 You can now follow me on all my social media platforms to find out who my latest guest will be and don't forget to click the subscribe button and the notifications button so you're notified for when my next podcast goes live. You're supposed to support one of the biggest acts, probably one of the biggest rappers of all time, some people would argue, NAS, two, three years ago, before you'd done your sound check to end up getting the jail, so you've had a wee bit of roller coaster the last few years. I'm still kinda like that, still kinda searching for my family, you know what I mean, like blood is blood to know that, but like where I belong kind of thing. Do you feel lost sometimes? Aye mate, aye, definitely feel lost, like I think I feel lost for listening to other people's perception of me. That's why I've been focused on trying to actually just cement myself as a proper top tier lyricist in this country mate and then hopefully globally mate and the last few years in that it's just been trying to actually learn how to be a man and take responsibility for some of my actions in that. Bimber on! What's happening? Today's guest we've got Scottish rapper Shogun, how bad you bruv? Aye, good, fuck you, I'm happy to be here mate, happy to be here. It's good to have you in. Thank you, thank you. One of my own mate just up the road, so yeah it's good to be here for the audience, this is a Scottish podcast so you might struggle sometimes but bear with us. Aye. You were in rap battle there. Rap game, rap game. I thought you were phenomenal. Thank you bro, thank you. You were supposed to support one of the biggest acts, probably one of the biggest rappers of all time, some people would argue. Aye. Nazz, two or three years ago, before you'd done your sound check to end up getting the jail. Aye mate, aye. So you've had a wee bit of rollercoaster the last few years, but now you're here, you're doing your thing. Aye, finally. You've gained time. Aye mate, it's just, it's just about being, like you're being sent to me, just being consistent and that's what I've been focused on mate. Just trying to actually just cement myself as a proper top tier lyricist in this country mate and then hopefully globally mate. And the last few years in that, it's just been trying to actually learn how to be a man and take responsibility for some of my actions in that. And no just the bad stuff, but the good stuff as well. I've got all this good shit. Let's know, dwell on it. Let's know, just revel in the fact that, oh, I've got this good shit. Which was, I was doing that for so long that I would perform well and then I'd just get excited about that and I wouldn't spend the next week or two or month or two actually like going right, how can I, how can I better this position that I'm in, rather than just be happy with it. So I mean, like all the experiences for getting lifted at Nazz and got a work in Pullman and then all the shit in between that and then got a little more spiraling and finally getting up to, you know what I mean? This point in my life is, it's very surreal. It's very surreal. Must have gave you some material though. I was, therefore. Now I've got a stack about that. That, like we, the A4 stupid jail paper you get. I've got that. I just shit I've not even used yet mate. Because your videos have been viewed over millions of time, tens of millions. I think, I'm not just saying this because you're Scottish, but you're one of the best rappers and lyricists I've ever seen or heard. Thank you. It's phenomenal that the stuff that you do, obviously in your own rap game, they were telling you to slow your stuff down. It's Scottish accent. If we, we speaking of now, people can't understand. Never mind, rap. I know mate. I know rap pretty fucking fast. Sometimes it's like a party trick kind of thing. It's like I can do very, very, very intricate and complex syllable alignment and I understand patterns and I understand music. So it's like, I might, I've just been, I'm just a, a fiend for knowledge man and getting better. And I man, I have my days where, where I, where I hate it and then I have my days where I love it man. But right now, like I think I've got back into a place where I absolutely love doing what I do. And that's why you see the, the jump up in quality. And I mean that rap game or tell me to like slow it down and shit. And for the first couple of weeks, I was like, man, what are these guys talking about? Like dumb it down, slow it down, make it easier to understand. Like you want me to rap the way I rap or do you want me to rap the way you use what I rap? But I kind of just like, if you can go back and listen to some of my older stuff and go listen to my stuff that I've released in the like, like since being on that show like the clarity, that is something that I definitely, I just took on the chin. I went, do you know what, if I can overpronunciate my words to English people and what not, in conversation, then I can do it when I'm rapping man. And my lyrical ability doesn't need to actually take a hit because of that. So that took me a couple of months to really grasp man. And I, that, just thank you for saying that mate, honestly. I don't even know what to say mate. I'm trying to be the best lyrical in this country. And that's why you've got to take advice for the people who's loved that because it's that we've got too much ego being for the scheme and who the fuck you're telling what to do so it's for me it's wider my audience I had to slow it down I had to but we're saying the word down instead of saying down it's just certainly things like that but for you to go the other these people know the tools and techniques to get to certain levels but again when we always get barriers up don't tell me how do you know but they've actually lived it they're just trying to get you knowledge but if you're starting to now take it in then you'll go levels you'll go above and beyond your main dreams and ambitions and then you'll leave the blueprint for I don't know any other Scottish rappers that have ever made it you hear the odd songs in that but I mean you had the fucking have you ever seen the Scottish hip hop hoax no oh what mate two guys mate two of my tutors fed on the emit working syllable and brains and I swear to them mate I swear don't they know that they get sent to Sony fucking we're met a tour with E-12 and all that and the only reason they've done it is because they pretended they were American they protect like like pretended they were hunting huntington beach california made up fake backstories spoke to their mom das and their girlfriends in american accents nor that like proper lived a line and one of them had a mental breakdown and went I can't do this anymore that's that's the pinnacle for every country before me that's what cunts look at and go oh that's they got close to getting signed and being famous nor that I bet they lived a fucking lie so like now you've got a crop of talent like myself shellot meuros uh ransom efe was on there when he's a bit more clean-cut nor that but for the people for the schemes you've got like me shellot meuros mccroy then you've