 You know actually I'm very excited to be here. I had broken my arm was out bicycling with my cockapoo on July 6th and Had thought I was going to have to I cancel coming An agreement with my spouse was that she would decide on this last Monday if I was fit to travel Unfortunately for me and for you guys. She said yes, you're good to go. So here I am So here are my disclosures. I do clinical research I have grant funding from direct MS charity. It's a group out of Canada That it believes there's a link between nutrition and MS a DJO incorporated which makes Electrical therapy devices clinical life Which is a supplement company tz. Press, which is a publication company I own the copyrights to my book mining my mitochondria and I do have some more copies I know I sold out of them last night. So we could talk about that afterwards at lectures I have trademarks to the walls diet the walls protocol. I have a patent pending on the therapeutic garment That we use for electrical therapy And they have equity interest in a number of companies that are trying to advance these Concepts commercially and I have a medical license which I have to protect So the food and drug administration does not come after me. So I always make this disclaimer In those of you in clinical practice, we're going to advocate for non USDA approved diets. I advise you to make these disclaimers as well The FDA has not evaluated any of the claims or statements made in this presentation on my website in my books or by me Nor are these statements and claims intended to diagnose treat cure or prevent any disease Only FDA approved drug diet and devices can legally make such claims. This is all about education The walls diet recommends nine or more servings of vegetables and fruit per day Which is more than what the American Dietetics Association recommends and there's quite a few more recommendations that I have that you'll hear about This is Thomas Edison said this a hundred years ago that the doctor the future will give no medicine But will interest her or his patient in the care of the human frame and a proper diet and the cause and prevention of disease And sad to say that is not what is happening Physicians like myself were very much in love with drugs diets and devices and we know very little about nutrition And we know very little about how to create health If we go back further to a Chinese proverb that was the superior doctors prevent disease mediocre doctors treat impending disease and The inferior doctor treats actual disease Now by that standard u.s. Medicine is really inferior and most of my medical career I was inferior and very occasionally mediocre Never did I teach my patients how to achieve real health? And I was exactly that kind of position till I became ill Having secondary progressive ms get becoming profoundly disabled was the most profound gift. I've ever received So I was diagnosed with relapsing remitting ms in 2001 I began stumbling I was actually quite relieved because I'd been having to decrease my Workouts and my Nordic track steadily. So it's like okay. So I'm not a slug after all In 2002 I discovered Lauren Cordain and went paleo Get rid of the gluten get rid of the dairy get rid of the grain And I still decline in 2003. I needed my sort of client wheelchair by 2007 I was so disabled. I could not sit in a standard chair like this I needed to be in a recliner or in bed and I could walk only short distances with two canes You know being an academic doc I went out and got the best care possible I went to one of the best ms centers in the country for a second opinion the Mellon Center Which is that Cleveland Clinic? I took the latest newest drugs. I Took when I got into the wheelchair I was told to take chemotherapy in the form of novantrone, which I took and then I took tizabri And then when that was pulled from the market, I switched to cell set. So I was taking disease modifying drugs At that time I was apparent to me that the best medicine wasn't stopping the trajectory And I would likely become bedridden by my disease I had two young kids. I was the primary breadwinner And felt like if I'm gonna I need to do everything that I possibly can Which meant I needed to start reading and so at night when I got home from work I would log on to pubmed.gov and I started reading In the midst of brain fog and of course, you know the half-life of medical cares Five years, you know It turns over 50% we think in five to ten years So all these basic science concepts many of them were new I'd never heard of where I'd fallen asleep through them So there was a whole lot of learning for me And some of the things that I saw I was looking for the brain models of diseases in which the brains shrink Because with the MS your brain and spinal cord shrinks over time I was reading about the animal models of Parkinson's disease Huntington's disease Alzheimer's dementia and Lou Gehrig's disease because in all those things the brains were shrinking And I saw that the mitochondria were not working very well leading to early Signals for apoptosis or death of the brain cell And with more reading I found articles that had protected little mice brains and the mitochondria And that they had to survive longer in all those various animal models So I started adding a variety of vitamins and supplements and the speed of my decline slowed I was very grateful, but I was still declining In 2007 I discovered an organization called the Institute for Functional Medicine and for those physicians and healthcare providers were here I strongly urge you to check out this organization. I think you'd find a lot of