 Okay, it is six o'clock and it is June 6th. And the Spike Board meeting is called to order. General public comment is first. Actually, Chuck, you're... No, you are on the public comment. Okay. Yeah, I'm not as he did it. No, I thought we'd push it. Six o' five. Okay, got it. So hopefully you all saw the, you know, care reform as the part of the committee has, is making a recommendation that the town grant CD-Fibre of $50,000, which will unlock a $50,000 matching grant from Vermont Community Broadband Board. And it is a little bit time-sensitive. So then we are also doing surveys for the community and so forth for other ways we may recommend using our funds. The CD-Fibre one is time-sensitive to get that matching grant. So we are going ahead and taking that recommendation. I invited Sasha with the documents that will need to be finalized, consigned, and so forth. So really my ask is review the documents and in two weeks' time I'll make sure we're on the agenda for a financial vote as to, you know, whether we want to receive it out. So that will be next meeting at six o' five. Yes. Okay. What's the deadline for time? Let me say time-sensitive, so we know we're all working on it. So the deadline is when the funds run out for September 15th, whichever is sooner. Because BCVB put together a $1.5 million grant and if other towns capitalize on it first, then we don't get the amount we get. So the sooner the better. We have commitments from four towns already. The Little Sex has given us 100,000. The Lister has given us 50,000. The Waterbury has given us 53,000. And Kavett, I don't recall, you know, a big also. I have a question as far as the questioning procedure. Should we go through Sasha and then Sasha? Because we want the questions as part of the public record, I believe, right? Right. Send them to Sasha and Sasha will forward them on. Yeah. That would be the way we do it, yeah. Okay. Any other questions for Chuck? Well, that sounds good, yeah. In general? Yeah, it looks like a real plus. Do you want to know any questions about the application you go through? Okay. Absolutely, Chuck, is that a question? Chuck, is that a question? Yeah, well, not for Chuck, but for just public comment. Okay. I'd just like to thank the select board or other parties to be our for finally updating the VTrans map on the town website. It actually is a brand new version, 2022. And I'd just like to, it's very much appreciated finally seeing an updated map. Yeah, that would be good to we. And honestly, thank you for wanting that out. Yeah. I really did see that. I did try to search out on the map for over 10 years. Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, let's go, I'd appreciate that special shot. Thank you. Anything else? Very interesting. It has to do with Tom Martin overseeing the zoning administrator. And I brought some things to the current administration zoning administrator regarding a subdivision on Marshall Mountain Road that was subdivided into four parcels of land that never, ever went in front of the DRV. And that was a Comminsky property. And when talking to the zoning administrator Claire Rock and the leaders, she told me that Tom said not to look into it. And then there was another issue with George Wells' property upon Legal Trail 1. And he, again, never went in front of the DRV to get a zoning permit. And then. I'm going to address that one later on, because I've been looking into that myself by the bit with Denise. So I could talk about that a little bit further. Yeah, make sure, yeah. And then also, there's a new person who's looking to develop that Legal Trail 1, the end of Caw Hill Road, and then turn to Legal Trail 1. And that person also should hope would go in front of the DRV, like zoning regulations indicate. And also, George Wells got another permit this year from Claire Rock out on another piece of parcel or the same piece of parcel. And again, even if it's a garage, which up on Jones Brook, there was a person there that asked to build a garage at his camp. And he went in front of the DRV. He did all the new geologics and got approved for it. And just want to make sure that the procedures are followed through zoning. And again, Tom told Claire Rock to not look into those issues. So that's a little concern. That's it. Thank you. OK. Thanks for having us. So you'll be around all meeting, right? OK. Because we'll be talking about some of these things later. Good night, Chuck. Good night. Thanks for coming. It's one more of a project. So my understanding really is that there was going to be a site meeting on Wednesday. No, site meeting, he said he could do it on Thursday on the night. Oh, OK. I thought it was Wednesday. No, Wednesday would have to be Zoom, unless they change that. I think it could change back to Wednesday. John, we can verify that in the morning to be sure. I don't think Rain Deagle could make it on Thursday. So I think we could move back to Wednesday. OK. But I mean, I have written down this Wednesday. Yeah, because what I had was I got the email from Charlene and it said that Andre's could only do a site visit on the night. And if it had to be 8th, then it would be a Zoom meeting. And then we'd have a site visit later in the summer. So I think there was enough data that Andre is going to send two of his associates to the meeting. Andre won't be here Wednesday. He's going to send his associates. And Rain Deagle will be here. So all the parties will be here on Wednesday. I'll be there at 1 o'clock. OK. All right, that would be good. So at that time, we're going to discuss this project again. I think the question is on the agenda to hold off until 23 or not. My feeling is it's June now. And we would want that park lot done by the time school starts. And I don't see that. If we put it out to bid this week, we still wouldn't have bids till the end of the month. The contract signing, you've got six weeks to work. I don't think it's a good idea to try to get it done this year, even though we all would like to see it done. Yeah, perfect. But I'm not the only voice here. But I think that's going to be my recommendation. You've actually got to be in the biz by the end of the month. And knowing all the contractors are pretty busy right now and the pricing is way up, I just think that if we put out a bid now, we'll probably reject the bids and put it out for bid yet anyway. So I don't know if you want to take a vote as a select board on what to do or wait till he's meeting on Wednesday. I wish probably it depends on the rest of the board. Well, my only comment would be that we weren't happy to jump in and help at some point, but develop a timeline so that if we are going to put it off to 2023, that on September request for proposals will go out. And then the contractor has this money, days to bid it. And then we can decide by town meeting or some schedule. So the contract is signed and ready to go come April May. As I think the problem was we were on a timeline, a very detailed timeline, until Pam, D'Andrea left. Yes. CBRPC, and then it's going to fall apart. Brian Boyd has taken over, so I'm not saying that it was. No, I'm just saying that it's really too bad because this has been going on for a while, projects, quite a few years. It's a problem every spring with the water on school. Yeah. It's a problem with the fire plot because it's not paid, but I just don't know what else we can do at this point. Yeah. Live with it another year. Yeah. Yeah. OK. Anything else on that? So I guess we'll just verify that it would be a site meeting. It sounds like it's going to be a site meeting anyway, so yeah, probably good. Because I did email Brian too. Nicely stated, probably said the same thing. Yeah. OK. Any other questions on the storm on the private? And moving on. Next up is Ira Hatt. Not going to be. Yeah. Yeah, I got a letter from. Tom, from the board about how the my property had been taken away and given to someone else. And I wanted to know how that happened. And he sent me a thing here that says that they were given the deeds of the area and took one point. And from that, they put the rest of them in place. Right. I had been paying taxes on the same amount of property for almost 40 years, which it wasn't correct either. I really would like to know if the listers, if they, how they find these spots where somebody comes to check on. Right. I mean, they're not taking every map and every deed in the whole town and going through every one of them. And deciding whether they're right on the acreage that the tax map says. So I assume that there are concerns. There's either a survey, a piece of land bought or sold. Or a conflict that would draw them to an area where they would then start looking at that stuff. And I'd like to know what drew in there in the first place. Well, but again, it was CAI that did all the work. Right. Because listers are the ones. Now, the way it turned out that my neighbor was saying that my property was his, I was gone for 12 years from town here, taking care of my folks. And so I wasn't present. The land had been sold. I didn't even know who owned the land. But I knew that they were saying things because they'd said things to my neighbors and stuff that they owned my piece of land. I feel that somebody drew them into that area to do that. Now, at the same time, another neighbor of mine lost a piece of property also. Discubo, my neighbor that was given that property had been saying that it was his property right along. I want to know, and he gained that. And they also, the others all only lost a quarter of an acre, but he only had an acre in 7, 8.7. He lost a quarter of an acre. That little piece there, I don't know how that even falls into what they would be looking for. So I feel that the lister, one of them did all this. I feel that he had, or she had talked to Kim and brought what he had to say to the tax people. Everybody said, no, that didn't happen. So I want to know how these things did happen. I mean, at first I wanted to sue the town, right? I mean, they made me do a survey. I was forced into that, and then I'm feeling as though I'm being forced to get a lawyer to bring against the town. I don't feel that I want to do that any longer. I just want to know the truth of how it came to be. The only meeting that I had to go to was one for a reappraisal, right? So I went to that, and I said, well, I'm paying less than what I should, but that is a problem. Either way, it would seem to me it would be to the town also, but do you kind of get to drift to what I'm saying? No, I do. Pretty much the letter that you got from the board pretty much spelled out what we know. Well, so whether there was any conversation between the Listers and CII about... On the letter it says here, right? I mean, do you know what this letter says? Yes, I do. Okay, good. I was hoping you did. So essentially it was not given to the next part slower. He made an example out of 10 acres. And then said, so essentially it was not given to the next part slower. And I had said that my land was given up. So it's like he said, well, that didn't happen. Well, that did happen. They did give the land to the neighbor, and it gave him that acreage. And it says here, so essentially we didn't do that. I mean, so does that mean that he... Well, what does that mean? Well, it was not given to the next part slower, it was just simply missed. Due to lack of information, do you get it? Well, that's all we have. But I don't know what that has to do with anything that I had asked. I asked how this could happen. Right, right. And then maybe that was the wrong... Somebody wasn't doing that, doing their job. And all I can tell you is that I can't speak for what's happened in the past, but we've done away with listas. Well, that made me feel real good, because I had a bigger bitch than I do now. And I'm getting over it, and I need to get over it, because it's been bothering me for four years now. So, but I made disappointments. So, I talked to Cheryl earlier, and I felt much better about the whole thing. But I did make the point, and I wouldn't just leave you