 Hey guys, I'm super excited that you joined me today and I've got a very special guest that's joining us I know many of us as house cleaners have always been really sensitive to cleaning chemicals And when we think of cleaning chemicals oftentimes We're thinking of our health in terms of things that we eat and things that we drink And we're not thinking of things that we associate with that we touch or breathe And so today it's a really important conversation that I've been dying to have for a very very long time And I want to read the introduction for Gabrielle because I'm just not going to remember all of the amazing things that she does And then I promise I won't read to you anymore. We'll just jump into a live conversation But Gabrielle Rosa is the founder and director of the Rosa Institute It's an organization dedicated to improving clinical outcomes And advancing scientific knowledge in reproductive medicine It's to help couples overcome fertility challenges and conceive healthy babies. I know awesome, right? Since 2001 she and her team have blended evidence-based science with a holistic and educational focused approach To fertility treatment resulting in the development of the f e r t i l e fertile method It's a unique methodology that boasts a 78 Point eight percent live birth rate for couples with a history of infertility miscarriage or failed treatments The institute has provided reproductive education and empowerment to over 140,000 Couples in more than 110 countries worldwide Gabrielle is a renowned fertility specialist She's the author and program director for the fertility breakthrough program Her two decades of knowledge and experience have been distilled into four books on natural fertility solutions Two of which have become bestsellers I know and she's joining us today. How cool is this, right? Her latest book fertility breakthrough overcoming infertility And recurrent miscarriage when other treatments have failed is a valuable resource for couples struggling to conceive for over two years Or facing difficulties in maintaining a healthy pregnancy Her academic achievements include a master's in public health clinical effectiveness from harvard's university th chan school of public health Where she received the scholar award for academic excellence She's currently pursuing harvard's Doctor of public health program and holds a master's of science and medicine reproductive health and human genetics and a bachelor of health science Gabrielle is trained in various health disciplines including neuropathy nutrition and botanical herbal medicine She's got all the goods here you guys. I'm so excited Gabrielle is featured in major publications and is a respective educator podcast host And radio comment commentator on health wellness and fertility Her podcast talk sex with Gabriella rosa explores a holistic conversation around a desire pleasure and satisfaction Guiding individuals on a journey of self-discovery whether they're on the fertility journey or not Gabriella is joining us today to have a conversation with me About cleaning chemicals and fertility and she's here to answer your questions. Please help me welcome Gabriella rosa I am so excited to be here. Thank you, angela. Gosh that that uh that bio makes me blush Well, you are certainly talented and skilled in areas of which I've had a lifelong curiosity Because as a house cleaner when we talk about cleaning chemicals It's something that affects us all and many homeowners will use cleaning chemicals randomly And professional house cleaners use them all day every day. Yeah, so this is a huge conversation So thank you for joining us. Oh my pleasure. You know when I saw you know the title of pit me of your podcast I'm like, okay. I need to go and educate You know I need to share some light because you're absolutely right You know like so many different things that we are exposed to in our day today that we think, you know Oh, okay. It's available on the shelf of a supermarket. Of course. It's healthy But is it you know, so I get what you're saying Well, I'm curious. There's something in your life that triggered something That made you decide to go down this path. Share with us what it was and how you got here Well, I was a cleaner at one point So when I was studying I was like, you know, what is the easiest way most productive and certainly, you know The least hassling kind of way to make some extra cash to pay for For school and cleaning was just such a fabulous, you know part of it and at the time and I guess, you know My parents I'm Brazilian by background, you know, I was raised in Australia I was born and raised in Brazil and then my parents were immigrated to Australia And I lived there for more than 30 years of my life But as you can probably imagine, you know from a Latina mother It's very much a situation of like, you know, go clean girl And and we just had we were just brought up with just, you know, really good cleaning abilities So but I think that what brought me to doing the kind of a Is very much this essence of wanting people wanting to help people transform You know, for me transformation is that the core of what it is that I do and as you can imagine, you know When treating couples who have been struggling with infertility struggling with miscarriage There's a huge amount of transformation that's required there for us to be able to get an outcome Of a healthy baby, especially when they've, you know, been trying for many many years and other treatments has failed So that's the passion for me, you know, that's the thing that really kind of it Gets me up in the morning. It keeps me up late at night and it keeps me doing it for what's now 22 years, you know It's it's been a long time Well, what is the connection between cleaning chemicals and fertility, you know, that is such a great question And and you know, the really important thing that I want people to take away from this conversation is that you can't isolate fertility You can't isolate reproductive health Hormonal health, you know, so many times when we have a problem like let's say you have a sore finger Right and it's infected. Let's just give that as an example That finger you might put, you know, topical treatment and you might put things on it That is going to help to heal from the outside in But the truth of the matter is that that finger is part of a greater system Okay, and the fact that that finger became infected to begin with is a flag To what else perhaps may be going on Underneath the the radar so to speak, you know inside the system of that person Because what happens is that, you know, I always talk about the fact that every system Is the is designed for delivering the outcome that it's delivering And this is true in the human body as well as life, you know, as well as cleaning houses I mean think about it if you have a you have a system everybody has a system in which they go about doing things And if the outcome is not what you want you have to question Okay, what is the process? What is the system? And so what happens is, you know in a roundabout kind of way I need to kind of help people understand that that sore finger is a part of a hole Just like reproductive health is a part of an entire system So the things that we breathe in the things that we put on our skin the things that we put in our mouths the things that You know, we experience in our day to day are all going to have an effect On how our body works in one way or another. Okay So when it comes to cleaning products The effects are various because there are many different types of molecules and Of components and compounds and ingredients that have different effects in our body So, you know, some some Products will have