 I'll start the recording. Thank you. Good morning, everyone. Thank you for being willing to shift to today, Tuesday, the week, the Thanksgiving week, a 30 in the morning, November 22nd. I need to, since we're conducting this virtually, I need to make sure that the committee members can hear and be heard. I will call on everyone and then it will be turning it over to Margaret to just quickly over, give us an overview of the agenda for the day. And then the design team is all here. So as I call out your names, just let me know if everything's okay. Jonathan. Here. Allison. Here. Paul. Present. Mike. Here. Sean. Here. Simone. Yeah. Elisha. Yeah. And I think I just got everyone that's currently here and I'll call out names when if I, as I see other people joining us. So. And I'll just let me check attendees that no one came in that way. Okay, we're fine. Hey, Margaret. I'm turning it up with you. Oh, we've got the screen sharing issue again. Paul has to enable screen, screen sharing. He is host. So somewhere. I'm good. Okay, you're good. Yep. Okay. Can everybody see this? Yes. It's a fairly short agenda. But I know we're going to spend, Dennis go has a pretty big update and I see that the third and Thomas Eddie folks have joined us. So they will also be. Helping with the update on sustainability. Energy use and modeling. So that's the big item. And then just as a reminder, our next meeting is December 2nd. So with that, I'm going to stop the share and I'm going to turn it over to Dennis go to get launched. Okay. Good morning. I think. Tim, this is your show. I just want to make sure that we do want to do it in the order as presented. We're going to do design updates. And then we're going to go into an energy model update with. Ali and throwing Thomas. Unless anyone has any objection. That's how we're going to do it. And we're going to start. Yeah. You're in control of the order. All the power, Tim. Too much control. Okay. So how are we going to do this? We're just going to go through the site plan, building plans. And then we have some videos of some interior spaces that some of that you have seen before and some that you will be seeing in this format for the first time today. Tim, before you get going, I just wanted to introduce Bill Brown, Natalie Brown from Brown Sardinia, our landscape architects. And then with Thornton Thomas, SETI. We have all of them on chat. If I say that correctly, Ali, I always butcher you. Rebecca. And I think I saw Irma. That was her max link that I sent to Rebecca. And so Rebecca just changed her name to Rebecca. Yeah, perfect. Since we were going to start with the site plan, since we do have Bill and Natalie here, maybe they can just spend a minute and talk about anything that has been updated on the site plan. We have had some discussions with the staff in terms of outdoor learning. So we've adjusted what our targets are for formal outdoor learning space, the amount of cultivation space that will be dedicated. And then there are just a few updates that are shown in the site plan here that maybe Bill or Natalie can speak to. Good morning, everyone. We made some site plan updates to show kind of what we're going to be designing for asphalt play. I know that's been asked about of what is actually going to be shown for spaces in the asphalt areas and also expanded the design a little bit on the rain gardens. And the cultivation area. So in the asphalt play, we're showing the line work that we're going to be working with right now. There's the line work is just going to be painted. We're kind of following the same design features with the circles and reiterating that throughout the entire space. And can you just point out where that is. Okay. I'm going to talk a little bit more about what we're going to be talking about. Okay. So over on the left side that is the younger kids play area. So with the younger kids play area, we have some meandering line work that leads you to different create areas for chalk play. Also different bag tosses. And then leads you over into the map of the world. The map of the world is kind of the central area, which is access for both younger kids play and older kids play. And then as we progress over to the right side of the plan, we're heading into more of the zone of the older kids play area, which includes four square. We have a running feet to yard track that comes over that and then it wraps around for the whole meandering path if people want to connect it. And then it wraps around to the first outdoor classroom, which is indicated in the blue. We are intending to put some stepping stones. So we kind of want this rain garden to actually be accessible for students to explore within it. But we also have the overlook circle. That's to the right of the top blue section. Which is for kind of more of a classroom setting people together. And see what's happening within this area. The dark green to the right is actually what we're going to be proposing as micro forests. So we're going to be breaking this section up into four different areas. One of a micro pine forest, one of a micro hardwood forest, one of a first succession forest, and then also having meadow off to the right side of those areas. And within these micro forests, we're also going to having outdoor nature play and more of a gathering area for the students as well. The idea behind the micro forest is that we'll primarily plant it with trees that are very small in the two to two and a half foot range, but interspersed with some larger trees as well. So that over time you'll see how these forest environments change over time. And then as we continue along the path down towards the south into the next blue area, it's another rain garden, but with a different design language. So we're going to be showing more of linear stones wrapping around. And then that leads us to more of the formal outdoor learning area at the south. The formal learning area is going to house the cultivation area, which I believe it was between 800 to 900 square feet of cultivation area that was needed. And we are going to be showing that. I think one thing to realize with regard to the asphalt play areas is we're trying to just, we're trying to define the area of asphalt play, the area of color that would be applied and a notion of what kinds of opportunities there are. As we go through the process after we get through schematic design, we'll have the opportunity to present a number of different opportunities with other people's input as to what they would actually want to see as we develop the project further in the future. So, so if I could just pause for a sec, Tim, was the slide before this was this. This is zoomed in and then slide before it shows a bit more. Okay. And then when we start, that's okay. So you can go back. I thought I saw the. All the images. One of the things that we should talk about for a moment, if we go back to the first slide is that we have made some minor adjustments to the field. And this, this plan of the field doesn't quite reflect it. We were able to expand the field slightly to the east in order to potentially accommodate a freestanding baseball backstop, which was discussed in our last meeting. So we have been able to accommodate that and we are showing on the plans, a location for the potential for the comfort station area at the top left. It's not shown on this plan, but we are showing it on the plan. So we'll be prepared for December. Can you explain the comfort station bill for those? Yeah, what we're doing is we're showing it just a box that's a 10 by 20 box that could house the comfort station. There was discussion of potential about doing a compost toilets there. And there will be a electricity conduits that will be supplied there as well. Actually, we are going to be, need to supply electricity for an irrigation controller. And we're going to need to supply a water meter as well for the irrigation system. So that'll be part of the plans that are prepared. For the next submission. And then I think just to, to go back maybe more towards. The design of. I just have an adverse reaction to asphalt play area, but to the, to the pave play area. Maybe Mike and your team Allison and, and some others could start thinking about it. And maybe even having a subcommittee that might help us design. The lines and activities that would occur in that area. Yeah, with other districts. If you do put a committee together like that, what would be great is if you could do a web search and. You know, show us images of. Games or things that, that you would like to have included. And then we can see if we can incorporate them into the design. And we can come up with ideas too. We actually. At one of our recent schools, the kids, the students actually told us what they really wanted to see. In the play areas for lines and games and things like that. So we would welcome that as an opportunity and happy to host. A couple of meetings or, you know, working group sessions with some students, if you think that would be something you'd be interested in. And to add, and sorry, just to add to that, we also worked with one of the teachers, I think for the fourth grade class, I don't know if this is the same project on off where we provided large scale drawings of the play area. We had a couple of students that actually tried to make the best of this. I mean, I think that was one of the original templates of. All these little components, so that they could actually participate and. And start laying it out. You know, it. Just for fun, just for understanding how. This puts, I guess, put together. It's