 Hey, coaches, welcome back to the podcast. In today's interview, we have coach Leo and coach Jack Carrillo. Jack is a private goalie trainer. He has a keeper specific business in New York. He's had a business for about five years. I think my favorite part of this interview, I just got done watching it, it is the part where he talks about going from doing things with cash, switching over to a much more organized model and how that helped him grow his business. But Jack shirts so much information in this podcast. He talks about how he got started, the challenges that he had, like his goals that he has about running residential camps, which is a really cool thing to hear about. And I think you're going to gain a lot of valuable information from today's interview with his journey that he's had so far with his business. So sit back, enjoy his interview. And if you want to chat with me after you watch this, shoot me a text, my numbers right below this video, you'll be able to see that in description. All right, and I'll chat with you soon. So I was about 15, 16 when I started coaching. My father was actually his coach at the time. And I where I was growing up, soccer was starting to get popular. But it wasn't something that was still like, I'm based in Orange County, New York, mainly. I currently don't reside there, but I still mainly do most of my work there. And while I'm doing my, my training, when as a kid, there wasn't really the soccer coach, there was no, no one that had the specialty was mostly still dads and things like that. And what ended up happening was my dad being the intellect that he is, learned to study the game, read all the books that were out there, became a huge fan of obviously Sir Alex Ferguson, became a big Manchester United fan in the process. And I learned a great deal of my coaching, especially with larger groups from my dad, because he was so well, so good at breaking down skills so that someone who doesn't understand it would know. Then because specialties weren't really there, I gravitated towards goalkeeping. I loved position. I liked the pressure. I liked what it was kind of about. And I thought it was kind of a funding to throw myself on the ground. So my parents sought out goalkeeper coaches, and there wasn't any in New York. So I started going to a soccer camp once a year. My parents weren't very weren't as fortunate to be able to provide more than that. And the camp that I my parents found was a company called Star Goalkeeper Academy. And Star Goalkeeper Academy is owned by and founded by Dan Gaspar. If you don't know who Dan Gaspar is, he used to be the Benfica goalkeeper coach. He was the Portugal national team goalkeeper coach. And he just recently finished with Iran, actually, I think he's been to the World Cup two or three times already as one of the staff coaches. And what I learned through his staff was the excitement, having fun as a goalkeeper, knowing that mistakes do happen, learning how to let it go. And it built me to be a better goalkeeper. But it became one of those things where I only got goalkeeper training once a week. I mean, one week every every year, because that's all it was. The camp is very expensive. It was about $700 at the time. I think it's now closer to a thousand, depending on what he's doing. But he his program used to run all over the country. And now it's mainly based in Connecticut. So from there, as a student through it, I started finding myself helping out younger goalkeepers, teaching what I was taught. And I built my my system. Once I graduated college around 22, 21, I started working at a facility where I was the goalkeeper coach. And the facility was based in Orange County. So I was getting to kind of go back and do what I like to do, which was help out the kids that didn't have it because I didn't have it. And I was molding a little bit of my information and my knowledge from one coach and a couple of my other coaches, like my goalkeeper coach at college as well. And I kind of developed my own system. While I was teaching at a younger age between 20 and 25. At about 25, I started noticing that the numbers were really high. But I was working for someone else. And they were accumulating more of the profits. And when I asked if we could negotiate and change how we would do the payments for me, because my program is being so so so successful. He had a negative reaction and it led to me leaving the facility. Thankfully, the majority of the people did follow me to the next facility. That facility I was actually managing while also doing the goalkeeping programs. But it was short lived. I actually tore my ACL while playing. I was playing semi pro for a while. I tore my ACL. And during that time period, no one was able to properly step into my shoes. So the facility actually didn't work out after I wasn't there. So the owners sold the facility to another company and they went a different route than sports. So from there, I took a little bit of hiatus from coaching the class environment and did more of a individual one on one private training. At that point, I was definitely doing a lot of cash based stuff. And it while it helped with the revenue, I wasn't really able to track anything. I was able to really say like, Oh, I made this much of a profit or not. And I wasn't factoring in my travel or anything like that. So as a younger coach, I was making in my opinion a lot of mistakes that now as an adult, I know more more well about. But then what ended up happening was I