you know the volatile component of them like you breathe for example ammonia or bleach You know, you will breathe that in you may not even get it close to your hands You might be wearing gloves you might be, you know But it doesn't matter because just the breathing of it has an impact on how your organs will perceive That chemical, okay If you don't clean with gloves, which god forbid that would be the case, you know, especially if you're using Cleaning products, you're going to be absorbing the skin Angela absorbs Whatever compound is put on it three times more in greater amounts than what you eat through your mouth imagine that right, so We literally will be able to Have a higher dose Of that chemical inside the body by having it on our skin Then if we were to ingest it if we were to drink it So hence the absolute importance of making sure that we are using protective, you know equipment when we are doing cleaning jobs And you know, there are there's the usual household cleaning and then there is the really kind of deep household cleaning And then there is the attics and the, you know, kind of whatever kind of people We want you to do and in those types of cleaning jobs even more so, you know, the entire protected year of like suits and masks and you know face masks and eye goggles and all of those things is vital because Whatever is in that environment is going to end up in your body in one way shape or form So whether and I think that's a key I think a lot of house cleaners don't realize that their lungs are also filtering out like you've mentioned the fumes with the Bleach and the ammonia and absolutely their lungs are acting as a filter and their respiratory system is going into high gear When we use some very cleaning chemical and it may not be necessary to use something as strong Yeah, absolutely. And it's you know, it's almost like the lungs will be acting as a filter and a sponge at the same time Right, so it's like it's literally sucking it all into the system So what happens is that when we are sucking on all these things into the system Then what happens is that the body has to Treat it somehow, right? It has to work on it somehow and so what happens from there is going to It'd be dependent on many other factors and many other pathways of what's going on in the body That's called epigenetics. You know when it comes to The way in which the environment Has a relationship with what happens in the body like we have all of our genes but the way that our genes will kind of Essentially show up in our day-to-day and what kind of diseases we may be predisposed to or we may be affected by Will be dependent on how our genes respond and that response is called epigenetics Okay, so for example, we know we all know or have heard of stories of people who have never smoked a day in their life And die of lung cancer or are diagnosed with lung cancer And we've also heard of people who are trained smokers and never develop lung cancer Right now. Why does that happen? That happens because of this You know piece that i'm talking about right now It's how our bodies respond to the environment that it will dictate essentially what predispositions or what we develop In our lifetime. So when it comes to chemicals and chemical products, there are different categories And there are different types and there are you know different ways in which they they show up in different products and so on But the takeaway of all of those different types of chemicals is the same is that they will have an impact On a cellular level on what's going on with the body and most cleaning products. They have an impact on Our hormonal glands Okay, so the end of the crime system So these hormonal glands They are the ones that communicate, you know, like our ovaries will communicate with our with our thyroid Which will communicate with our pituitary in the brain, which will then you know, kind of have this feedback loop To release the egg for ovulation or in the case of males to produce sperm When these pathways are affected or they are obstructed Because of different chemicals or different exposures Then those loops and balance that would ordinarily happen in terms of hormones. They break down Right, they become disconnected. There's little difference. There's a difficulty of communication Between those systems between those cells and between the you know those pathways And so they become disrupted and when they become disrupted we start to see symptoms and So and those symptoms they will be they'll range from many different things from imbalanced cycles from, you know, say irregular cycles to the inability to conceive to the inability to keep a pregnancy to term And increase risk and miscarriage fibroids and the metriosis, you know, you name it There's lots of different symptoms that will arise Well, and one of the things that we have seen over the years is we've seen a lot of house cleaners who have had challenges trying to conceive Because they are affected by either their diets or the things that they're breathing or whatever And I know that as mothers we we have more of a tendency to think about well, I'm the mother Here's what you know is affecting me. But tell me about the the cleaning effects and how that might affect the fetus of of A baby that's not born yet Yeah, that's such a great question Okay, so I will say one thing that I think is important in fact two things that I think are really important to understand this First fertility is a team sport Okay, so it is not just to do with the female and you can have a woman do all of the right things And still have sperm from a male that is really under par and that will produce increased risk of miscarriage and difficulty in conceiving Okay So what many people don't understand that a miscarriage for example the loss of a child in utero is actually 40 percent to do with female factor 40 percent to do with male factor and 20 percent to do with embryonic factor Wow, I did not know that. Yeah. Yeah, and many people don't right So like say those couples that cling together, you know that are exposed to those chemicals together They will both be impacted from a reproductive perspective, you know from from that hormonal balance perspective So that's the first thing that we need to understand is that fertility is a team sport The second thing we need to understand and this is incredibly critical Fertility is and this is a very big word, but it's passed on through generations It's what's known as transgenerational Okay, but basically because those generations like, you know, we now know that what our grandmother ate Impacts the quality of our health today Isn't that fascinating, right? And we also know that what you do today as a mother or as a prospective mother will impact your child's health And their child's health So we need to take those things into account when we are talking about fertility because sometimes The majority of people and in fact in populations The truth is that most people can see without trying It's really just a very small percentage of the population where people have severe issues and just because it's a small percentage It doesn't make it any easier, you know for someone going through infertility at this stage, you know We know that one in six couples experiences difficulty in conceiving and keeping a healthy pregnancy to term You know miscarriages are highly highly likely and sometimes what happens is that most Mothers most prospective mothers. They don't know that they're pregnant Until much later on so what happens is for many couples that are struggling to see a positive pregnancy test Sometimes what's happening is that they are conceiving, but they're not actually implantation isn't