got kind of mere abstract people that physics and gasps who are a bit like they're a bit an older generation and those but they're still kind of relevant in the Scottish bit but it's just like you're saying it's it's sometimes it's too scottish it's too hard to like digest if you're no fae i said like specifically the west of scotland and that but i mean it's getting there it's just about five ten fifteen years behind some certain scenes and like especially london and mani and burning them in that so it's just a bit try to get that synergy with all the all the good all the talent in this country which i feel like like you're saying with the the egos for coming through the scheme like i'm the fucking best everybody feels like that so it's like it's been a struggle trying to get all the people who genuinely believe they're the best to come together and date like london does do you know what i mean like fucking because there's a crust to be made as well and there's a business in it so but as long as you're loving it always go back to the start with my guest brother kind of where you grew up and how it all began i well i grew up in paisley hunter how uh toad home hung about like glen burning that went to st andrew's academy and uh actually i wasn't even the first one of my pals that started rapping i was just like i think i was the one of my pals that was like i was in the higher kind of english classes and that like credit and all that back in the day i was good with my words good at writing and i loved rap but it was my pal i think my pal john forest he was like the first one that came up to us and went oh i forgot my rap not at all i'm gonna go battle lynch not you know i mean there was a boy fat lynch that was like he was like the best rapper in glenburn and we were like 12 13 not that we used to have wee rap battles at the back of the school not that and then we'd go and get mad with it and fucking the dark foray and the gas foray the tap foray and all that like all the forays up fucking glenburn get mad with it and there'd be like 70 we guys and be lasses or steaming and then i'd be sitting on my phone fucking writing raps not like what are you doing nothing fuck off you know i was just like i go into it for everybody else being into it and then as they kind of stopped me i just kept going with me i just kept going with it and then that ended up in me kind of being i just became a bit of a fucking recluse because like day my research and watching just stuff that was beyond my years i go a bit more wisdom than the people that was around me man so i started i was like i don't want to hang about with people my age man i ended up hanging about with people that were a bit older a bit more nefarious shall we say and then go into a bit of trouble and all that got any more trouble wrote me all raps ended up getting myself kicked out of school you know what i mean so i mean like my whole life's been geared towards me being like this mad rebellious figure mate for the age if i was young mate like my fucking auntie used to call me Houdini magician you grounded me mate and i was gone mate i was out of like he says sitting that corner and fucking think about what you've done like turn your back and i'm out the corner i'm away like so i've just always had that wanderlust and wanting to meet new people and learn about new cultures and all that you know i mean especially when i was growing up one of my best friends banelian clapo who i called him bani he's from South Africa and that was like the first black boy that i was pals with i was a what seven eight year old when i met him and then like his dad had lived through what they apartheid they had like scars in his head and all that and that was the first time i learned about all that shit so i started to look at my fucking people my family are a bit differently like because they were a bit racist and whatnot i was like well jeffrey bani's dad's telling me this and then my uncle gero's telling me this i'm like okay so my whole life man i've just been a bit of an outsider but cannot in way sort like the popular ones at the same time like i didn't really know where i'm fitting but as soon as i found this man it made ever it made everything make sense made everything make sense like all these feelings and repressed emotions and even guilt for like mad shit that i've done i've get sort of get an outlet now do you know what i mean and it doesn't it doesn't it doesn't get me a weekender it doesn't i don't need to get mad with to have an outlet i don't need to go and fight with people to have to express myself to get this anger and whatnot i can just write it during that page and actually provide people with content that they can live vicariously through not only that but it can inspire them to get into themselves you know i mean or use any other any other hobbies or passions as outlets for their situation man because i didn't necessarily have like the the hardest upbringing but it was a single parent and me and all my siblings have different dads so it was a bit like not not much of a family unit do you know what i mean so i felt like i was kind of like i was always taking care of always had stuff on my back always had food in my belly always always eating i wanted if i didn't get it for my birthday i'd get it for my christmas kind of thing like maybe a wee bit behind everybody else but i was always looked after but it was more so the emotional side of things like i'm quite a fucking needy guy i'm quite a emotional especially when i was younger man i was a fucking angry wee crybaby you know what i mean so like i needed that kind of caring attention and then didn't quite get it for the people that i wanted to get it from got it for other people that the wrong people the wrong people bro you know what i mean but i don't i don't even like saying the wrong people just other people's confused as well at the same time it makes sense to just be getting any attention from anybody that would do at that time just to survive me personally i've always wanted a big brother always wanted a big brother man always felt like the wee brother always wanted to look after me so soon as older boys were like i won't hang up with us won't go do this and that and i was like easy there's my family there do you know what i mean and i'm i think i think that i still kind of i'm still kind of like that still kind of searching for my for my family you know what i mean like blood is blood to know that but like where i belong kind of thing do you feel lost sometimes i mean i definitely feel lost like i think i feel lost for listening to other people's perception of me do you know what i mean like people will have me up here and then they'll have me down here and confused it's it's very very confusing it's like and there's people that will hold you up here and then if you don't see their message and don't message them back that day that like you end up seeing the message where they send you a paragraph i hate like fucking do you patch me or a ship you'll love your music it's confusing try to be like a public figure when you're just trying to figure out your