 What's going on guys? We are back with a very, very, very special episode of the After Hours podcast. I have probably gotten 3,000 DMs requesting Austin join us, so we are very excited to have him on, so Austin, thanks for coming on. For sure, I can't believe you were even talking to me. I know, I feel like we hear enough of you, Jesus. But no, we're very excited to have you. And we traditionally, we kind of always start this off the same, but how did you, you know, come to start trading, and how did you find MIC from that? So, I mean, I mean, I started when I was in college, and like, you know, the typical, like, in high school, I wanted to get into trading because of, you know, this, I don't even know what the F it was called. I think it was called Teen Biz or some BS. I don't know if anyone else did that in their high school, but anyway, there was this competition, and, and I didn't get into it as much as I wanted to. But one of my classmates said he got really into it, and like, and I was really kind of jealous because I was like, man, that's kind of, I wish I would have done that and it's over now. And then so, you know, I went to college and I was like, you know, I do want to take finance, I knew I wanted to go to school for finance. And then when you go to school for finance, you get to pick whether you want like, in Hawaii, you get to choose if you want Asian finance, corporate finance, you know, like financial planning or equity research. And so I was like, well, I want to do stock market equity research. And that's really how I got into it. And then like, you know, you get into class and you see a whole bunch of people with thinkers. I saw a couple people with thinkorswim charts. And that's it. I was hooked. I was like, what program is that? I downloaded it. Ichimoku cloud. And you went through the whole I didn't even, I didn't even know you grew up in Hawaii. For some reason, I always thought you moved there from somewhere else. Oh, no. No, I'm, I'm a Hawaii boy just like that's where I, I mean, this is home. I can't live anywhere else. I'll tell you what, if I was a, if I was a trader, I would not move here. We're not here. The tax is the same. But no, I can't. Yes. See, what amazed me about you is like, is you're so, you have to be so dedicated into trading because your time schedule is fucked. Like I could never do what you do. Like, no way. You know, you, you can, no, no, no, you can, because trading just becomes so like, it's just, it's not a question of, oh, am I going to wake up to trade today? I got to wake up to trade today. It's like, I got to wake up and see the market. Like, it becomes such an addiction. Like you guys know, like, it doesn't matter where you live. Like if you want to trade, like you're going to be like, and that's, I don't know, that's how it is. It's just, it's just, it's just a way of life. It's just like, well, I have to eat today. Yeah, yeah, thanks. I think like, trading really. Oh, sorry. I think like, as far as when you kind of were getting started and those kind of like early growing phases. Like, was there any like education out there? Because I mean, this is long before I might see you. This is long before everything else. So like, were you in like an early kind of like education thing early on? Oh yeah, I was in Sykes' room. Sykes was the first person I found. Yeah. And so you kind of get into that. Like everyone else. How did, how did that kind of work out? And just like, I guess like, how'd you end up kind of getting to where you are now? You know, progression? So the interesting thing is I was actually like, I was in Sykes' room and, you know, like he had the three different payment plans. I only chose the monthly one just because I was like, you know, and everything in there is like, don't follow my alerts. Don't follow my alerts. And, and I actually did it. Like I did it. And I was like, no, I'm not going to follow. And then I really started to learn like, oh, every time, like there was an alert, it would tank. And so like, that's kind of how I was in there. But the interesting part was, like the, my classmate from high school, who I know his initials. And I saw, I saw his name, his username in that room. And that's, and that was just like, oh, he's in here too? That, and I didn't like him actually. But I saw him in there. I was like, dude, this is the place to be. And so that's how I really got started. And, and really like, I remember even Grittani was there too. And there was one thing that Grittani said that really struck, struck to me. And I actually emulated this, I copied him on this. He said that when he started trading, he, for three months, he didn't do anything. But about what market to close didn't, didn't trade a thing, right? Market to close for three months, didn't touch the keyboard, didn't, you know, he had an account. And that's, and I actually kind of, I did that for three months, I didn't do anything. And then for the next three months, I only placed 200 chair trades, which, and that was my first six months. That's how I started. And so like, with those like, with those 200, I think me and James were just going to ask the same question