happening You know the embryo that baby is not sticking and so miscarriages keep occurring Before you actually have the opportunity to do a pregnancy test to see a positive result Or they do a pregnancy test see a positive result and then a few weeks down the track. Unfortunately, they they lose the baby But the chemicals and the exposure to those chemicals in fact the exposure to anything that could be detrimental to a To a developing embryo to a developing baby Are things that are in our day-to-day like for example, you know something that we may not even realize You know those fragrance products, you know those kind of like sprays and those things that people put on In their cars and in there like, you know, those those dangly things. That's I am not a fan of those No, I get around those and they just make my eyes go bloodshot and my nose is like I'm like, why do people do this and they're popular and they You know, you go into a house and they got the little plug-in thing and it spritz stuff in the air and I'm like stop Please stop And you know what exactly and you know, it's one of the most toxic things that people could do And most people don't understand that because it's marketed so well with literally multi millions of dollars People think oh, that sounds like a good idea, right? And they or you know, it masks this particular smell Well, let's look at why the smell is there to begin with, you know And let's try and address that because all of those types of things that we don't even think about, you know, like even During the pandemic. I mean, one of the hugest things was Hand sanitizers, you know, hand sanitizers are full of triple sand That is a chemical that's directly related to hormonal imbalances and the crime disruption So, you know, the truth of the matter is that these chemicals are Revolent and pervasive in our day-to-day and in our environment We can't help the fact that they're sold in every supermarket and we also can't help the fact that when they are present in a place Have you ever noticed When you you might be in a supermarket and the second that you go into the cleaning product aisle The smell is so strong Have you ever noticed that way? Have you become desensitized to the smell of cleaning products? No, fortunately, I try to stay out of the cleaning aisle at the stores because when I go inside people like, oh my gosh, I got a question I'm like, whoa How did you know I was here? But I do usually buy my cleaning supplies through a supplier and we buy them in bulk and concentrate And then we dilute places, right? But you put it in a room, right? Does that room smell different? It does it does and you know what? It's interesting because we ask customers when we show up at their house How will you know your house is clean and it's a great question to find out their barometer of what their their thinking clean is and Oddly enough a lot of people will say my house will smell clean And then we have to have an educational conversation about clean doesn't have a smell And if there's something in your house that smells You have issues of a different sort, right? It's not it's not That your house is clean except something smells. I don't want somebody to come in and just spray smelly stuff in the house And go, oh your house is clean. That's why I want you to actually remove the dust and I want you to clean it Which is why you know the whole the dream, right? But no the point is and this is the point that I'm making Whether you walk in the aisle of a supermarket or whether you store your chemicals that have arrived, you know Somehow in your workplace or your home There is a different smell And that in itself is a cue It's and a clue Of the fact that you are literally breathing in these chemicals Okay, well, so tell me tell me this if it's not just cleaning chemicals It's probably also everything that smells like laundry detergent Absolutely soaps and deodorants and things like that that is the plastic containers that they come in There's basically that plastic will leach into the product as well and that plastic It mostly phthalates, bisphenols, you know, these very kind of potent chemicals that are You know have an impact on hormones So you're absolutely right. It's not just what you use to clean, but it's how you do your laundry How you brush your teeth how what shampoo you use what soap you use all of those things And this is a piece that I have to educate my patients on All the time because we know that really detrimental impacts like some cleaning products Most commercially available cleaning products can have And because our patients come to us typically after many years of infertility Having experienced, you know, miscarriages in the past and the like We need to look and assess their entire life Not just what they're doing in terms of the food that they eat or the exercise that they do or, you know What treatments they have had we really need to kind of like it's almost this Diagnostic of their life going deep into What else is there that is impacting you? One of the things that I talk to my patients all the time is this the importance of ensuring that Not only that they are not and this is kind of different for your audience and it's and I want to say this I want to say that in the same way that not every person who smokes is going to be affected Then in this way, right? Not everybody who uses cleaning products is going to be affected in this way However, there will be some effect We know that the person who didn't develop lung cancer Perhaps had a stroke or had a cardiovascular disease or had emphysema or had, you know, other Conditions that were related to the exposure that they had. So no exposure is neutral Okay, when when we're talking about toxic chemicals Okay, the only best way to Reduce the impact of those things is by changing the the exposures that we find ourselves facing right and so Understanding what it is that we're using to what degree how we're protecting ourselves Following the guidelines of making sure that you have, you know, open windows and you know, all of those things It's all going to help But we can't expect that, you know and and storing chemicals, you know cleaning products or otherwise Underneath the sink. It's going to permeate your whole house No matter what those volatile organic compounds are the very thing the things that we breathe in are the very mechanism in which these chemicals impact hormonal health and reproductive health Wow I love this We have a comment that came in may says my mom used bleach her whole life smokes and drinks daily 73 still healthy Maybe working out is Helping sweat it out our house cleaners now in the 90s still alive has seven children including twins another three A move out cleaner works with ammonia for 34 years still strong and healthy, but she could never conceive So this is really interesting to me because we're I hear stories like this all the time I hear stories of house cleaners who have had either complications or they have not been able to get pregnant Or they've had just physical What do you call it repercussions from cleaning chemicals that they've either inhaled or heaven forbid? They've mixed and it's had a weird reaction And I just I just can't Express the importance enough of this conversation Rachel says wow another life-changing discussion. Thank you for your ongoing dedication to support and teach others angela And thank you Gabriella. Wow. Yes. Thank you, Rachel for dropping in and saying hello We also have several other people here that have jumped in and Say hi to us and thank you so much for joining us today for those of you that are just joining us I'm here with Gabriella Rosa and she is a fertility expert Sharing with us