful that you were speaking on the behalf of Erin and I guess for me pulling these people into this umbrella this idea was also a way for me to sort of speak on their behalf to what they don't want to all come out and say how social or political you know some artists certainly it's political on some artists I would keep the social consciousness more of the idea but you know in some ways I had the same feeling you know can I just put you under this umbrella and speak on your behalf of what I feel is within the work of this group of artists so yeah part two here for everyone what is the most difficult part about being an artist for you personally I think that the most difficult thing happens depends on what time of year you're asking me right now the most difficult thing is to have time in the studio trying to find time to make work is like a big one for me right now so but soon I'll have my summer and then I'll have more time but the thing is also sometimes the most difficult thing is for me to remember I think the thing is that there is a whole personal like I need to be an artist because I'm not an artist I'm going to go crazy you know I just need that and you know it's like and I will I'm not in the studio for more than a week I'll start acting differently you know that's my time so my time's up already so the thing is that but that's kind of like thinking of myself as an artist that needs it's almost kind of hard to speak about that too because like say well you know I was special because I was born an artist and I need this to be an artist and part of me does actually believe that I do kind of say I need to make things I mean whatever manner that would be maybe if I wasn't an artist I'd be redesigning cars or something but I have that ilk okay I think another thing though too is that I'd like to think that I'm that I want to know more about what I can do in the studio because I get excited about things I make in the studio and I know that if I don't get excited about things in the studio that I have to think about why that is and I think once the time once you reach once you have an epiphany in the studio like I can remember a handful of times when I was in the studio where I went I got goosebumps I completely blew myself away and it's like I can't believe I made that and then you kind of go I'll never make that I'll never, I wouldn't it was the next time I'll feel like that maybe that was the last time or you make something that you're really happy with and you say that's the best piece I've ever made and you're going to go and if you're a positive mentality you think I wonder how many new discoveries I have left in me do I have how many more how many more things can I find out about myself by doing this you know so that's a very insular kind of answer it's not just making these things in your studio and having them all around you but you need to take them then they need to go out then you need to let them go like children like go and prosper but get out of here so I think the thing is that the reason why that is because this happens without that this won't happen the whole idea that we're communicating I'm only sending out my own I mean the things that I make are made just because I have these intentions and then that's the thing and I go and then somebody else comes and sees that thing with their history and they make sense of it hopefully they'll try to make sense of it with their history so works are kind of like ambassadors in a sense where they're between two kinds of communication so I thoroughly dig that you know and also one thing it's really hard for talking about what our work is about I can't remember who it was the quote from but it was from somebody asked a poet can you explain this poem to me what's the meaning of this poem and the poet says what you want me to make it worse because there's a difference between prose and poetry so we could be sociopolitical but we're kind of like poets in a sense where we're creating visual poetry that hopefully you will also attain that kind of second language visual language and understand it nonverbally anyways that's what I think I would give out what he said but also like this is kind of a boring practical thing but the hardest thing for me about being an artist is not making the work but it is actually dealing with like the career side of it and any kind of business side of it and really it's really hard for me to give doesn't rhyme with truck doesn't rhyme with truck it's hard for me to care about that aspect of things to my detriment and I think to have the to find that part of yourself as well so like take care of yourself and your career and put your work out there and kind of take part take care of that part of things I think it's difficult for a lot of artists and that's one of my failings is not like looking after stuff like that because it doesn't feel like that's part of being an artist but if it's not you're going to have a harder time out there in the world so that's you know a practicality you should probably do it yeah I really appreciate what Arthur had to say much more beautiful than the basic practical thing I was going to come down to is just yeah the struggles of balancing trying to earn a living or trying to keep your career afloat or trying to get time in your studio and finding that balance in life as an artist I have found to be challenging you know and it's interesting because there's times there's just incredible highs you know I have found that having this exhibition has been really delightful to be able to connect with all the artists in the show and to have this happen and yet behind the scenes there's times when the effort behind it you know luckily we didn't have to make a new catalog for this one but I had to twice with the last two and there's times when it's like okay you know this is tough or moving that big sculpture one more time and anyway but yeah there's many things and the self-doubt that comes up times maybe I'd say times when I am not in my studio and I'm not feeling inspired to make something new and I'm in this kind of lull of not working and I have to have some faith that it's going to come back and part of it is because of time either teaching or doing other things but luckily despite what certain people in my household might think I trust that I'll get it back but yeah there's a lot of challenges it's not an easy choice you have to be you have to do it because you're crazy and you love doing it I don't know okay so I think for me and I'm kind of a larger some scale I know that art is like a vitamin like vitamin C if you don't have vitamin C you get scurvy if you don't have art in your life whether you make it or you appreciate it if you don't have that you diminish as a human being you may not notice it people don't notice when they're getting scurvy but they're getting it and you're starting to shrink your spirit is starting to shrivel and that's a fact and that's a fact we know it's been proven in research has shown that students in high school and junior high the correlation between people who have been exposed to art and how much they've been exposed to art and how well they do on the SATs is direct and there's no art questions on the SATs but people who have art in their lives do better on SATs so the hard part is that our society in the west in America doesn't value art you have to struggle to make your case again and again and here I move to Davis because the schools are so good you know what the budget for art in Davis is the actual budget committed by the Davis Joint Unified School District to art oh how'd you do that there you go all art training in Davis the land of the great schools is provided by the PTAs that's crazy and it's the hardest thing about being an artist and it's my greatest hope we are going to get this right hopefully in our lifetimes and thanks again to the Penns