you're about to go ahead. Yeah, yeah, go ahead. Chair trades. Was it more like long the breakout? Was it like more OTC style trades? Was it kind of, do you remember what you were kind of doing? Yeah, I actually started off as a shorter. I started off as a shorter, which I think like you, Harry, I started off as a shorter and and it's because I grew up in the era of like, oh, short, short, short pump and dumps, and it made sense to me. And that coupled with the fact that I had just watched alerts get destroyed. And Sykes wasn't the only one. I saw a couple other, you know, I started getting alive on Twitter. I saw other pumps and stuff. And you guys got to remember for those watching this, it was a different time. We're seeing stocks with 50 million shares of volume. At the time, a 10 million share all day, that was high volume. Here was this, Austin? How long ago was this? 2015? 2015. Wow. Dude, 10 million shares was, that was, that was a good day. That was a good day. That was high volume. That was high volume from open to close. 40 million was like really high. You only saw that once in a blue moon. And so it was a lot more, it was a lot simpler. Like it felt like price action at that time, shorting was a lot clearer in the sense to where once you saw like a high of day break, you saw an exhaustion counter to say, okay, that's where longs just bought, got trapped, you're short. And he would all day fade from there. And it was just an amazing time to be a short seller. And then it got, and then, of course, like, like kind of everything, you know, right as you, right as things get exploited, it gets harder. And, you know, we've seen that over and over and over again. And I didn't know at the time. And like, I had this amazing run. And then, I mean, I gave it all back. I gave it all back. Like I gave my first year, I was actually, you were, you were profitable. Profitable right away. Were you profitable with those two entries? Oh, that's cool. Yeah. Well, yeah, first six months, I was profitable after my first year. And then the second year, I gave it all back. Yeah, all back. Yeah. And so I guess that kind of mental battle of like, give me it all back. Like, did you ever think about quitting or you were just like, no, I'm going to, I'm going to make this work. I'm going to keep trying. I'm going to like do what I can. I'm going to, you know, that type of mindset. At that point, I was not ready to quit. I was like, no way. Like, because I tasted it. And like, I got addicted to like what it felt like to win. And I was like, I know it could be possible. And once I knew that it could be possible, I wasn't really to give up just like, I didn't have any thoughts of quitting yet until I got, got after, after that year of losing that I did, after a year of losing, I came back, like around 2017 and 2017 was like the roughest year for me, but also the best year. It was kind of like where I hit my bottom. 2017, I can't like late 2017 is where like, I hit that desperation where I was just like, dude, like, I mean, like, I'm tasting it like, but I'm in the depths and like, I've given it all back. And like, it's already been two or three years. Should I, should I just like, what's wrong? Should I just give up? And that's when I started to feel, but you know, deep inside, I knew I wouldn't give up. Because of course, you know, like in the back of my mind, I was like, well, it took Nico seven years, right? It took Nico seven years. And I'm sticking with it. So like in the back of, you know, surface level, you have those, oh, fuck, I want to give up. Like this sucks, I hate waking up to lose. And then you get like, you get in this losing streak, and you're just, and, and, and, and it's hard to just like, take that off your shoulder. Like it's just, it's hard to keep, especially at one in the morning. It's hard to just do it. But like at no point ever did I ever think about not waking up. Like I was always, I was always going to wake up. That's amazing. Because again, like waking up that early, like we all know the drive and like the addiction feeling, but waking up that early and like taking a mental beating like clearly made you the trader you are now. And like, while you were doing that, was it you making the mistakes? Like were you doing the things that we kind of teach against now? Or was it just lack of understanding of setups at that point? Well, it was both. It was both. Like one, I was an emotional wreck at the time, just because, because I knew it could be possible. And I knew, and I knew that something was getting in my way, and I didn't know that I was getting in my way. I didn't know that it was my stubbornness, that it was my despair. It was my negativity that was keeping me from like, like the worst part is when, you know, you're in a red streak. The worst part is when, and you know that you can be a green trader, but you're not doing it for some reason, the worst part is missing a trade. For me, that's the worst thing ever is when you miss a trade. We miss a trade. And, and you know, you needed that trade. And then you take your next trade and it's and it's a red trade. This is the cycle that I fell in. And