own shit hi mate hi mate hi literally mate literally bro so it's a very very surreal thing like going to work with people like Dizzy Rasko and love Dizzy shout out to Dizzy shout out to Dizzy all day long man absolute G man like i actually told him when i was like i owe you a tenor because one of the first albums that i ever stole at a hmv was fucking maths in english his third album man i used to sit and listen like why are you moving with that pussy yeah i used to sit and listen to that playing like fucking modern warfare he's 20 years deep in the game and still like a tap of it i know he's been in it since i was in nappies mate and then city sick like fucking two feet away from him and he's just like like he's gassed about my shit like he's actually like you're a fucking banging writer you're a proper good storyteller or not i'm just like sitting there like didn't even sink into it i went home i came home and i was just like fuck i think i was just making like a toast to us i'm just purely how did how did that come about you and dizzy working together actually i was meant to be on a track with him and a guy called ld physics seven a drill crew was meant to be on that with him through i asked scottish the producer of the track was scottish shone prove and he fucking loves my shit and i love his shit so he was like he kind of sorted it out but i think the label didn't want me on it i think they seen it as too much of a risk or something so it kind of ended up just being ld and dizzy you know you're a risk anyway why do you think that is your nature because i think it's a fucking i think it's just because there's never been an artist like me no really like you can be like all the archetype for me is like devlin or somebody like gets a volatile mc that's actually very intelligent but no i'm my own breed at mc my own breed artist and i've got a heavy duty bullshit detector and i do struggle to like play the game sometimes do you know what i mean i do struggle to to give the fucking higher ups what they want whilst i'm like crafting what i need out of it so it's like just i'm not so much i'm not that good a businessman see if i had made a business head on me like you're only 23 i know you're learning all that as you go and just it's learning to take more risk and learning to give a wee bit of trust because i'm the same it's i'm the same as you but again sometimes we get it wrong where we think maybe i'm fucking wrong maybe it's me that's crazy so trust me i've been sitting there a few times like that and i think what i do or not is i project like past shit on a new situation so like i had a manager and an agent i was with diplomats of sound and this guy called fucking charlie who was like my agent's best friend and then he ended up coming out to manage my man they stole a fuckload of money off of me man like left me homeless in london owned my fucking ass to the point where i was having to pay off debt in the jail through a fucking jail phone do you know what i mean getting my fucking distributor to send fucking royalties to a fucking landlord so that i don't get chinned for that when i go to the fucking jail because of raprics so i still i seem to see them face to fucking face which i fucking i will man i will seem to see them and speak to them and this man they're like why did you do that to me when i was a fucking 19 year old why would you lie to my fucking my family and all that so you're going to take care of me and all that shit how it happened were you supposed to sign supposed to sign a record deal broke no it was like investment money that came in investment from this investor they got and basically i signed something that i wasn't meant to sign do you know what i mean have i got it looked over and i don't know because they they put it in front of me after i think it was like either my first setting show in london and i was like mad waiting shit like i prefer i was a pretty good show and everybody liked my performance and that's why i was obviously celebrating and then they sat down a fucking the mad record contract in front of me man to sign for a belgian artist a track that i was doing with sony france and then there was like a couple other sheets to do be like the naz show and all that that went platinum that and i went fucking went platinum and gold as well platinum in belgium and gold in france i mean you never get a bean for that no i get paid for it i get paid i get paid for that but they let me get that kind of smaller payment and took the fucking tens of thousands of pounds off me do you know i mean i really like saying the actual amount because it's fucking yeah do you know what i mean 11 learn i know me it's the camera always prevails money i was like tuition fee you know that's what i see it is i paid a tuition fee i was like no i'm no i'm clothed up you saw me valking is her tens of millions of views all over social media all over online how did that come about so if people check that check this out man you'll see how good shogun is unbelievable valking yes mother fucker how did that come about me honestly i done that tune right after my uncle Henry died because after he died like i cannot seem like an apathetic response for some people in my family because like it was a bit of a troubled guy do you know i mean he was like fucking on drugs on that and a bit of a not a wronging but you just lost again man done shit that he knew he didn't put it that way to get what he needed and he died down south he's died in Croydon moved down to Croydon and to get a wifey or a shite up here and fucking just drank his self to fucking death so after that i was just like i just had a like an epiphany man i was like fuck man that's my wee uncle i like i didn't even get to say fucking bye to him or nothing i didn't even get like i think the last time i seen him i gave him like a tenor i was moaning because i you know what i mean because he always used to come up and ask for money and i was only getting like fucking 70 quid a week or something i feel like i work at speeding his program that i was on at the time and i think at the last time i seen him we were no arguing but i was just moaning him i felt like a fucking cunt man i felt like a heavy duty heavy duty asshole man and i was like in denial about like nah man he's no deep nor that like no chance man he would just be he would just be no well nor that and then now proper so i fucking um i just sat down and i wrote that in like a pure burst on the train going to college i don't want to just just hit us when i sat down the train i was just thinking about it or away done to it because i was thinking about it every day for months after it and i don't know me i just wrote it in however long it takes to get fae paisley air what were you doing at college sound engineering mate i was just because i thought fucking i need to go and learn about i don't know any dj's i don't know any producers i don't have my own setup nor that i need to go and learn about what equipment i need then how to use it and whatnot and to be honest i just used that time to try and fucking sell weed you know like i mean i was a fucking