 we never know. So I think we should start because I really think we should have a time for discussion and we don't have that packed presentations. We really want to join all of you into the discussion that has been happening. Oh, what is here? Can anyone fix this one? This is being recorded. Okay, that's fine. So these discussions that we have been having for quite a long time and it is what about this all this capacity in countries, all these his groups, 17 his 16 his groups in countries that actually also cater for other needs of their government. So shouldn't we make this kind of more as not to stay sustainable and maybe more strategic thinking about what is e governance means digital strategies in countries. So we we have actually embarked on a new project again, a new project that is actually building capacity on this kind of e governance for countries that leave multiple call and digital national digital infrastructure, which is actually what we are thinking of when we are thinking about how can we support the digital transformation for government in the global south. We could actually teach some in the global north a little bit as well. But that may become later when they see the glamorous examples from countries. So we are embarking on a new project with 10 new PhD students scholarships that we starting now now now we had meeting yesterday. So yes, we can say now, building capacity on more strategic conscious digital strategies for e governance in countries. So this will in a way be the topic for today. But we will give examples on how they just evolved into cross sector. We will like samples of how cross fertilization between education and health. We knew education is super important is as important as health in countries. But what was a little bit surprising for me was actually the cross fertilization between health and education. How important that is for decision making in countries for bettering the digitalization processes in countries. So we will also have example from that one. You can see it's a long list. As usual, we are many always. So this long list will not know some of us will not talk so much me and Pamud. We are just, you know, introducing the discussion. Hopefully, if you have some questions, I hope we will have time for discussions. Even after each session, we will try to be a strict timekeeper. Because this is to be discussed. How can we catalyze the SS to interview domain? And it doesn't mean that the SS to want to take over the whole world. It's true. It doesn't. It's more like we will try to see how can we integrate? How can we actually support the activities on each level, not only on national. We are going here to the village level. And I have shown this picture before. It's one of my favorite because at the village level, all these topics are catered by one village committee. Water and sanitation, nutrition, agriculture, health, education is treated in these village committees. So this is actually what we have done so now. But we are also thinking, hmm, what about climate health? What about, you know, effect of climate changes on all levels? That should also be monitored, taken decision upon and enable countries to have data based evidence based or not so much evidence because that's happening. But having data for decisions and and being able to take the right decisions at any time. So this is just to to remind us that it's not only a national is all the way. And that is what the SS to is kind of focusing on is the drilling down to where we where the action can be made in order to affect situations. So I will give them the word over to Pamod. Yes, so now thank you. Yeah, I'm Pamod from history Lanka. So I have been involved with some of the work where DHS to is involved beyond health. So now that we are on to the final day of our academy, which said, you all can recall that we have already discussed during the week of some of the use cases where DHS to is used outside the domain of health. So in the previous slide, Christine mentioned some of them, including education where we are having some global movement where most of the his groups are heavily involved with some countries are trying to figure out how we can use DHS to where we have a lot of expertise around health to cater the requirements, education management requirements, not everything about education, but mainly education management requirements that are present all all over the world. So here you see some of the potential areas where we have identified DHS to can be utilized. And we already have some examples where DHS to is used already to cater the requirements, the information requirements around these domains. So a bit of a technical perspective on how we are planning to use DHS to. So we all know, like, there are various ways of using DHS to if you joined the interoperability session yesterday, you may have seen like, it's not just you install DHS to and all these sectors start entering data. So we have actually broadly identified two categories, at least when it comes to data capture on how DHS to is used. So the first would be we have this domain for example, it could be climate agriculture food security, nutrition disaster health, of course, and there could be more in future, where these sectors will directly enter data into the DHS to so that means like the existing tools such as the data capture tracker capture or Android capture application can be used to capture data. So they will log in directly into the DHS to and will start entering data. And of course, might also use the analytic tools. The other common use case now we are seeing is because now we are not operating on a green field, because in all these sectors, there may be existing solutions which are already there and which may have some user base. So in that case, what we already have seen in some of the use cases is that we will have the digital systems, the capture applications, which are already existing, and we will try to integrate them to DHS to. So we already have some use cases for both the scenarios and towards the latter part of this session, you will be hearing some country use cases where both these methods are followed, right? I think let me introduce the one of the keynote speakers this morning. Lynn Martin, she's a you met her in the first day. She had the opening. She's a policy director for NORAD, but she's also the one that are taking, that are one of them, the co-chair behind this Global Digital Public Good Alliance. So we will hear Lynn Martin's perspective about DHS to and beyond. Thank you. Can you hear me okay? It's good to be back. I'm amazed at how vibrant people are early in the morning because I know Kristian is keeping up late at night as well. So that really makes me think that something great is happening here. I actually covered quite a bit of this on Monday. And I'm actually thrilled that that is being captured in the session as well. So I'm going to speak to it in a little bit more detail. This is just to mention quickly what this Digital Public Goods Alliance is, that I am co-leading the secretariat for. These are the six board members. You'll recognize UNICEF here, but also iSpirit, which is the Indian think tank that has been very involved in what has happened on identity payments and data exchange in India, for instance. We have more than 20 members. So these are just the board members. And we have members among the countries that are here today as well. So both Sierra Leone, Uganda, Rwanda are now member countries of this alliance. It's very recent. So it's been very recently announced. And India is also a member country. What this alliance is about, it's a recommendation that comes from the UN Secretary General in a high level panel report that came in 2019. And this is from his roadmap for digital cooperation. And this is just to restate what the definition of digital public goods is. And I do know that there are very good perspectives also on the Digital Public Goods standard from many here. So I'm just going to point to that. The standard for the Digital Public Goods is an operationalization of this definition. And it's stewarded by the secretariat of the Alliance for Digital Public Goods. And it's an open standard, which means that it's also possible for you to contribute to it. And we have a process for doing that on GitHub. So very happy to share back in case there are perspectives. And as you will see, it's a technical standard in the sense that it looks at aspects by design. It does not look at maturity. It does not look at implementations. And I know that this is an important perspective, particularly when it comes to what is recommended for countries, for instance, or sort of what to fund and support. And I just want to say up front that I very much agree with that. But the idea of having a standard that looks more at how a technology is designed is that it also can facilitate new things, innovation, digital technologies to address problems where there are no existing solutions. But