 Ah, it feels very reverent here. We've just been listening to a love note from God and the sinking into the quiet. So we're just happy that you can join us and we're grateful that we can come and stream to you what we're feeling, what we're experiencing here and hope you feel the love note in our hearts, too, as we share what's in our hearts, what we're going through. So I think that there was a topic for today, spiritual maturity. Yeah, that's a good one to go into, but maybe you want to say anything? Welcome our guest and welcome everyone here. Hello, everyone. Welcome. Thank you for being here. We feel very honored just to be able to share the blessings and the fruits really about an actual experience of spiritual maturity, going through an actual experience of our own development of trust really in God and just this beautiful love affair with God. We were listening to that. Is it love notes? Yeah, and just how precious this love is and how God is surrounding us. And while we were playing the song, I was feeling like Jesus had his arms like tightly around my shoulders. Just, you know, this morning I was thinking how he says, I am always with you. And I remember at one point in my journey, I was like, God, I just need to know that you're with me. And he said, you know, I heard this voice and it says, I am always with you. Where are you? You know, how our mind, you know, that is the maturity, like remembering, remembering God, remembering that he's with us is really the mind training and the focus and the discipline, you know, because we get caught up in our own thinking and get caught up in the past and the future. You know, but we're here to just talk about just this development, you know, of trust and faith and remembering that God is always with us. Yeah. Yeah, this is really the, you know, where it's 04 and pathway, the means, the end, it just points to this direct experience with God. Because this morning, you know, I was reading this sentence that you just need to call and he will answer. And I was reading that, I thought, in my mind, I thought, wow, how many times I called and you answered. And I'm so convinced that you're there with me. But since this is what I'm reading first thing in the morning, once again, I will call and just to call and just knowing you will answer. And that's just how the whole day started. And I, after I thought of this just really nice thought of how much God has answered all this time, then I just started my day and then the first thing after that was I got a song sent to me and that was the song. So that's like, I call you and the answer came through a song saying I sent my beloved son to be the one I love. And I love you in the morning, I love you in the evening, I love you in the noon. Now let's just be together. I'm above you, I'm beneath you, I'm in front of you, I'm behind you, I'm all around you. Let's just be together. That is like a direct. I can't think of anything that direct that I was putting that song on autoplay this morning and have so many emotions, just the fact that I'm grateful that God is right here. He's right here right now with us and it takes just us to call and to trust that He is here with us. And that's really what this is all about. You know, what more is there? Yeah. It's beautiful to swept away, carried away with that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I think as we kind of open up to the whole, just to be shown the meaning of spiritual maturity, it's like we can say that our spiritual journey was nothing like we thought it would be. It's always got new surprises and fresh experiences with it. And basically, when we look at the world, it is a world of time and space. And it seems like much of the thoughts and the activities as we have perceived ourselves as human beings have been rooted in time. You know, you might say that if our preoccupation is thinking about time, then it's like we've allowed our mind to be made a slave to time. I don't have enough time. Time is money. Oh, I've got a little extra time. Oh, I need to kill some time. You know, it always seems to be that what we're talking about, the currency of our minds in this world is time. And then when we think of the simplicity of the present moment, we can think of all the love and joy. God is in this moment. Love is in this moment. When we start to serve the moment, when we start to give ourselves over for being childlike in the moment, being playful in the moment, being loving, joyful, having glee in the moment. That is a very different way of thinking. The way that we've been thinking and we've been programmed to think from little child on is to always take time into consideration. And so everything from the task to the jobs to the careers, everything seems to be rooted in time. And if you do try to serve time, then you will use your mind as a means of serving the belief in time. And you will use your mind as a means to reach an end that has something to do with time. And really, we can say that at no single instant does the body exist at all. It's always remembered or anticipated. So the body is not only in time, but it's made by the ego and from the belief in time. The body is just a caricature, a puppet that has been made by time. And it was made by the ego for the purpose of being an end. What do I mean by an end? It was made as an identity. So you can help this identity grow. You can dress it up. You can paint it with makeup. You can perfume. You can wrap things around it. You can put houses and cities around it. You can make it into a home. And it seems like then you will use your mind to try to make a better body or for the betterment of the body, even for the betterment of housing the body. And what we're learning from Jesus is that the body is to be a means and not an end. It's to be a means that the Holy Spirit can use to bring the mind back to the unified experience of oneness. So in one sense, we could say that that's the only purpose that the puppet has is to be used by the Holy Spirit to bring the mind back to an experience of unification. Also, when we talk about spiritual maturity, you can start to see that the world has its own definition of maturity. But maturity to the world is really meeting the world on the world's terms. So survival and how well you handle the body's survival is tied into the world's definition of maturity. Or it's betterment in some way. They talk about quality of life, but then when you fill in the definition, what is quality of life to the ego? It still comes back to the body as being an end and using the body as the definition of that quality of life. And what we're learning from Jesus is the present moment is really our goal. We have a present goal, not a future goal, and that when we go for this goal, instead of using our mind for time and for the mechanisms of time, we are using our mind for prayer. And I think that's why we're shifting deeper and deeper into prayer and worship. Every day it seems to be just taking over our life, our experience. A lot of our discussions, we're talking about prayer and worship discussions. There's a lot going on about that. Like for the past two days, there's been so much talk of instruments, keyboards, electric guitars, drum sets. Whoa, that's an interesting new development, but that's just toward the making music and for worshipping God. Not for some kind of earthly purpose, but just for the aiding us in our worship or being used in the worship. So when I think of spiritual maturity, the first things I think of are prayer and worship. It has nothing to do with anything on the timeline. And then when you start to give yourself over to prayer and worship, you start to feel good. Like, wow, what was I thinking before? What was I devoting myself to before? It's almost like it starts to disappear when you get into prayer and worship. So that every day is a prayer. Every day is a prayer to God. Everything that you think and say and do is a prayer to God. Everything that you feel is your prayer to God. And you want your prayer to God to be filled with love and adoration and thankfulness, gratitude, not with the things of time. So you start to look more at the things on the timeline is like, wow, that's a that's a preoccupation of the mind. I've been preoccupied by stuff. I've been thinking about things too long to turn my mind and turn my thoughts towards something that will last forever. Not something that's just passing away. So it really puts us in a very different mindset when we go for God. Yeah, I was sharing that yesterday I was reading in the Bible and I never saw before the word oracle is in the Bible. And I thought, oh, this is interesting. And it was talking about how the oracle, you know, that we are the Word of God and that talking. And, you know, Jesus was always, you know, really teaching what he needed to learn over and over and over again. And I feel like that's kind of our life. And even with the worship, it's this experience that we're giving ourselves permission to fully surrender to to sing the praises of God. And, you know, and in the prayer to really go into a real experience because I'm only ever teaching myself and all that I give, I give unto myself. And so it feels like some kind of swirl of union of experience that's continuous as we're stepping into this new direction. That this gift is being given to all of us as, you know, for us to really delve into this present moment. You know, even the always things like always has no direction, you know, to really merge with God and really merge with that experience. And to see how safe we are there in this present moment, in this holy instant, like that's where the rest comes from, the peace comes from, that everything in this moment is exactly how it's supposed to be. And Jesus is calling us home and wanting us to rest in his love and just abide in this love. And so I feel like with these new worship service coming, I'm we were talking about it yesterday about, you know, never ever thought in a million years that I'd be preaching. I guess that's what I'm doing all the time anyhow. But to know that I don't know just, you know, Jesus has used all of us in so many different ways. But this is like he God is always keeping it new and fresh and alive. And it feels like this new vibrancy that, you know, is it's just continuous. I what was else was I think in this morning about this, you know, this well of love that continues to deepen and deepen as we allow ourselves to just drop into it into this presence that's always here. It's just, I don't know, just, you know, just being here with God and knowing that everything is exactly as it's supposed to be and resting. In his love, but that we have the opportunity with this worship and prayer service. I mean, it's been so fun because we were talking about different places because as we're every day, it feels like we're expanding. And so now over at the place where we've had the stage, it feels like it's growing. And so then we thought, oh, maybe we move over here. But actually what we're going to do is we're going to have two worship places now this morning. It came up that, oh, we should just have another one. So Jesus is having this opportunity for us to come together and just really talk about God, talk about the truth all day, all long, you know, all the time. And just really to feel the experience of that. It's really not anything in time, but for us to, you know, really feel how much he loves us, which is delicious. It's a delicious, delicious presence that every one of us can tap into. And I can feel that when we come together in the worship, it's our minds are all opening up to this love and this joy. You know, we want to experience joy and song and celebration, but for no really earthly reason. It's not of this world. It's because we want to just open up to how much God loves us and, you know, he doesn't love anybody any more than the other. He loves us so exactly the same. And it's in our willingness to come together and really say, you know, I'm going to open up to this. I'm going to actually allow myself to really feel this love and also just the Holy Spirit. You know, I feel like the Holy Spirit is very underrated. I was thinking about, you know, how Jesus left the Holy Spirit with us, the comforter that he's left the Holy Spirit with us. And he's the one that is so eagerly waiting to support us, you know, as we're, you know, fears and doubts and unworthiness and shame and all those things are naturally going to come up. But