cleaning chemicals and the effect that it has on fertility And so I'm really curious at what point of your reproductive health Let's say from being a teenager to getting ready to conceive. Should you start paying attention to cleaning chemicals? Like remember how I was saying before how Fertility is multi-generational in its impact, right? So the best time to start paying attention to cleaning chemicals is three generations forward So, you know, you really are looking at the health of your grandchildren here Wow And and and look mind you of course, but you know, there is always a situation where We don't know what we don't know Right, so we'll always be times and I think that there's also such an important Conversation to have that we have to have compassion for ourselves, you know in the things that we don't know Because it's really easy to go. Oh my god I should have known that I can't believe that I don't know that The truth is we're not none of us is born knowing right like we We do our best and we learn along the way So I think that first that self-compassion and that Ability to to look at ourselves and just do our best is so important, right? The following on from that it's it's then looking at okay Now that I understand this information or that I have this new knowledge that I didn't know before How can I or what can I do to help myself? Right, what can I do and especially if somebody is trying to get pregnant right now? Or they have experienced reproductive difficulties or challenges or everything else Like we then need to ask the very specific very very good question of like, okay What can I influence? Also understanding that for many people this is a occupational hazard It's a hazard that is coming Um from work from the fact that you know, you're living your life and you're you're making it work And it is work and it's your livelihood So it's like, you know, I've had patients in my clinic who have come to me because they worked as clinic as cleaners or they um, they worked in in chemical plants and so on and so forth and what I always say to them Changing jobs is always the last resort Because that just becomes an extra stress on top of everything else, right? And fertility treatment in it isn't exactly cheap, right? It isn't exactly free So you've got to actually figure out go. Well, how do I make this work whilst still, you know, protecting my health protecting my fertility and so on So what I'd like to always say to people is the first step is How do we Start from where we are and make the biggest But in a positive change that we can and for some people it might literally just be Using protective equipment, you know, like I had a man once who worked in a um in an aluminium factory And he would you wear absolutely it is absolute no protective equipment I'm like, are you crazy? Like the workplace provided it and he was like, oh, no, it doesn't matter, you know And we found that his fertility problems were specifically related to aluminium exposure So there at that point we're like, okay, you know what you need to wear Everything from the suit to the goggles to the to the thing to the to the to the masks every single thing And when you get home You literally remove everything you have a shower at work and then you go home because otherwise also what's happening is you're bringing all of those Chemicals into your own home Right, so that's another very important thing like for for people who do cleaning as a job My recommendation would be the set the the last job of the day you get changed Put everything in a bag And you go home already with different clothes because no matter what you would have touched your clothes You would have and in their clothes will be dirt, dust, grime Cleaning products, you know, you name it. I mean, I know I did the job so Well, you know, and it's funny because who knows who knows what it's really like to clean houses all day every day except house cleaners And as you come in as you come into my house from my garage I have a laundry room right there to the side and it has a great big Enormous tree in front of it So you can't see out the window from the neighbors and I literally would strip off all my clothes and leave them right there Because I don't want them in the rest of my house But I would come in and I would have and not just cleaning chemicals But I would have dog hair and I would have dust and I would have all kinds of stuff that had Just come in contact with me throughout the whole day And I didn't want to then cross contaminate take all that stuff through my house Even to go to my bedroom and just you know change in the closet Exactly. I wanted to just get everything off right there And it's it's interesting because we we are aware But many of us don't make choices about our own health I mean we we noticed uh, and I don't know I was probably in the business for five or six years before I learned about HEPA filtration with vacuums And I started thinking wait a second. They're making vacuum cleaners with HEPA filtration. What does that mean? When I started thinking through it, you know logically that it's removing the particulates out of the Air wait a second if they're making vacuums that have HEPA filtration What am I breathing if I'm the one that's working around the dust and things like that? And that's just along with those cleaning chemicals We talk about personal protective equipment But it's not usually until we do like a deep cleaning project And there's a lot of dust or something that we even put a face mask on No, and there's actually such an important point that you make and I have to stop you there for one second Because you know we treat in my clinic. We treat people with serious health conditions as well That are causing their fertility problems typically And one of the most serious that most people don't realize and cleaners would be in contact with this all the time is mold Mold is Literally, it's one of the worst possible exposures that a person could have and when you are cleaning Mold in particular literally like I would recommend hair covers I would recommend like literally goggles. I would recommend masks. I would recommend bluffs. I would recommend different clothing and literally All of that stuff needs to be completely stripped before you even get in your car Right because all of that is going to end up in your car that eventually is going to end up in your clean clothes from your wardrobe Right and then getting back into the house So I totally totally agree with you that you know, sometimes it's the things that we don't think about That we are doing that we can potentially start to look at it and examine and go Okay, well, how do I need to do this differently? Because otherwise we end up with more of the same, right? So that's a really critical piece that you bring to the table Well, and it's interesting because when we start talking about mold a lot of house cleaners will go straight for the bleach When it comes to the mold so now they've got mold plus bleach And I got news I got news for you the mold might look better, but what does the insides of you look like right? I know and that's that is definitely a tricky thing It's definitely tricky because it's like, you know, there is that trade-off It's almost we do need to kind of figure out. Okay. Well, how what is the best way to approach this? And so going back to that piece of of the conversation It's like what it really it's about examining It's about looking very deliberately at every part of your job And every way in which you do something and question Can I be doing this better for my health? Can I be doing this better for myself? Right, and of course if they're not sure if they would like some extra tips