coached a few colleges instead. I was working for Naya College for a few years. I worked for St. Thomas Aquinas for a few years. And during that time period, met my wife, we got married. And to actually help pay for the wedding, she told me I should get back into it because that's what I love. And it would be better than me picking up like a night shift job. So I very thankfully said yes, I'll get back into it. And I started forming the plan for summer camps, clinics, private sessions, and working with travel teams as our clubs as opposed to trying to find a home base that had classes. And that has grown over the last five years into something that we're pretty proud of. We work with about 100 goalkeepers a year, maybe a little bit more consistently. And I have eight coaches that now work under me that are either still in college or they are graduating and they have their part time job or their other job and this is their secondary thing. And we do winter clinics, spring clinics, summer camps. We are now looking into doing a holiday goalkeeper war tournament that will be in the fall. But obviously a lot of stuff has to go in the right path to do that. So what we have planned for this summer, we have three summer camps planned starting in July. The spring break, I actually have one of my coaches used to be running his own goalkeeper spring clinic. So and I'm currently working with three goalkeeper, three soccer clubs right now as their goalkeeper coach. Okay, awesome. Awesome. Awesome. So so tell us tell us a bit more in detail about your business then how how are your how's your company different to another goalkeeping company? So this has become the the conversation that I've had a few times with more or less just other like minded people. And that is Orange County, New York is not known for its financial stability. I want to say there are a lot of people that do have that are very financially stable. They have their families. But it's a different cost of living than living closer to New York City. It's about an hour and a half north of the city. So property is a little bit less. Jobs pay for a little bit less and things like that. So the idea that a former pro soccer players that come into Orange County and charge $150 an hour, it's it's very short lived. So I've seen a lot of goalkeeper coaches come in, and they don't stick around. They move either to Westchester, where people have a little bit more money, or they find an academy program or a premier program in another state, and they move on. And that's one of the big things is where I have focused the majority of my, my business as not making the prices unattainable, offering discounts, especially when parents have multiple kids that are interested. And keeping the concept more about the numbers, as opposed to about the the price tag. I'm not someone that's going to walk around with an ego saying that my goalkeeper coach style is the best. I actually tell people if you are interested in looking at so and so and so and so, I usually tell them you should go not have his own home base. She does but those are the two others that have a very similar concept. We are trying to prepare them for what we're seeing goals being scored on. We're trying to teach them about not just the proper technique and safety, but also how to develop and grow for the higher levels. But where my company differs more from the other two is I really heavily specialize in goalkeepers that have never played before. That developing younger goalkeeper. So my one of my goalkeepers who's currently at West Virginia, West Virginia University. When I started working with him, he was a striker that just wanted to learn goalkeeping at nine years old. Now he ended up falling in love with it. Now he's one of the goalkeepers he's playing. He's having a great time. He's learning. He's one of the backups. They have about four people. They're very very talented group. But yeah, I don't specialize in only the goalkeepers that can do the full extension diving save. I'm working the goalkeepers that can catch up. And I want to make sure that they have that ground that level that skill before we move on to the next stage. So I think that's probably where I differ the most because I really take a teacher approach and have a curriculum based system. Okay, cool. Like that. So you you've been in coaching for for a long time and working especially with keepers. What would you say is the one or two things that a good goalkeeping session must must have? A good goalkeeping session must have fun 100%. If it is just a session of drills and coaches hammering them with like, get up, get up, get up, but they don't have that fun with it. It becomes a chore. So energy fun from the coach has to happen. And joining from the keepers has to happen. And I always say this to every single person. I don't know if you hear the kids in my school are getting ready for their lunch. The I always asked three questions after every single session, especially with my clinics, clinics are much more rushed than my camps, which is a full day. And I asked them three questions, I said, did you get a good workout? And they almost everyone's like, Yes, because I we put them through a lot of footwork based activities before we get them into the hard training. Then I asked, did you either learn something new today? Or did you get better at something you already had? And 90% of the time I get, I get, I got better. Or I get the new students like, I've never heard that before. I've