wondering where they have it. Here I am, and that's the question that I have. I want to know, really, if the listener had talked to Kent and then brought what he said to the tax people. And like I said, I don't have any intentions of suing the town anymore, but I want to know the truth. We don't know anymore than... So, we don't know the truth, any of us, right? And I don't know how to find it. Right, right. So, I guess that's all. But I didn't want to just leave you hanging. All right, have you spoken with Don Butson? I have not, but I'm probably going to make me do it. Because I'd like to know, and like I said, if this seems to me to go after the town, I mean, I live here. I'm going to fade part of it back. So, I guess that's all. And I thank you for listening to me, and y'all have a good day. Okay, thank you. Five. 2017. Yeah, it was a mess. Unbelievable mess. I mean, there were 200 acre parcels that got messed up. Well, hopefully we have a new zoning administrator. Karen, have a seat. Good, how about you? That's good. Nice to meet you all. Yeah, same here. It was introduced herself. Yeah, my name's Don White. Oh, yeah, yeah. All right. Don, how do you move? Right washer. All right. Call the streeter. And Tom Martin, the chair of the South Park, well, he's come down with COVID. Oh. And that's our fire chief, won't he? Well, these fire chiefs. And many others, they make the things off. Yeah. And I'm all control off. Oh, OK. We're all in house. Yeah. We're all in house. We're all in the bar. Yeah. No, no, no. Again, we're all good guy. So we've seen your resume. Very impressive. And I just want to just tell us about yourself. It's why you're interested in it. Sure. So I am originally from Malone, New York, a few hours northwest of here, on the Canadian border. I moved to Vermont a little over 20 years ago and have owned a home in St. Olden's. And then moved to Burlington. And then six years ago, moved to the valley, lived in Leedsfield. And then moved to Fasen and moved home there. My main background is scientific. I graduate with a biology degree, minor in ecology. Forgive me if I'm just repeating what's already on my resume and you've seen that. And I was in the laboratory field on doing microbiological and chemical analysis for 12 years. And then I switched over to coffee. I kind of fell in love with the beverage and started working in coffee labs and did some time at Curric Green Mountain. And then I'm currently working out of an laboratory in Hinesburg called Coffee Enterprises, which I am planning to leave in a couple of weeks, so that I can focus on my roasting business, which I started in 2017. I roast out of the, convert the loft of my garage to your roasting facility. And I supply through mountain and a couple of other places in the valley. And I'm looking to spend more time on that. That's the intention of leaving my Hinesburg position. And I am still needing to have some additional income to support my household. So I'm not, I'm looking to go down from working two full-time jobs and still have a part-time job. So this is kind of the sweet spot for where I'm at in my life. And my two to five year plan is to open a brick and mortar, hopefully in this area. But for now, I am opening a mobile operation and hopefully being something in the straighter. So my relative, my experience that relates to this position is that I'm currently the chair of the FACEN planning commission. I've been attending meetings for five years, shortly after I moved here. I just had an interest in participating mostly as civic duty, but also I think it's really important if you have an opinion about something that you're informed before you form that opinion. And then I joined the planning commission as a formal member two and a half years ago, and I was just elected chair in March. So also a relevant experience is that I have a lot of technical reading, writing, and editing experience, writing standard, operating procedures in the lab, atmosphere, conducting and going through auditing at state level, and lots of technical experience. Drafting LUR language, that's what we're currently doing. We're just finishing in the base in our LUR edits for this season, and hopefully putting those before the public in the next couple of months. That's what's going on. So with all that, you feel like you can do like 10 hours a week or whatever it is for the whole time. I'll be leaving my full-time job in this part, so yeah. No, as you said, the resume would be perfect, perfect. Not the time for this. I would work for us and work for you, but I mean, I also know the space in the book with those on the industry. They are, they're looking for 35 hours a week. Oh, they are. And that is beyond what I think we should be at. I didn't know if they could, you know, do both. That would be great if we, the town could find someone to do that. I think that is an extreme challenge to find someone that could do that. I have degrees in biology and biology college. Nice. So you're hired. So, Karen, one of the, probably the major problem right now is number one, our previous Soviet administrator issued permits that did not comply with something. And so going forward, that's kind of stuff. We need to have some, we need to have this done by the book. And at this point, the building permit is only signed by the, it's only administrator. There's no check by this left board on that. So I think I'm more than recommend to the board that at least for a while, that once you sign off before the permit is really issued, we need to have the age left board member sign off as well to make it a valid permit. Because it just, it just slipped me through the loops here. You know, there's a lot of permits that are pretty straightforward. But, and you don't know, once you get into the zoning position, you can see where mistakes have been made, some serious mistakes that I don't know how we're gonna fix yet, but we're gonna fix them. I hope. We need to get some checks and balances in there. It sounds like it. Not, it's not that we're taking away anything from any new or anybody else. I think it's important that somebody look at this stuff before it becomes a permit. We do the current curb cut, the site board signs off, the martin, the road board signs off, everybody signs off, but for some reason, a building permit gets validated on just one person signature. And is that something you think you'll change in your procedures as well? I think so. I think there's a way to do it, you know. Somehow we've got to do something. Yeah. It's especially the trial class. The trial class workbooks are a huge portion of this. So. Have you run into issues where permits were issued that should have gone through the DRB process, you know? Yeah, yeah. That's a big one, a big plan. We've got a building permit that doesn't have an address on it that signed off on, you know? Doesn't have that. It just says Cobb Hill Road, and it's signed, you know? It just goes on and on. It's sad, it got down to this point. It is what it is right now, but, you know, so I didn't even know if that's a valid permit. I wouldn't, and we could talk about this later, but I believe that that's not really a valid permit because it's not even in the owner's name. It's in the previous owner's name. Right, the owner that I was talking to, you know? Yeah, yeah, so there's several issues here. Well, just to address that, I am a huge proponent for the QC check, you know? Having been in the lab field all my life, we always have that checks and balances, everything. Someone does, another set of eyes has to review that before it goes out the door, before the report was out the door, before the proposal goes out the door, so I think that's great, and I'm always happy to be that second set of eyes also, so I have no problem with some of reviewing my work. I'm welcome that, absolutely. Okay, that's fine. Hey, John? Yeah, this is Dave Stapleton. How you doing? Hi, Karen. Good to see you again. So we talked to Karen last week, and I just wanted to make sure you realized she has some background in quality assurance and quality control, and so one thought I had was, if we do hire her, maybe we should have her help us come up with a quality control system for permits. That would be fine. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's fine. Yeah, I mean, anything to, anything as best as possible that we ever have. We need to go forward with some sort of quality control. Sure, and it doesn't have to be elaborate. It can be pretty simple and straightforward, but I think you're right, just having that process in place is... Karen, with all that said, I've got a question for you, so if you'd like to ask, I did see you first at the planning commission of LUPIO, and would you be able for meetings, like when DRB has a meeting, the planning committee has a meeting, the select board has a meeting for many evenings to be able to come to those meetings, if it's has to be with zoning regulations with the planning commission that's currently working on. Yes, the only thing I think might be tricky is because I'm the chair of the Planning Commission of Basin, and I do hope to retain that position. That might be a bit of an issue with scheduling, so we meet every second Monday of the month, so I don't know if that conflicts with any of this middle tier, but otherwise, yes, absolutely happy I'm kind of a meeting addict, actually, so if it helps me do my job better than them, yeah. And we have an idea of what we would like to pay because we also realize that we were underpaying our previous zoning administrative. Do you have any thoughts on anything that you would have to receive or anything like that? Well, the position I saw advertised on front porch forum, I think it's like $30 a nail, is that correct? Well, we hadn't actually nailed it down. That was a while ago. Oh yeah, that was a while ago, so. That can match many people. So what we were thinking was somewhere between 30 and 35, and so maybe if we started at 33 and then with a idea that like come four to six months, we'd review it and could pump it up to say 35. I do have some questions in my own response. Okay, sure. So the other, so essentially you said this advertisement that I saw on front porch forum was a little dated. Okay, so at that time, I think it was advertised as 10 to 12 hours a week on average. And I thought, well, how for a zoning administrator position that seems a little bit low on the low end of hours? Do you think that 10 to 12 hours a week average still makes sense? I think initially it'd definitely be more than that and it would drop off probably. And it's not, it's really hard to put any time number on that because some weeks it could be 20 hours. Sure, I see that. Other weeks, yeah, other weeks it'd be five or none. So yeah, that's why we said 10 to 12 on the average. Average, yeah. Okay, well that's insightful that you provide a minimum as well. Okay, because I do have some limits on the time as you know I have a lot, why not? So I'm just thinking like over 20 hours a week would be unmanageable for me. And if that's a conflict, then a make or break. Yeah. The day and change or so is good. Yeah, can I say something? Yeah, go ahead. I don't think that I've had a zoning person in here that's worked over 20 hours a week. Okay, that's good to know. Unless it was behind the scenes stuff. Like you make us answer, oh, something like that. Okay, and what is the expectation for time spent in the office versus remote work? Or if there's like, what's the temporary, what were they doing? She was here, at least, that is clear. Like 9.30 to, she'd stay and wrap things up by probably before one and then work remotely on Fridays. And if anything came in, I'd just scan it to her. Okay, how many days a week? She was just coming in on one day. So we were physically here, but working remote on Fridays. Yeah. Yeah, and then we're going to reach out to Claire and JV tomorrow. I wanted to see her this morning before chatting with them just to be clear, it was very long to help train somebody. Well, I, that's great to know. That is really great to know. And she's good, so I had to work with her with the planning operations side. Okay, do you have some other questions? Well, I was waiting to see if anyone else has questions too. Oh, is, is there a computer or phone supplied? Computer on that back wall? Okay. Desktop, no laptop? Just, yes. Okay. No, just desktop. Okay, is there any consideration for a laptop for remote work or what were people previously doing? That's a good question. Yeah. I think that's something that we could certainly talk about. Yeah, yeah, at that point. Not gonna seem unreasonable. Yeah. The way things are now, so much worse. How old is that computer? I think it might be one of the next ones to be updated. Okay. And then, do you have mostly electronic bio-organization or things more manual? Okay. Do you have a zoning software program that is used here or anybody to track? I think it's the NEMRIC. NEMRIC? Okay. Right there was NEMRIC, right? Can you hear me? Mm-hmm. I don't think you can. I think you might have put it around here. No, he's- He's frozen. He's frozen. He's frozen. Oh, I mean- What do you say, Aaron? You can hear us, David? Oh, you're asking me? Oh. No, I'm not. I didn't know you were talking to me. So, no, I don't know anything about it. Okay, I agree. I just want to talk to you guys for a little bit. Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's there, right? Sorry about it. I love it. Okay. That's all the questions out there. Okay. Now, you said that you would want to talk with Claire and JD more before you would accept it. Okay. But certainly, about the end of the week, I mean, assuming- Yeah, I'm sure I can get a hold of them pretty quickly. JB is really receptive. He was very excited that I was applying for the section. Yeah. JB has worked a lot for us. Yeah. Yeah, and he used to work as a board based in his role. Yeah. Well, since we don't meet for another two weeks, it would be good if we could get this moving. So I'm going to make the motion that we offer the auxiliary administrator job to Karen Souther. Souther? Okay, effective, I believe it's July 11th. It's a... Is that Claire? That's the release date I could start. Yeah, it's a Monday. It's a Monday. Okay. Yeah, it is a Monday. And yeah, so that's the motion. And then you just give us the answer in a second on that. Second. Any more discussion at $33 an hour with a review in six months. All right. Everybody okay with that? Okay. All in favor, stay high. All right. High. Are you opposed? Okay. Thank you. When we look forward to your response. Thank you. Thank you very much. So you're going to check with us. You're going to challenge those guys. Yeah, in the next couple of days. And I'll let you guys know by Friday. Good. Is that good? Good. All right. Have a nice rest of your evening. Okay, same to you. Thanks for coming in. Thanks, Jeff. Where's your, where's your, um, animal control officer? Yeah. You see, I left that one on the car and I must have missed it. All right. So what do you think? So I mean, the ordinance is pretty outdated. It is. So I, what I did is I went on BLCG's website, got, you know, their, their template version. Obviously made a few adjustments because they had some pretty outrageous numbers for the first second and third offense fines. I brought those down a little bit, but still moving into the 21st century with the, with the fines. And what this new ordinance would effectively help us do as well is if he shows to go through the state, we could get ordinance ticket books and then actually properly ticket people and then the state of Vermont judicial bureau would take care of whether or not the payment was received and further action needed on that. And that was the, the big driving factor that we've had a few people that are, you know, multiple offenders. And I think that it's a, it's a good ordinance to adopt in town. Stephanie, is there any way like a new resident comes to more town and they have a bad dog? Do you get any notice or are there any, there isn't any program that I've, I've heard of for that, which I'm sure that, you know, some places probably do have something like that, different counties in bigger states, but that's certainly something that would be good to know, but it's nothing that has been built up in Vermont. So what would be the next procedure process? Looking for the slack board to, I'm looking for the slack board to, you know, put their grace on. I believe that it has to go to public hearing for an ordinance change and then you guys can vote on it. But I certainly, you know, I sent the draft off to you guys in case there was a change it. You guys saw our thought needed to be made, but overall, you know, and I, I've proofread it a couple of times and it seemed to make sense to me. I'm just hoping that you guys will. Do the next step and we'll get a, you know, public meeting for it and get the change to happen. So it was, we got to figure out the ordinance procedure. Yeah, I think that you have to hold a public hearing. That just be at a slack board meeting type of thing? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's part of it. Yeah. Okay. And I was, that was basically it. I just wanted to get it moving forward to hopefully we'll have something to go off from. It's been quiet for a couple of weeks now. So we've only had one, one incident in the last two weeks. So it's been good. Oh, that is good. Yeah. I'd like to go a month without anything, but I just don't see it happening. And then it's a lot of repetition, same dogs. It'll be the same dogs often, but then you'll get an out of left field one where somebody's dog just got out of their kennel or something on a fluke and went down the road. But a lot of it is a one singular repeat offender. I was doing the count. I've gotten one of the dogs 18 times since I took over just over a year ago. How does the order feel about that? Doesn't, oh, I just looked away for a minute or oh, somebody's opening my door when I'm not home. I've heard every excuse, pretty sick of the excuses through y'all. Even with that current order, so isn't there a penalty for repeat offender? This is, there is. And so we were at almost $1,000 owed. Roy's Valley Animal Hospital didn't wanna take those animals anymore to see more of a place for animals that we don't know who the owner is. And I had no place to bring them. So I had to bring them back to the owner. The owner never paid. And then Tom Chinat, the constable and I, we tried working out with plan with him to build a kennel and get him under control. And that seemed to work for a while. And then this spring it started back up again. Is it one or two dogs? It's two, it was three. He knew we couldn't take care of three, so he got another one. And so it was just two dogs, but they still get out often enough that I know them by name and they know me by name. They bark at me every time and jump right in my truck. All money every time it never fails. So it's just, you know, I love dogs, but I don't love safe dogs over and over again. I'm just hoping we can get somewhere forward on it so that they find that they're a little bit more real if you know. They're good dogs. All just great, they're great dogs. But it's just, sooner or later, sooner or later, one's gonna get hit. Absolutely, that's nice to come up a couple times by people that have almost hit them in the road and stopped and grabbed them. But I feel like this is the next step forward. Just get the audience in that audience, and then talk to them when they say it. Get the ordinance ticket book, because then once you issue an ordinance ticket, it goes just like if you would be to get a speeding ticket to the traditional bureau, and then they take care of making sure they get the pain. If it doesn't, then they can, that's when things can start being levied or garbage wagers or things like that. I think that'll help get it real to the people who are gonna repeat offender. I mean, that one time, that one person has a lost dog is kind of what it is. Things do happen. We've all, I feel like, had a dog, get away and lost one for a short time. But it's the repeat offenders that I think are gonna make problems. Yeah. Okay, yeah. So I would say, Sasha, just get, see if Tom has any input. But we should get on as soon as possible and have the hearing scheduled as soon as we can. Very good. Thank you. Thanks, Devin. Good for you. Dick is due at seven. And Martin's already here. But let's just go on to report some communications and then we'll go as soon as Dick is here. We'll deal with that. So, Ray, start with you. Well, I wanted to put off the class four stuff. We'll talk about that in an old business. Yeah, that's fine, yep. So as you've heard earlier, the RAF committee met last week and has recommended, is working on several things. But right now, they recommended to the Slack board that we go for it with the CB500, $50,000. The rest of the items are still being discussed and will be discussed probably for a while. One of the things that I did add and I was going to tell Martin that, we talked about updating, getting more gravel surfacing done, but we also talked about possibly getting some signs with the flashing indicator on it, the speed indicator on it. Maybe get some of those signs, which are not cheap, they're $5,000 a piece as well. And maybe look at some of our guardrails and see if there's areas that we need guardrail that we can somehow get covered under the RAF money. But yeah, those are some of the things. We talked about the sewer, the municipal sewer. Right now, the committee is going to, the sewer committee is going to interview the two engineers, Otter Creek and Du Bois and King, I think for the last week of the month. And after that interview, they'll recommend to the board of which engineer can go for it with on that. Yeah, that's probably the whole class one thing, which is a whole new technology. Yeah, okay. All right, anything else? Decided on that? That's it. Okay. Okay, nothing. Okay, got it. No, I guess I'll just, I'll be in new business or old business with some stuff. Okay, all right. And the thing I have is, I did get an email from Deborah Carroll and regarding this new, the new law, S-281. And the main reason she was submitting that to me was because of the issues we have, the tick count, and that is going to be discussing with us. And then also, what's also interesting there, that Tom and I are really excited about, is that it sounds like you can put traffic coming devices on our roads. So that would really be good too. But we can talk more about that when we talk about, in old business, when we talk about the roads and the signposts that we've gotten and so on as well. And speaking of, and we'll go back since Dick is here now. Hello, Dick. And you're actually up, because we were running a little bit early in here. Here? So. Since Don's back, we'll, this way. So how's it going? I'm here. Yeah, well, that's good. That's what I say too, about me. Ah, it's just like everybody else. It's been more than three years. Yeah. Yeah. And we're not going to walk on places like that. So. My exercise. Yeah. All right. So have an update for us on our neighbor here. Yeah. Well, I'll give you the good news first. Frank is the property at the end of the street. He is not going to rent it. Like a letter to be sent to him. He is planning to sell the property and not rent it. So from that point of view, that may be out of our head or on loan. I don't know if we can do something to put a stipulation in that the property can't be used as a rental property until the water issue is determined. I think that would be the best way to explain it. Right. Yeah. Ah. It's a long story when we get to 10, 13, I would be assuming you all had a single letter that was sent out that I can't see now. Basically, they did a lot of the simple things quickly, such as the storage system was corrected, the broken pipe was fixed, and I disinfected the water of the cellar and everything. When I went there, the cellostares were so steep that I indicated that it should be off limits to the renters and