the Holy Spirit is just eagerly waiting for us to hand it over. You know, developing that relationship with the Holy Spirit is the most important thing. It's like we aren't alone. The Holy Spirit is just saying, you know, just give it to me. Are you willing? You know, and I feel like the maturity. I was even thinking about that this morning, you know, it really does come down to happiness and joy. Really, do you want to be right or do you want to be happy? You know, that really is like so simple. And, you know, it's like God is pulling us into this, you know, living experience. And we don't have a clue of how that's going to look. It's so humbling. I would have never expected, you know, my life the way that it's been. But he is pulling us. And as he's pulling us, he's like, I love you so much. Could you just let go, you know, of the rope? I got this, you know, but it's like really, that's why it's the maturity of developing that trust that we aren't going to be thrown on our heads and that God has a perfect plan for us. And I guess for myself, I see that, yeah, it's so humbling because I could never figured it out and and it's the most perfect plan. And really, it's not of this world. It's a plan of peace, you know, peace that passeth all understanding that, you know, to barely be abide in the presence of God, it's not, it's everything's bringing us into this direct experience of the presence of God. And just, you know, he, yeah, that's all he's pulling us into, to just let go. To really just let go and rest, you know, to be in this rest and safety, because he's got it all figured out. That's what I can see. And I, you know, so humbling, but so beautiful that I'm so happy that I'm wrong about everything that I was like, oh, my goodness gracious, like I, you know, we, that we can be like little children, not just talk about that, you know, these are the scriptures that Jesus has been promising us, you know, that we can really, you know, trust his plan is so perfect for our life and that I don't need to take thought for the morrow. So, yeah, so I think that this worship service is just opening up this whole not whole, whole nother world that I know for myself, it's taking me more into an experience, deeper experience. Oh, it's like, oh, this relationship with God just keeps getting better and better. I, it's this endless, eternal love, you know, that it's like, oh, my goodness, this is really getting good now. And I'm going to be able to say, you know, it's like, oh, that's a new flavor. You know, talk about the fruits of Jesus. You know, I never knew they were so juicy. I was like, oh, this is some good stuff, you know, and it's not of this world. That's what's so beautiful. It has nothing to do with this world. It has to do with our creation and our creator and our communion and our union that keeps as we just open up to this beauty. Oh, my God. And, and, you know, it's like we're doing it together, like this opening experience of that, that we're living together to practice this. I mean, it's like, you know, to open up again each day, we begin again each day. We, you know, OK, let me open up again today. Let me, you know, let myself, you know, trust you a little more today, Holy Spirit. And I feel for me that that's really the spiritual maturity is really knowing that God got this completely, not just saying that, but to real experience that God and Jesus are walking before us and leading the way and that I can, I can truly enjoy the flowers along the way. I can truly smell and stop and smell the flowers and that I don't need to rush. And yeah, just just in our hearts desire for the truth for God, like everything's been given, but the kingdom of heaven first and all things will be added on today. It's not it's like, oh, that's what I get to do. But the kingdom of heaven first, you know, and I'm the kingdom and I kingdom come, I will be done as earth as it is in heaven. But I can really just do that. And then what's miraculous about that is like, you know, then the whole universe supports for me to do that. It's a miracle. I didn't have to fix that. People think that, you know, you have to fix that first, then I can go to God. But no, it's like us really trusting that when you put the kingdom of heaven first, that it will be taken care of, you know, that everything gets taken care of. It's miraculous. Actually, it's like, how did it happen? I have no idea how do I happen? But I know that my desire has been for God and his kingdom. And, you know, and to be in this, you know, promised love affair and he hasn't failed in his promises. And even just this morning, I mean, that we get to sit and listen to these love songs, that this is how we spend our days and preparing worship services and, you know, getting to read the Bible anew. My God, and never and finding the oracle is like, oh, this is a good one, Jesus, you know, just always this new, fresh aliveness that we get to live. Living church ministries. I am the church like, oh, look at that. Yeah, I actually just, even this morning with the song, I was just thinking the ones, it probably is a chain of people who from the beginning that they find a song and they love it and they send to the ones and then they reach to me in this most perfect timing. And I was thinking we have no idea that we are performing miracles that touches someone's heart so deeply in that moment. And that's really our true function in a way that we are being called to be his miracle workers, his followers, but not to perform miracles, so to speak on earth, but it's really to bring a love note to everything we touch. And because I was thinking the other day I was talking with David and and then I watched this near death experience interview. This guy got interviewed by a friend of David's. And and he has this amazing experience where he he was caught by a rip current in Florida. And he was just there was nobody coming towards him to save him because there was a storm behind him as well. He's it was like the last gasp. And then he realized all the life rescuer who were approaching him saw the storm and turned back. So he thought, OK, then this is it. So he surrendered and he said, God, this is it. Just take me and then this huge wall of water. Came and consumed him. And then in it, he saw a shadow came over towards him and pull him out of the water and it was a dolphin. So the dolphin took him out of the water and followed like stayed with him until there was a boat and got him all the way to the shore. And then when he got off the boat, some something was touching his head because he was trading water to walk to the shore. And he turned back and it was the dolphin still following in the shallow water and he was so overwhelmed with emotion. So he turned to the dolphin and he said, you know, God, if you save me with this dolphin, you know, the one that's the old me left in the water, died in the water now from this moment on this person who walked on to shore is yours. It's yours completely. Everything that comes out of this mouth is yours. Everything that I touch is is yours is everything. And this was such a conviction. And I was just listening to that. And I thought, isn't this isn't this what we are wanting deep down our heart? Like, God, I'm yours. My life is yours. This is yours to take. And then then he had this near death experience when he actually fell asleep because he was so exhausted. So it's quite a different near death experience because it's in a dream and vision. And Jesus held him from behind and kind of took him to heaven and said, I'm going to I'm going to hold you to your promise. So your life is mine. I'm going to really use it. And then he said he didn't really think too much about it because he thought it was a dream. But his life changed so much from that moment. Everywhere he goes, he doesn't even know it. He is so clueless. He meets people. He says the things. He doesn't even know it. But people all freaking out around him left and right. Oh my God, can't believe you say this. They all break down into tears crying because everything he says, he does, he shows them is a direct confirmation that Jesus heard their prayer. So when I was listening to that, I even started to see it. You know, this is really what, what this new identity, you know, as we let go of this old aware, just a body and survival and getting. This is really what the new identity is. It's we are used as the messengers of God, you know apostles 2000 years ago apostles. This word means messengers where the messengers of God. And we bring this message, we bring the miracles not for our self. But it's for everything we touch every person we meet. And these miracles have nothing to do with ourselves. It's all orchestrated, all orchestrated by Jesus. Absolutely orchestrated. So we, we're like coming into a situation. We have absolutely no idea what this situation is going to be for. Who are we going to touch? What is going to be coming out of the mouth? What is really, this is really the way that our life is about. And we can truly rest in this assurance that Jesus has a plan, not, not only for, for this so-called body, but it's actually for the whole mind, for the whole world. He has a plan that he wants us to really see how we are having such a big part in bring this message of love absolutely every, every where we go. And I really, I see it, I see it in this, this guy's testimony. I even see it in the song and in people who send me the song. It's just like, wow, if we can only see this is what is going on behind the scenes, behind, you know, our problems and I need to solve this. No, no, no, that is wrong perception. That's wrong thinking. What is really going on is actually this. This is really what's really going on. Yeah, it's interesting that you heard that, that song too, and the word like a love note, even a note. Yeah, it's almost like it's, you can take it as a note, like something that's written, but then or a note in a song, like a vibration, a frequency. And when you start to see that that's the highest use of prayer is to merge in that, that song of gratitude, even this, you could call it the song of prayer, where you just merge into the song and everything is in harmony. And that is the purpose of the prayer is to to be in it and to feel and experience that communion with the Creator, with God, that even in terms of earthly songs, you know, it's nice when you sing a song, but isn't it interesting when you have two people singing a song and there's this harmony or three people singing along, like there's so much feeling when you have people harmonizing on a song. And there's a simple joy to that. It's like, ah, I like that, I like the sound of that, I like the feel of that. And that is the purpose of all the miracles is just to unify our mind to see that that there's just one of us that's not separate parts acting differently, do it going their own way. But it's like the divine dance, everything in one song and one dance, and that's the most natural experience there could be. So it just, I think, takes willingness to to move in that direction, to move away from this idea that I'm separate and I have to figure out a way to survive. I have to figure out a way to interact. I have to figure out a way to be in relationship. And what Jesus is saying is more just just join with me. You know, there's a teaching in the Bible that you come to salvation by grace and not by works. You know, to the ego, everything's about the works. Did you work today? Are you going to work with me? Work, work, work, work, work. For however many years or decades, work, work, work, work. And then even sometimes when people retire from work, their mind keeps wanting to work. They have trouble. Now it's a habit. They can't stop. They can't stop it. And that just shows you that the ego is trying to do anything to dissuade you from this this harmonious song, this glorious unison, this glorious harmony, anything at all. And I find we have to reverse our ideas of using things in the world as means for a future end. In the end, you start to see that the grace has always been there and that nothing you think or said or did was necessary for the grace. The grace was the answer to all of the thinking and saying and doing. Grace is the answer. Grace of this moment, the grace of God. I never had to figure out how to save myself. It was grace that brought a sense of harmony. And it takes all the strain off of it. Then you don't have to think, what am I going to do in the future? It's more