 Ladies and gentlemen, good afternoon and welcome to the last panel of screen age Last because probably this is the biggest panel with seven panelists. All who love the sound of their own voice myself included I think it's going to take us about 40 minutes to get through just introducing who's here So I'll save everyone some time meet said that said that said that said that and severe No, I'm just kidding. We've got a bunch of sedats here and just to make it more exciting They put the bald guys on either side. So let's have some fun We'll try and make it not confusing with too many sedats. Of course, we have the pretty lady right in the center So I'm Keith. We're gonna kick off today, but because before we kick off with you today, I'm Keith. Of course We're here to talk about video Yes, we're in a post-covid world. Yes, content consumption has gone through the roof. Yes OTT platforms are recording groundbreaking numbers. We know all of this. We're gonna talk about all of this in detail We're gonna talk about the role that different platforms play we're gonna talk about the role of the creator and We're also gonna talk about the role of 5g in video Although Dolly we were paying attention to your presentation and we did realize that you say that 5g isn't really gonna change the Landscape and video too much. So I guess the panel is done. Thank you ladies and gentlemen No, I'm just kidding. Okay, cool. So let's get this show on the road Panelists, thanks so much for taking time out today and joining us and sharing your insights with the screen age group That's gathered here today so of course, you know In this post-covid world in this mobile penetrated world Content consumption has taken new dynamic in new paradigm and having said that we're gonna try and debunk a few myths over here breakdown a few Facts about how the content landscape is evolving given mobile phone penetration given the fact that OTT is reaching new heights Now, let's start by trying to understand. Ankita. We're gonna start with you as the only woman on our panel We're gonna start with you. Let's start by trying to understand why video has taken off so rapidly and aggressively as Opposed to other forms of content other mediums, etc That haven't necessarily seen this kind of exponential growth over the last few years What is it that has really thrown fuel on the video fire? Cool. So Siddharth Siddhant. Sorry sit number three Let's call him sit three. Let's do sit one sit two sit three Okay, so sit three, you know, of course We've seen the advent of so many new video platforms also pop up specifically during covert where every second person with a smartphone In the hand has become a creator as well now with the advent of short-form content content consumption patterns have also completely changed Right. How do you see brands or creators being able to harness this strategy to create video ecosystems that pan to a variety of audiences across platforms? Firstly, thanks for having me here guys. So I think that's a damn good question And because we currently seeing an explosion, right? Anyone like you said anyone with a smartphone is essentially a creator and that's The smartphone is basically a moving studio. I think for brands It's important to firstly understand that you know each platform exists for a certain reason within their within their category And if your audience is there you better be present over there, right? And especially I think a very important point is to ensure that you know You don't have a singular message or a singular format running across every platform, right? Each platform for your category has a certain nuance with play within that nuance address address the kind of you know Metrics that work over there and I think it's also important for brands to perhaps let lose a little bit Let it let rely on the creator to take your brand forward, right? I think creators do quite well when they're given that freedom to express themselves, right? And take a little bit of ownership away from the brand saying, you know Let me also define what you could be on this platform, right? And if brands are able to live with that courage saying, you know, let me rely on this guy You know, he has he or she has amazing creativity and let them figure out, you know what my brand can be over there So let make them part of your content strategy rather than you know Just working with them and telling them that please speak about my brand or speak about the you know My features this is I think what is perhaps very very important You have to be active on those platforms And you have to rely on those creators on that on those platforms to take your brand message forward and not the dictate terms to them Interesting. So you spoke about the authenticity of the tone of voice You spoke about the brand's openness to let creators be co-creators of the brand and help define their narrative and help define their landscape Let's hear from one of the brand guys actually sit one You know, you're a brand guy and you've been on the brand side for a while You guys have been championing video at TVS and of course worked with a number of creators Why don't you talk about your experience in terms of how creators are able to retain the ethos of the brand and still do justice to the various Different platforms that they specialize on while distributing to their audiences Which has a variety of stakeholders We have learned we have learned that we really really need to look at video content at Multiple levels and define the objective very clearly. There are certain video content which we create purely with the Need to build our brand presence and brand awareness Whereas there are a certain types of videos which we create which is very very clearly targeted at bottom of the funnel Sales-oriented activities the other one which we to maintain the brand essence and to maintain the Ecosystems respect for the brand what we have figured out is more than just talking about us We create content where our ecosystem is recognized and they believe that they are being talked about and our Ecosystem partners are influencing partners who could be our Mechanic partners or could be retailers. They become