basically they walked up that door. The fire extinguishers and the smoke alarms and everything were all updated. Finally because of our order in fact that the fire marshal did a inspection and he's a little more enforcement minded. And so all of those things were done immediately. The low water pressure seems to be soft. They have the water pressure now. And apparently the gas lines were cleaned out and so everybody is getting off water. So those are the things that they did. At the request of the fire marshal's, the two units on the second floor, because the windows were so small or they didn't have access, they weren't allowed to use those rooms for bedrooms. And the fire marshal also indicated that the stairs going up to the second floor were too steep and that they had to be replaced. What I'm hearing from Jason, who is Frank's maintenance person, is that they planned to walk those off completely and put up new stairways on the outside so that the back would build up. Is that okay with the fire marshal? Because of the fire marshal, although it also complies with the health regulations because of the sequence in the stairs. Things that still have to be done. The places just badly insulated although when Frank rebid it after the flood, I think he did some fair insulation on the walls. But when I was there, all the baseboard in both of the units that I went through, he could feel the cold layer coming through. So I requested that they do something as far as doing better insulation on the baseboards. In one unit, the pipes rose three times during the winter. And the other big thing is there's a leak coming from the second floor down to the first floor unit. Unit five to unit six, which is the bottom floor. You can see where the water has hit the tile and everything else. But basically, unit five just got vacated and the answer I got from Frank's person is, well, there's no leak now because nobody's living there. Now, I still, he refuses to take down the tile to find out there's more there as well as the terminal where the leak is coming from. So that's one that I'm really concerned about. So and the other thing is on the construction of the stairs, I keep asking for some type of schedule. And I just get no answer and do it when we do it is about the best answer I can get now. And, you know, we've asked for progress reports in the past. They never feel well. There's a mouse problem. We all have a mouse problem in our house right now probably. But what's happened now is that because the unit five is not occupied, there's mouse problems all over the place indicating that it's all through the building. I mean, it needs to do something about that. Again, I don't think it's the biggest problem in the world, but it's just another one that kind of comes up with everything else in terms of lack of maintenance. There needs to be a number six unit one down four that needs to put a railing around the porches out there. The other thing is that my letter requested that they pick up the construction debris and all the other practice in the yard and that I couldn't see during the wintertime because of the snow. It's all over the place now. It does pose risk to health and safety. The roof leaks, it's not big leaks, but you can see where there's some stain from leaks both in the hallway as well as in one of the rooms. And I also asked for pipe fitting doors. Right now, the doors that are on the, at least the two units upstairs, it's just a regular on the door from 1920 with a little latch, iron latch. There's no locks on the doors or anything else. And again, a lot of the wind coming in from the outside is coming through those doors. So there are some issues with the tenants. The tenants have started a, probably, a not so legal escrow account three or four of them have. I wish we had a social officer for the time so that we could have some discussion about some of those things too. But we don't. I just don't know enough about some of the social aspects. I mean, one person in there, and I don't understand this arrangement, but I want to land one. Frank has the master account for the gas from the propane that's delivered. But the individual tenants need to pay the individual bills. One woman couldn't pay her bill two and a half or three years ago, and so they shut her off. She's been eating her apartment with electric eaters. I'm sure she probably qualifies for some type of fuel assistance or something, but apparently she can't get her gas turned back on. And again, I don't know enough about some of those issues. She just recently also, as she was going into her unit, her light fell through the porch. Her light fell through the porch. And they said put a bullet hole in it. So that's kind of where we are. Sasha has sent at my urgent request for private reports. We didn't get any of the lines to us. They sent them, you know, they all searched our junk files and everything else. About a month and a half ago, I met with Jason, his man that picked care of the properties. And I said, look, since you're having so many problems with the tenants, I'd be happy to at least witness if you meet somebody there as you do a repair or you look at some of these issues. He said yes, and I never heard that from him again. So that's about where we are on this whole thing. I keep asking for some private reports and writing. I did this past weekend when I met with Jason again. But I just don't get anything. I don't get anything with dates. That's the thing that worries me the most. I've had a past life in enforcement. And, you know, the regulations and the laws are there to get compliance on enforcement. So you want to try to do whatever you can to get their compliance, and it just doesn't seem like it's happening. Do you have to answer any questions? Well, you started with the good news that he was no longer going to be renting or wanted to sell it. But I mean, bottom line is that place may not sell. So it'll take probably a long time to sell. And so what do we do in the meantime? He's got to fix the problems. Well, the big problem, among other things, the huge problem is the water supply system. I mean, it's a spring-fed system. You know, maybe somebody who was really careful and on the property could run it. But, you know, I've had two tenants now that ended up where they ran out of water. And this was before we ended up with any drug conditions or anything else. So I don't know what's happening over there at all. But that's the biggest problem, I think, over there. There's a bunch of other things. There's bad insulation. You know, they have the sliding doors, which are just terrible. Somebody's going to take over that trunk and they bought it. It's going to have to put in a lot of water. But no, I'm going to rent it. He's not going to rent it anymore. Well, yeah, but he's got existing tenants in there. Oh, no, no, they moved out. He claimed that they were sports. I didn't get into that. But with the court order, he got them out of there about a week ago. They cleaned up the place and everything else. No, there's nobody to do that. But he's not going to rent it, right? He's not going to rent it. Well, and we sent him a letter, right? We couldn't rent it. Rent it unless he could show that he had a good water supply. Right. Well, that's soft. Let me make sure I'm clear. The building with being rented is almost across the road. And the one at the end of the road is no longer being rented. It's on her. Oh, yeah. Well, that's what he's asking. No, he's asking. You know, the apartment's on the road. Yeah, yeah. And the thing is, the apartments across the road are fairly nice. You build a lot of work after the flooding and everything. And they're fairly nice. The problem is, it just doesn't keep them up. Well, then they're not nice, are they? Well, you know, but... They have all kinds of small problems. Yeah, they certainly sound like it. That would make this. So with the new, isn't there a new law that we can start to support the gate more action? Yeah. Well, so let the board, I think it's the Board of Health can take a lot of action. But I just, that's why I wanted to, I wanted to keep the board informed. And if we need to, I've talked to Ron Shims about doing another health order and then going to the courts to try to get some enforcement. Mainly in terms of trying to get some dates in terms of when things have died. And the other thing is, since he's in a contest with the tenants there, he and Jason don't want to do anything. And the renters don't want to pay them unless they see the money going into some improvements in the house. Again, I don't know. I'm not in the middle of that. But I mean, again, I can talk to Ron and try to come up with a list of things that I didn't need to do that. Yeah. I would definitely stand up. Everybody in agreement with that. It's tough. People need places to live. Yeah. And I don't know, you know, he asked me where I got my hour factor stuff. I mean, maybe you should be doing an NGO on the police. I mean, they're usually free dealers next to free. And, you know, the legislature and the wisdom passed the bill that puts a lot of room to land what's a great apartment. I don't know. Yeah. I just, as I said, I actually had a social officer like the old days. So some of these other issues, such as a woman that has to use space units to eat her apartment and try to find some relief. I'll put something together and talk to Ron about coming up with the border and trying to get dates on... Yeah. I'd let him know the urgency of this. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Thanks. Thank you very much, Jeff. Thank you. Thank you. Final time, road department update, Martin and probably Stefan. Good evening. Good evening. Nice job on road today. Thank you. A little drawing, but... The biggest thing I'm here for is just basically my overall budget is obviously set the budget in October basically to get ready for January 1st. So I'm going off to those numbers. Things have changed drastically as I'm sure everybody's aware. Field costs being one of them, but culverts have doubled from last summer to this year. I mean, literally have doubled in price. And that's across the board. It's not just one member. That's everybody. How about availability? We've got our time. How about doing that? So far, I've only placed one border and they had everything that was in stock. Is that through Johnson? Yeah, it was through Johnson. Yes, Johnson partner. And he said that his availability was good. It weren't seeing a shortage. I guess there's a shortage on some of this smaller pipe. The SDR-35, you know, the 6th, the 4th, 6th, 12th pipe. I think there's shortages on that, but that's not something that we use a ton of. So I may be able to get the pipe, but it's obviously my budget's not going very far since it doubled. The sand... where we get our sand from Varen's, they had a $1.50 bump per yard across the board that she set in May when we started for this year. So that's a total even on buying just the sand alone. That's a $7,500 hike in budget. What's that? What's happened to that now? 11 or? I think yes. I think she's... I think it is 11. So from the price that they give us? Yes. From last year to this year. Then they haven't... I was saying, yeah. Instead of my budget on last year's numbers like in October, everything was pretty still, ordinary, nothing ridiculous. Then kind of January, things started getting a little crazy. So she set her budget. I did reach out to her in the fall and she said at most she thought that she'd go up at least 50 cents, but she wasn't sure. Which is normal? Yeah, which isn't like a normal hike, but $1.50. We just... I guess the material from the old Brusso's pit. The June 1st, they set new pricing out there. Is that 16? 16.40. 