 Great show tough act to follow Quite unlike the last time you and I were on stage one after the other same room. I think right Okay, even tougher act to follow. I was here yesterday spying on both Catherine and Daniel and They had some kick ass talks to give Daniel gave Really rushed version of it today again Those of you who had both rounds. I think you would have understood a little more. It was really super useful to me I have actually honestly no idea what the hell I am doing on the stage between these two fantastic Brains one a global expert at the metaverse at the minimum. That's the only thing that I remember from the super long introduction that Kathy gave and another Among the top 10 people in AI in the whole world this I heard from Catherine Right top nine Somebody died along the way looks like What is in that box? Sorry dark humor, but permitted because I know that I'm standing between you guys and your awards and all of that so Okay, so What we are supposed to be discussing is future-proofing marketing marketing's what we are most interested in Futures the word that is certainly center stage today for all of us, but I'm based on everything. I've heard over the last two days I'm honestly inclined to believe that being able to say anything about the future seems like a mugs game and we are quite likely to fail Catherine, what do you think I? Think you're not wrong I think what's interesting about this panel and the composition of this panel is that we bring two different perspectives that are Nother for less very complimentary in terms of looking at the future So, you know AI is the powerhouse It's going to drive many metaverse and web three platforms all of them in fact But also we're looking at the discipline from two different perspectives So that it's what I call top down and bottom up It's a typical financial or economic term but it describes the analytical and data driven framework that drives so much of Daniel's work in addition to the sort of bottom-up Cultural behavioral patterns that we're observing empirically in the work that I do in the metaverse and web three spaces So it's super exciting to have this combination and really see how all these things are coming together So that we have a better understanding of what we can expect in the future Yeah, and it's very difficult of course to see what the future looks like but Which is why it's very important that we build adaptive organizations Probably have heard that word more than enough now the more adaptive they are the more resilient we are Because the world is going to change rapidly over the next decade and those that survive are going to have to adapt to that I have a changing world and you already know my opinion which is to be able to adapt We need to innovate and to innovate we need to unlock the creative capacity of our workforce Thank you Daniel Catherine I'm coming back to you yesterday. You talked about how if we used words like crypto and NFTs we would probably get cancelled too and therefore the Emperors new clothes and alcohol digital goods among other things Question for you from a young marketers perspective We don't want to be making the mistakes where we end up throwing money at the shiny object in the room Neeraj. I'm not talking about your box And get caught on the wrong side, right? Because we don't want us boardrooms to be yelling at us saying you threw money away at something that just doesn't work or didn't work And we've seen numerous examples of those kinds even in my limited space of banking I know we people have tried to do mobile banking apps on blackberries and on wearables and we've fallen flat on our face I myself I confess readily I attempted to do Hashtag banking banking on Twitter once upon a time it did Do the little gold dust sprinkling on trying to create a patina for the brand but beyond that obviously nobody ever used it In that sense is there a way are there some clues some guidance you can give us on how do we Sift through what to say yes to and what to say no to in terms of spending money behind New technologies in the context of the metaverse AI etc for marketers particularly the younger ones in the room I think if we're thinking about being at the frontier of these spaces It's it really requires a couple of things first is we need to make sure that we delight Engage our audiences. We need to make sure that they're really that we're tapping into things that are Interesting and relevant to them. So we need to add value to these Experiences in ways that again that they recognize and specifically What I think about H I think about Gen Z and Gen Alpha and the emerging behaviors That that we see that we see emerging in these spaces and the expectations that are evolving as a result So if you add all these things together, it's it's about creating value for a new cohort of target Audiences that have new expectations behaviors And if you think about this and you put it together Then it really adds up to a new paradigm across platforms And so at that point you need to adapt your behavior across the different platforms so that you can adequately address them so Understanding the behavior then will inform what you need to do on these platforms to touch with the audience and community and Then knowing what they value on those audience community will inform how you have this reciprocal Relationship so I have these little acronyms in my head. It one is add age and I think it's AGE but that's basically it is Identifying the community what they want what drives them and give it to them, but that requires iteration over time There's no this is the thing right now. There is no one solution those Those kind of you know cookie cutter solutions are gone. They've been gone for about a decade at least but especially in emerging platforms whether it's gaming or metaverse spaces or Or if you're thinking about Places where you've got you know digital trading marketplaces all of those things will have different demands and you're going to have to You know just think about what works for you brand Thank you, Daniel. I'll spin that question slightly differently for you Are there pointers you can think about showing us about? What filters we should keep in our head when we attempt to Use AI in the context of a marketing problem You did give us some examples during your talk, but perhaps what you can tell us