 I'll call the 14th regular meeting of the Common Council of Order Susan. Would you please call the row? Bowman D. Berg Eberg Serta Davis Graff Kittleson Manny Meyer Montemay or Ratke Sigali Stefan Sushia Van Akron and Vander wheel 16 present quorum is present Approval of the minutes all in graph. Thank you, your honor I would move that the We dispense with the reading of the minutes of the previous Common Council meeting and the same stand approved is entered on the record There's a motion in second under discussion Not all in favor state aye You oppose motion carries Next we have the pledge of allegiance and we will be led by girls Out troop 354 please come forward and only one of you will get to use a mic so Whoever wants to use it would like to say it you okay. We got a volunteer There's a flag I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States America and to the Republic for which it stands One nation under God and the visible with mercy is justice for all Thank you very much That was a nice Pledge of Allegiance loud and clear with a lot of heart next we have resignations Attorney McLean first is a letter from Susan good Zinsky Advising that she's resigning from the housing committee I'd ask for motion to accept Motion in second all is in favor state aye Any opposed motion carries Okay for appointments the first is Everybody submit the following appointments for your consideration to the Halperin water feature advisory committee Alderman Radke Joshua Decker Dustin Havens Bernard Markovich J. Morris Brian Ploutz and William Wood Alderman Radke's term expiring April 17th, and all the rest expiring April 30th 2006 signed by the mayor that will lie over and Dustin Havens to be considered for appointment to the housing rehabilitation committee to fill the unexpired term of Susan Gadzinski whose term expires 430-06 also signed by the mayor and that will lie over And this was submitted to the last council meeting here by submit the following appointments to the business improvement district for your consideration Reappoint Linda jar Cleo messner Janet Carter Jane Davis Wood and Tricia Fippin for a three-year terms to expire 9-12-08 And a point new member Douglas Palmar for a three-year term to expire 9-12-08 signed by the mayor As for a motion to confirm Motion is second All those in favor state aye Any opposed motion carries the next is second For confirmation on the tourism advisory committee There's the mayor director of planning and development Alderperson Stefan The Harbor Center Marina Michael Fero the lodging facilities with 120 rooms or less Kara Leonard Non-logging tourism related business Linda jar Harbor Center bid Richard Meyer bed and breakfast establishment Frank ribbitch Lodging with more than 120 rooms Rick Peterson Museum Ruth Kohler non-logging tourism related business Rob Hury and the tourism manager as an ex-officio non-voting member signed by the mayor Thank you. That's for a motion to confirm There's a motion in a second All those in favor state aye opposed Motion carries one day all the sushi and Thomas Holton to be reappointed as director of Public Works and Engineering commencing January 1 2006 and expiring December 31 2010 signed by the mayor Thank you turn clean. I'll ask for a motion to confirm the appointment There's a motion in a second All those in favor state aye Opposed motion carries appointments are confirmed Next we have public forum Susan first on the list is Sean Severson is Sean here Sean if you'd like to come up to the mic and I just need your home address, please. It's a 512 Geely Avenue I'm sorry. That's my shabuagan address It's a 395 sandstone terrace in keel 39 excuse me 395 Sandstone terrace, okay in keel in keel. Okay, and you will have five minutes. Okay. Thank you. Thank you I'm a member of first congregational United Church of Christ in shabuagan And I'm also one of the committee members helping to organize the youth work camp coming to shabuagan in June of 2006 We are cosponsoring a week-long youth work camp along with group work camps foundation a non-profit organization headquartered in loveland, Colorado Now group work camps foundation has been cosponsoring work camps since 1977 and every year they cosponsor between 60 and 80 work camps along with local government agencies and private organizations And a work camp consists of roughly 400 middle and high school youth and their adult leaders Now these campers pay to spend a week sleeping on the floor of a classroom or gymnasium eating cafeteria food Working outside in some of the warmest weather of the season and all of this is for people that they have never met And the main work performed during the week Includes porch and step repair wheelchair ramp construction interior and exterior painting Weatherization light carpentry and siding repair Now the recipients of these services include low-income elderly and handicapped homeowners There is absolutely no cost to the homeowner for these services all materials and services are provided for free Now from June 25th through July 1st of 2006 shabuagan will get to experience such a work camp 400 middle and high school youth from around the country including youth from shabuagan will be converging on urban middle school The campers will spend five days working on approximately 70 homes within 30 miles of urban They'll build new friendships and create bonds with the homeowners that they'll serve Now the impact of such a work camp is really simply incredible the campers will commit more than 12,000 hours of free labor to the residents of shabuagan The financial impact to the community can reach in excess of $137,000 with payments going to the school district for housing and food and to local merchants for the purchase of building materials paint gas and entertainment But the entire community is impacted by this positive project We'll all work together to work on 60 to 80 homes for the needy We'll create better living conditions for our neighbors boost pride in our community Bring thousands of dollars into the local economy Provide positive peer role modeling to young people in shabuagan Send a message of caring to the disadvantaged in our community and help teach the adults of tomorrow the value of serving others Now the youth and adults of first congregational have participated in over 10 Work camps over the years and I personally participated in two work camps, and I know the life-changing impact that Participating in a work camp can have and this is why first congregational decided to co-sponsor a work camp here in shabuagan It's a way to serve our community and also provide a way for our youth and youth from around the country to give the gift of service and my primary reason for being here tonight is to raise public and community awareness of this project and Second to ask for help. We need to find 70 homes that can benefit from the services of the camp and The the types of homes that we're looking for our homes that could use the the kinds of work that I outlined the portrait pair and the wheelchair Ram construction painting and weatherization and the targets for this people that we're looking for our low-income elderly and handicapped homeowners Now I know that taking on this this camp is a big responsibility and it's going to be a lot of hard work for For our organization and the volunteers, but I know that with the support of the community. We can make this a tremendous success. Thank you Thank you, Sean Next would be Scott Lewandowski Scott can you give me your home address, please? 2201 Uri Avenue And you will have five minutes. Okay, Mr. Mayor and members of the Common Council and Sue Richards. Thank you for allowing me to speak tonight In April 1912 a large new ship described as a floating city set out on its first voyage across the Atlantic Ocean a Few days out of port this ship received warnings of icebergs ahead But the captain of this ship ignored the warnings given to him from other ships and even other officers on his ship Instead of altering the ship's course. It was full speed ahead This ship sailed into the field of icebergs and one iceberg in its path was seen too late This floating city struck the iceberg Suffered major damage took on a great deal of water Sank lower and lower and finally sank into the depths of the ocean. The ship was a Titanic Over 90 years later. We have another type of city receiving warnings of danger ahead Which are also being ignored and again its full speed ahead into a field of danger This time the city is the ship the city is named Sheboygan and warnings from the mayor finance director and even a few fellow officers alderman of the city are being ignored Instead it's full speed ahead into another dangerous field not icebergs this time But it fueled a debt which will sink this city unless we alter course The majority of this common council is trying to sink this city and to see a debt any way they can The latest example is by adding a municipal court which the mayor said we can't afford The finance director said we can't afford to take the risk and some alderman said we can't afford it because it is projected to lose at Least sixty five thousand dollars or more when the city needs to be pinching pennies According to the city quirks report in the minutes from the last common council meeting two weeks ago Sheboygan received thirty one thousand nine hundred sixty three dollars and nine cents in August from the Sheboygan County courts For not much more work than writing out the tickets While this court can be held in the common council chambers Where do we put the staff for this court the judge is going to need an office and The two quirks are going to need office space and desk space And there is no room in city hall for this as shown by the fact that the police department wants a new building for more room And the city is already spending forty three thousand nine hundred eighty dollars a year to rent part of the building 807 center Avenue in addition to the building it owns at eight thirty three center Avenue