 This is the show, The State of the State of Hawaii, and I'm your host, Stephanie Stoll Dalton. This show features candidates, Sam King, Jr., running for office in the Office of Hawaiian Affairs, or OHAS, as OHAS, OHAH, who trustee. Now, OHAS is a state government agency, and it was created to improve conditions for Native Hawaiians. So, we'll hear more about that from Sam. Welcome, Sam, to ThinkTac, Hawaii. Thank you. Good, good guess. Taking time from your campaign. Tell us a little bit. Tell us briefly why you want to serve OHAS as Oahu trustee. So it's that large, that large trustee. Oh, you meant large? Oh, they were reporting it as Oahu, okay. No, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I ran Oahu last time in 2018, and that was back when an audit came out about the Office of Hawaiian Affairs, and it was showing that the trustees were using their reimbursement fund for, you know, personal kinds of expenses, and all these little things that were not appropriate for personal, for, you know, for a state reimbursement fund. And it really fostered this perception of corruption at OHAS, and it's a huge problem. And it remains a problem at the Office of Hawaiian Affairs is people always want to know how is OHAS using its money? Is it being used effectively? And that's why I ran in 2018. And I think things have improved somewhat because Kaylee Yakinah has been there. But, you know, the price of freedom is eternal vigilance. And so I'm running in large part to support trustee Yakinah and his efforts to ensure that transparency and fiscal responsibility stays alive and well at the Office of Hawaiian Affairs, make sure they do their independent audits, and make sure they spend their money effectively. And that really goes to another reason I'm running, which is spending the money effectively. There's a lot of... Sorry, I was going to say that that's very interesting. I know that the state has audited, the state auditor has also had news for you, and is also still holding, not completing the audit yet, but from the last court decision, does that mean that he will have to close out the audit and allow you to get that extra money that you haven't been able to spend? Yeah, I actually have not followed that exactly. I know that the courts went after that, you know, they went there and they said he did not need to release it. I think that the court decision did result in that. It said, you know, what has happened is enough and therefore the money can be released, but I don't think the auditor ever finished that report. I don't think he's ever... Because what Oha was doing was saying, our executive session minutes are secret, right? So it was a state agency keeping state records secret from the state, which to me makes no sense at all. I think Oha should have released that information. They should still release it. It's mind-boggling that they think that their executive session minutes would be secret from the state's auditor. I'm sure they have some sort of legal argument, but what are you hiding? What are you talking about? You're spending state resources to improve the condition of Native Hawaiians. And I think there's a perception sometimes that the trustees had that certain people working in Oha, that they think it's a separate government. They think that it's the government in waiting, which is not, and it shouldn't be. And we shouldn't be spending Oha resources and time trying to create a separate entity that's only race-based for Native Hawaiians exclusively. That's not how... That's not going to improve the condition of Native Hawaiians. I mean, in the end, equality before the law is a great American experiment. That's a great equalizer. And that's what the Kingdom of Hawai'i was built on, even. That's the thing no one really talks about in this day and age, where you go back to... And we did all this research for TMT amount of chaos stuff, but you go back to the very founding of the Kingdom. And you'll love this, Stephanie, where King Kamehameha, right? It's always interesting. The state is called Hawai'i, right? And this is very interesting as an example. The reason it's called Hawai'i and there's also an island called Hawai'i is because Kamehameha was from the island of Hawai'i and he conquered all the other islands. That's very true. This is the name of the state. And so part of that is that when he did that, he used cannons that were brought in by European, by people that were not born here prior to 1778. And John Young and Isaac Davis were the two gentlemen that trained his troops on how to use it. And he made John Young and Isaac Davis into chiefs. He made them into a lead. And that was really the start of the Kingdom's multicultural, multi-ethnic heritage. Anybody who can contribute can be a citizen of this great nation equally. He's a legendary leader. That's for sure. You mentioned this audit and the findings that we're casting, Ohas, work in a darker light. So as you come into this, and it's still not settled, and I refer viewers to the paper to look at what's going on with this state auditor and what the last ruling was and how you all are going to go forward, but how are you planning to make a difference for this fiscal oversight that you feel is maybe not as responsible as it could be? How are you going to be the best steward you can, especially as an at-large trustee? Well, I think the number one thing to do is look at what trustee Akina is doing all the time. I think it's just making sure there's independent audits of the office wine affairs, right? Not just state audits, but independent auditors that come in and look at how the spending is being done and really get into the, even for the trustees themselves to be able