just one more thing that we can use to throw the kids into the process. I'm sorry. What. Okay, now, Kathy. Tammy and Rupert have all joined us, so I just want to make sure they can hear and be heard, Tammy. Yes. Hi. Hi, Ben. Hello, good morning. And Rupert, although Rupert's name says Ben, it's Rupert. Hi Rupert. Hi, I'm the other Ben. So I think you answered the question I was going to have on a, some of this is a design template that would allow us to get a cost estimate on it, but you can get a lot more input. So, you know, both for the kids, the parents, the teachers. So just at some point we should figure out whether it's a subcommittee or however you want to do it, but to let the community know that. So as I'm going to be starting to talk about these designs, but let them know where to work in progress as opposed to this is it. So that was a just confirmation. And then on things like the around the world diagram that I've seen at a couple of different schools. I'm hoping that Ben and Rupert or others will get a good sense of your ability, you know that as you sweep them or clear snow, you know, do do they stay fresh and beautiful. Five years, 10 years. You know, so the less fancy to me often lasts longer in terms of the way they look. They don't get chipped and beat up. So I don't I don't have a sense of that because both schools I saw that had this had just opened a year ago. You know, so what I didn't have any. What is this look like after five years or 10 years so that we get something trees I can understand better little trees get bigger. But, but it's, it's the flourishes on whatever you want to call the hard surface, Donna that I agree that if we go overboard on it. It will not look great after the beginning. And so I'd like to be able to say where we're building things to last so it's a comment and a question on that. Yeah, Bill, do you want to comment on the durability it's painted correct. Yeah, it is painted and there's a couple things one is, we're beginning to do some research into a product called street print, which we think is more durable and we're in the process of doing it now. The other is that I know that that's Anita Williams that they purchased a plow for the area that they do plow that is painted that is a special plow blade that is fiberglass and it doesn't scrape up the surfaces as much. So that's something that we could talk about in the future as well. And the other thing is that, you know, we take a look at this and it's sort of unfortunate in a way because there are areas that are pinched in terms of where a plot could actually get through, like between the cafeteria and the rectangular play area that's to the north. There are some areas that we really don't do a whole lot of painting because we're concerned about plow marks and things like that for the future. I see several hands are up. I can resume role as chair, Mike. I want to really support the idea that was shared about bringing this to students about what games what lines and I know Tammy and Allison are presumed I shouldn't say no. But I feel confident that that they would be exceeded excited and eager as would I to be interacting with students around that dimension so I just want to plus one that and really encourage us to involve students in that process. Thank you. So Mike, maybe we can start after the first of the year, right after everyone gets settled. That would be awesome. And the other the other component to is the actual play structures we have a budget amount for the play structures but we will certainly want to start that conversation sooner rather than later, as well as soon as we get through schematic design and start starting to think about who may want to participate in that. I don't know if it's the larger community Kathy if it resides with the school department but we definitely want to involve the community in those areas. Well, thank you. I have four comments I'd like you to consider one is on the map. I think it's really important that we don't use the Mercator map which is the map that we're used to seeing because it overemphasizes the northern hemisphere that there are different maps out there that sort of really should reflects the true. It puts the equator in the middle of the map instead of on the bottom third of the map and things like that so it really reflects the true landmass of the world. I think that's a really learning that's a real learning tool that we have the opportunity to put in here because it's an aha moment for a lot of people who are used to seeing just a flat map that overemphasizes the northern hemisphere typically. So that's one. The second is, in my experience playing basketball you like the two basketball courts to be side by side. Because if there's a game going on you want to be shooting at the hoop right next to it so you can keep an eye on the other game instead of that having to be far apart so I think that should be a consideration because glomming two courts together gives you more flexibility for how to use the courts as well and I understand how this is sort of laid out sort of very organized this way but I think it's better useful is more useful if the two courts are side by side. Three, I think that what often happens in situations like this is that, you know, we have vehicles that the staff use and then they sort of park in the driveway where it says service entry and because there's no place else to put the vehicles. Otherwise for us to anticipate where to put, you know, a couple or three pickup trucks or whatever vehicles that we use on a regular basis that the service workers use to park, either adjacent to the service entry where those little trees are or some place in there that that's what that is for. Okay, that's you got that. Yeah, that those are pull out for parking. People actually use them you think I mean I would think that if I were going in and out a lot I probably just want to pull up right where the service entry is, but that's a good point. And then the fourth thing is I just, I hope that you considered where like where we're going to store snow when there is no storm where it's going to get loaded after it's removed from the parking lots. Yeah, Paul related to the snow, we will have to work with Conservation Commission on where we can place the snow so typically what we would do is put signage, no snow removal here, you know, put snow here, whatever throughout the. Yeah, so be good if we're designed so you know that the vehicles that have to move the snow can get there and not damage anything on the path in the process. That's a good point. That's important. They they're the engineers will as part of their submission. At some point and as part of their, their plan for submission before construction will be preparing a snow plan for the property. So that's part of the submission that we will be doing. Perfect. Thank you. Thank you, Kathy. So this design looks really great but it does seem like a lot of site work and I just I think Kathy has this last time I wanted to double check that this level of site work is something that's already been included in our and sort of baseline that we've been using for a cost estimate and that we're not going to see when we do the next cost estimate a huge jump in and site cost because it looks great but when you actually look at the sort of mass outside of the school, it's, you know, it's pretty large. Yeah, I was going to jump in on that the area and level of complexity are similar to what was costed at the PSR estimate. And in some ways, it's a little bit simpler. The design now has water sheeting off of the hardscape play areas into the stormwater management features. And I think that's a much of what we were calling the lazy river is now gone. I'm not saying that the site is less complex, but there has been no dramatic increase in scope or complexity that would increase the cost from when we were pricing it at PSR to now. Thank you. Yeah, I think Sean, the only area that we've added and we don't will find out what the cost is is the play area, the kind of multi purpose green play area between the two. But it should be, it shouldn't be that increase the cost by much right and hopefully by simplifying the site design. There'll be overall savings. I'll pull this down. I guess just to consider that, and I think that this is I know we're still sort of in the preliminary phases of this, but we will be housing at this new school and intensive learning center, which typically has students that are in wheelchairs and have mobility. So we would have to consider how this these playgrounds will be boundless right. The other things I know about my students here for rivers they love things like wobble, but I would say at least 20% of my student body likes to play that. And it would be interesting when I think about my K to twos right my conversion through second graders. Mostly they're using the swings in the playscape. And then as they age up they're doing more field games soccer for is the wall ball for square basketball. Last using the playscape but they still do. Just just to sort of be mindful of those things. And I do have a student principal advisory committee so I will be bringing this to them. So Tammy I think having, you know the older kids involved and what they really are truly interested in will will really help make sure that the features that they will use will be here wall ball might be. I don't know I'm looking around to see what what what wall surface can play on, but that might will have to work on that but I think if if you feel that the kids age up and really don't