and whatever else You know, I'm sure that you would be very happy to answer those questions But it's about first becoming conscious of what it is that we're doing Examining that and going right. What is the next step? What how if I was to make one tiny improvement here? What could it be? You know, even when I was a cleaner quite seriously like my my bit like I will never even my own house now You know as I do, you know clean Um, I basically will never ever ever use any particular on my surfaces. I use a microfiber cloth with water Mm-hmm. That's it Like and I do that for everything my floor I literally use and I never ever and this is another thing You should educate all of your clients on For all the ladies and gentlemen listening to this is to never walk into the house for shoots Right like never ever why because the poo from the dog and the geese and the whatever else that's out there Immediately is going to end up on your bed How so well you walk with your shoes inside the house you walk around the house You have a shower you walk barefoot on the floor. Guess what that Those particles and then you get onto your bed. Those particles are under your cupboards I was thinking about this the other day because I was doing a tiktok video and we have in my in my neighborhood We have these Canada geese everywhere, right? And every time that I'm walking outside I'm literally like to towing around the the the poo, you know these animals And I was thinking gosh and imagine I never ever walk into my house with shoes I have like a shoe rack literally on the side of the door to make sure that that never happens But you know, so many people don't realize and they don't know so it's about looking and putting those little things in place, right where You're literally looking at your behaviors your actions And figuring out how can I be making micro improvements because those tiny tiny improvements of habit Will add up to a big thing like on my floors because you know, I will use Vinegar and water or I'll use you know, so it just really depends as well on And even when I was cleaning like actual houses, I would do pretty much the same Like the mopping of the floor I used just to mop with with water the the vacuuming and then of course the bathroom You know, it's it's a little bit different and there's different things that you need to do in terms of that but Just reduce the amount of chemicals as much as you possibly can because that's definitely going to make a huge huge difference Well, and I'm a big fan of reading safety data sheets safety data sheets give us a lot of information And it will tell us don't use this chemical unless there's good ventilation in the room And it will tell us here's the warning like we have warnings on the sides of the cigarette containers that say This this will kill you we have we have warnings on the safety data sheets that say keep out of the reach of children And animals and keep it in a cool dry place Isolated from everything else And it will tell us what the hazards are with little pictograms that show, you know Somebody's heart exploding and things and if you tell and if it tells you that Literally run and do not use that product But it's it's important to know it's important to know because there there are it's It's easy and you asked about the grocery store aisles. It's very easy to be bamboozled by fancy advertising You walk down the store shelf and what what happens is it triggers this cool commercial You saw on tv of all these people that were happy and they were dancing around and they were effortlessly cleaning with this particular product And if you don't look at the safety data sheet sometimes those beautifully packaged products Like you said billions of dollars in advertising are going to Make you buy that and take it home with you thinking. Oh, here's the the next big fast solution Yeah, but the reality is there are so many cleaning chemicals that are on the store shelves that are so incredibly Hazardous to your health 100 even even if you're not trying to have children As far as breathing and there will be notes on the safety data sheet that says This kills aquatic life keep it out of the lakes and rivers and streams Honestly every time I read there every time I because you make total sense. I mean, that's obvious, right? Why are you looking at these things? You know, like it's the same thing that you were talking about in terms of warnings on cigarette labels Yes Like you're gonna die if you smoke people, but still it just keeps on going, right? So I totally hear what you're saying I think that the key aspect, you know, like everything In life it's really about the fact that we need to it's a trade-off It's always going to be a trade-off and there will be times where You are going to reach out for that thing that's going to make your job easier, right? And if that is the case, then you need to be aware. How can I be reducing my exposures elsewhere? How can I be string lining? What else I do so that I protect my health and utilize those those moments where you really, you know, like I I've moved to Boston recently. I'm doing a doctorate at Harvard as you said and so, you know in my home in Sydney With with my kids and you know, like I have a nanny and you know, it's just this whole very blissful life where You know, I have everything done for me and it's wonderful Here it's very very different Where I'm kind of you know, I'm studying. I'm working. I'm doing all of the things and I'm cleaning my own house And so what and what that has brought to me in terms of like a reminder of The fact that It's what I do on a daily basis and when I do on a more frequent basis that makes more of a difference than what I do sometimes And because you see normally at home I would instruct the person who's cleaning my house do not use any chemicals whatsoever I want you to use bicarb soda vinegar and water and that's it right Here I've scrubbed that tub I have done whatever it is that I could do with water bicarb soda and vinegar and it's still not taking the thing off The other day I went to target and I got this spray thing and it was like, you know what this is amazing So I did that and I'm like I do that once a month because My life is also short. You know, it's all open all the windows and I do now It's not ideal and certainly if I was trying to get pregnant I would think three times probably, you know a little bit more But I'm you know and even so I mean even though I'm not trying to get pregnant hormonal health is important throughout life Right, and so I want to make sure and you know, I see on the comments Someone asking about policies of covariant syndrome PCOS I have PCOS So, you know, which is a basically it's the number one cause of infertility in women of a reproductive age which it causes the The ovulation to be irregular and there's a few things that I'll say about this in terms of the context that we're talking about But the important thing is to understand that Taking care of your health is literally a moment-to-moment Situation and you have to be asking questions moment by moment because otherwise these things that we think are little Right, they accumulate And so and that's really the key takeaway of this whole conversation is that you might think that Oh, you know, it's okay. I'm only just using this little bit of this cleaning product here And it doesn't really matter But for eight houses that you've cleaned in that week If you've used that little bit eight times, guess what? You've just put yourself in an exposure that is probably about 10 times or more Higher than the average person Right, because the average person probably is cleaning their own house every two, you know, two times a month