16.40 a yard, I want to say. It was $14.60 and $100.50, gentlemen. So they're gravel... They're very gravel... Also, they've been at $14 an hour, $13 an hour. So considering the distance to bearings now, it's probably becoming more evident that they may be using plant necks or something closer. Well, it's still cheaper than the product that we may end up, but I fully expect it northeast. We'll also have a price hike here at some point, but northeast, which isn't a very nice haul out of Granite Forest, but they make a manufactured sand, which Berlin uses now, but the price difference was still a big enough jump that we really couldn't afford to jump to that, but any more of the increase than we definitely... I would definitely consider moving to a product that I wouldn't much prefer on the roads anyways. It would be like a quarter to half inch plant mix, basically. More on the roads instead of a round stone, sand that just ends up in the ditches. So just things like that. So we're probably going to, in an attempt to stay as close to budget as possible, we'll probably back off on some projects related to culverts, stuff like that. We have a decent municipal road general permit grant that we're doing on the mountain road that will still take place, but will be reimbursed for a majority of that work that gets done. Another thing, mowing roadside, the rental mark went up $1,500 for a week rental. It was... I didn't rent it. Our old contractor, Al-Anat Dad, had been doing the first pass. He canceled on us late. This year, so I was kind of left scrambling to figure out what I was going to do. So the next logical thing was he either rent the boomer for two weeks, which when I called, got ahold of that. That was out because that would throw my budget way off, you know, $3,000 more. So I did call around another guy that knows for Berlin that could do it. The other option is Eric Howes is willing to purchase a mower and do the mowing, and that would be the route that I would prefer to go. Obviously, you know, it does work for the town already. And I've spoken to him, and he's ready to pull the trigger on renting or unbuying, not a boomer, but just a regular side mount mower to do the roadside, which we could get by with for a year. But we're going to have to come up with a strategy going forward. Fairfield's not even going to rent their boomers. They're getting out of it. So part of the reason I didn't rent the boomer from them is they said if they were able to sell the machine, that they would sell the machine and not honor the rental dates. So literally could be counting on getting a rental unit in July or August. They sell the machine and basically they're saying here, you're not getting the machine. I'll be on the other place that I'm aware of. The ransom is a piece. And I call them in their book straight through to the fall. So Eric Howes gets a machine. In the end, would he charge us by the hour? Correct, yes. He said, I'm 75 an hour, which is comparable to what Alan was charging us. I think he was 65 an hour, but that was last year's pricing before the field went up. So I think it's a very fair price. And then we can just basically end till the money is gone in that budget and you know, and then we have to come up with a plan, I guess, forward. Well I think, you know, we should consider maybe a multi-year contract with him. He might work out better for him, and for us, and a fixed rate or something. We probably have to put it out for a bid and just have a bid on it and see where it came out. It seems like, at this point, Runtbull is not going to be an option. We need to get a contractor on board that we can get on. Exactly. And Alan, that would be for this year though. That would be going forward, right? Yes, right. We'll talk about the hour this year then. I agree. I think that's the best route to take the only downside is we definitely need to either hire somebody with a boom or going forward. I'm okay with it for a year, maybe two, but we definitely need a boom or to be able to get behind the guard rail to get across that bank to keep the brush down. Sometimes it's not brush, all brush they cut. No. He did a mess on my property when I was here. Yeah. Yeah, my worthy border horns took down some nice bottom nuts that were coming along. I mean, I know they'll eventually die, but it would have been nice to know that he was kind of doing that. Yeah. I'll be honest, if it's in the ditch or in the ditch line, I prefer it to be cut from a road standpoint. Maybe not from a tree standpoint, but from a road I understand. I think that landowners should know. Yeah. Anything that's in the right way, definitely if you consider a prize or something that you definitely want to reach out to us prior to and maybe a public service known as men for living on it or something, because it's very difficult to tell what is what as you're running it. Sometimes you don't know when they're coming too. Correct. They have to be maybe some way of letting people know. I think sometimes they go up like that and get up high and take some branches out of some trees that might not really get to go. Yeah. Exactly what you're saying. And it's not pretty, but I can tell you it's a lot more time effective than a chainsaw and a pole saw. It's definitely not pretty. Yeah. It's a machine. I have my employee to put in on this subject. With all the invasive species that we're getting, the Japanese knobby that we've put in Carson, it might not be a bad idea to consider buying a roadside mower because then we can hit it more than that once a year to keep those invasions down. It's a big investment from the town. I know it's a new piece of equipment. It's generally a one-purpose piece of equipment but it would help to keep those invasions down. Yeah. It's about $150,000. I've priced it. It's in my home. A lot of towns have gone that route. And I'm definitely not opposed to it. It would be great to have that piece of equipment more or less to use when you want it, when you have the time to use it. You know, you've got poison parsnip, how it's rolled up there. You could knock that down before it blew. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't believe I've spread just in the last two years. Yeah. Japanese mower. Obviously, you can mow it. You can watch that grow, basically. Yeah. So I'm definitely not opposed to it. It's tough. It depends on what you can get per year for contractors. Right. If you're leaving, it's fine. It's true. We should definitely keep that in mind for the future. Everybody okay with that? Doing it this year? Yeah. I'm sure that we can come up with some of your app money to cover those over budget items. Yeah. There's no way we could anticipate it. The kind of increases that you're seeing. 50% increase in fuel and things like that. Yeah. I'm already in basically scrambling. Just trying to do what will have to be done. And I would encourage you to do what has to be done and not put off, I think, because of the money. I'm a true believer that if we put it out, it's going to be better. It's going to be twice as worse next year. If it needs to be done and we see it, it will have to get done because as we all know, after the fact, it's a lot more expensive than fixing it beforehand. Just, yeah, it's just better. What's the status as far as the river road by sprinklers that we have? I don't know as we've actually received the grant yet. So we're waiting on that, but I have started pulling the trigger on getting updated pricing on that as well because the pricing that I had to apply for the grant was lack, was 2020, I think, so I fully expected that pricing to be through the roof but it's not that big of a jump like 20 grand. So it's about 15 to 20% increase? Yeah, probably right around there. How's the risk that it comes through? Hopefully we get the grant and then we can just pull the trigger on it. Like I said, I've gotten some basically budgetary pricing just to find out where we're going to be for that, and then we'll just get a couple, you know, three companies to bid. Yeah, I think we can try that. So far, Pike has said they can do it and Top Coat Fresh Coat reached out to me looking for work and I had them look at it and I think we got back with the price too. So hopefully we'll have product. Who's doing the work on Route 2? Is that Hutchings going to be paid in there? Is that going to be in the area? I don't know. I think Hutchings has got that contract for Route 2 and it might work out reach out to them and see if they're going to be in the area perhaps they can give us some sort of deal. So yeah, so I will mention, we awarded the same bid to has come down and said that he needs more money to complete that contract and I told him that I would bring it up to the slight border but at this point I think if he's asking for a dollar or more per yard and that definitely outside the realm of what I'm going to work with he hasn't stopped hauling so at this point I think we just let him either haul it for what he agreed to or or cease hauling. That would be mine. I think the best way to pay the rent I mean we get anything over a six, six and a quarter we would probably haul it ourselves Sounds like a plan. Okay. I told him I would run it by the board I agreed with it. Everybody? That he won't haul it anymore? If that's what he chooses to do if he doesn't get any more money but he agreed. He signed the contract if he doesn't want to finish it then that's up to him and then just went back to the budget usually the gravel budget is where I can save from if I need to make up on overages on other places of course after the month season we had we spent some money on treating mods so that money may not be there to kind of steep that rock from Martin do you think number wise are you ten percent over budget or any idea how this might work with Sasha and get she sent me an updated budget report maybe three weeks ago and it's yeah probably ten percent I can get the latest round of slips and stuff that kind of that culvert order that's a big chunk yeah yeah right so I like I said just with her dollar fifty bump we're going to be seventy five hundred dollars on the scene the moment we'll be over budget just from last year I didn't bump it three thousand more so that will be forty five hundred dollars but then we're paying more for trucking basically seventy five cents more we are for trucking so we're back to we'll be over anyways we look at and I'm not not willing to not put up you know five thousand yards because you just seem to well throw up with their rain immense we get in the water we've tried that before paying the price for it yeah we're definitely paying in the spring what other thing to have is the shop it's once around the shop the other day and the trim boards on the back peak have come off there's two trim boards and it's going to be an extremely tall ladder to get to it if we have a contractor that we use for that sort of thing in the back peak can you get to it with a ladder? I'm not saying that we couldn't repair it but we'd obviously have to rent a ladder figure out how big a ladder it is we have to be at least a forty footer we have a thirty five footer at the fire apartment I don't think it would reach a hundred and forty we can try that yeah try that because I can't I can't help myself that's a big lie you won't find me a thirty footer am I? I'll get a show on the do-it good luck yeah I don't know as far as contractors you can find somebody who can do it we'll look and see figure out what the extent is well maybe we can find a contractor and supply the ladder I don't know I don't know if that's something that Joe Gabbari does or not I get asked I'm not sure I might have a person we might have a person we still have the condensation thing to work on to try that I know we took a knock then we'll find the right person maybe and I think we better just go it's a kind of jawed my mind about hurdle road those cedar hedges they are on hurdle road or out of control again so we need to address those I'm sure if I go in and start pathing it's going to be an ordeal so maybe we can reach out to Frank first and let him know we're going to be trimmed back more than willing to do it we just need to know we asked all everything you want to cut is in the right way it is oh yeah the whole hedges is in the right way is that one of the three warden files in actually Eric is the ultimate