 Kia ora, it's Alina Siegfried here with Kiwi Connect. We're at New Frontiers 2016 and I'm here with Melissa Clark-Krinnos. Melissa, how are you enjoying the festival, Ziffer? Oh, it's great. I think it's great just to be in a community of people who are exploring ideas and wanting to have great conversation. And yeah, it's just fantastic. Great. So one of the themes that we're talking about this year is new economies and how entrepreneurship is driving business around the world. So what trends are you seeing in the field of entrepreneurship? I think one of the big things I'm seeing more and more is that probably maybe 20, 25 years ago when I first started out, it was very much driven around how are you going to make money. And so it was kind of greed is good, you know, rich dad, poor dad. I remember doing courses with Robert Kiyosaki and it's just all very, it was very much around money. Whereas I believe now what I'm seeing is much more people looking at how can I solve the really, really big problems in this world? You know, how can I create businesses that are of service to the environment, services to people, service to community? And so I'm seeing less of a discussion around the making of money and much more around the purpose of money. That's a really great framing is around the purpose of money. I mean, obviously with business, money needs to be involved. So we're seeing some models of social enterprise, other forms of entrepreneurship. Have you got any comments around, I guess, the way we structure companies? Yeah, I think, you know, at the moment I'm seeing quite a few incubators that almost assume, say, social impact or, you know, B corp. So they're creating the form first. And I'd really like to invite people to think much more about what are you trying to achieve and then the form should follow the purpose. And so sometimes it will be a social enterprise. But social enterprise doesn't mean let's make a bucketload of money and then do good with it. What it should be is let's live the solutions we're looking for. And so we use the money that the business makes. But the way the business makes the money still needs to be ethical and solving those really deep problems we wanted to solve in the first place. Right. So it's about embedding impact first in the core of your business, I guess. I think so. And I think more and more we'll see that the businesses that are sustainable, and I mean, like survive will be impact businesses. And it's no longer appropriate for us to be starting any other kind of business. All right. Down in New Zealand here we've got a country of four and a half million people. We've got some amazing businesses, impact-orientated businesses here, but that's pretty limiting, I guess, with the amount of people we have here. Is there any more international cooperation in an increasingly globalised world? Yeah, I think we have to go. There's long been a joke that New Zealand, we have no capital and no customers, really. So no market, no capital. And that means New Zealand companies have to be born global. So right from the beginning, I think we're going to find, we've been thinking about trade, but it's way beyond trade. What we now need to be thinking about is our collaborators, our customers, our suppliers, the teams that we work with are global. And so, you know, I haven't really worked on anything in the last probably 15 years that didn't have a global team from day one. And so that means we have to be really, really good at collaboration. And I think for a small economy, if we want to live in New Zealand, which I do, then our number one skill has to be collaboration. Right. And do you see that international entrepreneurs are looking towards New Zealand? What have we got to offer? I think we have a whole lot to offer. I think amongst other things, there's the collaboration side. And sometimes New Zealanders can be a little individualistic, but compared to most of the world, we are actually a collective kind of culture. You know, we know we're in it together and we support team sport. You know, we like to play with others. And so I see New Zealand, people look to us for diversity. We're really good at diversity. I know we criticize ourselves for it, but compared to most of the rest of the world, we're actually leading lights, sadly. I think New Zealand, so we bring diversity to the table. We bring a can do attitude, which everyone knows. That lack of capital constrains us in a good way, I think, because it makes us inventive. So I think we have a lot to offer the world. You know, I was joking earlier before we did the film that we're the Scandies of the South. And what I mean by that is, you know, we're very similar to those Scandinavian countries where we're egalitarian. Men and women can be friends in New Zealand, you know, and that shouldn't be a revelation. But in many cultures, men and women are not friends. They can know each other or they can have a romantic relationship. But true friendship is deeply embedded in New Zealand culture between men and women without the romantic or sexual connotations. And I think that enables us to open a lot of potential. We are fundamentally against inequality, even if we are an unequal country. We have a sense of fairness that means we want to solve these issues probably much more than cultures that are just about individuals getting ahead or individuals with a meritocracy. So sometimes those cultural differences between New Zealand and the US can seem quite vast. And other days they don't seem very big at all. It sounds like we've got a pretty good grounding place to launch off from then. I think we have a great grounding place, but there are some big things we need to do. And if I could waver one, one I would get proper internet, you know. Even when the new fibre comes to my house, I'm still going to have slower internet than I can get on a mobile phone in the English Channel, you know, on a train, right? So we need internet if we're going to be globally able to export our ideas and not just our milk, right? So one, two is we need to be educating our children for a global economy and that means multilingual. And we still have a lot of New Zealand kids who only speak one language and we have to speak at least two Maori and English and then a third one, some international language. Three, we suddenly have this focus on STEM, but if we don't train our kids in the arts and if we don't train them in social sciences as well, our science is meaningless to us. So we have a few of these things that we're going to have to address if we really want to compete long-term and be part of the conversation long-term. Fantastic. Thanks so much for talking to me there.