that is why, like in all of my webinars that I try so hard, I'm just like, guys, let shit go. Right. And that that's ultimately the secret that I learned is just to let shit go. Like you miss a trade, it doesn't matter. Pretend that didn't happen tomorrow is a new day. You know, the next trade is new. Everything from everything from one second ago is new. And that's, and that's like, that's where I found my, my rhythm. That's when things just started to, because I didn't care if I lost yesterday, as long as I, like, like we preach, as long as I kept my risk under control, nothing that happened yesterday mattered yesterday before. And so that that's why I sound like a broken record when I say that all the time in chat and just like next. As far as the, as far as like, so you're, you know, you're in kind of like 2017, and you hit kind of that rock bottom. And you're, I, I know what that feels like of that kind of like desperation of just, and you're almost saying to yourself, something has to change. Like you, like something needs to change, like you need to change your behavior from what you were doing before. And you almost need to form a mold of like a new person. And how did you kind of go about that kind of change? How'd you kind of like make yourself into the person you are now? Was it that you were just finally just selling into resistance or was it that you were just shorting into resistance or that you weren't chasing anymore? Like what kind of steps did you take to build yourself into kind of the trader you are now, you know? Yeah. So that's when I really embraced the one key rule that I, that I said my very first day in MIC, which I realized I didn't get the game question about how I found MIC. But we'll get to that. We'll get into that. Okay. Yeah, we're still in 2017. But yeah, so that's when I really figured out that golden secret, dude, because at the time I was still all shorting. I like, I had never placed a long trade up until then. And so that's when I found out that like, I need to nail and bail because, like, because that's when I, that's what I had struggled with all of 20, because like 2015 was good for me. Even beginning of 2016 was good. And then it started to go down downhill from there. And then 2017 was, you know, mid 2016 to mid 2017 was just the roughest time ever. Then late 2017 for me is when I realized I need to just start nailing and fucking bailing because I can win, but all of my shorts were front side shorts. And I didn't have any, I wasn't good at adding to winners back then. So all of my trades were always on the front side of the move. And I just like, it's not that I wouldn't win. It's just that I would always give it back. And, you know, that's when like things were starting to just kind of go up with more vigor. That's when more volume started to come into the market. And I just knew that I had to front side short, front side cover and get the f out and leave on the day. And that, that's when I really found the rhythm to just short cover, see, I don't care if it was 15 minutes, I was done on the day walking away. If I was green $300, that was perfect. That was awesome at the time. That was a great day for me. And I was leaving guy. I was leaving, even if I lost $500 the next day, because then I would just do it in my mind. Well, that means I'm down 200 for both days. I lost 100 each day. That means all my next trade. I'm green. And that's just like, all I had to do because that's what really killed me was that, you know, the losses were always bigger than my winners on the shorts. And I, and I couldn't fight that. I couldn't fight that, that battle of win, win, win, give it all back on one, win, win, win, give it all back on the fourth. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah. And that's when I really learned like, dude, front side short, front side cover, in my opinion, the only way to short, unless you're going to be a swing short, if you're going to be, unless you're going to be a swing shorter, you're a front side short, front side covered dude. And you have to be. Yeah. Or that, that's all I could find success with. That's incredible. Like mentality for a new, even, even two years in or so, like that's a pretty good mentality to have. Like there's, whenever I see struggling members of, of MIC, like these are the things, and I hope everyone listens to this, that it is so key that you just, at, at this point in your career, you were fed up and you just, you were taking what the market gave you, you weren't going for home runs. And you like, as of right now, like your trader path is like very like almost exactly what it should be. And then, so at this point, you're finding consistency and you're actually like letting gains add up and kept a risk in check. What kind of pushed you to the next step of like, okay, it's time to maybe add a little bit of size. You know, maybe, maybe push the, push the wall a little bit. Right. And so right at around then is where I started to, that's exactly what I wanted. I was starting to see that consistency and I wasn't falling into, not only was I not falling into the financial pitfalls, but I wasn't falling into the