of your preparation is just to receive the grace. To actually receive the grace of God is what the preparation is. Not preparing for the future. You're preparing for the present. You're preparing to receive the gift of grace. And then I think when we look at Jesus, we can say, wow, he seemed so friendly. He seemed so relaxed. Whenever they try to throw a difficult question, what do you do about enemies? And he'd say, pray for your enemies. What about those that speak evil things and curse you? Bless them. That's got to be coming from grace. That's not a human answer. Someone smites you on one cheek, turn the other cheek. There's nothing about defending yourself. There's nothing about attacking back. There's nothing about proving somebody wrong. There's nothing about trying to fix or change somebody even, because it must be that if we believe someone's in the wrong, we simply believe someone's in the wrong. And still there's grace. Still the grace of God is coming and going. No, correction is not your function. Leave it to me. Leave it to the grace. And so it's a very different way to live your life. Imagine if you were in high school or university and somebody came to you and said, what do you want to do with your life? And you said, be graceful. That was your answer. Be graceful or just be loving. Extend the being values. Who I am is my contribution. Who I am is my gift. Who I am to God is the gift. That's the miracle of the mind where you start to realize that if you're a creation of God, then it must be that God is thinking you. You've been thunk. Where were you born? I was thunk. I mean, where are your parents? What country? I was thunk by God. Just the look on the, what? Is this a come online? Yes, I was thunk by God. You start to realize that there's a joy in that because there's a perfection that comes with that where you don't have to try to improve upon it. You don't have to try to make it better. And this is a realm, a realm of time where it seems like the ego in time made the show to cover over that grace, to cover over that happiness and that light. I saw something on one of the, maybe Facebook or Instagram where it's like children don't try to be happy. They are happy. They don't search for happiness. They are happy. And then there was a picture of a little girl picking up seashells on the beach with the biggest smile on her face. They don't, they don't have to look for, they look for seashells and they are happy. They don't search for happiness. So I think it's this, that's the trick is turning our birthright, which is happiness, into a search as if we would need to search for it. As if we aren't it itself. But the very search implies that something is missing or something is incomplete. And the grace of God is saying, no, I didn't create you incomplete. I created you love. I created you happy. I created you as my beloved extension. You are, you are the Christ. So wow, to open to that every day, whether it's through a song that comes or the experiences that you have, you know, you as love and as happiness, you want to extend that. And then it seems like we have a lot of opportunities that are given us to do that. And wow, great to step into it. Just to let the grace pour through. And also it's like all these beautiful miracles ripple out quite involuntarily through us expressing in any way that our joy and happiness, if we have something that touches us and then we think of someone, we send this beautiful love notes or in different ways. And this is really how I see the miracles happen. But it's not really through conscious control. That's why, you know, even this morning I was talking with David and David said nothing is better than just coming into any situation completely not knowing. Because our mind is so empty of pre-assumptions, then we're ready to receive whatever that comes through our mind to be given, to extend. Something touches us, something tickles. And that's really where all the spark and miracles start to spread out as in this moment. So that's really a very relaxing way for us to know. You know, we have such a big part and in this divine plan. And yet our part is just to follow. Our part is just to be ready to receive. And not really to think, you know, there's any other part. And I would say that is maturity in trust, in faith. We have mature, our faith in God, in trusting these present guidance matures as we go. That's who we trust. That's who we follow. Yeah, I was thinking of the word care. You know, I think when you care, in the truest sense, it comes from the love in your heart. That's what brings you to be able to care. And I think what the Holy Spirit's just inviting us to do is to start to bring that love and that care to every circumstance, every situation, every situation that we perceive to bring that caring, loving heart. The ego has told us there's things, there's certain people and certain things to care about. And then there's certain people and certain things not to care about. You can be indifferent, the ego says, with some things. And you can care about the special things and the special ones. But I think what Jesus is wanting us to do is to transfer our caring where you have a caring heart. You just bring presence to everything and everyone without exception. And feel like your true self because love is one. Love isn't partial. Love isn't partial love or partial caring. It's whole. It's complete. It just has to just extend and radiate. And sometimes when people try to deal with the world, sometimes they will try to tell themselves, well, I'm just not going to care. But if you ask them, why don't you want to care? They said, because I've been hurt. So maybe I won't be so hurt if I don't care as much. But that isn't the care that comes from within, the care of the spirit, whether there's nothing too big or nothing too small. You know, I liked reading into your answer book of us talking about how Jesus could be in the middle of a teaching. He's speaking to a crowd of people. And then behind him, there's a road and someone's walking on the road and then there's someone who's in need on the road. And he stops his talk. He stops his sermon to go and help the people and the rest are all just hanging there waiting. Like, no, he was talking to us. He's not here now. And then he would go and help somebody walking by on the road who was in need then come back and continue the talk because he was giving great care to everything that was presented to him. He wasn't trying to divide the world up into the things to care about and the things to not care about. Why would we think we could do that? If it's all really one song, one harmony and everything, why would we think we could pull away from part of it and pay attention to part of it and not give full attention? So I think that strikes me as spiritual maturity when you have a caring heart and that caring heart just simply transfers to everything and everyone. You can give the same care to a person or to a flower or to a blade of grass because you're not going to make distinctions between them. And to me it's an attitude. It's a state of mind when you have that care because you're not distracted. You can't be distracted because your mind is focused. Like Jesus said, let thine eye be single. Your prayer is single. Your desire is single. Your focus is single. Your mind is clear and crisp and sharp. It's like a laser beam. But it's a laser beam of love, of caring. So you can just apply that care towards everything. Let that laser beam land on everything. And that is not something that requires a thought of the future either. That's a very present moment experience where you've basically just given over the future to God and say, I placed the future in your hands. And in doing so, you also let go of all these thoughts of the past. All the could of what it should have. If only I could have done this or if only this was different or I wish I could redo that. Or all those thoughts are gone too when you come into that moment. So it's like just being in the beam of love and being happy and content to be that beam of love. Saying, that's my function. I accept my function. Nothing could disturb that either. When you focus on it, then that's, I think that's the most natural experience. Well, do we have a microphone? We have the orange roving microphone. If anybody has anything to share from that. Any online questions coming in yet? We didn't put it out. You're the first one who mentioned it. So now they know. If anyone has a question watching on YouTube or Facebook, you can just type it in the chat. Joe has a question back here. Yeah, I just really want to say how grateful I am for this session. Like as soon as you said the title of the session, I felt it was all for me because I was so triggered when you talked about spiritual maturity before and my ego just grabbed it. And I can just hear it so differently now and that development of trust. And, you know, everything that's happened since then has felt so intense. And the call with Francis, you know, she was just sharing like, you just need to feel carried by God. And I realized how I just didn't trust and I didn't believe that that could be my experience. And when it all came to a head and I finally went, okay, I really don't know. And I really want to know and I really want to be carried and show me. And it's like everything since then has been showing me right up until this moment. And I'm just so very grateful. Thank you. Yeah, I love the topic of the note. And I just had a similar experience this morning. Just not feeling very well at all and being in prayer and just looking at my morning coffee and then just settling into the, I don't know, like just a focus and then seeing the love just, it's like my heart opened with tons of emotions and it felt like everything shifted. And I felt that as you were talking about this deep appreciation for everyone and kind of an opening. But I had a fun experience too with the child, someone I knew from childhood reaching out and letting me know that there was like a Facebook impersonator, is what he said, like someone who was pretending to be my mom on Facebook. And he said, I'm sorry to end the long gap in communication. I wish it were a happier note to end the gap of communication, is the way he put it. And I responded like I said, like I had not communicated with him for a very long time, ever really. I mean, we were friends or a fan from childhood. And I just said, I think this is a beautiful opportunity now to connect and so rather than seeing it that there was a gap, where there was no communication. And so now is a beautiful time to connect with you. And he said, I love that interpretation. And so then we just connected and it felt very, very beautiful and like kind of just miraculous in a way because it, it just felt like a beautiful connection with the spirit. So yeah. So I just wanted to share that, but just felt right on track with my mourning too. So thank you. Thank you. We always can give the gift of a happy interpretation and experience that beautiful reflection back. Oh, that's beautiful. Coming back to the song, it's like when you see a movie and you say, wow, that movie had a great soundtrack. It means they just blended in in the back of these scenes. This something that was very enjoyable, that you were really enjoying it. And then sometimes even when you really are swept up in the music, then you just start to take in the scenes with a greater appreciation. And I know like with some of the great movie makers, Cameron and James Horner, when they were collaborating on the movie, The Titanic, what they do is they basically they shoot the footage and they have the dialogues and the scenes and everything. And then they bring in an artist like James Horner and he sits at a keyboard or with his instrumentation and they just put him in a room and he just watches it and then he watches certain scenes and is so moved from within. And that's where we get the soundtrack. They literally add this heart-opening, majestic, amazing music to the scenes and to the dialogue. And so sometimes it just comes in that way. And so I started to think more about how songs and worship is kind of like, it feels more that's like the soundtrack of the parable of David. So many scenes have been filled with a song that's underneath, a very beautiful song. And that seems to unify everything. It seems to, if you had a life review, and you had not only a life review with Jesus, but a great soundtrack of the life