 So I think it's going live Lyra, we've got Mork the Cat and Lyra here with me today and we may not have many of you joining us but we thought that while we were testing out Facebook Live you said you were up for giving us a go with me didn't you? So we thought we would have a bit of a chat about school based anxiety which is something you know a thing or two about how come? Because when at the start of year five then I was very unhappy about going to school and I would purposefully stay home at school and I would lean against my door so that dad and mum couldn't come in to try and get me up for school and stuff because I was really unhappy and I didn't want to go in and I became very anxious about going into school because I didn't go so and something that mum has taught me because there's other things that I've been anxious about not necessarily to do with school but other things and mum says always to me if you don't do it then you're just gonna get more anxious about doing it when you next have to do it and so it's got worse and worse and worse and I in the end because it started off with me just being very unhappy at school and then in the end it became with me not wanting to go to school and it it being a very kind of upsetting time to manage with like in the mornings and it became quite a lot to handle yeah We didn't prepare this at all, thank you for sharing that. One thing I'm interested there so you were saying how I've taught you since because I don't think we necessarily quite got to grips with what was happening right away but I've taught you since about how when we're anxious or worried or scared about something that actually often we need to keep trying to do that thing or else it gets worse do you understand why that is or do you want me to explain that? I don't really understand why it is but it does work yes and that's the most important thing is that it works but just to help you understand why it is that if we're worried or anxious about something why we need to keep trying to do it is actually because basically when we're worried our brain goes into what's called fight flight freeze which is you know if we had a tiger or a bear running towards us and it's what would help us to respond to that situation so we're scared about the bear and so we need to be ready to fight it or to flee from it basically so our brain gets all ready to do that and what happens is that we get very very worried about certain things and we build them up like the bear and we worry about them and if we go and we engage with the situation we go and do the thing that worries us yeah and we find that it's fine or at least kind of okay and we manage it then we tell our brain that it's okay you don't need to run away from that however if we don't go and do that thing then our brain kind of assumes that the worst would have happened so our brain kind of every time we're thinking about the thing we're scared of goes into that fight flight freeze response so if you're scared of school if you go and you find that schools kind of okay then the next time you're slightly less scared of it but if you don't go then your brain goes oh well if you'd have gone it would have been terrible and yeah yeah if that makes sense but that's really hard when you're scared about going in so we have to think really carefully didn't we about how could we help you to go to school because it's better say you really really didn't want to go that didn't just start on the morning of school that sometimes started like on a Sunday afternoon say Monday in particular didn't it and can you remember what helped there I mean obviously ultimately you ended up changing schools but you get to the point where you could go in didn't you yeah I think one of the things that really did help is having the support team at school so that then when as soon as I walked in through the doors then I knew that I had somewhere that I could kind of get used to it almost before I had to go into the classroom and I would sit with my friends and I'd sometimes some of my friends would go and I would kind of talk and sit with them and just get myself almost prepared to go into the classroom and that's really important that's what I would refer to as a soft landing so you're arriving at school but you're not having to go straight in and do all the really tough stuff right away you're actually going and getting yourself mentally prepared really for the rest of the day and taking a few minutes at the beginning of the day can often mean that then you're more able to do it and so yeah we kind of got a bit of a routine going with that didn't we so yeah always went to the same people in the same place and what what did you do when you got there so this was the kind of nurture zone wasn't it what your school learning learning zone that's it so what would you do you say you had breakfast in yeah so we would have we'd have breakfast there and then we would if there was something that was worrying as we could either talk to one of the like I would quite often talk to one of my friends who went there as well and or there was some teachers who were there who like worked as the learning support team and you could just go and talk to them if you had any worries and then they would try and help you talk through them and kind of make your worries less big worries yeah and then they were and then you'd feel more ready to go into the classroom than if you hadn't have talked to them through okay okay so you could tackle stuff before it kind of yeah yeah and was there a time limit on how