use the play equipment, then you know we can reduce the area for play equipment, which would be great so reduces the cost and and focus on some other areas. And the only like comment I would say back is maybe a gag a ball pit could potentially be something that would be similar to wall ball if there's something that we can't, but I'll bring it to them but thank you. The gag a the gag a pit still a huge success so. And as far as your accessibility, everything will be accessible not just accessible but we want to be really mindful when we select the play equipment that they can also interact and use the equipment. Tammy, I was just going to ask on wall ball. When I was at Fort River they were using the gym wall a lot the outside wall in the gym a lot right so that's one of the surfaces that's not available in this design, you know when you look at it so just thinking about is there. Yeah. Alternative. Yeah, we'll get the fourth, fifth and sixth graders on it. Paul's hand is up again. So I just wonder if it would make sense for us. I mean every inch of space here seems to be programmed. And would it be wise for us to say let's not program everything because we're sort of making a decision in 2022 for the next 50 years maybe there's some space that we want to leave unprogrammed that some people's attitudes change and they want to do something different 10 years from now. So that would save us some money as well. But I'm just wondering if it, you know, sort of unstructured space, we have a lot of nature trails and stuff like that but immediately adjacent to the building it's all seem to be heavily programmed. So that's why I wanted to wonder if you get to consider that. Are there any other. I'm just looking, I don't see any other hands but I might miss them so shout out if I'm missing you. Okay, I think we're good. Just one more thing that I should mention while we're on the site plan before we move into the building through discussions with Rupert. We will be carrying a generator at grade in about this area, putting it on the site rather than on the roof simplify some things and gives you a bit more flexibility. It's not shown on this plan but the generator pad will, while the generator itself is about 10 feet by 14 feet potentially eight to 10 feet tall depending on the size of the tank. And we could put a fence around it to screen it but the location shown where my cursor is it is out of the field of vision as you approach from or directly the field of vision as you approach from either direction and sort of away from anywhere play areas areas used by the site and it's convenient with the flow of utilities into the site. You know as as we progress we will show you what it looks like what the fence could be but putting it on the site rather than on a roof simplify some things and gives the project a bit more flexibility going forward. I apologize I wasn't I don't think I was at the last meeting but just to clarify, it's about a 600 KW diesel generator. So, so it's not to use gas so that we can maintain the massive incentive of not utilizing gas on the site. Rupert. So just to add to that I think the reserving rooftop space for PV makes a lot of sense, as does the larger oil tank capacity would have if we're ground mounted I think there are a couple of good reasons for this decision. Jonathan. I like the idea of ground mounting the generator. I do think we should be considering, you know, both fencing and possibly some acoustic screening from from the adjacent properties. Maybe you can handle this all of the timing of when it runs but you do have to run generators from time to time to keep them going and diesel generators are not quiet or can often be noisy. Yeah, absolutely they are not quiet there is the potential there it will be in a weather tight enclosure and that enclosure can have different sound ratings and so as we, you know, get into the design we will work that out and make sure that it works with the proximity to the neighbors and the acceptable levels of noise. You said to get the energy incentive, we have to use diesel, not natural gas. Is there any chance over this next several months that restriction will be removed. I don't think so right Kathy this goes back to for the round source heat pumps to receive that incentive. No I understand that and I'm just that saying, therefore diesel, which is noisier and smellier, you know, and you have to. It's, it was a question that I don't need an answer right now but it feels like an odd link to me that they've put that in. Well, well, the reason that we would be going with diesel is to avoid having a gas meter and therefore involving Berkshire gas in the project. If Berkshire gas is involved, if they have a meter on site, the incentive would come out of their pool of incentive money. Their pool of incentive money is much smaller than ever sources pool. So it's it's it's not. It's not a real restriction it's a choice that would allow to absorb or use all of that incentive money if we had to go through Berkshire, there would be a limit on it. Did you have a question on that to pull. No. And then a diesel generator is loud. It does have to be exercised but those are also true of a natural gas generator maybe not exactly decibel to decibel but a natural gas generator has a large area that is loud. The reason that it would be quieter as perceived from the neighbors is simply that it would be further away and on the roof. And then, and then the other alternative from diesel and gas would be propane and propane has a different set of issues one the tank would be larger. It and also a propane combustion engine has a inefficiency curve that is much less preferable you'd be spending more for fuel and the generator to produce the same amount of power would have to be larger so from just from a efficiency point of view propane is probably not the way you want to go. Sean. I don't know enough about how this works but I'm just curious in your, in your thoughts. Would there be any room for possible battery storage in the future. I'm not sure how heavy it is or how much space it takes up, but with all the PV. I know a lot of places are adding battery storage I'm just curious. You know if you've seen that anywhere and how much space it takes up. So it's a related but it doesn't solve the same issue as the generator, if, unless you have a very large probably larger amount of battery storage then you could fit on the site or would reasonably fit on the site batteries typically are used to take the peak off of the demand curve if you will rather than to run the building totally on its own in a power out situation. Technically it's possible but the battery array that would be required would be very large and expensive and I don't know that any schools have used battery backup for that purpose. Tim correct me if I'm wrong though I think what I was hearing Kevin Murphy who's our electrical engineer he stated that PV and energy storage. And it's have to be disconnected and a full power outage. I believe that's what he stated so. There are some intricacies to whether it's behind the meter and, and, and, and, and yes and so if it's a it's a full battery backup system that there are some complications that would add complication and cost to the project to allow it to work. Because, you know, I looked on a second there are code restrictions that if it's behind the meter that battery has to shut off with the building and then you have to essentially add equipment to turn it back on an automatic transfer switch. So, you know, all of these reasons. I don't know that we're there yet to count on batteries as a backup for power for the system. Yeah, no that makes sense. I've so learn the same thing that you have the power goes out you have you can't use your solar which kind of stinks but I'm just curious if the town did want to even if it wasn't for backup purposes at the town just wanted to explore using battery storage on the site because it's one of the newer buildings it has a lot of PV. How much space do you think will be required for, you know, for a, you know, a meaningful amount of battery storage. Correct me if I'm wrong Donna but the pad for battery storage at Hastings is similar to the size for the generator. Correct. And the generator was is 500 kilowatts at gas, but so it would be about equals Sean. So, what if if the town. Desires even just to anticipate it in the future, which might not be a bad thing, right. Technology is in 100% there yet these these storage systems are quite large, but maybe what we should do is double the pad size by the generator or or where we're putting the PV. Yeah, I mean, maybe the sustainability subcommittee can talk about it but I do think there's going to be a lot of grants coming out for things like that. I think there are sustainability coordinators interested in it so but thank you for answering the question. Yeah, I think my only comment is that we would need to incorporate an area for the conservation commission so they see, right Tim. Yeah, and I think this should anticipate. There's an overall strategy of including some future ready features be it conduit for EV charging that might be beyond what's initially included even talking about conduit for the lights and the piping for the comfort station I think, including a pad and conduit to a battery storage location. And not the batteries themselves or the infrastructure themselves make sense that would allow you the flexibility in the future to add these without essentially digging up your site again to get them to work. Yeah, and it's also just having more