heard it differently or something. And then the last question I asked is, did you have fun? And that is my goal. I have to have that for me. And that's why because at the end of the day, we are choosing a position that's high pressure, that usually gets blamed for the loss. That at the end of the day is standing in front of a ball that's being kicked as hard as possible, that may hurt us. And we're choosing to do that because we like it. The second you don't enjoy doing that anymore, you shouldn't be doing that. So I always stress, making sure that the kids have fun. Another thing that I think every single class, every single class, I say class because I'm a teacher, every single program or training session that we do. Should have a plan. What is the goal of today? If you are just going to go out there and wing it, you're going to actually lose the goalkeeper that doesn't want just fun. So having fun is important. Even for the pro keeper or the semi pro keeper, the college teacher, they need to have fun because they want to enjoy it too. But you're going to lose that mentality person if you don't have a structured plan. And they'll stick around for a couple, but they're going to lose you in the long run. They're going to go somewhere else. That's going to give them what they're looking for. And then the last thing is you have to meet them at where they're at, and then show them what the challenge of the next level is. For instance, I coach a club where we have they give me all their keepers at once. And I have premier level goalkeepers with goalkeepers that can catch. How am I supposed to present a plan that's going to push that pro that a premier level goalkeeper with a girl that is just starting as a goalkeeper because she is younger and she wants to experiment. How do I do that? I have to have a plan that's going to be able to hit both of their skill sets, but also show that I can challenge the little one that's learning, but also make the premier goalkeeper not feel like she's wasting her time. So that's that's where I feel are the probably the most important aspects of the goalkeeper training session. If you have that, you're really putting together a really good program. Awesome. Love that. Love that. So now that now that you touched upon it, something I know our coaches, especially in our program they sometimes struggle with is when they have clients that are at different levels. So how do you, you know, how do you deal with that situation where you've got one goalkeeper that has that mentality wants to get ahead and then you've got the other goalkeeper that might just be there for fun or it might just be sort of a development. Do you put them together or are they separate? How does that work in your business? My programs, they're not together for my when it's my program. I'm putting you in a program that's going to work with like-minded skill sets for the goal of growing. It doesn't help a when you're because the truth is, is a lot of people don't understand that when you're doing a program where you're developing an individual, you're still working with the group. So and the group is building off of each other, they're feeding off each other. So if you think that well, the little one is or the younger one or maybe just the less experienced one is having a situation where they're by themselves, even though they're together, so I can just do a different thing with them. The older one knows it, the older one sees it, the more skilled and experienced when they see it and they're not as prepared for their next shot. That's not fair to that person. So what I do with my camps, we'll base it off that is we break it off right off the get go with two age groups. We have a summer goalkeeping, future pro, I floored with a couple of different names, younger group, and that group is 14 and younger. Then I have an older group because at the end of the day, camps are more geared towards a little bit more committed goalkeepers. So 14 and under, and then I have the 15 and up and I call that my elite development academy. And the big difference between the two is that the elite development academy at 15 and up, they work together, they're one group. The younger group, I split the 14 and 13 and the advanced 12 year olds from the from the less skilled. And the reason why I do that is because we're going to have nine year olds, 10 year olds that are that are there to either train or maybe because the parents just want them to do stuff. And they say like, you know what, there's a goalkeeper camp, my kid likes soccer, he's nine, 10 years old, he should try it. And I'm like, that's fine. We'll make him a goalkeeper. I'm happy with that. But that nine, 10, 11 year old isn't going to be able to work heavily with the 12 year old that's been playing from the soccer for three years already. So and also, the the ball size is different. So the U 12, U 13, U 14, they're playing with the full size official five size five soccer ball, where the third, where the 11 year old and younger is playing with the size five, besides, sorry, size four. So because they're using a different ball, and they are of different size, different strength, things like that, I want to break them apart. And then what we do on the very first day is we evaluate every single one of them. And if there's a 15 year old that's in that older group, that isn't ready, we tell the parents, Taylor, we strongly recommend that he goes to a to the lower level. We have no problem reimbursing you the