the champion and hero of the video and in this way We are able to actually I would say scale up our brand through our Stakeholders and not just us keeping on harping about what we do and how we do That was brilliant Sid you said so much you spoke about the role of video in the life cycle of the brand You spoke about the consumer journey You spoke about the video format to meet its specific goals and then you spoke about real world influencers for bookmarks on that On that one sit. I'm gonna stay on platform a little bit before I come to consumer Rupak Let's talk about a different kind of platform now You guys at bang bang have been medium agnostic and platform agnostic with a lot of the content that you guys have created Of course a lot of us in the video space started with TV and eventually evolved to digital and with digital We don't have the same restrictions that television would provide for us 10 seconds 20 seconds 30 seconds Even with digital now we started by doing editorial content then moved into branded content And now we've moved into OTT with brand integration coming into OTT content as well So why don't you share some of your experiences that the flexibility of digital has really given creators and brands alike? I think with Netflix turning on the tap of Advertising in India around the world and yet to do it in India But in general, I think that question perhaps Answering that question perhaps becomes a little less urgent, but it's urgent nonetheless, right? And I think the the particular thing and this goes back to the principles of branded entertainment and branded content as Was being spoken about initially right people come on to these platforms, especially if they're paying to be on these platforms They're going there because of the integrity of the content. So they're Their tolerance to put up with brand messaging goes down tremendously. However, people aren't averse to brand messaging They're only averse to irrelevant brand messaging and that we've proven time and time again If you've got a fabulous piece of branded content and by fabulous piece of branded content I mean one where you know, there's always a balance Branded entertainment. There's brand. There's entertainment and as long as you have the balance, you know tipped in favor of the entertainment Not just entertainment. I use that as a proxy for all kind of value that you can get out of it It could be entertainment. It could be education. It could be utility. It could be information Whatever it might be as long as they're getting that value exchange. Essentially, they're giving you their attention And you know for so that you are able to you know provide that brand message I Think that works fine And that's something that brands are training themselves to do better and better agency partners are training themselves to do But at the end of the day remember that you're competing not just with other brands You're competing with stranger things. You're competing with family man. You're competing with sacred games You're competing with everything, right? So that's something that has to be particularly kept in mind I think that you're just starting to see the beginning of it actually just scratching the surface There are brands who've done that quite well, but also remember, you know, everyone can't be Apple and Nike You know, and so brands need to know where they are what they're doing what their ability to do things is and so cut Cut your coat according to the cloth that you have as well And the ambition shouldn't get the better of you. I think that's very important And I think finally the last part of it is that, you know, often enough when you look at this stuff People often ask the question and I and I highlight this in particular because when suddenly the stakes are higher because you're competing With not just other brands, but all content that's available out there in the universe Then it's about the quality, right? And I think people often ask why can't we produce content of a certain quality in India when we're competing on let's say branded Entertainment forums or can't branded entertainment lines, whatever it might be It's not about the people often think it's about the budget and the money that we have It's not that right because there are brands who actually spend Disproportionate amounts of money or when it needs to be spent or have the ability to spend it The answer actually is time and that's the that's where we get caught off guard in India Is that we often don't have enough time and if we're able to do that That's very important in order to provide that quality output I actually want to circle back and debunk that myth because there are a lot of people who say look budget Kitna ham look content as I bring it and I want to come back to that because we're all on the Agency slash creator slash brand side who have this restriction and limitation, but are still able to work within our means So I want to come back there and Rubak You said something very interesting Which is a bookmark for the audience as well saying that effectively you need to be conscious of the fact that you are Comparing for share of time of that user that he's spending in front of that screen Whether it's his iPad or whether it's his cell phone or whether it's his connected TV in this case, right? Which is all trying to eventually reach an audience and the second bookmark I want to make for the audience over here is Netflix turning on the tap as far as advertising is concerned right that's a bunch of red flags and a bunch of green flags Depending on which side of the fence you're looking at this from and when it comes to advertising Let me now come back to Karthik. Thanks for being patient with me and ladies and gentlemen I promise you Karthik is hairs not turned white while waiting for his turn here It was white before we got on to the panel, but we will come to Advertising here Karthik, you know given the fact that you do come from group M And you got a wealth of experience there everyone's talking about you know segmented audiences and everyone's talking about the most Effective way to reach these audiences now platforms keep playing around with their