pavement and so when we go to conservation commission, it might be who of us to include that area so that in the future. We do need or desire to put it in if we don't do it now because we're not sure where the location, the best location would be that it's something that we should maybe consider when we submit our notice of intent. Jonathan. I would like to kind of second Sean's idea that this is something that even if we aren't even if the technology isn't there to do it today if they're reasonable and logical things to kind of prepare for. It does seem like something that over the next 10 or 15 years is likely to be an element that we will be adding to buildings and so if it if there's a way to facilitate it. Now that would be great. We can move into the building and now we do still have a bunch to talk about. A lot of the plan updates that we've made in the past week or two have been small and things like moving electrical closets and some toilets around to make sure that the infrastructure of the building works of the program spaces are where you have seen them with some minor refinements. There's a small change in the service area. We've moved the MDF and some electrical closets around, but as a theme throughout the building. You will see that again on the second floor, the academics based classrooms, the location of the library art and Sam are all as you have seen, but we have some made some minor changes in terms of where the electrical closets are as we really get into making the building is coordinated and we'll work moving into the estimate cost estimate. And with that, I am going to start sharing some interior views that we can talk about. I just saw that Phoebe's here also so Phoebe could you just let us know what you can hear and we can hear you. Hi there. Yes, yes, hi, thanks. This is a view that you have seen before. It will coming in the front door through the secure vestibule the opening to the main office space. Many of the finishes and the composition of the interior elevations are the same. We have adjusted the roof height in this part of the building the geometry of the clear stories. I am pointing that out to say that we've done it to make the building work more efficiently. And, but it should not be noticeable from what you've seen and reacted to in the past. There are some slight refinements to the finishes as we move in and look to the spaces that are open to the lobby the gym to the right. And then we'll circle around the main stair from the lobby. One of the changes to the plan that you just going to scroll back a little one. To find the plan we're beginning to think about locations where we could potentially put art and wayfinding in a previous iteration of this video in the plan as you were looking down the hall you would see the elevator window elevator door I should say. Now you were looking at a wall that could sponsor either a mural art. There's just a placeholder here but circling around the gym again. Now we're looking into the cafeteria. We're moving out to the play space. Here for the first time we're looking into the gym into the cafeteria I should say the ceiling here is rendered as a series of acoustic panels that are curved that makes sort of a structural or pattern in the ceiling with focus toward the stage that ceiling in the high is higher in the center of the room. For performance it's lower as you look toward the lobby to the left and out to the place based on the right. This shows the ceiling panels all as one color not to distract from what's on the stage, but it's also possible to bring the color patterns color way that we saw in the acoustic panels into for that we saw in the lobby and bring them into the cafeteria so you might have a more lively expression on the ceiling here. So as we get into the designs that's something we can talk about the use of color, whether it's a feature itself or a background for what is happening on the stage because, you know, most of the time when kids are in this room there isn't going to be a performance on the stage. Here, we are moving upstairs into one of the main parts of the building the project areas outside of the classrooms so here we are walking down the hall looking to the east and you can see light, basically Florida ceiling glass. At the end of the corridor here we're going in seeing students storage and storage for teachers above and the door to each of the classrooms. In each cluster of three classrooms there is a one classroom that is most of the exterior wall of the project areas and we've shown clear story glass. Above that and into both the second and third classrooms on both sides, so that light from the exterior of the building through that transom through the large sidelights at the side of the door will be able to get into the project areas. You know, most kids and teachers will not be able to see directly through that, but it will allow light it'll give you a bright ceiling. You'll notice, there's some ceiling clouds shown but we've shown them sort of woven out of pieces, not solid to allow the most of the daylight through into the spaces and then some sculptural and come colorful light fixtures. If you want to just talk about the lockers Tim. Okay, so as shown here. There are 72 lockers enough. And they're all on the perimeter wall, the center mill work each will be one per student 15 by 15 inches wide two feet tall and then above those lockers one per student we have cabinets that could be storage for the teachers and other academic things. If the lockers all on the perimeter wall. There's room for this mill work that separates the space of the project areas. You can. This is shown with whiteboard and tack board and some seating areas and some storage and potentially a place for a child to sit alone and read. We can go through and really develop this space we can talk about the best use it is possible to take some of these lockers and move them to the mill work in the center if we thought that was appropriate and allow for some whiteboard space that's a little bit further from the circulation of the corridor. But overall, with this mill work defining the space. If you look down the corridor you'll be able to see the edge of these clouds as a way finding technique and then this is a blue and green palette. That is not to say that there couldn't be a specific palette to each grade to each floor. All of that has to be decided as we move forward with the design. Tim, can you explain the cloud concept I'm not sure people will necessarily understand what you're talking about. These elements are with ceiling structure, either aluminum trim or ceiling grid with panels in and lighting, and they bring the ceiling down to a level that may be a bit more appropriate for the project area, they can sponsor a lighting. And as you go down the hall, you can see them, you know, from a bit further away and if their colors go to they will allow you to, you know, see what's coming next, but it isn't simply an element that defines the space through changing the ceiling plane. That the lighting, the colors will transform the design. Then here we show more tax surface on the exterior, you can display student work. Kathy, you have a question. Yeah, you talked about color schemes and one of the schools we visited the floor had a stripe in it. That if you were going to the blue room, you followed your blue stripe. I mean I think Paul you had mentioned some kind of way fan. The floor is a nice neutral color right here but that would that also be a choice if you wanted to have. Yeah. Okay, so it's just, it was just a question you know, you're, you're on your way to the blue wing or the red wing, the orange or the, I don't know, the green wing. Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, if you remember tastings where the floors told you what the color palette told you where you were that extended to the flooring itself. I mean here we are just showing a neutral so that we can focus on some of the elements that we have designed already, but absolutely. Wayfinding and many other elements can be expressed through the floor. So, this is taken granted that we'll call it my eye level. So you'll just see the hint of windows above the transom to the outdoor that ceilings are 10 feet. And then at the perimeter of the classrooms 12 feet so quite high which allow light to get pretty deep into the space. We've moved on from the project areas. If anyone has any comments from the project areas we can talk about that but then we're going to move into as I imagine you could guess the library. We'll keep moving. So this is the view as you exit the corridor and step into the library. You know, this is sort of a first pass at an organization of bookshelves and learning spaces in the classroom but you are looking at the curtain wall to the north that you have been seeing from the exterior for quite some time. There are our spherical and rain lights to sort of give some life to a fairly simple but you think elegant ceiling plane. And then as you move into the space we currently are showing a space for classroom size learning or a with movable tables and classroom technology. And that is not to say that this might not want to be somewhere else in the library. Here we're pausing to look at above the stacks there are a good amount of space that could sponsor artwork murals graphics. And then as we sort of circle around this is a storytelling area with the stacks moved to the side and the storytelling area itself defined by furniture, and then here we're looking into the librarians book room, which is enclosed, and the