 Hello and welcome back to the run-up. I am Maureen Menong, Izzy Gray, but following fears of violence and allegations of plots to rid the polls, the police have declared their readiness to ensure hitch-free and credible exercises and they have deployed their men to all parts of the country. This came as top politicians and legals urged the Independent National Electoral Commission, that's the INEC, to transmit results of tomorrow's elections electronically to its result-viewing portal in real-time from the polling units, unlike what it did during the February 25th polls. Well, joining us to discuss this, I have with me, Aleksda Wilcox, who is an accountant and a public affairs analyst. Hello, Aleksda. Good morning, nice. Nice being in the studio after a very long one. You're welcome. Back to the studio. Thank you for having me. In the course of the program, we'll also be joined by Achi Kecude, who is a civil society activist, a public affairs commentator and, oh, oh, morning, a technology executive who has actually created an app that could allow you to follow the elections even as they unfold. Wouldn't that be interesting to have that happen? Well, until they join us, I'm going to start with you, Mr. Wilcox. What has been your, give us a summary, though, your observation of these elections because I haven't spoken with you since after the February 25th elections. Give us a brief summary of your overview of what has happened and what we could and should have learned from it as we'll go towards the next elections on Saturday. Well, sincerely, be the cacophony of voices that have engulfed the entire media spectrum, both in fact, more of the social media spectrum. It becomes very, very difficult for anyone who is not an insider to really understand truly what is the state of things. But I know that when the elections started and results were trickling in, a lot of people were happy that results were favoring them. But when the results begin to become unfavorable to them, people begin to shout, to regain a massive regain and all what not. Is that what you observed? Well, that's my first observation because I voted in Lagos, I'm a voter and I said my civic duty all the time. I don't know the mechanics of the INEC. I also know that, I don't offer INECs, I don't even know the mechanics of there. But all I know is the project. Because that statement you made about how people were excited when the results were favoring them and when it stopped favoring them, they began to cry foul. It just, it touches me personally because I was happy after the results were counted and it favored my candidate. But my joy was lost at the point when I heard that it could not upload to the beavers. That was when I started being unhappy. And I understand that's what happened to many people. That was when they stopped being happy about the elections. Not because it wasn't favoring their candidates. No, no, no, let's be honest and be fair. Let's just be honest and be fair. We might have different political leaning or different interests as to who wanted to win the election. So that creates happiness or unhappiness. I mean, I'm sure of your polling units. When you voted in your polling units, maybe you were there and the river counted and you were happy. Okay, in my own polling units, I was happy. Even though when the result was counted, I took a snapshot of the result and I was happy about it. Now, when the- Was it uploaded to the beavers in your place? Is it my, how do I know? You went home? Of course, of course. The beavers were used to identify me. That was for accreditation. And somebody has corrected that the same. The beavers is for accreditation. The beavers is to snap. It's not supposed to- Isn't that supposed to have been used to upload to the IRAVs? No, no, I don't see. I'm not in the tech- Let the tech- No, that's the understanding we had. That's the understanding we had. Now, it was supposed to be snapped. I was told it was supposed to be snapped. And whatever, whoever punches the, whatever it, I'm not the wreck or whatever. But it is expected that if you hit a server, which we are told. Exactly. That's what we are told. Now, the result- Because that was the basis on which Nigerians had confidence in the process. The confidence we are talking about here. The confidence we are talking about is the fact that the results will not be manipulated. That if what was counted at the polling unit were taken up to the server, it will not be manipulated in the process. No, but what about- It is the process. What about the process of taking the results from the polling unit to the coalition centers? Manually. Manually. With the agents all around, with all their results. Oh, because we've had stories where some agents- The agents were manipulated. Yes! Oh, one of the ones that do not have any agents. Let's not be found- Why should any- No, we're being very practical here. Let's drop emotions. Let's drop emotions. I'm not going to be practical. I'm being very practical. Yes, I've been very, very- And that's when I came to your studio. I'm being very practical. That's when I came to your studio. I drove down