I very much agree that maturity is an important aspect of what we choose to recommend and support for implementation and looking at how we can validate these technologies, because there are many increasingly DPGs. And then there is, as Christine said, I would come here to talk about digital public infrastructure. Another word that's being frequently used is stacks. That comes very much from the India stack, but there are other stacks as well. They typically include digital identity systems, digital payment systems, civil registries, systems for secure data exchange. And the idea is that these are the foundational cross-sectoral enablers that public and private services build on top of and where vendor looking or being looked into proprietary solutions can be particularly damaging because it's sort of and continues up throughout the entire system and it really prevents the diversity of solutions on top. I think what we are seeing when it comes to, yeah, so here are just some examples of digital public goods that are relevant for deployment is digital public infrastructure because digital public infrastructure is think of that as what countries deploy. So, for instance, in India you have Abhar, which is a digital identity system. In the Philippines, you have Philsis, which is a digital identity system. In Estonia and Finland, you have X-Road, which is the system that has been built out. Abhar is not an open source system, the Indian Abhar. Mosep, on the other hand, is a modular open source identity platform that has been inspired by Abhar and is open source. It's also been made into a modular generic technology, meaning that it's made for ease of adoption and scale. It's just to try to clarify the distinction then between the generic and the implementation. You will see that in the case of X-Road, it's both. X-Road is implemented as digital public infrastructure in several countries. It's also open source. And I know, for instance, that Uganda has leveraged X-Road as part of its own digital public infrastructure as an example. These other examples here, you probably know some of them, OpenCRVS. I think I saw Sean up there somewhere. Sean knows that very well. It's a civil registration and vital statistic system, which is now gaining more scale through some more support. OpenGDP actually emerged in Sierra Leone during the Ebola crisis to provide government to person payments for health service personnel. It is now being adopted by Ukraine as part of providing social protection and managing the humanitarian financing flows. And I think that's a pretty fascinating story, a technology that came out of Sierra Leone, co-developed with UNDP and others, is now being reused by Ukraine. Ukraine is also reusing X-Road as part of its own digital public infrastructure. MIFOS and Mojolup are other different types of payments systems. X-Road is for secure data exchange. And you will see that I've listed DHIS too. The reason for that is that as Pamoud very well illustrated, even though DHIS is to evolve and started as a health management information system, it's increasingly being adopted across sectors and for many different use cases. And I think that's what distinguishes a digital public good that has the potential for deployment as part of infrastructure is its generic, cross-sectoral relevance. And this is kind of the role I see for DHIS too, but also for his. And I did touch upon this on Monday as well, but just to go into this a little bit more. So first of all, DHIS too is in itself very much becoming part of the global public infrastructure because it's so adopted for health, but also because it's scaling across sectors and it has a generic relevance. That's DHIS too. Obviously, the community and capacity building model, as I also said on Monday, is the most important part of that success. Obviously, there are some personalities involved that have stewarded it since the very beginning, but ultimately it's the community and capacity building model in combination with the technology. As Pamoud mentions, increasingly now there are integrations between DHIS and other DPGs. And I know that, I mean, I don't know how many requests you get every year for integrations, but I think there are many and they probably come both to the HISP community, the HISP hubs also to Oslo, to individual countries, but there are a myriad of integration requests. And I do think that there is huge potential in these integrations, but as I've heard frequently mentioned and fully agree with, they need to be locally owned. It can't be some international development donor. Sometimes donors like Murad, where they feel like they want to recommend something that they think is a brilliant idea from where we sit. And we can't have top down driven ideas about fantastic platforms. It needs to emerge in the local use case, the local need, but some of these integrations can really make sense. And I think Pamoud can tell some great stories about, for instance, Sri Lanka and about Daivok and DHIS too, and how things have evolved, but also the complexities involved in doing that, because it's not easy and it also costs money. And I think that's another point here. It's the funding to support some of these innovation and integrations, because we can't expect DHIS too and the HISP community to take the cost of doing that all the time. I also wanted to point to how at least my impression, and I try to stress this with Pamoud, is that the success ultimately and the impact of DHIS too and HISP is also dependent on digital public infrastructures, where there are digital identity systems, civil registries in place, it's much easier or other types or even payment platforms to build on. It's possible to pay health workers, it's possible to target different types of assistance much more effectively. And so I would argue that this sort of e-governance or evolving into more of a sort of digital public infrastructure, e-governance, comprehensive thinking is also ultimately in the interest of everyone who's working on DHIS too, even if it's from purely a health use case perspective, because these other digital public goods that are being implemented will hopefully help strengthen the impact also in health. At least that's what we're taking a bet on from our end. But I think there's some things that need to happen to make that happen. And of course it's to not forget the need for technical assistance and implementation support and the whole community and capacity building. So how can we leverage that when we go beyond DHIS too? How can we also leverage the HISP model into these other digital public goods and use cases? And also I really hope we can learn from HISP when it comes to this idea of sharing back. I know there's a code of conduct, but it's not something you're forced to do, right? There's not the legal requirement to share back. My understanding is you're doing it because you're part of a community, because it makes sense, because everyone wants to contribute and everyone is benefiting. How can we infuse that spirit also beyond? Because that has been a key sustainability challenge for other digital public goods. How can we support that ecosystem? What can we learn? And lastly, I think no one illustrates better than the HISP community, the importance of a long-term perspective, because I think it's the only project in the world I can point to that starts in 1994 when I was 16 years old. So I do think that it's a lesson learned particularly again. I sit in an international development donor. If we're funding things, we can't do these two and three year perspective things. We have to be willing to say that, okay, if we want this model and ecosystem to actually be what happens, to actually be what replaces the old paradigm, then we need to be there for the long run. That is not something that comes easily for international development donors. I also know there are many government representatives here. It's not easy also for governments in countries to commit to these long-term perspectives, but really that's maybe my last statement to encourage that, that we can manage to try to give 10-year horizons and predictability so that we can actually make this paradigm shift happen. Thank you. Thank you, Liv Marte. Do I have some? Yes, I have some. Thank you so much, Liv Marte, because I mean, so these long, long thoughts, that's what we do at the university. So that is actually key pillar at the university is to have long thoughts and investing capacity in a lifetime perspective. So thank you so much for this good introduction. We will now continue with the next keynote speaker. Yeah, we have quite a few, but I mean, super important one, director Steve. Next slide, please. Anyone that can do the next slide? Yes, Steve, please come up. He's a director for the DDI, the directorate, no director for department of data and analysis, co-chair of HCC, anyone that remember HCC, health data collaborative, and also a chair, maybe also chair of the UN chief statistician