Really, right? Unless you're correct cleaning freak like me, but But the reality of it is that most people are not going to have the same level of exposure that somebody that cleans houses for a living Would have and that's where we need to be very careful Right because your exposure Angela is going to be, you know, multiple compared to just a general, you know, kind of general life now in terms of In terms of spectra man who basically has asked about Difficulty struggling with PCOS and intermittent cycles Trying to make another baby, you know, definitely this is certainly something that is important for us to take into account Because of the impact that it will have on hormonal levels But the other thing that I will say in terms of polycystic aberrant syndrome Is that you also need to be very careful because for many women with PCOS We tend to have difficulty with losing weight And when you are overweight We store chemicals and toxins in our fat tissue Okay, so for all cleaners out there who perhaps are overweight and actually I heard a fabulous study the other day that I want to share with you But for for cleaners who perhaps, you know, might be overweight You do have to be careful because you will be storing more toxins than the person who perhaps Is not overweight, right? So that's going to be something that's really important as well The other thing that I was going to say there was a study that I heard of the other day Which is intentional, you know, like how do you put your intention towards like especially in terms of being overweight? The study separated two groups and it looked that, you know, one group of women basically were just observed Observed and nothing really was done in terms of educating them on anything The other group was educated as to the intention of what it is that they were doing They were told that, you know, that if they if they um cleaned briskly that they would Be able to improve How their body operated in terms of blood sugar levels, they would be able to Burn extra calories They would be able to and there was a whole list of benefits that they would describe this to, you know That physical activity Improving their skin tone and they're they're just healthy general and so on their levels of fitness and and etc And after a month, they actually went to compare those two groups with no other intervention And they would they saw that the group that was actually told us to the benefits that they had that Intentionality behind what it is that they were doing Um, actually lost weight. They felt better. They felt fit fitter and had, you know A very distinct difference in terms of physical conditioning between the two groups So I think that it's really, you know, it's interesting for us to also look at, you know, that What it is that we do and how we do it because chemicals on the environment They impact the way in which our body operates if we are thinking about the fact that oh my god I'm using this thing and it's killing me. That's not going to be good for you either Right. Well, you brought up something really interesting a minute ago where you said I used a cleaning chemical and it did a really great job And I'm a really big fan of using a cleaning chemical to do a specific job And the question is this and this is where I draw the line because it does come down to my health And I've got the awareness for myself that there's only one version of me And we do live in a technological age where we can have knees replaced and, you know Valves are replaced and whatever but there's one version of me And if I do my best job to keep track of my health right now, that's less I have to try to replace later on But I'm very keenly aware that there are chemicals that are used for specific things Am I cleaning one of those things right now? And if the answer is no, I don't need a really strong chemical I do not need to use it like you said I could use a microfiber cloth to wipe things down and to keep it sanitary because microfiber does a great job of Doing that that said there are times I will use a strong chemical because it is required However, if I'm going to use a stronger chemical it goes back to what you said about the personal protective equipment I need to double up on my personal protective equipment I need to make sure I've got my gloves on that I have a face mask on That I have clothing and I usually wear a great big long apron like one of those great big ones that the butchers use You'll prepare it Just so that I can protect my clothing because in a minute I'm going to take that off And then I don't want my regular clothing to to be covered in that And I know that there's only so much of a barrier you can create But then I don't want to breathe that and literally when I climb inside a shower And I have to spray something like you said you talk about mold if I have to use a stronger chemical I will jump in I will hold my breath And I will jump in and spray as fast as I can and then I will dip back out of the shower and like take another breath Hold my breath and go in again and spray some more just so that I'm not like you know inhaling that and breathing that as I go It's every single precaution you can make every step of the way because the reality is after 30 years in the cleaning business My health can only repair itself so many times and every time I'm face to face with all those cleaning chemicals It can it can really take a toll on you and I don't think just in terms of my organs, but like also my brain Oh, it's cool. It impacts the entire system And you see the thing is and this is also another very important point is that the cleaning products for cleaners is not the only Toxic exposure that we are exposed to in our day today Unfortunately our food is not as clean as it is to be Our environment the breathing air that we breathe outside is not as clean so the thing about it is that We all have these extra exposures right these additional exposures of of food of water You know, there was there was a study that was published recently that showed that in unfiltered water and most people unfortunately drink Unfiltered water in unfiltered water. There are almost a thousand chemicals Found present in unfiltered water in a glass of unfiltered water a glass So anything from Prozac to the oral contraceptive pill is in there So imagine well when you stop to think about it and here's what really caught my attention years ago because I started drinking Bottled water or filtered water. I had one of those filters that hooks up to your sink But I started thinking wait a second I'm going inside people's homes and they've got hair dye that splattered all over their tubs And they're doing the do it yourself hair dye Where's that hair dye going? I'm like, oh, it's going into the water system And then I started thinking about like washing machines like you pour all, you know a handful of Laundry soap inside your laundry and then what happens what goes back into your your processing systems? And granted we have systems that try to filter all that stuff out But there've got to be traces of that stuff that of course Absolutely through And so I'm thinking for all the chemicals and all of the hair dye and all of the stuff that people are washing down the drain Thinking wow, that's really amazing that we would then try to turn around and You know use that as our good our good clean water. Yeah, exactly. And hence why it's so vital to actually have a triple filter water system under your because you see also This is the other thing with um plastic bottles, you know plastics plastics are the bane Of hormonal existence Okay balance of hormonal balance existence Because anything that contains plastic whether it's something