difference. Or if you want to use that for a future future clinic, future program, future camp, you're welcome to. If there's a 14 year old that is just out of this world, or just has maybe a little bit stronger physical development, we bring them up. And then we tell the parents, Hey, listen, we think that this, this is really going to put a better opportunity and better experience for your son and your daughter. So we do have to separate it. Now, the problem with a club training program. So for instance, if you were to train a team, even if this is not so train a team, there's going to be skill levels all over the place. Yeah, the key is knowing sometimes you want to have a balanced group. But sometimes you want to put those stronger kids together, even if it's a small drill. So one thing that we really focus heavily on my program is folk work. I believe that a goalkeeper in the right place at the right time is going to have a much better chance to make a save than a goalkeeper that's unbelievably athletic in the wrong position. So we stress, stress, stress forward. If I were to put a skilled goalkeeper with someone who doesn't have the skill and put him through a footwork activity that was higher energy and higher repetition, you're going to see the more skilled goalkeeper, the more advanced goalkeeper feel like he's taking a step back, not taking a step forward. So it's about learning about how to balance it together. Now, the other is very important that I like to do is I like to play games with my goalkeepers. At that time, bring them back, bring the less skilled and the more skilled together because you do want the younger, less skilled or less experienced player to see what that next level is. And if you don't get exposed to it, you're never going to know. So that's how I approach it with my business. I guess if I was to summarize it, it clubs, it's difficult like a, like a working with a team, it's difficult because you are working with everyone together. What I do is I separate the two. I try to create two, two or three groups. I try to give them two areas. But at the end of the day, we are all working together with my camps, with my clinics. We separate the age and then we subdivide the ages within. And we make sure that there's at least one or two coaches working with those specific groups while I am more bouncing around and maybe putting forth more effort with either the kid that's never caught a ball before, or I see that, hey, you know what, that coach with that elite group, we need a, I need to, I need to raise my coaches attitude. So I'm going to step in and make that coach see what that, hey, no, we're going to go harder. They can handle it. So that's how I, so I do believe that there's, there's quality for them to come together. But that's more the time for the games, more the time for the intercompetition. Not at the point of the training. When you're, when we're here to train, we are here to work. We do want to make it fun. We'll throw out the jokes, but we got to make sure that we are focused when we're doing it with the right caliber player. So that's a great, great response. Perfect. So, so let me take you back, Jack, to where, when you first started your business, what was, what has been your biggest obstacle since you started to coach, your coaching business? I didn't, I didn't understand how to, as a business owner, pre-business owner, I should say, know how to negotiate what I should get paid for my service. I kind of said I want a coach, so I'll take whatever. Yeah. And that, that did cripple me when I decided I wanted to renegotiate that. I think I mentioned with the facility. That was, that was, the truth was, is I think the owner knew renegotiating meant him losing profit. And, and as a business owner, I, I see that as someone who now owns my own business, I do see that. But at the same time though, there's a way to properly communicate to staff that wants to grow. But my biggest issue as a, as a pre- business owner was I didn't know what my worth was. I accepted what someone told me my worth was. Does that make sense? Yeah, 100%. 100%. And it's interesting you say that because I, I sometimes think to myself, right, goalkeepers are more specialist position. So maybe there's more opportunity in that. You know what it is? It's, we are the afterthought, even still today. Like people are, I think the thing is that the idea is changing mostly because parents are actually getting more educated, which is a positive and negative. That, that's, that's a conversation for another day. But no, like the truth is, like what I was first saying was like, well, I specialized myself. But I didn't have to say. And the reason why I said that first part before I talked about pre-business side of things was that yeah, there is always the goalkeepers, one to two goalkeepers on almost every single team. So there should be a high number, especially since I was one of the only goalkeeper coaches in the area. The problem is, is that a club is going to say, well, I'm already paying 10 coaches to coach my 10 teams. Why am I now going to pay for a goalkeeper coach to coach my 10 teams, goalkeepers? And so when I was starting out, goalkeeper coaches was not, not a, not an important factor, especially with travel programs and the like right after town teams, like right after the red, these kids are now playing games and we're just throwing kids in gold that either don't know how to run as well or can kick the ball further than the other