committee. So now we will hear more about the importance of data. Do you hear the kind of, you know, you just start to talk there, but then you will get. Yeah, so thank you. Good morning, everybody. My name is Steve McFeely. As you heard, I work in WHO, but what I'm going to talk today about is really more from the chief statisticians of the UN perspective. So I'm going to give a lot, so Christine wanted a long view. I'm going to give you quite a long view because my story is going to start in 1966. And in fact, it starts right here in Oslo. So back in 66, I hope I'm forgetting this right, Sven Norboten in Statistics Norway published a paper with a very short title, a statistical file system. And we use the word seminal paper, I think too often, but this really was a seminal paper. This paper turned the statistical world upside down. It was the paper that began the journey in the Nordic country towards a register based statistical system, which is really unique around the world. It was highly controversial in the rest of the world. In fact, a lot of people thought this paper was heresy. So it really, really shocked the world that we could move away from surveys, that we could move away from census and start using register based systems. For me, when I read this, I joined the statistics office in 1993. This paper had only been translated in English, but it had a huge impact on me. When I read it, I really thought like, what the hell is going on? Like, we haven't been doing this everywhere else. So much later on, myself and a colleague, we wrote a paper, and it was really an open letter to the Irish government. We were saying, look, we have to organize the national data infrastructure in the country. Like, we are squandering information because there's administrative data in every department. It's not been digitized. It's not been properly organized. And we're squandering resource. So really, there was three messages coming out of this paper. First and foremost, was this because what we did is we reviewed all of the government strategies. And across the strategies, we were reading about seamless government network government joined up government. And we were arguing, how do you achieve that? If the data aren't seamless and joined up, if you want evidence-based policy, which they all claim they did, and if you want seamless policy, then you have to apply the same logic to the data. The other point that we wanted to make is that everything is interconnected. So each department tend to look at their policy in a siloed perspective. And this is important for the discussion today around health. Public health, if you really want to look at health, you need to connect the data to education. You need to connect it to tax data to look at income. You need to look at environmental information. So health is just a domain in a broader national infrastructure. And I use the word infrastructure very deliberately. If you go to government and you say, okay, we need to put in a new electricity system, government will instinctively understand that means they need to invest in generating the information or storing the electricity, transporting the electricity, consuming it. So they understand there's a whole bunch of steps involved. And all of those steps have to be carefully managed and they have to be connected. For some reason, they don't understand the same about data. But in fact, it's exactly the same. Data don't just pop up. They have to be manufactured. They have to be organized. They have to be stored. They have to be transported. So in the same way when we talk about oil, when we talk about roads, we talk about infrastructure, we need to start talking about data as infrastructure. And in a modern economy, in a modern data driven economy, if we're thinking about data as an asset, then we have to treat it like an asset. It needs to be carefully curated and managed. And this really was the argument. One of the key things we were saying is that in Ireland, we needed three unique identifiers. We needed a spatial identifier. We needed a person identifier. And we needed a business identifier. In Ireland now we have two of them. We have the locations and the people. Not all government departments are actually using those, but that's another battle. Another battle that we had at the time was actually with the health sector. So the health sector was arguing continually that they needed a special unique identifier. And we were arguing, no, you don't. There should be one national identifier and you should use it. And I've heard this argument repeated in other countries too. So what I would say is if you do have to have a special health identifier, make sure it can be connected to the other person identifiers in the state. Because, again, otherwise, you're wasting infrastructure. Okay, this came out a little bit lumpy. But when I joined the UN, I had done a lot of work in Ireland linking data. When I joined the UN, they asked me to give some examples at some regional workshops around the world. And what I very quickly discovered is some of the things that I took for granted as a European statistician didn't exist in other parts of the world. So effectively, I had to rewrite the open letter to the Irish government to try and explain, apart from data infrastructure, you need governance. So we called it a legal framework. If I was rewriting this paper now, I would broaden it and call it governance. And you need institutional coordination. Because an awful lot of what we do is connected by people, and people are either blockages or they're facilitators. So you need to find the right person that's going to kick open the door for you. There is always somebody who will do it, but you just have to find them. And in a lot of countries, what we see is these pieces on my left don't exist. And this is a lot of the work that we have to do. And again, if you look at the words here, sorry, there's a lot of words, but we're talking about infrastructure. We're talking about architecture. And we heard those words earlier in the week. You need to think of data in those terms. They don't happen accidentally. And this is key now as well when we talk about trust. So in more recent times, governance has taken on a new dimension because we're hearing a lot about fake news. There's a key role if data is going to have a role in debate. And data, you would hope, and statistics and information would be the neutral element in an argument. So both sides can agree on the data at least. They may differ on the interpretation. But again, this is why this stuff around governance is so important, because if the information is contested, then we're really going to get nowhere. So let me take a slight, let's jump off the highway for a second. I'm going to take a little by road for a second. So this is the first of the random walks. This is not only information or the logic of interconnection. It's not only important for analytics. It's also very, very important for advocacy. So I give you an example. We've been talking in WHO a lot recently about CRVS. What's interesting for me, coming from a non-health background, and I come into the WHO, the whole narrative around CRVS is around health, which I guess is what you'd expect. But in fact, to me, when I look at HRVS, I'm kind of saying, well, it's much more than that. I mean, the UN broadly is trying to help informal economies formalize. So in other words, to increase their tax base, their ability to raise domestic resources. You cannot do that if your population isn't registered. If they don't exist on systems, you can't tax them. So CRVS is much more important in health. It's critical for human rights. If you don't have an identity, and this becomes crucial if you become a migrant, if you're undocumented, then you're in real trouble. I mean, this really affects the outcomes for the rest of your life. So again, we're talking broader than health. Democracy, I mean, how do you run elections? If people don't exist, if there's three or four of you exist, there should only be one of you on an electoral register. How do you set electoral boundaries? How do you know how to distribute the representation in the country if you don't know where your populations are? How do you transfer property and inheritance when people die, if you don't know they died? Massive economic implications. How do you plan? If you don't know that, and from a statistical point of view, if you don't know the natural rate of increase, so that there's really only two ways population change, natural rate of increase and migration. If you don't know the natural rate of increase, then how do you plan for hospitals for education? How do you know where to locate them? And now increasingly with security, with terrorism or things like that, if you don't know who's in your country, if you don't know who they are, then how do you really plan for security? So if we take something like as simple as CRVS, which we tend to think of probably in this room