algorithms And as a result the concept of organic reach is continuously challenged time and time again, right? Influencers themselves creators themselves struggle sometimes to keep up with this Algorithm to make sure that they can maintain their reach and be relevant to their audiences But having said that what is the boilerplate advice that you have in order to meet these goals of letting brands reach? Audiences organically without falling into the trap of asking media plan may budget. Kitna. Hey Algorithms will exist as long as we're around There's no point in in trying to commit and what you're trying now will be very different two years down the line I think the from a boilerplate perspective to me. That's very clear, right? I think whenever you know like like Rufal said we're all in rest three two three minutes We all decide when it's when we start a video, right? And at some point in time that content to resonate either we or because That we feel very strongly about or is it someone that we really like So for a brand to be able to demand that sort of a time investment from the audience You need to be on top of what is that big? Why am I going to resonate this? Why is the audience going to resonate with this and for that? I think it's very important to Understand different subcultures Getting something You need to understand is the audio okay? You need to understand how how what what what is working in gratitude if you're trying to create something on hip-hop You can understand what's what's working in it if you're trying to create something on Say sports you need to understand, you know, what is that subculture? How are people? Likely to enjoy it and then sort of go into the the ideation phase So to me decoding the subculture ahead of time is that boilerplate? So I think classic advertising one-on-one everything starts with the inside Understand your audience get the inside right double down on the inside and every the idea the messaging everything stems from there Sit to you said I said one you said something very interesting about the role of content I'm actually gonna loop sit three in into this conversation as well. I know it's really confusing to keep up Let's just call them sit so sit three. I'm gonna loop you into the conversation You come in from the publisher side right for publishers your balance sheet depends on the strength of your community, right? It's all about the size of your community for you And I want to talk about the role of content here because as far as community is concerned when you're a publisher yourself It's you're very conscious about how many audiences you're reaching how relevant these audiences are to recruit them into the community Because eventually you have a very different challenge from the rest of us We are trying to buy media for our brands. You are trying to sell media to our brands So you're looking at things from a very different lens altogether, right? So when we look at it as role of content top of funnel middle of funnel bottom of funnel We're very clear about what that content needs to do for the brand basis the life cycle of the journey You don't necessarily look at it the same way. Why don't you shed some light on that? So I believe the biggest challenge that we have faced is there's an audience But the audience attention span is very limited and one thing we need to understand that for anything to be popular unit mass Acceptability which essentially beat you as a medium grew thanks to tiktok. So tiktok is your what's your first? It's bad in India now was your first shot to fame, you know Suddenly you put a tiktok you get followers and you realize that you can become your own star in your locality Without visiting may be the wire for our t-series office for an audition so Like I was saying when we created content Action emotion as means of Content ingredient played a major role Secondly the challenge for us was with the short form increase Brands tell us a minute. They can eat though minute. They can eat the minute. They can eat the dropout rate Was so high because people are used to the short form content consumption beat on reels or tiktok or shachar, etc So how to map that audience and increase the audience attention span being Spend so that they go to that moment where the brand messaging is there is very very important Secondly, if you can use UGC content for integrations That really helps where we have done campaigns for brands where we have said Why don't you make a deal with a brand messaging and if it's cool enough we give it to the same jury who's maybe Agiticating a Netflix kind of a entry and if you have made a good reel on a creative wheel you get to win an award So that's how we have integrated some form of brand messaging, which is very very organic Thirdly, like I mentioned I'll take two minutes more that in the past we have had experiences where every brand consumption Pattern was different In YouTube we put up a talk show with a very popular TV celeb which got a lot of organic views But on Facebook it was not getting when we reached out to the Facebook guys and what's happening? They said why didn't you put subtitles in it? So we realized that on Facebook a lot of people were not listening to the video They were watching on it on YouTube. They were watching and listening together. So for us the internet audience the consumption audience is very fleeting and The feedback is instantaneous. You know if they like it they like it if they don't like it They can go to the comment section no matter what you do. There are multiple platforms where they come and say, you know Your crap then your business is gone So it's very important that when you think about content creation with the brand You should think of all the things that can go wrong when you put out that video If you think of all the good good things then it's not gonna happen You should tick box the good and also the feedback part which is absolutely negative and then create plans around it That was amazing said actually you said three very important things and three bookmarks there, right? I think this is the second time that we're reforming that content is about co-creation Whether it's co-creating