circulation desk. And then here we are looking at the entrance of the library from the inside with the door to the quarter. This is imagined as mostly glass wall and then you can see across to the stair that connects directly below to the lobby. Rupert you have a question. Yeah, just a quick question. Just give me a sense of scale I should probably have my head but the higher ceiling is that between floor and finish ceilings that like 12 or 14 feet. It's considerably higher than that at the very. You're looking at 17 feet at that point right here so there's a good amount of volume here in the library. And then as you circle around back to the entrance you're in the range of 10 or maybe a little bit below. So it is a comfortable area, it will be a very well lit library media center. I think what's also important is just to note that with the exception of the built in bookshelves along the perimeter, everything in the classroom is flexible so all of the stacks in the middle of the room the teaching area the seating area the storytelling area are all movable and obviously you're not going to move the stacks in between classes or whatever maybe you know over a summer if you decide you want to move them around for whatever reason that's certainly possible. I'm sorry to interrupt. So Rupert. You know I'm, I'm looking at this and thinking about your comment and thinking that you have a building with relatively low ceilings now. So, you know an issue with a space like this is relamping lights and ceiling access is that where your question is coming from. Do you want to just ask, be more specific about what you're asking. I can see that you've got looks like pendant globe lights that will be a little bit more accessible, but I am trying to imagine getting in there with a lift just to change the light bulb. All of the lights will be LEDs I know you've heard that LEDs never need to be changed but obviously they do need to be changed sometimes. But as Donna said, the sex in the center of the room will be movable. And I'm not going to say it's going to be easy to change but it won't be any harder than anything else and it will be possible. And, and Rupert, to that point, as part of the F&E furniture and equipment, you know, we're going to want to work with you on what kind of maintenance equipment. You may need, again, in here in the gym wherever they're really high ceilings, you know, ideally the LEDs don't have to be changed but, but every 10 years or whatever but if you want to start thinking about if a lift does make sense for this building then then we can incorporate that into the budget. Thank you. I just as another comment while we're on the subject. I'm delighted to see there's no recess lights way up at ceiling height in the high ceiling area. Thank you very much. Yeah, and Rupert, Donna's correct. There is, there is a piece of the budget that's embedded in this that we haven't talked about at all, which is the equipment you're going to need to maintain the building. So that that does come as part of the overall project cost. One more thing I should mention. We're talking about ceiling height since we have that higher ceiling height in the cafeteria below there will be a couple steps that will be right now it's one foot four above the rest of the second floor. There will be two ways to get into the library one will be a ramp and one will be a few risers and we're working on the best way to make it as seamless as possible and Jim and those that that accesses the function of having pulled the overall Florida floor height down in order to reduce the overall volume of the building so that's you had mentioned that at a previous meeting but just to reiterate. Just as another comment. Another reason why we will probably be looking at a lift for the ceiling is not just changing LEDs but smoke detectors and sprinkler systems and so forth. It is not uncommon that all lift be purchased as part of the FNC package there are there are going to be spaces. And the question we don't use ceiling fans or anything like that is situation to circulate here right. No. So just, just, you don't need to go back to the library but when you're talking about input from teachers and the use of space. These central bookcases can be moved around and I think the ones I saw at the Lexington school weren't as long as these maybe they're exactly the same these look heavy. So I'm just, and then the tables and the chairs. So it's all of this, you're getting input from the teacher, I'm not saying that I have any idea what to do with this by getting some input from teachers and Tami was along on the board to see some of the choices but it felt like there was a huge amount of choices of the kind of chairs that were in the library the kind of tables that were in the library. This the sheer length of the bookcases in terms of I could move a few of them and so without help. So that was like boy I could overnight if I wanted to recreate a space I could do it so I'm just, it's more on how you can move on things that don't need to be. You don't need to have a hard decision on them right now, but just a sense. Yeah. Yeah, and thank you Kathy I mean these these are just representations. We wanted to carry a volume count per se but but we can get into it and yes these are shown as one large kind of bookshelf unit but but in actuality probably. We probably would do it in half. Yeah, it would be to. Okay, you're all very observant with the details. And then if there are no more comments questions, thoughts on the inside we were going to just awesome. Allison has her hand up. Hi, I just was wondering, I know that there's all these beautiful windows in the cafeteria. Do those open are they sliding doors to the cafeteria will have doors but the glass itself is not operable. In the classrooms there will be operable doors, certainly, but for the sake of. Yes. So Allison yeah what we envisioned was that there is ample seating on the outside. So that you can have outdoor dining but we have that one exterior door Tim leading to the outside. Yes, to be all right. I only was asking because one of our concerns during COVID has always been ventilation I know this building has better ventilation. And we are very sensitive to the idea that when children are eating that there needs to be better airflow so then that's the only reason I'm bringing it out but I'm sure the airflow in this building will match whatever is needed to make sure we're responsive to pandemic needs. I'm going to sit back and go. Just a quick tour around the outside of the building to show any changes that have been made as we're adjusting the plan. And for the most part there have not been many and to the extent that there are there were not really noticeable we have adjusted. We mentioned the floor to floor height we've adjusted the roof height in the library a little bit all of which in the interest of making the volume that has to be heated and cooled lower and make the building therefore more efficient. The north elevation is essentially the same as the last time you saw it. Circling around to the east side you can see that we have a good amount of glass at the end of the quarters and on obstructed view that will allow people circulating through the building to see out to get daylight in. Moving around to the south side of the building, you can see the external sunshades on the classroom windows. We are still working on the canopy at the bus entrance. The geometry of the building has made that a little bit deeper and so we're probably going to be changing that we are still working on the service area the best way to screen it and to organize it. Tim, can you talk about what the light and dark the dark I'm assuming is an effort to render the manganese iron spot. Yeah, this is a little bit washed out the dark is the manganese iron spot brick. The light is the lighter masonry materials that we have been showing. And some of the other materials here, we have not decided what the canopy will be the, this is a an equipment screen, which will probably be a single skin metal panel. And then curtain wall and accent panels of masonry around the openings. There have not been many. A lot of the work has been focused on the interior but just wanted to show for this very absorbent group that a few things have changed. And with that, if there are any questions, we're going to switch over to the energy model and Ali. All right. Good morning, everyone. Let me share share screen. Perfect. Two and hopefully this works and I'm going to put it on presentation mode so that all the messages from my team members don't pop up every so often. It's an active week for those of us who are around. Okay, so we go here. All right, you should be seeing the full version and not the presenter view, can you confirm that. All right, great. So this is an update on the energy analysis for the building. The key goals of the study were to perform the energy analysis to submit energy use and then get a sense of where we were lead points wise. Besides all the other. All the other things we think about when we're looking at energy what has changed I have an extra bullet point there blank but not meant to be there. What has changed from the last time you saw it the zones basically the model has been redone. What has changed the zones have been refined the earlier model we had was very rough. It's a type of models that we do really early in the design where we're looking at zones just very roughly like these are going to be roughly classrooms. These are going to be roughly offices but it's really rough. So what we have done