as a issue, I would argue it's something much, much wider. So again, it's this idea that everything is interconnected. The other thing, another side road is just the world is changing fast. The world of data, when I joined the statistics office in 93, we really thought of data as numbers, columns and rows of numbers. In my lifetime, that has utterly changed with the introduction of the internet. Now data are sound, data are images, data are text. So the whole way that they were beginning to develop our analytics to mine information has utterly, utterly changed. And that means that the concept of data itself has changed. And that has implications for governance. Now at the chief statisticians level, we've started to really become more and more concerned about governance, about what's going on at a global level. So a couple of years ago, we started writing some blogs about what's going on at the global level, who's taking ownership because we see some kind of dangerous dichotomies emerging. So you see with the open data movement, the open data movement is really focused on public information. But the private sector is completely exempt from the open data movement. So we see this kind of worrying dichotomy. We see, Liv was just talking about public goods. So at the governmental level, we're looking at data now as a public good. Statistics are now free. Like 20, 30 years ago, you probably had to pay for statistics from your national statistical office. Now they're free. There's been a seismic attitudinal change. But yet we see at the corporate level, they're now looking at corporate assets. These are assets to be monetized. So we're seeing these kind of dichotomies emerging in the data world. So we started publishing these blogs. And at the UN, this really has reached traction. And in fact, last year, the World Bank, that they dedicated their World Development Report to data. I mean, that's an incredible statement. And also, Untad and one of their main development reports, they looked at trade and data. So the idea of data as a good as a commodity being traded. And what does that mean for development? The UN, at the high level, there's a board called the CEB, which is the chief executives board of the UN. These are really the secretary's generals of the UN. They've now become sufficiently kind of interested in this topic. So they're preparing for a summit, I think in two years time, called the Summit of the Future. And back to kind of what Liv was talking about in a way, they're looking at duties to the future. They're looking at new public goods. And they're looking at networked and inclusive governance. So they approached the chief statisticians and said, look, we need to look at data across all of these domains because we're actually getting a bit alarmed by what's happening. And the reason I'm telling you this, because I think that this is the context that can shape how you think about what you're doing. And so just last April, in fact, in London, the CEB has now asked the chief statisticians to start developing and drafting a global data compact. I'm not sure what the final name will be, but you may know, just to come back to the last talk, the UN is also producing now a new global digital compact. And in fact, there's an open consultation is open at the moment. That closes in September. So they've asked us to input into that, but they've also asked us to start looking at these types of issues about gaps in data governance. Data is a public good universal data principles because there's a real gap here. And really, I think the UN has realized that no one is looking at this seriously. And this has profound risks and opportunities for us. So we jump back to health again now. So if we look at something like health information systems, the other thing I've noticed since I've joined the WHO is a lot of routine health information systems, health information systems, HMIS, is that right? There's all of these terms, but to me, it really doesn't matter. In fact, I think the information for health systems or systems for health is nearly a more interesting perspective because we should be taking the broadest view because as I said, everything is interconnected. So even within HIS, from an administrative data point of view, I would include everything. I wouldn't be ruling everything out. And I'll explain why in a moment. So for me, what we want to do is we want to develop systems that are adaptable and flexible. We don't want multiple systems. I would say, I would argue IT can solve everything. We need to organize the data as well as the IT. This is a message really for WHO, but for everyone else too. I think the dichotomy of routine and information is a really false and a really unhelpful dichotomy. You need to build systems that can deal with emergencies and not just routine. And this brings me to this one. Indicators are not enough. I'm an indicator skeptic. Indicators have a place. But the idea that we can develop a set of indicators now to prepare us for the next emergency, I think is frankly ludicrous, because we don't know what's coming. That there's an argument or a saying that generals always fight the last battle. I think statisticians are guilty of the same thing. We're preparing for the next COVID, but it probably won't be COVID. There'll be something else that's going to come. We don't know what it is. So we must have systems that are just flexible and adaptable that when something happens, we can add in variables. We can reanalyze. And the critical point then is capacity. We need systems management capacity, and we need analytical capacity. There's no escaping it. There's no easy way out. We need analytical capacity. We need creative minds. We need people who can use the data and just reformulate the data. So I would just please argue, don't get trapped into indicators. They have a place, but they have a limited place. Thank you. Thank you so much. This was really, really interesting and very put a shed light on the perspective that is super, super important, the need of flexibility and capacity to be prepared for new emergencies. And also the importance of looking at data as much, much broader sense than often are done. So this was super for the cross-sector plenary. So over to the next. It is actually learning from health, which we have done since 94, into the educational sector, but also see how that has happened, that it's actually much closer connections between health and education that at least I anticipated, because we are all going to schools and all our children are going to schools and we really want them to go to schools and we really want the teachers to be in the schools teaching our children. So this is actually super important when you come into national digital infrastructure, because if our children are not taught in schools, the country will not really exist and be a democracy. So over to Monika. Monika is from his Uganda, but also a PhD student within our education, the SSU for education project. So I'm very happy to give the word to Monika. Thank you very much, Christine and good morning to you all and thank you for the previous speakers, presenters. I think it was a very good opening and also ushering in us to share our experience on how we've learned from health and now we are implementing in education and also in governance. So talking about basically the lessons that we've learned while implementing in health. In health, DHIS2 has been implemented in Uganda, I think since 2010. So we have this more than 10 years experience implementing in health. And so building on that experience, we now ask ourselves, what can we learn from health and adopt into education and also avoid any mistakes that were made during the implementation in health and so that they are not repeated in education. So one of the things that we learned while implementing DHIS2 for health is that the districts were really, really at the center of data management and so this improved quality, improved data use at district level. So now bringing in DHIS2 for education, we saw that opportunity really to use the district as a center for data management of education data and also at that point now use this data to help routine decision making at the district level. So before we actually adopted DHIS2 for education at the district level, you would find that data was really, the district was just a conduit for data down from schools up to the national level it was a manual process. So the district was really left out in the data management process. But now with this, this has created a potential of empowering the districts to really improve their capacity in data management and also use this data. Then of course the districts are very close to the schools. They know that issues, they know that problems at schools, the school inspectors at district level are able to identify which schools have problems and then go and support them. So working with the district really was giving us an opportunity to empower