for needed office space for departments that used to be in city hall I Ask everyone hearing me tonight either here in person or watching on TV To give the alderman who voted in favor of the municipal court a call and ask them Why they voted on something that will cause the city to lose money when we are in a budget crunch Somebody the same alderman did not say one word during the discussion on the council floor before the vote was taken Also asked them what a staff at a court will have office space and ask them about security Will the police department have to hire an additional officer for this court? Pay overtime for an off-duty officer to come in on his day off or take an officer off the street to provide security The alderman who voted the sale tore forward full speed ahead and take on more water or debt That will sink the city deeper into the debt with the municipal court our Eldenburg Dennis Bowman Jean Kittleson Dan Berg bill Stefan Don van Akron Jean Davis March the golly Bonnie Serda and Silas Vander wheelie Give them a call and see if they give you a reason or are even willing to listen to you Many of the citizens the shabuigan who were at mere Perez's listening sessions Believe that many of the aldermen still are not listening and most of these aldermen tonight We'll probably vote to sink the city deeper in debt by voting to build a police station in 2006 instead of waiting a year Thank you. Thank you, Scott Next on the list is Dale Kolar Dale if you could step up to the mic, please And I need your home address 2004 South 25th Street Okay, and you have five minutes, sir. Okay. I don't need that much time and I didn't prepare a speech But what I do have is I have a problem in my neighborhood I live within a half a block of old Wisconsin sausage and They have grown in the past years and they don't have ample parking to park the cars for their employees So what's happening is 25th Street and parts of Union Avenue are becoming an employee parking lot With that comes the noise at 11 o'clock at night when shifts change and engines roar and You get loud screaming and people are relatively excited to be off of work But you also get the garbage of cigarette butts the beer cans that are thrown in the back of my truck And you get no place to park with the winter parking regulations are going to be coming up soon Right now they're taking up almost half the block and with winter parking regulations Excuse me. It's feasible that they could take up One whole side of the block for the alternate parking So I want to know if something can be done To get old Wisconsin to provide their own parking for their employees Secondly The the smoke house issue there's times throughout the summer where you can barely see across the street The smoke houses are running Virtually all day and into the night And you can't even sit out on your patio and enjoy the fresh air there is none You get the residue on your windows on your siding on your cars And and what I'd like to see is if they could just raise the stack to a higher level to get that air to dissipate We're possibly put scrubbers in to reduce that smoke and that smell it. It's really nauseating in the neighborhood and we have a petition signed with many of the Homeowners in that area That have complaints about both the parking and the smoke So thank you Thank you, Miss Kohler Alderman almond I thank you your honor for the opportunity to speak and this is concerning the With mr. Kohler I just talked about The problem of course is very real that he is stating Since the company has done a little bit of expansion They've hired 65 new employees But they did not provide enough parking space for these employees to park So in reality what they're doing is parking up and down the neighborhood streets Not just on the street that he lives but other neighborhood streets and including Union Avenue The noise the Garbage virtually everything is a real problem also and as he stated there is a Communication via petition that they did turn in as being distributed both to public protection safety and to plan commission And hopefully these issues and of course the smoke thing which was not part of it could be handled and thank you Thank you Alderman Bowman Susan next on the list is Dan Brasselt Dan can I get your home address again, please 705 Fairway Drive? And you will have five minutes sir, thank you Thank you for letting me speak here this evening I'm here tonight representing the Friends of Sheboygan's Parks And I'm here to discuss a portion of our upcoming fundraiser, which is the Great Pumpkin Festival Great Pumpkin Festival is a children's festival intended to raise money for the shared and park Equipment in the upcoming years With the past five weeks our group a number of dozens of our Members have been working with local businesses to secure funds door prizes and so on to pull this entire event together We've secured many games and prizes from local businesses as I said But we've also secured funding for met for the metros needed for the music and so on Pigly Wiggly even stepped in and sponsoring our pietying contest or pumpkin pietying contest As you can see we're working very hard and we're very serious about raising money for shared and park Tonight I'm here to ask for the council support as well For this event will need about 20 to 25 picnic tables or straight tables or a combination thereof But if we follow the existing protocol with the city park department This is going to cost the group in the neighborhood of three to four hundred dollars All funds which would ultimately take away from our donations back to the city as I said This event is intended to raise money for the city park system in this event specifically is for shared and park Not all future events will be but this one is for shared and park We feel that because of the unique design of this arrangement or potential arrangement the city may want to consider Providing these tables at no cost I'm not asking for any special exceptions not any special treatment And I'm not asking for any special favors because all of this would imply that this is some sort of Event that's similar to all the others and we're looking to cut a deal, but this event is different Like I said our group is pledging to donate 100% of the net proceeds back to the city in the form of park related Equipment and promotion which I think makes it different than any festival that I've seen out there I'm not aware of any group that donates in this in this order. So to me. This is a unique event Besides what would be the downside if 10 groups saw this tonight if this it go ahead and decided to do the same thing What would be the downside if 10 more groups? Wanted to hold an event strictly to raise money for city equipment and so on Like I said, I'm not asking for any special favors. I just want you to treat this situation for what it is It's a fundraiser for the city. Thank you Thank you, Dan and last on the list is Jeff Schucho Jeff could you give me your home address, please? Yes, 2303 South 17th Street And you will have five minutes. Thank you. Good evening ladies and gentlemen I would like to like to thank the city of Sheboygan's Common Council and the mayor for providing the citizens with this opportunity to speak My name is Jeff Schucho of Great Lakes avian pest control I am a lifelong resident and state indentured journeyman mill rate I am here today to offer possible solutions to concerns over financial matters and health issues in our community with service trades Jobs, which generally pay less and have less benefits replacing jobs in industry tax reduction Is no longer really a viable option if our citizens are to remain viable revenues need to be generated in this new service-based economy and Well, I think we'd all agree that this service-based economy really has is none of our doing This is something that's being brought about by market conditions today and competition possible Possible solutions that we could take a look at would be a bring in a cruise ship with high-stakes gambling I know this has been discussed before, but I don't believe a high-stakes gambling Facility has been discussed this would eliminate competition as we would have the only high-stakes high-class gambling Facility fitting for the type of clientele. We would like to have it blue Harbor Revenues would then pay off blue Harbor investments and Offer a high-class atmosphere to our visitors Be the revenues generated could then be used for a new police station Which I believe if we would venture into something like gambling that would be the first thing I would want to see With expansion of operations to provide added security and enhanced service to the citizens And in our tourism guide we could offer that higher higher security See pursue and develop the armory into a naval science center, which I had heard about I I believe that is a wonderful idea for that that facility. It could be done in stages For example, initially missiles could be put on display there now The Loki would be a wonderful one. We set up a dummy look Loki in their sidewinders Which are used by the Navy sparrows phoenix missiles none of these missiles are very large and Displays could be set up relatively easily Then build a walkway across the river A horse buff for the carriage sort of thing is what I was thinking there Bringing in Things to bring people here other than blue Harbor itself In reference to our view of the Sheboygan Press editorial D Great lakes must be protected cleaned I believe that was a august. I believe that was in the paper august 5th A disaster as big as any on the news is taking place right now under our noses We are systematically destroying the greatest resource we have water Signs along the river saying eat this fish once every six months does nothing for tourism Beaches from Chicago to Sturgeon Bay were red flagged this summer These beach closings were due to high E. Coli bacteria counts two causes for this Sewage sewage dischargers after rains and gull droppings Those are the