long you could stay in the learning zone do you have to go to lessons at a certain point or was it just when you were ready well they suggested if you're having a good day and you were ready to go in then you went at the time when people came in and lessons started if you really weren't ready then you would just stay in there until you were ready and you felt ready to go in and then you would go into lessons slower slowly and I think some of the people who are watching this so we're for anyone who's just kind of joining us this is my daughter Lyra who is 10 nearly 11 who struggled with school based anxiety and school avoidance and we're just talking a bit about her experience there and how when this was particularly difficult that going to the learning zone when you arrived was really helpful yeah and I seem to remember from that time and you'll correct me if I'm wrong that you built some quite good relationships with the people who worked in the learning yeah yeah and lots of people watching this will probably be the kinds of staff who work in those kinds of places so maybe can you tell me a bit about what it was that they did that was helpful why you kind of found you could get on with them I think what I found helpful was that you knew that I mean even if you were having a tough time if you came into school and you were perfectly fine you went off to lessons and then you found that you were really anxious about actually being in there being in the classroom and actually you couldn't focus because you were so anxious that you could just go to them as long as the teacher knew where you were could go to them and you could talk to them for as long as you wanted and then just come back in when you were ready and I think that's kind of having knowing that you could go there at any point yeah so you could go to someone that you trusted yeah yeah and what about the kinds of things that they did with you or said to you was there anything because it seems like you quite you know you really trusted them didn't you yeah I think I think I trusted them just because I knew that they they wouldn't tell anyone unless they thought I was kind of that they that they actually needed to tell someone like if it was my worries then they wouldn't tell anyone it was only kind of if I was in danger that they would tell anyone and I also went to place to be but and I think those sessions also really helped because I would go on a Wednesday morning and that would help me come to school on in a Wednesday you always wanted to go to school on Wednesday didn't you really liked going to place yeah and so I would I would happily go into school on Wednesdays and then if I was worried about how Monday or Tuesday or how Monday or Tuesday had gone then we could talk that through and if I was worried about coming into school on the other days then we could talk that through as well and I think just having that safe space kind of it was only Wednesday but on Wednesdays then I was very happy to come at school yeah which is really good that's really positive and do you remember kind of how it all started it started by getting well so in year four I absolutely love my teacher and he's still my most favorite teacher that I've ever had but it start so I had him I was really happy that I had him and we got on really well and then in year five then I found out that I had a different teacher I really didn't like quite frankly and when we got told that that was the teacher that we had then I was I I got quite upset I think it's fair to say and I on the first day like I'm normally really excited to go into school I was excited because I was excited to see my friends but I was also not very excited after meeting my teacher for the first time I think there must have been I think it was a difficult time generally wasn't it so more joining in here and so we'd had a recently grand dad who you're very close to had died and there were there I think there was there were lots of different things going on weren't there but the first science that we knew that anything wasn't quite right was that actually that I was getting calls from the headship team that you've been naughty yeah and I remember you recently spoke at a conference I was talking about you gave the closing closing remarks and you what you said to everyone was about how unique they needed to give children the opportunity to show their problems other than being naughty yeah that makes sense yeah because I felt that the only way that I could be heard was by being naughty because then everyone would know that I was being naughty and then they try and and then they try and stop me from being naughty and then I knew that I had their attention so then I could speak to them about the actual problem yeah which is yeah really like as a parent when you said that you know it that's hard to hear because obviously we'd missed stuff yeah we should have been doing something sooner but perhaps you've been kind of quietly getting on with it and trying and what do you think would have made that better like how could you've been heard differently what I'm not really I think I think actually kind of telling someone that if you do get anxious or if you do just need to go and speak to someone that there are other ways of doing it and kind of telling them and kind of giving them those options of ways to get your point heard and you're in new school now since September and that school it's been quite a different experience hasn't it so yeah and I think that's it I think it's fair to say your old school did some