kids or is a gymnast and they, they want to also play soccer. So they're kind of acrobatic. And so that's what I was kind of saying where you being a specialist in goalkeeping at a time when goalkeeping wasn't a priority. I kind of forced to do whatever the field player coach was doing. Yeah. I wasn't able to communicate with them on that. And then on the business side of things, not knowing what my worth was because you deal with the coaches that tell you, Hey, this is goal keeping is not as important. I just took whatever I, whatever I was given. And that, that, that's where it kind of falls. And that, that looking back at it, I think a lot of coaches, a lot of goalkeeper coaches probably had that problem. I would say everybody because a lot of the better lot, a lot of the goalkeeper coaches that are more established than me, like, for instance, I'm like, John, he had a great relationship with field player coaches and program directors that valued it. So when you value goalkeeping, you can build that specialization clientele quickly. I'm not, that's how John did it. I don't know John's story, but I just know that John has a great program that he does in New Jersey where he, and I know he has great relationships with St. Benedict's with Red Bulls because he's built that relationship with them. This was our few conversations. But like, for me, I mean, I came out of Hudson Valley, New York, I played SUNY Cortland. I, they, and they just started semi pro when I was like in my late 20s. So it's a bit too late for it. Awesome. Perfect. So, so, Jack, where, where do you see private training going in the US in the next two to five years then? Well, that's the one thing I will tell you. We are, our biggest problem in the country is, well, private, privatized training or supplemental training, it's, it's the direction of every sport. It's, it's like obviously they're, they're trying to find the best AAU basketball coach to get their kid to the best college to get their T or that the best high school program of the best college. So hopefully go to NBA. You're going, if you play Kiwi football, you're paying for your trainer to get your running back to work with a training facility to develop so you can get scholarships. It is definitely the direction that things have been going. I think that it's going to continue that way. I do see a higher push, especially in the soccer world for the premier program. And it's a pay-to-play model in the US. So being that it's a pay-to-play model in the US, that is both a positive and a negative. So on the positive side, yes, if you, if you are developing, you have that opportunity to play at a higher level. And you're usually paying money to get there, but not paying money to get on the team, but paying money to develop and grow with coaches. And obviously the more you're able to commit, the more able to go. The problem I have is always making sure the parents and the players know the last thing that any one I work with has is burnout. I don't want a single kid to be like, I'm going to college. I don't want to play anymore. Like it's, it's a commitment to work with private training. So we want to make sure that they enjoy it. That it's it. That's the, that's the only, that's the only focus that I think private training needs to happen. Make sure you're enjoying what you're doing, not doing it and hating it while you do it. Because I want the kid to succeed, even if he chooses not, or she chooses not to play soccer in the future, they're going to still value what you were able to work with them on as an, as a young adult. And that, that's the goal. I mean, and then end game for me is that they value what we, what we provided them. So I think that private training, it's, it's always going to be there. It's always going to be the direction. I think that it's always going to be positive. And I think that more and more trainers are becoming more educated. For instance, I know more about physical development than I ever did. So when a goalkeeper asks me, hey, what are some good workout programs for goalkeeping that I can do in the gym? I can give them some advice, but I always refer to them to work with a trainer in that field. But I, I'm even more knowledge than I was. I have more information now because I took the time to learn it. And I think they're doing that. So they're not just focusing on, alright, well, this is how you catch the ball. I'm going to just focus on that. No, they are like, you know, I, no, I see what's happening. And I want to work and also recommend this other personal trainer in that. So it's, it's, it's, it's an interesting, I don't know, I want to say it's interesting question because it puts a little bit of emphasis on the fact that we don't always work with teams and develop groups. We really work with the individual, but obviously small groups and camps and clinics and something like that. They're, they're a big part of the team development, learning how to correlate what they do with one on one to the team is important. So yeah, there's always going to be a value. I think it's going to grow even more in terms of privatized training programs 100% Cool. So what, what would you say to a coach that's watching this or even listening, who is thinking of starting a business but hasn't yet done it? I would ask what their goals are. If their goals are just to make money, then they should, then they're very well on their right to do it, but they're losing them, the actual value of it. If your goal