these district education teams to really support the schools at that level. Which was now a best practice also. This was learning from health because in health it was a best practice that the district health teams go down to health facilities, work with them to improve really the challenges at this health facility. Then also we had in health where we have routine data quality assessments because the districts now are really interrogating their data with the DHS to for health. So we saw this also as an opportunity where the education teams now would now interrogate their data and in so doing improve the quality really of this education data that is coming in. So this is really a very good best practice that we are learning from health and actually being adopted in education. And of course the promotion of data use can't be more emphasized. So we are having really increased data use at the district level. We are having this data, informing district plans. We are having this data, inform allocation of resources, advocacy of additional resources to support all the school interventions in various districts. So for us we think that this is a very strong point that we could learn from health and now we are adopting into education. And of course the promotion, the display of this data in real time dashboards both at district level and also at the central level has really increased the appetite for data use. Then as we all know that of course there are various partners in the education sector, education development, partners, different stakeholders which is the same as in health. So in health you have all these health development partners and each partner is really interested in their various needs, in their needs, data needs. So you find that with that each partner maybe would come with their own data collection tools down to facilities or down to schools. That was happening. But now while adopting DHIS to for health during the implementation of DHIS to for health there was need for harmonization of all these data needs. So we had a harmonization process of all the data collection tools where now instead of different implementing partners are picking their own data. You have all that data picked in standardized tools and then this data is entered into DHIS too and now this enables the partners to really support the facilities to enter quality data. So we are all contributing to one cause. So learning that best practice in health enabled us now as we implemented DHIS to for education to really come together with partners the Ministry of Education education development partners to ensure that we harmonize these tools. We harmonize the data collection process to avoid really ad hoc that reporting ad hoc data calls that really burden the school level or the districts in the long run. So this has led to harmonization of our data collection tools. We have the family data collection tool now that we have and then also this has really enabled us engage with these partners to support the scale of this initiative to all the districts in the country. So when everyone is contributing to the same cause I think resources are more aligned and then this really increases adoption of the system. So with this as well learning from health we've also gone ahead to do a costed implementation plan because in health partners we are contributing to a costed implementation plan somewhere assisting with server hostings data collection DQS all these were being contributed to by partners having human resources. So now this has also now been adopted in education to enable us really organize harmonize these partners to support the implementation. So of course like live and the other speakers have indicated that data integration is really key. I think we need to ensure that data is integrated and so this has also been this is a lesson still that we learned from health and Pamud also indicated that in his presentation. So really data integration we can't have like the DHS to collecting all the data that we need from various areas so having all the population statistics and what. So what we have done really is integrate this data into the DHS for education. We need data from various areas we need population statistics we need examination data. We need data from health. So all this now we use it all this data now can be integrated into the DHS for education to allow us really calculate the indicators the key performance indicators that are going to inform planning and really programming. So that was also something we learned from health in health the DHS to for health in Uganda is really used as a central repository and it draws data from various from various sub sectors. Then of course with this integration we went ahead now to link education data with the health data and this really has been critical for that successful implementation of health programs. You find that now using our school surveillance data it's informing the interventions of COVID vaccination. You find that our school enrollment data is informing interventions for health inside for routine immunization. So really there is data sharing across the different sectors and this has really improved interventions in the different sectors. Then lastly I think this has also been shared before during the week. We've adopted the DHS to as a generic platform for e-governance in Uganda and this here we are tracking the national development plan and this national development plan of course different ministries departments agencies are basically supposed to report progress on the national development plan. So you find that all these different sectors all the different sectors are contributing or are reporting into the DHS too. So talking about interoperability talking about sharing I think this is a very good use case at national level and now all the other ministries the Ministry of Health will readily integrate its data with this system the education ministry that has also adopted DHS would readily integrate its data with this system. So I think this is an opportunity for also having sharing data from the various sectors and then integrating it in the national development plan system. Then the other thing of course that while adopting DHS for education that we really learned was it is a very low cost model. Why? Because we are really leveraging on the DHS to community on the existing DHS to community on the capacity that has already built has already been built over the years. So this really has given us a leverage to really to now easily implement or adopt DHS to in the other sectors because we are talking about that his network the MOH the ministry all the district health teams are knowledgeable in DHS to so they are able to work with the education teams they are able to support them they are able to you know mentor them you know that as they adopt this system. So this really has increased improved the adoption of DHS to for education in the other increase the adoption of DHS to for education. So we think really using a mature system which is open source which is generic being adopted from one sector which and it's tested and tried really will give us a low cost model for adoption in the other sectors. Thank you. I think that's where I stop. Thank you so much Monica. This was super super super interesting to hear this story from from Uganda and the educational project of ours that's creating a lot of enthusiasm around in the his groups. We have another sector as well we would like to report on and that that is agriculture and even climate and agriculture. So we will now go into a different domain of agriculture and I will Tivongis already here Tivongis say from University of Malawi but also his Malawi and the former holds a PhD long time ago. Morning. Thanks, Pristin. So morning everyone. So I think just take you through the Malawi National Agriculture Information System use case. So for this implementation we currently implementing in 12 districts in the country with over a thousand tablets. So the idea here is that you know as you know agriculture is the main activity for our economies but then there's been noted that there's a key need to strengthen processes from data collection to communication of the data analysis and dissemination and then also because agriculture is weather and climate dependent. So for this system there was that need for having the early warning capability which is in a way too forward. So there's one component building from getting weather and climate data but the other component to this early warning deals with food situation assessment and also monitoring the production within the country. And then there's the capability for the trade and marketing. So marketing information system to enable the country be able to determine trends in markets and commodity prices. And then also the community development aspect to look at efforts that are taking place at community level track those be able to track for example lead farmers and provide appropriate