Use in that organization. They had a course called neuro protection a functional medicine approach for common and uncommon neurological syndromes I Took that course learned a lot deep in my understanding. I'm going to summarize Now very quickly what I learned in my own reading and through the functional medicine folks to help you understand What I began to create Okay first thing MS and most of the diseases of Modern civilization are related to our diet and our environment Walter Willett Big honcho here. I believe at Harvard wrote in science a top journal Balancing lifestyle and genomics research for disease prevention He says we've been able to identify modifiable behavioral factors including specific aspects of diet overweight inactivity and Smoking that account for over 70% of stroke and colon cancer Over 80% of heart disease and 90% of adult onset diabetes and there's another article that looked at the risk of Multiple sclerosis that if you have a sibling your risk is 5% a parent your risk is 3% If you have two parents your risk is 30% Always it's the environmental factors that are the most important driver So that gives me great hope that there are things under my control that I could do something about We know or actually I should tell you guys We think the problem with MS is that my immune cells are really screwed up and they are attacking the myelin Which is the fatty insulation on the wiring between my brain cells and between the cells of my spinal cord? That damage leads to a breakdown the communication which leads to sensory problems Problems with muscle coordination and strength In addition there's some interesting literature that says the blood's too thick when you have MS as compared to the other folks And of course lots of information that says there's too many inappropriate inflammation molecules in the bloodstream and in the brain and These are just some of those references for that What we also know is the blood you eat has a big impact on the viscosity or the thickness of your blood and The number of inflammation molecules now in medical school. I had to memorize countless reactions involving my mitochondria What I didn't learn and wasn't taught or what substrates my cells could make and What substrates I had to eat for those reactions to happen properly? Here's the the quick version. It's B vitamins a lot of minerals a particular sulfur and a bunch of antioxidants So myelin is what's being attacked By your immune cells and being destroyed leading to problems with MS And your brain is continually trying to repair that myelin to repair the myelin you need a lot of these things Vitamin B1, which is thiamine B9, which is folate B12, which is cobalamin Omega-3 fatty acids in particular to coca hexanoic acid and iodine and this is from the article Boer And we just talking about old brains Now you also need to activate the next brain cell in the line of the communication In your brain in your spinal cord and on out to the periphery to do that. You need a rich supply of amino acids Sulfur and vitamin B6, which is pyridoxine This is a terrific article, which I didn't have at the time that I was creating my diet But we have it when we created our study diet It looks at the nutrient biomarker patterns. That's blood levels of all sorts of nutrients How will you think and the size of your brain in old farts the mean age? Well, I believe was 87 Okay, and people had to be relatively healthy to be in the study What they saw is and this is no surprise the more vitamins minerals essential fats and antioxidants in your bloodstream The better you could think and the more brain tissue you had They also measured some anti nutrients hydrogenated fats Which by the way, you can make in your own frying pan if you heat up vegetable oils And if you have a higher trans fat level in your blood your stupider That is you perform less well on those thinking tests and your brain is smaller So between the Bowman article and the bore articles the 31 vitamins minerals fatty acids and antioxidants That I knew that my brain needed In my mitochondria needed so I had a long list of supplements. I am still going downhill, but I'm going downhill much more slowly and then When you think of that list of 31 and you look at the NHANES data and dr. Cordain at Dennis nicely What you're able to see is in study after study shows this Americans we eat so poorly half of us are missing our B vitamins vitamin C vitamin a two-thirds I'm missing our minerals magnesium calcium zinc iodine and 80% are missing the omega-3 fats So we're setting our brains up to be more stupid and smaller And by the way, we're trying to really accelerate that for our children And that's because this is the stuff that we eat a lot of processed food White sugar white flour high fructose corn syrup and trans fats and that's why one in three kids born today or what be Severely obese diabetic as children or young adults or one in two if you're African-American And of course this group knows that's not How humans evolved we spent two and a half million years as foragers Eating leaves roots berries meat fish a lot of it hard tough chewy and we had to work pretty damn hard for our food And in study after study that has looked at the hunter-gatherers They have a very very diet That each society had learned how to identify which plants you eat Which animals you eat which parts the animals you eat which parts you don't eat What's poisonous? What's good for you? And they knew how to optimize the health of their clan now of course and Of course the other thing that I'm humbled by Is that these ancients knew far more about