mental pitfalls either. And so I was ready to grow. And the thing is, is that at the time, now I didn't even really have a, like I was just starting to learn about the whole, like my framework of buy, sell, dead market kind of thing that, that I, that I drive off of. I was just kind of getting into that, but like that really wasn't part of, that's a big part of what I do now, not at, not at the time. But what I really started to learn was the volume was starting to increase and I wanted to, I wanted to make more money. And I knew like just from, from like two years of trouble that I just could not increase the size. I did not want to increase the size because I knew that I just knew that if I increased the size, I was, that my consistency would go yeah, I just knew it. And so I, like at the time, everything started to squeeze at around, you know, this 2017, 18 mark. And I was like, you know, there's big money to be made on the long side. Like that's when it really clicked. Like if I want to make bigger money, I need to be on the long side. Yeah. And 20, like that 2018 year, like right at around not early, like early to mid 2018 is when I said, fuck it, six months, I'm going to do exactly what I did when I started trading, except for the long side, you know, like, because the market is, I noticed that the market was conducive for it. And I'm going to try longing. And so for six months, I went back down to a couple hundred chairs. I was ultra patient. I mean, even though I was starting to see some consistency and like my pitfalls were gone, I was feeling good. I went all the way back down and started longing. And that's what I did for like, for like six months, I didn't place anything but a long trade. And so when you were kind of placed that I went down almost like almost very similar journey to a T where I was consistent shorting, but I wanted to start catching some of these moves on the long side. And I had money saved as well. So I was saying to myself, okay, I'm willing to risk what I'm making now shorting in order for like a better gain longing. And so I mean, that's just what I did. And we have like so, so, so fucking similar journeys on this one. Because you know, you and your back pocket, and that's the confidence that traders need to have, like they need to know, like that's why we focus, that's why we say, get good at one thing. The reason why that's so important is because if you ever want to grow, you need to be able to say, well, if I need to, I can make money on this one thing. Yeah, like, like for me, like right now, like there was some good, like, I saw James, you had a great trade today on TLC, which is a simple view option. That was a great show. And like part of me right now is what in this market, of course, like, this market is like, why aren't you shorting? Why aren't you shorting? You don't. Like, part of me is saying like, dude, like, why didn't I just take that trade? Like, I mean, I saw like in the back of the day, that would have been like a bread and butter base it. Like, why am I not taking that trade? But here's the thing, I know in the back of my mind, if I ever, like, if I ever like need to make money, the view option. Yeah, that's what I'm saying exactly. Same, same, same mentality. You need that in the back pocket so that you can feel confident to try something else and give it a wholehearted approach. You cannot ever grow until you have that one thing that you just know is rock solid in the back of it. Yeah. You need that as a freighter. That's ability. I like that. And, you know, we get a lot of questions like, how do you know, because I think I've seen you shorten, I think you're a very, very talented short seller. And it's like, what gave you that? Like, did you have a feeling in your stomach that was like, Oh, longing just feels better. It feels I like it more. I'm more comfortable. Or was it just that you noticed you were better at it or whatever? I think it was just a reward for all of us. You know, honestly, I didn't really start coming into longing until after I kind of got here to M.I.C. Right before, like, I remember, and so we can get into this now. Like, so, like Alex actually confronted me, or not how it's bowed it, bow is the one who actually DM'd me and said, Hey, like, we're starting this chat room. Do you want to be a part of it? Because he had seen, like, we had, I mean, I had met in that one time too. Right? Yeah, I got to tell that story for sure. Yeah, I'll tell that one. But yeah, Bow and I had met in Maui one time, just to make a long story short, because we've already talked about this, but bow came to Maui one time. And this is when I, you know, like, I was like, I feel like I'm the only trader on Maui where I have just because not anymore. Now everyone's a trader. But at the time, you know, like, Bow had came to Maui and I followed him on Twitter, of course, and on Snapchat. And he tweeted saying that he was coming to Maui or something. I was like, dude, I mean, it's a small island. Like, I'm going to be able to stalk him if I want to. Like, Snapchat, I'm going to be like, I know where he is. Like, I'm just going to happen. It's going to happen to go