review, you know, where you were just like, oh, wow. Yeah, right. That's it. That's it, you know. And that's the kind of life review you want. That's like, it's so great and this music's so good. And then it's just like, wow, job well done. Okay. All right. Okay. All right, it was magnificent. Okay. It's different from that idea that you have to hash through. What did I do wrong? Or what could I have changed? Or how could I have had it? Why did I take this turn? You know, all the wood-a-cuda shittives of the ego are all collapsed in the soundtrack, where you just feel the joy and the harmony and the appreciation. And I think when Jesus first had me start traveling, most of the traveling I did the early years was by car. So you just, you know, some people would say, well, that has got to be the most mundane boring thing ever to be in a car driving around and around and around, many times around the United States, because it's a lot of miles just with the engine humming and you've got this scenes going by you as you just drive and drive and drive and drive. It's like the movie Forrest Gump, except he had his jogging shoes on. He was running, running, running. Remember the scenes? Run, Forrest, run. And he was just run, run, run. I was drive, drive, drive in the little car. Yeah, but the thing is the most important part of the car for me was not the tires or the engine or the seats or anything. It was the stereo system because I always wanted to have the greatest soundtrack playing. So, you know, you're coming into a new city or you're coming to the Bay Area and you see the Pacific Ocean and then boom, you've got your sound system going too. It's like a movie, you know. It's like you've got a great sound system, a soundtrack going as you're watching the scenes. And after a while, I thought, yeah, that's the most important part. Like people would say, yeah, the car's ready to go, everything's, oil's changed, new tires. It's just good to go. How's the sound system? Oh, the radio's, the stereo's broken. Not gone. That's not good enough. No, that's the first thing you should have checked. I forget the tires. I forget the tires. I can always stop and get tires. I can always stop and get something, but I need my music. So for me, the music's been important, you know, because I could feel how unifying it was. Even when I was going through really difficult stages where I was really down, the music had a way of kind of lifting me out. And I thought, wow, this is amazing. And then you start to realize you have gratitude for the song, the song of prayer that's always been there, the grace that's been underneath whatever struggles and difficulties you were going through. It's the song was still there. I wasn't always paying attention to the song, but eventually you start to pay more attention because you have more appreciation for it. You see, like, oh, I think that's the most important part. There was something beautiful, so beautiful there, every moment. And now I want to be aware of it. I want to be aware of it. So I think that's part of the whole thing with the worship, prayer and worship coming in and more music, more instruments starting to show up and even more sets. You know, we can even have a roving set because really the worship is really just your state of mind, your attitude. So it doesn't, it's not really dependent on a place. When you're happy, then the whole world looks happy and you bring the happiness with you. So it's not like something that is an activity that you start or stop. It's just something that comes from your heart. So that's, that's good. That's, we're coming to this now, the soundtracks reaching a crescendo. Yeah, yeah. I have a question about being miracle-minded. I think it relates to the worshiping as well. It's like, yeah, in a way, like even if doubt thoughts come up, having, having like the desire for God as the lantern to go through all of that. But I don't know if you can just tell me a little bit more about that because I love it when you talk about being miracle-minded. But yeah, just yeah, if you can tell me a bit more about that. Well, I think when, when I first started to open up to miracles, I, I started to get this feeling like, wow, they're, they're just waiting to come through. Like Jesus saying, you know, you have a, you have a storehouse of miracles within you. And you, and they're just waiting to come through. They're just, they're just waiting for your own willingness and readiness. And they've always been there for you, kind of like almost having a whole group of angels with you. And first of all, not recognizing they're there. And then when you recognizing they're there, then, then you have to like say, I need your help or be a participant in my life. You know, I want you to help me. And I think it's the same where the human condition is kind of a, a covering over where everything has to be explainable and fit into some kind of a box and, and relate to something so that it can be studied or, you know, found out in that way. And, and for me, it was more of, of something that had to be introduced to me. Having to start to believe in miracles, not even fully knowing what they were, but just kind of feeling like, wow, I, but they sound good. They sound good. I, I don't know what they are, but they sound really good. And then you start to open up more and more. And then the first wave of doubt thoughts you have to have is most of us were not raised to be miracle workers. That's just not something. I mean, if they tell you we can grow up to be this and this, they don't, they, I've never found a university that has a course in miracle working 101 or, or an advanced curriculum. You know, what's, what's your major? Miracles. You know, people think it's crazy, you know, but, but I did explore because I was in university for 10 years full time. So I basically explored everything in the university. I was taking art classes, art history. I was in a conservatory of music at the university of Cincinnati. I took legal classes. I took engineering classes, mathematics, calculus. I was in urban planning. I took architecture classes. 10 years. I took in 10 years. I took everything they offered and they didn't offer miracles. I, I can tell you that it was a big university too. And they did not. And then after those 10 years of university, the first thing that came to me was a course in miracles. So, you know, it's almost like I couldn't find the course offered and I tried and there was not there. But then the first thing that came was, okay, you ask for it and you've got it. But the more I kind of gave myself in that direction, it was more about undoing. I thought this is clever. It's in the form of a course, but it's actually more of unlearning. So it's clever. And what I got was, yeah, miracles are natural. They're so, so natural, but, but you've, you've learned too much of the other of the ego cover. You've, you've covered it over so much that you, you can't know what they are. You can't experience them. You can't appreciate them because you have, you haven't allowed yourself to experience them. So I think that's the first step. It's, it's quite a journey to overcome the doubt, but the first step is, is giving yourself a willingness and an openness to try something that you have never tried before. And I tried a lot of things before, but this was not something. And, and I didn't really have anybody that was encouraging me in that direction either. They were encouraging me in the other direction, like find something, please, for God's sake, find something and finish it, you know, and use it and become something in the world, become something. And intuitively, that just didn't feel like that was my purpose or my calling. But I think that's why I took so long. It took 10 years is because I, I couldn't really, I wasn't really ready to, to go in another direction. But then once I was, then everything started to come to me. Yeah, that's it. Like Joe was saying, when Joe prayed and then all of a sudden this whole new way, this new interpretation came in and then, and this like, that's again, like the gift of grace, it's by grace, the grace of God, you know, God's will is for us to be happy. And there's nothing that can actually stop God's will. There's nothing that can, can stop grace. It's, it's unstoppable. It's an unstoppable grace, you know. And so then you start to think, well, if it's unstoppable, then maybe I shouldn't try to stop it. Just go with it, you know, surrender, that's surrender. But it just contradicted everything that I believed in. So that's why there was a lot of kind of initially some pretty strong resistance to it, strong, like not just a few doubts that's here and there, but like some walls, like dark walls of doubt. And then little by little things start to open up and, you know, like that Bachman Turner overdrive song, you know, You Ain't Seen Nothing Yet, Dun, Dun. Bubba baby, you just ain't seen nothing yet, Dun, Dun. And Jesus is like, here's something that you're never going to forget. You know, God, there's, here's the unstoppable love. Here's the irresistible love. Here's the inevitable love. And, and you can't gauge that love by anything that the past has taught, even though we've been kind of addicted to the past and it's very habitual. The past is just like a bad habit. And, and Jesus is like, yeah, come with me and we'll kick the habit. Let's kick the habit. But I think the main thing is just the willingness, the willingness to go in that direction. Because even if you're willing, and I think I showed glimmers of willingness during my, my 10 years in university, but I wasn't ready. I just, I wasn't ready to, to really go for it. And then there just came a point where I was, I was ready. And that's when it all started to just unfold effortlessly after I was ready. But before I was just, oh, that's not, that was cool. That was nice. Oh, wouldn't it be nice? And, you know, but I still wasn't ready, but then when you get ready. And readiness is not something that has anything to do with time and space. You know, it's almost like even from a reincarnational perspective, you could think of those as just attempts or opportunity to loosen from guilt without really being ready to entirely loosen from guilt. And then now we seem to, on this seeming go round, we, we are actually ready. You know, I look at the community and it's, and for me, I love to share and shine and extend. And we have a lot of collaborative projects, but, but the thought that's coming out now underneath the projects that's wanting, you know, to really rise up as part of the worship is let's have some fun. Let's really have some fun. Not the kind of worldly fun, like part, party time. Because it's not that, it's not that kind of. I tried that too. It was not fun, but I'm talking about genuine fun where like even with, we have our little Spanish ministry that we're putting together, but we're, we have a little meeting coming up, but we're just going to have some fun. If we do a broadcast, we want it to be a broadcast of joy, of happiness. We want it to be a demonstration of whoever's watching going, wow, they're having some fun. I don't know, you know, because that's attractive. That's how you make God attractive by being joyful, by being happy. That people aren't really interested. They're pretty fed up with theologies and philosophies and they're, they're overwhelmed and inundated with philosophies. And it's like, yada, yada, yada, yada. Don't even tell me. I don't even want to know what it is. But that vibe over there is fun and happy. Whatever that is, you know, I want, I want that. I want, I want to move into the direction of that. I want to open up my heart toward that. And that's how you, in the end, transcend the Dal thoughts is through happiness and joy. I mean, if you're happy, who would look further? Who would look anywhere? Who would look left, right? When you're above me, you're below me, you're beside me, you know, when you start to get that feeling that the presence of Christ has really got you, you know, you're really surrounded by the love of God, then you're happy. So that's the kind of things we're just going to be meeting to kind of let it emerge. How, how's this going to emerge? And it's the same with like our online courses, you know, Eric and Laverne have been really looking and we had, was it yesterday we had a little touch base call and update call. I was just swept up into happiness. I was, I was come up with so many downloads of