here with my fuel and everything to come to your studio. So I'm being very practical. Okay? Now, let me say this. Even at the point when candidates were leading, even with the manual process, and they were leading, they were happy. Let me take later for example. The whole city went agog. Now, INEC has said- I'm also aware of the- Or you want to descantinate that maybe you're not aware of that. Well, let me hear. That INEC server was attempted over 1,000 and something times to be halved. Wait, 12 million. Are you aware of that? I was told, I heard. Oh, you were told. But you are not so told that- The other side of not uploading, you are not told. You are aware of that. You are not aware you are told. So it is sometimes we choose what we want to take and throw what we don't want to throw. This is because we didn't- The minister of information gave that information. And that was how we got to hear about it. INEC has said it. Yeah, the adventure- They have to shut their server because of the- And some people have to shut down their server because of the massive attack. And why were people so interested in the server other than in the process? Now, you have my result. I have my result. So why interested in the server more than the piece of evidence you are having? Did you see videos, pictures of some results that were doctored? Tipex, Tipex were used. I saw that all over the place. I saw that in Nanambrai, in Enugu. I saw that in River State. I saw that in Abuja. I saw that in Lagos. I saw that in massive places. All right, did you see videos of polling agents that refused to upload? Their body language was telling you. Matter of fact, in the polling unit close to mine, the agent refused to put it in. In fact, as he was typing and fiddling with the beavers- You don't type in the beavers, you snap. I don't know what you are typing. You snap the beavers. Point where a code was supposed to have been imputed. I don't know if I like, I don't know if that's... All right, fine, let's move on. What lessons should we have learned? Look, the lesson we should have learned is the fact that Ainekova promised and under-delivered. I remember fully well that when this bill of electronic transmission of reservoir was going on, a lot of people talked about inadequate infrastructure. And which is part of what Ainekova found. A lot of people talked about inadequate infrastructure. In terms of coverage of the entire country, either with the 3G, because most part of the country is still on 3G, most are on 4G. And this was complained all over the place. Now, how many... Now, so that now came out to become a problem for Ainekova. Because they were so excited, we are pressurizing, no, it was done in America, it was done in the UK and all what, and all what, it can be done in Nigeria. If you can have an ATM that is being, you can use it. A lot of funny narratives came to the fore. And so, Ainekova said, they are going to use the beavers to transmit results. Now, test run in ocean states. Test run in ocean states. Ainekova has three different satisfied copies of the beavers, three different before the ocean state Electoral Tribunal, which is not subject to obligation at the Court of Appeal. Now, sometimes we in Nigeria, we just tend to want to run ourself and then come to a problem where we now have to say, let's go back to the beginning. We were pretty retention. First, the infrastructure was not adequate. The training was not adequate for those who are supposed to do whatever upgrade or placement or whatever. The system was not working. I suppose there are some places the beaver did this, walking in for agitation. Beaver was supposed to be used for accreditation. First accreditation and second accreditation, that is, unlike the one you usually don't put in. The beaver was supposed to capture your image. To come stand. Yes, to come back to your view. That's what the beaver is meant to work. And in my pulley unit, I live in Shimola and I put it in. In my pulley unit, the beaver worked 100% in terms of accreditation and in terms of what's supposed to do. After the zone was counted, I left the pulley unit. When I came back, the copper zone was posted on the pulley unit. I still snap that. So that's for me. And at the point of talking about the server, I had to say they had to shorten the server because of the massive attacks that people were attempting on the server. Why was that happening? Remember, some people are saying they're developing app, they're developing app that will help this. And while they go through by saying it, they could do this electronically, multi-selection for somebody. It's all about the internet. People are saying that they could electronically, there are young guys, the young tech guys, they were electronically with selection. People were interested in the server. And because of, remember 2019, what did the BDP took to the tribunal server, server result? When there was even no server? A server that was not functional. They have repeated results into the server. Now, people are interested more in the server than in the process. So because they could not have access to half the