to see how the money's being spent. And there's a great turn of phrase that on trustee Akina's website is, you protect the trust, you grow the trust, and then you spend the trust. And that's really the recipe for success is protecting the trust through independent audits and fiscal responsibility, making sure things like the Ohas trustee's reimbursements, right? Make sure they're submitting receipts instead of just getting $40,000 or $20,000 into a slush fund and spending it at the beginning of the year. That's not responsible. But then also growing the trust, right? Through food investment. And Kakako Makai is one of those areas that owns all this land. It's lying fallow. It's terrible. Then we should be developing it. Well, before we get on to that, that housing issue, how are you going to be able to know, yes, certainly that the money came in and was spent and was recorded in the ready for the audit. But what are you going to do to find out, to measure the outcomes? How are you going to know, I know you've been concerned about this and the things that you said about what are the outcomes, how are we going to measure them? And what are they doing now? And what do they need to do in your way of planning to help? I mean, that goes towards the last part of that trinity, which is spending the trust effectively, right? OHA is a grant giving organization. And so part of grant giving is you design evaluation system, right? And so the trustees, as a trustee, you oversight that process and you tell the executive branch, you need to come up with these evaluation process. And part of that is data, right? I mean, I talked about in 2018 where the Office of White Affairs has these, they don't even have the, you know, the confidence intervals for the data they have about Native Hawaiians, whether or not we are, you know, what our income levels are and, you know, what our health disparities are. And part of that is not entirely OHA's fault in the sense that we don't necessarily collect data on Native Hawaiians alone. It's lumped with Pacific Islanders, which, you know, that's racism is dumb, right? So it's complicated to have this whole race structure in our Census Bureau because we can't figure out which way to slice things. Now, to the extent you're talking about culture and identity, that's, you know, that's an interesting, that's great. That's a good thing, but it's something you need data on. It's hard to define and hard to dig into. So you need to figure that out. And OHA should spend money on it. OHA should basically be going out and finding data on Native Hawaiians, right? It should be looking up data, not just the census, right? It shouldn't be relying on, because the census is mixing up all these things, right? And so break it up. And you can look at individual data. And the Department of Health has some of that data. Department of Business Economic Development and Tourism has some of that data. And so you can break that out. But OHA has voter, it has roles, right? It has roles of its own members, people with OHA cards. They can poll these individuals and find that data for itself instead of just relying on the data that's out there. And that's really what it needs to do to evaluate its own impact. I mean, it's existed for 50 years. And I'm still reading DBET reports that say, you know, the Native Hawaiians are the most impoverished race in Hawaii. Like, okay, where's OHA doing about that? Are they measuring it? Are they looking at it? If we're going to have race-based institutions, right? And that's another thing that's important to note, right? I'm not the biggest fan. I'm not a fan of race-based government, right? That's not something that I love. The reality is that OHA does exist. And it's not going anywhere. It is, right. And if it exists, we should do something effective with it. And if you're going to do something effective, this is the group that we've identified, then that's the group you should serve. Yes. And to be the national treasure for that work and for the data showing what their status is and how it has improved through the benefit that this agency is supposed to bring to it and supposed to be value-added in addition to what other resources there are, of course, for all of the children of Hawaii, all the people in Hawaii. So tell me about your issues and your goals then that you're going on about in your campaign and trying to communicate about to those voters out there who will want to have you do that. What are you going to work on? Absolutely. I think the number one thing I'm looking at is early childhood education. There's a big idea in development economics right now, which is you look at kids from zero to three years old. And that's really the age group where you can have the biggest impact. And if OHA's job is to improve the condition of native Hawaiians, which I think it is, as opposed to paying reparations for the overthrow, which a lot of people think, you know, there's a lot of that angle. And I think that's one of the issues OHA has in the challenge. But if its job is to improve the condition of native Hawaiians, then it should be looking at early childhood education. And I'm digging more into this and doing more research. I think there's actually been programs where you try to do this. This is very specific intervention. There's a project called the Perry preschool project that did this. And you can improve upon this intervention, but functionally, fundamentally what it is, is you send kids from zero to three to daycare. And then you have so the parents can work so the kids can acclimate and can meet other kids, right? And they can learn in that environment. And then you take that learning and you send someone to the