like Plastic wrap on food plastic bottles for water plastic containers for whatever It has a massively impacting effect on hormonal balance on Endocrine glands. Okay. So what happens is that we need to really look at our whole lives and go, okay How do I reduce these exposures because There is no way of avoiding them. There is absolutely no chance that we can avoid all exposures. That just isn't like, you know those Pans that are non-stick pans All of those things highly toxic. I'm part of a of a research group at harvard that we look at exactly these forever chemicals You know, we look at these plastics and forever chemicals and bleachers and all of these types of things Are the effects that they have on endocrine health And you know, the study after study is published with the find the same findings that these things Make a distinct difference in the way in which our body self-regulates So and and the impact that it has that it actually disrupts that self-regulation Hence why we end up with situations like Reproductive disease policy, cigarette syndrome, fibroids, endometriosis, you know, all of these types of things Prostate cancers, you know, prostate imbalances, etc So it's not to say that we and we can't avoid any of those things. So really what we need to do Is we need to reduce all the other exposures that we can so instead of drinking unfiltered water from the tap Get a water filter that reduces your exposure instead of using non-stick pans Get stainless steel instead of, you know, like so it's looking at where are the places that we actually have some influence And how do we behave and act and change in the best possible way to protect ourselves because like you said There's only so much that the body can take in continual exposure Before it goes, you know what I'm out. That's it. I'm done Well, and it's interesting because my husband and I were having a talk the other day about We called them made-up diseases when we were kids there weren't all these weird diseases that people have today And right now if you watch tv like especially if you watch it late at night Then all these commercials will come on that will have these these Diseases I never heard of before and then it will say ask your doctor if this is right for you And there's a new medication about a new disease And I'm like where are all these diseases coming from? And I I have to think that because our air is not as clean Because our food is more processed than ever before and full of chemicals. Unfortunately, we're breathing chemicals And it's I know that as a as a world. We're becoming more conscientious And it's it's small steps that people are taking my husband brought this to me the other day And I said what is this and he said it's your window washer fluid I said why is it so small and he said it's a concentrate And he said they're getting away from single-use plastics And so here's here's your window washer fluid and you mix it in with a gallon of water I was like, whoa Then I love to see that because we're getting away from the waste and the Overprocessing and the landfills and we're we're trying to reduce Yes, Angela. Yes and because in you know, this is this is the challenge is that When they do things like that and they concentrate these chemicals so much the impact is even greater Right and so yes, it's great from the perspective of the environment that we're not having such big things and landfill and all of those things And yet we still have to question. Do we really need it? I think that that really is the biggest takeaway because you see the thing is those highly sure you can put those those Chemicals in the thing you will spritz it into the air. It's going to end up in in the environment anyway right and so I think that that's really the the piece that we all need to come to as humanity Is to ask ourselves like what is really essential and what are we making up as essential? You know, and I'm not saying it's right or wrong like I'm just saying I think that the more aware that we can become in Asking and discerning, you know asking ourselves the question of like what is really really important here And and do I really need this right? Because if you can get away with not needing it Rather than making up the story in our minds that we need it Then I think that that's a really good place that we get to Um, so I think it's just it's just a by the by there wasn't a comment here about cast iron a love love love cast iron Pans when we were talking about the non-stick Absolutely love cast iron the only thing that Men need to be aware about in terms of cast iron For women, it's fine because especially menstruating women because we will menstruate and we are our iron levels are going to reduce As a result of menstruation and so cast iron pans are actually fantastic For women because most women unfortunately are iron efficient However for men it can bio accumulate and men don't have the same, you know kind of physiology of menstruation and so what happens is that They will accumulate iron and an excess iron in the body can be toxic So that's why, you know, I love cast iron. I use cast iron I love steel carbon as well, which is another type of, you know, kind of cast iron pan And for men who perhaps, you know, might need to have a different kind of Exposure stainless steel is also a really good idea Well, I love this conversation because it's it's certainly got us thinking about a lot of different things Yes, yes, but I think I think the big overarching grasp of this conversation is That we are affected by the environment that we live in And every choice we make is a choice And so if we're just You know drifting aimlessly and we're not paying attention It could be affecting our health in long-term effects. And like you said, it's the regenerations down the road And and sorry to just add this but The thing that I think is so vital and I want everyone to take this away from this conversation Is the fact that when it comes to fertility Especially whether it's inability to conceive inability to keep a healthy pregnancy to term just general reproduction There is no such thing as a neutral exposure Okay, there's nothing that you will do that will just have no exposure Every single thing that you will do will either have a positive exposure You know, it will be a positive exposure or will be a negative exposure There's nothing that's just going to be in the middle. So for example, what do I mean by that? well, you might say on the conversation of filtered water Unfiltered water is going to have a negative exposure. It's going to be a negative exposure, right? But then there's the greeks because is it better than alcohol for fertility? Yes, it is right So there's alcohol and then there's unfiltered water and there's filtered water Exactly. So I'll say, you know, there's alcohol unfiltered water filtered water So, you know, the reality is that in that kind of spectrum You will have different levels of exposure of positive and negative as well And what what I hear you saying is make the better bad choice begs exactly Always make the best possible choice you can there won't be a perfect choice You know, there won't be something that's you know, it's going to always be the and A choice sometimes is not going to be we're not going to be able to make that choice consistently Every single time, right? But if in the situation that you find yourself in there is a way of making a slightly better choice Than a worse one, then make the slightly better one Right and know that you're working towards improving that every single time. I think that mitigation. Yes I think that's a really good way of going about it because, you know, and in some instances I will say this as a