I'm not sure I think he probably tells that it isn't even a safety issue even a car training there is so much there wasn't much trimming done last time either not enough we need to cut some and we thought it would be better cedars grow super fast anyways especially when you prune you train and grow really fast I suppose I can get reach out to the only other big issue I have is the class 4 road issues that we have going on you might as well talk about that now under old visits didn't he say something that's what you're waiting for too yes I just want to do what's happening with that I just have one more question we had talked last year about some sort of compactor to use after grading you could tell with a grader where do we stand on that we were going to attempt to build our own drum roller with a lot of town shoes but I think when you were on the board maybe we should hold out for the locking roll which are the pneumatic tires which get into every crime is what they're extremely expensive I think we could be into a drum roller for well, old pricing under 10,000 new pricing I guess I'd have to re-price it to see but we have some really talented I still think it's a I think it's a really good idea it is we're going to skip right over it so 5.24 we all took part in a greater class and we went over some things with us in a classroom setting and then we all went to the river road and took turns grading a section of road while he followed us and gave us feedback on that it was really informative it was definitely a great you know instruction and all four of us were to the section of road and did our own section of road it did happen to be the flattest I will one other quick thing button on hill sign is that going to be a new one? I have it I believe it's in the show I believe Ruth was going a big one let me check with the guys that actually brings up an interesting road department 8.9.1.1 question as new roads are going up and obviously the town is getting a sign and getting a sign post what is this $75 or something that the people that are proposing the road pay the prices of that stuff has gone up crazy as well so we'll have to revisit that as we get new roads because I just issued a new road that was approved prior to me that's going to end up meeting a sign and I don't know where the money is coming from or if we even recede anything you definitely may want to find a new fee schedule for the signage the portion of that just simply because it's typically right around $150 with the insert the post and the rack or the hold the sign and the sign it's right around $150 and they took that little sign north of it which is okay because a lot of times it says north of it people wouldn't see that at all and they'd end up at my house that would be awful I think I've replaced $65 that is really weird just people on this they still have very many names we can put a bunch of them down below but at least they don't take the post to mess them up maybe a bunch of free sign from the bottom of it maybe we should change the name of the road alright Class 4 okay so Class 4 roads and trails I guess so I did spend some time the last week or so actually met with Denise last Friday to review what I found out basically like I said earlier we have issued permits that should have been through the DRB did not go that way and part of the DRB review which was important is the access to their property clearly states that we supposed to have 20 foot roads the town plans gives us specific criteria it's supposed to be met and so right now we have a building permit from Mike McCartney for a house on Cobb Hill but the house was built by George Wells and George Wells got a garage permit for that house but again these were both approved by the zoning administrator when it's clear that any development is permitted on lots that don't have class 1, 2 or 3 access without DRB review so it's my feeling that the select board should contact Mr. Wells until he has to get the right permit the right building permit which means going to the DRB that's what needs to be done if that's legal I think that's what we've got to do Sentinel Energy is willing to re-imply and comply with the zoning regulations as they are now and see how that goes I think that's a start as I said earlier the whole building permit process it's all in the zoning administrator's signature and they need to have some sort of review I believe to make this right so we don't run into this problem again Cobb Hill is not the only road Brownsville Road it's going to be the same issue you've got people up there that want to build that road is probably worse than Cobb Hill if there are places up there the culvert's ready to jump out of the ground it's very narrow if we ever had to get a emergency vehicle up there there's no way at this point in the wintertime now you know what you can do in the summertime but yes you can get there yes it would do the job I wouldn't like any benefit so again these are two of the probably many issues that we have but these are two are really coming up that we really need to look at and be careful where we're going to you have the same on Lynch Hill too there's a camp up there it's right in the middle of the shoot the shoot is an ice skate in the winter but there's a camp up there that is planning to be lived in year round with no power no wire so yeah Lynch Hill is another one so these are all roads that are we just need to be paying a lot of attention to curb cuts I'm even going this far saying when we issue a curb cut we ought to issue a separate sheet conditions sheet on curb cuts in these class 4 roads or trails specifically addressing what is required so they know even if they're not going to build anything right now they know that they have to fix this road the town is not going to fix these roads they're just sort of not okay according to the town plan they said trails they want to keep them trails they don't want to upgrade them you could but it's a process to do and it's an expense to our town and more burden on Martin here to be able to maintain if that became a class 3 road also these legal trails are issues all over the town so it's not just the ones that are currently working yes I agree now that we have the new map we can now know the right road names and hopefully going forward from select board we had this issue last time Tom Martin this year for a select board meeting that they were issuing a permit on the top hill you should be aware of your roads and your trails and your class 4 roads because when you look at E911 curb cut address it basically tells you the mileage of how far up that distance is and we ran into this issue and it was way down a cob hill that needed a curb cut and that's well within the reason of the class 3 road so I mean you should know how long your class 3 roads are and so regarding the 2 permits that were issued do we need to I mean is it something that we have to get legal advice on whether that we can send this letter we can basically evoke it I think we should write a letter to the owner stating that the permit they have is not valid and see how they may say okay we'll just get them at the permit or they may fight it I don't know I know one of those buildings is complete now right it's not like I'm sure a permit will be issued but they need even if they have the wrong permit there's still regulations here that have to be followed it's just like a speaker that's on you know you just can't go 50 miles an hour because that's road it says it's pretty clear in Arizona you have to comply with this stuff right so I think we have to write a letter to Mr. Wells well the other thing is I was never notified of the permit for the garage sorry this is Denise McCarty I live on Cobb Hill I was I was notified of the first building but I was never notified in writing for the second permit which I'm assuming is separate and not the same and if I'm wrong somebody please correct me but there's two permits one for the house yeah March 9th okay well so the um the second permit the one issued in March I don't believe the zoning administrator or whoever nobody notified any of the um surrounding neighbors like the land the joining landowners including myself of that second permit um there's and so I was not notified of that I saw a sign that there was you know permit had been issued or something but I didn't know and then I asked George and he said he was putting a driveway in and then as time went on I was like what are you exactly doing that's more than a driveway so um I don't think that the process was followed for the second permit um it was followed I agree I don't think the process would fall for either so well um I'm sure it wasn't but the second permit definitely wasn't followed and that was under a different zoning administrator so whoever has oversight to her work um you know where is that oversight okay well as far as notification to landowners by the person putting the permit in um and if the March permit was put in by George the landowner um but didn't cite an actual location that seems like it's also incomplete so why wasn't that caught and questioned the garage permit has the physical location 9-1-1 address on it we just have the proper the ventilation of roadway or legal trip it only it does not state anything as far as access usually it says off call hill legal trail or call hill number 6 so according to the Vermont E-9-1-1 more but that's where the number was generated yeah but E-9-1-1 is not the official map period it is a number that everybody has chosen to go off it is 1760 Cobb Hill Road on the garage permit it does not say number on the building permit but on the wastewater permit the seed Vermont got it correctly and one of those permits does say 6 it says town highway number 6 okay I don't have the wastewater permit the wastewater permit does have the dilation of legal trail number 1 but all point aside I think we all recognize yeah yeah right and we are going to correct them there are several things and I know Denise we are very concerned about everything and like I said we will get to the bottom of this and do our best to make it not happen again well it's going to happen again because now we want to build off Kaminsky's property up on top of Moretown mountain road it's been divided up four times and that's legal trail 11 and I met Martin up there not too long ago and you know you don't know where that legal trail is it goes smack dab through the field right over the top of a 4,000 foot well drilled right over the top of the legal trail run over a quarter mile that well it goes the well head right flush with the ground where's the health inspector on that it's flowing right out on the ground that's a health issue it's this big around it's almost 24 inches around and that's right smack dab that's everybody's well that's right smack dab in the middle of legal trail 11 and that just got divided up and those people plan on building up there and how they can access their road they may have a different legal right away but legal trail is what they might presume to go off it so these issues were brought up back in October 4th back in 2021 by our old zoning administrator and he went into great detail about these issues so this has been on the docket for quite some time I believe and I'm going to start with you Ray get the nail right on the head hopefully we you do what you say you can kind of do so I guess I can work with Sasha on a letter and trying to get something that would be good you know you can draft a letter I can send you over something within a couple days of what I think and then on another note the planning board is working on creating a document that we can address how people are going to proceed building on a trail do I work on that? I thought we discussed that at one of our meetings they're not currently working on it we talked about correct me so we talked about it that needs to be addressed that we make the changes in our zoning documents to reflect the pressures that we're now starting to see on building on these roads that we you know come