fan of me or he was all the place but at that time i was i think i wrote quite a lot of poignancy because it's like it's beautiful to be broken in it so i was heavy broken at that point and i was writing some heavy beautiful shit man but i recorded that it sat on my soundcloud for like six months i had like five hundred plays mate like fuck all i was happy with at the time because like 50 plays to me was a fucking lot at that time so i was like this is actually alright and then went to go to a music video for a tune called the effect where i crewed that i was in called MFTM ended up the people that were filming it didn't have the right equipment didn't have the drone and all that so like fuck it we'll just film these styles and all that we'll just get some content that way i was like let me do this tune i want to see if he's like it done vulcan to get out behind the camera i was like fucking did that again done it again put it up three four days later mate it was fucking on the front page i read it i had like a hunter emails two on our phone calls like my phone was just gone for fucking that change things for you i mean it changed it changed what it just changed what i was doing it didn't really change my situation i was still living with my mum and all that and like between hers and my ex-girlfriend scarf and that like but i eventually it started putting a lot of money on my pocket and i was like doing two shows a week and interview for big magazines and but just everything man and i was like traveling up and down to London a lot you know what i mean getting the dodgy train tickets for off-pricing that i tried to save a buck anywhere i can mate and i fucking was meeting my dj cameo at the time or just flying a boot got to London fucking Brighton fucking anywhere man i ended up meeting foreign beggars and shout to foreign beggars oh jeez a drum and bass and hip hop scene and but they're kind of they don't get enough fucking respect man they don't and resting peace to evil graham as well he passed away um this year it will last year um during all this shit but when i met them they kind of took us pavan most mostly pavan from foreign beggars took me under these wings and like proper gave us some good advice took us on some shows and all that showed us about the country and stuff explained the music industry to me and all that and i would never have got to meet all these people and people like that people that i revere if i've never done that fucking video in that car park that day do you know what i mean even like kicking the bottle over accidentally some like adds to the aesthetic of the fucking tune and then there's a baby crying at the end that wasn't a sound effect that was our fucking real live baby it just was crying in the street and it's pure added it's like i sense a rebirth at the end of the song it's like after that it's my rebirth and all that this tune's mental mate but i just wrote that as like a personal attack almost you know what i mean like for the first bit of the tune i'm building myself up and then i go what does that make me being a little bit fucked lately do you know i mean like is it therapy for you do you know he's writing it down in paper and wrapping it definitely mate it's catharsis it's therapy it's fucking life-saving it's connection it's communication where like sometimes you can't i can't sometimes i can't get my words out the way i want to do you know what i mean but as soon as i sit down and put them into like rain form it's like everything i want to say comes up how hard is it to be a rapper in the uk fucking i mean it's like you're a rapper what are you crying what is it would you say i'm i'm i'm i'm just i'm like a kendrick lamar mate i'm like a tech nine i don't associate to anything it's no one specific genre like i'll fucking i'll make a rock album one day i'll make a heavy metal album one day i'll do drum and bass i'll do probably do like a couple fucking edm tunes or it like whatever whatever i'm feeling do you know i mean i haven't found my specific little brand of whatever do you know i mean because you see all the rappers who may be in grime or whatever they're doing and then like a second further up when you see it becoming more mainstream you see them mixing or other people but it's just business look at dizzy what may well be volume calvin harris changes the game the machine of everything brings in wider audience and i mean and that's what i've always been i've always admired people who are not afraid to challenge themselves and step out of comfort zones and challenge status quotes and stereotypes you know i mean that's why tec means like my fucking favorite rapper one of my favorite rappers along with mick jenkins mick jenkins a big six foot five guy from chicago that should be talking about bang bang this and shoot him up this and all that but he's no he's a poet you know i mean say i love akala aye aye i go to support him twice i know i go to support him and uh the 10 year anniversary for no no the knowledge and we always say knowledge is power that's what i got that from is just next level man when he was in fire in the booth and he'd done i think it was 10 minutes 12 minutes and phenomenal the knowledge is in there for a remit or a more bang and my thieves banquet as well but he says that he'll no get the recognition obviously because he's not talking about guns and asses and money and because he raps with a fucking like borderline oxford education do you know absolute genius yeah isn't it isn't it isn't it how did uh nas then come about how did you get that chap at the door nas came about um through the agency that i was with see that was the thing with that agency they i supported so many banging people through them man so many bang yeah fucking well bugs him alone a j tracy uh ghost ghostface killer feral munch bugs his next level now as well he's flying i know man i know man i know man i fucking who else have i supported him on the podcast this year bugsy you'll be on fuck man actually actually nas is this is like he's elite he's up there we are two packs m&m's and all the american superstars these people would say he's the greatest all time he came through with nineties i'm i'm a ilmatic man like one of the best hip hop albums when he was a teenager man do you know what i mean lost his ring book on a train managed to get it back don't know how he'd done that in new york like cunts i fucking can't can't deserve respect man especially for like his business mind as well because he invested in a lot of shit before anybody was on on it man and made himself so much fucking money man that's why he just sits back and does what he wants now do you know i throw a lot of shit as well i watch these documentary on netflix aye man like his whole family's got a rich history man like definitely one of the people i reveal and respect the most at any fucking mc on the planet man so like to actually get like literally a fucking bar hair away feel like getting literally did you meet him no man i met i met he's i met somebody i met a random guy it was like a rodeo or something because i fucking i went like it's obviously