two main contributors that I found in looking into this We had no rain this summer With the large numbers of gulls on our beaches the water was left smelling and the beach sand full of droppings This does nothing for tourism either The beach groomer the city operates does not remove droppings from the sand I believe it could and should be modified to do this cheaply and I believe it can be Keeping the migratory birds out of the parks and lakefront to acceptable numbers is now possible and more economically feasible than ever before All the city has to do in regard to this is give me a call and I'll take care of it On our beaches and in our parks our own kids are rolling around in bird droppings the kids at Kiwanis Park playing football We've noticed and uh The sand on our beaches from what I have learned about the avian bird virus Is many mutation it's many mutations away from jumping human to human And I think some of the hype that's out there is a bit overstated Uh, however, it is now spreading throughout the world by migratory birds And that's what we have problems within our parks, uh, mainly the federal federal government should be encouraged to do us both a favor They dredge out the shabuigan river and do the super fund cleanup work We were told was going to be done years ago We put the world war two cruiser at our facility, which they're trying to get rid of right now They're looking for a home for it. Excuse me. Mr. Schucho. Your five minutes are up. Oh, okay I have one sentence left Thank you move to Oh, okay, thank you All those in favor hi One no, please thank you We put this world war two cruiser in our facility Which they're trying to find a home for this ship could possibly be even fitted to be the casino I uh in following these steps our tourism guide could read jet capable airport world class golf world war two cruiser museum casino High stakes high class gambling Cleanest beaches and parks nasa science tent nasa science center high level security. Thank you Thank you, mr. Schucho. Thank you very much And as a council may be aware mr. Schucho's are one that gave endless hours to help resolve the Goal problem that we had up on the south side and we thank you for that for for your for the time that you Okay, that it that's it. Thank you very much We'll long we have the mayor's comments. I'm going to make a few comments regarding two things the second the second budget concerns. I'm going to Not say anything on that. I'm going to wait For an issue that's coming up An item that's coming up on the agenda. It'll be more appropriate for mr. Gephardt to talk to us about some of the budget concerns There and then we'll talk a little bit about a handbook that that i'm hoping put together for a committee and city council protocol The first item that I want to talk to you a little bit about is the the legislative versus the executive role And I really shouldn't say versus because it's nothing that's that's that's a competitive in nature or Confrontational it's really a synergy. One cannot exist without without the other And it's it's very important that that I address this matter to you and and with with utmost respect For some reason There seems to be a tendency or a temptation at times to want to overreach and perhaps extend the legislative role and and and go to the area of micromanaging and It is important that we recognize a role that the mayor plays as the executive and that the mayor is elected to do as the executive And the role that this legislative body the common council Is elected to do as a legislate as a legislative body? The mayor is in a very unique situation Being that I I play a role in the legislative function when there's a tie the mayor can elect to vote or not vote in the case of a tie But the mayor aside from being a part of this legislative body in that manner is also the executive meaning that I I have to execute the the daily Managerial duties that that you would expect from from a city manager Perhaps if I may say that to compare me to a city manager And there are things that can happen if we don't watch yourselves and we overextend ourselves things that can happen they can disrupt Can disrupt the daily managerial duties that I have to execute And if I don't have a Feel for that structure then it will get me in trouble and people are going to hold me accountable for it So that I would ask that you keep in mind that I have a role to play And you have a role to play and I will always respect your role And I will hope that you respect mine now There's all the time we get inquiries for information and requests for information that is perfectly all right I encourage every one of you to to continue to do that But it's at the point where the request or the inquiry becomes perhaps a demand or a directive Then that takes a different a different turn and we need to just be careful with that If there's ever a time that you've asked for information or made a request for information And inquire about something that you weren't satisfied with the information you got Then come to me and we'll make sure we get it to you and in the fullest form that you're asking I guess what I'm saying is we need to work together as a legislative body as an executive body And I know that I know that we can do that Moving along the the budget concerns that say we'll be addressing the next one is a council committee protocol handbook There was a suggestion made at some point Because of some of the some of the manner some of the way that some of the meetings are being handled that perhaps we should put together A handbook that would help us Work through the process of our meetings And I mentioned this during our staff meeting today and asked if there was any staff member Department head I should say if there was any department head that wanted to Participate in the actual construction of the handbook if they would like to provide input And every single one of them said yes, we do. So it's an important issue for us I think that people are starting to see that perhaps some of the meetings are a little too relaxed You know, maybe we're not following the the proper rules of order The proper recognition for the chair the proper recognition for alderman when alderman are in a meeting Perhaps not a standing committee meeting. They're another meeting that they'd be addressed as alderman not just Jumping into the conversation or discussion There's little things like that that I think we can put into a form of a handbook that can remind us and help us Help guide us through through these meetings Susan Richards has agreed to work with me very close and keep an eye on me And what I'd like to you before before we even hand those books out I would like if any alderman would like to review that also just just let me know and I'd be glad to give you A copy in draft form if anybody would like to to look at that As I said every department head is going to have the opportunity to to review it And so will our city attorney. Okay Thank you very much Moving along we have a notice for the vacation and discontinuous of the east west up Unpaid alley located within fairview subdivision between north 27th street and north 27th place And I believe that's just the notice we have the place. Yes We can just accept the notice We can ask Is there a motion to accept the notice? Second second Any discussion on that questions for those in favor of state. Aye. Aye Motion carries Consent agenda all of them and rock Thank you, your honor The consented agenda for 14 one through 14 26 I would move that all our o's be accepted and placed on file all our c's be accepted and adopted We passed the resolutions and general ordinances There's a motion in the second under discussion If not would you please call the roll Dberg eberg Serda davis graff Aye Kittleson Manny Meyer Montemayor Radke Sigali Aye Stefan Sushia Van Akron Vanderweel And bowman 16 ayes Motion carries 16 Report of officers to 14 27 we will hold for 14 49 14 28 to 14 31 lies over 14 32 to 14 48 to be referred Resolutions introduced 14 49 by Alderman Montemayor Allowing the friends of shabuigan parks to use various parks equipment provided by the park department free of charge for For use at their pumpkin fest celebration on october 22nd Alderman montemayor Thank you your honor. I'll ask for a suspension of the rules on agenda number 14 49 Is there any there's a motion in second all those in favor? I pose Does anybody want a roll call? Otherwise there was enough eyes, partner It requires a three-quarter vote, so I suggest we'll take a roll call Eberg this is to suspend suspend the rules right um eberg serda davis I graph Kittleson Manny Meyer Montemayor I ratki Segali I Stefan I Susha I Van Akron I Vanderweel I Bowman And dberg No 14 ayes two notes Three quarters Motion passes All the momentum I or please continue I make a motion the resolution be put upon its passage And also for agenda item number 14 27 move to accept and file. I think um citizen Verhastl explained to us Okay, there's a motion in the second. Is there a second? Under discussion, please. Thank you your honor. I think um Dan Verhastl explained why we he would like this why the friends of shabuigan parks would like this simply To raise money to give back to shabuigan So I think it would be in all of our best interests to go ahead and do this I think it's wonderful that the group of citizens are gathering together Volunteering their time simply to raise money for shabuigan. Thank you. Thank you You need further discussion? I have a light for me. Alderman Segali. Did you wish to say something on this? No, I don't have my light on okay. That's okay. Alderman Vanderweel Thank you, your honor I also think it's great that they're doing this and giving the city the money that they raise My concern is a few years ago. We were asked to give habitat for humanity A waiver on the building fees And we were advised not to do that because you're opening the floodgates All that sort of things I would ask attorney mclean. What is your opinion on