home to meet with the parents and connect the learning going on in the school with what's going on in the home. And I can tell you as the parent of two young boys myself, right? Three and six is like, I heard this idea. I started researching it and it blew my mind because I was like, can I get somebody to do this for me right now? I could use this help. This is amazing to me. Kind of like a home state. Well, have you looked into what the other agencies or other stakeholders, community stakeholders have been doing in early childhood education? I mean, of course, you know, always coming through on that is the commandment schools and their preschool programs. I mean, are you looking to partner up or how are you thinking about what's already going on in the state and what, what benefit you can derive for Oha from that? Yeah, I've been looking into various groups and I'm trying to reach out to people. There's, there's, you know, there's groups, committee of schools has done this in the past. Like I said, I'm trying to reach out to them. Kikioka Inus, another group I've heard of that does it. So I'm, I'm exploring those and reaching out to I don't, as far as I know, from looking at Oha's annual reports, they're spending no money on this right now. And so I don't know how many groups are connected to Oha looking at it, right now, how many groups are out there. And that's one of the things as a, as part of this campaign, you know, wind loser draw, that's what I want to build that network and really see people are okay, how, how do we get this network out there? How do we do more of this? Yeah, and that's a missing. So that's missing because it hasn't been identified as an, as a need that Oha chose to address or, or just to help, right? I mean, why, why isn't there, in other words, the question you're bringing something to, to the organization that they're not already doing, if that's what you're saying. That's, that's, that's my sense of it. That's my sense of it, is that this is a new thing that the organization, that is very powerful is there's research, this Perry preschool project has this long, the reason that particular thing you can, if you Google Perry pre for preschool project, I think one of the first hits is the US government website where they talk about it because it's so powerful. They have this longevity to the study where they show that the people that got the intervention, they're, it's interesting because their test scores are not necessarily higher, right? They're, they're reading math test scores, but what is higher is their life stability, right? So that the kids that had the intervention, they have stable home, right? They're not in prison, they're not in drugs, they have jobs and they are married. But the most interesting thing is that their kids also have stable lives, right? So it breaks that cycle of poverty, right? It keeps the families stable. And that's really valuable and powerful in Hawaii. Well, that's, and you're talking about that being this geometric, however you describe that impact going beyond even one generation is what I'm hearing you say too. It breaks the cycle of poverty. I mean, that's, and that's one of the where you look at, you know, DBIT has reports and basically saying Hawaiians are, Native Hawaiians are the most impoverished group. And it's because of, you know, this, that, that cycle of poverty issue, right? You get caught in that trap and then it, it's hard to break out of it. And this is the thing that does it. And it's, it's interesting. I think there's actually a group of people that resist this idea. They, they think that it's like an indoctrination project or it's a similar forced assimilation, right? Because you, you send someone to the home and they're afraid that you're going to take the children and put them into, you know, which, which to me is, which to me is like, I think that's, that's just kind of a scary way to think about the world design and intervention through the office of Hawaiian affairs that can have a very culturally sensitive team that go into a home and maybe that's why like the office, I would not recommend that the office of Hawaiian affairs do this itself, right? They would give a brand to an organization that has. Yes. Yes. You're partnering with people. Well, what, now when you go into, if you're elected, then you're, you're in then as a, at large member. So have you, have you thought about or learned about how you can influence others to agree that this is work that Oha should do? What happens within Oha? Are you ready to talk about how, what's the processing of your influence? Are you coming in with ideas and you want to influence the organization to go in direction step? What, what are you thinking about how to do that yourself? Yeah, I have looked at the politicking of who is going to be on the board and how that vote is going to work exactly. First off, I don't think anybody's even talking about early childhood education, right? So it's, there's nobody even has heard it yet. They're all talking about housing, which I also support housing, right? That's a great thing. And I think, and also there's going to be a lot of turnout. I mean, there's potentially a lot of change this year. I mean, right? There's the Hawaii seat probably won't change, but it's big seat, right? It's really at large and long seat, right? So it's a big year. So who knows what's going to happen? But the key thing I think that I would say is, I think early childhood education is something we could all agree on. I think we could all agree that this is something worth talking about, worth looking into more and worth exploring. And that's really what I would want to start doing. And so it's, you know, I