is how do I watch out for what not to do And where not to throw my money? Yeah, so we I used a prioritization framework to To make sure that when we're solving these frictions, they're really driving value To Catherine's point so that I guess your one of those criteria is is data is a data available to help us answer the question Sometimes it's not but sometimes solving the problem is so valuable that you have to go and get the data So so there's a whole set of criteria that I can share the slides, but is it data available? What's the return on investment also stakeholders are all of the stakeholders across your business bought into the solution? It's okay to be bought into the top, but if the people's lives that these technologies are going to be affecting Not bought in they're going to reject it. Is it going to be maintainable and also one critical? Criteria is reusability. So we build these expensive smart module solutions And and actually you can reuse the underlying assets to solve for the parts of the business So for example, if you're doing feedback in your business or career development or pay setting or performance review All of those things you need to know the skills of people so you don't just build multiple Skills profiling modules you want one skills profiling module that serves all of those for when it comes to marketing You don't want to be building multiple brains that generate content You want one brain that generates content you want one brain that represents how your audiences think and not built Reusability is critical I wanted to add to that because I think that's an excellent point in terms of the the data that we can collect on user behavior Increasingly people think the metaverse space is that this is just a question of you know How many people attended a specific event, but in very short amount of time? We'll be able to have a lot more information about what users are doing in these spaces right now It's uneven at best, but I will say that soon enough we will have more individualized behavior Which will allow us to create more customized experiences that are AI driven and we're also going to be able to analyze What's their share of wallet because younger people especially have much greater facility opening up wallets and? and and Investing in digital goods sooner than they're likely to invest in say a savings account or open up with natural physical banking account so they're going to have access to disposable capital within these gaming platforms and That's already the case and they're making allocation decisions for this that the capital that they they own through either earned points or Invested money and so whatever you know, it's kind of the what's show me what's it your wallet? And I'll show you who you are It's a new form of tapping into that the identity of this person beyond the persona that they adopt in this space And so as marketers we're going to have greater insight especially in the younger generations because they will have invested So much of their own capital in both building trading selling all of these you know, they're their objects in these 3d worlds and That will give us greater insights as to what they want and how to reward them and how to incentivate them So I think that they're rich analytics be had not just from AI and external CRM systems But certainly within Metaverse and gaming platforms Super catrin in fact that segues to a thought that I had based on what you said yesterday about You mentioned Nike having sold 200 million dollars if I remember the number, right of digital goods already It was a hundred eighty-five as a third quarter of last year So we can It's not letting that rounding it out as far as 200 per year I went and looked that up last night and I found out that about this is to do with one of their most popular Selling lines the Air Force one, which is all the rage. I didn't know or else. I would have warned them today I have to bought them first, but this is not about the physical shoe. It's apparently you download the 3d Virtual version of that shoe and you not only download it you download your own interpretation of the shoe Apparently and so there are arguably a hundred thousand versions of that shoe sitting somewhere or the other and because I specified I customized it for myself now. It's in theory a co-created digital good that I can also make money off along with Nike Am I right about that? Yes, that's true We actually did a series of that for adidas. We created a series of Avatars that was a I driven you asked a couple of questions. It was the first time you use a We used a personality quest Personality quiz that then determined your personality and they generated character that reflected your personality and then you could Download this and it was interoperable Which means that you could use this avatar across multiple gaming spaces, which is also in itself fairly rare We must have generated about a half a million within the first week and some of them You know most people kept them But there were a good portion who actually took those avatars enlisted them on open sea Which is a digital is a digital marketplace for branded goods and they sold them and so this is a great way of sharing these The value the passion of the brand without really forcing people to either buy NFTs or invest in crypto Because you could pay with it with your credit card And the second thing was it's rewarding fans for their loyalty as opposed to trying to exploit fans for their loyalty So rather than try to get rich quick and you know make it a quick buck off of your brand fame It was a way of actually turning that around and saying thank you very much for being so so loyal Feel free to play with this but feel free to also sell it And I thought that was a really beautiful way of giving back So here's the dinosaur question my son who's a teenager now 16 probably gets this I am left wondering I Paid a ton of money or my my son took a ton of money from my credit card. He didn't even get the damn shoe So he's not going to get any exercise anyway It's another matter that I bought the shoe and it's sitting in my shoe rack, and I'm not getting any either but is there a Is this okay? Is this kosher that now Nike is selling just the idea of a shoe and I'm paying money for it It's not exactly the idea of the shoe because if you're thinking about people