this? Attorney mclean. Thank you, your honor Alderman Vanderweel. It's you know, it's not a legal issue. It's really a policy issue. So You know, I'm not going to advise you as to whether this is something you ought to do or not You know if you do I can see others Making similar requests and you'll have to deal with that. That's just Uh, you know, I get to kind of cop out and say it's it's not a legal issue. It's a political issue or policy decision Thank you. Attorney mclean, uh, alderman settler Thank you, your honor just I have two questions. Um, and maybe alderman, um ballman could expound on this being chairman of public works If indeed there's other, um Entities that do something similar to this and if we charge and then secondly, is there a liability issue? I guess when they Pay for these fees that way they're responsible. Do they have to put down a deposit and so on and so Thank you. I'm sorry. Alderman ballman. Did you wish to respond to that sir? Well, I guess I can try if nothing else. I noticed mr. Holton is here also So I'll I'll give it my best shot. Okay. Would you rather not we can have it to hold? No, I'll I'll give a little bit um Yes, when as an example The kawanas festival is and uh bratwurst day happens and other events We do lease the parks. We do lease the equipment to the The entities of course involved as with the jcs. Yes, they do give back a great portion of the monies that they earn through Community donations as an example the waterslide was one of them and other things that they've done for the city Um and of course other organizations also do give things back to the city as for liability issues um I think we're going to be exempt whether we um Least the equipment to them or not, but if town has a little better explanation, maybe he can come up with it also Mr. Holton, would you like to add anything to that surface? I guess I'd defer to steven on that liability issue. I don't know if that fall under recreational immunity or not Uh, but we there have no alderman ballman is right down. There's other groups. We do charge The going rates for the rental of the park itself and equipment and they do give a portion of what they've raised back But I guess in this group they're going to give a hundred percent back to the city Which is something a little bit different what we've had in the past Okay Thank you, sir All in the start. I did that answer Okay, thank you. I turn with me. Thank you. As far as liability um Generally, you know as a general legal proposition There's less liability if you Give something away than if you charge for it Uh, generally you're held to a higher standard if Somebody's paying for whatever it is you're you're providing but uh That being said as far as You know if someone is injured in a park During an event such as this the city Is pretty well protected under the recreational immunity statute in any event. So I don't know that there's Really a liability issue one way or another that would impact this decision Thank you turn him clean all of us sushi Thank you, mr. Mayor Um, I just want to bring to your attention that this council does have a history of giving things away To different groups at no charge just a few minutes ago We voted on item number 1412 and what that was is we just gave away one of our free days For using blue harbor conference center And we gave that away to the shabuagan county planning and resource department And we're not getting anything in return for doing so So we do have a history of giving things away, and I think that this is a worthy cause And I would encourage the alderman to support it. Thank you. Thank you all in sushi alderman eberg Yes, thank you You're under happened to get one call on this from somebody who was a Board member of a youth group and simply said We're watching you if you give this away We've paid for every single thing And we do good things for the city and I think it's perhaps wise to call this question I'm going to vote no not because it has nothing to do with the organization It has to do with if we're going to have a policy to open it up to groups I think we need a policy to open it up to groups the policy that has stood I think is has been a reasonable one We get about 55 thousand dollars a year in in park Fees and rentals we get about 14 thousand dollars a year from renting the armory We get about twelve thousand five hundred dollar a year for rental of equipment I can recall times that public works when people would come in And every organization is going to find an old and meant to be an advocate Just plain and simple and every organization if they're nonprofit I think has good cause To ask for a suspension if you would have fees if we're going to do that Let's do it by policy And something that we could say we're either going to do it for all Or we're going to do it on a limited basis and until we do that I'm going to vote no on this particular matter. Thank you Alderman Cigali Thank you, mr. Mayor When it comes to the blue harbor conference center Is that not in the contract that we have 30 Free times that we are able to rent it out and that This is what we're doing on this location. So we're not actually giving it away where this is something that's part of the contract Well attorney McLean can probably address it better But my understanding is we have I believe 30 days for the city to use for city purposes for city use The extension is that correct for city sponsored events or city sponsored events, right Does that answer your question now, Alderman Cigali? Okay. Any more discussion? Not we're going to call the roll. Please explain the vote here This is to pass the resolution And I vote would be yes to waive the fees Everybody okay with that? Eberg Serta Davis Graf Kittleson Manny Meyer Montemay Montemay or Racky Cigali Stefan No Susha Hi Van Akron No Vanderweel No Bauman No D. Berg No Seven eyes eight nos one extension Motion fails Okay 1450 lies over 1451 to 1453 to be referred The report of committee 1454 to be referred The report of committee is 6 1455 by law and licensing recommended denying Taxi cab drivers license number 6908 Based on the grounds of habitual criminality failure to report all felonies The need to preserve public safety and his failure to cooperate with the committee Alderman Manny Thank you, roger You have to the committee I move that we accept the report and deny the license There's a motion to accept and adopt report of committee and deny license or second Second Under discussion Alderman Manny Thank you Is James D. Turner here? Is James D. Turner here? Your honor James Turner is not here And the committee found a clear and compelling reason to deny Including um Child enticement conviction Three second degree sexual assault Uh convictions related to children and a burglary conviction all would Impinge against his Appropriate use of the license Thank you, Alderman Manny any further discussion Not please call the roll Serta Davis Graf Kittleson Manny Meyer Montemay or Racky Segali Stefan Susha Van Akron Vanderwill Baumann D. Berg and Eberg 16 ayes Motion carries 1456 to 1458 to be referred Report of committee seven 1459 by finance recommended filing resolution authorizing the transfer of appropriations in the 205 budget Alderman graf Thank you, your honor. I'd also like to do 1460 Which is the rc by salary and grievance We we the finance committee and the salary and grievance committee had a joint meeting at which time we We took care of both of these documents and this is a transfer of appropriations That we ultimately decided we could do this in-house and therefore we're asking that the two rc's be accepted and placed on file There's motion to second under discussion Alderman Serta Thank you, your honor and just for the viewers at home and for the individuals in the gallery. We've just saved the city $25,000 Thank you. Thank you Any further discussion Not all those in favor state I any opposed motion carries 1461 through 1470 to be referred Report of committee's eight By finance recommended approving the revised capital improvements program recommend pardon me Alderman second. I'll leave. Did you have your she's been a talk on this? Yeah 1471 by finance recommended approving the revised capital improvements program recommended by the capital improvements commission for the program period 206 through 210 and adopting the 206 program for the implementation with the program amended to fund the police facility at an amount of 7 million dollars in 207 and city hall remodeling at 3 million dollars in 207 Alderman graff Thank you, your honor At this time, I'd like to make motion that the rc be accepted and adopted and that the resolution be put upon its passage There's a motion. Is there a second? Was there a second second under discussion under discussion your honor the finance committee Made this recommendation after their last meeting and it was an unanimous recommendation based on the The four older persons that were there all turn older person monta mera was not available So we acted on this and included in this is Moving the police facility to 2007 Just to set the record straight this was a change and we Brought brought it forward a year rather than leaving it Where the capital improvements commission had put the capital improvements commission had recommended that the construction of the police facility be done in 2008 The finance committee moved it to 2007 and recommended That the cost be set at seven million dollars We also moved the city hall remodeling of three million dollars into 2007 And asked that to be included in in that borrowing And the reason where we picked 2007 is because we know 2006 is going to be very very tough presently we have about a million dollars in in the In the building fund for the police facility some of which we're using right now for the architect and based on Based on what all has to be done in 2006 it appears as though We'll be busy enough and we can use the funds that we have in 2006 to prepare for a brown break breaking early in 2007 The things