like oh two academies got a bit and it's a wee side door i went to the side door and fucking i'm like that show gun i'm here to do my sound check and it's this i think it was like Nigerian or something and it was like i kind of polished like two security guards and it was just kind of looking at me man and i thought i've spoke too fast or something was like i'm show gun i'm here to do my my sound check like and i was like looking at like no no you need to go find somebody that i was like man like how am i going to go find somebody and so i'm arguing with these two guys i'm like can can one of yous please go and find somebody like anybody man go inside speak to anybody they'll know who i am he goes and finds the one guy that doesn't fucking know who i am some american guy and he comes out and he's like i don't know man who maybe he's do you know what i mean like he's confused as fuck i'm like fuck this mate like i'll come back in five ten minutes we've got to go get the fags i was walking down to the wee sparring that fucking go to the like the back of the the underground bit the fucking subway and then two guys were like show gun show gun show gun mate i was like i was walking my power by the time i was like i'd be a man i was like i think these guys want a photo or something man i'll turn turn around to see i was like what's happening you show gun i i don't know they go to you about what the distance between me and you and i was like what's your real name i was like oh no man i was like how no what's your real name i was like joe herring and i thought oh no this is the police man i'm fucked like what day of day what day of day i was like fuck it i'm fucked i'll just take it on the chin i was going to run mate i was like fuck it they're no catching me it's too mad fucking potbelly cunts and i was like actually decent shape at the time i was like you're only catching me if i turn around and boost but as soon as they radioed and man it was like two meat wagons cid more like proper mad sting operation for somebody that breached our community so as you get done for fifth you never went in for a community service and that's where you end up getting 12 months i mean i get done for a fucking failed fucking burgerie attempt for a seven how many attempts did you feel your community service it's like 12 months i did they screws no you were there at the concert or was it just a coincidence or watch a man star something deffo somebody stuck in i think there was posters or doing glass gun or that mate somebody's deffo fucking oh well there you go there's no ziff somebody's here stuck me in or they've just drove past and went is that that fucking i'm sure i've got that we come to my desk i'm trying to get him because we're up at my house and my sister's for months man i was just like doing London and shit do you know i mean see that's the only thing man i mean yeah if you're you're trying to rise through the ranks and you're working with badly biggest superstars in the rap game all time and you're going to support them will you ever shite yourself even for you in or did you think it'll be cool me i was that excited to support nas like me i gave you power the tune where he's talking about the gun and these prettys he personifies the gun do you know what i mean talks about how a gun feels just getting passed for the owner to owner or not see that mate that that's one of the tunes that made me want to be a rapper mate so like for me to get so fucking so close to even open up a stage for a man like in the reaction for people in the crowd when obviously my pal physics like all my boys were there to do my hyping that they ended up kind of doing the show for me do you know i mean i never get any fucking money for it do you know i mean i never get any of my fee and i don't know who got it don't know if my agent kept it don't know who fucking got it mate but i didn't get a single fucking penny maybe sent me a penny when i was sitting in moment waiting to get fucking they did cares mate they did cares mate they be fucking cares mate honestly so how did that affect you then when you were instead of supporting why the biggest rappers all time to then sit in employment or me i was fucking distraught me i wanted to kill everybody in the fucking hall mate like walked in me and my hair was a bit like longer than it is in a minute try to control that fucking skater boy you know that i was like the fuck you was talking to me like skater like me i was just about to go support nas man it's like talk to me with some fucking respect you bebomb it's like you punt hashing fucking what oh i did a bit of the brunette between 1920 i was 19 19 coming up for 20 how would that have been how would that have enhanced your career so young at that age if you got to do that performance i was like mate irrespective of me doing the performance fucking enhance my career because the screws came in like there's wee justin b-ball but fucking superstar or push my like see if i got to do that making that perform to the the i performed to the best of my ability i know for that fact that there would have been two thousand two two and a half thousand people leaving that place like that we show guns class he's banging i'm gonna keep my i'm gonna keep an eye out for him because do you ever work again i mean nah i don't think so i think if ethan i think nas knows my name i think nas knows who i'm because if i fucking won't know if he's got some to support them they've got a jail that's what rappers and shit dates always fucking drama and he's a he's no you know he's a fucking think i wily mate wily used to get me i think he booked shows mate just get a deposit and then no turn up do you know i mean because like cunt's were going fucking stab him and shit you know and he's an everyone free he's got a bar he's like a free time community service breach up so that's like me mate looks like i'm a bit of a wily and fucking dizzy do you know i mean mixed in the one but i lean towards the zero what happened i mean how was the jail when you're doing yos the yos were just like the yos mate just everybody try to make their name for themselves i just fall out of fucking wee guys and nuttles mate like very hard to get a real conversation um i quite stressful a little bit i can't turn it was only a little three weeks because i was only on for fucking romance and that but see if i had to get sentenced in there mate but i fucked this mate because it was full of wee guys man heavy duty wee guys it just would stab you just to fucking get a bit of respect after some kind of there's no respect to him do you know what i mean i'm not about all that shit mate what was the plans then when you came out i don't even have a plan mate i just i came out mate and it was just shit lined up for us it was just because i was in order and the papers and all that and people wanted to hear from me and shit and like i didn't really affect my shows and that that much a lot of pressure though come on top when people start speaking and shit it was it was it was mere the frustration i like fucking see the way the papers fucking portrayed me man as if