haven't started counting the votes. If that's to the extent we're asking that, it's just really developing the idea and starting to get people to think about it more seriously and then see what the results can be. Well, actually, do all the trustees meet on the board? So I was just, what's the structure within the organization? So all the trustees come together in board meetings, right? And then you have, and that's your opportunity to. Yeah. I mean, that's a little bit more complicated. You have to go into a board. I think you can write proposals and whatnot. It is kind of strange because of the open records law as a boy, which are good. But one of the challenges is a board like Oh, I cannot meet like the trustees can't meet more than one on one, right? And even one on one is a little bit ish fee because you can't daisy chain messages and stuff like that. So it's fascinating because the legislature isn't held to that, right? The legislature has secret meetings all the time with all kinds of groups of people, but then they expect boards like Oh, to do it also. And it's like, it's a little bit of a hamstring. I mean, I, I want that. I don't want Oh, to be having secret meetings, but it also does hamstring these organizations that we've put all this responsibility on in a very straight way. But, but that's not, I'm not going to be worried about that. I mean, I'll, whatever I'm doing, my early childhood stuff, I'm just going to say it on the internet, right? I'm going to put it on online. So we'll talk about it there. And I think it's, it's already on my campaign website, right? That's, that's what we're going to do. Well, let's talk about housing. I know that you've got some ideas about housing. And you would already mentioned the Kakaaka Makai area. Is that what you're referring to as the area? Can you just describe where that is and what its circumstances are and what needs to be done? So housing in general is Hawaii just has a housing shortage. I mean, to the extent, and I say this, and I have to be very particular here because I'm an attorney. So I, you know, language definitions, it means a lot to me. And it's very interesting. When we say we have a housing shortage, the presumption is we want economic growth and we want population growth because those two things go hand in hand. There's people in this world on this island that do not want that. They want Hawaii to shrink. They want, they want to live a subsistence lifestyle. They don't want any trade. They don't want to have anything at all, except maybe cell phones and, you know, roads, but never mind that, right? So these are survivalist people? I'm saying, I'm saying metaphorically, I'm saying, I'm saying, my point is that when I say we have a housing shortage, what I mean is if you want economic growth, if you want your cakey to be able to live here, right? If you want to be able to move from your apartment to a bigger home with your two kids or three kids, you need more home, right? There's not, there's no amount of subsidized homes. There's no amount of government regulation that's only for locals, whatever that term means, you know, people born and raised here, which are, which are not even constitutional in a lot of situations, right? And not even a moral good. I wouldn't want to stifle my society with only people born here. But even if you were doing that, we're not even meeting the population growth, right? And that's why our population shrinking for the past couple of years. The population has been shrinking. So when I say I want more homes and there's a housing shortage, I'm talking about, I want prosperity for my boys, right? My cake, our families. I want us to be able to grow and prosper. And if we're going to do that, we need to build more homes. And one place that Ohaw can have a direct impact on that is in Kakakamakai. Okay, why is that? Why is Kakakamakai a target area? Well, so right now Kakakamakai is basically a blight, though, right? There's a park there, and then there's a bunch of, there's car dealerships, which are economic drivers, but you could have a lot more economic value. And then there's lots that are just parking lots, right? There's a completely empty. The state of Hawaii made it illegal to build home, Makai of Alamoana Boulevard. And we did that to satisfy people living in high rises across the street. They didn't want their view blocked. So I think that's this nimbyism run amok, right? We have people living in high rises complaining about new high rises. It's like you live in high rise. That's where, that's Hawaii. Kakako is the new downtown, right? Like, if you want to keep the country country, you need to make the city city and you need to develop homes in downtown. So Kakakamakai, you need to legalize home building. That's one of the things you need to do. And then Ohaw has, so Ohaw owns a bunch of parcels in Kakakamakai. That's what I wanted to know about because usually things are already structured in that manner with the land owners. Yeah. So the Office of Hawaiian Affairs gets, this is very complicated. I don't even know if we have time for this one, but Ohaw basically had a settlement with the state where they said, we're owed back money, therefore we should get this money. That whole debate is a whole other subject where Ohaw says we get 20% of the seeded land, but the Supreme Court's actually said, no, you don't, you get whatever the legislature says you get. And so, but in order to settle one of these many lawsuits Ohaw was filing, Governor Abercrombie said, okay, we'll give you these parcels in Kakakamakai, which are equal to what you wanted. And, and David Louis, the former attorney general under Governor Abercrombie said in a book, the reason