that have to be done is The drawings and everything have to be prepared the bidding on the project and everything else And in order to avoid borrowing money in 2006 of which we'd have to pay debt service on in 2006 We thought if we could hold off until 2007 to borrow It would help us Financially I know rich gap art has some information to present regarding this same issue But we the finance committee and I don't want to speak for all of them But after discussing this for good I would guess half hour 45 minutes We thought the best use of our borrowing power would be to borrow for this Facility in 2007 use what we have set aside right now in 2006 to prepare to go full force in in 2007 Thank you one graph and we'll ask mr. Gephardt to step up in a minute, but right now. I believe uh allerman deberg Oh, you want to listen to him first? Would you rather do this? Go ahead? Let him and I'll thank you Mr. Gephardt, please step up to the podium. Thank you Thank you, mayor I'll refer to the memo that was placed on your desk in a summary manner The state levy limit allows for an increase of 4.3 percent on the tax levy for 2006 That is what the city is current as scheduled as recommended by the finance committee the budget recommendations From the standing committees would require a tax levy increase of 4.0 percent The assessed values will be received from the state during the next two weeks and are expected to increase 2 percent Therefore the estimated tax rate increase would be approximately 2 percent The levy limit can be increased for the interest payments on debt that was authorized prior to july 1st 2005 If the council wishes to issue seven million dollars in bonds for the police facility construction in 2006 The tax levy would increase to four and a half percent And this is basically related It's not as major of an impact because we anticipate talking to the architect That he would not have the design available to go to bids to mid-year And therefore we'd issue the bonds in mid-year And we would only have four months of interest that we would be paying rather than six months Obviously that means in the following year you'll have a bigger impact because you have to go to 12 months of interest And also you have to be paying principal in 2007 And um as I state assuming a tax levy limit of 2 for operations in 2007 And with the above debt issuance And issuing three million dollars in notes for city hall remodeling in 2007 The tax levy for the old seven budget is estimated to increase 5.8 So you get this blip basically that spiking of the debt in 2007 if you do issue it in old six and that's one of the concerns of The finance committee has But if the finance committee's recommendations are accepted The principal and interest payments will be more level in old 607 and 08 and Instead of having the large increase The other area of concern was starting the project at this time while we're under the levy restraints in 2007 and Expecting to be limited to two percent for operations is the police department when they presented to the Kaplan improvements commission their request They had an amount of two hundred and ninety thousand in there for utilities and other costs for the new facility and with the Maintenance costs of higher maintenance personnel. I think the total is about four hundred and sixty thousand We realized that this would Probably not really sure when it would open if we could start a construction, you know the mid-year in old six But we'd probably have to absorb part of that cost in old seven And that would have to be absorbed within The tax levy limit again of about two percent, which we estimate about be about 275 thousand for the general fund Um, so there are some concerns about starting early Uh Is all in my graph indicated we do have Funds currently available that we could Besides the design we could be starting some site work In oh six if that was reasonable to do Obviously we'd have to work with the architect and with the department whether or not that is that's reasonable to do and then start The actual construction early in old seven So if there's any questions Yes Thank you your honor Have you factored into this the million dollars that it's going to cost by putting off this project until 2007? I We've talked to the architect He's looking at probably an inflationary rate that normally is around three and a half percent Probably going up to about seven percent as an inflationary rate So on you know a seven million dollar project you're talking probably talking about a half million. I don't know at this point If they can be avoided even if we start in old six, you know the energy has gone up a lot of the situations that We fear is is generally already occurring So obviously each year there is a factor But he said on the average in the past on the long term it's generally averaged about three and a half percent But occasionally you do get spikes and this is what we're experiencing at this time And secondly, um, the state has guaranteed us the same amount of shared revenue up until 2007 What do you foresee if that declines are we going to can you guarantee that there'll be money enough then? To wait off and put it off because right now we do have that same guarantee up until 2007 Uh, we yes, you're correct. We do have it in 2007 We do not know what's ahead as far as levy limits as far as shared revenues, which now they call municipal aid Beyond that We do not know who the governor is going to be. There's a lot of factors ahead That we we really do not know at this time it There's really no way of really telling what's going to come out of medicine for a wait and beyond Any other questions? Alderman kittleson Thank you, mr. Mayor. I'm sorry. Did you want to go first? Do you want to go ahead or speak? Okay Let me let me explain to you I did not leave your light on and that the red one went up. So we'll get you in minutes, sir. Thank you. There we go I guess thank you. Thank you. I just want to be crystal clear on this topic because What i'm understanding is that we're not putting off building the police station We are putting off borrowing the money until 2007 But we will continue to keep the process going here in 2006 as with architectural plans with committee meetings With with the agreement and and maybe even reports to the council as to how the police station is going and And then borrowing at and what is the timeline and early in 2007 that you will borrow this that we will borrow this money or don't we know? Well the normal pattern for construction would be to issue the debt in the first quarter of the year and start then in the spring I think we need to clarify that I mean the council would have the option if they wished to issue debt and start construction mid or late 2006 Obviously the architect has to have it designed in order for it to go out for bids But that is an option that you would have so you you know, you're not Not really postponing it a full year. You're postponing it a part of a year So say we got going with this project and by the end of 2006 we were ready to Carry on with it. What what are our options at that time? Is there anything that this council can do a special resolution that we can go ahead and borrow that money? Again, we do have some funds The council has already designated that you could use for starting site work Before you went for the actual construction. So that's that's all that was appropriate Okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you Next we have Alderman eberg and then demerg afterward. I would defer to the senior Alderman Alderman eberg Thank you, thank you your honor Okay now The big thing was the site for the pre-station everybody was There was a group here group there everybody said, okay Our biggest thing right now is let's get that site down and the minute we got that site We're gonna start Building that police station because that's everybody's priority Was that police station? Okay, now now do you want to shove it off again? Now do you want to delay this? If we delay this now 207 comes along there's going to be another project or we're going to be short here or short there I got a lot of calls this afternoon because a lot of people listen to whba because they got some pretty smart fellas there I guess But they told they told our listeners to call their older persons And I got a lot of calls this afternoon and they said To start in 206. Don't delay it into 207 even if it's going to cost us a little bit more They want to get this issue done and over with once and for all So at this time then I would like to amend 1471 To say that we will start on the police station In the year 2006 Thank you. There's a motion to amend in the second Under discussion on the amendment only alderman eberg. Did you wish to discuss the amendment? Okay, to start the police station. I think that's a separate issue than the bond. Am I correct? We can start the police station now We have started it Your amendment does not speak to moving the bonding up to 2006, which I believe Alderman Berg was your intent, correct? Everything from what they're saying 207 to 206. Okay, that was uh I'm always pleased to clarify the senior alderman berg's motion. Thank you Alderman de berg So then your amendment will be just so you're clear to amend to fund the police facility At 7 million in 2006. That's your amendment, right? Okay. Thank you Second, okay. There was a second to that and we're still under discussion on the amendment only Alderman graph Thank you, your honor. Um regarding the amendment here again We just heard from our our expert the finance director on what we should and should not be doing and um He said it would be best At least that's what I heard It would be best to to even out the borrowings and wait till 2007 It's not that we're putting this off a year But we're going to start it in 2006 and work with the monies that we have appropriated We would not borrow until 2007 if this amendment was not passed Thank you Alderman steffen Thank you, your honor. I guess just to