i'm just mad fucking idiotic thug as it may have done it in either years it's fucking it's hardcore man i've never heard that before and like people on my street that i'd fucking like cut their grass and like wee old women and that weren't they weren't they talking to me i was like why does we gene know what to talk to me like i what like actual hurt me mate actual hurt me mate i was like this is fucking brutal like people in my own family like actual i was just like this is brutal man i'm not a fucking bad person i was like i just get left in my fucking own they couldn't take it into fucking babies i ended up doing some shit and then everybody wants to take care as soon as i've done the fucking like 364 days out the year they don't get a fuck in that one day where i fuck up they're like i'm fucking you should be doing this you should be living your life like this you should be like hey fucking bother man yeah you could listen you could do a thousand good things man but somebody will pick up the one thing that they've done wrong so this is society that's life but you must just pick me up again and just keep soldiering forward like fuck everybody else there's people that have been through way fucking worse than a bit of emotional trauma that have been through me and they pick themselves up and go to work every day and provide and and and day what they're supposed to do mate so i think i'm my own worst enemy i'll convince myself that the world's against me and everybody's against me to the point where i'll end up that that'll become my reality do you know i mean how did rap game come about fucking um my man ran some f a put my name in he was on the first season done pretty well you know what i mean showed the clean clip they showed the clean cut you know mainstream kind of like we've got a rapper that can you know what i mean do or the the the fans say shit as i call it do you know what i mean um i'm a bit better fucking left a field you know what i mean left a center kind of i think i but i might think he just put my put my name in says this is a big good ticket on the show they obviously went and done a bit done fuck all research on me because they were asking me shit that just like the devil just read like a son article on me i was like cool kept asking me my interests of questions about my family and whatnot but i was after the the fucking laborious fucking screening process it was just like come down to Birmingham and fucking let's get the show on the road it was pretty straightforward man like i didn't even do half the shit i was meant to do for like see the like you're meant to die you're meant to die mad stupid videos like hey i'm showgun 23 from pay i was like i'm no fucking den that mate i was like i've got more views on every i guarantee i've got more views on everything than every else on the show put together for the first season and the second season no to put my own trumpet but i'm no den that mate like people fucking know who i am you know what i mean but do you think that's what gets the producers and everybody's back up towards you then i don't give a fuck about a bbc producer i don't care about some wee fucking university fucking mob i don't care mate because you don't have a video on your instagram and says fuck the bbc while still on the show i mean how did that happen there how did that affect you obviously no you're working for the bbc i wasn't working for the bbc mate no i was hired not in fact i wasn't i wasn't even hired mate i was a fucking documentary piece that's what that show is a documentary so they don't need to pay the people on the fucking show do you know i mean the last is it's owns she was brilliant as well you and turbo brilliant so she was really good man never felt or never started never just destroyed people man she was brilliant but some talent on it some talent and you can see the pressure how hard it is when your people think they're great and they're starting to want to cut their bodies and they just crumble i know i know i made that fucking boy the first couple weeks mate oh the boy with the beads in his ear just kept crumbling the boy i mean it was it was a shame for him but at the same time it ended up you were just like get this country fuck me like it was no cut out for everybody so how do you because things seem to have changed then it's enhanced your profile anyway so how's that is it helps you a lot if i'm i mean how can i describe it man because nothing's really changed it's weird nothing's really changed but it's just listen you can get a number one single nothing will change i know it's all about how you see the world definitely no i don't i don't think that's what i'm saying i don't think i've really i think all it did was a firm a couple things that i thought about like how they do these types of shows and documentaries are mostly entertainment they're no really fucking documentaries like showing you the real facts a life and whatnot and i was just on that show and i was like how the fuck can this be a documentary but these are like telling us what to say kind of thing you're like oh can you give us this line and the we voxies the we fucking interview scripted it's like half scripted half no like they just kind of wait to see if you'll say something that's poignant or noteworthy because you were arguing with people and fighting and nah well i was fighting it i'd been in the jail mate because and somebody else would have been arguing i was arguing because cunt's didn't it cunt cunt's would never met a Scottish boy for the scheme they all think it's haggis and fucking tatis and leaps up your name talking about in scott's and drink whiskey they don't know the the real people really know what it's like up here and you don't need to be a big bad fucking hard man to know what it's like up here top city glasga man glasga paisley fucking dundee bits and head number everywhere mate there's bits everywhere that and they think it's fucking like the green belt up here we're all fucking dancing about fucking mad tribo nuttles or something no i mean no i mean like some of the greatest fucking minds in the fucking world i've had the biggest inventions in the world so we deserve our fucking respect and i went down there with like a fucking thousand year chip on my shoulder mate i'm being serious mate did you feel like an outcast i was ironically the black sheep in the house being the only white guy and being the only scottish guy and proper scottish as well do you know what i mean and they they love the banner they love the pattern and they love the way we say things and all that but as soon as we start to get passionate or angry about something it's they don't like it they don't like it they don't like an angry scott's man they don't like it unless they're portraying it in their own way do you know what i mean so i just i took it upon myself to be like mate i'm gonna represent myself the way i want to be represented mate and then they can fucking edit it the way they want to edit it but i'm going to be going half my nut if i see things that will be edited in a certain way and even like we do mad props challenge