up with clearer language on what people can do to just living on these roads I know you don't want to hear this but we may have to have a committee well that's what I was going to bring up they're actually saying that Ray was going to be head of the committee because in working together on that so we have the new zoning administrator planning commission flood board members but you know it has to do with a focus committee working on these things because whenever there's something joint with the planning commission the two boards just aren't going to be able to meet all the time and of course Martin and somebody from somebody else if you want well that brings up another issue according to statutes Martin has authority on town highways and the statute I can't read off top of my head here right now but the statute basically says he has authority over town highways and a legal trail is not a town highway so I mean just to look into that maybe further but basically I know there's going to be a committee I was at the planning commission last Wednesday and they mentioned such a thing and they suggested that Ray may be the chair or somebody on it but we've also had these committees before and we also had a meeting that no minutes were ever posted or ever taken back in 2016 2017 and there was a lot of people it was in the town clerk's office down here there was Reed Coral was involved then and a bunch of other people and then there was it was in 2015ish that's been done since the fight no the town a hall we had at least a handful of people that lived on legal trails in class 4 no minutes are ever posted on that and then we also had a financial committee meeting afterwards I'm a little aware of those we've cleaned that up we're in class the point is we had that meeting and this was back when we we already had a legal trail class 4 road committee which is still on the website and we had meetings and they're not posted regarding these issues Denise did you want to say something just I just wanted to add that if there is going to be a road committee I hope that the purpose of it is very clearly defined what the role of the committee is and that that is communicated to the public because doesn't make any sense to form a different committee with not and not have a clear and concise purpose and mission for it understand I just wanted to add that that's all that's a good point with that said and I brought this up a few meetings ago with John is we have a policy that's a select board is supposed to abide by on these class 4 legal trails and it's basically the state statutes and it's kind of just gone in the wind I mean it is your responsibility as a select board for these issues to know where these legal trails are to know where these class 4 roads are and any issues that become on those town highways it is strictly the select board's responsibility so even if we have this committee it's still the select board's responsibility it's not the committee's responsibility just an advisory committee advisory committee is a good word alright so we can certainly I guess I don't mind being on the advisory committee let me figure out a schedule here you know I'm sure we can figure out who's going to be on it Travis you already have volunteered right well it sounds like you're already there so I'm pretty close to it yeah I guess I have I've made it this far in all this BS so I'll keep going I think Denise you might want to be on too sure any thoughts Martin yeah I'm pretty torn on the whole thing it's pretty messy I mean even our class 4 road policy right now with the AAB is pretty convoluted it's messy it's very messy I know surrounding towns most of them do nothing with class 4's then there's statutes saying you're responsible for waterways blah blah blah it's a double edged story I know right now Brownsville we've got a culvert that there's water running right down the road the last I heard the board had agreed that they wanted us to reset basically it was sitting on top of the ground and it got pushed up like a lot of culverts did with the frost and last I heard the board wanted me to reset that culvert and put one load of gravel over the top of it and that was it I think that's agreeable because I think we have some responsibility as far as maintaining a drainage to a certain point connecting streams so I don't know why the how or why surrounding towns get away with doing I've had numerous discussions with other road crew and they just basically wash their hands of their legal trails in class 4's well that's what we're probably supposed to be doing but our town has allowed these individuals to build houses out in the middle of nowhere which I don't even know how they get there I really don't and it was all I could do to get up Jacob's road or what do you do so and my truck I was going to bottom out every culvert I went over so if a fire truck made it up there good luck we all know about season heads residents are like we're going to be able to make it this year we had class 3 roads but they might not have made it so you're not they immediately turn to the road crew to come fix their problems and well that's where it becomes a burden and that's why people should point with these class 4 and legal trails it puts a burden on Mark I mean it puts a burden on the taxpayer and that's why it's in the town plan not to upgrade these roads because it becomes a very highly big expense now we're not going to do culverts I got a culvert below my house it's not even on the culvert survey why you know I just met with Allison Andrews which I know she just met with Martin on that issue on something to do around that issue and that culvert's been there for 40 years how come that's not on the culvert survey and it's a connecting stream right across the brook culverts like that replace not class 4 road culverts so that's why we have the advisory committee to help work on this to get it clear to people that they can't if you want to live on these roads this is what you have to do maybe we just have it made that clear so I will just add to that that and that's great so now you're going to mandate that they're responsible for updating keeping the road up to snuff the wires that are working right away permit which then how do you tell somebody that just spent $150,000 on a trunk of land that they're going to put another $80,000 into a road to get to it that may or may not be on an actual legal trail because we have no idea whether the legal trail is where it is it looks like it may be the path but after having legal trail 17 you're going to come and lay down below my house and all the maps and something else to be done before they buy the land as a buyer they have a responsibility to look into what they're buying I would think sell it too the other thing is too I brought this up in the past financial institutions on Denise McCarty's house she has a loan now from Norfield savings bank she may or may not have paid off Norfield savings bank that puts a financial institution at risk and our town's helping this stuff happen by allowing the people to live out in these middle of nowhere places they can live out there they can have insurance in their house they can have a loan but they might need a special right here for those houses to be able to provide the insurance needed for the loan well they don't provide the loan yeah well they don't no I know that's where the bank should provide the loan based on the bank I think we have the normal one but it's normal I think we're going down the rabbit hole that we need to fix we don't need to go down at the moment you know thank you okay so Ray will take charge of that see if if Tom wants to be on it or otherwise I I can you will work on the trail zero yeah before you leave Travis I should get you a phone contact info okay good that sounds good and Martin your input is really important too so I would like to be a part of it okay good morning thank you step on thank you guys thank you step on thank you guys thank you yes thank you I'll be in touch okay everything that's on that that's enough isn't it yeah well one another note I haven't done anything you know we've talked about the other two trails that we want to survey I have not done anything because this is really I've been focusing on this and we're waiting for our map which we now have it's coming okay did we realize that we don't have enough money for these surveys oh yeah yeah about two oh that's going to be the yeah we may not be able to do it we may have to you know estimate and add more money next year for one survey I don't know you're currently on a survey right now it's still a little bit we've only asked for pricing we don't have any contract that I know of the past meetings they said it's already moving forward you needed some certain maps over on your way I don't know the legal the legal trail I have not signed any contract I think we've discovered one of our meetings that we budgeted like $5,000 we budgeted we budgeted we got hourly rates from Vermont survey but I have not reached out to them to go look at any road or do any work that's not what was portrayed in our meetings I thought it was funny because they said the name of the survey Vermont survey what's his name? no that's uh Steven Steven Frazier yeah okay so it's been a long time since I've been up there and looked at the one from Moor Brook so we have we're giving our supplying six yards of stone every year because the area goes through the do's problem so six yards of stone is $500 whatever is that worth a $10,000 survey to fight about okay we're just going to do this everybody's happy with it right location it may be that's an answer, I'm not saying it's the right answer but the right answer is let's get everything located but we don't have enough money we're off to spend it is there a concrete block blocking the way? yeah there are concrete blocks up there that are blocking and I think that's a big issue I thought the blocks were removed they were up there this spring I've been through there two separate people said that they were up there they were up there I don't know if they were up there earlier but I thought Jeff said they were removed nope okay so that's why I need to go there's obviously unless there's like we're going to be blocking you know because I know Abaren told me I was blocked and then I asked Jeff is the road blocked and he said it is blocked this spring March April so it is blocked still blocked okay today alright other old business Tom wanna talk about what? got a couple things to talk about well I mean on the on the transportation stuff you were also I mean Ray sent his email out because he found out about those signs the flashing signs that we could possibly get and John and I have been working with Drugs Manchester just identifying some transportation items and one of them was what Sasha just sent out the other day was the one that was dropped to over on route 2 and they did a study and they're going to drop the speed limit from 40 to 35 miles an hour and there's public comment available for that on Wednesday one and I was going to ask you did you I can't find the zoom link on that I've seen the guy in the email all about it but you know because I said what I've noticed is the guy sent you the email and you accepted it so I think maybe it's I don't know, I didn't see it in his email can you check on that to me because now I have a conflict and I maybe call them at least they have someone there for that aspect and they did this comprehensive study I don't know if anybody had a chance to read that so that 30 miles an hour is that up to Gallagher acres well no it's going to go to 35 which is what route 100 does as it comes into that traffic like you know from the school and now it's going to go from basically Gallagher's acres Gallagher's, where they dropped it to 40 remember they dropped it to 40 from 50 to 40 we did that a few years ago probably longer than that now to 40 so that whole area is going to be dropped to 35 Warner Gams had submitted the letter requesting 25 but we knew that probably would the