ideas of what we could, what can come from this, you know, because it seems like it's unlimited potential. That was the swirl. So it was quite a joyful update meeting we had because it was, we were just kind of letting the spirit kind of download like, you think maybe this, this, this, whoa, you ain't seen nothing yet. Like it will be far greater than you can imagine based on your past experiences. But all we have to be is willing to step into it. And then the doubt just fades away. Kind of like, you know, when, when we've had some string of, of rain and cloudy day or cloudy days here, but here we are this morning. I got up and we're going live streaming and look at the sun is shining. The sun is blazing today. And that was just kind of just a symbol. Like, wow, we just love that symbol of the direct sunlight. Even now I can look out, see the bright green leaves and the bright flowers and everything because it's all illuminated. It's not, it's not gray. It's vibrant, vibrant colors. And that's just a symbol too of how our life is meant to have vibrant happiness. You know, we're not here to settle for, how's your, how's your life? So, so come see, come saw, you know, so, so, you know, that's that Jesus is like, that's you, you're going to settle for the so-so when you're, you can have so much more than so-so and, and just let it show itself too. Like Joe was saying, just trusting, just like it's going to just show itself. God's got you, you know, God is and God's got you every step of the way. And wow, that's, that's beautiful. Just to pray on that, contemplate that. Yeah. Yeah. Instead of so-so because this morning I was even talking and I said to JPS that, you know, it just everything like is so too good to be true. You know, like we got to connect with God, God. And he said, yeah, Jesus is too good to be true. That's our guide. You know, this is our life too good to be true. And that's instead of so-so, it's, oh my God, this is where, you know, where are we going to rest when we follow a guide that is too good to be true. Guiding us to this state of mind that everything is beyond so-called even magical. I don't want to use that word, but that is almost like this is the quality. Once you become a miracle worker, a true follower of Jesus to say, you know, just use, use me up, use me, and I'm going to have no, I'm going to be your child, you know, have no preconception of how this life, this day going to be. And you interpret all his interpretation is so, so good. And you lose attraction to any interpretation. That's not good. That doesn't bring you happiness. Even something seems to be presenting itself. And you're like, oh, Anna, I'm going to wait. I'm going to wait for this only goodness going to come to my mind to tell me what it is. That's the attitude of little child. Just I trust you so, so much, Jesus, that I don't accept anything else because I know who you are. I know who you are. So I'm going to wait for this presence that's so, so good to tell me what it is, to tell me what I am, to tell me what my brothers are. And that's really our, our life. You know, it's, we, we, we live in this world, but not off it because God is not here. And we can be with him. He's swept up. Yeah. And it really is that living in wonder. I mean, I mean, just the mystery schools that we've had. I know a lot of you have gone through the program, but, you know, it's really this grace to live in the prayer, to wake up every day and say, God, what is your will for me today? You know, not no, you know, like I don't feel like, like, oh, okay, I'm going to be a miracle worker today. That's not what I'm thinking when I wake up. But when we're just open and ready, I think that for me, it's been a life of from, I remember I was a getter. I was always trying to get, get, get, get, get, get. And I was so empty and so depressed and so dead, but I just was doing what I thought I was supposed to do, get, come here and accumulate whatever was. And so for me, it was a real learning how to turn off the getting mechanism and start giving, you know, and being in an experience and really present with that and consciously choosing, you know, for me, I remember thinking, well, I thought that's what I was supposed to do. I thought I was supposed to get something here and to turn it all around. And then I really like feel the experience that God wants to give through me, not just say that, let me, that God only gives. He can only give and is a creation of God that he wants to give through me. And he's going to give you so many opportunities to give. And like, it's like, you know, you don't even need to go looking for them or you don't need to go do it. It's like, I'm just going to be ready and open to give. Where are you going to have me given being in that presence, you know, in that real prayer, you know, okay, this is what I'm going to, and then you start to feel the blessing. Oh, that feels so good. Oh, that feels really good. You know, that this is all I'm here to do is that this supports me remembering God. You know, I used to say the monastery, you know, it's like, it's like you turn on the faucet. Like it's a gushing water that wants to come out of the giving. And, you know, then you start to feel this like you're not doing anything at all. Actually, you're just open to the spirit to say, I'm here to be truly helpful. And so it's like, oh, okay, every day I get to wake up. And, you know, really, it's not about anything in time. It's about being in that experience of that living water or something that's coming through you. It's like, oh, wow, that's something new, you know, that I'm going to be able to live this way. And you can feel when you start to say no. And it comes up to tons, you know, but it's the contraction, that contraction when I say, no, I don't really want to do that. No, I'm not doing that. And the minute that you shut that off, it's like you just shut off something that it feels like you shut off life. There's some kind of feeling like, you know, it's you go inward and just become contracted. And I guess for me, that's really what it's, you know, even this morning and that never stops. It's just, whether you call it a miracle worker or whatever it is, I'm here, you know, to give and I don't get to choose what that's going to look like. Jesus is, and that's what's beautiful is the more that you're saying, yes, he's giving you like even the worship thing. This is a whole new way that I feel of giving, you know, of singing. You know, this is like a new song that wants to sing through all of us that I would have never planned at all. And just such an honor and how that affects people. I have no idea in my willingness to open up because even for me, you know, just even that session that I did last week, that was pretty vulnerable for me because I kind of do that in my own little backyard or whatever. And so, you know, and like I really did hear, I'm going to cry about this. But that morning he said, you know, I have, I have fulfilled all of your wishes and hopes and everything. And now he said, we got a little, you got to give me a little sum sum here today. That's how me and God talk. Me and God got a really nice little love affair. He knows how to sweet talk me. But anyhow, you know, like, oh, well, you know, he did give me and when I look, he's like, oh my goodness gracious, like, you know, and I, and then it was just like, you know, and really all I can really share, I feel authentically is just all this love, you know, but, you know, I've never done it in public before. Truthfully, my neighbors used to watch me on the side there. Like, what are you doing over there, Lisa? And I remember one time my neighbor said to me, it was so sweet because I was letting myself burst out. And then I didn't even know it. I had had this, like, what are they called, like, terrorist there and you couldn't see with all these plants. You remember all my deck and I used to go out on my deck and just sing to the top of my lung. And I would just do it all the time. And then one day I'm sitting out there praying and she said, I couldn't even see her. She goes, are you going to sing today, Lisa? From behind the plants. From behind the plants. And I was like, oh my word. And then she goes, I love when you sing, Lisa. And I'm like, oh my goodness. Like, she was behind the wall over there somewhere. I mean, we had a lot of room. I'd be like from over there, but she could hear me. You have an audience. Exactly. And I didn't even know it. I'm like in this like, whatever. But now I feel like, I don't know, like, because we were talking, you know, it's like really becoming vulnerable. Really, I feel like God is pulling us and expanding us. For me, I guess on the journey, I didn't realize when that discomfort came, it's like, it's fear or doubt or shame or whatever it is that it's really growing pains. That's what I see. We're just in growing pains. I was talking to Emily this morning, just, there's a massive shift right now that we're going in. Well, David's arrived, of course. You know, and it's like this massive shift that's happening. And, you know, the ego doesn't like it at all. The ego wants to contract and resist and no, no, no. But, you know, when I, I guess for me over the years, what I've learned is you go with it and you go with it and you feel like, oh, you, you start, you don't like the feeling of that contraction anymore or that resistance. It's like, that's just not natural. I want to open up and really trust God's plan and, and really be in this experience of, you know, expansion, you know, because Jesus says that the mind of God expands forever and we are part of that mind of God. And so our natural state, I feel is in that, like a star bursting, you know, it continues to expand and like, that's what we want. But the ego's like, you know, so it's like these opportunities to step into that expansion that are being given here that are always new over the years. I think we've just, I mean, every year I think we have some kind of like this too shall pass. You know, it's like we seem to be working on these major things, whatever they are, and then it could disappear. But it was never, it's never about the form. It's not even about, it's for us to go into this deeper experience of God and trusting and, and that's what I know. It's like it's not the form, but this is what's being, will support us to continue all of us. And that's what I see. Like, look, you guys are all at the new, you know, I see a new group here. It's like it's pushing everybody into this movement of, you know, God expansion, trust, miracle working, whatever you want to call it. But that opening for the spirit to come through us all. Yeah, that's, it's just really getting down to the cut the chase, get, get to the point. The point is to be Christ-like, not because of something in the world, but because God created you as the Christ and the point therefore is to be Christ-like. Now that's going to require some, some forgiveness, some inner work. You're going to have to face the fears, the doubts. You're going to have to face everything that the ego can throw. You know, you're going to have to get to the point with the ego where you start to build the confidence in the Holy Spirit and it grows stronger and stronger. And then, you know, then you get so confident, you actually turn to the ego and Pat Benatar, hit me with your best shot. Come on, hit me with your best shot. Fire away, you know, you, you're not going to be afraid of the ego. You're going to actually get confident in the Spirit with hit me with your best shot. Fire away, because, because we're here to be Christ-like, because it's, it's the most natural thing there could be. We were created as the Christ, so we're here to be Christ-like. And it was funny yesterday, I think, I woke up and I got a message on Facebook Messenger and somebody I'd never heard of before, but they got a message through to me and they said, Holy Spirit has guided me to send you this video. Don't you love it? You had somebody you've never met. Holy Spirit has guided me to send this video. So of course I watched the video and I'm like, great, you know. And it was a preacher. And it's a preacher I've listened to over the years here and there. Now he's got a little tinge of gray coming in because he's been preaching for 43 years. And so I saw him and I, right away, his name is Cree Flow. So, oh, Cree Flow, nice to see you again. And there was Cree Flow and he started to get into his sermon. But one of