to that grocery store at this time. And just happened to bump into him. I know he's going to be at the seafood market. So, but anyway, I actually did. Like, he came to Maui and I saw that he was staying, I believe, at the Four Seasons and out. And so I put my canoe on my truck and I was like, I'm going to go paddle before Seasons Beach because I mean, it could probably be at the beach. He wasn't there. And I just had a good paddle. And then I saw that he was at a shave ice place. And I was like, I know where that place is. That's right by my new club. So I'm just going to go take a drive down to my canoe club. I had just missed him. And I was like, maybe it's not meant to be. And so later on that night, like, I was actually just going to go to bed and I don't drink or anything. But my friends wanted to go drink and just party. I was like, well, it was a Friday night, I think. And Friday nights in Hawaii for anyone trading. For me, Friday night is where I stay up a little bit later to kind of get on a Hawaii schedule for the weekend. And then Sunday I go to bed early. So it's kind of like this Friday Sunday game that I play. But anyway, I stayed up later to just go out with the guys. And we went to the sushi restaurant. There's a sushi karaoke restaurant. And I was just having a good time. And then I saw Bow walk in. And that's history. Bow walked in. Awesome. I told my friends, like, dude, that's one of the best day traders in the world. I have to leave. I'm sorry. I walked over to his table and I'm like, modern rock. And, you know, he welcomed me down and and then and bought like the table. He had he had a girl and a friend and he bought the table like 10 shots of Hennessy. And we had a great couple of hours. I love that story. I love it. And I don't know about what did you ask him? Like, I mean, you have him there. Like, what type of shit are you saying to him? Are you like, you know, more as like a fan? Or are you like, how are you getting these trades? What are you seeing? Like, I tried not to do that. I tried. I tried to just have a good time. And I tried very hard not to bring up trading. Yeah, like, like, not like to be not be like a spaz fan boy or anything. Just wanted to have a good time. But thankfully, he kept bringing up trading. I was stoked on that he kept bringing up trading. So I was like sick. And that's when I mean, that's when he like, that's when he basically told me he's like, you got to be covered by 1030. That's the secret. Because these moves will just rip up on you. And at the time, I was starting to figure that out too. But that was like, ultimate validation for me. That was ultimate validation. And this was right around the time. Like, this was right at around the time that I had figured out that front side short front side cover kind of stuff. Because a lot of that came from bow because I would just like reverse analyze his charts. And he would always get the top tick. But like, I always knew that like, by the time that pull happened, I'm like, oh, he covered already. And it just matched. I'm like, that's why you can't chase the short because he's already covered. And so I love that. It was all just super validating for me at the time that the fact when he said that and yeah, and then that was basically that was the big thing. He just said, you know, be covered by 1030, call it a day. And that's when he actually his nugget that he gave to me then was like, at the time I was with centerpoint two, and they were getting super pricey. And that's when Cobra trading was starting to come to and he's like, you should try Cobra. And I was like, oh, perfect. I tried Cobra and they were great. And I've been with Cobra ever since. That's funny. Dude, that's what a story. I just every time I hear that, man, I love it because that's such a I'm a big believer in destiny and like fate and all that. And like, that is like key. That is the perfect story for it. I love to hear that. So at that point was he that was 2018 that I'm guessing, right? Yeah, that was like, I don't even remember. Yeah, I think 2018 something like that. So now how long after that did bow and Alex start? M.I.C. Do you remember a year? Oh, God. I started in 2019 when bow asked me to join, but I thought it was only six months before that. Yeah, probably something like that. It's funny. So now how did that? How did that happen? How did you end up with this group? Yeah, I mean, so bow just messes me saying, Hey, do you want to be a part of and then Alex Alex gave me a call a week later. And I said, sure. And at the time it was actually kind of hard because like I was I was still kind of coming into longing. So I was actually pretty nervous when I first started. And so like actually when I first started M.I.C. that was after I when I first started M.I.C. I was kind of this mix between a short and a long because that was like I was just like you were more of a longer than I was at that time, Harry. And I was like starting to long like that's when I had done my six months and I was ready to start longing. But at the same time, if I was going to be a moderate in this chat room, I had to do what I knew. Like, you know, like I had to