reiterate what was said I It took us 11 months to build a fire station on land that we owned How in god's name do we think we're going to get this thing built? In 2006 is beyond me. I mean you might get it started. I think that's a reasonable goal to get it started But the people who think that we're delaying it for some sort of tactic I think the normal progression leads us to at least the end of 2006 and early 2007 So why not take advantage of the bar one? For example at our finance meeting Again, it was we were working on the recommendation from the plan commission and capital improvements on 2008 I made a motion to move it up to 2007 not one person seconded it And I couldn't believe it and then as we got more motions. What was because I didn't deal with the money I don't know what 13 million is going to buy us now alderman burg says 7 million. Is that enough? It's a chief. No, we've heard 17. We've heard five in jamesville, but that doesn't matter We're going to make a commitment tonight to spending 7 million and that's it And what are we basing that on the biggest thing? I think we've got to wait on it to say, okay Here's what you get for 5 million. Here's what you get for 7. Here's what you get for 10 Here's what you get for 13. Okay. We kind of think we pretty much solved the gun range issue now We're working with the county and the ltc It's kind of thinking that most I think there's an agreement that the municipal court can be held here But we still don't know what we're getting for what cost and I I can't imagine We're locking in dollars tonight when you put it in the 2006 capital improvements. That means that's it If we put it in 2007 at 7 million and 3 million We can always adjust that next year and say, you know what that's not quite enough We need 8 million, but maybe we only need 2 million to fix city hall I think that process takes us Well into next year and you know, I have no intention whatsoever If I thought for a minute that this thing wouldn't get built, I wouldn't support it I wouldn't support 2008 because I exactly what he said, you know, I believe our governor is going to be Jim Doyle But you don't know what the restrictions are going to be under You don't know if you're going to be able to build it In 2007 we know the rules were under we know the state rules We know what our revenues are going to be I think it's just, you know It's going to take us that long anyways. We're arguing about a four month five month period And it would be foolish to say, you know to stand firm and say we want to build it in 2006 Because that's when I want to build it even though it doesn't make any logical sense to me Alderman Eberg Yes, thank you, I guess on on the amendment The financial model to me is relatively unclear. I think I hear Some bits and pieces of it But what are the areas that really hasn't been addressed as the cost of money now versus the cost of money A year from now And the research that I did involved contacting a banker and a broker They indicated that the cost of money between this year and next year would likely be Be between one half and one percent On seven million dollars that would range between two hundred and two thousand Dollars and four hundred and four thousand dollars So if we look at the cost of money by borrowing it now versus the cost of money in terms of borrowing it in a year That would be the cost to us The second cost is I I had contact you had a couple of builders who didn't get back to me, but I have two in-house experts Tom holton and alderman groth Who basically used a 15 percent figure that they felt would be the inflationary rise in building To some degree that is buttressed by a conversation that I had with the broker because as many of you know Steel has went up approximately 25 percent and The reality is in the united states. We're not going to build any more steel mills And her belief was that that will hold and and be a significant factor in any new construction When you factor in that by waiting one year and again the part of this model I wasn't aware of it. Where do you slice this off in six months? That's why I'm really willing to kick it to the finance committee Primarily to have this model put out in a more three-dimensional role So then you can have more more data for a decision But to the point if we have a 10 percent increase in building costs On seven million dollars the 10 percent increase next year will be about 900,000 dollars if there's a 15 percent increase excuse me 700,000 dollars if there's a 15 percent increase that will be a million 50 thousand dollars So when you roll up the numbers If you wait from january this year for example until january 2007 the increase in Inflationary costs of building and the potential increase of money would range from about 900,000 to 1,454,000 And I think that factor has to be put into the model that we're looking at and I guess for me tonight I'd like to see that that's why I'm going to vote against the amendment Have it go to finance and the hope that you could take a look at this And then we will have a chance to get another kick at the cat, correct? This will be coming back Okay, thank you Thank you Old Mancerla Thank you, honor I I'm just I'm just dumbfounded by some of the discussion that we're having here I think we're working backwards I mean let it be said I mean I did not pick the city hall But I'm willing to you know move ahead on this issue and I think it's about time We don't pass the buck anymore because guess what there's no guarantees whether we want to have warm fuzzies about this issues If we put it in writing there's no guarantees and we're just delaying this and I think this community has had it up to here They want to see it done now And when you look at it and I will be making additional motion We can borrow money for what some would perceive as a want towards 125 thousand dollars For a park improvement And we're going to spend over close to a half a million dollars for our parks in 2006 But we can't even fund a necessity of our police department that I thought we were all At least on agreement for There is no guarantees rich good apart just said that right now You wait till 2007 There might not be the same amount of revenue from the state. What is going to be said there might be new council members here And we went through all this homework. It is our job. No more passing the buck Alderman sagali Thank you your honor. I guess what I'm not understanding if I want to go to a building contractor and I want to build a new house I tell him I want a house for 150 thousand dollars So he's going to do the architectural work whatever and whatever is going to be it's going to be 150 thousand dollars He's not going to come back to me at least a better not And say it's going to be hired. This is what I can work in now if we say to this architect Zimmerman that we're going to want to build a police station for seven million dollars I'm sure there is something that can be worked out that it comes with everything that They're going to need to equip this police station and we can come up with seven million I guess I'm like with alderman surda. We're having a problem here These officers have waited for how many years We've gone this far and we need to go further and we need to build it now We owe that to them They have protected us and this city and we need to do that now Thank you Alderman sushi Thank you, mr. Mayor I guess what I want to look at is what we owe the taxpayers There are some things that we can't really control such as the increase in the the price for gasoline that we put in our cars And the increase in the gas that we're going to use this year to heat our homes And I do feel that as an older person I do have some small amount of control over What we're going to slap them with in regards to their property taxes And at this point in time, I don't feel that we have cut the budget enough to warrant a new police station I think a step in the right direction is that we are going to be looking at the table of organization in the next few months And hopefully early next year There will be a recommendation as to which positions on the table of organization. We can eliminate I'm not talking about laying people off. I'm talking about eliminating positions Primarily managerial positions at the top of the organizational chart where it's a little bit heavy And if we eliminate let's say three positions that would probably free up close to 300 000 dollars in salary and benefits That we would be saving by altering the table of organization Once we do something along those lines I'm just using this as an example Then we will be in a much better financial position to move ahead with more borrowing Because ultimately the goal is to keep the tax rate as flat as possible The people in the city of shavuigan are paying a pretty high amount in their property taxes And I think they've had enough and I'd like to try to help them Control the controllables and keep the costs down. So I'll support moving the police station up to 2007 But moving it up to 2006 is infeasible at this time Old manny Thank you ronner My concern is along the line of where alderman sushi is going and that is General fund and the costs in our budget Rich gebhardt and suggested originally that a new police station if we had built the full 80 000 square foot model Would cost us perhaps four hundred sixty thousand dollars in operating budget per year How do we fund that when we have limits? I believe i'm correct when I say we will have 200 000 additional from the state in 2007 over 2006 is that correct mayor? Prox correct. If that's the reality We will incur increased operating funds in the general budget somewhere in the range in my guesstimate of 300 to 320 thousand dollars for the new police station If we incur such funds, how do we pay for any salary increases for personnel? So what we're doing is Probably building a station laying off officers and other city employees or perhaps redoing the table of organization I think we need to look at