well or you didn't bring any props mate i did i had glasses i had gloves and i had a wee slingshot thing that was all going to be incorporated into the fucking performance as for a specific type of glove and a specific type of glasses catapult didn't didn't care but with the gloves and the glasses the catapult wasn't gonna work right cool they brought me the nan gloves they brought me the nan glasses mad gloves that they had to come off rapid they had to like fling off like that and they brought me mad carry more gloves that were skin tight i was like how am i i was like mate i was like it's not a big deal but how am i matey fucking and you brought me the nan sunglasses and also mad like pre markings man i was like bro i had a budget of 150 pound i spent a hundred pound on a pair of shoes that right that had scottish shit on it and that was like i mean fucking cool like so i'm just sitting like props like whatever man do you know what i mean like that's no mad job to think i props see as an artist see when you're fucking going to a video and that the fucking director will come up with fucking ideas like that but like do you want to try resting on it and then you bounce ideas off of back each other so i'm sitting like i'm fucking props i didn't even give a fuck about that cool i'll get my wee props they brought me the nine props and then they edited my like my wee bits my wee interviews after that to make it seem like i have because see when i see when i say i've i've i've got any props apart from apart from fucking these bad boys there's a whole other sentence before that but i'm like i fucking i got brought the wrong props and all that so i've no got any props apart from these bad boys they edited the whole fucking first half of the sentence and gave it gave them that and it's like i don't kind of weirdly it worked to my favor because everybody was like oh he doesn't give a fuck oh that's pure cool but i was actually trying to give a fuck and they fucked me over but that's all part and parcel of his tv that everything's done remember it's all about time so they have weeks and weeks of footage to cut down to 45 minutes but that's the editing team you've got the wee runnels and all that that are meant to be on fucking job and they were on job for every kind else but when it came to me it was like that's like cool bro you know what i mean so what's the plans then for your future where these where the show gone gone 23 years old now you've you've established yourself now it's just a case i get that break again hopefully fucking make it to 24 and 25 hopefully the music industry like i don't know man hopefully everything kind of goes back to normal and i can be in that like top percentage artists who stay busy during shit like this do you know what i mean because there's only a certain amount of people that are getting invited to come and do shows that you know i mean the kind of online side of things now so hopefully i can get to a position where i'm i'm in that kind of stratosphere where like no matter what i'm one of the names that like every kind of booking agent or whatever thinks of hopefully i can just to keep expanding the brand get get more merchant you know what i mean i'm quite picky with that because i want to write materials and want to look the way i want it to look do you know what i mean i'm quite stubborn that way but um projects man projects and visuals sorry excuse me for all this year i've got a EP coming out on january 22nd i'm kind of like the featured artist on that it's my friend uh Sean Cosgroves uh EP he goes by uh Senga Megadrive that's his fucking production name that's mental but he makes some good shit man so look out for that and we've got um one of the visuals for one of the tracks off the EP out now on my uh youtube channel it's just showgun do you know what i mean what is all your social media uh fuck contact fuck what am i on instagram what am i on instagram showgun on instagram but it's shv gvn because i'm a hipster fucking uh twitter twitter is at SHO and it's phonetically spilt so it's at E-S-S-A-I-C-H-O-H then fuck i just like joe herron on facebook and showgun on facebook i've got youtube i just showgun like literally see if you've got any just type in showgun i'll be like the first second third if you've got to get a record deal this year or someday that i don't have one album two albums i don't know right now that it's it's going to be all independent you know i mean through um so is that just then another tune hopefully get another one like valkyrie no no not so much i'm proper an album mode man in project mode now like it's a not so much about the singles it's about incorporating the good singles into a proper cohesive body i work now do you know what i mean being a proper artist and learning how to like um arrange my own stuff and just i become become more of an engineer and more of an mc more of a writer and what that's that's my plans just continue to grow and be around people who are better than me at it and learn from them that's the best thing is to go with people it's more established it's totally the training you learn for them totally i don't know who says that we feel the smartest man in the room you're in the ring room that's why that's why it's like i like coming up back up from like those situations and coming back up here and being able to like divulge information and kind of we like cheat codes for people in that but at the same time i hate being the big fish in the small pond i like to be the wee fish in the big pond because there's no shit to explore but um that that's pretty much what i've got in in store for this year man is just more shit on everything more content and definitely get these projects out so we've got high rise coming out on the 22nd of january and then people get that on all streaming platforms it'll be available i think we're trying to get some physical copies made but it'll be available on everything from 22nd of january um not got an exact date for the next EP with british and cain a top tier lyricist from mani um that'll be like executive produced by turkish decipher um looking to get some international features on it i can't really say too much about that right now but it'll be it'll be banging it'll be it'll be banging me trust me who'd you like to work with? oh how'd i like to work with top three top three with right anybody anybody guerrillas are they still producing aye guerrillas take nine can i even say dizzy because i've worked with dizzy i don't know that's a hard question aye so guerrillas take nine oh it's a hard one kendrick lemar kendrick lemar take nine kendrick lemar guerrillas seen the jail in that as well kendrick lemar i don't think so i don't think so he's just about hundreds of bloods and fucking i think i think damn near everybody else around him's been in and out and i think he's like the only one that's doesn't smoke weed barely drinks and all that and he's like the most bucked conmentary like this is what i'm saying literally the lives that they've made like the game 50 cent and all being shot done that we've done on the jails and they've made a massive