clinician and as a fertility specialist, you know, who's specifically help Helps couples overcome a fertility and miscarriage There are situations that I will have to say no, you cannot make this choice Like you have to make this other choice because otherwise what you're telling me that you want Which is a baby is just not going to happen Right. So there are there have been situations I have had to tell people Over the years that you have to change jobs There is absolutely for you. There is absolutely no other way. So, you know, you either do that Or you have no baby and that's also a choice Well, I think there's something to be said about that because there are some children that are brought into the the earth under Circumstances where the parents were not careful with their health or they made poor choices about their their health And it affected the children and the children had all kinds of, you know, they had to be incubated or they were born prematurely Or they had health challenges that chase them around for the next several years of their lives and and all those things And so I have to start thinking in terms of we only have one version of us And if we are going to reproduce it's probably a good idea to be on high alert About the things that we eat and the things that we drink and the things that we breathe and the cleaning chemicals that we use So that we are giving ourselves and like you said three generations down the road the best chance possible Absolutely. Absolutely. The best, you know, really truly The best start in life starts way before life starts And so, you know, it's about being deliberate. It's about being aware. It's about Being prepared, you know, I think that to a huge extent and look there are different types of populations and sub populations under populations Right, there are situations where for the most part like I started this conversation in the general population out there People can see without trying really people have one night stands drunk and one night stands and get pregnant That is literally how most people no, I'm serious. That is how most people get pregnant, right? However, there are sub populations within populations. There are then the people who The drug and night one night stand is not going to do the thing right and The the really diligent, you know, eating healthy organic and this and that still is not doing the thing Right. So there's those layers those variations that we were talking about of best choices and and not so great choices They happen even like and and for couples who struggle to have, you know, a healthy pregnancy They're a different type of population They're a population that needs to be looked at in a very different way And so, you know, sometimes like, you know, people might say to me, yeah, but, you know, my neighbour my auntie my Parent, you know, they drink they smoke they do all the wrong things and they get pregnant and here I am Actually, I call it the heroin addict syndrome. I had a patient once in front of me So angry and boiling her eyes out and telling me, you know, maybe I should just shoot up heroin Maybe then I'd get pregnant and I was like Okay, that's random Um, how do I respond to that and she continued to say, you know, yeah, because, you know Here I am doing all the right things and not getting pregnant and these people are doing all the wrong things and getting pregnant And then it was the whole conversation of epigenetics the way that one person is impacted versus another and so on But that's the important thing to realise is that for some people the threshold is much lower than for other people Right and so there is no Point in trying to compare yourself if you've had the drunk and one night stand with the person who is Not having the same luck Right after years of trying having done multiple different things to achieve that outcome It's just different people like you're comparing watermelons with, you know, peaches They're very different things. They're both fruit But they are very different fruit, right So I think this applies here I appreciate this conversation with us today because this has shed a light on a bunch of really uncomfortable topics And and maybe some self-reflection that maybe some of us are not paying as close attention To ways that we can live better And I love your uh, choose choose the best possible situation in any circumstance approach Because if we do pay attention, I mean it is it is our health that's on the line And I don't think that we're going to randomly get healthier just by drifting aimlessly I don't think that's going to happen. Hopefully. Oh, thank god you said that I think our world with the with with all of the chemicals and all of the the airborne contaminants and just the pollution that we have I don't think it's getting better on its own I think it's going to take everybody doing their their own little part to try to make a difference Even in your own little world Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I agree with you so much on that, you know, like and I think there's so much to be said For being conscious about our choices in the day today, you know, sometimes people live so unconsciously and so You know lacking the liberteness about improvement because if you allow If you are not deliberate about improvement Entropy, which is the fact that everything just goes You know kind of dwindles to its lowest possible common denominator Is the definite thing that is going to happen, right? So that's why When people think about aging in many situations, they think about aging as a process of decline Because they just think that okay, well, I'm going to keep doing the same thing that I used to do in my 20s And in my 60s it will still respond the same Exactly and and but that's what happens rather than realizing that okay The thing that I did in my 20s was actually not the thing that's going to keep me at the level of health that I want to be at in my 60s Therefore if I want a different level of health that is improving as opposed to declining What do I need to do differently? Right and I actually had this conversation with myself actually quite a few years back I got into bodybuilding like seriously because I was like, you know what? I actually want to be able to sit on the toilet unassisted at age 90 How am I going to do that? You know So I was like, okay The best way for me to do that is to maintain my muscle mass And the best way for me to do that is to do some heavy lifting And to be able to do it deliberately and and carefully and cautiously so that I can be the healthiest version of myself And it completely transformed my body and it completely transformed how I thought of life and what's possible You know when I am 90 so I think that that's such a key takeaway for people. It's like don't Just sit there and drift in your life You know really Decide be deliberate Be conscious because that is the best way that you can live your best life Irrespective of where you are on a reproductive journey I love that. Thank you so much for this conversation today. I hate that our time is up Tell our listeners where they can go to find you Absolutely um fertility breakthrough.com is where they can go or they can just google my name Gabriella Rosa G a b r i e l a r o s a and if you google me Gabriella Rosa fertility, you will find me Awesome. Well, thanks again so much for being here with us today I'm so honored and I feel so blessed. So on behalf of me and everybody that's joined us today Thank you guys so much. This was awesome. And uh, we we really do appreciate your help I will leave links to Gabriella and the uh the show notes as well so that you can stay in touch Thanks guys. Lovely to have you here as well