this time around as we've gone, you know, classroom by classroom office by office corridor by corridor drawing everything and so it's, I would say it's brand new model. It's also been refined and so we had a conversation on this is in particular the summer use and guidance in terms of the fact that the building is anticipated or that we would like the model the building to be modeled as two thirds occupied. That's something for all anticipated use because as a reminder we want to know the reason why we want to know the UI has to do with, you know, not only lead points but also the utility incentives are dependent on that the size of the PV array depends on that and so having a good sense of what we the real, you know, anticipating the real occupancy of the building on a busy building is important. So at a wall ratio we're still at 22% glazing, there are certain glazing areas that are that are well defined already. And for the others we were asked to just match it to make sure we're 22. And so they're still, you know, we'll still need to be reconciling as the design moves along just to make sure that the designs on track to meeting the 22 but we're confident. The Cisco team will be, you know, is tracking that as well and so 22% so nothing has changed there, you know the amount of glass and where it was, you know has changed a little bit went from the past design but as I mentioned this is a brand new model and reality. And so without more, we can talk about envelope, nothing has changed from the envelope assumptions from the last time around, and we can talk about the assumptions in detail but I just wanted to give you just a sense of where we are. Our lead baseline has an UI 46 for those of you who are familiar with the lead baseline the only reason why we look at the lead baseline is for the points but it's not a representative building in any way shape or form. The proposed building as it is, is it an UI of 25. We looked at what would be the impact of incorporating high performance class we've been talking about a glazing system that performs like triple pin glass, but that is more affordable and triple pin glass that is used in many schools and that is actually really successful and so we wanted to just get a sense of where we're going to look at this and more welcome as we dig a little deeper into that. A couple of things I think the most important thing to point out and so I've added there also the size of the PV array that would correspond to this EUI. I think that I do want to point you to and that this is, we consider this a conservative estimate, because we, the next step will be to make sure that the occupancy. We're using, we're looking at the schedules and taking, you know, default occupancies for a typical classroom etc etc but what we have found is that we typically do this as we move into dd. The people count is really important. And so making sure that we're not, you know, at lunchtime this is the most typical but at lunchtime oftentimes a default schedule and energy model be counting people in a classroom in the cafeteria at the same time. And so we have to yet go through that people count at every hour just to make sure that we suddenly don't have twice as many students at lunchtime. I'm exaggerating but that refinement will typically the EUI will go down with that refinement and so we definitely consider this to be a conservative estimate. Other inputs that need to be refined or elevator energy exterior lighting occupant count as I mentioned, and then lighting per space right now we're taking an average Watts per square foot as recommended by the electrical engineer but we'll definitely want to refine that a little bit. Maybe I should have just step back and pause a little bit on the proposed and just point out that this is a really efficient building. How does one know typically and really efficient buildings the equipment. So can you see my mouse, I don't know if you can see my mouse but the equipment takes up a bit you know a good third of what the energy is in the building that means that a lot of equipment and lighting are, you know, are the bigger loads. And then everything else, you know, thanks to the ground source heat pump and all the other things then all the other so these this is energy we need the lighting and the equipment is energy we need by program and so what we try to do with a really energy efficient building is try to minimize any other energy we need to condition that space so of course there's pump energy and fan energy to ventilate but this is definitely the profile of a really energy efficient building. A last slide that I'll show. Oh, it's not there. Hmm. Sorry, I will try to pull it up for some reason. I'm missing that slide I had some issues saving and versioning yesterday and so it's missing right there but we had to I'm sorry to interrupt you. Yes. Jonathan has his hand up I just want to make sure you yes. Jonathan, I'll just get to you because I'm leaving on the like I'm missing a slide I'll just tell you we have the utility the annual utility costs for each one of those in case there were questions about. Well, how much are we saving with a high performance guys we actually have that number, but my slide disappeared and I'm happy to dig that up if it's of interest right now, otherwise it will be sent within the deck afterwards. So my question just touches on the glass. Right now in the proposed in the proposed energy model, not the proposed with higher performance glass, and also in our cost as to what what are we carrying are we carrying do a place or triple glazed reminder. It's double pain. Thank you. It with user controls of the building use in terms of energy. Do you have incorporated into this places that people could see how much this area the building is using how much is that I don't know what kinds of monitors in and not articulating it but rather than just one being able to look at a upper floor lower floor. Yeah, that if, if we wanted to have the teachers, others say how, how do we do today how we do over the last four months or the kids look at monitors would there be places that other than high tech people, people, the users can be looking at. So I'm going to defer to the nisco but just to clarify so you're talking about sub metering. The energy model itself does not take that into account that doesn't impact what the predicted energy use is. But how you actually understand how the energy is is is going to the different places would be done by sub metering in Tim and team. I'll defer to you on on on the conversations in some metering on how far we've gone into that discussion. We have not designed a building management system or the software that will be included with the project that would allow this sort of monitoring but it has been mentioned in the past there are certainly an opportunity and a desire. I think as we develop the design with the AVR mechanical we will incorporate that, you know, to what degree and how many locations. We don't know yet but I know that has been expressed and it's something we're thinking about. Yeah, but I think what Kathy, maybe correct me if I'm wrong Kathy is displays throughout the building so that it can also be used as a teaching tool, right. It's both that it would be metering so Rupert Ben custodians could be managing it but also teachers and students could be learning from it. You know, it could be learning from it and it wouldn't have to be every single one. I see both Paul and Rupert have their hands up. Yeah, Kathy just just to build on that Kathy. I think that's one of our brands for this building is a net zero and that I think you know UMass is physical fitness building has that they have a big screen when you walk in shows you how much energy been used and history and stuff. So I think if we can incorporate a screen of some sort like that in terms of how we brand this building. That's one of the things we really want to promote. Thank you for bringing that up. Yeah, and I wasn't talking about everywhere. You know it's, it is the one North Virginia one I saw there was one place you could go and go whoa look at today. So, thank you, Rupert. I just wanted to echo what Donna had already said, we sort of had preliminary discussions between Dinesco and their DAB international their mechanical engineer and myself and we're looking forward to following up on that I think part of the discussion will involve what's what level of detail is useful and meaningful for learning purposes and what level detail is important for building management purposes, and they're two separate discussions really, which I'm looking forward to. Any, any other comments. Sorry to just jump in but I'll just add that that this is particularly important when you have an electric building. You know, in the past we at least could look at heating and you know gas as a separate thing is electric but now everything will be electric. Right. And so understanding of the electric what is going to the ground source heat pump versus what's going to your plug loads right what can you control versus what kind of depends on the climate is what their conditions is is important right so measuring but thinking about what what use will we give to that data and how can we get data that we can that we can take an action on right so that that relates so data that relates to usage in particular and I can influence how we use the building should be separate from data that is just you know it is what it is for the climate. Well, is your hand still up or is that for me for okay. Thank you. So if, if there's not another question I