who spend on Average two to three hours gaming every day your swag means a lot, and I can tell you having been in these spaces I get very uncomfortable if I am not Representing myself in a way that I think I should so if I'm a dragon princess or if I am a furry Like ball that kind of like you know pulsates that's important to me in that space It really is and it's very hard to understand To generations that aren't used to being on gaming platforms But each one has a different kind of it's like if you're going to a certain party or if you're going to a concert You're gonna have different outfits for different occasions, and that's the case also in the metaverse It's the case in different gaming worlds So one might be you know more I don't know more Western themed and the other one might be futuristic And so you'll want fits for every one of these occasions And so it's important very much for the players to have that what's beautiful about it is that they can actually Express themselves different identities in different gaming spaces At a different cost so for five dollars ten dollars. I mean Ralph Lauren famously increased their digital their their revenues on digital assets by 40 percent due to the Distribution of digital assets in gaming platforms like Zepetto, which are only five dollars So it's aspirational as well So if you're looking at you've got your Metro core, but then you have your non-core you're thinking well How can I bridge that gap? How can I make this is accessible instead of you know being Gucci and selling you know Cheap belts and having that drive the revenue you can also think of is Diffusing the brand in virtual spaces. So it's a great alternative to get very high ROI and To expose your brand to a new generation Okay, I'm still a little on the fence. So let's see if we can get Daniel's help on this But before I come to you Daniel, I want to tell you one of the super shortest short stories I've ever read author called science fiction author called Frederick Brown He wrote the story about the building of the world's first supercomputer Where essentially all the computers in the world were hooked up together to make one and we have some version of that today That exists already and I guess AI in another form is the same thing. So the guy who invented it Through the switch turned it on you hear this ominous hum all over the world and then the guy who funded it Let's say the president of the earth or whatever it is is given the honor of asking the first question to this computer So he asks is there a God and There is an answer that comes out of prick apparently nowhere saying yes Now there is The scientist realizes what's happened and he tries to turn the switch off From a clear blue sky bolt of lightnings fuses the switch and strikes the scientist dead Based on that short story Are we headed there Daniel? That's a big question We might need so I guess The development of large-language models of the past several decades I've been they've been doing interesting things. We've been able to get them to recognize objects and images and things like that and around 10 billion neurons they started to do something very interesting, which is encapsulate lots of knowledge Encapsulate an understanding of language how the world works. I think my expectation is over the next decade We will see in the next few years these large language models moving from being like a intoxicated graduate in your pocket to like a master's level so they'll be able to reason and then in a few more years we'll be able to Give it a complex objective function like a PhD and it'll be able to go and try and address that and Determine with that hypothesis is true and a few years later We will probably have a professor in our pocket that's as smart as all of us Which is a GI and then the question is that if you give it then the the task of building a smarter AI We we could very quickly see what is called a fast takeoff where we see This intelligence going from as smart as all of us to a million times smarter than all of us Which is super intelligence and we could take a long time it takes years But I think my community think that we'll achieve a GI by the end of this decade decade and That means we could see super intelligence in the in the next 20 years. Wait, are you saying six years? Sam Almond not necessarily out of work. I guess not just out of work It's Sam. I think Sam Almond and others believe that by the end of this decade will achieve a GI and Then we don't know when super intelligence will come but the concern is is it is potentially Either the most glorious thing that happens to us or our biggest existential threat My worry is that if this thing sees us as a threat then it will remove us from the equation now Even our ability to make more super intelligence is it might see us as a threat so it might prevent us from doing that I hope that it will find some interesting dimensions out there and just leave without taking all of our resources with it But I do say to people that when it comes look busy be nice to each other and hopefully it will go away We are going to have to end this in a hopeful note. So we'll take that So it's not dystopia. It's utopia. We're painting and Daniel painted this yesterday as well He said we will also be reaching economic singularity where none of us will have to work free food free housing free clothes free virtual goods as well and Then what the hell will we do with our time? We will get to be creative. We'll be making more Nike's and Gucci's and so on and so forth for ourselves. We'll be the metaverse We'll be in the metaverse But you also said something equally useful and I think all the great scientists from Einstein have said this that Mankind exists because we have purpose at the end of everything Our purpose used to be quite simple and banal We used to be about getting food and clothing and bringing our children up see in a safe environment, etc When we reached the utopia Daniel promises within two decades maximum Minimum probably by 20 another 10 years. What is it? 2030 at that time our purpose will be to attain our higher selves New next level of evolution for humankind. I suspect and into that free world Let us all arrive. Yeah, let's hope so. It sounds really positive. I'll sign on that I certainly hope for that on that cheerful note. Thank you guys and Congratulations