the things he was making a distinction with in his sermon was between being a fan of Jesus and a follower of Jesus. Let's look at the difference between being a fan and a follower. Like when we think of, we're fans of sports teams, of singers, of movie actresses. We're fans of all kinds of things in this world. But fan doesn't mean you're really a follower of. You just, you just like them. You enjoy them, but you don't, you're not really a follower. And even with Jesus, you know, if Jesus wants us to be Christ-like and we, and we're a fan of Jesus sentimentally. Yeah, love what you stood for. Great, great, great. I got things to do. I'm busy, but, you know, but I'm your fan. I'm a fan. And then Cree Flow was saying, when I go and meet Jesus and Jesus asks me, you know, what did you do with your life? How did you spend your life? I want to be able to say to Jesus honestly, I tried my best to follow your teachings and to be like you. Not a fan of, which is a fan was, you know, a fan can be involved in lots of things. You can be fans of many things in this world and you can have many things going on. But to, to follow Jesus is to be Christ-like and Christ-like is love. How loving was I to everything and everyone in my life? That's what counts. How caring was I? How peaceful was I towards my fellow brothers and sisters? What was my connection with my fellow brothers and sisters? Because that connection is designed just to take us in one direction, is to be Christ-like. And so it was so beautiful. I just had tears of joy as I was listening to Cree Flow because I was thinking, there it is. It's so simple. It's, he was using all kinds of examples and Pastor, Pastor, but I never miss a church. I'm in church every Sunday. So, so what to Cree Flow says, you're in church every Sunday, but are you a follower of Jesus is teachings? Are you a demonstration of the Christ? Are you demonstrating love in action every single moment of every single day? Oh, but Lord, Lord, you know, I've done things. I'm manifesting things now. Lord's got me. No, that doesn't matter. I've learned five new ways to make money. No, that doesn't matter. Are you a follower of Christ? Are you demonstrating love? You know, he was just going through all the things. And he was talking about different courses and things that people can take and how to be a better husband, how to be a better wife. He said, it's the grace of God to be Christ like that is what it's about. It's not trying to be a better person. It's trying to be Christ like. And is that a high enough standard for us Christ like? If God is love and Christ is love, then that is setting the bar way up there. We're going way beyond being a fan. We're going right into the following. And even if we know we do our live broadcast or we put online programs up or we come out with our new Spanish show. We don't really care if anyone's watching. We don't need fans. But what we need to do moment by moment, day by day is have some fun. And we have that fun by following Christ from crying to be Christ like. It's just like the obvious simple thing. Oh my gosh, that's the point of course to be Christ like. And it doesn't matter if it seems like it's a high standard because with activities, you know, you can do the activities for a while. Then you then you stop doing it when you say, yeah, enough of that. People sometimes do that with the Bible up. Enough of that. Of course, another that I got a new diet. Enough of that. New exercise routine. Enough of that. I floss. No, enough of that. You know, I mean, you, you can get into anything in terms of form. And then at some point you lose the inspiration and you just drop it. You move on to something else. And it's the same with being a fan. You can be a fan of this one, this one, this one, this one. And then they, they either die or they get scandal and locked up in prison. And you, you squint now you're you unsan them. They're in prison. No, you know, the one you like the singer. Yeah, they're in prison. Click on fan. But see, you can fan and unfan all the time. But, but to be a follower is like a full time present moment devotion. So really that's what Cree flow was kind of getting at. He was saying, you know, we don't need fans. We are here for devotion. We're here for a state of being. We're here to be a demonstration of love. In the end, that's what counts. None of the stuff will count. This is all like the props. This is the props. Like, like you were saying, God said, you know, you've got all your whims. I gave you plenty of whims. I know I was there watching. Lisa was getting, you had all kinds of whims. I've never seen so many whims answered. You set the all time Guinness World Book of Record for most whims answered in a lifetime. And then he's saying, I need something from you now. I know I need you to love. I need you. Right. Everything else was given. So beautiful is because I think you were saying it the other day, but I don't want anything from this world anymore. I have no desires of this world. There's nothing anyone could give me of this world. And it's like, you know, like, yeah, like he has given me all my whims. I'm unbelievable. Any thought, I feel like he has given me. If I even have a tiny little thought, it like comes in, you know, it's pretty interesting actually. Like I don't need to think about that. There's kind of things at all. But just to open my heart and give my heart and love, like you're saying, it's just like this invitation. Well, I feel like we are that, you know, we are the Christ. We are the Christ in our natural state of that loving. That's when we wake up to our union with God. But that's what it's all about. It's the Christ living Christ that divides within all of us. And it's not just words. It's like, that's what we were created to do. And then it's like, you know, just to continue to open up to this bountiful, endless loving. Really each moment where there's Benny, when we pull up in the driveway, how happy he is to see us. You know, you know, he's, he's ready to love. He cries when we pull up. He's the happiest one that's ever seen me here. Yeah, because I think in the end you start to realize it's, it's between you and the Creator, which is really Christ and the Creator. And you can see why it would be between you and the Creator, Christ and the Creator, because that's, that's everything. That's, that's absolutely everything. And once you start to get up into the tractor beam of that devotion, where you just think, wow, every day I just want to think the thoughts that you give me, God, every day I want to just express the light that you are and that I am, and that you, you gave me in creation. Once you get into that, then, then the first thing you'll notice is you have no longer an interest in opinions, good opinions, bad opinions. You find you're, you're just not interested in opinions because God has nothing to do with opinions and Christ has nothing to do with opinions. That's reality. So then you're on your way, you know, I'm on my way. You know, once, once you've got your devotion going, and then, you know, the opinions, it would be like, if you were like an actor, an actress, and you did a play or a movie, and then you read the reviews, become the critics. Interesting name. Wouldn't that be a terrible profession? What do you do for a living? I'm a critic. Oh, God. That's your profession? Yes. What do you do? I'm, I'm, I'm, I want to heal. I'm the Christ. Spit it out. It's the truth. So, you know, but you imagine if you're identified as an actor or an actress, then you read the reviews after your movie or your play, and you're very much giving full attention to the reviews. And if the reviews are good, then it props up the self-concept, the acting image. And I did look up act one time in the dictionary. What does act mean to impersonate? Oh, now we've got an ego impersonation going on there. So, but if you look and the critics praise you, then the ego is happy. If the critics pan you and criticize you, then you're down. And, and therefore to me, it started to be obvious that I had to really get into a devotion, a devoted life of prayer, because how else am I going to transcend the opinions of the world? How else will I not take it seriously? How else will I not react and respond unless I get anchored in the truth of my, my creator and my being? And for most people, they have a lot of whims, whims, whims. I was just talking a couple of nights ago to a friend who's, who's an actress and she's been, she met me and she started studying the course and she carries the coursebook all around with her when she travels around the world and, and she's devoted to Jesus and Mary and, and forgiveness and everything. But, but she had, oh, she was having a very happy life where everything seemed to be very, very happy. And then her agent called her and said, you've been offered to do a series on Netflix. She just told me two nights ago. She said, I thought, hmm, that's a dream job. That's actually what I've been dreaming about my whole life, you know, to get offered to do a series on Netflix. And she did, she went for it and she somehow felt that she got more identified with the image because she started to get unhappy just from going for the dream job. And I think it's like, if we just start to see things as whims, but we know there's something so much greater than the whim, then we keep surrendering into the, the greater. But if we think that the, the whim will bring us happiness, the thing, the, the part or the action or the possession or the relationship or something in form will be the source of happiness, then it's the ego that is smiling back in the back saying, got you again. I threw another sparkly diamond and pearl in front of you. I dropped it down. And when you reached for it, the ego is like, gotcha, gotcha. I'm still safe in hiding back here because you're still chasing after the trinkets and going for the next trinket, not realizing that there's nothing, you know. So we had a talk and again, it was the whole point of the joining was just, oh, let's come back. Yeah, what's, what do I really want? What do I really, really want? What brings me happiness when I just open my heart to it and my mind to it? By the end of the conversation, we were just laughing and laughing and laughing and laughing and, and to me, that's what the point of everything is. We, we want to be able to honestly laugh to feel that happiness and joy and, and discovered that it's through devotion of letting the spirit just come through me, give through me, sing through me, smile through me, hug through me, laugh through me, speak through me, whatever that surrender is, is the whole key. Because you're just doing it for the right reason. You're doing it for love. You're doing it for love. And that, I can't think of anything that's more important. Yeah, I always also think to be Christ means to be fed sustained by Christ as well. You know, sometimes I ask myself, you know, receive your daily bread. Did I, did I receive my daily bread to sustain me to be happy or the mind is like thinking of food or just, you know, it's like a such a different, am I sustained by the daily activities of food, thoughts, problems, solving problems? Or am I really receiving my daily bread, which give me joy, which give me energy, which fills me up. And, and that is what we can count on, we actually can live by. It's very, very practical. It's not, it's not an empty promise, but that is what I think a day to day living experience that will point us directly to know that we are Christ when we actually allow ourselves to be sustained by that, by the daily bread that is given to us on the day, not the day before, because, you know, you receive every single moment and then you extend what you receive to realize, yeah, Christ with me, truly Christ before me, behind me, above me, beneath me. And I live in it, I'm sustained by it. And that, that is what it means to, to know that we're Christ. It's not a concept. There is no concept that's going to make us happy. It doesn't matter how many years we, we know about a concept. We talk as a group about the concept. It doesn't really matter, but this is our daily practice and daily experience and daily life that convinces us beyond a shadow of doubt. This is what sustains me. This is given to me in this moment to make me happy. And there's nothing else that makes me happy. But, but that is what I consider, you know, being Christ and how practical it feels like, truly, in a day-to-day