just see that you've got proposed high performance glass. That hasn't been priced in yet so that's a, that's a maybe is that where that's sitting. Okay, that is a maybe that we will be looking at when we submit documents to cost estimator in December. Questions or comments, and Tim is, does that. That concludes our presentation for today. So I do ask, you know it's a repeated request but please send this set including the rotating videos. I've got at least one district meeting, I'm going to try to do, and so some of these refinements are terrific and they're exciting. Any, any other, I don't know whether we have invoices for today, Sean, Margaret. We do Margaret do you want to bring them up or do you want me to. Yeah, so I we have just the answer and voice for today. Let me just open that up. Okay, it's opening. All right, I'm going to share my screen. Okay, so this is our October invoice, which just went out a couple days ago. It's for 6455, which, and it also includes the cost of our estimate, the PSR. Oh, sorry, can everybody see it. Just realize I may not have shared. Okay, so it our fees for this period is 6455. And then there's $5500 for the preferred schematic report estimate by our estimator Peter Bradley. And as always, this sort of has really mostly my hourly billing. A little bit of work by Bob Stevens on administrative activities. And there's PM and season voice. So that is it. Do I hear motion. I'll make a motion to accept. And I need to do a roll call vote. Rupert. Yes. And Yes. CB. Yes. All. Yes. Jonathan. Yes. Mike. Yes. Tammy. Yes. John. Yes. Simone. Yes. And Alicia. Yeah. So Margaret, when you do the tally, you'll have to count the people Allison had to leave early. Okay. Okay. So, you know, one thing I think I've been told is on the total amount we have budgeted for answer. There's an overall monitoring of it so that we're will be fine up until the next stage of the project. Is that correct? That's true for both contracts. So both contracts go through the submission of the schematic design and then there's some time set aside for helping get you to the vote. But once we hit the vote now, one thing that does need to happen is that we need to negotiate and agree upon fees. For the remainder of the project because they get included in the overall project budget. So that piece is going to happen the next month or so. Okay. So before I open it up for public comments, I, I sent it to people over the weekend because I just learned about it on Friday, but the school committee. This week, Mike, been voted on a motion to support the CPA proposal for the fields, just the field proportion of it is, is that correct? Okay. And I sent people that our committee actually has as a building committee has no. No school properties. So I didn't know whether anyone wanted to express support. I will be attending that meeting. I am a liaison to CPA anyway, but I'm in an awkward position because I'm a counselor, and then I get to vote on the CPA budget so I have to, relatively, well, I can be a citizen, I can be a resident. So I just wanted to make sure everyone was aware because the group that presented to us asked if we wanted to take a vote. And I thought it was more important that the school committee does because they have to, those will be athletic fields if CPM money is awarded. It's kind of late breaking news, but I didn't know whether people wanted to take any action here or not. I'm not seeing any. So, Kathy, can I ask a question? Yeah. What would the best way, whether it's as a, you know, as a committee or individually that we would show support for that. Number one, it's on, I will send everyone the exact dates and time to CPA schedules on it. And I think in public comments will hear that you can come on as a resident and express your support, you know, I think the big one for us is it reduces the taxpayer ask for, for the rest of the project budget. And so this is an integral part of the project. So you can come on as individuals you can come on as people from the committee I'm just saying that I'm in a position where, as a council member I'm also going to be on the CPA budget so I have to, I have to be cautious on what I say I'm clearly everyone in the Sean finance world is trying to figure out the best way of packaging the financing the school to keep the, you know, the news on the energy budget that we get that big incentive, you know, are going to be grants for PV. So we're looking at the whole package but so but that you, everyone can come on with comments and you can send in written comments there, the CPA takes written comments as well. Okay, there's a, and just to, there's a public hearing for CPA on December 8. That's after all the presentations are done, and that's sort of the specific time for community members or residents to come and voice support for any of the CPA projects. So, the way they work is they, they've got an ass that's much bigger than the amount of money this year. So what they do is they're talking within themselves on higher priority and making judgment calls about amounts not just is the project inner, but they don't have to accept it at the full amount if a project can take less. Jonathan. I want to make sure I understand from the fact that I sit on this group. Are there, is there a protocol about putting that you know, putting forward support or comment for something. How does a member of this committee, express that properly. Paul, you can comment on that you know what I what I've seen on other projects not this one I've seen people from the historical commission come in and weigh on a historical project, you know, even though it was, you know, it wasn't their project. We're, we're just, we're a different kind of entity here, you know, we're a public building we're a school we're, and we're residents Paul, I don't know. Yeah, so, so I think you don't give up your right to be able to have a public comment so you can always go to the CPA public hearing and make whatever comment you want as an individual. Yeah, but you can't say, I'm speaking for the elementary school building committee because the committee hasn't taken a position on it and probably be analyzed for the committee to take a position position on it at this point in time. And still up. I didn't mean to cut you off. Yeah. No, no, I just had another question. And, you know, maybe given what you just said Paul I'm, I guess my question which maybe should be answered offline I'm not sure is, is there a reason why we wouldn't as a committee make a public statement to make me that it would be in the best interest, because, you know, overall funding of this is, you know, something that we talk a lot about and if there's a benefit. I don't know. That makes sense. Yeah. It's a clear question. Yeah. I mean the committee can do what it wants but I think in the context of what the CPA is looking at. This is more a finance question like where does the money come from this is all taxpayer money it's not free money or anything like that it's all taxpayer money. So a matter of in terms of assembling a package of financing this project is, you know, I think we're putting a lot of credits and all kinds of different things, saying we really want this one source of revenue. When there are some other needs in town, I can't really take a position on it because it would not want to because of all the other demands that are coming from other departments and in the town. And I think that Sean and Mike might be in a similar position. Thank you. So I, I understand what Paula saying but I also just wanted to speak in support of what he was mentioning in that I think there is some benefit and that's at least making a statement that we support the initiative, or the idea around that because I do think it would really benefit us in the exclusion override if this were a successful endeavor. And so I think that it would be wise for us to support such thing in terms of making sure that this is possible and just other extra efforts that we can put forth as a committee to ensure the success of the project. So I'm not sure if there is another appropriate way or another way that the committee might feel would be more appropriate but I personally think it might be wise to saying we support this initiative, whether it be approved or not I think we should say that we support this moving forward or make that clear to the CPA if that is possible so that they know that when they're making their decision that this would also benefit us as a committee. I mean, I'll just try to summer what was what I'm hearing. I think we're hearing Alicia and Phoebe that some people would need to abstain wouldn't be a post, but not take a position but each one of us can go in separately and be supportive for the debt exclusion reducing it is a tax package. So I don't. And that the school committee, I think was the critical group because they had to actually CPA will put. If that money gets awarded those are recreational fields forever, they don't become usable in other ways so that was an extremely important vote. I'm, I'm low to take a vote if we're not unanimous, if we really end up losing people and we have nine people left right now. Tammy had to leave and Allison's not here and Angelica is not here. You know, maybe I'm miscounting so I mean it's it's clearly up to the committee. I don't I think it's not on the agenda. So I'm not going to vote today anyway even if we wanted to you could put it on a future agenda for the council for the committee to vote on. Okay, so if the hearing is on the seventh we have another meeting on the second so that's