support. And then there are also various tools for livestock and animal monitoring. I'll show you a screenshot on one of those shortly. And then there's also the component on resource mapping. So because there are various implementing partners so it's essential that we're able to monitor what projects are implemented where they implemented what sort of activities they are supporting. And then also the budget lines and the duration for those projects. And then there's the household component because households do receive support from various streams. So it's also essential that we map what sort of support households are receiving so that resources are provided appropriately. So for example at the moment what we have is just the daily weather report but they plan to enhance that with the other streams of weather data but also because we utilizing the DHSU platform we currently exploring possibilities of using the other online services where we can pool weather and climate data to also interface with the the data that we that we're collecting because the data for whether that's being collected is being collected at community level by agricultural extension workers. So these are community level workers that go to households and provide advice on best cropping practices and everything related to agriculture to the households but then they also collect this data. I think it's also worthwhile mentioning that within this system we have multiple streams of structuring things. So there's the general reporting structure of organization like from the lowest level so at the lowest level we have what's called a block and then there's a section a group of blocks then an extension planning area then you have a district an agricultural development division and then the national level. So this is the standard reporting structure but also within the system we have embedded the marketing component so we have the structure for all the markets in the in the country and then we have the structure for all the weather stations in the country and then we also have the structure for all the fishing points within the country. So there these sort of like multiple streams for service delivery and getting the data and then on the right here now that's a tool for food situation assessment at household level. So every by week the extension worker follows a sample of households to determine the food insecurity so this is a protocol that they would run through checking the size of the household so behind that you have the protocol running that would so say okay if you have this number of members in the household then for the next two weeks this is the food energy requirement for that particular household and then you check the the main food source do they buy or do they grow their own food and then you check whether they have food in the household or not and then what types of food so based on the amount of food they have then the app does calculate the energy reserve that the household has and then you also check what livestock they have market prices for food and livestock and then and also the amount of money they're able to get and whether they're able to save or not and from all this then the app does make calculations to see based on what they require and what they're able to generate either by selling livestock or crops and what they have in the household will they be food secure for the next two weeks or not so so based on that then appropriate interventions can be taken and if need be the household can get support and also in addition to that as a key aspect of the system we do have what's called the household register so the household register forms the foundation for work so as a matter of organization all households are supposed to be to be registered so this serves the two functions at least one is that with the work processes at community level the population based workflows like for example where you're monitoring livestock so you'd follow all households that work with I mean that skip livestock but then for this food situation assessment or for production estimates these are sample based workflows so you do run a sample on the registered household so by registering all households then we're able to determine that representative sample then the other thing as well is there's the component for checking let's say what sort of enterprise the household is involved in whether the household is getting support from NGOs and if they're getting support from NGOs what sort of supports they're getting like in what areas they're getting how many NGOs are they getting support from so we follow like the top three NGOs and then you also check whether the household is getting support from government linked projects so this then can also form the basis for determining what sort of support should be provided to households so that resources are provided equitably yeah and then the other component is on livestock so we have tools for monitoring all dynamics for livestock so births deaths livestock being transferred in being transferred out given as gifts livestock stolen and then based on that you can determine the increases or decreases for livestock and also for other animals let's say cats and dogs then you can check whether they've been vaccinated or not and whether the people beaten in as like number what number of people have been beaten let's say and whether you know the animal responsible was vaccinated or or not so with with this work well we also are able to generate you know different types of statistics so like with this line chat there what you see are just trends in in market prices for for different commodities and then with the charity on the right so based on that household registration then we're able also to check the average land holding size per household to see you know what size of farming land is available and then from there you can also form a basis for seeing possible productivity at at household level so I'll stop there and then I think Zephyl continue because we have we're doing some collaborative work in in this space thank you let me thank you Tivonga this is this is yet another domain and I really think it's interesting he forgot to mention that this is implemented in 12 after 28 districts in Malawi covering 30 000 households so now over to Zephyl you know Mozambique thank you Christine good morning everyone my name is Zephyl Saugen I'm from Mozambique and just like Tiongas apart from being a former PhD student at University of Oslo I belong to a group of DHS2 experts that are supporting the Luzofone community and implementation of DHS2 for the Portuguese speaking countries so in this process of advocating for the use of digital public goods we end up being being exposed to several stakeholders that are that are working in the different domains and as an example in 2016 for example we were approached by a group of NGOs that were working with farmers in one of the districts in Maput we called Matutwin they requested apart from their projects that they were dealing with with the different aspects of the agriculture chain value chain and then one of the aspects that we are having challenging it was the exposure of the products in the situation where the country was exporting goods from South Africa while within the country we could find several of these districts having products that were not being used or even they were not able the farmers were not able to sell their products within the country so together working with this NGO we developed DHIS2 platform or which allowed both customers and farmers to expose and then to do somehow to share the experience and then be able to sell their products later I think it was to 2016 or 2017 we also had opportunity to work with another group of NGO that was working in another province in Nampola province they were also looking for possibilities of having a platform that could be used to share specific aspects in this case there were accidents were working that were happening along the railway because people farmers were producing for example rice and then they used to go to the railway the railway and then use it as a mechanism for drying I think they product so then since we don't have the railway station in our countries are not like the way we have here for example all the railway you have your is blocked if you go there you see that there is a a kind of barrier that they allow that doesn't allow people to cross for in our country they just they are open you can the people they can pass then and there were a lot of accidents and then they asked us to also expand that this platform to allow individuals so even experts in the field to produce some information that could be shared with the with the farmers especially the farmers so we expanded this platform then allowed to be able to send notifications and also alerts as well as sharing some of good good parts with related to the production of agriculture goods little in the last years we have been also seeing several