your brand whether it's about co-creating your narrative which was amazing, right? The second thing you said is that the Indian audience is very fickle and I'm gonna come back to that because we can dissect that and slice and dice it You know very interestingly and have some fun with it and the third thing that I'm sure everyone has fun with on a Sunday afternoon Is scrolling through the comment section of sticky content? So I'm definitely gonna come back to that sit to I'm gonna tag you in right? Yeah, you're sit to I'm gonna I'm also gonna look at you when I call when I call you out. So, you know I contact and all anyway, so So sit to I'm gonna tag you in we're gonna talk about We're gonna come back to the comment section of sticky content, but what is sticky content? Let's talk about a few examples stuff that you've watched it could be editorial It could be branded what is sticky content stuff that's jumped off the page stuff that you said man I wish I made that piece of content So I love brands that can entertain me and tell us why sure yeah So I'm a big fan of brands that choose to entertain you frequently like if there's something that's every day or maybe weekly I'm not a big fan of brands that only wake up. Let's say once in a quarter do one campaign and they move on right And I think a good example of brands that do that well come from sports right because you know wild sports is very seasonal They may I mean let's say Rajasthan rolls is the brand that I want to talk about they may be very relevant during IPL Right, but outside of IPL. They also need you know reasons for someone to actually come back to them And the reason I like what they do is because you know, they're able to create a robust content calendar that goes beyond IPL And is able to perhaps also circumvent a lot of challenges that can come right They can you know, you may think that a sports team has access to players 24-7. That's absolutely not true Right and there will be a lot of lots of other challenges, you know based on whether your team performs doesn't perform So the way a sports team is perhaps able to you know, still trap you keep you hooked Irrespective of how well they're performing right because let's face it RR I don't think as you know one in a long time right But it is one of the most well-loved well-loved sports teams in the world right and the way They're able to do that right is through constant fan engagement is through ensuring that there is a very loyal base That will keep coming back to this page Irrespective of what happens on the ground Irrespective of who which player has said what or you know, whatever other news may be circulating I think they get it right every time and and there's there's a lot of learnings that you know Perhaps we can take from swords brands and apply on to other brands that are interested in sports And we've done that actually with brands like Aether Aether's one of our brands You know which recently partnered with Gujarat Titans There was so much that we learned from what we did on RR that we put into a partnership over there because we were able To perhaps use you know, you know if you have taken up a sponsorship you get certain entitlements Right, you'll get three hours with the player and those three hours with the player will perhaps go like that Right, and you've practically shot nothing so it's learnings from how they were able to use those three hours right that Made a lot of sensors because we got a lot of amazing funny scripted content featuring comedians Which otherwise would not have been possible So I love brands that can do that you know brands that are active throughout and don't just wake up on a certain day And I think RR Rajasthan Rajasthan is a good example of something on that and you guys Aether did a pretty cool metaverse experience as well for the IPL this year Yes, yes, yes. In fact, we have a lot of entries in the evening. I'm very excited We did that metaverse experience Karthik you see a lot of content as well sub a couple of examples from your end What kind of examples of content that's jumped off the page content that you said I wish I had made this piece of content and why We did actually make the piece of content for Mondeleev I think the one that we did for Diwali which Harukaan And again, it goes back to what I was saying earlier like what what really worked in that was At a mass scale if you're able to personalize Content like that, you know, because we used technologies like deep-fake. So So that that really really works I'm also a huge fan of you know internationally What brands like tide do which is take something that is on on television and make that an experience I like the you know, I'm talking about it. It's a tide ad Commercial if you haven't seen it, it's a great case study. So to make television an experience is really a challenge Isn't it otherwise it becomes this static thing that you watch once in a while And then we sort of move away from that to make that an experience to bring that to life on digital and even to on ground I thought that was that was fascinating I'm sure I'll think of more So two things to bookmark over there very interesting right you spoke about aided content aided content is AIDD content as an aided with artificial intelligence aided with machine learning We're going to come back to that and you spoke about cross-media content as well picking up a television asset and having fun with it on Digital this was a formula that we all had to do seven eight years ago When we didn't have budgets which we're going to come back to very quickly to decode budgets on digital But now of course if you have the ability and the flexibility to build differently for different mediums How do you retain that authenticity and that consistency across mediums? And that's a great bookmark Arctic seed one. I'm gonna I'm gonna come back to Karthik's first point He spoke about aided content. He spoke about using tools today There's Java is copy AI Rephrase bunch of stuff that gives you so much technology to create dynamic content Now I would imagine in a rich ecosystem like yours that creates immense opportunities to be able to dynamically Manufacture this