is to go out there and develop and see the, the kids grow or even the college players grow, you're going to, you're going to value that more. It's not going to be just a job for you. And that's the reason why I really do believe Crill Keepers School has grown so much. Like I said, I'm in my fifth year and now instead of me working with 40 goalkeepers for the entire year, I'm working with closer to 100 goalkeepers. And a lot of them are goalkeepers that keep coming back to other programs. So and you see it, you see the goalkeepers that keep coming back from the winter to the spring, to the, to the summer. My coaches are just like, Oh, man, Parker, she's growing so much. He's doing this. So even my coaches who are younger, they see that value and how much the growth happens in our clients. So make the goal something that you are going to say, I want to do this every day. That that any coach who wants to start a business, that should that should be your focus. From there, you have to think about how are you going to do it. So if you're just going to go about and do what someone told you to do, all you're doing is replicating someone else's information. And you're not making it yours. You're not going to be passionate about what you are bringing to the table. You're just going to be another coach who's regurgitating information. And you might be good at stimulating them and getting them to do it. But if they don't, if you don't know why you're doing it, how are they going to know why? Definitely, definitely value the growth of your clients over just making money. Definitely ask yourself, how are you going to do this? Why are you going to do it? And then and then and then go out and don't don't don't hold back. Like if I if I was subtle with it, I wouldn't have been able to enjoy it. Yeah. But the there's a caveat to that. And don't go into it thinking that you're the best. But there's other people that you're learning from. And there's always going to be someone you're learning from. And that's going to make you better. No one's going to you because you're the best. They're going to you because you're providing something for the kid that gets them excited about getting out of bed. That's the key. That's the key. So those you're going to you're going to be you're going to be successful 100%. Love that. Love that. So so talk us through what is your your current sales process with your business then? So I would say about about four years ago when I really because I started Krill Keeper School five years ago. And I had this desire to say, you know, and I want to want to take this to another level. I can see this being something that does also contributes to my family. I'm married. I have mortgage. So my time I do want it to be valued. But I also want to be able to provide because I have twin babies at home and I want to be able to take care of them as well. So and also my wife is very type A and she's like, Jack, I don't know how you live. You have a thing full of cash. What are you doing? And I'll say you're on the money. You're right. I got you. So I talked to a few people that that have either started their own businesses or work in things. And I actually one of my goalkeepers parents teaches about web design. And he had a project during he's a professor at Marist College. And one of his projects, someone was deciding to build a website that was built around sports. And he came across a program in his studies called DemoSphere. And DemoSphere is like a lot of different other companies where they provide you a website, but they also provide you a backing. And this is where things really changed for me. Being able to not just, oh, I have a like I have a square. No, like I have an actual back, back database through DemoSphere, where every credit credit card transaction, online or in person goes through it, gets categorized, gets placed. I have everyone's contact info now, not on a piece of paper on a sale spreadsheet. And it all gets logged on the website as they register for every single program. Whether they pay on credit card or cash or check is different, but I they can't even register without putting their information into my database. So now I've built a now I've built a an email like log for every single contact. I just sent out my summer camp information. And obviously I go through it to make sure I'm not emailing college kids or people that have graduated through my program. So I just sent out an email to 86 people last night by just selecting my previous programs, copying, pasting the Excel spreadsheet, plugging it in, emailing it out. And I have an email blast. And before I even start advertising to the outside, 86 of the goalkeepers I already work with have access to my program. The website is a little limited. I know that some of the other programs are really good at being diverse, adding video content, things like that, such as Wix. I fiddle with that prior to DemoSphere, but using DemoSphere is really paid off. They do take a small percentage cut from credit card transactions as part of the the service that they provide me. But in the team, my company went from a system where I did not have knowledge of exactly what my profits are to being able to say, this is how much I spent with my credit card and how much I have made through my camps, clinics and things for an entire like, and I can get it and I can log and look at the differences between one summer camp to another summer camp. I can look at, well, this week has performed better