kind of go back into shorting a little bit. But I went back into shorting and and I wanted to do some long stuff too. Like that like I had been on this long journey. So the timing wasn't really that great. Because like if I'm going to be a moderator, I kind of have to do, you know, preach what I know and like watch lists on stuff that I'm an experience with. And I wasn't the most experienced long at the time. Yeah, remember, we would have a lot of conversations about longing like we talked a lot. And I was jealous. And I was jealous. I was like, see this guy, why am I shorting this guy is fucking longing and banking. And that's what I want to be doing. But like, I'm kind of stuck. I'm going to stuck like in this short moderator position and like, how do I get out of this? Because I was just, I was like, I'm not shorting anymore. I would take some shorts back then, though, like if I saw really easy shorts, the thing is, is that back then if I missed the long trade, but I saw it kind of creeping up into those airlines positions, I'd be like, well, I can cure my phone with the short up here because I know it's probably not going to keep running. And that's how I would kind of cure my FOMO. Because I mean, back back then I was like, shit, like, I was just like FOMO king. I was like a FOMO Titan. Like I was like, man, I got to get this trade. I got to get it. Outer lines, outer lines. Or if we were kind of like, if it did come and I did get it, then you know, it'd be like down at the bottom of the range long for sure. But yeah, we did have a lot of like good kind of conversations and talks. I remember that. That was really fun. Harry, we weren't even mods then, right? Both of us weren't. I don't think I was using a mod for a while. I was like in MIC, but I wasn't a mod for a while. I didn't even really think about ever like becoming a mod or anything like that. I believe it was like that one day just messaging and after hours like, yep, Harry, you're a mod now. And then I was like, all right, dope. Like I just, I never had like asked or anything like that. Or it was just like, I was just purely waking up, focusing on trading every day. Like I would always talk to you guys. I would always be like great trades, like great, whatever. I never really thought of it like that because I was just purely just focusing on my trading really at that point, you know? It's funny. Like I think awesome. Like you don't give yourself enough credit for that time because I remember like seeing your charts and like, I'd be like, this dude's sick of shorting. And then I'd see a long, I'd be like, what the fuck? Like you can do both. I didn't know any like traders that could do both of the time really because I, Harry, I didn't even know that you were like shorting or like which one and I knew most of the long guy is like, how the hell does this guy do it? And I think everyone had had the mentality. It's just, you know, trading kind of fine. Like trading will find you. Like what, what you're good at will find you. And like, that's what I felt like long kind of did for me. Like I really, like the VWAP reclaim became like my bread and butter. That kind of became my iconic setup for a very long time in my career. In 2019, sorry, in 2019. And I mean, I mean, I just milked that in 2019 and that was a great year. But yeah, it's going back to your earlier question, James, like how like transitioning to longing or whatever, you know, that's really the secret is it's just going to find you. And like for me, longing, I'm innately, I'm innately a guy who I'm not, I'm not a risk seeking gentleman. I love like the idea of risk for reward for me is much more enticing than high probability. And that's the long side. The long side is all about, I mean, we all, we, I mean, you look at the biggest moves on charts, they're all green. The biggest moves you'll ever see on an intraday chart or I mean, on average, right, on an intraday chart on a daily chart, the biggest candle, the strongest candle is going to be a green one. You're going to see some nasty stuffs too, but nasty red candles and nasty death candles. But they're going to be, I mean, when you compare the worst death candle possible to the, to the, to the, the best life candle possible that life candles three times the size. Yeah. Yeah. You know, and to me, that just, that found me and like, I'm, I'm such innately, I'm going to take a cut, I'm going to take a cut, I'm going to take a cut. And, and that combined with that mentality of next, and I don't care, and I can leave this loss behind me, I can leave these two losses behind me and stay mentally sane to get that winner or to, to nail that one that I know is coming or kind of deal. Like that, that matches with me to take that cut and to stay sane. Like that, that fits with me. What I, what doesn't fit with me is the win, win, win and give it all back next week. That I can't do. Yeah. I also love that kind of mentality as well, because that really kind of fits in like kind of your approach to longing. Like, I guess for me, because like I say a lot, like my best trades work right away. And like, so if I buy at support at five bucks and automatically