server and to upload whatever their own form of user they want to upload. They create the entire system. Now, INEC has uploaded. So go down and confirm. There are imperfections. Go down and confirm if what INEC has uploaded. But when they did the batch uploading, not online real time. Even the banks, even places, even companies that have strong IT, their IT has been so customized and it's become very effective. They still do batch... The major opponents in this election are contesting the process and the results at the court, as we speak. So that is a major issue. The process and the results. Why? Because the process is what leads up to the results. The credibility of the process is what determines the credibility, the integrity, the acceptability of the result. So the process is crucial. The guidelines came out first. Remember the controversies about this. And you have alluded to it that there were threats to the server, the INEC system before the elections. That one would have thought... Even on election day. Good. One would have thought that INEC would have taken... And obviously they did because according to the information given to us, they were able to ward off the attempts. Over 12 million attempts, cyber attacks they had. All right, so secondly, the process were told the guidelines. Which was why, if you remember, before this election, many Nigerians were not excited about coming out. But in 2022, November, when INEC chairman gave that assurance, Nigerians were optimistic that, okay, because look whether we like it or not. There is the Nigerian factor. There will always be the Nigerian factor. So Nigerians thought, okay, if there won't be a Nigerian dealing with these things, writing and cleaning and erasing or whatever, if it's going to be uploaded from the place where we voted, to the system straight, to the server, online real time. Okay, we can perhaps trust that this time our votes will count, we will come out. And so when that was not done, whether intentionally or by accident or by attacks or whatever, as we're not so sure right now. Nigerians were dissolutioned, Nigerians were angry. Now let me ask you, what do you think, or how do you think this places in Nigeria, this whole thing that's played out in the committee of nations globally? I don't, first and foremost, the process is absolutely important. And the process is not important when the results cannot be important. Look, in every system, there is, there is even offices anywhere, the banks, you still have physical evidence, even though you have electronic evidence. So when you go to the bank to get your bank statement, if they print out for you, you can verify with your physical evidence. You might go to the bank and the system is not working. They will take your check, they will pay you, and then they will post later. You can go sometimes, they will do batch, batch of processing. Even after processing it at the counter, they seem to upload it to their main story server. They cannot do that at once because it's coming from everywhere. They do batch processing. I would like that to the IT guy, but me, from where I've worked, like you said, I'm an accountant, I'm a child accountant and I work with in organizations with such a nomenclatures. Now, I do not see anything wrong with the process. You do not see anything wrong with the process. I do not see anything. You see, this much I do about upload, which has taken on the shine. Look, every candidate is expected to have an agent in every pooling unit. The result is entered in form, I don't, I did EC8 or something, is entered in form EC8, signed by every agent. Copy is given to every agent. As a matter of fact, the copy is sent off for every agent that is accreted to that pooling unit. So you have your copy. I have my copy. Signed, stamped, including that, which is signed by the security agent that was there. Everyone have their signature on that copy. So it's simple. With or without upload. Now, if you doctor the original copy, after you have signed, after you have signed your own copies, you doctor the original copy. The agent that is having a challenge, have his own copy. How did somebody who came forth in a state declared winner? They're talking about the government of a state, who put the demo. How did, why was he declared when I bought his Supreme Court? He had his signed copies. So even when the manipulated, I call it not, not considering what happened in the tribunal. Even when the powers that be manipulated and give victory to all of them, who put the demo, have his own signed copies, for which he took to the court and presented as evidence. These are my copies. These are copies. This is the next signature. This is police. This is DSS. These are the copies I have. Yeah, so they are contesting that. Exactly. They say they won and they are going to prove it. Exactly. Now I'm saying, my question is, how does this portray, because international observers, matter of fact, global press description of this process has been a matter of hot topic. Because from the economists, the New York Times, the Guardian of UK, the Financial Times of London, et cetera, et