in this week over the last two years, three years. I can look at my locations to say, is this worth it? And it and it really makes a big difference for me in terms of all of my expenses in the grand scheme. So having that over the course of five years now, now I know exactly what is coming in, what is going out. And I can better pay my coaches because of where before it was like, all right, well, we got 40 kids this time, so I can give you this much. We only have 15. So listen, even though you did the exact same thing, I'm going to do that. No, I know exactly what I'm going to have for an entire summer. I can say before the first day of the first program, you are guaranteed this regardless of how many kids are in the third camp. And the and that my coaches appreciate that even more. And that's that's one thing that I would say my program would not be successful. If a, I'm not hiring people that I trained, but B, that they don't want to keep coming back. They make my summer camps highly successful because they know what we're teaching. I can talk to them quickly about it. If they're messing all them out on it real quick, and then they take, they take the program seriously while also knowing, listen, we get to come here, kick soccer balls and have fun with kids while teaching them. So they enjoy it too. So yeah, but that getting, finding hemisphere, getting business relationship with them has been monumental to my program. Yeah. Now, that software you use, was there was there an investment you had to make for that? It was a very small investment prior to it was $500 for just the for exclusively for just the website design. Okay. Then they give me tools, they trainings on how to edit the website afterwards. Like I said, they're a little limited in terms of what they can do. But their focus isn't on that they're focused. They hire. So I don't know if they hire outside or they have a hired personnel that does the websites. If there's anything something that I can't do, I contact them, they, we set up a meeting time and we change but the majority of things there's a and the other thing too is there's also a normal business hour time slot where I can reach out and there's always someone that I can reach out to during that time period. Hey, I'm having trouble with this part of my computer, but this part of the program. Yeah. And then we'll be like, Oh, you need it. I see what's happening in the login. They'll see exactly what I'm doing. And it'll be like, this is what we need to change or this is why it's not working for you. So the small the investment was $500 upfront. And then from that point that it became like there's no more investment in the website at all. It's exclusively they give me unlimited aid while I'm with it. The only thing that they take is they take a small percentage of every credit card transaction. So for the parent, so what I with and they they're open and honest, they say this is how you can go around our credit card transaction. If your campus $400, $400 add that percentage to the credit card fee and that percentage could take it out and you still make $400. Yeah. We explained to the parents, hey, when you pay credit card fee, this is when you pay the credit card, that's what it is. If you're going to pay with cash or check, understand that we're going to be counting you for the two weeks prior to the program. But yeah. And to be fair, the majority of parents are OK with paying the credit card fee. But some some would prefer to say, hey, listen, I have two girls that are going to come to all three of your programs. So I'm going to give us right you're checking. So OK, that's fine. So so a lot of the coaches when when they start working with us, they they they use that cash in hand system. So tell us how how important was it to make an investment because I'm guessing all your clients when they enroll with you, they have to go through the online system, right? Yeah, that's a hundred percent. So how important is it to to invest in a software like that? Because a lot of coaches don't want to don't want to do that because of a fear that they have. Yeah, I'll be honest with you. I had the fear as well. It's an irrational fear. It really is. It's one of those that once you do it, then you're like, why didn't I do it sooner? And but it's also like, well, I have to I have to commit this time and the fact is that you're going to be giving up more time and getting more headaches by doing a cash based system because you're you're going to if you're going to do cash check, you're going to be handing out flyers asking that of flyers or or like mailing out things and you're going to have them fill it out, write it, check, mail it to you. And then what you're going to have to do is you're going to have to log everything in on your own to develop your email databases that you want, where the systems that are in place because of modern technology really speeds up. It expedites your time. And in my opinion, time is money when it comes to that. Being able to guarantee that you're going to get 20 people before the 20th with either a special discount, early bird prices, things like that that you can do now where you couldn't do when it's cash based because when it's cash based, you're like, oh, and then you're just nobody signs up and then you're just like, all right, well, well, we're going to if you come, I'll make a half price for you. Now you're cutting your costs even more and you're even hurting you, you're cutting your own legs