content for a variety of different purposes coming back to what you spoke about I had bookmark real world influencers, and I know you guys have done some superb work Why don't you tell us about that? Yeah, so This is an example, which we had done using artificial intelligence and machine learning so Answering two things one is how without asking for a media plan. How do you organically make something? Actually create the impact and the other one is how do you actually? have actual real-world Impact creators as the influencer. So what we had actually done was we partnered with CSK as principle sponsors last year so what we got was we had a chance to actually record one of the superstars and We had a one-hour session with him where we actually created an avatar out of the superstar And then what we did was we were able to make customized ads for 30,000 of our Retail and mechanic partners customized for each one of them And we had done this in about four or five languages English Hindi Tamil Malayalam Bengali so we had done in a variety of languages So it became their own piece of ad and we were very clear So we did not endorse our brand or our product So most of a retailer are actually multi-brand multi-product retailers So it was an ad for them where the superstar Tells them that if you want these products you go to this person's shop So this actually at the bottom of the funnel helped us activate 20% of the inactive counters and also from the Retailers and the mechanic partners perspective. They felt very excited and happy about the whole thing so I think from a brand perspective and from a bottom of the funnel perspective I think it helped us a lot and we didn't spend a single buck on Media promotions. It just happened organically Lovely, I think this is the third time for the audience's bookmark Rupak brought up the first time sit two brought up sit three brought up the second time is said one We spoke about the role of programming, right? I think Rupak spent a lot of time on that and then sit three spoke about the Bollywood show that they made Which obviously had a few popular faces and now sit one spoke about the partnership with CSK Which obviously had a popular face as well and thanks for that sit You also spoke about without spending any money. You were on paid media. You were you were able to activate 20% of Unactivated offline channels and we're going to come back to metrics, right? But I'm gonna tag you into this conversation here because of course when you throw star power into a into a video It's gonna shine right you put CSK superstar and no prizes for guessing who that could have been and you put Bollywood actors You know sit three and you know, obviously these videos are gonna shine But when you don't have the flexibility of using these large-scale Celebrities and you need to be more nimble you need to be more agile you have to get faces or personalities that are closer to the ground that will appeal to people on a slightly more realistic basis right and I know that you guys do a lot of work with micro Nano on the ground that will create large-scale content Which may not necessarily be supplemented with technology as Sid one just spoke to us But supplemented with great audience connect Why don't you tell us some about some of the work that you're doing with micro nano to get this great audience connect and Wide distribution at the same time So I think at only we We always say that we help you find your Mr. India So that is not some celebrity that is not some influencer who's become a celebrity But it is that one influencer who's sitting in probably some a place in Kerala Which you might not even know off But when this person talks about your product your product will definitely get sold because of the factor of the Resonation so we did this one campaign called the Bama though and this was a campaign during Raksha Bandhan and we actually Broke the norms of actually gifting By gifting your fashion personal care. We rather focused on Gifting a DMAT account. We rather focused on gifting a course by you to me We rather focus on gifting a bank account SIP and these products which did not sell during Raksha Bandhan So 32% hike in their sales without any celebrities So we tapped around 500 micro influencers from various regions like Gujarat South Kerala and even up in East and these influences actually did the talking and they actually resonated with it Yes, why should we give something that is perishable? Let's give something that'll last long and something that the person will remember you for life Okay, I started investing because my brother gave me a DMAT account and that became a conversation starter Once you have a conversation starter between your families and you discuss that that is a campaign. I Generally resonate with you know, I want to sit down with a campaign and talk to my father about it You know, why don't we do that in our family? You know when you do that? I think that's a campaign idea I would want to resonate with rather than any superstar campaign and At only we have 2.5 lakh plus influencers and these all nano small micro influencers. We have housewives from Kerala We have a housewives from From Gujarat who make the vlogs but the kind of conversion the kind of loyalty that the audience has Even one subscribe unsubscribe to them is a big pain They actually come back to us and tell us that ma'am, you know, this content is not working Should we tell the brand and work on this content that will work out better for the brand also and audience will resonate as well So, yeah, I would always want to tell brand that it should be open to ideas because every content is different Every creator is different. You don't know what the creators audience is wanting to listen to and nobody not me Not you it's the creator who knows the audience best You know, you said that so matter of factly Ankita as if like everyone knows this but thank you for those valuable insights and What I really liked about what you said right now is that you know when you're trying to activate an audience in Kerala You're bringing micro influences from Kerala that people relate to and in all likelihood They are not the influencers