we're at 530, 540, like, that's a good trade for me. But if I buy support at five bucks and we're like 505, 503, 501, lingering around, that's a trade I'm just going to take off and say, okay. 495 done, 5% loss. 100%. I'm willing to take that little paper cut, that little loss, because I know that my winners are always going to be so much bigger than my losers and I'll know when I'm winning right away. Because like, I always say to myself, like, if someone wants to stock at 540, it'd be at 540 by now. And that's exactly what I'm saying to myself every single day, you know? Yeah. And that's, I mean, if there's any longs out here, shorts will know this as a bad experience where like they short a low and then boom, it rips on you every short in the world knows this, when they short and then can't, well imagine that as a long side, that's your validation. And that's why you'll see on a lot of my charts, I'll put an order right there at support. And if I'm right away, I'll add to that. I'll literally, like you'll see me have green candles all the way up a green candle. Because I'll just like, yep, adding, like as it's working right away, that proves to me that support is right there. And like, I know that my risk for reward in that spot is, is killer. And that, and that really, like that's my whole, that's my whole view on trading is it's all, for me, it's all risk for reward. And I'll take a cut. It's risk for reward and I'll take the cut. Yeah, I was, I was trading a stock the other day. And we had this like key 560 level. And we had kind of support at 550. And we kind of broke a bit over the 560 level. It was key kind of a breakout level. And we stuffed and we went to 550. And that was also key support level. And I said to myself, like, okay, like, if we don't really break, like 550 here, like, is this really a stuff move? I don't know, because like it's only 10 cents. It looks like a stuff move acts like a stuff move. But is it really a stuff move if we don't break this key support? And so we couldn't break it, couldn't break it, couldn't break it. So I just took some of 550. Because I was like, you know what, I might as well. And that is a great spot. I have great risk reward. This should have stuff. If this was a real stuff, it would have went way lower work would have worked right away for them. We would have known that it was dead. So I took some right there. Automatically, we ripped back up over the key level. And I was just selling into the strength. And I think that has been a key part of my trading is just stuff like that, little stuff, watching price like that, understanding those little key tidbits of how kind of the market works. That has helped me tenfold. And it's all it's all patients, right? You have to you have to wait for your opponent. And this and this is the secret for all trading, right? So you just have to have patience when there's no trades. I thought about this today. I woke up today and I'm just like, yeah, I'm more waking up just to see if anything happens rather than waking up to trade. And that's kind of been my approach, especially in this kind of a crappier market that we've had. I'm just waking up just to see what happens. So if there's a good opportunity, I may partake. And that's what I think a lot of new traders kind of have to find is that that they really don't have to trade. They need to trade only when they see something. And they don't have to see something every day. When you wake up, there's this expectation where you deserve, trading is not that job. Trading is not the job where you're going to get a paycheck every day. You're not entitled to a paycheck every day. I mean, if you want to be entitled to a paycheck every day, then you need to get a job, right? That's not trading. Trading is you have to be so patient. Like, if there's nothing today, there's nothing today. And you have to kind of have that. When I talk about that, I don't care mentality. I don't care if I trade today. I don't care if I miss this trade. There'll be another one. And it's that patience that really, that you need to have. Like in intraday, on the intraday level, and what if you don't, what if you're not profitable in two years? Are you willing to stay for four or six, right? Like, what's, how long are you willing to give it? It's all patience, right? Yeah, no, I really like that. And also today was the day where we both woke up. Like, I find a lot of times in chat, like, I'll say something, and then you'll say, I agree. Or you'll say something. And then I'll say, I agree, because like, we do have a very similar mindset and approach. I really believe to like trading and just kind of how we like, do things like that. And like, today was a day where I was like, there's nothing I like right now. There's nothing I see that's amazing right now. I mean, we had all stocks that were broken, all stocks that were under view. I mean, there were some opportunities where you could catch a support level, like a little bit on like a smaller kind of level. But it wasn't a day that was amazing. It wasn't a day where you had to go guns blazing. It wasn't a day to size up. And I mean, for me, it's just knowing