cetera, the headlines have been very, very unpleasant. What was the headline in the US election? Please, let me know the headline in the US election. I'm the one asking the question. Who is contesting it? I'm the one asking the question here. And we're talking about Nigeria. Exactly. So I'm asking, how does this portray us globally in terms of our ability to conduct our elections, in terms of our ability to protect and deepen our democracy? Look, Nigeria democracy has deepened. This is our 7th election cycle. Anybody who is discredited, both in Nigeria, because you lost or your candidate lost, who is discrediting our system, is unpatrotic. Because this is our 7th election cycle. We've come from the era of landslide and seaslide victory. When 25 million people vote for a candidate, when in River State, where I come from, you have all kinds of names, in the all kinds of names of fishes and the crabs and everything in the election, and they all vote. You have 2.9 million voters in the list that 2.7 something will vote. Nobody, and a lot of these all will be 95% for a candidate and we've gone past that era. We've gone past the, look at it. Now, I was so shocked in what you call the National International Press something, was saying that Ashwajib Balatimu was elected by 10% of the total elected that BBC. Are you, are you, are you possible to come and vote? Because of Biva's, we had the least, we have one of the least turnout in our election. And it keeps dropping every year. No, one question. No, and what I'm saying, even with the enthusiasm that a lot of people showed, like you said, a lot of people showed, even with the advent of the B-Factor that a lot of people now took extra time to go out and get their votes and get their registered and I can give ample opportunities and get, for people to collect their BBC and standard the dates, even put it on weekends against their own run of business time, put it on weekends, so people had their vote. Yet, the vote turnout shows the originality. That's why even me, I call it a Nigerian population, something we exaggerate there. Now, a lot of people that had double, multiple BBCs, they couldn't use them. A lot of people were used to have, naturally, right results, right results without any voting. In many places, you couldn't do it because the B-Vas was there to check the, just like the first machine that we use, that's going to bring down the number of voters. Now, the B-Vas, the B-Vas. Now, the first one was, is it what was the first one? The one we used for 2019. 2019. Now, that brought down the number from one week to half for the something million voters. It came to about 30 something. In 2019, we'll have to do something. This one, we'll have to do something. So, if anybody is not appreciating that fact, that the cleanup of a system is, it had, I mean, should be commended, then one patrotic. Because in every election, one person will win. Definitely. So, if you're kind, they didn't win. Is that important enough to reclaim the system? Now, people are saying, I keep trying to say, oh, we want to contest the process, not the outcome. So, if the outcome is okay, and the process is not okay, but the outcome to you is okay. Because the same outcome, which what made the law put to calculate the certificate of return, those are one, a synod, seats, those are one half of red seats, they all went and collected their certificate. So, the outcome, the same process, they put in the same outcome, and they all went and collected their certificates, and they're all happy, celebrate that they won, across party lines. Now, you are not discrediting the same process, because it didn't fit where you're kind of at the presidential level. They were being unpatrotic, and we're being selective. We're having selective judgment in the way we judge. I don't know if from INEC, I don't know who briefed for them. It's one of the most corrupt organizations, I mean, we've ever had, I don't know who briefed for them. I've not worked there, I don't even know who I've worked there. But I think as a Nigerian, I always say duty, to always defend the integrity of this country, and not to join unpatrotic, foreign observers of foreign element, who will not see what is wrong in Georgia, in what Trump is saying, in the US election. Today, tomorrow, everyone say the US election was rigged. Most Democrats and Republicans say the US election was rigged. What do you call it? Donald Trump is still insisting that it was rigged out. And no international press has said anything about it. No New York Times has said, no London has said anything about it. And yet, it's only Nigeria because you want to bring down this country. Nobody will bring down this country. This country is bigger than everybody. I will stand by this country. I love the spirit of love for Nigeria. I will defend this country. This is the country I have. All right, Alexa Wilcox is an accountant and a public affairs analyst. He's joining me to discuss elections and lessons learned from the February 25th presidential elections. And we're going to also project towards the forthcoming elections tomorrow. Stay with us.