he did this, the reason Governor Abercrombie did this was to get Ohaw to use, you know, their moral leverage to build homes in Kakakamakai, which I think is a great idea. But this is the kicker, right? I don't want to just build luxury high rise places for fancy people from California, although I don't want to exclude them either because Kakakamakai fundamentally is an investment, right? It's an investment for the Office of Wine Affairs to make money and then spend that money on early childhood education to improve the condition of native wine. But Kakako is owned by Ohaw, Kamehameha Schools, the University of Hawaii, and the city and county of Honolulu. Those four entities could make a joint development program, which I've written about this in civil beef, and consolidate all those parcels and build out a master plan community that could really shine, right? You could have mixed income developments, commercial spaces, you know, you can maximize commercial spaces, you could change the roads around. There's a, you know, there was a big fight a while back about a playground, right? We wanted to build a playground in Alamoana. And then everybody who opposed the playground in Alamoana said, oh, we're not opposed to the playground, we just want it built in Kakakamakai. You're not going to build a playground that's big and fancy in Kakakamakai right now because it's a dump and it's just overrun with homeless and, you know, vandalism and it would be destroyed and no one would go there. But if you redevelop the entire area and you have a big park and you have all these homes and you have a Hawaiian sense of place under a master plan community, then you could build a big playground and you could have dedicated parking for the public and things like that. You could have dedicated parking for surfers, right? People could come there and go down the stairs. You can redevelop the whole area. Well, let me just get clear here. Now, are you, when you say Kakakamakai, do you mean south of the Makai of Kapiolani Boulevard? Of Alamoana Boulevard. Okay. So that would be in the Kakakamakai park area, right? Is that what you're talking about? Yeah. So Kakakamakai is Makai of Alamoana Boulevard. It's where the Children's Discovery Center is. Oh, yes, yes. Okay. All right. So what, so I was thinking it was that whole section above that between Alamoana Boulevard and Kapiolani. Okay. No, that's just Kakakamakai. That's Kakakamakai, Malka. Malka, okay. And that's where we're building tons of buildings, right? We're already building lots and lots of buildings there. Yes. Yes. Oh, that's a huge development, which is a loss of a lot of stuff that's, but okay. So then there's loss in it, but there's loss in all redevelopment, right? I mean, there's also, there's also growth, right? There's also a benefit to building those kinds of, I mean, I know all my friends who are growing up now, my age all live in Kakakamakai. They're all living in Kakakamakai. They're families in Kakakamakai. And there's requirements, you know, the developers, you want to make sure they build a park and stuff. They're required to do that. And you got to do that. We lost Ward Warehouse. That's true. I loved Ward Warehouse, but that's the growth and development. We cannot always just say things are perfect for me and therefore they must stay this way. Well, what about the resistance to this for that, for that parcel? Now, because like the medical school is there too. Oh, it's there. There'd be no reason, why the medical school is there, to provide that kind of refurbishment, that kind of revitalization of the area. It would, it would stay there. I think even the Children's Discovery Center, I wouldn't want to take it out. And they would be on board for this type of development. Well, I think you can talk to everybody, right? This is not something that Sam King is going to be able to get elected and wave a magic wand and make it happen, right? This is a, and this is important, this is something worth closing on. This is something worth closing on. I talked to a lot of people on this campaign trail and what everybody wants is healing and cooperation, right? So I'm not going to come in here and start. I mean, I know I used to term dim beer and I've been out there fighting for a lot of big projects that are controversial, but I think it's worth saying this. I don't want to just come in and start yelling at people or saying, this is my way or the highway. And I don't think we should do that. We need to work together. We need to discuss how is the best way this is going to work? And when we come to a decision through that process, then we follow through and we make sure that it happens, but we do have that process. That's a very important, valuable thing. And that's the history of going. Well, I'm encouraged by your idea and notion of that. Now that I got it straight, that it's the uncle McCoy, because, you know, there isn't really a beach down there. And that has been a blighted area. It's been, it's beautiful. I go, I go down there. It's absolutely gorgeous. But I mean, it doesn't have the features of like an Alamo on a park. So you're coming up with something that might, you know, have some likes here. And then this would solve some of the houselessness issue of the Hawaiian Hawaiian people. So these would be oh, hot designated. No, no, no, one minute, one minute to close. But no, you would not just be building homes only for native. Why it wouldn't be race based house, right? That's not even a good idea. But it would be reasonable. So we're talking maybe some low income and you would have a, you would have a stretch, right? You wouldn't just have one income. You'd have a variety of income. You would have