study they did they came up with it 30 if they could go to 35 and once that once they changed that I'm going to between Don and Joyce and myself we're lowering the speed limit all along that whole section of route 2 50 is just too fast for that section well I know but now that you know you have the low income housing in there that's a resident's favorite it should not be that high especially when it gets paid this year it has to make it again this curves and stuff the other item that we're trying to meet with someone from the state is here in the village to see if the radar the radar sign I can't feedback sign the one that's by the the post office fire station that one we've talked about this before we're trying to see if it could get moved as you come into the village after you come over the bridge before Dennis Freppert's house and I would say the speed there to slow people down as they come into the village past the town garage around that corner so we're trying to get to meet with someone from the state to come out and actually physically look at it and also talk about crosswalks and actually I'd like to bring them down past there I got another call from Jerry Maynard people are just as fast as ever and it's just it's just off and something just has to be done I just talked to someone from the Sheriff's office today and we talked about more town talking to the Sheriff's office they were ready for us they were ready for us they were ready to move forward with something I thought so that's not what they told us they sounded like they were understaffed well that was the state police that was understaffed no the Sheriff's office wanted they both said they were understaffed yeah we'll check it out too so that's sort of I don't know if there's this item that we're working on and so the pricing it looks like you've got prices on both the cart type and the fixed and the fixed we're going to put we'll fix not more in the village it'll be up in wherever we want obviously more County Mountain would be a crime I should think the mobile would make more sense at this point the mobiles are I think 10,000 a piece yeah I think it was because we talked about we could get 2 the signs are about 6,000 if you got the one that has the actual feedback so at this point I think we should get 2 of the mobile ones and start placing them around the town we're going to switch these around based on what Tom what Sasha sent us today from the Tom one of us to look at it looks like and John references earlier some state statutes that are changing that are going to allow towns or municipalities to start to take control of changing speed limits on town roads not on state roads still but it wasn't the past that we couldn't change them on a town road even without going through a whole process with the state but is that how you read that we can put calming devices sorry we could put speed bumps but we can't traffic calming devices as well but we can also change from what I read we could change a speed limit that's 35 that's kind of cuckoo on some of these roads because people are at 2 30 or 25 at some point because we get along in this yeah my understanding is if you want it will be below the 35 that's when you have the speeds I might be wrong I don't know do you know what act that is what act that is like through legislation that allows it's 181 the new one is 181 I would certainly like to see this speed limit reduced everywhere we have to reach on everything no no but you can do a 5 year plan you can do 10 years it doesn't have to be all done tomorrow more down there's people doing 65 70 on that one there's people at 35 now so you can make it 25 make it 5 I got it we've lost all common courtesy if we've got the 20,000 in the foot I would really like to see if Sheriff's Department would be willing because that's still our best route to go because the mobile units they're flashed the speed but that's not going to catch anyone it's not going to catch anyone I'd actually be a little worried on what kind of mountain road it would be animalized animalized I'm not sure there's an option too with a computer they have an option for the mobile that will record that that you can get I thought the data that recorded was just the speed that people are going I think you can set them up like license plate that would be that would be ideal I don't know you have to put correct labeling if you're going to make pictures of people there's places in Killington that have that and there's very few places in the month that have that but I'm not saying it probably would be possible it's probably connected with that like you can't law enforcement can't hide exactly it's probably connected with that it's a work in progress the first route should be I would say that or the state police looks like state police if we cannot get some enforcement we're going to try to do our best with some sort of signage we're limited none of us can pull anybody over and say this is it I'm giving you a ticket we can't do that but I think a lot of people a lot of people go fast and don't even realize they're just getting their car and they're driving along they realize there are people that live in these houses and I seem to come down or up past my house holy mackerel if I was backing out or crossing the road yeah well that's what the name is who wants to go that fast on a dirt road we don't need to go straight it's like marble we got that granite on the road and I've seen those rocks flying then as a I don't know this is probably still a glory on old business so I sent out to everybody on Thursday this is we got in the town hall to get the services of a design firm to take everything that we put together in the last year and get it design schematic together to for in a process I don't know if you've got to read this through some additional meetings and now some of the changes down get so that we can have pick what we want to do or not do so that eventually in the schedule that's outlined in here we would have something ready for town meeting in March of 2023 next March so but the point of this is is that it should really go out like this week based on the schedule that we've put together we've reviewed it with Cheryl Lynn as far as some of the language in the back about submitting it and insurance requirements and stuff and it's very elaborate about the proposal evaluation with the select award at the town hall committee and more town library and such and so I'm hoping that I'd like to get this out I'm having a feeling that no one got a chance to really read it yeah so this is like you know here we are this is now the next step in our going forward with the truly you know fixing up the town hall and keeping it as a beautiful building and being more of a community center with the library you know all the other uses that we have and some of the uses that we identified during more tests and walkthroughs and all the community engagement so do we need a motion to do that or just a nod I don't know I'd say yeah make a motion okay so I'll make a motion that we send out the RFP for the more town hall to the architects so we've got so far 5 firms 5 or 6 firms that have expressed an interest in submitting a proposal yeah I guess we're going to need a specific way for the architects no no I mean someone got to go double back with some of them and you know it's been so that's my motion that we send out the RFP to the architects for the more town hall renovations I'll second that any more discussion one favor say aye okay good we go okay and one more thing because I know we still have to go back for some of the things but the town forest management plan I think that pretty much between Ray myself and Don Don and I will work on this one here and part of the committee and Ray when we start the forest management plan and the tract of land in more town mountain Ray will be involved so I'm planning to get all those parties from our committee oh boy here we go after one meeting and so on together next week at some point so I'll let you know the needs so that you can post that where are these committees all going to start being posted on the website how are we doing on the website we have so many committees right now that are not posted it's not a good process tract is helping publish more questions because we can't really permit to interview okay we have one committee that's been in major violation ever since it's been in existence making people work on it tomorrow so these committees need to get cleaned up start putting on a website start putting your jibs out I'm a real stickler of it because the transparency of this town is not too transparent I have this good point but I don't have to work on that okay any other old or new committees good Sasha do you have any for reports communications other than we have here Sharon was Sharon was a grant for the study on loop so I bought the study on loop too so she needs to signature on that and then there's a grant agreement for the other one because she's been working on it something to do with that I believe the letter of intent and then this one okay so grant agreement advancement of a grant predation project no one had in Wartown TAP TA 22 11 the title of the description the project of the state is coming out is that what that is did you go through this Sasha okay okay I know I forgot my glasses you did that on purpose I see you have a new pair of glasses right if you have them okay so this is the grant agreement for the sidewalks forward more town more what we just talked about okay I thought you said that there's two different ones you need to signature on that one sidewalks coping study more town and this is on the hydrologically connected municipal roads it's municipal roads grants in aid program so that's the other thing charlin is applying for okay what does that mean that's part of the stuff that martin was talking about municipal roads permit oh okay work on class 3 roads well hydrologically yeah pretty much all the roads and more town are hydrologically connected okay and then that one the game you got was washable yeah stuff like that okay that was nice that's just one signature okay anything else here that's one this is the cd500 it won't be signing the steps I guess hold that one and those documents that he dropped off did you get all those no he said he may have this after I mean there was after I don't have to okay you can read them okay the last thing that we did not do approving the limits of 516 that's a good idea I make a motion second discussion I don't think I can vote on it because I know it's in here yeah you can okay all in favor say aye okay anything else before we sign these and adjourn next time this meeting is going on long time my fault there's too many guests too much of me acting this is old school we drive home in dark some of us we just go at 10 o'clock that's right some of the Berlin ones go to like Nattertown Board when I was on the board in the early 2000s we had an average of 11 o'clock I remember they just started at 7 well that's true too though I'm overhanding easy 9-10 if it goes over 2 hours people are focused make bad decisions I'm signing a fleet permit for Jerry Tabor Sid Tabor and for Cardinal Logistics Management Corporation and for Solid Communications just a vehicle permit and then a fleet permit for Griffin Griffin and son's accident I don't think we're going to sign it get in there ok anything speak what's the best way to reach you I'll give you my info ok board rates I think they're just getting as big as mine that's all I do at night hold sometimes it has no control that's the top one anything else that's on the website reports and communication dear Charlin and the Moorjohn community wow thank you for your donation during spring supporting member campaign I together we help neighbors just together we help neighbors connect and we support local business and non-profits donation makes a big difference it's really Michael, Valerie and the entire front porch forum team speak to our federal ODPs are we done ok I'll make the motion second Moorjohn