advertisements and also Minnesota agriculture looking for platforms that could be used to manage data and also because of the several disasters that have been happening in in Mozambique I think most of you have seen that the government has created what they call the National Institute of Risk Management and Control and with one of the the objective of this institute is to have a platform that is going to be used to alert the population the general population when or before disaster happens in this case for example the cyclones all these things need to be they need to be to have a platform that could be used to to manage using for this data and also to warn the population before it happens so as part of that so digital have been also developing the capacity on hella warning systems and we for this year we just developed a module that is supporting the national Malaya Pro-Untro program on the hella warning system using climate data and also historical data to predict out outbreaks this is used by the Malaya program in Mozambique so we are at the moment using these expertise and together with the colleagues of Malang developing that it is extending this platform that we have been developing as I mentioned from 2016 to also be able to integrate Amonika's mentions here also about integration so our idea is here to have an integrated platform that can be used to not only for the management of data also to predict all these aspects that I've mentioned which are linked to to the agriculture and the climate and also keep the farmers informed we know that there are several other challenges that we have been discussing here the whole week we are hoping to learn from what we are doing what we are doing in health education in order to to help in developing this integrated platform thank you very much thank you Stefareno it's very very inspiring to hear about all this project that goes on in countries that actually adhere to local um situations and local needs in the government government we we have some time to to to discuss I mean we have so much to present always but we have at least 10 minutes plus depending on your your length of your cover break anyone that would like to ask questions for any of our presenters would like to come with some statements of what they have heard you're most welcome and it's now Anis Karin good morning everyone still awake so I'm Karin from Gavi the Vaccine Alliance and just a really a comment question maybe some ideas for for all the the panelists first great presentation is very refreshing you know every year I'm coming and every year when beside the last two years every year I'm coming and I'm quite impressed so it's it's really nice just one word that have not been pronounced during the week is dollars money funding so I know it's not the goal of this week it's really to present the results but I think after such presentation this morning at some point someone has to say this word funding dollars I heard it a lot in the background in the corridors everyone talk to me about talk about dollars to me every day when I'm here but just to say of course you know it's low cost you say this I think but low cost that don't mean no cost of course you know it's cross sectoral but doesn't mean one sector is to support more than another of course it's all about oh it's cheap because it's local technical assistance does not mean that local people I don't know what does that mean doesn't mean that those local people are not human being doesn't mean they don't need to sleep they don't need to rest during the weekend they don't need to have money they don't need to have to be paid so of course I'm not to say that here because if you're here it's because you contribute as by hand your brain your hair your dollars your Norwegian crown but maybe together we can be better in you know demonstrating the use case demonstrating the cost effectiveness and be better in fundraising I think there is a lot of ideas on what can be improved I will not talk about challenges or weaknesses I would suggest area to improve we talk about security better data use better architecture better things but we need dollars so let's be better together to go out and call for those dollars I think now health sectors the five six donors that are there are stretched difficult for us to do more but maybe better we could do more together to fundraise so I just wanted to say it and let's go back now to the to pick another dollars thank you for that Karine even the hispers need the salaries I agree and sleep at night anyone that would like to comment on this or more people in the audience maybe because now we are picking topics for the for the for the afternoon outing you know at Song's one in the sunshine we will have plenty of things to discuss and of course the dollar is one of them and we I appreciate Karine mentioning that health cannot finance all the other sectors so we are looking for other sectors as well prosper other comment yeah yeah thank you very much Karine for bringing that up I think at some point we had a comment that weighs the money but I think from what we are looking at and trying to do cross sector is we trying to build a case that can be funded across I mean you know Gavi's funding immunization what is the cost of you extending the immunization now to the school and helping the school get that data so we think we can build a case that we can present I think to the donors even the four that are there right now to see how this can be because we find you find some countries like UNICEF you are funding health alone education alone and if this was integrated I think it would also be less cost it would be cost effective anyone that yeah yeah yeah yes oh because I even have a mic yeah thank you very much for the presentation and I think it was really encouraging to see how you're extending the use of DHIs to into these other domains my question is what kind of limitations have you seen within the platform itself that doesn't allow you to respond specifically to these new domains and how have you overcome those and what is the possibility of actually having separate platforms for these specific sectors is that in the roadmap and would it go into JIRA ticket 6070 or something very very good question and that has been the topic for the the previous week we had all the history groups together discussing actually these matters and you know it's all about slack sorry no JIRA ticket anyone would like to comment on this all right thanks for for the question so I was like with the that I required but there are some specifics such as like sampling so I said there are components where you have to do sampling you can't do that with the platform out of the box but I think on the other hand then there's that possibility to extend the the platform with up development so like in our case then we developed the the apps for for the sampling and also they are some reporting formats that you couldn't support straight forward out of the out of the box and then we had also extending that with with apps for for doing that so I think also and finally I think another use case is on the the duo entity tracking so I think by and large when you get to the tracker level you're tracking a single entity but here you want a household but you also want to track the people inside the household so but I think this also is coming up in health because we do have another implementation for community health and when you get to the community level then you have to track the household and the members inside the household and I think in some conversations as well on the getcha sufo education that that's coming up as well the classroom learners in the in the classroom so I think that would be generic and can also be incorporated possibly in the main platform thank you super just to contribute a bit more I think as Christy mentioned last week we had the his week we are like all the his groups from all around the globe gathered here and like we had so many discussions very structured discussions and even in addition to that some ad hoc discussions so these are all about the challenges that we are facing while we are using DHLs too for various domains not I mean health plus many others especially education because we have so many his groups covering education and we have had so many discussions these two weeks about education so it's usually like this right before we try to apply DHLs too for a given use case I'm talking about outside outside health domain we usually consider like whether this scenario matches the DHLs to data model if it doesn't work that's a kind of a big no to use DHLs too for that given use case but like when we try to like we feel DHLs too is suitable because it matches the DHLs to data model then we have some challenges right so when we start customizing it we realize or even before when we are planning when we identify requirements there are some challenges so some of these challenges are basically about the DHLs to platform