you know you had some really wonderful times there didn't you and there's some bits about it that were great but by the end it was time to change but can you talk to me a little bit about your new school is there anything that they're doing that mean that you feel a little bit more confident about going in each day or I think it's so we don't go kind of straight into the classroom and start with kind of all everyone everywhere kind of you start off in the playground and you get to see your friends first and then you can then you go into the classroom but it's not kind of you see your friends outside and then if you do need space like it's bigger outside than inside and if you need some space then you can just go off and have some space and then it and then I I certainly don't feel anxious at all really except for my mother's swimming but I don't feel anxious about going into the classroom too I think just knowing that you don't have to go straight into the classroom where everyone is I think just knowing that you can kind of go off yeah and I think so you only started in September yeah probably so see we were locked down before that yeah and but in that time there's been maybe a couple of times haven't they where you've had a little wobble which is fine we all have moments like that and and I I felt as your mum that and the school responded to those moments really well but I wondered what you thought about it yeah because one of the times was that well Ellie was flying and she may be hurt by batting it on a metal pole but yeah Ellie is Lyra's sister there in the same yeah and then she had to go to the medical room and I was maybe slightly sad that I had done it to her yeah completely by accident yeah because we do this we do this well we did this quite often and it would be like on magic trick that Ellie can fly by her being swung around by me and then we did it in a maybe two small space and then she bashed her leg and then she had to go to the medical room and I got really worried and upset that I had done it to her and worried that she was she done to it what if I what did I do to her but she kind of is it just a bruise or is it a break you know I didn't know kind of what it was and I have never been I don't think I've ever really been in school without Ellie no and I get really anxious when I know that I don't have Ellie because I know that kind of I can like we hate each other but then we also love each other yeah because I know that like at break times then I always have someone to play with but knowing that I possibly would possibly wouldn't have her that break time and that lunch time because I had to come and get her yeah yeah that was kind of it made me worried just because I didn't know that if I was going to be on my own or if I was gonna have her there or what kind of I don't like uncertainty I like things to be how they are every day and so you were worried about going to school the next day why don't you yeah because I was worried that people would ask me why haven't you been in school yesterday because well Ellie was at the hospital that day and I didn't want to go on my own yeah and so I was worried the day after that that people would ask me like why haven't you been in school and they did ask me why haven't you been in school and I just decided to say that it's because Ellie had to go to the hospital until five o'clock in the afternoon since three o'clock this morning and in terms of the car yeah which was all broadly true and but the key thing now is that you didn't really you were not feeling very confident about going back into school and you'd have your confidence not knocked a bit and I think that that's an important thing to understand with this isn't it that yeah even though you built your confidence up and actually you largely enjoy going to school then you find you can manage that now it can quite quickly if we don't respond fast yeah it feels like it could unravel but actually your teacher was really helpful that morning yeah yeah because she she came and met with us and her teacher and we kind of talked it through and we made it feel better because we didn't just talk about that we talked about other things so it wasn't kind of like this is the problem we're gonna talk about this the whole time yeah we kind of sorted it and then we talked about some other stuff you know yeah and I guess going back to your earlier point about needing to like people to hear you I suppose that having your teacher and your head teacher come to meet you in the morning when I said you know Lyra's having a hard day can you help that maybe you feel a little bit more heard yeah yeah which is helpful and it your new school if you're having yeah if you're having a difficult moment of what do you do now how do you kind of manage those ups and downs in the day is there anything that helps or is that still a work in progress well first of all I'll talk to Mrs. Rivers but if I still need if I need kind of more time now and not just to talk to someone then I'll use my time to see Miss Musgrove card and I'll go and see Miss Musgrove and then I'll just sit in with her in her room for a bit until I feel ready and then I'll go back into the classroom and that's how I normally manage it but sometimes it's a bit harder than that but that's how I generally manage it because I generally manage to get it quickly before it gets bigger yeah and I think that's important isn't it and I think yeah some days are hard aren't they we had one day where we'd had quite difficult day so we went home by the vicarage and