out. Why don't you just to get numbers up and when you're doing it, though, it's like I said, it's too many small headaches that build into one stressful working environment for yourself. It would be like owning a bar and saying, I'm not going to take credit cards. Yeah. Why would you do that? Yeah. Obviously your bartender is going to be happy but you will not be. So like it just you're better off developing like like taking that step and building that relationship. But truth is, you do have to do your research. You do got to you have to look around. You have to say what is the best thing for me. If you're just a personal trainer that's going to float around and do things it you can get away with a smaller system. But if you if you want to work with large numbers, you you're going to you're going to limit yourself by being paper and cash and because you're never you're never going to reach that higher numbers. Like specifically speaking, my last winter clinic in January, we did every single Friday for an hour and a half for all of January one week of February. We had one snow cancellation so we moved into an additional February week. But rented out a bubble to this because of my my not having to log everything on my own. My numbers grew from 25 to 42 goalkeepers from the previous winter. Now I have 42 goalkeepers and that's it was about 15 I've never seen before. So it's 15 goalkeepers I've never worked before that I now have their information without having to be like, all right, well, let me let me pull this together and let me look this up and let me find out where they're from and log it into my computer. No, I have it. It's ready to go. I don't have to stress about that. So it might it's just it's a headache you don't need when you are thinking about the greater, like the larger numbers, the greater programs. So perfect. All right. So so last question for you, Jack. And where do you see your business in the next five years? You know, it's funny five years ago, my wife asked me that. And I've been I've been debating I've been having this conversation with myself specifically about that. And I was the the short answer is getting back to what it was right before the pandemic and the direction that it was right before the pandemic was residential camps. It's a it's a big, big market that isn't being tapped into, especially in my area, pandemic that hit this bet in New York. I hit pretty hard. Before that, I had my first time a residential goalkeeper camp at a local college that I was working at. The I had a challenge and the challenge was that they only had two goals and that doesn't work with a goalkeeper camp. You do need multiple goals. So I actually had to go get and bring goals in a U-Haul. Like I rented out a truck and brought over like seven by twenty ones, because that's all that could fit in there. And I brought them to there and I rented them out for a week from another facility and brought them back. And the camp was highly successful. We had 38 in our first week ever doing it. And the plan was to then make two weeks of residential camp where I was going to do one there and then went out another college. But with the pandemic shutting us down, that was the it's kind of made it so colleges are a little bit more tight to letting that happen for an outside rental. So within five years, I think my plan I I know what I want and that is to have two to three residential goalkeeper camps that also are local enough that can still host the day camp kids. The young the young goalkeepers that aren't ready for it or the locals that can just go there. Because the reason is like I have goalkeepers that try from Pennsylvania for my camps and I have goalkeepers that drive from the from New York City that come to my camps and to make life easier. I've actually heard that they rent out a house during my week. And so it's not a long commute every single day. Yeah, I hear them. I feel them. And I know that there would be a greater tap for the youth development but also the advanced development of goalkeepers. If we were able to provide two to three residential goalkeeper camps in the Hudson Valley. So yeah, so that that would be my that's my goal. The next five years that we are converting at least our summer program to that. Also, that's awesome. And well, good, good luck with that. I'll definitely be following your your your journey with that. So I think things Jack for for coming on. Things for sharing your your expertise, your advice, your story with with our viewers. And now if anyone watching or listening wants to follow your your business or even once they get in contact with you, what's the best way to do that? The best way to get content with me is email, which is Carillo Keeper School at gmail.com. You tags for my Instagram page and Facebook are exactly the same Carillo Keeper School. And the you can also go to my website, which is www.carillokeeperschool.com. So awesome. What we'll do is we'll put that below the video so anyone watching can can can follow you there. All right, Jack. Well, it's been a pleasure. And again, good luck with everything. And I hope you reach your goal and I hope to see loads of residential camps in the next five years. I hope so too. Thank you very much. And I'm sorry for. I know I can. You these type of questions I can go for hours on. So I I I I appreciate you not not being like, hey, listen, got to pull back a little bit. I do appreciate it. OK, perfect. All right. Take care, Jack. All right, you too. Thanks.