eating for maximum health than we physicians? the Ancestral diets have more nutrition per calorie than the American Heart Association diet the American Diabetes Association diet the my pyramid diet Or the my healthy plate diet? so I Need to set set you up for this in 2002. I'm paleo. There's no grain no legumes. No dairy I'm still going downhill. I'm adding supplements the speed of my downhill decline has slowed in the summer of 2007 I Start a Very comprehensive intervention. I'll tell you more about that when I explain the research in one of those interventions was I Took that list of 31 nutrients Looked at the diet and said you know I'm going to use what I learned from my reading of the basic science From functional medicine to design a diet that gives me those 31 nutrients using the paleo principles so what we What I created is what follows and you think of a big manly dinner plate This is not a salad plate. This is a big manly dinner plate when you heap it all up. You can't see the bottom That's three cups And so I start with greens Because I want a rich supply of B vitamins vitamins a c and k in particular And a great source of minerals Some of the things that all those good nutrients do for you We have studies that show us adding beets That's the beetroot and the beet green greens and berries protect blood vessels the endothelial cells That line the blood vessels are much healthier And perform more effectively when you add these items to the diet Some great studies that have come out that vitamin K particularly K2 Which is what your gut bacteria will do assuming you have the correct mix If you're eating a lot of greens, I'll make something called vitamin K2 mk7 and That's very important in blood vessel health the health of your heart valves your bones and making myelin Some very interesting studies that vitamin K2 lowers the risk of Little mice getting the animal model of MS known as experimental autoimmune encephalitis It also by the way lowers the risk of cataracts and mercury generations, which is a leading cause of blindness Cabbage family onion family sulfur vegetables Mushrooms asparagus so a plate full of other non-starchy vegetables rich in sulfur. These are things that give you bad gas And have the guys wanting to light their farts At college dorm parties Okay, so what's good about this food again? This helps improve blood fluidity and the endothelial function of your blood vessels More articles for the same Colors are rich in flavonoids flavono flavanols polyphenols antioxidants. You can get them from vegetables Or you can get them from berries And to be colored in my world you have to be colored all the way through apples, pears, bananas are not colored and they are not part of my dietary scheme here When you have intense color more antioxidants, it's great for your mitochondria The great studies showing this improves cognition. It's important for retinal health and it's an important part of The processing and elimination of toxins You guys all know that we need DHA, which is an omega-3 fat that Dekosa hexanoic acid so we could have a big brain It's also very important in the mid-face development So you have a nice broad dental arch straight teeth You get this in wild fish wild shellfish into a lesser degree in grass-fed meat raw When you cook it you do lose it So grass-fed meat of course has more omega-3 fatty acids, but you want to have it raw the more you cook it the more you lose organ meats our produce ancestors Knew that organ meats were a critical part of the diet I think about a third of their protein calories would come from organ meats heart lungs liver kidneys pancreas They ate it all they would even chew up the Small intestine they having sort of a game of chewing it up at both ends and seeing who could race meat in the middle I think that was only the small bowel though. I don't think that was the large bowel Okay So Here's a Here is a comparison of some of the nutrients that you get in a hundred grams of an apple broccoli or liver and It's no surprise that the broccoli has a lot more Vitamins and minerals than the apple because the apples sugary sweet has a more carbohydrates in it and Sort of in general you go up by a factor of 10 and then when you go to the liver In general you go up by a factor of 10 again You have a lot more of the fat soluble vitamins You have more of the B vitamins and you have a very Bioavailable source of minerals Magnesium zinc Calcium But you don't want to cook it too much the more you cook it the more you destroy those water soluble vitamins Our ancestors knew to travel or trade to get access to seaweed seaweed is a great source of iodine Now one billion of the world's inhabitants are deficient in their iodine and they've lost 15 IQ points as a result you need iodine to make myelin toxin Eliminate toxins heavy metals introduce your cancer risk Food allergies are hard to diagnose my daughter made this for me with dairy and gluten I shall conquer the world Lord Voldemort now He's the bad guy, okay Here's just a sample of some of the articles case reports about bad brain problems that got better when The person went on a gluten-free diet Problems with motor neuropathy psychiatric disorders autism Lou Gehrig's disease seizures Harry Potter the boy who ate kale Voldemort met his match JK Rowling's mother died of MS. I think she'd be very happy to have Harry defeat MS using herbology Okay, so here's my quick story 2007 Five years being paleo so recline wheelchair have to live in a zero gravity chair losing my keys losing my phone Having a detailed daily planner thinking that I'm going to be forced