those days that are under view app and bad and the days that I don't like, that can really like, I think that can really make a change in your, your just your profitability and consistency. Like, if you can consistently nail days where you should be sized up and consistently nail days where you can be sized down. I mean, you've really done a lot of the battle and you've really, you know, I think helped yourself out a lot. If you can just nail those kinds of types of days. Yeah. But the secret there is not to be so in the toilet in your brain from last week. If it didn't happen and you tried to force it, because now you're not getting it this week, I promise. No matter how good today is, you're not going to be able to capitalize. Yeah, because you're mentally, you're, you're screwed. Yeah. No, I, yeah, I love that. I think like maybe just to kind of close it down and kind of end it on the podcast. What's one advice you would give for short traders and one advice that you would kind of give for, for long traders? I think that's a good way to kind of end it. Don't you James? Yeah, so I can listen to you guys talk all day. It's five and I love hearing this, but yeah, go ahead. Yeah, so for a short trader, your, your mindset needs to be like that one baseball player that bow likes a quote all the time is an Ichiro or the dude that has a super, a super consistent batting average. Like you need to really just as a short seller, you need to go for a repetitive hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, hit, right? If you're looking for consistency, it's all about the base hit, base it, base it, base it, base it, and then don't worry about adding to winners until after you've built up that, you know, that back pocket that I'm talking about. Once you build up that back pocket, don't try to grow on the short side until you have that, that stability in your back pocket. And the way you grow after that is, is the, the only way that you can grow is to add to your winner, right? And then don't, don't think about, don't think about jumping size. It's a slow increase of size and a slow adaptation of adding to winners. That's going to increase your bankroll on the short side, you know, slow increase of size and slow adaptation of adding to winners. For the long trader, other than what I've already said, I really think, Harry, you've already said the best advice is that as a long trader, I think risk to reward is your best friend. And as Harry said, the, the, the support levels that are going to work are going to work right away. The demand is going to come in, the market is not going to give a whole lot of opportunity to get long at the best spot. So that's why you have to have patience for the best spot. Do not get in early. It's better to miss than, than, than to get into early for a long, because the reward side on longs is so big, you don't have to be first. Whereas shorts, a lot of the times, depending on your patient's level, your reward side is going to be capped at the bottom of the range unless you're going for a fader, which until you have that comfortability in your back pocket, don't be going for that. Right. And so those are, I guess the two bits of advice that I would give is shorts, you really need to base it, base it, base it, and then slowly add to winners, add to size and longs don't get exhausted. The patient for the best price and the best price will show itself to you without you having to guess. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, I love that. So, so much. That was, that was perfect. Yeah, your, your grades are going to, are going to work right away. And, you know, that's just it for longing, like you just need to be okay with that. And I think for longing as well, you need to be okay taking singles when shit is not working, you know. Yeah. And that's my biggest weakness right now. That's my biggest. It's not, it's not easy because you know that the problem is, is that if you're a trader right now in this market, you know that the short at VWAP is going to be more profitable than taking the support line underneath VWAP and selling at VWAP, right? And so you either need to say, okay, I'm a long trader or maybe you short for a while and take those types of setups till they stop working because right now, like for me, I'm okay with like taking my consistent hits of 10, 20, 30 cents, maybe I get a nice 40, 50 cent rip, but I'm okay with taking that because I know what can come next and I understand the reward that can come by just taking those singles over and over and over again. And I guess that's what I try and do each and every day is just take those consistent singles until we get into a market where we start running. And then it's like, wow, Harry's making a dollar, $2, $3 a share and everyone's mind blown. It's like, bro, where were you when I was making 10, 20 and 30 cents? I'm not getting those types of DMs. And that's really it, you know. And again, this patience all comes down to, you know, patience through the hard times so that you can have a clear head in the good times. 100%. 100%. Well, I think we can wrap it up here. I love it. That's a, yeah, that's a great