this more holistically before at least i'm ready to vote So i'm going to vote against moving into 2006 For the amendment, but I would like this pursuit and committee of a whole so we can look at all the implications And not just the capital cost implications Alderman van der wheel Thank you, honor. Um, this question is directed to your self mayor or alderman Graf, whoever can answer it. Um, it's been said that in 2000 even if we Leave the spiraling to 2007 that we're going to move forward that we're going to Go all with the architect have them do everything involved What guarantee do we have that that's going to happen? What what guarantee do you have that the police station is going to happen that we're going to move forward that we're going to have the architect come in That the architect's still going to go forward because it's going to take probably nine months a year to design this so i'm just I know that we all want this to happen that we've already waited too long I'm just wondering if there's a guarantee besides If there's a guarantee written down is what i'm wondering Okay, I I will respond to that on this I don't know that any of us are in a position to guarantee any any of us something Okay, we have to be very careful how we do that But what I what I can do and I think what I've done over and over and over again is to tell everyone That I support building a police station And it's going to get built Some of the thoughts that are being shared with you today is that we don't move fast and foolish But that we move thoughtful and progressively Keep this police station in track. It's going to be built now the insinuations The insinuations that somebody's trying to sabotage the construction or somebody's trying to delay It's a good fear tactic, but it doesn't work for me. I know the amount of time that I spent on that budget Every single day we talk about that budget and mr. Gebhardt Every thing that's his job every single day. I know the amount of time that we put into it I trust his judgment when he comes to me and tells me what he just told you tonight I don't have to second-guess him But I can give you my personal word That if I have my way Sometimes you've seen what happens when I have my way that police station is going to get built in 07 But there's a lot of things that need to happen even now and we have the money set aside for that So that we can continue to keep this thing in track Nobody's trying to derail anything nobody's trying to delay anything We just want to make sure we do it very thoughtfully and very progressively And by golly, I guarantee you that I can guarantee you we're going to have a police station Okay Alderman Meyer was next Oh, I'm sorry. Hold on. Alderman Meyer. Alderman graph. Did you want to say something sir? Just in in response to all of them invented with Looking at the finance committee we talked about well Would we do this and wouldn't we and everybody on the finance committee said yes, we wanted to move forward but relating to alderman segali's um Item that she had brought up if she wanted to build a house she'd go and ask it She could not have it built tomorrow There is no way you have to go in you have to ask them Well design this for me and tell me when you can start construction Because the construction in the city of sheboygan is fairly decent right now It it they'll probably say okay. We can build this for you and and we'll start the design work But it's going to be four months before we can start So you have to live with that or find a different builder if you don't like that the same one with the police station um We're we we have john. We have zimmerman associates john Seven seven ash. Thank you. Um working on this and um, I believe there was a meeting like Three or four weeks ago where he met with you your honor and the police department and several other things and you worked out What needed to be done and things that needed to be done and based on the drawings that he needs to let um Estimates out to to see what it's going to cost for this and what it's going to cost for that he's got to build he's got to come up with some type of Of a timeline so that you know this can be started here This can be started here and this can be started here And that's why finance chose 2007 because they knew we had enough funds To work on all these things in 2006 to plan for an early start in 2007 And so that's why it's got to stay in 2007 because I don't think we'll be building in 2000 and and um He won't have his designs and everything done in 2006 Thank you Paulin Meyer Thank you, mr. Mayor I know our police have to work out of this old crummy building But I do believe that our police do a very good job They operate out of their cars. They are their offices And I feel very safe in this city I think our police department does an excellent job And I guess it's just too bad that for 40 years we have needed a new station and in 40 years We don't have any money saved. We are so in debt and now we're going to throw more money onto our taxpayers This is wrong. And I think everybody needs to sit back and think about what's your what's you're here for You're here to represent the taxpayers Not somebody else the taxpayers and these are the people that have to come first. Thank you Alderman eberg. That's thank you. And I think this is a fruitful discussion And again for me, I'm not Feeling like I've got all the information. I've got I think technical questions I think it would be for me helpful if mr. Saban Ash could come and give us a timeline with some inside and outside Times and I do believe a motion to refer takes precedent over an amendment If I'm correct, so I'm going to move to refer to committee of the whole There's a motion and I'm sorry who seconded it that Motion is second to refer the matter to committee of the whole alderman davis. Sir. Did you wish to say something on the Go ahead. I'll let you talk on the other issue The whole intent of the finance committee and the discussion that went on, you know, it's pretty lengthy discussion And we literally negotiated numbers and years Our whole intent was to put death service off To eliminate either zero or a very minimal amount next year And that's hopefully what that's that's where we're driving. I have to agree with, you know Alderman Eldenberg there and recommended Come back and we look at that I think it's Mr. Gebarts intention That we minimize any death service for next year Exactly how on paper we get that I don't care But I you know, I'd be fully Supportive of you know bringing that back to the finance committee and take a stronger look at you know construction starts in a late fall Increase in inflation or whatever construction costs, but it it was the intent that the finance committee minimize death service Thank you. Alderman davis And as was mentioned, there's a lot of logistics that have to be taken care of building news committee needs to meet with John Savinash his associates. They need to meet with the police Chief and the deputy chiefs and wherever else he'd like to include those meetings will occur There are things that have to be discussed and looked at there will be Specific to our police department not in general reality to other police departments that have been built There's a lot that needs to happen Council it's going to happen. It is happening. Let the process work Please call the roll on the referral to committee of the whole is it to the committee of the whole or to finance Committee of the whole Do we need a do we need a roll call steve for the referral? No, you don't need one just the question if you referred You don't want to refer to do a dual referral to finance so they can take a look at it Okay, let's make would you include that in your motion to open monday's coming up, okay Dual referral Okay, please call the roll Davis graph Kittleson Manny Meyer Montemayor Ratke Segali Stefan Susha no Van Akron Vanderwheel Bowman Dberg Eberg Serda 13 eyes three nose motion carries 1472 by Oh my god, would you say something sir? Yeah, I just want to ask um Rich kepphart How does this fit into our schedule as far as the budget being approved by the end of november? We'd have to have these meetings Very soon. I would think Mr. Kepphart Yes, I guess, you know, I get be the question of Amending the budget at the last meeting on november 28th. I guess it's you know still can be amended to that point But I would think you would want to have if since this is No, a major adjustment We would want it To be included in the proposed budget that is going to the council in the first meeting in november, which I believe is november 7th So it's included in the notice that is published on the budget Um, but it would not have I don't think that I'd have to be required I mean you could do it at the end, but that's kind of a major adjustment to be doing at the last meeting So I guess be the question whether or not, you know, we can Have these meetings during the next Couple mondays here and try to get that in for the november 7th meeting in council Okay, thank you. Thank you, Mr. Kepphart Okay 1472 by public works authorizing the purchase an agent to enter into Contract for the demolition of the municipal incinerator oledman ballman I thank you your honor I'd moved that the reporter committee be accepted and adopted and that the resolution be put upon its passage There's a motion and a second under discussion under discussion your honor. Um The original estimates for demolition of that former incinerator building were over 300 000 dollars We are very very pleased to have the amount come in at 127 $1,900 So I think it's a very good thing Yes, it is. Thank you Oldman graph Thank you. You know, I know this was in uh capital improvements for a long long time and was always voted down The 127 9 is coming from um department public works Account number 400 1 1 2 1 6 0 Tom, what is that? Or rich, what is that? Mr. Gepphart 400 fund indicates that it is non-borrowed uh capital project funds This is appropriations that the council had