the core or some maybe about usually the interfaces I think the most demanding thing is the interfaces when it comes to for example education there are some interfaces or like I mean it could be not only digital like sometimes paper forms that they are used to and we are not really rendering it the same way so if that's the case it's kind of easy because it's all about building apps on top of DHLs too but when it is some platform challenges we have identified many it's most of them are related to DHLs to tracker because like because now we like aggregate it's I mean it's it's a very mature thing and we have some solid use cases so it's usually fits but when it goes to tracker there are some some I mean there's a lot of different areas that we have encountered challenges it doesn't mean it is not impossible and and also I mean we try to foresee what is what it is going to be in five 10 years time like we are talking about entire populations of countries being registered so when it comes to that again another thing is about performance so we have been working very closely with the DHLs to core team to identify them I'm not going to list out all the challenges but I just mentioned I mean some broad areas and as you correctly mentioned we have submitted general tickets and and also we like I mean even in the experts launch that we had last two days we have been discussing how to address them and that's the second thing and thirdly I mean what we are also trying to do is whenever we feel DHLs too may not be the ideal or may not be the most efficient we always try to integrate with other platforms which are already there so those are some solutions that we have been trying to kind of yeah work with and also to add I mean those are you that have followed the app innovation development sessions we are really working hard on how to support innovations and also on innovating with apps on top of DHLs too whether it's custom or more part of the whole global generic community but it's also that we in while waiting for Godot we develop these kind of apps that kind of you can use while we are waiting for this Jira ticket to to you know come through the Slack channel so so there are many ways we are handling tackling and handling these kind of needs of that cannot really cater for as we see the platform today so this is also pushing the I would say the HS2 as a platform for multi-sector is because always this kind of I think that is also a hint to the DPG Alliance community that how important it is to be having a software platform that is dialogue with the use cases in countries because we always need to evolve we are never never happy we are always striving for supporting even more stretching it even more that keep this platform alive relevant in countries for various use cases I can see Ola are you you want to say something oh when I'm finished and but we can have a time and sky do you want to say something representing the I'll take off my mask to speak I only just want to thank I think this has been a great great session and just for those of you who don't know me I'm sky Yodin I'm the executive director of an initiative called Digital Square and and we support mature digital public goods including DHIs to and open CRBS both of which we've talked about today I think it's been I just really enjoyed listening to all the great ways and directions DHIs to has evolved in response to the demand we're hearing from countries and I'm really interested and also really happy to see so many government representatives here at this session and and hoping coffee breaks and elsewhere to catch up and hear what other needs are you seeing in health and beyond and how could digital public infrastructure digital public goods and global goods help you get there that's all I've got thank you maybe you also want to say something you're allowed and then I don't need to run yes thank you Christine and thank you for the presentations as you know UNICEF is a multilateral organization we have different programs in different areas and I'm from health and Suguru and Jambak my colleagues from education are here as well and we do support WASH social policies social protection CRVS and working on CRVS with the health perspective but we have colleagues that you know work on it on with the children right perspective etc so it was really interesting to see the HSU is expanding reaching more more domains and more components so perhaps next year we're going to have more people from different you know sectors within UNICEF and quite interesting but it was also good to share challenges because we know that they are challenges and it's really good to know that they exist and that we are working towards you know addressing them great thank you commenting sectors represented here from ministries it's because we actually just one month ago had a very glamorous the HSU for education academy with so many people involved and we didn't have any money to sponsor anyone to come to this one so so we had all the ministries of education collected together for one week in in Banjul Gambia so so that's why people are not really here for this one but next year I think it will be much more coming together because it's actually more similar to this than you anticipate so yeah that's the reason why there is no minister of education here because no money you know we spend all the money on Banjul talking together yeah so one more update from the his week so we had a special track session on in the in the his speak about digital public goods and digital public infrastructure where we kind of introduce all these concepts to the all the his president and we also received some comments so I just want to share one comment with you that that's kind of like the summary of the discussions so they really appreciated the indicators and the dpg standards that you have where you have these nine indicators to identify I mean out of so many solutions what would really fit to the criteria of defining as a digital public good but also the the his well of opinion like if the go the broader goal is to achieve the ST cheese it's a really crucial that the ministries of like it could be health education all these ministries adopt these solutions rather than the individual organizations and for them to make that decision in addition to this technical criteria about the open source licensing and things like that I mean it's a broad list which is very comprehensive you should also have some I think we have already had this discussion around the maturity model like to for you to make that decision we need to know like what is the support involved how long this solution has been around whether there is a community who would support it like I mean if I if as a ministry say like a director if I adopt this solution is there any any any I mean support available to build the capacity or at least even this solution will exist after five years so these are again some areas because I already know like when you select individual dpgs you have some information mentioned at the bottom but probably like a suggestion coming from our side would be like whether it is possible to include some of these aspects into the indicators thank you for that point to remind us again about that one I think we could give the word over to Ola now or if not any burning issues from from the audience I think they continue to be continued during the coffee break during the the the social event at Sonsvann to discuss further how we will overcome all the challenges also Carine's one you know the dollars it's not Carine's it's so good to have someone saying it we are too polite to say anything Ola thank you Kristian that's working we could maybe start by charging for the beer at Sonsvann today see if we can raise any money but just a few quick messages we have a pretty packed and maybe a little bit optimistic agenda for this morning so we have a parallel session starting 10 30 we have another set of parallel sessions at 11 15 and then we have the very exciting app competition starting in this room 12 sharp so I encourage the presenters for the 11 15 maybe to end at 11 55 and for all of you to make a new record on how fast you can actually walk into this auditorium because it tends to take a bit of time so we'll start 12 sharp so that we can get through all the program for the very final session and then hope to have lunch at one 30 thank you thank you and I think a big hand for all the presenters for these planners yeah one small program change for the parallel sessions we previously had a session on the community on our schedule but unfortunately our community coordinator was not able to make it because he wasn't able to do his visa and time so there's now a session about impact stories you're welcome to join us and learn a bit about shaping stories for the audience and we'll be interviewing some people live so if you want to come and share your story with us we encourage you to join that session over in auditorium too thanks