high priced homes to make a profit and you'd have regular home. I mean, that's any development. But Kaka Kaka Makai is some of the most valuable land in Hawaii, right? Something to build in there in order to make money that defeats the purpose, the purpose is investment. And that's where you spend that money on early childhood education. So, okay, Sam, we're almost down to time. So why don't you take this time to just say a few things about your other aims and goals that we haven't had a chance to get into. But why don't you just let us know what else is your focus for your work as the, the trustee on Oja School? Well, I think the other thing I would advocate for strongly is, is just making sure that Native Hawaiians and all the people of Hawaii who are interested in astronomy and supporting science and the 30 meter telescope have a voice on the Office of Hawaiian Affairs. And so I would make sure that that project continues to get support and continues to have legs under it to move forward because it's critical for our future. It's critical for our kiki and one of mine is right back here right now in the blur. Yeah. Well, he's being very quiet. That's good. So yeah. Okay. So you're still working on the telescope issues or do you see that those are resolved now that the university can manage it? No, it's definitely not resolved. It's definitely something that will be an issue in this campaign. It's very important that if people want astronomy amount of care and they want the 30 meter telescope to be built, they should definitely vote for me because it's going to be a very, very important issue. And it's not over by any stretch of imagination. I think we're having a lot of interesting conversations. The change in management that's being discussed now is it's an interesting idea. There's a lot of support for it, even from supporters of the 30 meter telescope project. I was opposed to it from the beginning and I still am on the fence because I think it's dangerous. We're rolling the dice with our astronomy industry because now we're going to have political appointees on top of it instead of academic appointees. But like I said, change is change. There's a degree to which you have to look at things and say sometimes things need to move forward. But in the end, I have no position on it because it doesn't matter who manages Mount Ikea. What matters is that that bill that came out said, we're going to support astronomy, pursue it to the principles we're laying out here. We're going to, and we need to get people on the board, and you'll make sure that we advocate for appointments to the new board if it's created, if it's not vetoed by Governor Ege, that support astronomy and support open access to Mount Ikea so that people can continue to enjoy that beautiful place because it's really some special and it's special for all the reasons that we use it now for advanced astronomy, for cultural practices. Well, do you see the most Hawaiian groups? Are they more accepting of it now that it's been through this process? Do you see that that has softened any, that there's some acceptance that it should be there? As you're saying, that Hawaii should have that telescope there and have that activity going on? There's some, there's some people that have changed their views on it, have softened and met with astronomy community and talked to them, but there's some that haven't. I mean, in the end, there will be protesters. If anything, people will show up and arrest will need to be made, pursue it to the process. You don't just go up there and arrest people for nobody, but you're going to follow the process. And if we decide that we're going to build the telescope, somebody is going to show up and someone's going to stand on the road. And we're going to have to commit ourselves to following the law and the decisions that we've made as a community, which I think is the, is just, that is Pono, right? Like that's the right thing to do. You cannot just say, I didn't get my way in this process. Therefore, I'm going to blockade a public roadway. That's not, we can't manage. This is our life now. These issues are all very divided and people are speaking up from both sides of it. So it's good to live and work within this climate. Yeah, it's good to talk and it's good to have these conversations. And I think we should continue to do that. And I think we should also commit to our decisions once we make them. Okay, one quick question. How is the campaign going? How do you like campaigning? Are you feeling great? Feeling productive, getting started. If you meet a lot of people, you've talked to a lot of people and making phone calls. It's always fun to hear from the community, right? And just hear what people have to say and hear their hopes and dreams and share your big ideas, right? It's a lot of fun and it's going well. So we're not there. We're doing it. Well, we wish you very, very well and hope things keep going that way and even more. So I think we're out of time at this point. And this show is the state of the state of Hawaii. And we've been talking with OHA candidate for the at-large trustee board member role. And he's going, he's running for that. So take a look at his website, which has been rolling on our screen. And I'm your host, Stephanie Stoll Dalton. We'll be back in two weeks. So I appreciate your viewing. Mahalo for being our audience and we'll see you again soon. Aloha. Thank you so much for watching Think Tech Hawaii. If you like what we do, please like us and click the subscribe button on YouTube and the follow button on Vimeo. You can also follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and LinkedIn, and donate to us at thinktechhawaii.com. Mahalo.