out of work here very soon That's when I reorganized my diet. I am using vitamin supplements massage meditation exercise Electrical stimulation my muscles. I have a comprehensive program that I've started Nine months later. I can bicycle 18 miles with my family The following year I do a trail ride in the Canadian Rockies I begin speaking to the public and in 2010 I have a clinical trial and I've got funding To start this trial we enroll people with secondary progressive MS in our second way We've now started enrolling people with primary progressive MS. We're using the walls diet We have a bunch of vitamins and supplements. I'm teaching folks to do self-massage meditation exercise neuromuscular electrical stim Now to get my study approved. We had to show the dieticians My diet was okay. So we did a 24-hour recall on my diet So we've got three days history for me. And what you see is I've got plenty of vitamins on board. I Don't meet the RDAs for vitamin D, but nobody expects us to get that from our food. We get that from sunlight. I Have plenty of minerals including calcium And we have plenty of fiber Okay Now I'm going to show you some of my pulmonary research data. Do not take photos of these slides. Okay So please no photos coming forward With us is our pulmonary data on the first wave that came through on the changes in the biomarkers No pictures Okay, thank you Okay, so Things that you want to go down see reactive protein. That's a marker of inflammation triglycerides a marker of the insulin sensitivity LDL Body mass index everybody loses weight Homocysteine an indicator that your brain's on fire because you can't Metabolize your B vitamins very well Things you want to go up high density lipo lipoprotein folate levels and B12 levels So the biomarkers were changing in the correct direction People did a short form 36 These are 36 questions that you can analyze with sub scales for a variety of Quality of life measures. This is general health and But you'll see is for some of these subjects They have a steady improvement because you want to get up to a hundred in terms of quality of life Subject 8 we had to withdraw from the study because she had such serious cognitive decline She was no longer competent and she was not able to implement our study in her vent interventions I'll tell you subject three Who came to us it took her I? Believe about 80 seconds to walk 25 feet at the end of 12 months. She was able to do that with About 22 seconds with her walker Subject 11 came to us needing a cane for short distances a walker for long distances She can now jog Yeah, I think we should applaud that this is fatigue severity scales and The seven questions that they answer in terms of how the fatigue Has impacted their life the people have the black star had clinical meaningful improvement fatigue the FDA Approved treatments for fatigue within provigal got FDA approval when they were able to show a point five Level of improvement our mean improvement was 1.9. There's no literature that comes close to this And so we had subjects 1 2 3 6 9 and 11 have clinic clinic clinically meaningful improvements in their fatigue Okay at this point We are now enrolling primary progressives and secretary progressives in the second wave And what we are doing? Is we're introducing the supplements at six months so we can see how important the supplements are in the study We have our two primary progressives that came in for their three-month follow-up, you know, and I was Sort of concerned adding primary progressives. They're not likely to improve It's much more difficult to show any improvements for them And of course we weren't giving them their supplements So I expected that hopefully they wouldn't get worse Well down there. I was wrong So subject 18 I came to us needing two canes to walk 25 feet When she came in for three months was able to walk 25 feet. No canes And let's see I think And let me talk a little bit about my primary care clinics The question is is this generalizable to other brain conditions other medical problems when we look at the basic science of Disease we see that for all of these conditions the mitochondria are not working very well And there's inappropriate inflammation in the bloodstream and in the cell tissues And those are mental health problems Like depression bipolar anxiety obsessive compulsive eating disorders dementia learning disability autism schizophrenia and of course MS In the medical problems of high blood pressure arthritis headache fatigue allergies asthma lung disease Athosclerosis heart disease diabetes And obesity the latest basic science research is identifying Athosclerosis as an autoimmune problem This kind of intervention is what I use in my clinics in my traumatic brain injury clinics, and I see remarkably positive results Yep cost more money to do this now in my clinics and in my Public classes I talked about the importance of growing your own food Bind food from your local farmer getting organic food This is the real health care policy changes that we need So back to the Chinese proverb For a long time. I was an inferior physician, but I think finally now I'm moving to the superior physician I'm teaching the public and my patients how to prevent disease and achieve optimal health and The doctor of the future will give no medicine But will interest her or his patient to the care of the human frame the proper diet and the cause and prevention of disease You guys are the doctors of the future. I salute you Okay now so It was my We have some Q&A. I try to get through all this so we'd have an opportunity to answer questions for you