from three and four years ago pre-pandemic was speaking English, right? If you bring influences from the south they're going to speak in regional languages And you see all languages right for Malayalam to Tamil having exploded in terms of their content creation abilities Creators gaining mass populace, you know on the various different platforms Karthik, can you throw some light on how regional content has now started overtaking this? Homogeneous old-world advertising English medium that we knew 15 years ago There are many examples For example, I don't know how many in the audience know the most listened to podcast today in the country is actually in a South Indian language and Some of the the engagement rates, you know that you're seeing there And it's not just South Southeast Marathi some of the creators and I could ever know this really well Some of the engagement that you see With a very small subgroup a small language a small Is the engagement percentage is just amazing In fact in regional content another thing that we're seeing is also that You know while engagement with brand handles or non-social media has come down You look at interest groups, right? You look at interest groups for like technology or cooking or home improvement Or beauty for that matter beauty is just through the group There a lot of the content is regional in nature and some of the engagements you see there is just So very clearly today, you know, these are bubbles sitting here in Bombay in Santa Cruz We really don't know about it. So it's important for for data to sort of show you the way in terms of what's going on And then sort of penetrate and infiltrate these communities You know, that's that's really interesting because you said how to as a category and how to is actually actually the second largest search term on on YouTube right for a fact and Rupa I know you guys have also now branched out into creating a lot of how to content explainer content small You know pieces of content that actually influence the consideration side on the buy side Where that's on commerce D2C so on and so forth. So can you talk about how these that's the small snackable content? That's called a plus content or how to content really impacts consideration in the buying cycle tremendously, I think my In my other company jack-in-the-box where we work with a lot of clients to Do various things in the digital space But in particular one of the areas of focus over the past three to four years has been on Ecom content specifically, right? So we work with Unilever for example to Create all the content for their specific Ecom pages on Amazon and other platforms for example and video in particular And the evolutionary curve of how this has been impacting the consumer journey and consumer decisions is The the evolution is tremendous over the past four or five years, especially, you know, you can see how You know little tweaks and as you all probably know Amazon doesn't give you specific Data on consumers obviously, but there is a fair amount of insights that you can glean from overall consumer behavior and and we feed that into what we do and make those specific iterative changes on a regular basis two videos for example and it's phenomenally interesting to see how one little tweak can have such a can make such a difference on buying let's say, I don't know Lipton green tea teabags for example just by changing one word or one sort of Change and you don't even realize it So it's really a great example of real-time understanding of feeding back into the loop and iterating from there Especially because these videos are not really high production or you know, sometimes they have a concept behind it Sometimes it's really functional and how to in that respect So it does work and it it actually has a direct impact on that last stage of the fund, which is the same Well, we're at time Sit to concluding remarks from you 5g is around the corner. We're here to talk about 5g today Gaming is going to go through the roof as a result streaming will go through the roof We spoke about hyper personalization around the corner. There's an advent of technology and automation That's going to penetrate this video to this video industry your thoughts concluding remarks on behalf of the entire panel I think the one thing that I'm excited most about 5g when it comes to video is gaming livestreams I'm a gamer myself, right and I don't think it's going to impact anything else as much as gaming because you know You do need a very very high bandwidth. Otherwise, you know, you're basically looking at pixels and The thing I love about gaming livestreams is that it's not just about the game anymore, right? Like people come with their own passion projects Someone may be taking an interview while playing chess someone may be talking about life or politics while playing a game like among us And if you're able to you I think what 5g will allow us to do is turn gaming Into a platform which is far bigger than just gaming and get more people into the mix, right? Because so far I think gaming, you know as a gamer I can tell you that you know We've been asked a lot of questions in a gamer You're you know, you're almost 14 now. Why are you still gaming, right? And there is that certain stigma, but I think with with stuff like this with live streams are coming really popular You would expect everyone to look at gaming as a much much bigger place, right? You have coffee with current where you're just having coffee and you're talking about life You can do the same over gaming and if I think if 5g can democratize that then nothing like it That's the one thing that I am very excited about looking forward to it Yeah, I can just add to that not as not as a non-gamer, but the parent of two gamers I actually see that and over through the pandemic my entire impression of that change And I think the killer app and the killer combination here is 5g with gaming engines that you have and that really change the game for Not just gaming everything around it That's all Well, thank you panelists. It's been a lovely 40 minutes. Thank you audience We hope we were able to shed some wisdom and entertain you in the process back to you