we had cuddles with the plug and chocolate from the vicar didn't we which I think helps a little bit yeah well I think we've definitely tested this I think it's working oh look we've got some nice comments on here so Stuart says such an inspirational young lady and Joanie says is this available to watch again I gotta take mum shopping but this is one of my SCN girls really really want to watch this yes I think it will stay available and Lucy says thank you and well done for sharing and yeah thank you Lyra and it might be that another time we could do another chat and we can answer people's questions but we mainly wanted to test it and see if it works yeah it does and I think that you know a couple of things I would want to add in at this point is as a parent and a professional that knowing a lot about these things doesn't make your family immune to them nor does it mean that you know exactly what to do we're all having to learn all the time and we're learning still aren't we and but the other thing I think I would say is that it's it's we've had to communicate really carefully and we've really had to stick with it haven't we and sometimes we've had to do things that don't feel nice so sometimes it has been about being really brave and going and doing the thing anyway you know we're a bit scared but knowing that you know there's someone there who will meet us and greet us and support us when we get there yeah and I think that you know for any one working in school who's watching a really important thing to understand is that for us parents or carers this is really emotionally draining as well so there would be days when it might have taken you know we might have been working from Sunday lunchtime to get Lyra into school on a Monday and that you know that Monday morning we might have had three hours of crying and worry and upset by the time that Lyra was on to school premises and so by that point as a parent you know you're completely emotionally drained because really upsetting when your child is worried and upset and so yeah the educators just remember that it's not only the child who needs support but actually we as parents and carers really need sort of tea and sympathy as well and you know any ideas for practical strategies for how to support children to calm before they get to school and that kind of thing can be really really super helpful as well but the key thing for us was about finding that routine wasn't it finding those people and places of safety and being prepared to kind of stick at it and trying to make sure that you have positive experiences yeah that's it we I talked recently on my YouTube channel about I can cycles which is about finding out the things you can do even if they're really little and then building on those so so yeah I think that's have you got any other final thoughts you would want to lodge at this point there'll be other opportunities Lyra always wants to help so many of you'll be watching who've been engaging with our new online learning and we are creative education or a family business set up by my mother-in-law many years ago and I recently returned to the family business to work alongside my husband because my mother-in-law just turned 70 in fact didn't she so we all live together and she just thought she might like to spend more time knitting and playing with our many dogs rather than running a company which is fair enough so I returned and then the pandemic happened which was challenging for face-to-face training so Lyra has been sort of during lockdown and beyond and lockdown too now she's been with us every step of the way as we've been developing the new website and putting it all together and actually you've done some some work for us haven't you and but you you have a future you have a future aim don't you what job is it you want to do in the business I want to really count yeah Lyra wants to be the accountant you love maths don't you so that's her that's her aim so we're we're hoping and you guys can all help with this we're hoping to keep the family business going long enough that Lyra and her sister if she chooses actually have something to inherit and Lyra has some accounting to do but yeah Lyra's been really interested in all the work we've been doing and all the online and every now and then she saved me during zooms that have gone wrong and haven't you been yeah the tech help so yeah thank you for everyone who's who has tuned in today and now we know Facebook life works technically works we will try and do more and I'm gonna schedule a chat for the 12th of November I think I looked clear in my diary about anxiety and I'll put a link out in our email for people to submit questions ahead and we'll take questions on the day if we have them and here we go Lyra you've got a lovely comment here from Katie Truby who says it's so wonderful to hear from a child so beautifully spoken thank you chances thank you for sharing I'll show this to my daughter and my granddaughter or good daughter is autistic and it's a trial and error finding the right way for the child every day is different and what a lovely young lady and Rachel thanks Lyra it's insightful to hear things from a young person's perspective I'm gonna ask my daughter to watch and Lizanne saying love this so thank you so much for Lyra and I just have to say I Lyra specifically said what are you doing can I help it wasn't I I sometimes worry like child labor it's not appropriate but actually you specifically wanted to be involved didn't you say thank you Lyra okay bye everyone see you next time