guys relaxing remitting MS having Good periods and so when you're doing testing, you don't know if the person is just going to spell But the fact that you're using secondary and primary progressives Do you think that that takes that piece out of that is exactly why our first that is secondary and primary progressives Nobody expects those people to have improved function now. We are doing a Our next study that actually I'm funding with the proceeds from my name. I'm out of kandria We'll be relapsing remitting and we'll have a weightless control Yes Go ahead Hello, get close. Yes So first of all, I feel like this is kind of a these are very minor questions in the grand scheme of what you're doing But since you put an emphasis on cooking and how or how it's prepared. I want to ask two questions one was on Sorry, one was on the form of k2 because I feel like I've heard both People talk about MK7 MK4 and I forget if it was on Chris Crescer's blog or someone else where they talked about the more active form like showing more Efficacy was the MK4 form and I didn't know if you had We don't have that data We're not measuring our vitamin K values. So I don't really know that People eat a lot of greens on our diet And we certainly shift their gut bacteria by ramping up the fiber It would be a I wish we had enough money to measure all those things And then my other question is when you talked about The cooking with water soluble vitamins now I thought it was just that you know, you might lose some of them But I've actually heard of people who will cook rice in The solution that they cook the vegetables in and then they reabsorb say like vitamin C into the rice So my question is are you actually degrading the vitamin C where it's not usable at all from the cooking or is it just seeping out? But if you eat that liquid or drink the liquid or I would say the answer is not really no Yes, yes, I was wondering will this approach do you believe work with everyone with MS or a certain subset of people with MS or is that I Expect that it won't work with many This is sort of the public health version for people who does not work I recommend a toxicology screening for looking for heavy metals looking for a stool analysis for what's growing in the stool are their Parasites yeast and then there's chronic infections such as Limes Chlamydia Bartonella Bibliosis, so it won't work for everyone I think people will benefit from a functional medicine of al but from a public health message Will this work for 80% 90% 95% that part? I don't know yet. Thank you. You're welcome How would you grade your own recovery in terms of return of capability and okay? So here are the things So in 2007 can't sit up. I can now jog around my backyard three laps I Can stand Before breaking my arm. I could easily stand for two hours giving lectures walk two miles Since breaking my arm I'm impressed that the metabolic energy it took to heal Set me back on my heels I'd have a hard time walking a mile now and I was not confident I could stand for the whole lecture Which is why I'm giving it sitting so I certainly have lost some ground having broken my bones. I Predictive that would take me ten years to recover. I've made pretty good recovery In the five years. I think there's a ways to go For example, I do my taekwondo warm-up kicks. I can do a side kick about six inches off the ground In pivot forward kick pivot back without falling So I'm making continual progress, but by no means am I cured if I when I'm traveling And I can't eat the way that I like to eat that becomes a problem for me if I Get some sauces on my food get some gluten. I will have a flare of my face pain Which is like a electrical jolts of? Of pain that in a matter of hours can be so devastating. I'm not able to speak So that keeps me very very compliant on my diet It also means that when I travel, you know, I have a bag of sprouted nuts and a bag of liver jerky and Powdered algae so I I can maintain my diet more effectively while traveling Thank you And and I will say this is one of the easier places I've gone to because you guys actually feed feed me food that I can eat. So thank you Hi, it's Glenn Brooks from vibrant living. I Just wanted to see if you could comment more about the the raw meats like I do travel and I see this They have grass-fed meats. Yeah, Trader Joe's. I was wanting to be a comment about eating it eating the so Disturbing around eating raw So raw meat The advantage to having your meat raw you're going to have more of the vitamins the minerals intact And the meat will begin to auto digest in your stomach You'll need fewer enzymes from your pancreas to digest that food The hazard of eating your meat raw is the public health hazard of Parasites and bacterial infections because of our conventional farming That now becomes a much higher risk Proposition if you can buy your meat from farmers that you know, you know the health of the animal You're decreasing the risk somewhat if you have the meat in a deep freeze For at least 14 days you're going to decrease the risk of parasites But there are certainly public health concerns eating enzymes with your food is another way of dealing with those issues I Buy my meat from directly from the farmer. I would be nervous about getting meat commercially and eating it raw Any other tips about traveling and your food? I've learned the hard way to bring a lot of food with me Yes You put a lot of emphasis on supplements Can you go into more details with supplements you use and how which supplements are important especially for the pain you mentioned pain for the face? so I Have a long list