what I think people will come back and we can, we can revisit this. If I said the seventh that's on the eighth. Sorry. Okay, no, I misspoke you just say the eighth shown. So we will be meeting before that happens. Alicia, is your hand up again, or is it still up. Yeah, sorry, I would just be interested I don't want to like force or be asking people to talk but I'd be interested to hear how the other committee members feel about this they would be interested in taking about or other people would prefer that we individually go forward. Mike. I'm not going to help much but to break the sounds I don't have a strong preference either way. I have no opposition, you know, to either method I'll have my opinions about you know the actual question but in terms of process. I don't have a strong preference either way. I will put it on the next agenda. I have forgot to do this poll but I didn't know whether the school committee was going to take a vote on it I had heard that they wouldn't be able to meet, and I was out of town so it's. So I only learned that they had actually discussed and made a motion and then Allison did send me the wording that she sent a direct letter over. So I can put it on the agenda for the next meeting and people would like to be. I want to clarify because I am not completely clear on the procedure. If we wanted to take a vote next meeting because we can't this meeting, would we make a motion this meeting to support or would we make that motion at the next meeting. What is the procedure here so that I'm clear on at the next meeting and I will I will put discussion and motion on the agenda. And then we can decide next, and we will have time. So I think that's it I'm sorry to make this awkward because I feel as a, I'm in a triple spot because I'm also the lead council liaison to CPA. So I'm on the finance, I have, I've got too many hats on for this question. So are there any other questions or comments before I turn it open it up Jonathan. This is not our last conversation I really like the idea of putting on the next times agenda but I just wanted to kind of make a general comment which is to thank the design team for all their efforts on the 3D visualizations I know the effort that goes into making those both interior and exterior, I think they're wonderful tools for communicating the progress and there's been a lot of great progress on the project. They're really helpful with with the, I think the broader community. And I love the fact that some of them are taken, you know, really start off at kid height, which I think is very important to kind of see the building from from the, the largest population group will be using it. So I just want to say thank you. I want to echo that because the other thing you did with the picture of the outdoors one person said there were no trees, Tim, and your original rotating around had so many trees you couldn't see the building and I kept saying the trees are there not to worry. So it's not a sight. We have to do that. No, I see the other way. Okay, so I think we are open for public comments at this point. And I see two people's hands are up, and I am not host. So, I think Sean has been promoted as host. So, yeah, I make Sean host because I started after started different meeting. Okay, so I brought Bruce. Okay, thank you so Bruce you have joined us. Yes, thank you I echo what Jonathan said. Absolutely. I have a couple of one question and I guess a question from it. The first is, Tim, the, or maybe it's a hunger. The, the, the upgrade to potential or the consideration of the upgrade to triple placing with the lower you value and so forth. I remember in the basis of design for the PSR I think there was mention of supplementary heating in certain places. I think it was in some cases it was near windows in in areas of sedentary activity. And I'm thinking that if that's the case, then upgrading those windows or some of those windows I guess it's the large areas of windows you might be contemplating to a higher performance glazing, presumably would enable the supplementary heating in those areas to be eliminated, which would save a little bit of energy of course, and, and also a little bit of cost so if that's the case I'm assuming that the upgrade to a high performance grazing might or would include the elimination of some spot heating. So that of course, but may have be may have misunderstood. Second, in, in respect of the, the, the energy use chart. I'm becoming quite interested in the, in the plug loads, which I guess in that chart is largely the equipment. So, I just think it's become increasingly apparent to me that that's the management of that. fraction of the plug load or equipment, which is essentially the user or occupant responsibility to achieve budgetary energy budgetary objectives is not going to be the responsibility of the design team. Design team seem to have responsibility for, and along with the constructors for getting us through maybe 70, maybe two thirds of that. But the other third, and these charts seems to be occupant use and, and when I was an architect I had a passing interest in that but I'm realizing that I didn't really have a really thorough understanding of how to go about managing this so I'm getting quite interested in how this project and who in this project takes responsibility and how responsibility is taken for meeting these occupant load energy budgets so on. Some questions I guess I will have in the future for that but for example I imagine that the elevator slash process that process doesn't include cooking and kitchen loads. It does it's very efficient. But so I would appreciate the as this model is refined to break out some of those loads like cooking, which are essentially things that can be tracked in the in the building that don't become so much an occupant load. And they are I guess the people who are running the kitchen but not the occupants of the building generally, whereas other loads really are going to be down to occupant behavior and and I'm getting particularly interested in those so I'll be asking questions in the future to build that interest and hopefully be constructive in helping the project to understand and manage them. That's it for me thank you very much everybody. Thank you both. And Rudy we have brought you in. I think, thanks very much. Oops, let me get my camera here. I just want to echo what Bruce, Bruce is concerned about the plug load, and to make sure that we're looking at energy savings and all the equipment the kitchen is, you know, and the coolers and walk in. The freezers and refrigerators, all of the kitchen equipment is going to be something that I suspect is going to be specced by as part of the project itself. Anything that's getting specced within the cost estimates I think we should be looking carefully at to see if there's, you know, more energy efficient versions at a same or similar price point, and that we go through the plug loads with the same care that you all have taken about the building envelope and blazing and so forth and really some of that's probably being brought over from the old schools, but to the extent it's not. We should also maybe have school people looking making sure they're getting the most efficient printers, computer screens, projectors, all that kind of thing to help us with our UI. We need to have a better understanding of where that responsibility breaks out and how much is within this committee's and what what can be done to improve that equipment number. And secondly on the vote on the CPA obviously I have a somewhat vested interest here is one of the proponents of it, but I think it would be really important for the SBC to take some kind of position on this as a group at the base to clarify that this is not in conflict with the, the planning and purposes that the school building committee itself is is undertaking I mean if I were the CPA, I'd want to know that this proposal or certain elements of it were consonant with, I don't know what the right word is harmonious with what the school building committee sees as the trajectory of this project and the need to get the public on board, and obviously I think it would better to have a full throated endorsement of it but I think the committee as a whole should express something to the CPA that makes it clear that there's certainly no conflict, but hopefully that that you see advantages to the CPA even even if you don't endorse every element of it. So I hope you all will think about that and I'll look forward to the discussion at the next meeting. Thank you. Thank you Rudy. I think Sean that's it correct. Yeah. So I want to thank everyone, including being flexible to move the meeting time and I just had one question of Alicia or Alicia arm is the morning meeting time now okay with your schedule. I still can't do mornings on Friday. I had a little bit of a schedule change but I still am working in. Okay, so if you can send them to me because there was difficulty getting a quorum together for the 130 on Friday but so next time we're scheduled for the the on the second we are scheduled for correct to 830 right morning. Yes, yeah we got it. The second is the morning so next the next meeting will be a 30 because that was today was going to be the afternoon but we can try to work get a schedule that will work. That's what we're trying to do so just stay tuned. And I'll get more information on Alicia about her work schedule. So I want to thank everybody and wish everyone a very happy Thanksgiving week. Hopefully with family hopefully with some downtime. So we are adjourned. Thank you.