experience. Give me my daily bread. That's the Lord's prayer. Daily bread. Give me my daily bread. God is my shepherd. I shall not want. God is my shepherd. I like nothing. I like nothing in you because I have my daily bread sustaining me. That's what I like. Nothing. I don't even pray for, for things. Give me this. Give me that. No. We're about our father's business. I mean, that's, it's like, this is the biblical scriptures that, you know, Jesus was teaching about living this, you know, that he does sustain our soul and I shall not want. And he leads me into the green pastures and lays me down to rest and whatever, you know, these living, it's this living experience. But we really, I mean, it's the way it is. We're about our father's business. You know, this isn't a business of the world. We're not getting any wealth. We're not getting it, you know, that we, our, our, our wealth is really the riches of the kingdom, which is not of this world, which is this fullness and this connection with God. Well, me two former manifesters who have now succumbed to God. Soren, back there, are you, are you, do you have a question, Soren? Oh, back there raised in his hand. Yeah, I was just noticing my mind, you know, when you were speaking up there about maturity and, and, and, you know, why you were speaking, you were answering many of the question that came up in the mind. And I think, I think what's left because, because I'm recently become the overseer of the program, the intern program. And so I've kind of being the face of the community for the interns here. And I think from many of the interns here, you know, the questions comes up, is, you know, is, is the community necessary for me to actually do the worshipping, do having the relationship to Jesus, doing mind training? Is that, is that community actually necessary? Is that because coming here, you know, it kind of, it does challenge, you know, a lot of beliefs, a lot of beliefs are coming up here, you know, rubbing up against each other. And, you know, a lot of stuff is coming up. And, you know, and to worship Jesus in this environment actually takes a lot of courage to still believe that, that he's there, despite I'm feeling all this hatred, despite I'm, I see my brother, you know, maybe not clearly. And maybe I was just wondering, you know, if you could speak to what the community has meant for you, reaching the maturity that you're speaking about? Yeah. Well, when Joni and I were up here recently, we were both kind of talking about how, how at a certain point, in different points along the way, then there's like these openings, it's kind of like a different use of symbols that I think for both of us were pretty unexpected, actually, we were trying to both convey, ooh, wow, ooh, didn't see that one coming, ooh, didn't see that one coming, you know, they were helpful. And I would say, even when we use the word community, because it kind of implies a group of persons, even though we can see the goal is Christ, is timelessness, is going toward eternity, towards remembrance of God, that I think community is like I was sharing, it's a symbol that Jesus used to help me get in touch with what was going on in my mind. It helped me get more in touch with the unconscious because it was like mirrors. It's another word for community for me is mirrors. And of course, anybody who has a relationship knows there's a lot of mirroring that goes on. And then sometimes they have a relationship, if they have children, there's more mirrors. If they have animals, oh yeah, we got three cats and four dogs. Yeah, you've got a community going right there. You know, let's face it, it's just mirrors. And so when I seemed to be going through the parable of David, if somebody had asked me, you know, when I was a child or a teenager or even in my 20s, you know, what's your opinion about spiritual communities? I would have just said, what? What's that? I had no concept in my mind. I was raised as a Christian. We went to church, you know, we would call it a church. We have some fellowship or we go to Bible studies in the summer or something. We had our terms for it all. But as somebody said, what's your opinion of spiritual communities? I would say, well, what is that? Tell me what that is. And I don't have an opinion because I don't know what that is. So I think we could say that the goal is communion. The goal is like Jesus experienced communion. I and the Father are one, the Creator and the creation, you know, God and Christ are one spirit. That's communion. That's not community. There's no community in heaven. You don't join it. It just is. You can't join it or unjoin it. You can't go to it or leave it because it's just what is. It's just like Jesus says in the Course, we say God is and then we cease to speak. It's just business, pure business. But for me, it was helpful because as I've said in the parable of David, I was shy. And I did not use the interpersonal relationship. I mean, I did not have a romantic relationship until I was like 20, 27 or something like that. And so it's like, I just had to say to Jesus, you know the way that I need to heal. You know the way to help heal my unbelief or heal my unconscious mind that I'm not even aware of. And you know, of course coming and then relationships coming and then communities coming and then going to different communities, you know, you find that same undercurrent of ugliness coming up in all the communities. I never went to one community where they're just eternal beings. It was always like mirroring, mirroring, mirroring. And so you start to realize at some point, like if it's mind training and the mind isn't informed, then basically all you go through is mind training to release the ego. And it's not like being in community or out because I always thought that's a that's an artificial line in community out of community. You know, that's just another artificial ego construct. But the real question is how do I feel? Am I at peace? Do I feel harmony? Do I feel love and connection? And I think that was helpful that Jesus took me seemingly traveling for so many years, decades to kind of wash away any idea I would have of community. So I could be free of the boundaries and the borders which are artificial and just start to feel that I want connection with all my brothers and sisters, not just some configuration of people. I want it with everything and everyone. And the travels helped a lot with that. And also you start to feel at some point, like if you're experiencing struggles and difficulties and challenges and living in communities seems like a lot of work. I'm not just talking about physical work, but mentally you start to feel this is draining. This is absolutely draining. Who chooses to have 25 mirrors? I don't want to live in a house of mirrors. That's for the circus. If I want to go to the hall of mirrors, I go to the circus and then you go through and somehow you get out. Hopefully it's the end of it. You're out. But I do feel like part of the gift for me was learning to open up to collaborations, guided collaborations like the one that Joni and I did. That was just kind of a dropped in. It wasn't like big preplanned thing that we had on our calendars for weeks and months. It just kind of dropped in. Livestreaming. We're up here with our little bare feet twiggling around. And just we were just riffing. We were just talking about what happened. Felt a nudge. Felt a guidance. Did this. Didn't see that coming. Oh, I didn't know. Didn't see that coming. We were just being transparent. But it starts to go beyond the idea of thinking of a community as a thing. And you start to say, well, I'm not really, if Christ is my goal, I'm interested in the state of mind. I'm not interested in finding a thing. I found lots of things. I don't need another thing. But I am interested in connection. I am interested in openness. And if transparency is a way to come to that healing, then Jesus used the transparency. If that will help me, if that will help free my mind, please use the transparency as well. And ultimately, we just have to become so much a follower of Jesus and the Holy Spirit and our intuition that then the questions start to fall away. Once we get into our devoted life, we're not constantly thinking about here or there or this thing or that thing. It's quite a conflictual state of mind to be constantly chattering away. What about this? What about that? When am I going? How do I get out of here? Better stay. You should stay. I should leave. No, no, no. After a while, our devotion just takes over. And in some ways, I think that's what relationships are designed to be as collaborations and very loving, respectful collaborations. And that's the highest we can hope to attain. I've even had a lot of experiences with collaboration where I would collaborate. I thought I was collaborating with people. And then the project would start and then the people would seem to leave the project until they all left. And I would say to Jesus, well, that's a failure right there. That's a failed collaboration. And he said, no, no, that's been designed just this way. So now you can collaborate with me. That's the collaboration with you. He said, yeah. But I don't think we can do. We lost the people. We lost the skills. He said, no, I have the skills. And I can bring the skills out of you that are maybe not in your awareness, but you can do more than you think you can do if you join with me. With me, you can do much more. And so then I began to start to think of kind of collaborating with Jesus or collaborating with Holy Spirit. And once I kind of shifted to that, then things started to flow because there was no problems. People could leave, be like, continue on. More people leave, continue on. You see, there was no desperate sense that the collaboration was linear. It was more like I was being shown. Oh, it's a very, I get it. It's a vertical collaboration. It's with you. He says, yeah, I give the instructions and you follow until the point comes where you see we're the same one. Then there's no more instructions. There's no more leader follower. But so yeah, that's just what it's been for me. I know we've all had, it's an interesting topic, this topic of community because yeah, Jesus can use it very well, but the ego can jump all over it. It will just like, oh, I can make that into hell. I'll take that concept and run it right into hell. But yeah, pretty strong. Yeah. And for me, I never ever thought that I would be living in spiritual community at all. I mean, I was a mom and had children and had my own house and everything. So it was something so alien to my plan. But one of the things that I actually, I needed help to tell you the truth. I needed help to understand what was happening in my mind because I couldn't do it on my own. And it was like really trusting my brothers to understand what was actually happening because it's such a deep journey to understand projection and understand, you know, I'm pulling it back in your own mind and looking at the thoughts and the beliefs and having shared purpose. Really, you said that the other day, I thought that was beautiful. Shared purpose creates a solid form or something you were saying on the, it was on an online retreat. What is it? Solid foundation. I thought it was beautiful because you know, that's one thing. It's a shared purpose and the purpose is practicing forgiveness. And for me, I could never have done that on my own. And also being able to communicate these ideas. So for me, I just started resonating with, you know, the deeper, see, experiencing that it was some kind of deeper healing for me, practicing no private thoughts, no people pleasing. I mean, you know, where was I going to, once I started to open up to that and seeing how, you know, what acceleration that gave me, like, wow, this is some kind of big acceleration being transparent, you know, taking off the mask and really experiencing the healing and a lot of darkness too. You know, I mean, I went through a lot of rebellious darkness for some time. You know, almost like I was in a washing machine, tumbling, you know, in a real intense time. And so that's what, you know, and I trust my brothers that have gone ahead of me because I don't understand what's going on. And so for me, it was like, okay, really, and then practically applying forgiveness, you know, in a really that and I could start to see that it was working. Like, that's a miracle to me that it was actually working. So I was here really, you