of supplements. I talked about them in the book We have a lengthy list What we have done in the second wave is people who have a high homocysteine We put them on methylfolate methyl B12 and a B complex And then we add sulfur amino acids and the cosa hexanoic acid and a variety of other things after that Thank you, you're welcome any of them particularly important for pain or The most important thing for pain is following the diet to the letter. That is absolutely the most important You're welcome. I was wondering you mentioned Omega-3 fatty acids. Yes when you talk about mitochondria to me medium chain triglycerides always come up as a good energy source Yes, you know mitochondrally healthy So do you consider that an important part of your diet or any other fatty acids that you particularly focus on so people lose weight Everybody loses weight on our diet when they lose weight and they get into a Body mass index that's too low. We have them ramp up medium chain triglycerides adding coconut oil and I have them take sprouted walnuts raisins and coconut oil and Make a add some cocoa and cinnamon and make a coconut oil fudge and we feed that two of them add limb I also asked him to eat more liver and more organ meat during that time It's part of weight gain because It was not what I did originally It's in our next study We will be using medium chain triglycerides, you know, it's it's really quite remarkable that I got the institutional review board to approve my study Because it's so comprehensive so complex And the whole reason why the IRB approved is I'm a member of the IRB they saw me get in the wheelchair They saw me look like shit and then they saw me suddenly walking, you know riding my bike and so when I And they were interested in having me do this study the pharmacy Therapeutics Committee said no, it's no safety data. We can't approve this So then I rewrote my study without the supplements The IRB disapproved that study. I was really upset But then they called me and called in the head of pharmacy and said you work it out We want to approve the study. She needs to do it exactly the way she did with all of her supplements You tell her what safety lab she needs and who to exclude so that's how we got into the study now our next day We will stress coconut oil more. Thank you very much. I think you're talking what you've done is fantastic. Thank you Dr. Wells over on the side I've been doing a lot of reading lately about the similarities of MS and chronic fatigue syndrome and fibromyalgia Yes, kind of my area of expertise because I've dealt with it for over 15 years And the more I read the more it seems like a very vicious cycle with cytokines and All these terrible things going on in the mitochondria basically destroying them And it seems like eating and supplementation It's pretty difficult to break that vicious cycle in some cases and from my experience I still deal with the symptoms and like you said you're still progressing, but just at a slower rate My main question would be Exercise Based on what I read it seems like exercise is a terrible idea given the state of our mitochondria I just wondered what you thought about that Exercise we zine exercise program for everyone in our study based on where they're at and we progress that It's easier to do when we add the electrical stimulation of the muscles I think exercise is an important part of recovery But it has to be paced very carefully to the individual if you go too fast you lose ground quickly Can you describe the electrical muscle simulation? I'm also I'll talk with you about that outside. Okay. It's an honor to hear you talk Thank you so much to part question One is with supplementation there's a lot of controversy on Versus Work with Comparing the two and if that makes a difference and the second part is the diet that you've said is Synoptim of is similar to a lot of the anti-inflammatory diets. Yes. Yes or irritable bowel syndrome Which then increases bioavailability and so I wonder if over time I guess that second part is is that does the diet require supplementation or over time? Do you find that you can actually lean off them because you're getting more from the diet as you decrease inflammation? These are great questions. We don't know. I do know Be sort of cheap I was running out of my supplements I go to them online is gonna miss them for a couple days and so I thought no big deal My face pain turned on Horrifically ended up in the ER with uncontrollable pain. It was miserable And then and I'm stupid enough. I let that happen a second time Well, I'm not so stupid to do it a third time So I I am very very slow about making any supplement change. That is why In our second wave, we are starting the supplements at six months so I can get a better sense of how important the supplements are And that's part partly why I was so surprised that our primary progressives were better. I thought wow That's pretty exciting. So you will publish the work on supplement versus non-supplement So I plan on writing and publishing all this stuff That's why I want you guys to take pictures for me Now I'm writing submitting grants and the neurologist to review my stuff say it's very clear Dr. Walls that does not understand the path of physiology of MS And so I think there's gonna be some very high barriers For publication because people accuse me of clicking the date and all sorts of terrible stuff But we will try my research assistants writing this up and our goal was to have Wave one submitted by the end of August Probably the journal of complementary alternative op time is up. Sorry Okay, thank you all