career lives man i listened to 50 cents audio book man it's so motivational it's a motivational book just talking about how we go to the tap of the rap game and the news and the tap of the entertainment industry we power just all about his work ethic and belief even if you go back to when you watched him i'd interview his people in his hood talking about him like that he was capable he was he was like he done the boxing in the shop he was just knocking people out for the fuck you know that started boxing and he's nine i mean he's well respected i mean so he he was already up there i think that's why the transition into the rap shit made so much sense and that's why it as soon as they done how to rob the game and draft started drafting mixed tapes with g-unit and all that man like i think i think everybody at one point like wanted to wear all the g-unit shit and you know i mean everybody man i think i was about six seven year old wanting to fucking wear it because my big sister was listening to it i had the 50 cent poster see the one where he's stalling the fucking get richard i try and poster and he's stalling he's just like glistening looks like a fucking bodybuilder man that my sister he's sitting just fucking must be sitting just which how's the heat space and that they know good mate good i think because this time of year man like christmas and that's a bit fucking weird for me how come just family stuff like there's a lot of arguments and a lot of like trauma for but this this time of year for me and um no last christmas no christmas just there but christmas before i nearly died and in hospital i fucking appendicitis it was nothing pure mad but like i thought it was food poisoning so i sat my guy for four days and fucking go to about the fifth morning or something and like i was like i need to go to the hospital this isn't food poisoning like i'm fucking i feel like i'm fucking dying kind of it's first man you can die bro i was one of my blood markers i can't even but the woman said it was like it was maybe between five and ten this mad marker when you're healthy and that for some day my age and it was like 233 or something like she read out to me my bird and like i thought my bird my bird's just like she's chalk white and then she's saying i'm fucking like piss yellow for the you know i mean like it was weird mate i was in the hospital for like 11 days 12 days or something like it's bit my christmas norah in hospital pure having mad fucking biblical hallucinations and shit man like proper because they had fucking the morphing whatever the fuck they were putting on me the antibiotics and all that shit man three mad things every few years it was like i mean i was actually a decent size norax i'd just come out to jail and shit and i'd kind of been fucking melted on my muscle are we i lost like three and a half stone and like 11 days mate i was like this because i'd been throwing up fucking stomach acid or something like fuck knows what or pure bio man it was even taking a dinker like i say water for like the next like three days after i got to the hospital it was like it was like taking a shot of whiskey fucking mental mate it was brutal mate like my wee pal fit see he stayed like 100 yards say like fucking two minute walk through my moscow and i was like taking like 20 minutes to walk around norah hodd not the hedges norah but i was adamant like for the day i got to the hospital i'm no fucking lying down over my back fuck that because i just spent 11 days like that and i fucking hate i hate it mate so i like i need to get up and go day something and get my strength back norah so fucking mate i just i don't know how mate but i'm that bring back a lot of emotion in that then pain i mean i because it was like i was like i don't give you the kick up the ass ain't it go fuck no it does i mean it's something in my life i was like where's the hardy fucking only person that came and seen us and the hospital and is still like there for me is my bud he cares mate jeo hospitals they only get a few you know i was like i you're actually being fucking serious like i can't see even gunny messages and be like you're right after i nearly died and then a month and a half later fucking what am i doing in London like i fainted in the street trying to go get the train if i can go down for this rap game norah i didn't get a fuck either i was like showing the fucking absolute dedication to it then i've get to cheat to something be like that or fucking change your attitude norah i was like mate see if i didn't have my fucking attitude mate as i wouldn't be the one country in my country that's done something with this type of shit if i didn't have my attitude that no matter what mate i'll get up and go and day shit do you know what i mean no matter fucking what i'll let i'm a fuck up and fucking i'll be late to shit norah and sleep in and what not you know what i mean forget to set my alarm for the right time and like i'm a bit scatterbraining that but i have a fucking purpose but this year or these wee things that you put in place to be more constructive than to be like you've got the talent you've got the gift but it's it's not just enough to i know i know levels i know just have me a structure and go right fuck it man you know what i can work in it listen we're working process constantly you know all these wee things that you need to change but to open other doors to get you through the abilities there it's not there's no question about it it's just all you don't want to be sitting in five years and six years seeing everybody else still doing it does it ask if we can still be 20 year in the game then you can be as well you're still on the young lot or the shit you've been through so it's all down to you know how far you want to go now i want to have you back on in a year's time and you're flying you've had a top 10 in the fucking charts you've you're everybody knows you and you've says fuck me you know what i've done it i know i know it's just i don't know they they're last like the last remnants of fucking boyhood you know i mean that's mature man and i think the rap game thing would have helped you because you're working with people who's established and i know you're like in total today but you've obviously took it in because you have changed the one in the song you're talking about shout out to Aberdeen i'll get love for the sheep shaggy or something you can tell there that your voice has been made clearer as well so you're learning it's all it's all down to you listen we'll learn to the day we die but it's all down to you would you like to finish it on it brother just thank you for having me on bro and giving me the chance to speak about my my story and my music and that and shout out to every single scottish emcee that is doing it and do you know i mean try catch up to me one day for coming on a day brah and telling your story i appreciate that thank you a genuine root for you and hope all the best for the future my brother thank you brother check out more of my podcasts on the right and be sure to like share and comment your thoughts on this week's podcast thank you