know, between me and God and trusting God that I was supposed to be here, but this was his plan, not my plan, letting go of all of the, the ideas of where I thought it should be, even with my family and things like that, like no one was really interested. I remember after a time with David, I was traveling with David and we were in the car and it was the first time I ever heard of no private thoughts. And so we start and I thought, oh, this is so I just started doing it and seeing how it felt. And I remember going home to my boyfriend at the time and I said, Oh my God, I said, I want us to live completely now no longer having any private thoughts. He goes, Are you out of your mind? Who lives like that? He said, that is crazy. But I could feel one thing I knew was I could feel some mystical thing like it was a communion. It wasn't even about David or Lisa. It felt like my mind was opening up to God like I wasn't like keeping anything hidden anymore. And that and also just even the fear and the doubt, lots of tons of it that by me exposing it, that it was going away. That's what I could see. So it was like an opportunity for me to be able to be, you know, transparent and another way of having relationships for me that I was experiencing. Oh wow, this is a whole new way of having relationships that was supporting my again, my relationship with God. But you know, and we need each other. And that's how I thought, I can't do this alone. I'm not going to, once I started on the journey, I mean, I studied for years the course before David showed up. And I needed that time of study. I was studying for years and years just, you know, and then David showed up and then I feel like, you know, the work actually began at such a level, I feel like Jesus had solidified me in my faith in God so that I could go through the intensity because there was a lot of intensity letting go of a self concept is not an easy task. I mean, letting go of a whole, you know, but you know, it was like I was in compromise and seeing that there was a possibility that I could actually be happy all the time. I mean, that's what Jesus had promised me in the course, you know, that can you imagine a life that you don't have to, you know, that you could be happy and have no cares or worries all the time. I'm thinking are you kidding me? I couldn't even imagine it. And then, you know, we need demonstrations of I need a demonstration who, you know, I was just, you know, beginning and so I needed to see someone and seemingly you showed up in my life and it was like, my God, this guy is actually living it. And that not even just David that the possibility was available to me, you know, that's what I wanted. That this actually is actually a living experience and I need to learn how to do that. It was like a real humbleness. That's why I say the humbleness is everything to come into like, okay, you know, I'm not consistently happy. Let's get honest, you know, but I want to be and maybe I'm wrong. You know, I need help God and I trust God, you know, our trust in God and our faith in God, you know, there's no accident that we all got here together, you know, you know, there's no accident. Somehow we ended up here together and that I trust God enough for that. And so now what is and being together to be able to have that experience of intimacy? That's what I feel like it was creating some kind of intimacy that I never experienced before. And everything else seemed meaningless to me after that. Yeah, I think, I think, you know, the tendency, like, sorry, and even when you were asking about about spiritual community, can I do it outside of spiritual community? But part of the ego belief is this artificial in and out to, you know, we, as a human being, you think there's an inner world with your mind and your thoughts and your emotion, and then there's an outer world, a big one. And people say it's, oh, it's, it seems to be out there, David. I mean, it's, they say it seems pretty solid, you know, but, but the workbook of A Course in Miracles helps you collapse that belief in inner and outer, like he's teaching us that the world is not outside of the mind. It's actually the world is in the mind. And, and you can forgive it when you, when you see that, but you can't forgive it while you think it's external. Or this in and out thing, for years people have debated, oh, I need to be in the spiritual community and then they get into the community and then I need to get the hell out of the community. You know, it's like, it's a back and forth, back and forth in and out. It even happens with my cats. I remember, I'm at the peace house and the cats are indoor cats. And then they keep looking out the window and looking out the window and looking out the window, then they start looking at me like I'm the prison, the warden. And I'm like, and they're like coming to the door, looking out, out, meow, meow, meow, out, out. Now you shall play doorman for the rest of your days, out, you know, you have a new role. So I open the door, they go out and meow, meow, they went in, meow, meow, they went out. Suddenly this is my meditation all day long. I'm a doorman. So, okay, in, out, in, out, in, out. And then it goes fine for the spring and the fall. Then when the winter comes, they're not so sure that they want to go out because it's cold. But because it's winter and I open the door for them, they get to walk to the threshold between in and out. And then they look up at me with all this power in their eyes. And they stand as the cold air comes rushing in like I am transcending. I'm right on the line now and I am the point of power because I am transcending in and out. They just look on their face like, like I'm in charge now. I can, I'm not at the mercy of the doorman. I can make the doorman stand there as long as I can till his foot goes, get out there. You know, so this is the thing that we're dealing with is we still, as long as you perceive yourself as a human being, then you also perceive this in and out concept. I'm in a relationship now. How'd that happen? When did that happen? It's all mental, you know, when people say they're in a relationship, they're out. They have a concept, a mental construct of what that means to be in. And that is not always a shared agreement. What was the story? The friends, the TV show friends, was it Rachel and Ross? I'm on a break. There was a big deal they made about being on a break, whether they were actually had broken up or not. It's all mental, you know, it's a construct in a relationship. It's not. That's just a mental construct in a spiritual community, outside of a spiritual community. Those are mental concepts. I'm in something, I'm out. I'm in university, I'm out. So what we do is we have to trust Jesus to use the symbols in a way that can free our mind from the concepts and take us into the light, into a direct experience, through forgiveness, which is really just, yes, seeing the false is false. So that's why this is a world of opinions and debate, because as long as you believe is in and out, then you're just going to find there's lots of opinions about in and out too. And when you try to make the right choice, it should be a choice that's based on prayer, on guidance, you know, really, what is my guidance? What is my little inner calling? What is my nudge? Tell me that. That's always listen and follow. It comes back to that. It's between you and God. It's between you and the Holy Spirit and Jesus and they're offering the instructions and where to follow the instructions to reach beyond the concepts. So that's kind of the way that it's gone. And the other thing people, they have ideas of community, like sometimes they think of there's an ashram or a place and then you just stay in the ashram. When your daughter had had a child, your grandson, where was I? I was in the hospital right there. Yeah, when we went to China, I got to meet your mother. I am not a stationary little mystic that just sits in alms all day. This, this body is in hospital meeting people. I meet so many people and then now I do digital things like I do zoom rooms and then people come on camera with their mother, with their daughter, with their family. I'm still doing it pretty soon. I'll be doing a, I'll be doing a movie and they'll be like in some operating room and I'll be like, what's going on over there? And that, what are we? What are we in a surgery now? And, but, but you start to see through zoom, you've done a lot of zoom, herpes done lots of first class. You start to feel like it's all your mind because there's these characters in these little boxes. And then after a while you feel a connection with them, you feel love with them. And it, and it doesn't matter whether you physically have met them or not, you still feel the love, the connection. And you know Jesus is working his plan because the whole plan is for us to feel unified and connected and not apart. So it's a deep question, you know, it starts off with in and out of spiritual community and then you go underneath it and you go, whoa, there's, there's some concepts here that are being raised up to the light. And I never did actually think of community. I much prefer the word communion to community. I want communion. I want connection. I want love. And the other parts get into concepts. And then once you get into concepts, then it's just, what's the opinion? What's your opinion? A lot of times people will still say to me to say, David, what's your opinion? I say, I have none. I have no opinion on that. And then they, sometimes they accept it. Other times they say, like one time they, I was walking with somebody and they said, David, do you know of the enneagram? And they said, yeah, yeah. And they said, what number are you? And I said, I'm all of them. And they said, that's not possible. I said, okay, none of them. No, not possible. And then they tell me what number I am. See, so I gave, I gave two answers. I'm all of them. No, I'm none of them. No. You're a, okay, whatever, you know, because, because you're not here to try to contest things. You're not here to contest opinions. You're just here to be love. You know, there's, it's not, it's not worth, we were reading in the Yarnshah book, which Jesus, he just went through his lifetime and he just did not get into arguments. Isn't that lovely to have a seeming human lifetime where you don't argue? What a blessing going around connecting, joining, sharing from the heart, but not arguing, not debating. Oh, lovely, lovely. That's, now that's a wayshower. I like a wayshower who's into love and acceptance. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Sorin. Thank you. That may be winding down here. Yeah, move on to the next scene in the movie. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you for being with us. Yeah. The worship. Maybe you want to, because the guidance has come in and we're likely, we're talking about them. Okay. Because we had been talking about the worship service, but there's a new schedule, I think, coming in and we want everyone to stay tuned. We're going to continue to do our Wednesday, 10 a.m. And then we're starting next week, or tonight, tonight, that's right. Our debut tonight, Francis is going to have a show. She's going to be joining every Wednesday night at seven o'clock. Seven p.m. central time. And it's going to be a worship along with the worship team. Yeah. It's our worship prayer and worship now moved from Saturday to Wednesday and Sunday. So stay tuned because you can, you can tune in through the app and through our Living Church Ministries website and through. So we're going to do every week, Wednesday night at 7 p.m. and now Sunday night at 7 p.m. 5 p.m. Oh, 5 p.m. See? Oh, Jesus. That's why we're trying to get you someone else. Okay. I can show up and try. That's all I'm supposed to do. Sunday is 5 p.m. central time and Wednesday tonight is 7 p.m. central time. So we're going to do it every week. Right. And also, I always like to talk about the Wednesday or the Saturday movies. You know, there's such an opportunity, you know, using the movies. I don't know if you're, you know, David's been doing these Saturday workshops, movies that are so profound and you use the, you know, cutting edge films just to use practical application for forgiveness. So yeah, I think all this stuff is listed on our website too, Living Church Ministries.org. So yeah. So thank you for joining us and staying tuned. And who knows, maybe next week we'll have new announcements. Yeah. So thank you.