put in place earlier. Basically there's a transfer from the general fund at that time All right, thank you Thank you Okay, please call the roll graph I Kittleson Manny Meyer Montemay or Radke Segali Stefan Susha Van Akron Vanderwill Bowman Dberg Eberg Serta And davis 16 eyes Motion carries Four ordinances introduced for 73 to 475 to be referred Matters laid over 1239 oral number 282880506 by city plan commission recommended vacating the east west Unpaid valley located within fairview subdivision between north 27th street and north 27th place olederman montemay Thank you your honor. I move to accept and file the ro and pass the ordinance There's a motion to second under discussion There being none, please call the roll kittleson Manny Meyer Montemay or Radke Segali Stefan Susha Van Akron Vanderwill Bowman Dberg Eberg Serta Davis And graph 16 eyes Motion carries 1365 general ordinance number 380506 by all of them in Susha Vanderwill Montemayor, Radke and Meyer Related to two-hour parking limits so as to create a two-hour time zone between 8 a.m To 6 p.m along the west side of the north 13th street from the south curb line of here on avenue south to the existing No parking anytime zone remaining olederman Susha Thank you, mr. Mayor. I move that this ordinance be put upon its passage There's a motion to second under discussion There being none, please call the roll mani Meyer Montemayor Radke Segali Stefan Susha I van Akron Vanderwill Bowman Dberg Eberg Serta Davis graph And kittleson 16 eyes Motion carries Other matters authorized by law 1476 will go to finance and the library board 1477 will go to public works and board of parks and forestry 1478 will go to public works 1479 and ro by the city clerk submitting an application for a private well permit at 4145 south 16th street. I'll ask for motion to accept and file There's a motion in the second any discussion Not all those in favor state aye Any opposed motion carries 1480 will lie over 14 1481 by alderman staffen authorizing the appropriate city official to execute an early construction agreement between the city The redevelopment authority and the harbour site development and entertainment LLC regarding permission to commence Commence certain construction work on land to be leased from the city for certain facilities Including a harbour terminal building and a two-story shanty style building alderman staffen Thank you your honor. I believe I need suspension of the rules Yes, there's a motion in the second all those in favor state aye Opposed motion carries, please proceed Thank you. I would move that the resolution be put upon its passage There's a motion in the second under discussion Thank you your honor. I think it's pretty self-explanatory The group that was here last week it just allows them to do a little preliminary work While we're still taking care of the final documents Uh, the important thing I think we had a question today and I wanted to point out on the second page Item number two just says commencement of construction under this letter It's conditioned upon you first obtaining land use approval and architecture review board approval So they will still have to go through normal procedures that way. It won't be any conflict there Thank you Attorney McLean Thank you your honor One thing that did not get attached to this letter if you look at the Paragraph six scope of work six a it's on the second page Says the nature and extent of the construction work to be performed in advance Is subject to the advanced written approval of the city permission is requested for the work described in exhibit a attached I didn't get anything from the developers until about the quarter to five this afternoon and I got an email What they indicate is They're looking to start harbor terminal the east building And building one in the next couple of weeks would be excavating putting in the barrier and pouring the foundation We would not go further until final approval. So those so excavation putting in the engineered barrier and pouring a foundation It would be The work described in exhibit a attached in other words For the council's information Thank you attorney McLean Any more discussion? Not please call the roll Montemayor Radke Segali Stefan Sushia Ben Akron Vanderwheel Bowman Dberg Eberg Serda Davis Graf Kittleson Manny And Meyer 16 eyes Motion carries 1482 Through 1486 will lie over Other matters Attorney McLean Thank you your honor 1487 is a communication from Mary Zerafanatus Asking an accountability of the city's investment of 20 million plus in the blue harbor resort and conference center And that will go to finance 1488 is communication from michael warner responding to an article in the shabuagan press from mr. Kepler dated october 9th And that will go to committee or the whole 1489 is communication from dav rickter o'connell 2420 north 7th street stating his concern about the overall shape of the boulevard's Boulevard section of 7th street from north avenue down to geely avenue That one will go to public protection and safety and public works 1490 is a claim from betty an stein price for alleged damages to her property When city garbage men picked up her personal items just unloaded from vervand as part of the garbage pickup And that one will go to special committee on risk management 1491 is a resolution authorizing the sale of lot 34 northfield meadow subdivision And that one will go to city planning 1493 is a communication from james boran 1526 nolcrest drive regarding the Milwaukee's fair share program for property tax exempt organizations And that one will go to finance Motion second all those in favor hold on hold on all of them say golly Thank you your honor. Um, what I would like to I asked before on this meeting ends is Could you please clarify that when? 1461 came up and it was going to be referred that you had said that I was not able to talk when I had talked to The city attorney and he said I could at least ask a question and when I buzzed in you said I couldn't Yeah, please ask what could declare I'm not following you which which one are you talking about? That is I'm concerning the tourism promotion was 14 death 61 And I buzzed in and then you had said that no she can't talk And all I wanted to do is ask a question When did I say that? So that Yeah, you single that and he looked at you and he says she can't talk I did not say she can't talk. Okay. Let me see what internally Well, my My understanding was I think the mayor thought you were buzzing in to for discussion on the capital improvements program That that was the impression I got but that's When you buzzed in at the same time that I was reading the one with the capital improvements and said Which you'll talk later or something like that. I think that's what I said I didn't say you can talk Before we close it. Would you like to make a comment? I just wanted to ask if you could Ask the finance. I would like to know how that the monies that The memorial day parade and independence day parade are going to come up with the monies that you are Taking away. I know they had opted on their budget and then you now have taken it away And I also would like to know in what fund the library fund that you're going to decrease by $194,000. I'd like to know where that $194,000 is you don't have your answer tonight if you would at your finance committee The next one just discuss it so that we would have some answers I'd really like to know where that $194,000 is going to go if we decreased the library Okay, hold on we got buttons all over the place all them grow up Thank you $194,000 we the finance committee have no control over it. It was our recommendation to the library board The library board is the one that has to come up with where the reductions will be made There was one that was brought up during our meeting and I Don't remember what account that was but at that at the meeting that we had Sharon Winkle the the library director had said yes, she agrees She thinks some of it can come out of there But from what we were told at our finance committee meeting was it was not going to affect any Any positions and there wouldn't be no reduction in hours in place that's what They were going to attempt to do the library board that is because they're responsible for making the cuts in the various cost centers And do you know what their amount of maintenance of effort level is? Because I asked the city attorney and he did not and I wanted to know that if we cut them $194,000 Did that put their um The membership of the federated library system their maintenance of effort will be Will be enough they'll have enough monies to cover the maintenance of effort and rich. What is a figure for maintenance of effort? Mr. Gephardt I don't have the calculation with me, but it is the average of the past three years tax levies That is the maintenance of effort and this will bring them at that level They'll maintain that $194 will bring them down to the maintenance of effort that that they'd need And the other monies that was the additional sums that were asked for out of room tax money To be used for those four different things the um The other amounts you asked about And uh, so we're just we removed approximately $4,000 From additional requests and moved it back to what they had requested in 2005 And you asked the tourism And we moved those monies back into the tourism because that's from room tax. That's where it's supposed to be Okay, uh alderman. This is an issue. It's coming up before finance is being referred to finance I don't want to see committee meetings being conducted during our council meeting. That's what we have committees It will be discussed by finance By finance, so please be present alderman sigali if you have some concerns Otherwise, we're going to sit here all night and and do our committee job during the council meeting I don't know that that's the appropriate thing to do. Is that what you were going to say alderman steffan Sort of Okay Okay, all those in favor adjourn Can you pause we stand adjourned